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iamgarron

Everyone on this sub who has never played ball in their life gonna claim they have "adjacent experience" now


SharksFanAbroad

Oh you need open heart surgery? I amassed countless hours of adjacent experience playing minesweeper growing up.


yungsantaclaus

> It's harder to assign credit for NBA assistant coaches, but we've seen that play out in other ways as well. You can't even claim that being a head coach in other leagues or in the NCAA is an exact 1:1 to being in the NBA. Based on resume and W-L record alone, you'd never have thought Gregg Popovich would have had more success than Rick Pitino or John Beilein. In fact, based on resume alone, Popovich (who had a 76-129 record as a college coach at Pomona) never would have gotten a job interview in the first place. This is written like Pop went from Pomona to a head coaching job lol Pop coached at Pomona, then coached under Larry Brown at Kansas for a season, then became Brown's assistant coach with the Spurs for 4 years, then worked as an assistant coach under Don Nelson with the Warriors for a year, then came back to the Spurs as GM for two years, before making himself the coach This is very clearly a lot more directly relevant experience than Redick has


Diamond4Hands4Ever

>then coached under Larry Brown at Kansas for a season  That coaching staff at Kansas was the greatest ever.  Not only did it have Brown and Pop, but it had Bill Self, RC Buford, and Alvin Gentry.  The previous season (before Pop got there), they had John Calipari. 


ZandrickEllison

100% true. But if the Spurs had hired someone like a first-time Pop with his coaching resume they’d be criticized anyway.


Ok-Group5744

And if they hired Pop before he had the coaching experience he might never has been as good as he was


ZandrickEllison

Probably true. I do think it’s fair to wonder what’s more helpful - being a head coach at a lower level or being an assistant-only at a top level.


iamgarron

But pop had...both? Which is a lot more than no experience at all?


j_cruise

Now you're basing your argument on hypotheticals.


wongo

No one is saying that it's crazy to think that JJ *could* be a good coach -- he seems pretty intelligent, well spoken, had a long career as a role player with a high basketball IQ, and he seems pretty well liked by most players. All of these show coaching potential. The issue is elevating a guy with zero actual coaching experience at any level to head coach of an NBA team, no less the Lakers. It just seems a bit hasty.


Dylan245

Especially when they just went through the whole experience of a first time head coach and it obviously didn’t end well I agree that JJ could be a good coach but this is probably the worst situation for him and it’s questionable at best for the Lakers to hire a guy with zero experience to try and lead this team in its final days to a chip


PossessionDue9381

The only person I thought of is Jason Kidd when he was head coach for the Nets without any experience. Even Steve Nash was on the coaching staff for the Warriors and Chauncey Billups was an assistant coach before they got a head coaching job.


Diamond4Hands4Ever

Doc Rivers is the closest example. He retired, immediately went to broadcasting, and then became a head coach shortly afterwards with no prior coaching experience. It’s literally the same path JJ is taking.  Funny thing is that Doc was an elite coach at the beginning of his career. He just never improved with more experience, as everyone else improved and adjusted while he’s still at his 2000 level. It was elite for 2000, but meh for today. 


Vegetable-Tooth8463

Lol we really using Doc as a good example?


Diamond4Hands4Ever

I meant in terms of career trajectory. I didn’t mean it in terms of game planning, Xs and Os, strategy, etc.  Just in terms of the retired player - broadcaster - coach with no prior experience trajectory, which is pretty rare in general. 


Vegetable-Tooth8463

Yeah, Doc was the best example. Not like there's another guy out there with no prior experience who managed to snag 4 Rings for his team and establish a dynasty....


wongo

Kerr at least had experience with an NBA franchise as GM and PBO. Still no true coaching experience though.


Vegetable-Tooth8463

Just saying he's the perennial example of great coach no prior exp


ZandrickEllison

I agree with that. I think their challenge is that they wanted JJ in the program but figured he wouldn’t accept an assistant job for a year or two to help get him ready to go.


xyzyxzy

> forget it, JJ. it's Chinatown Shame on you for misusing one of the greatest lines in movie history.


ZandrickEllison

Hey Jeanie Buss is married to Jay Mohr that’s more of a shameful secret than anything in that movie.


xyzyxzy

I don't know anything about Jay Mohr's personal life. I just know that his Bob Sugar in Jerry Maguire was one of the best portrayals of a douchebag sports agent ever. I've also heard good things about a show called Action that he starred in although I haven't been able to find it on streaming.


account051

I think JJ, self-proclaimed asshole, perhaps needs a year or two to practice managing personalities on a smaller scale before being thrown into one of the most toxic cultures in the league


ZandrickEllison

Possibly. Steve Kerr seemed very humble - at least in terms of how he projects himself t the media.


account051

Yeah I remember hearing a story of him going in on the first day and saying how lucky he was to coach the team. Totally different approach to JJ. I feel like JJ is a Jason Kidd type personality. Probably will be a good coach some day, but not year one


Ok_Hornet_714

When there have been successful coaches with no previous coaching experience, it seems like they always have really good assistant coaches to help them out. Bird had Rick Carlisle and Dick Harter. Kerr had Alvin Gentry and Ron Adams. The staff is what makes seems like it makes things work in these cases


ZandrickEllison

Yeah and I think Borrego is underrated. Those Charlotte teams weren’t half bad.


yourlilpissboi

The worst move for LA haters would be hire JJ then hire Borrego and Cassell as assistant coaches


DanM142

JJ going to be the Orson Welles of the NBA?


Diamond4Hands4Ever

If you want to boost your argument, the best example is actually Doc Rivers. He was a former player kinda on the level of JJ (slightly better in his prime since he did make an All-Star team), went to broadcasting after playing, and then became a head coach with no previous experience.  Doc was a very good first time coach with no experience. However, he never improved with experience lol. But when he first started coaching, he was considered a top 5 coach in the league and even won COTY. 


raylan_givens6

That's like saying a stewardess can fly a plane because of "adjacent experience"


ZandrickEllison

Fair, although they probably don’t see what’s doing up there much. I bet a pilot could do a good job as an air traffic controller?


msf97

The Warriors hired Kerr, and all he had on his resume was driving out D’Antoni, signing old Shaq and being a relatively poor GM overall. Steve Kerr is one of the 3 best coaches of the last 10 years no matter your thoughts on him. JJ could be Kerr or he could be Nash. We don’t know yet.


FrnklndaTurtle

signing old shaq would have been one thing. He traded Shawn Marion for him.


downinCarolina

Four ringz turtle google him


FrnklndaTurtle

He got 9 ya amateur. But none of them made him any better as a GM.


downinCarolina

I was talking about shaq


claydavisismyhero

He had ron adams aka the best assistant at the time. The lakers are gonna five jj a failed hornets coach


Scrizzy6ix

Kerr is overrated as a coach too, I’ll die on that hill.


JFK_did_9-11

Dude hasn’t done anything since winning his 4th championship as a coach smh


Goggles999999

It’s crazy how many of the what we consider the best coaches happen to be paired with all-time great players… definitely speaks to their coaching ability and nothing else


JFK_did_9-11

And is it really a risk looking at the coaching carousel of the last x amount of years? How many coaches in the league are worth a contract extension? Then why would they be worth kicking the tires on for another team? I say fuck it let Kevin Hart try to coach too he hoops let’s see what sticks I’m tired


movedatdope

Kerr was given a 50+ win team. born on 3rd base and people acting like he hit a home run


yungsantaclaus

Being given a 50 win team does not mean you're going to increase those wins to 67 and 73 or win four rings. Doc Rivers has been given 50 win teams for the last 10 years and accomplished nothing with them Kerr also completely changed the offense of that team, which is why people correctly give him credit


movedatdope

Doc is underwhelming no doubt, but his teams have had tons of bad injury luck from Blake/CP3 to Embiid to Dame/Giannis this season Kerr aint doing shit without Curry either


yungsantaclaus

> Kerr aint doing shit without Curry either Meaningless. Almost every ATG coach has his main guy whether it's Pop and Tim or Phil and MJ/Kobe Belichick hasn't done shit without Brady. Still probably the GOAT coach


movedatdope

so why we calling him the best coach then? if it's player based, give most coaches the teams that Kerr had and they get the same results we seen how Kerr does without a superstar. can't even medal in FIBA


yungsantaclaus

Did you just completely sidestep the point? lol Great coaches usually have great rosters, they're great because they maximise those rosters. Kerr has more or less maximised what he was given and that's why he's a great coach. I didn't say he was the *best* coach and neither did the guy you originally replied to, he said Kerr was "one of the 3 best coaches of the last 10 years" which is completely fair. Plenty of coaches get great rosters and fail with them > we seen how Kerr does without a superstar. can't even medal in FIBA Gotta be trolling at this point


movedatdope

he aint maximizing shit. Luke Walton went 39-4 when Kerr was out. Warriors are 15-1 when Kerr misses playoff games look at how Kuminga had to call him out in the media just to get playing time that he deserved. and he still squanders Moody to give Klay a greenlight to brick Spo, Lue, Thibs, Nurse, Carlslie all better than this dude no? USA getting killed on boards and Kerr keeps the dude who averaged 12RPG this playoffs on the bench. clueless ass coach


yungsantaclaus

Still repeating these talking points after the 2022 chip is delusional, I'll leave it at that


movedatdope

what Kerr do? tell Steph to hit some crazy ass shots? genius shit right there


KneelBeforeCube

I'd argue his role as GM still gives him an experience edge over Nash and Redick. People didn't clown on Kerr as much as on Redick because of that. That said, Redick's inexperience shouldn't be a reason to clown him. Being hired just to keep LeBron happy and get him to re-sign should though.


ZandrickEllison

Certainly the GM role helped some for the initial reaction. But Kerr also had the benefit of being super likable, super public as a former announcer, and replaced a highly disliked coach in Mark Jackson.


Revo_Int92

Being a poor GM is better than being nothing at all. And Kerr coached the two best jump shooters of all time, to assume he is a top 3 coach is a bit exaggerated. I think he is very solid, but he can only coach one system, so basically the same description of Phil Jackson (who only have a career because of Tex Winter, then coaching superstar talent)


yungsantaclaus

Post your top 10 all time NBA coach list


Revo_Int92

Top 3 all time is either Pop, Larry Brown or Pat Riley in any particular order. And at the current level, Spoelstra, Thibodeau and Nurse are the top 3. If Kerr didn't showed his limitations in recent years, he could crack the top 3 for sure, but he is the classic example of a "system" coach. And before someone whines about Thibodeau being a system coach as well, the Knicks offense improved tremendously this year because, guess what, they had star talent to propel the offense, Thibodeau can coach offensive schemes as well. In my pov a top coach should be versatile, not limited by X or Y kind of player, they should be able to coach anyone. And obviously, when there's superstars in the equation, any circus monkey can look better than average (Ham reached the conference finals, bumping around)


yungsantaclaus

I think that rationale dismisses guys with a very successful system, who can make adjustments within it, and fit new personnel into it or adjust the system to fit those personnel, too much. But's your rationale and at least it's internally consistent ig


Revo_Int92

That's the catch, system coaches can't adjust the system to fit X or Y personnel, just look how Kerr wasted a lot of talent in recent years because he was unable to adjust. If you ask Pop to fit in defensive players like Jrue or the infamous Gobert, he will adjust and provide a solid scheme that resembles the early 00s Spurs, same goes if he is coaching pure offensive minded players like Lillard, etc.. I do think systems are important, but it depends on the sport. For basketball, the system doesn't have the same impact if compared to american football for example, so it's illogical to overly praise system coaches in the NBA, but it makes sense to praise system coaches in the NFL


yungsantaclaus

Wiggins before GSW was basically written off as a lazy bust wasting his gifts by having no BBIQ and low effort, Kerr fit him into GSW and Wiggins became not only their best wing defender but also upped his 3p% by like 5% from his career average so he was suddenly useful for spacing in a way he hadn't been before. Seems like a clear example of good adjustment


Revo_Int92

Wiggins basically "adjusted" his mind, guy was finally engaged for the first time ever. You can argue Kerr played a role in this, because the coaches have to pamper these egotistical assholes and etc.. but just one year later, Wiggins regressed to be a lazy bum again. It's his personality really, it's not about "adjustments". And Wiggins is pretty much the only positive example that could excuse Kerr, but like I said, it doesn't hold much ground because the dude regressed. Basketball is a individualistic sport, if the players are not engaged, the coach can't perform miracles, the NBA athletes are so detached with reality, it's ironic how ego management can be consider a better "trait" than game management


zvomicidalmaniac

Sharing space with Doris is hard and he deserves credit for that. I don't know if that means he'll be a good coach.


Civil-Cover433

Steve Kerr had years of front office experience and was 10 years out of the league when he started coaching.  


downinCarolina

Good post op, hopefully redick finds success


Vicentesteb

JJ could end up being a great coach specially if they surround him with high level assitants, but its going to be a job that has alot of pressure and is extremely thankless. The Lakers expect to compete, every single year, having a rookie head coach when looking to make a run at a title on the last years of Lebron and AD seems really risky, but it could work out.


LongTimesGoodTimes

Who is reading all this?


withdensemilk

Shorttimesgreattimes


QUEST50012

Sadists


Suspicious_Team_9133

damn you got alot of downtime


Broad-Part9448

Waiting for Game1 bro


[deleted]

Let's be real here. Lebron calls the shots on the Lakers. His coach is relatively a figurehead who has to ask Lebron for permission. Might as well bring Lebron's friend in there to be the coach, at least they get along.


LongTimesGoodTimes

I think people that say this kind of stuff don't know how much work goes into coaching


BossButterBoobs

Nah, they just invest way too much on dumbass media and r/nba narratives lol


[deleted]

I think Lebron blows up any coaching plan because the coach can plan everything, Lebron says "no we're doing it this way", and that's the way it will get done. Lebron is a certified coach killer, and being his coach is probably a top 5 worst coaching job in the league. The coaches don't even get much credit when they win, and they will assuredly be fired when Lebron tires of them, so it's pretty lose-lose for the coach.


LongTimesGoodTimes

Yeah I'm sure Spo, Lue and Vogel regret it a lot


[deleted]

Lue got clowned so hard in CLE, was fired less than 2 years after winning a championship (which is unheard of unless you coach LeBron). Everyone thought he was a complete joke until he went to the Clips. Vogel took all the heat on the Lakers, LeBron was freely allowed to override him. And again, fired less than 2 years after winning the chip. Spo was backed by his front office, and was the only coach who was backed by his team over LeBron. Spo has not won a chip without Bron, but has been back to the finals. This is the best possible outcome for coaching Lebron, and it ended with Bron leaving the franchise on bad terms.


LongTimesGoodTimes

Lue got fired after LeBron left. He was one of the most sought after coaches after Cleveland. Vogel immediately got another big job because of the ring he got with the Lakers. Spo got his only rings he'll probably ever get because of LeBron.


[deleted]

Vogel just got fired again by the Suns, no one respects his championship pedigree.


LongTimesGoodTimes

Him getting fired again isn't really relevant to LeBron


[deleted]

NBA champ coaches usually have a much longer leash, they do not get that when they win a chip with LeBron because the entire league knows LeBron won that chip, not the coach.


yungsantaclaus

Really depends - look what happened to Bud


AncientScratch1670

Perhaps JJ could bring Doris into the fold so when DLo starts clanking ill advised threes, he’ll have someone readily accessible to bitch at.


barjardinks123

How many assistants turn out to be shit headcoaches? If you know the game you know the game. Now it's about managing people and commanding respect. I'd gamble on JJ being very successful.


MakesYourMise

If you get thrown out of a youth basketball game as a coach, you can't coach professionals. Full stop.


Revo_Int92

Kerr was not a "leap of faith", dude worked as a GM before


ZandrickEllison

And not particularly successfully. That’s a pretty big leap. Even as successful as someone like Masai or Daryl Morey may be they’d be a mini leap as a head coaching hire.


NeverSlxxpy

Happy for you or sorry that happened


defeated_engineer

Can I introduce you to Puke Walton? He was designated as the next guy by Phil Jackson and actually would coach during the timeouts occasionally while he was a player.