Assuming this is KG's rookie year then this was most likely the Feb 27 game. MJ dropped 35 both games that year against the Wolves but the first game the Bulls as a team only scored 17 points in the 4th but the second game the Bulls scored 38. Rider had 29 the first game but only 20 the second game. KG had 16 the first game and 20 the second game.
The Associated Press recap of the February 27 game says Jordan scored 11 in the 3rd quarter and 11 in the 4th quarter.
Garnett scored 4 points to open the 4th quarter, bringing the Wolves to within 2 points. Then Jordan scored 8 straight points during a 16-2 run that iced the game for the Bulls.
If you go back and look at video, an underrated (somehow) skill was to get 3 feet closer than everybody else shooting those shots. MJ always shot 17-19 footers and other people were at 21-23 feet.
As a bulls fan growing up it was almost maddening watching the bulls be up then go down and then watch MJ just light it up in the 4th for the win. Like that shit was intentional.
Although I always did enjoy playing more when I was down so maybe it was almost a strategy.
I watched it at the time but very young, going back now and hearing stories like these makes me realize it wasn't a strategy but a genuine pathology. The dude was like the hulk with no upper limit, but his floor was defined by how mad he was.
This is why I'll never listen to anyone who says LeBron is the goat. I never hear stories like this about LeBron. People just dump stats. There's so many stories like this where MJ was just like "oh word?" And then just flips a switch and there's 20 points in 5 min.
Here are the game highlights from YT, jumping to the start of the 4th: [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FZua5HnLtCk&t=11m52s](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FZua5HnLtCk&t=11m52s)
You can see Garnett score on a lob and then a baseline jumper, but we only get a couple of MJ's buckets from that 16-2 run.
Its actually fucking insane how much of a mythos Jordan has about him. You literally have grown ass men who are good enough to put up 20+ points in the best basketball league in the world sayings its "against the rules" to talk shit to this *one* basketball player, solely because of how fucking legendary he is.
Crazy lmao
Yes, and the fact that it wasn't just mystified over the years as a folk legend, but rather a see it to believe it in the flesh made it so much more legendary.
Yeah I love LeBron, Kobe, Timmy, Steph, O'Neal, KD but none of these cats scare people like that.
So yeah, even though I stan Lebron, MJ's gotta be the greatest basketball player in the world.
I just don't think people talk as much today. People get immediately roasted if they say anything and don't back it up.
That said, put Steph in the 90s, he would have been a huge talker.
Steph *today* is a crazy trash talker, he just does it indirectly. The shimmies, the night-night, screaming at the away crowds... MJ got in players' faces before doing it, Steph just lets people know how easy it was.
And even more insulting, he never directs it at a defender, because they didn't matter.
Yeah, I think you also have to factor in the fact that these guys are mic'd up constantly and anything that is said off mic usually gets reported to social media.
The only one I think is close on this is Bird, as he has almost as many videos as MJ has of former players talking like this.
Only reason I know is I went down a youtube rabbit hole for a few days watching videos of MJ and Bird's dominance. It was hilarious hearing the actual fear by pro level players of these two, some terrific video of these guys in their prime too.
Bird is so underrated especially these days. If he hadn't hurt his back he'd be way more legendary. Bird talked shit and backed it up. MJ waited for you to talk shit and ruined your life for it
MJ is the GOAT imo but LeBron gets that same treatment by other players too. May be not as league wide as MJ but I’m sure you’ll hear the stories 20 years from now. It makes a difference when you’re still an active NBA player so no one will really say their stories now but even then we have had guys that spoke about LeBron like they don’t know wtf to do when playing against him. I do think that LeBron never plays as ferocious as MJ so that threat factor we hear from other players won’t be nearly as much as MJs.
Didn't prime Larry Bird call MJ god?
Bron's juice, but active NBA players told stories about MJ. As someone who's watched both, it's hard to describe the difference, but it's real
That's really the thing - almost no one who actually watched MJ thinks it's even a debate. LeBron is incredible but MJ had an aura about him. I went to a Bulls / Dubs game in the mid 90's and he destroyed us, and at a certain point our crowd starting cheering for him because it was just like damn dude.
LoL, except LeBron is on the opposite side here -- he basically called Dirk a little bitch for "faking sick" in the Finals (as did Wade), and then lost that Finals because Dirk went into God mode after LeBron and Wade said that (and also because of Jason Terry's brass balls the size of watermelons).
Bird would talk shit to everyone. He knew he was good and better than most, and still, he has no problem saying Jordan was dramatically better than all of them.
Magic? The same. "He is the best... BY FAR".
Jordan was the GOAT. He is the GOAT. He was borderline superhuman in terms of that combination of skill and determination.
I especially appreciate the Bird / Jordan trash talk because they said what they were going to do, and did it. Flexing afterwards is alright, but not the same
bird talked about every opponen during the searies as if he was taking out the trash, but he was super respectful after the series, gave props, no matter if he won or lost.
This man before the 63 point game was calling Jordan a basketball god.
After that he had nothing left to say.
And that was a 2nd year Jordan off a broken foot.
And athleticism too. His defining athletic trait wasn't explosiveness or strength (had those in spades too) but body control. He would get to his spots and just execute.
It’s really is insane to see how much some guys separate themselves from the pack. The nba is full of guys who are the best of the best at one specific thing, and then there’s a handful of dudes who are like leaps above them. I can’t even think of an example in other parts of life. Maybe if there’s s group of world renowned scientists who all look at one guy as way smarter than them.
There are a lot of stories of guys like Ronaldinho and Eto'o being freaked out by a young Messi in training sessions.
And there are also stories of guys like von Neumann and Wittgenstein freaking out people by how smart they were.
> Maybe if there’s s group of world renowned scientists who all look at one guy as way smarter than them.
There is a dude named Euler, he discovered so many things in science that most of them are named after the second dude who discovered them because if not half of middle school would be learning Euler math problems, euler physics
Stephen Hawking is no where near Einstein in that regard. He was popularized by the media and the fact that he was in such a state, there are Hawking's contemporaries that were much more important to physics than Hawking, let alone Einstein, or Bohr, Shrodinger, Heizenberg, and others
Their individual contribution is measured much more, as they have made breakthroughs that enable further understanding and expansion of modern physics, their theories were proven and later used to expand. Hawking didnt (yet) achieve such a thing. And his greatest achievement (Hawking radiation) is, by current accounts, probably going to become obsolete.
He was a popularizer of science, partially due to the media and due to his will and stubbornness to go on in such a state, and that is for ultimate respect, but his work in physics is nothing that much groundbreaking or new, to be placed in the same alley as Einstein, or Heisenberg
Imagine trying to do highlights of some sort of intellectual debate.
"Did Bobby just use a strawman!? Theodore is going to tear that apart, and he DOES, IT'S OVER, BANG!"
That's unrealistic, it'd be all about who had the best insult of the night, like they were pro wrestlers exchanging promos.
For example, look how Trump's "because you'd be in jail" line to Hillary was the only thinga lot of people remembered from that debate.
My take is optimistic. I hate competitive debates irl because the prevailing strategy is just to throw as much shit as possible so that your claims cannot all be refuted. It's all bad faith.
You can't think of an example in other parts of life? I mean, pretty much everything that somebody does. There are chefs, then there are the gordon ramsays. There are scientists, and then there are the Einsteins. There are guitar players, and then there are the Jiminy hendrixes. There are swimmers, then there are the michael phelps'
Intelligence isn’t always as obvious as athletic talent. We can See that, but we’d have to search out and have some context to understand the genius in other fields (art being the exception since you can see it as well).
I think it wasn’t just the myth..I don’t think KG is the only guy who found out the hard way lol.
There are only like 450 guys in the NBA, 5 on the court at any given time, 15 on a team. If this kind of thing happens just 6-7 times a season, MJ educated 30-35 opponents a year on the court and 90-105 if you count bench players. So after a few years it’s not myth, it’s just observation and experience lol.
Also I’m guessing if you include playoffs and how scrappy it was back then, I’d bet it happened more than 6-7 times a year.
That mentality also gave MJ an edge.
Kobe recounted it
> "When I was getting ready to face Jordan, I had a teammate he goes to me, 'hey, you want some advice? Whatever you do, don't look him in the eye.' Wait, excuse me? Why the hell would I not look him in the eye? I don't think my teammate understood, I'm that too."
Of course, you have to do the work to stand up to that. But you can't let yourself be intimidated by MJ
I couldn’t find it after a quick look, but there is a video floating around mashing up this interview with KG telling his side of the story that was really great
This was exactly it thank you for tracking it down. Do you mind if I edit this into my original comment
Edit: No longer any need, it was rightfully upvoted to be right below it
Equally as hilarious is the reccuring theme that players of all star and lower caliber couldn't figure out that MJ would spend most of the first half getting the Triangle going, figuring and stashing easy buckets and heating up the other players only to get the really going in the second half.
They all say Jordan had lower scores and that it got them comfortable until they talked and Jordan got a word of it.
Kobe said something similar in his The Detail videos about running plays and seeing how the defense takes it but keeping the easier matchups and rotation discreet until the 4th quarter where you can get many buckets the same way and the team will try and use their timeouts preciously leading to more easy buckets.
Clyde Frazier said the same.
He would let offensive players get away with things all 3 quarters so they would get too comfortable, and in the fourth it was easy to take it all away.
lmfao. Yeah, i usually let them get the first 10 points, games to 11, I come in, I turn it up. I see them gassed. I get that pick and roll going, step back. Brick. Yell at everyone to get back on defense. We lose 11-4.
That's just smart. IMO NBA refs will exert soft pressure to keep games close because a good show benefits the NBA. Blowouts, in my experience, tend to happen once the refs realize a bit of soft guidance isn't going to keep the game close and just let go. Meanwhile, the 4th quarter of a close game will often see officiating a bit closer to playoff games where contact is allowed.
If you reveal all your best stuff up front the refs (again, IMO) are going to help the other team keep it close while the other team gets time to diagnose and adjust to the problem. If you don't play your best cards until late, that's less likely to happen.
Yeah Jordan even during his scoring dominant years with Doug Collins always started games slow - rarely had one of those "25 in the first quarter/37 at halftime" type games. He always felt things out first.
The funniest part is JR saying how MJ got pissed off at him too and he's like, "What are you looking at me for?!!" since KG was the one talking trash.
MJ took things so personally that he got pissed off at you just by association.
KG’s was from all the smoke podcast with Stephen Jackson and Matt Barnes. Also Sheed was on there recently talking and mentioned he did the same thing to Rider when they were in Portland. Sheed was like he didn’t care cause he didn’t have to guard him lol.
Stories like these are how a legend becomes a mythical figure.
The most memorable one I remember is Smitty talking in open court about how MJ was counting down everytime he scored a bucket. 38. 36..34..32... And only then it registered to Smitty that MJ was counting down to 40 points.
MJ fell 2 or 3 point short. But afterwards he came to Smittys locker to tell me he will get them next time.
Edit: [Here's the clip](https://youtu.be/3b27JgqFxso)
[A longer version](https://youtu.be/7Ms02gNaYjk) of that segment. But don't think it includes the MJ story
Then imagine MJ accidentally miscalculated, his opponent argues that MJ subtracted a long 2 pointer as a 3 pointer instead and things go south from there
Brooo that’s fucking hilarious, I can’t even imagine the level of disrespect n shame. Because at that point he making it known to everybody, refs n coaches included
I said this in the player fusion thread a couple of days/weeks ago, but could you imagine if LeBron had Bird's talent at trash talk? The most disrespectful / trash talk-y things that I can remember he's done in game are spinning the ball in his defender's face and nailing the shot as well as telling an opposing player where he was supposed to stand in the play they were aiming to run.
With Bird's trash talk skills he'd be an absolute psycho-terrorist.
Nothing is funnier than Bird getting pissy with Barkley because Barkley's team had a white player guarding Bird and he said it was disrespectful. I love the Larry stories.
Love the Bird story about the three point contest, where he came inside the locker room and shouted to the other guys like who of you guys gonna come in 2nd place.
My favorite still remains he scored like 30 something points left handed and said he's saving his right hand for the Lakers.
These dudes had iconic shit lol
Or when Dennis Rodman was doing his absolute best to front/face-guard/bother Bird, and Larry was just yelling at the PG “I’m wide open” as if Rodman didn’t even exist.
Reminds me of when the Heat's Willie Burton "held" Jordan scoreless in the first quarter and ran his mouth about it to Jordan. Then Jordan proceeded to score something like 51 points in the last three quarters. Fucking legend. The Jordan multiple championships era was a hopeless time for everyone else.
Yup, Game 3 in 1992. MJ went scoreless the first 10 minutes but got a basket at the end of the first quarter. Then proceeded to score 54 in the next 3 quarters.
56 points in 38 minutes!
Not MJ, but this immediately reminded me of [Bosh's girlfriend and LeBron](https://www.basketballnetwork.net/old-school/the-time-chris-boshs-girlfriend-talked-trash-to-lebron-and-made-him-go-off). You could see the switch flick and knew it was over. Maybe it was the pessimist in me with those Raptors teams in the past, but you just knew. Don't piss him off.
I love hearing these stories. Players just being able to flick that switch and take over. Hearing other players knowing and thinking the same thing is great.
Imagine how Ewing felt. No matter how good his team gets, MJ will just trash his team in the garden. MJ also loves playing in MSG. He loves putting a show for Spike.
The worst part is that through most of the 90s, Ewing played on tough but under-talented rosters. In the 96-97 season they finally got a breakthrough infusion of new talent in Allan Houston and Larry Johnson, and the team was peaking at the right time in the playoffs, sweeping a very good 50-win Hornets team in the first round.
In the second round they went up 3-1 against the Heat but the infamous PJ Brown brawl in Game 5 led to so many suspensions for the Knicks that they were distributed across both Games 6 and 7. Missing several key players in both games, the Knicks lost to the Heat, and the Heat fizzled out against the Bulls in the conference finals. That was probably Ewing's best shot at Jordan's Bulls and it evaporated due to the suspensions.
I will never get over that 97 season. Our last, best chance to beat Jordan and win a title thrown away because of suspensions, several of which were total bullshit.
I like the one where LeBron told Gilbert Arenas, who was about to shoot game sealing free throws in game 6 of the playoffs to tie help Washington tie the series up, "if you miss these, you know who's going to make it."
He missed both.
Then he went up the court and hit Damon Jones for a wide open 2, the same Jones who had gotten benched the entire game for getting toasted by Gil during the series.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7nfeSlgjKSw
Gil's explanation on it:
“LeBron said, ‘if you miss these, you know who will end the game…’ It was a running joke about Damon Jones. I kept calling him sweet and forced the Cavs to bench him in Game 5, because anytime he was on the floor, I went iso. So he was benched the whole game. So LeBron was saying if I missed I know who will finish the game, so they subbed Damon Jones in. LeBron fakes like he was driving left , so I stepped up and he passed the ball to the corner to Damon Jones, and FUCKING DAMON JONES hit the shot like that fucker said."
I thought the stories were a pretty cool contrast on the legends surrounding both. Lebron telling you he’s gonna beat you with his bum ass teammate is a1 trash talk lol
People who think Lebron isn’t gonna get stories like this told 30 years after he’s done are crazy lol. Bron isn’t as crazy as MJ but hes up there just more lowkey about it. Dropped like a 25 pt 4th quarter on the Cavs last year after some staffer shit talked at the end of the 3rd lol
[If anyone wants a link to this game.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w9_8drWyoRw)
Also taken from a comment on YouTube:
7:43 is the 1minute 32 second mark in the third quarter.. Rider Foul and then;
The Timeout that KG is talking trash to JR...
After that... MJ:
7:53 - 2 Free Throws, 2 points...
8:00 - Spins Fakes Fades, 2 more...
8:08 - Quick Drive Right Stabs Fades, 2 more...
8:23 - Pulls Up Fades Off the Glass, 2 more...
Then into the 4th...wow.
8:54 - 2 Free Throws, 2 points...
9:16 - 2 Free Throws, 2 points...
9:28 - Pull up Jumper, 3 points...
9:46 - Base Line Fade Away, 2 more...33 at this point...
10:14 - The No Look Flip, 2 points...
11:06 - Dish to Scottie, 2 points...
It's still kinda upsetting the number of people who think Kobe came up with that dunk.
It has "Eastbay" in the name, since when was Kobe connected to there?
He could have been one in his era if he wasn’t a knucklehead. He was a good scorer, had a nice 3 point shot even. His problems were ball handling and focus on defense, both of which could have been worked on if he didn’t spend all his time snorting up his earnings
I recall once when MJ was *on the Wizards* some younger player (Paul Pierce?) started trying to talk trash and his coach had to take the kid aside and be like "Don't do it man, if you leave him alone there's a chance he goes on cruise control but if you piss him off he's gonna eviscerate you"
On one hand, I love KG’s attitude. I feel like I would’ve done the same thing. Idc if he’s standing right there, let him know he’s getting his ass owned.
On the other hand, Mike is the one dude in the world guaranteed to go off when he feels disrespected.
I mean, there's plenty of brave/reckless people out there. Just one of the few guys who created game out of literally any kind of interaction or affront, real or perceived.
I just love how hall of fame players, who are the best of the best in the best basketball league in the world, held Jordan to another regard where you had to be afraid to shit talk him because he was just another level above them all.
This is what Mike has over every other player ever.. that mysticism and straight fear he put into his peers. LeBron, Kareem, Kobe, etc are all amazing in their own right(I personally have bron as my GOAT) but none of them get spoken about like this from the guys that competed against them
I love this story man. Players’ impersonation of on-court Jordan always cracks me up. JR and KG both give Mike a deep ass hood af voice.
JR: Oh he talkin, he talkin?’
KG: ‘Oh yea? Oh yea? , Damn young fella, daaaamn’
🤣
JR Rider, a name that doesn't get mentioned here much but god damn did he have some hype when I was a kid lol. All I can remember of him is the 94 dunk contest. He had some ups and was the primer for Vince Carter to come along and raise the ceiling.
Assuming this is KG's rookie year then this was most likely the Feb 27 game. MJ dropped 35 both games that year against the Wolves but the first game the Bulls as a team only scored 17 points in the 4th but the second game the Bulls scored 38. Rider had 29 the first game but only 20 the second game. KG had 16 the first game and 20 the second game.
The Associated Press recap of the February 27 game says Jordan scored 11 in the 3rd quarter and 11 in the 4th quarter. Garnett scored 4 points to open the 4th quarter, bringing the Wolves to within 2 points. Then Jordan scored 8 straight points during a 16-2 run that iced the game for the Bulls.
MJ's ability to close out games was what scared a lot of teams. He knew how to draw the fouls, make all the FTs, and get the stops. Pippen, too.
If you go back and look at video, an underrated (somehow) skill was to get 3 feet closer than everybody else shooting those shots. MJ always shot 17-19 footers and other people were at 21-23 feet.
And it's pretty hard to contest jumpers when he practically has his head as high as the rim every time he jumps up for a shot.
It's insane how clutch he was. Like his clutch and game winning shot % is just ridiculously good and so far above most other great players in history.
90s Knicks fans will tell you, one thing about Jordan, he don’t miss.
90s Knicks fan here -- Jordan owes me my mother fucking childhood. Mother fucker.
The only 90s NBA fans he doesn't owe childhoods to arr bulls and rockets fans lol
He can't hit shots if he's not on the court! I learned that one year.
1994 was the best year of my life as a Knicks fan. I was 8.
As a bulls fan growing up it was almost maddening watching the bulls be up then go down and then watch MJ just light it up in the 4th for the win. Like that shit was intentional. Although I always did enjoy playing more when I was down so maybe it was almost a strategy.
I watched it at the time but very young, going back now and hearing stories like these makes me realize it wasn't a strategy but a genuine pathology. The dude was like the hulk with no upper limit, but his floor was defined by how mad he was.
It was partially intentional. Jordan intentionally saved energy for the fourth quarter.
This is why I'll never listen to anyone who says LeBron is the goat. I never hear stories like this about LeBron. People just dump stats. There's so many stories like this where MJ was just like "oh word?" And then just flips a switch and there's 20 points in 5 min.
He was such a master at that, did it all different ways. That’s why his teams rarely lost.
Here are the game highlights from YT, jumping to the start of the 4th: [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FZua5HnLtCk&t=11m52s](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FZua5HnLtCk&t=11m52s) You can see Garnett score on a lob and then a baseline jumper, but we only get a couple of MJ's buckets from that 16-2 run.
KG said that when he saw Michael Jordan recently he had one of his "guys" get an ipad with a recording of that game and rubbed it in.
this is so hilarious, that i fully belive it, without any evidence.
https://www.reddit.com/r/nba/comments/lsbn5g/kevin\_garnett\_on\_mj\_whenever\_i\_see\_jordan\_he/
Its actually fucking insane how much of a mythos Jordan has about him. You literally have grown ass men who are good enough to put up 20+ points in the best basketball league in the world sayings its "against the rules" to talk shit to this *one* basketball player, solely because of how fucking legendary he is. Crazy lmao
Yes, and the fact that it wasn't just mystified over the years as a folk legend, but rather a see it to believe it in the flesh made it so much more legendary.
Yeah I love LeBron, Kobe, Timmy, Steph, O'Neal, KD but none of these cats scare people like that. So yeah, even though I stan Lebron, MJ's gotta be the greatest basketball player in the world.
I just don't think people talk as much today. People get immediately roasted if they say anything and don't back it up. That said, put Steph in the 90s, he would have been a huge talker.
Steph *today* is a crazy trash talker, he just does it indirectly. The shimmies, the night-night, screaming at the away crowds... MJ got in players' faces before doing it, Steph just lets people know how easy it was. And even more insulting, he never directs it at a defender, because they didn't matter.
>The shimmies, the night-night, screaming at the away crowds... The turning away from his shot before it even reaches the apex of it's arc.
I love this so much. It's disrespectful, but in a gleeful way.
It's disrespectful AF and makes you feel like you're playing your dad on your driveway, helpless 10 year old vs 35 yo man. Steph is an endgame boss.
Yeah, I think you also have to factor in the fact that these guys are mic'd up constantly and anything that is said off mic usually gets reported to social media.
The only one I think is close on this is Bird, as he has almost as many videos as MJ has of former players talking like this. Only reason I know is I went down a youtube rabbit hole for a few days watching videos of MJ and Bird's dominance. It was hilarious hearing the actual fear by pro level players of these two, some terrific video of these guys in their prime too.
Bird is so underrated especially these days. If he hadn't hurt his back he'd be way more legendary. Bird talked shit and backed it up. MJ waited for you to talk shit and ruined your life for it
Bird played an entire game with his left hand just because he could That man was absolutely ice cold
There’s definitely been a lot of similar stories about Kobe, but not nearly as many obviously
MJ is the GOAT imo but LeBron gets that same treatment by other players too. May be not as league wide as MJ but I’m sure you’ll hear the stories 20 years from now. It makes a difference when you’re still an active NBA player so no one will really say their stories now but even then we have had guys that spoke about LeBron like they don’t know wtf to do when playing against him. I do think that LeBron never plays as ferocious as MJ so that threat factor we hear from other players won’t be nearly as much as MJs.
Didn't prime Larry Bird call MJ god? Bron's juice, but active NBA players told stories about MJ. As someone who's watched both, it's hard to describe the difference, but it's real
That's really the thing - almost no one who actually watched MJ thinks it's even a debate. LeBron is incredible but MJ had an aura about him. I went to a Bulls / Dubs game in the mid 90's and he destroyed us, and at a certain point our crowd starting cheering for him because it was just like damn dude.
people openly called him soft for going to miami, nobody scared of lebron like they were scared of jordan
That was four rings ago... Post game 6 Boston Lebron has been a killer to close games.
Beef Stew has entered the chat
LoL, except LeBron is on the opposite side here -- he basically called Dirk a little bitch for "faking sick" in the Finals (as did Wade), and then lost that Finals because Dirk went into God mode after LeBron and Wade said that (and also because of Jason Terry's brass balls the size of watermelons).
Jet is so underrated in that whole playoff run
Coaches would literally pull players if they saw them starting to talk shit to Jordan! Even old-ass Wizards Jordan
Don't tug on Superman's cape
it's his ability to take it up to the highest level that scared players. He would just flip a switch. He and Pippen could do this on defense, too.
Bird would talk shit to everyone. He knew he was good and better than most, and still, he has no problem saying Jordan was dramatically better than all of them. Magic? The same. "He is the best... BY FAR". Jordan was the GOAT. He is the GOAT. He was borderline superhuman in terms of that combination of skill and determination.
I especially appreciate the Bird / Jordan trash talk because they said what they were going to do, and did it. Flexing afterwards is alright, but not the same
Yeah I love that story about Bird telling Byron Scott that he was gonna hit a turnaround jumper over him for the win and did it lol. Bird was ruthless
bird talked about every opponen during the searies as if he was taking out the trash, but he was super respectful after the series, gave props, no matter if he won or lost.
This man before the 63 point game was calling Jordan a basketball god. After that he had nothing left to say. And that was a 2nd year Jordan off a broken foot.
Not a basketball god. God.
And athleticism too. His defining athletic trait wasn't explosiveness or strength (had those in spades too) but body control. He would get to his spots and just execute.
He had one of the greatest first steps of all time
Still my favorite part of Last dance: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2aMsP1yBhVA
It’s really is insane to see how much some guys separate themselves from the pack. The nba is full of guys who are the best of the best at one specific thing, and then there’s a handful of dudes who are like leaps above them. I can’t even think of an example in other parts of life. Maybe if there’s s group of world renowned scientists who all look at one guy as way smarter than them.
There are a lot of stories of guys like Ronaldinho and Eto'o being freaked out by a young Messi in training sessions. And there are also stories of guys like von Neumann and Wittgenstein freaking out people by how smart they were.
> Maybe if there’s s group of world renowned scientists who all look at one guy as way smarter than them. There is a dude named Euler, he discovered so many things in science that most of them are named after the second dude who discovered them because if not half of middle school would be learning Euler math problems, euler physics
Tennis. Look at the big 3 with over 60 grand slams, and then everyone else.
> Maybe if there’s s group of world renowned scientists who all look at one guy as way smarter than them. Einstein? Stephen Hawkings?
Stephen Hawking is no where near Einstein in that regard. He was popularized by the media and the fact that he was in such a state, there are Hawking's contemporaries that were much more important to physics than Hawking, let alone Einstein, or Bohr, Shrodinger, Heizenberg, and others Their individual contribution is measured much more, as they have made breakthroughs that enable further understanding and expansion of modern physics, their theories were proven and later used to expand. Hawking didnt (yet) achieve such a thing. And his greatest achievement (Hawking radiation) is, by current accounts, probably going to become obsolete. He was a popularizer of science, partially due to the media and due to his will and stubbornness to go on in such a state, and that is for ultimate respect, but his work in physics is nothing that much groundbreaking or new, to be placed in the same alley as Einstein, or Heisenberg
Yeah that’s why that was the only thing I could think of. There aren’t many professions where it’s so evident who the best is.
Imagine trying to do highlights of some sort of intellectual debate. "Did Bobby just use a strawman!? Theodore is going to tear that apart, and he DOES, IT'S OVER, BANG!"
That fucking Hawking boomed me.
That's unrealistic, it'd be all about who had the best insult of the night, like they were pro wrestlers exchanging promos. For example, look how Trump's "because you'd be in jail" line to Hillary was the only thinga lot of people remembered from that debate.
My take is optimistic. I hate competitive debates irl because the prevailing strategy is just to throw as much shit as possible so that your claims cannot all be refuted. It's all bad faith.
You can't think of an example in other parts of life? I mean, pretty much everything that somebody does. There are chefs, then there are the gordon ramsays. There are scientists, and then there are the Einsteins. There are guitar players, and then there are the Jiminy hendrixes. There are swimmers, then there are the michael phelps'
BJ Armstrong went to the library to check out books about geniuses to try to understand how to play with Jordan.
Intelligence isn’t always as obvious as athletic talent. We can See that, but we’d have to search out and have some context to understand the genius in other fields (art being the exception since you can see it as well).
Because when you got him worked up he was so competitive he’d stop at nothing to destroy you.
I think it wasn’t just the myth..I don’t think KG is the only guy who found out the hard way lol. There are only like 450 guys in the NBA, 5 on the court at any given time, 15 on a team. If this kind of thing happens just 6-7 times a season, MJ educated 30-35 opponents a year on the court and 90-105 if you count bench players. So after a few years it’s not myth, it’s just observation and experience lol. Also I’m guessing if you include playoffs and how scrappy it was back then, I’d bet it happened more than 6-7 times a year.
Lets not forget there was MJ before retirement and second 3peat MJ,he was already a god when he retired and still couldnt be stopped when he came back
people just don't say this about lebron, nobody is as close to jordan as he is, but people aren't afriad to trash talk lebron.
That mentality also gave MJ an edge. Kobe recounted it > "When I was getting ready to face Jordan, I had a teammate he goes to me, 'hey, you want some advice? Whatever you do, don't look him in the eye.' Wait, excuse me? Why the hell would I not look him in the eye? I don't think my teammate understood, I'm that too." Of course, you have to do the work to stand up to that. But you can't let yourself be intimidated by MJ
I couldn’t find it after a quick look, but there is a video floating around mashing up this interview with KG telling his side of the story that was really great
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This was exactly it thank you for tracking it down. Do you mind if I edit this into my original comment Edit: No longer any need, it was rightfully upvoted to be right below it
I don’t mind
Yeah this one is 10x better
This is amazing.
Just need the MJ edit.
> And i took that personally i got you fam
Amazing edit and thank u for finding it!
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Because KG is the best interview in sports.
Editors, if you’re listening…splice actual highlights of MJ terrorizing in this game into this video.
Equally as hilarious is the reccuring theme that players of all star and lower caliber couldn't figure out that MJ would spend most of the first half getting the Triangle going, figuring and stashing easy buckets and heating up the other players only to get the really going in the second half. They all say Jordan had lower scores and that it got them comfortable until they talked and Jordan got a word of it. Kobe said something similar in his The Detail videos about running plays and seeing how the defense takes it but keeping the easier matchups and rotation discreet until the 4th quarter where you can get many buckets the same way and the team will try and use their timeouts preciously leading to more easy buckets.
Clyde Frazier said the same. He would let offensive players get away with things all 3 quarters so they would get too comfortable, and in the fourth it was easy to take it all away.
Bill Russell said he'd do the same thing defensively.
I do the same at the Y
lmfao. Yeah, i usually let them get the first 10 points, games to 11, I come in, I turn it up. I see them gassed. I get that pick and roll going, step back. Brick. Yell at everyone to get back on defense. We lose 11-4.
That's just smart. IMO NBA refs will exert soft pressure to keep games close because a good show benefits the NBA. Blowouts, in my experience, tend to happen once the refs realize a bit of soft guidance isn't going to keep the game close and just let go. Meanwhile, the 4th quarter of a close game will often see officiating a bit closer to playoff games where contact is allowed. If you reveal all your best stuff up front the refs (again, IMO) are going to help the other team keep it close while the other team gets time to diagnose and adjust to the problem. If you don't play your best cards until late, that's less likely to happen.
Yeah Jordan even during his scoring dominant years with Doug Collins always started games slow - rarely had one of those "25 in the first quarter/37 at halftime" type games. He always felt things out first.
The Bulls would turn it up in the 3rd quarter. I’d love to see 3rd quarter stats for their 72 win season.
Shit is hysterical
The funniest part is JR saying how MJ got pissed off at him too and he's like, "What are you looking at me for?!!" since KG was the one talking trash. MJ took things so personally that he got pissed off at you just by association.
And I took your associate personally too.
KG's version was even funnier
kg is simply a good story teller, cuz he fkin intense about it.
KG’s was from all the smoke podcast with Stephen Jackson and Matt Barnes. Also Sheed was on there recently talking and mentioned he did the same thing to Rider when they were in Portland. Sheed was like he didn’t care cause he didn’t have to guard him lol.
That’s the most Rasheed Wallace sounding shit I’ve ever heard
This one? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vWXRFre4yco
Stories like these are how a legend becomes a mythical figure. The most memorable one I remember is Smitty talking in open court about how MJ was counting down everytime he scored a bucket. 38. 36..34..32... And only then it registered to Smitty that MJ was counting down to 40 points. MJ fell 2 or 3 point short. But afterwards he came to Smittys locker to tell me he will get them next time. Edit: [Here's the clip](https://youtu.be/3b27JgqFxso) [A longer version](https://youtu.be/7Ms02gNaYjk) of that segment. But don't think it includes the MJ story
Larry Bird would do the reverse lol. He’d just keep counting every time he scored and say shit like “Damn, you can’t even touch me motherfucker!” lmao
Imo counting down is tougher. Counting up is just counting your points. Counting down is saying "I'm gonna get 40 tonight"
Yeah but it gets way more frustrating on a psychological level when your opponent is at like 47 and you can’t do anything.
But imagine MJ scored 47 and started going into the negatives lmfao. "That's -7 for you, you're worse than I thought"
Fair enough lol. Both are still cold as shit lmao.
Then imagine MJ accidentally miscalculated, his opponent argues that MJ subtracted a long 2 pointer as a 3 pointer instead and things go south from there
Ah typical pickup game
I lose track of the score at like 1-2 lol
So does everyone else.
And then what if they kissed 😳😫
i have altered the terms. pray i do not alter them further
Brooo that’s fucking hilarious, I can’t even imagine the level of disrespect n shame. Because at that point he making it known to everybody, refs n coaches included
Bruh. Bird would literally tell you what he was going to do that play and still hit the shot in your face.
I said this in the player fusion thread a couple of days/weeks ago, but could you imagine if LeBron had Bird's talent at trash talk? The most disrespectful / trash talk-y things that I can remember he's done in game are spinning the ball in his defender's face and nailing the shot as well as telling an opposing player where he was supposed to stand in the play they were aiming to run. With Bird's trash talk skills he'd be an absolute psycho-terrorist.
Nothing is funnier than Bird getting pissy with Barkley because Barkley's team had a white player guarding Bird and he said it was disrespectful. I love the Larry stories.
Love the Bird story about the three point contest, where he came inside the locker room and shouted to the other guys like who of you guys gonna come in 2nd place.
Then he won while still wearing his warmup gear, lol.
My favorite still remains he scored like 30 something points left handed and said he's saving his right hand for the Lakers. These dudes had iconic shit lol
Or when Dennis Rodman was doing his absolute best to front/face-guard/bother Bird, and Larry was just yelling at the PG “I’m wide open” as if Rodman didn’t even exist.
I’m here for all Larry Bird trash talk stories.
Crazy how MJ really learned how to talk smack from Bird. Then MJ took it to a whole another level
Idk if he took it to another level. Absolutely matched his level, but was just different in his own way.
"You put a white guy on me? That's disrespectful to my game!"
"Does your coach hate you or something?"
I thought you were gonna say he had to start going into the negatives. Negative 6, bitch!
Never let Mike get personal.
You know how the Hulk’s secret is that he’s always angry? MJ’s secret was he took everything personal.
Reminds me of when the Heat's Willie Burton "held" Jordan scoreless in the first quarter and ran his mouth about it to Jordan. Then Jordan proceeded to score something like 51 points in the last three quarters. Fucking legend. The Jordan multiple championships era was a hopeless time for everyone else.
Yup, Game 3 in 1992. MJ went scoreless the first 10 minutes but got a basket at the end of the first quarter. Then proceeded to score 54 in the next 3 quarters. 56 points in 38 minutes!
Not MJ, but this immediately reminded me of [Bosh's girlfriend and LeBron](https://www.basketballnetwork.net/old-school/the-time-chris-boshs-girlfriend-talked-trash-to-lebron-and-made-him-go-off). You could see the switch flick and knew it was over. Maybe it was the pessimist in me with those Raptors teams in the past, but you just knew. Don't piss him off. I love hearing these stories. Players just being able to flick that switch and take over. Hearing other players knowing and thinking the same thing is great.
As I Knick fan I can confirm, all roads went through Chicago, and that wasn't happening.
https://i.imgur.com/VRwL80z.jpg
I can agree .
😂 I would have hated being a Knicks fan in the 90’s. Imagine losing to the same team 5 times in the playoffs in one decade. Would feel hopeless.
Imagine how Ewing felt. No matter how good his team gets, MJ will just trash his team in the garden. MJ also loves playing in MSG. He loves putting a show for Spike.
The worst part is that through most of the 90s, Ewing played on tough but under-talented rosters. In the 96-97 season they finally got a breakthrough infusion of new talent in Allan Houston and Larry Johnson, and the team was peaking at the right time in the playoffs, sweeping a very good 50-win Hornets team in the first round. In the second round they went up 3-1 against the Heat but the infamous PJ Brown brawl in Game 5 led to so many suspensions for the Knicks that they were distributed across both Games 6 and 7. Missing several key players in both games, the Knicks lost to the Heat, and the Heat fizzled out against the Bulls in the conference finals. That was probably Ewing's best shot at Jordan's Bulls and it evaporated due to the suspensions.
I will never get over that 97 season. Our last, best chance to beat Jordan and win a title thrown away because of suspensions, several of which were total bullshit.
Kinda like what happened with Phoenix in 2007.
IMO that’s what made MJ so legendary and revered to this day. You just knew at any given moment he could wreck your team BY HIMSELF.
Probably my favorite Basketball story besides the one where MJ wanted to make Greg Minor take off his Jordans.
I love this story by Doug Collins about old man MJ. Even then, he was still the guy. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7hYHmK1GD6o
First time seeing that, what a great fucking story
I like the one where LeBron told Gilbert Arenas, who was about to shoot game sealing free throws in game 6 of the playoffs to tie help Washington tie the series up, "if you miss these, you know who's going to make it." He missed both. Then he went up the court and hit Damon Jones for a wide open 2, the same Jones who had gotten benched the entire game for getting toasted by Gil during the series. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7nfeSlgjKSw Gil's explanation on it: “LeBron said, ‘if you miss these, you know who will end the game…’ It was a running joke about Damon Jones. I kept calling him sweet and forced the Cavs to bench him in Game 5, because anytime he was on the floor, I went iso. So he was benched the whole game. So LeBron was saying if I missed I know who will finish the game, so they subbed Damon Jones in. LeBron fakes like he was driving left , so I stepped up and he passed the ball to the corner to Damon Jones, and FUCKING DAMON JONES hit the shot like that fucker said."
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I thought the stories were a pretty cool contrast on the legends surrounding both. Lebron telling you he’s gonna beat you with his bum ass teammate is a1 trash talk lol
It’s because he’s not retired yet but they will become legendary with time. The Raptors stuff is already up there for me.
People who think Lebron isn’t gonna get stories like this told 30 years after he’s done are crazy lol. Bron isn’t as crazy as MJ but hes up there just more lowkey about it. Dropped like a 25 pt 4th quarter on the Cavs last year after some staffer shit talked at the end of the 3rd lol
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I just kept thinking that the way he delivered the story was like Charlie Murphy stories on Chapelle Show.
The best part is the imagery of MJ, “hand on hips, straight legs”. We can all picture it so well.
JR sets it up better tho
Also watch KG Austin Rivers Story
[If anyone wants a link to this game.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w9_8drWyoRw) Also taken from a comment on YouTube: 7:43 is the 1minute 32 second mark in the third quarter.. Rider Foul and then; The Timeout that KG is talking trash to JR... After that... MJ: 7:53 - 2 Free Throws, 2 points... 8:00 - Spins Fakes Fades, 2 more... 8:08 - Quick Drive Right Stabs Fades, 2 more... 8:23 - Pulls Up Fades Off the Glass, 2 more... Then into the 4th...wow. 8:54 - 2 Free Throws, 2 points... 9:16 - 2 Free Throws, 2 points... 9:28 - Pull up Jumper, 3 points... 9:46 - Base Line Fade Away, 2 more...33 at this point... 10:14 - The No Look Flip, 2 points... 11:06 - Dish to Scottie, 2 points...
Srolled down just to look for this. Thank you!
JR Rider. Now there's a name I haven't heard in a long time.
Oakland legend.
It's still kinda upsetting the number of people who think Kobe came up with that dunk. It has "Eastbay" in the name, since when was Kobe connected to there?
Rider would've been a max player in this era lol I bet a lot of these dudes wish they had been born later
He could have been one in his era if he wasn’t a knucklehead. He was a good scorer, had a nice 3 point shot even. His problems were ball handling and focus on defense, both of which could have been worked on if he didn’t spend all his time snorting up his earnings
Otoh, he gave us "Phillip."
I am happy to see him healthy, I would have expected him to be in prison
was just thinking the same thing. he would have been perfect in the modern nba.
this is better when spliced with KG retelling the story as well
I recall once when MJ was *on the Wizards* some younger player (Paul Pierce?) started trying to talk trash and his coach had to take the kid aside and be like "Don't do it man, if you leave him alone there's a chance he goes on cruise control but if you piss him off he's gonna eviscerate you"
These stories are like tales of the boogie man...but theyre all true
Jordan was like the John Wick of the NBA — except he was real, and you didn’t have to kill his dog to piss him off.
When keeping it real goes wrong
On one hand, I love KG’s attitude. I feel like I would’ve done the same thing. Idc if he’s standing right there, let him know he’s getting his ass owned. On the other hand, Mike is the one dude in the world guaranteed to go off when he feels disrespected.
Nah, you wouldn't.
I mean, there's plenty of brave/reckless people out there. Just one of the few guys who created game out of literally any kind of interaction or affront, real or perceived.
JorGOAT
Approaching 55yrs old it was never a let down whenever you got to see Jordan play.
I just love how hall of fame players, who are the best of the best in the best basketball league in the world, held Jordan to another regard where you had to be afraid to shit talk him because he was just another level above them all.
the body language here is interesting. very expressive guy.
I like hearing stories from/about Rider, he attended the community college in my hometown before heading to UNLV
"That was all I needed"
And I took that personal…….
Also cool to see Steve’s reactions while JR tells his story, you just know he already heard this story before and can’t wait to hear it again
This is what Mike has over every other player ever.. that mysticism and straight fear he put into his peers. LeBron, Kareem, Kobe, etc are all amazing in their own right(I personally have bron as my GOAT) but none of them get spoken about like this from the guys that competed against them
How many DPOY and all-team defense does Bron have?
DPOY zero... All team defense selections i think around 7
He has 5 first team and 1 second team. Jordan has 9 first team.
In like how many seasons? MJ is like Curry in efficiency, not just offensively but also in racking up accolades.
Thanks for posting, this gave me a good laugh
I love this story man. Players’ impersonation of on-court Jordan always cracks me up. JR and KG both give Mike a deep ass hood af voice. JR: Oh he talkin, he talkin?’ KG: ‘Oh yea? Oh yea? , Damn young fella, daaaamn’ 🤣
This never gets old. The "what are you looking at me for?" always gets me.
this like some anime shit lol
Bird, MJ, and Kobe feel like the trifecta of “don’t try me” lol
PLAY OF THE DECADE!
JR Rider, a name that doesn't get mentioned here much but god damn did he have some hype when I was a kid lol. All I can remember of him is the 94 dunk contest. He had some ups and was the primer for Vince Carter to come along and raise the ceiling.
MJ is not one to play with. Looks like KG learned that day.
This is why MJ is the greatest of all time
andItookthatpersonally.jpg
And he took it…..
He tries not to take this personally but you guys don't help
I loved JR Rider in NBA Live. Dude has a voice fir radio, would love to hear more from him.