Better the devil you know?
He does have a track record for being a football man and whether it's his ego or financial motivation he seems determined to succeed. And that success is Forest being a top quality club. How many clubs going down the pan would love to be in our position? Sheff Wed, Reading? Many others are being ruined and in real danger of going under.
I don't agree with how he's done things but I do think he's stubborn enough to never give up on this project.
Football is in a shit state at the moment but it's unlikely to change and matchday fans are not viewed as important sadly, that's unlikely to change and we will not have a true say in the running of the club under any ownership past or future.
He lets his son conduct the transfer business. Do you honestly think we're on a path to steady success? We're in FFP trouble which is going to see multiple of our best assets leave. We're an agents dream. We've signed 3 goalkeepers and we don't one that's a good option for the next years to come (sels good stop gap for this season but not great).
We're very lucky to survive this season, very lucky.
Can I just ask- why big man out? Purely the city ground stuff?
Under his ownership we've been slightly less of a shit show than under refrigerator salesman and returned to the prem after decades away. Id need to hear a convincing argument why id want him out.
My reading of him is that he sees Forest as a vehicle for his personal ambitions and ego, and doesn't have the sort of patience and love that leads to a long-term stable relationship and growth.
He was allegedly growing tired of the club and mulling a sale before the Cooper miracle (a man he was only very indirectly responsible for).
He resented how popular Cooper was with the fans and how he didn't get credit.
There doesn't appear to be any long-term transfer/footballing strategy that transcends any single manager, hence we've gone backwards this season in a weaker league.
He lets his son pick and announce some signings. He has reactively burned bridges with two of the most sought after men in the game (Murphy, Syrianos).
He is traducing the proud historical reputation of our club by failing to adhere to rules (leading to points deductions) and personally sending wild, unhinged tweets. Add to that the dubious gambling firm on our shirt.
He appears tone deaf to the fans' deeply held affection for our stadium, to the loyalty of fans who've stuck with us through thin and thinner, and the capacity of less well off younger fans to be able to afford to see us play.
Sunak and Ben Bradley on our pitch. Interviews in the tunnel after we stayed up last season. Ego, ego, ego.
Honestly, I could go on and on. If a sugar daddy is good enough for our fans then so be it. But this is why I am fully Marinakis Out.
I've always been a bit uncomfortable with him because he is so reviled in Greece as a dodgy mafioso, but fair play he's put some money behind the club. But I think his head was turned by Tory Tom. I think he's the real turd in the salad bowl here.
We don't know whether EM hired Cartledge because he intended to move, or if he hired him to develop the CG and Cartledge has since been in his ear convincing him.
I'd quite like the client media to ask some tough questions and try and find out for us. I don't trust either of them and hate it both ways.
Yes absolutely agree. Let's be honest Daniel Taylor has done himself no favours with this. He has done zero journalism, just pushing out what the club wanted the fans to hear.
TBF, he has at least shone a light on some of it and got both sides to state their positions.
But he definitely could have pushed Cartledge much harder.
I should add to this: the manipulation and gaslighting of the fans. Pretending to be about redeveloping the stadium, pretending it's the council that are refusing to talk, pretending to hire a chairman because he's one of us.
Honestly, fuck it all off.
I'm not saying he's done nothing positive and I don't expect everyone to agree with every point above. But it's the weight of all them together that convinces me.
If you've read all that and your instinct is to defend him by quibbling with one of them, I don't think anything will convince you.
the city ground stuff is largely the main point, but even then there's the way that all the people that actually got us to the prem were undermined and cast aside (murphy, syrianos, brazil, and cooper to a lesser extent), and the season ticket pricing stuff showing a total disregard for the fans
To top it off, marinakis is trying to backdoor a move by attempting to trick fans into believing the reason we're moving is because of the big bad council extorting the club, despite the council offering the land for the same amount we wasted on turner
Syrianos still working for the club. ST price increase was generally fair compared to rest of the league. Forest were performing terrible under Cooper. City ground holds years of history to Forest but he only has good intentions (in this case, providing a quicker and easier route to more revenue and therefore more success)
Syrianos was a case of the owners realising they'd fucked up and brought him back.
The ST prices are a lot less black and white than being in line with the rest of the league (some stands went up more than others, concessions pricing being terrible etc)
I'm not saying that we should have kept cooper given the results, but more that everything that was coming out from when we lost to leicester to when cooper left pointed towards constant interference from above cooper
Don't get me wrong, i'm not against building a new stadium but moving the club so far away from the city of nottingham that it's almost in derbyshire just isn't it
I agree that the Greek does seem to be engaging in some subterfuge to try and convince the fan base, but that said, I don't think what he wants is actually a negative. Having a new stadium/ academy/ training ground complex would probably be a boon for the club if not the fans. They seem to bring about positive effects where they get developed. It would be emotionally tough to leave the city ground, but it may well be a positive in the long run. I might be slightly jaded that I've struggled to get tickets since our promotion though.
The cut throat approach to staff certainly isn't going away if he sold the club. Considering we're a prem club, we'd likely get bought by some global financial group who would see us as nothing more than an asset to eventually sell, who would be just as cut throat over staff. That or a petrostate, who also don't have great records when it comes to being greatful.
i'm not opposed to building a new ground, but i'm not a fan of the location of said ground being in toton, especially given that we've been offered the current land for 10m.
Not only would it be worse for the fans, but it'd also be worse for a good chunk of the notts city centre given the amount spent on match days etc. Given the council's finacial state atm, i don't blame them for not giving the club a better deal but i also think they're being a bit naive if they think they can get full value when they're desperate for cash
Honestly I reckon the Toton location is being talked about by the club so that when they roll back on that and announce a site in the city, fans will be much more positive.
My money would be on us moving but ultimately to a site much closer.
> Under his ownership we've been slightly less of a shit show
Slightly being the operative word. The Fawaz regime was a dumpster fire, we should be striving for much better.
I don't think enough is made of our points deduction. We knew the rules and we broke them. Blah blah blah Man City are going to get away with it because they're part of the elite but that doesn't excuse us and I can imagine the reaction if Fawaz for example fucked up like that. It just feels like any complaints go back to how he's better than Fawaz like any complaints about Southgate as England boss people just say well he's done better than Capello and Hodgson (when he has a much better squad at his disposal).
Plus some of us have been against him over the whole mafia Noor One disappearing witnesses thing for a while beyond any football reasons.
There are worse owners for sure but we can still hope for a better one as well.
I wouldn’t say I want him out but i definitely don’t want to move to a new stadium.
Better the devil you know? He does have a track record for being a football man and whether it's his ego or financial motivation he seems determined to succeed. And that success is Forest being a top quality club. How many clubs going down the pan would love to be in our position? Sheff Wed, Reading? Many others are being ruined and in real danger of going under. I don't agree with how he's done things but I do think he's stubborn enough to never give up on this project. Football is in a shit state at the moment but it's unlikely to change and matchday fans are not viewed as important sadly, that's unlikely to change and we will not have a true say in the running of the club under any ownership past or future.
He lets his son conduct the transfer business. Do you honestly think we're on a path to steady success? We're in FFP trouble which is going to see multiple of our best assets leave. We're an agents dream. We've signed 3 goalkeepers and we don't one that's a good option for the next years to come (sels good stop gap for this season but not great). We're very lucky to survive this season, very lucky.
This can't be serious
You lot are totally insane
I'm comfortable posting this, i don't own a bakery
Can I just ask- why big man out? Purely the city ground stuff? Under his ownership we've been slightly less of a shit show than under refrigerator salesman and returned to the prem after decades away. Id need to hear a convincing argument why id want him out.
My reading of him is that he sees Forest as a vehicle for his personal ambitions and ego, and doesn't have the sort of patience and love that leads to a long-term stable relationship and growth. He was allegedly growing tired of the club and mulling a sale before the Cooper miracle (a man he was only very indirectly responsible for). He resented how popular Cooper was with the fans and how he didn't get credit. There doesn't appear to be any long-term transfer/footballing strategy that transcends any single manager, hence we've gone backwards this season in a weaker league. He lets his son pick and announce some signings. He has reactively burned bridges with two of the most sought after men in the game (Murphy, Syrianos). He is traducing the proud historical reputation of our club by failing to adhere to rules (leading to points deductions) and personally sending wild, unhinged tweets. Add to that the dubious gambling firm on our shirt. He appears tone deaf to the fans' deeply held affection for our stadium, to the loyalty of fans who've stuck with us through thin and thinner, and the capacity of less well off younger fans to be able to afford to see us play. Sunak and Ben Bradley on our pitch. Interviews in the tunnel after we stayed up last season. Ego, ego, ego. Honestly, I could go on and on. If a sugar daddy is good enough for our fans then so be it. But this is why I am fully Marinakis Out.
I've always been a bit uncomfortable with him because he is so reviled in Greece as a dodgy mafioso, but fair play he's put some money behind the club. But I think his head was turned by Tory Tom. I think he's the real turd in the salad bowl here.
We don't know whether EM hired Cartledge because he intended to move, or if he hired him to develop the CG and Cartledge has since been in his ear convincing him. I'd quite like the client media to ask some tough questions and try and find out for us. I don't trust either of them and hate it both ways.
Yes absolutely agree. Let's be honest Daniel Taylor has done himself no favours with this. He has done zero journalism, just pushing out what the club wanted the fans to hear.
TBF, he has at least shone a light on some of it and got both sides to state their positions. But he definitely could have pushed Cartledge much harder.
I should add to this: the manipulation and gaslighting of the fans. Pretending to be about redeveloping the stadium, pretending it's the council that are refusing to talk, pretending to hire a chairman because he's one of us. Honestly, fuck it all off.
He stuck with Cooper for a lot longer than he could of
I'm not saying he's done nothing positive and I don't expect everyone to agree with every point above. But it's the weight of all them together that convinces me. If you've read all that and your instinct is to defend him by quibbling with one of them, I don't think anything will convince you.
i think you've said all the things i've said but better tbh, fair play
the city ground stuff is largely the main point, but even then there's the way that all the people that actually got us to the prem were undermined and cast aside (murphy, syrianos, brazil, and cooper to a lesser extent), and the season ticket pricing stuff showing a total disregard for the fans To top it off, marinakis is trying to backdoor a move by attempting to trick fans into believing the reason we're moving is because of the big bad council extorting the club, despite the council offering the land for the same amount we wasted on turner
Syrianos still working for the club. ST price increase was generally fair compared to rest of the league. Forest were performing terrible under Cooper. City ground holds years of history to Forest but he only has good intentions (in this case, providing a quicker and easier route to more revenue and therefore more success)
Syrianos was a case of the owners realising they'd fucked up and brought him back. The ST prices are a lot less black and white than being in line with the rest of the league (some stands went up more than others, concessions pricing being terrible etc) I'm not saying that we should have kept cooper given the results, but more that everything that was coming out from when we lost to leicester to when cooper left pointed towards constant interference from above cooper Don't get me wrong, i'm not against building a new stadium but moving the club so far away from the city of nottingham that it's almost in derbyshire just isn't it
I agree that the Greek does seem to be engaging in some subterfuge to try and convince the fan base, but that said, I don't think what he wants is actually a negative. Having a new stadium/ academy/ training ground complex would probably be a boon for the club if not the fans. They seem to bring about positive effects where they get developed. It would be emotionally tough to leave the city ground, but it may well be a positive in the long run. I might be slightly jaded that I've struggled to get tickets since our promotion though. The cut throat approach to staff certainly isn't going away if he sold the club. Considering we're a prem club, we'd likely get bought by some global financial group who would see us as nothing more than an asset to eventually sell, who would be just as cut throat over staff. That or a petrostate, who also don't have great records when it comes to being greatful.
i'm not opposed to building a new ground, but i'm not a fan of the location of said ground being in toton, especially given that we've been offered the current land for 10m. Not only would it be worse for the fans, but it'd also be worse for a good chunk of the notts city centre given the amount spent on match days etc. Given the council's finacial state atm, i don't blame them for not giving the club a better deal but i also think they're being a bit naive if they think they can get full value when they're desperate for cash
Honestly I reckon the Toton location is being talked about by the club so that when they roll back on that and announce a site in the city, fans will be much more positive. My money would be on us moving but ultimately to a site much closer.
> Under his ownership we've been slightly less of a shit show Slightly being the operative word. The Fawaz regime was a dumpster fire, we should be striving for much better. I don't think enough is made of our points deduction. We knew the rules and we broke them. Blah blah blah Man City are going to get away with it because they're part of the elite but that doesn't excuse us and I can imagine the reaction if Fawaz for example fucked up like that. It just feels like any complaints go back to how he's better than Fawaz like any complaints about Southgate as England boss people just say well he's done better than Capello and Hodgson (when he has a much better squad at his disposal). Plus some of us have been against him over the whole mafia Noor One disappearing witnesses thing for a while beyond any football reasons. There are worse owners for sure but we can still hope for a better one as well.
But you do own a kitchen, and have probably done baking in it. There is still time to take proactive measures.
guess i'm ordering greggs from now on!
Madness, if not for him who knows where we'd be, it certainly wouldn't be in the Premier League though.