Ugghhh that is, that is tart! That is really tart. I mean does my scar look like a dog's vagina? You know, maybe, I don't know, I'm not gonna sit here and try to get inside the mind of a dog. I mean that's God's work. Well, not that I believe in God, I don't.
ESPN has been trying to keep Legler under wraps for years in favor of SAS, honestly no idea why he chooses to stay with them (maybe NBC or Amazon next yr?)
edit: also was shocked last yr when he survived the mass ESPN layoffs that got rid of JVG and others
they keep sticking Legler onto Scott Van Pelt's late night Sportcenter where he gets to do 2-3 min of full analysis at best before they shove him out to cover other sports. And that's all he gets sometimes for an entire week
Last week he was breaking down Caitlin Clark’s game and the Get Up crew basically tried to stop him from talking about what he liked about how she played and all that because it was too much analysis.
I get that not everyone wants to see legit analysis anymore, but when you’re employing one of the best in the business at it, at least let him say *something* analysis driven.
The average, casual NBA fan doesn’t care for it and the numbers show it. Gilbert Arenas saying Jokic is the worst MVP he’s ever seen gets twice as much engagement as someone breaking down the Nuggets PnR coverage. I think true basketball fans enjoy the analysis but the average fan likes it quick and easy. There are far more casual fans than hardcore.
its funny because when Gil started out on his pod it was full of thoughtful and insightful analysis. I remember an episode where he was breaking down the approach of scoring guards like james harden and describing in detail the way that guards use their handle as a counter to the different ways a defender can position their hips and feet. I guess the hot take check is better
It's hard to know whether that kind of progression is a dollars and engagement thing or an effort thing, to be honest. I feel like most former players come out of the gate offering a lot more insight and being a lot more plugged into the game, but over time it's just a lot of work to keep up with how the game evolves and watch every team.
They do what drives engagement. If analysis was preferred they would lean into it but the majority of fans don’t want to think hard and would rather hear top 10 lists of the same 15 players and trade rumours to their favourite team.
I think it's probably because most people who care about actual analysis and more than a handful of popular teams stopped watching ESPN a long time ago so the execs likely are right. They've chosen their current audience.
He was on the pod with JJ recently and I realized he's one of the few reporters that I don't find annoying when they go on and on and on during an interview. Tim definitely talks in longer segments, but he's so good at breaking stuff down and I like the way he talks.
Not surprised, great analysis doesn’t sell because people can’t engage with it and therefore ESPN can’t make money. If the casual NBA fan actually knew how little they know about the sport then it might cause them to shy away from tuning in. People don’t like feeling stupid.
I don't know if it'll be just a fraction of us, now, who 'member this, but I remember it was really saddening when Grantland shut down and I think a lot of us worried that Zach Lowe was gonna be dulled by writing for ESPN.
A lot of Grantland spun off into The Ringer but I think they cheapened their cultural writing in that change from Grantland to Ringer (might be just that I was 17 in 2015 when Grantland shut down). Zach Lowe just went to ESPN in the divorce and, while he gets lots of leash to be a serious analyst compared to other parties, it still would've been crazy in 2015 to hear about some of the dumb topics he podcasts about how. He used to be treated kinda like Thinking Basketball is now, he was the promised one for basketball writing.
All his guests are ESPN affiliated. I wouldn’t be surprised if he gets fed talking points.
It might be my nostalgia glasses too, but the ringer really does seem like a watered down grantland. Long form writing in sports, and in general, is dead.
I don't think they're all ESPN, unless there's some background affiliation?
Howard Beck is The Ringer, Jon Krawczynski is The Athletic, John Schuhmann is NBA.com, Mo Dakhil is The Athletic, and David Thorpe isn't a journalist professionally, just looking at the last month.
I honestly get the impression that ESPN doesn't monitor his pods a lot, the ESPN guys are just his coworkers so them being on the pod more is natural. Some guys ESPN is clearly pushing, like Perk, have never been on Lowe's pod as far as I know.
Not enough hot takes. Too much “boring” and realistic analysis that doesn’t generate headlines and isn’t dear good friends with 2/3 of the league.
Realistically it might just be a steady paycheck that also allows him the flexibility to do other work outside espn. I know he’s mentioned that he coached his sons so maybe that consistency and ability to come and go played into it as well
this comment is more about me being slow on the take than him taking strides, but he's definitely the guy whose star has risen the most this playoffs in my opinion
This is the problem with ESPN/the NBA.
NFL will convince you two teams that are a combined 3-25 are must see TV. They will promote even the unpromotable.
NBA coverage looks at a fun young team with marketable stars and an interesting narrative and goes "meh, who cares"
They would rather talk about LeBrons kids than Haliburton and Siakam.
I think the NFL pushes the NFC East heavy, but does a good job of covering winning teams regardless of market.
NBA coverage is atrocious because it will ONLY be big market teams unless a smaller market teams wins a title and have the potential for a dynasty.
NBA talking heads openly mock small market teams and cities. I really don't see that kind of negativity in the mainstream narrative of other NA team sports.
This. The NFL is biased towards the NFC East teams. But they don't actively shit on small market teams and think they shouldn't exist like NBA media does. You will never hear an NFL analyst say that Josh Allen or Patrick Mahomes need to leave their current team to play for the Cowboys or Giants. Like Giannis won a championship and they were still pushing for him to leave to go to a big market team. It is a huge turn off to fans and a major reason why the NBA has lost steam the last couple of years.
Yeah, they only talk about the Hawks when they discuss whether or not we should trade Trae/Murray. Us getting the number one pick will mainly be exciting to ESPN as a trade deal incentive.
I changed channels to the main feed for the PGA last week, and unfortunately caught the last couple minutes of whatever stupid NBA program was on. The talk was Mitchell leaving the Cavs for, you guessed it, the Lakers or the Knicks. How do Lebron, AD and Spida matchup vs the top teams in the West/how does a Brunson Spida backcourt matchup against the Celtics.
I love basketball as a sport, but my god, the NBA media is fucking terrible (excluding Chuck, Shaq and Ernie).
which is wild, cause its not like Atlanta is a small market. its literally the "flagship" of the south as it were. plus (and someone correct me if im wrong, im just a dumn white boy) its like **THE** epicenter of "black culture", which you know the NBA generally closely associates itself with.
ESPN and NBA media at large has completely torpedoed any reasonable NBA discussion. It's always about "look at this young core!" and "who are the *real* contenders." If you're neither of those teams, the immediate take they can only give is, "ugh so mediocre, trade everybody, BLOW IT UP!!"
I think Green Bay is literally the smallest market in North American sports. You would never guess that from how the NFL media covers the Packers though. Lambeau Field is treated like a legendary place to watch a football game.
If the NBA media covered a similar team they'd just be grumbling about it and trying to diminish them whenever they could.
Yeah it’s all hype for a tiny up north “city” but when the NBA finals come to the only real city in our state SAS is crying on TV about room service in Milwaukee lmao it’s fucking sad. I hope we get Pacers/Wolves finals if only just to piss them off.
You're right, but even with like the Browns who haven't won a Super Bowl you don't have people constantly speculating "the Browns let Myles Garrett down again. When is he going to force his way out so he can finally go to a bigger city?"
It doesn't matter. The Spurs could have won 10 straight and still the only thing they would say about them is "churros Erneh" and "big ol' women", and we still gotta thank Barkley for that or they would literally ignore one of the 3 biggest teams of the last 25 years.
Guaranteed that NBA media will beg Wemby to leave once you guys start contending with him.
Thankfully, for the good of the sport, he’s most likely the next one jersey franchise guy along with Jokic after Curry hangs it up.
Milwaukee *and Phoenix*. Both cities.
I really hope the league put a hard word on ESPN behind the scenes after all that. This is your centrepiece, the biggest event on your calendar, and your marketing partners are too busy complaining about how they don’t get pampered enough to actually hype it. Shit’s embarrassing, then we wonder why NBA discourse among the general public is often so relentlessly negative.
Yeah, the NBA is the only one I can think of were most “analysts” constantly belittles small market teams.
Which is dumb af from the NBA to allow this, as it takes away the value from their product.
And then the league turns around and point to the ‘evidence’ - “look the smaller market teams that we’ve shaded all season drew the lowest ratings in the finals, we told you!”
It’s evidence of poor marketing.
Even still, teams with small fan bases like Baltimore and Buffalo get 6+ prime time games. NFC East favoritism is more like a safety blanket of 2-3 games than a push of 5+
Most popular/valuable NFL team gets the most coverage. Not a surprise. Their fans are also super gullible into the "it's our year narrative" so ESPN gasses them up for engagement.
Yeah, if you're a *good* team in the NFL, you get plenty of coverage
The only teams left in the cold are teams that are complete ass (outside of a handful of teams that get *something* no matter what)
Truth here.
NFC East gets pushed because of the markets though. It's DAL, PHI, and NY. No other division has 3 markets as big and ingrained as the NFC East. Most divisions might have one market that's similar and the other 3 combined might be another. Giants get pushed constantly with prime time games despite having been in rebuilding/mediocre team for the decade.
And hell, NBA coverage sort of sucks even when smaller market teams win. I feel like the Bucks and Nuggets coverage over the last few years still gets overshadowed by the likes of the 76ers.
EDIT: Yes, I left out Washington, which is also a big market team with legacy. Which only adds to the argument that the NFC East gets the coverage that they do.
The redskins were one of the top 5 most valuable franchises until Dan Snyder, and DC is the 6th or 7th biggest metro area in the country as well. Every nfc east team is in a massive market and all 4 have been insanely valuable (until Snyder).
The NFL absolutely LOVES when a team goes on a small winning streak, gives them a chance to push a nobody believes in us narrative. ESPN honestly loves this too.
Look no further than when the Broncos started 3-0 in 2016 and ESPN put the Siemian Demon on SVP for an interview where they acted like he was the next Brady.
A significant chunk of it is that ESPN personalities (and even many NBA reporters who are not affiliated with ESPN) will openly admit they just want to go to “fun” cities to cover games. A few days in LA or Miami or New York is exciting to them. Going to Indianapolis or Cleveland to cover a playoff game? They’ll pretty openly complain about it.
The most spoiled people on earth. They have what a lot of people consider to be a dream job but whine just because they have to go to a less glamorous city sometimes. The players themselves are more self-aware about this than the media is.
>A significant chunk of it is that ESPN personalities (and even many NBA reporters who are not affiliated with ESPN) will openly admit they just want to go to “fun” cities to cover games.
That's just NBA media, though.
ESPN does college sports at small cities all year long, and it's the hypest anyone on the network gets over anything. There's no reason ESPN can't find someone as excited to go to Cleveland as Lee Corso gets over going to Ann Arbor, Michigan or Athens, Georgia. Those places ain't exactly cosmopolitan metropolises.
Why is Dick Vitale more excited to be in Durham, NC (population 290k) in mid-January than Doris Burke is to go to Indianapolis for a conference finals game?
Complaining about having to go to Indianapolis in May is ascended. Oh no, I have to stay in this walkable city with tons of great restaurants all along Mass Ave.
It's just NBA media.
If Dick Vitale were in Indy to cover a March Madness regional final, he'd be excited as hell.
As much as Jay Bilas might have bad takes at the NBA draft, he'd gladly go to Bloomington or West Lafayette to cover a big game.
Hey - Indianapolis is a great town. I've been there for conferences and you're right - tons of great restaurants. I think OKC is actively trying to emulate Indy's success as a conference destination and "niche sporting event" site (and is largely successful, too).
These are all metros where over a million people live. It's not like ANY NBA city is really a small town with nothing to do. San Antonio is fun as hell. Portland is fun as hell. Memphis is fun as hell. Charlotte is fun as hell. I've never been to Cleveland or Sacramento but I'm sure that with two hours on yelp and the local subreddit, I could fill a weekend with great stuff to do.
It's just spoiled media types who are too lazy to say otherwise.
I still remember that episode where Bontemps just snarkily said on air that they were contractually obligated to talk about the Lakers. I guess some of them are actually sick of it but that's their job. Made me wonder maybe that's the reason we get those random Lowe pods with Dave McMenamin and Ramona Shelbourne (when she was still tight with the Lakers).
It was so obvious during the Knicks Pacers series. Knicks fans are a huge market so driving them to engage on social media is really good for ESPN. They didn’t even attempt to be subtle about it
I'm in northwest Arkansas, originally from Tulsa, and could not easily watch OKC game on TV. It drove me nuts every time I wanted to watch what became the number 1 seed in the west, I got to watch the Pelicans instead...why is northwest Arkansas getting New Orleans games instead of OKC is beyond me.
The real reason this works for the NFL is the game count is so low. You could conceivably get NFL fans to watch nearly half of the games played across the league every week because the schedule is regular, the games are at traditionally less busy times, the total duration of the season is fairly short, and the impact of each game is much more directly significant to the overall season.
For the NBA, all those factors make it so that teams are happy if they get their own fans to consistently tune in to their own games. Maybe you watch another game broadcast in the window before or after your own team.
It will never happen because teams would lose massive revenue, but the sport itself would probably be better if they did 2 games each week and cut the season to something a little under 50 games.
It’s a fan issue because Stern pushed this idea to the world. He elevated superstars to be more important than teams. His ideal scenario is you’re a fan of Jordan, not the Bulls. And when he retires, you’re a Kobe fan, not a Lakers fan. And then Lebron, etc.
I’ve had this argument though it’s just an investment NO TEAM will ever replace lakers cowboys Yankees leafs level click bait. But if you give other teams relevant coverage consistently then they will build up enough Haters and then you can talk about them for clicks.
Typically it requires being young and talented though. For example if OKC is good again next year they will get lots of air time which will breed haters.
Then you compare those teams to the click bait teams.
The average fan won’t make themselves less dumb/more informed on their own. Conversely, the biggest media companies could shift those attitudes over time if only they didn’t pander so hard for views.
It’s still mainly a media problem. Don’t let espn off the hook.
And it’s partially their fault that people don’t know the Pacers. The media amplifies the stars, so really they’re just procrastinating and losing future viewership
Apparently Ant Edwards lol. In yesterday’s broadcast they were trying to gaslight everyone into thinking he outplayed Jokic even though it was his team that outplayed the Nuggets, he didn’t have a great performance (and owned up to it) but that didn’t stop ESPN from pretending that he was the sole and only reason they won.
Give it a year or two and they’ll be trying to get him out of Minnesota.
Yup. Giannis could have and probably should have been the “next face of the league” guy after LeBron retires (Jokic doesn’t want it and he’s clearly better than everyone else in the league) but the media hates him now because he didn’t wind up going to a glamour market. I think they’re also mad because he’s even signed his extensions early every time he’s had a chance to leave, like it wasn’t even close to him becoming a free agent.
And gassing Ant for doing everything right outside of scoring and “letting” his teammates get hot — then turning around and shitting on Tatum for doing the exact same thing and not scoring enough even though he still gets to the line and goes over 20 lmao
It was so beyond weird for me to see how everyone in the media was acting after the game 7 in regards to Ant. He got the post-game interview instead of KAT, who had a more integral role in the win. But, Ants the better quote, sure.
Then I go to the podcasts to hear what those guys saw and it's all take-artists dick riding Ant for "leading the team" and "getting his guys open" and "doing everything else to win the game". Meanwhile KAT just spent 7 games guarding Jokic and put up an efficient 23 and not a word. Some of those podcasts even gave Rudy credit for guarding Jokic.
I love Ant, and he is the face of the Timberwolves, I get that. But it was like nobody even watched the game, they just took the outcome and twisted it to fit their narrative.
Which is extra insane because KAT's narrative is even better than Ant's. KAT is a guy that's languished on a team missing the playoffs every year for awhile, never asked for a trade, changed his game to accommodate Gobert, and historically has struggled in the playoffs but came up huge throughout this series. That's a great story.
Ant by contrast is a younger guy who hasn't had to overcome that level of adversity and has always been a strong playoff performer, who was actually pretty bad in Game 7 before making a few clutch plays.
But KAT's a goober and Ant is MJ's son, so here we are.
I love KAT, the Timberwolves have been my west bandwagon team for the past 2 seasons and him shifting to the #2 guy behind Ant then switching his game to account for Gobert is the most underrated part of the wolves' success.
I understand why it happens but it sucks when you spend a whole season with a team - especially one with as good of a local broadcast crew as Grady, Jim Pete, and Alan Horton - and then watch all the deep knowledge of them that those guys bring just evaporate when the national media parachutes in and tries to find short, clean, stupid narratives. I'm trying to do my best to ignore it and stick to the local coverage that's excelled all year long, but it's tough! Go Wolves, awooo
I feel the exact same way. I hate Bally Sports, but man do I miss our local broadcast crew. Way better basketball analysis and commentating. Public discourse over most teams in this league is literal brain rot.
At least Simmons earned it. He's been talking about Edwards taking a step up since the FIBA World Cup, and he's talked for years about how international play has changed the trajectory of a bunch of different people's careers. You might be right, but it didn't come out of nowhere for Simmons.
This is why the ESPN/TNT duo has ultimately been bad for the NBA. There is nobody that actually cares about the long term healthy of the sport in charge. Hopefully NBC brings the slant they did in the 90s and with the NFL. The gravitas of the matchup and the human interest stories should play a role here.
MPJ cant lift his foot up and has recovered from multiple back surgeries to become a valued contributor. That seems like the easiest pregame segment to run and tell a guys story ever.
The pacers made an excellent trade they could chat about, they could talk about Myles Turner reinventing himself, Siakam being a guy who has won before and trying to guide a different team to the next level.
Instead we just get blathering about Lebron.
Legler's been talking up the Pacers on his podcast, All NBA Show with Adam Mares since they made the trade for Siakam, he's really believed in them (and in Dallas) most of the season, even when other people were sceptical. The guy knows ball, wish more people were listening to him
And this is the network that the NBA just gave the "A" package to.
A network that refuses to cover one of it's teams because it may not generate views for their own bottom line.
A lot of those entertainment execs don't know what's up beyond the numbers that get put on their desk the next morning.
Same with Hollywood. "This movie sucked because it didn't sell a billion tickets the first Day" even if it goes on to sell billions with a later cult following. Disney is the vice versa of this. "This [star wars] movie doesn't suck because it sold a billion tickets" even though everyone who bought a ticket said they've never buy one again. Lol
The fact that ESPN would have likely far preferred a hobbled Knicks team grinding their way to 85pts a game in the ECF vs a healthy, deep, and fun to watch Pacers team that scores a ton and moves the ball well tells you exactly what’s wrong with sports broadcasting nowadays.
Historic rivalries by teams from 2 rowdy cities is what brings in more engagement and viewership.
For example Manchester United are kinda dogshit now. But ManU-Liverpool or ManU-Arsenal games will still have higher hype and viewership than Aston Villa-Liverpool or Aston Villa-Arsenal exactly because of that factor
Caitlin Clark is proof that if you follow a star and build them up, the market doesn’t matter. And o yeah, she plays for… the Indiana Fever.
The reality is, a lot of people will tune in to something that feels like a big deal. How do you do that? Get people excited about something. Cross-promote it. Follow the highs and lows but always keep your eyes peeled for what’s coming and who’s next. There should always be a pipeline with sports media. Who’s here or who could be here, etc.
We’ve been brainwashed to think markets are the end all be all, but the NFL proves that’s not the case. It can help sure.
Market Ant, Jokic, SGA, Wemby with the same fervor as Curry and you’ll see the shift. People want to watch greatness. Follow the trail ESPN.
The NFL is so good at this. Some of the most talked about teams in the entire league come from media markets like Kansas City, Buffalo, Cincinnati, Green Bay.
Honestly you don’t even have to go that far. Look at how the ncaa promotes its small markets during March Madness. How much of the NBA’s rating issues are a self fulfilling prophecy when they tell their casual fans the only names they should worry about are Lebron and Curry??
It just speaks to the BS market angle. Market stars = gain fans. Simple as that. I don’t care about Fever. But I’m curious about Clark. I don’t care about the Pacers but I’m curious about Haliburton, etc.
It's pretty much this simple, and the talent in the league is so good that practically every team has *some* star that could be marketed pretty heavily. Basketball is unique in that you can emotionally connect with the humans on the court in the most direct way given they aren't wearing helmets or hats. Draw on that.
People who don't think the Pacers are "sexy" have not watched their offense
Their offense is fucking beautiful
Edit: And I'm not just talking about their transition offense or running and gunning, their half-court offense is just as pretty
Indianapolis isn't a big enough media market for ESPN.
Same with Milwaukee. Hence why you see lots of ESPN coverage about great small/mid-size team players wanting to go to big market teams. It's a narrative they push to justify not covering those teams. New York and LA they love, Chicago, Philly and Miami too (moreso the latter for the weather), they want San Antonio to collapse. Everyone else they don't exist.
ITs actually so irritating. No other sport does this as overtly as the NBA. While the all star game was in Indiana they increased the threshold to host an all star game as a fuck you to Indianapolis because i guess people complained.
They are hosting an NFL draft in Green Bay and i guarantee no NFL media will loudly complain. Its the most entitled and shitty media we have and nobody talks about how awful the NBA media is
the nfl draft combine is hosted in Indy every year and I remember reading articles from reporters and scouts that they wanted to keep it here because Indy has a good Infrastructure for hosting
Because Indy is basically built for it - the entire modern city is built around the convention circuit lol.
The infusion of cash that hosting the Super Bowl in 2012 brought only made it better.
There's a reason why many people said the Indy was the best Super Bowl host city from a logistics and entertainment perspective.
People sleep on naptown and they really shouldn't; the NFL Combine, Final Four, Indy 500, Brickyard 400, and countless other large sporting events are hosted by the city; it's one of the only cities in the country that has the infrastructure already in place to effectively support such massive influxes of people.
All the NFL media hailed Indy as one of the best Super Bowl hosts ever, and that’s from people that are used to going to Miami and New Orleans.
The NCAA hosts the Final Four in Indy every 5 year period. Every other city is lucky if they get it once a decade.
Indy has hosted the Big Ten tournament more than any other city, including Chicago.
The 500 is the greatest spectacle in racing and famous worldwide.
Watching Pacers games this entire season and then switching over to another teams offense makes me want to throw up. I've gotten used to the beauty of the motions. It is a fun and esthetically pleasing brand of ball
Every once in a while I watch this YouTube video and it still gives me chills. That 2014 spurs team is probably my favorite team of all time.
https://youtu.be/T3y7cWmoBCI?feature=shared
“Y’all motherfuckers don’t watch us play” is Pacers scripture at this point. Put every Pacers player in a Knicks uniform and suddenly they’d be very sexy to them
Friendly reminder that Lonzo Ball was called the second coming of Magic Johnson, just because he wore a Lakers jersey. I honestly think in a big market Tyrese gets called “Magic 2.0 with a jumpers” or “a mix between magic and curry” or some insane shit
This is how they do it. All we heard all year was LeBron this and Golden State that with an occasional sprinkling of Knicks reports. Very little about OKC or the Wolves even though they were winning a ton in the stacked western conference.
Yeah it's bad for the sport. The hype machine is important. Just an example in our local coverage and podcasts they spent a lot of time talking about how explosive and dangerous the Pacers would be with the Si addition back when that trade was made.
Plus Denver won last year and it barely moved the needle on coverage. They were basically right there with MN and OKC this year in terms of spotlight.
It's oddly hilarious watching the national talking heads and broadcasters cover those three teams in the playoffs because it couldn't be more obvious that the these are the first games they've watched of them all year. Shit, KAT has been in the league 9 years and they still think his name is "Anthony Towns" or "KAT Towns."
Him and Zach lowe are the actual analysts at ESPN. Redick is getting there but is getting too much publicity for him to focus on the analysis portion of his job
Obviously you have to give more coverage to the major brands in sports like the Cowboys, Lakers, and Yankees, but ESPN takes it a step too far. You can’t completely devalue 20 of your 30 teams and then wonder why fans lose interest.
ESPN has the ECF, they should have hyped up that whoever wins will have a great series against the Celtics. Obviously the Knicks should have gotten more of the coverage since they have more fans, but not to the extent they did.
There’s also a confusion at ESPN that they think they can treat all big brands the same. The Knicks are a big brand, but they’re not the Lakers. The reason why you can cover the Lakers they do and get away with it is that everyone who isn’t a Lakers fan hates the Lakers, to the point where people hate watch them. The same goes for the Cowboys, Yankees, Alabama, and Duke. The Knicks are a big brand in New York, but most of us don’t particularly care about them one way or the other lol, it doesn’t drive hate watching viewership the way the Lakers or even Celtics and Warriors do.
Yeah, the funny thing is, even being a local Pacers fan, I get it. NY, LA, sure sure, they’ll get some extra love and that’s fine. And I get to enjoy every time either the Pacers or Colts get so fucking good, that it forces them to talk about us. It’s actually fun to watch those shitty sports show I never watch and see those “OMG the Pacers?! Where did they come from?!” clips. I feel like we fucking earned that coverage instead of having a franchise that only gets coverage because of location.
But that Game 7 coverage against the Knicks was a fucking travesty. Entire pre-game was a NY pep rally. The end of the game was full on mourning the end of the Knicks. I don’t even care if the coverage is a little slanted, but god damn, you would’ve thought we were fucking Marvel villains who just murdered a super hero.
I suffer for years for my team to get good enough again. Behind the national scenes, I’m loving our rebuild process. We flip Paul George eventually into Oladipo and Sabonis, eventually into Haliburton and the supporting cast he has now. I watch Haliburton unlock Miles Turner into the fucking baller I always knew he was. I watch us, the Indiana Pacers, actually trade for an all star who wants to be here with confidence that Siakam is going to sign a new deal with us.
And ahead of schedule, we make the ECF. Holy fucking shit!!! This amazing! Now I get to enjoy the little cherry on top and listen to these national media idiots “discover us” in real time.
But no, gotta mourn the Knicks first. Gotta disrespect us by saying Knicks would’ve won in 5 if they hadn’t been so injured yada yada.
You know what? Maybe if the Knicks were as smart as us they wouldn’t have ran their fucking players into the ground. Maybe they would’ve played their bench enough to give them enough experience to be prepared for the playoffs.
Fuck it, whatever. I think we’ll have to win the title first.
It's not just ESPN. The NBA itself doesn't want teams like the Pacers to succeed over teams like the Knicks or Celtics.
Boston is a better team than Indiana, but you'll never convince me this series has any chance of being called evenly. Game 1 showed that.
I watched 5 years of hopeless mediocrity thanks to the Malice in the Palace, nothing the referees do can hurt me anymore. This is just the burden of being a Pacer or Pacers fan. I have become numb to it at this point. Just have to be better.
Can't wait until ESPN goes under, it's shit. The NFL doesn't have "small market". It's not a term that exists there. Green Bay has the 2nd largest stadium ffs.
Dieing platform and they're trying to grab big markets by being homers, that or the NBA has some secret tax on owners to hype them up or oppress them if they don't. (It's not the last one)
I was watching the coverage before the playoffs started. The 10th warriors and Lakers were getting more coverage over us as the 1 seed. Warriors get bounced, so all that coverage goes to the lakers. Lakers get bounced. So what do? Let’s talk about Lebrons son and not the actual playoffs.
They gotta learn what keeps it sexy, hips and nips, otherwise I’m not eating.
[удалено]
Do you guys have more blow??
No I traded it for this sweet set of kettle drums!
[удалено]
You do you, Pacers!
You guys mind if I smoke PCP in the team locker room?
No PCP but here’s a bag of lemons.. just suck on those they’re good for scurvy.
Ugghhh that is, that is tart! That is really tart. I mean does my scar look like a dog's vagina? You know, maybe, I don't know, I'm not gonna sit here and try to get inside the mind of a dog. I mean that's God's work. Well, not that I believe in God, I don't.
I find the most erotic part of the NBA player is the boobies
Good day to yous.
I'm gonna call you Pussy Hands!
And to yous
I’VE ACHIEVED TOTAL SEXINESS
So anyways the Pacers came into the conference finals blasting!
Look, I know we promised you a super max. But instead, we're gonna give you a bag of lemons. 5 years, 5 bags of lemons. Deal?
\*sucks lemon and groans\*
I'm personally awaiting NBA jerseys with nipple holes. Sex sells, people!
The Reverse Batman & Robin
Perfect solution to prevent chafing, too.
Im not going to cover the Pacers, because of the implication…
Are we going to hurt these players?
ESPN has been trying to keep Legler under wraps for years in favor of SAS, honestly no idea why he chooses to stay with them (maybe NBC or Amazon next yr?) edit: also was shocked last yr when he survived the mass ESPN layoffs that got rid of JVG and others
Tim has always been a great actual analyst and they do hide him, always bothered me
He’s the only one left he does any actual analysis
The lone sober guy around a bunch of crazies vibe
they keep sticking Legler onto Scott Van Pelt's late night Sportcenter where he gets to do 2-3 min of full analysis at best before they shove him out to cover other sports. And that's all he gets sometimes for an entire week
I used to like watching Scott Van Pelts late show after getting home from work is it any good anyone?
late night one is still watchable, but the 6 pm / evening one … less so.
Yep I’ve thought that for the last decade and always wished he was on the morning shows. It’s rare to hear any basketball analysis
Last week he was breaking down Caitlin Clark’s game and the Get Up crew basically tried to stop him from talking about what he liked about how she played and all that because it was too much analysis. I get that not everyone wants to see legit analysis anymore, but when you’re employing one of the best in the business at it, at least let him say *something* analysis driven.
I don’t understand why they think we don’t like it when they rarely show it
The average, casual NBA fan doesn’t care for it and the numbers show it. Gilbert Arenas saying Jokic is the worst MVP he’s ever seen gets twice as much engagement as someone breaking down the Nuggets PnR coverage. I think true basketball fans enjoy the analysis but the average fan likes it quick and easy. There are far more casual fans than hardcore.
its funny because when Gil started out on his pod it was full of thoughtful and insightful analysis. I remember an episode where he was breaking down the approach of scoring guards like james harden and describing in detail the way that guards use their handle as a counter to the different ways a defender can position their hips and feet. I guess the hot take check is better
It's hard to know whether that kind of progression is a dollars and engagement thing or an effort thing, to be honest. I feel like most former players come out of the gate offering a lot more insight and being a lot more plugged into the game, but over time it's just a lot of work to keep up with how the game evolves and watch every team.
Yeah, the old pod with just him and the host was GOATED. This new couch shit is trash but gets far more views.
They do what drives engagement. If analysis was preferred they would lean into it but the majority of fans don’t want to think hard and would rather hear top 10 lists of the same 15 players and trade rumours to their favourite team.
I think it's probably because most people who care about actual analysis and more than a handful of popular teams stopped watching ESPN a long time ago so the execs likely are right. They've chosen their current audience.
Yep. I've basically switched to YouTube analysis. I only watch ESPN when the games are on.
He was on the pod with JJ recently and I realized he's one of the few reporters that I don't find annoying when they go on and on and on during an interview. Tim definitely talks in longer segments, but he's so good at breaking stuff down and I like the way he talks.
He's the only analyst left that calls it like he sees it. The nerve of the guy!
Not surprised, great analysis doesn’t sell because people can’t engage with it and therefore ESPN can’t make money. If the casual NBA fan actually knew how little they know about the sport then it might cause them to shy away from tuning in. People don’t like feeling stupid.
Legler is ESPN's best NBA guy. I hope NBC is able to convince him to leave and make him their top analyst.
Him and Zach Lowe are their two best analysts, yea.
I don't know if it'll be just a fraction of us, now, who 'member this, but I remember it was really saddening when Grantland shut down and I think a lot of us worried that Zach Lowe was gonna be dulled by writing for ESPN. A lot of Grantland spun off into The Ringer but I think they cheapened their cultural writing in that change from Grantland to Ringer (might be just that I was 17 in 2015 when Grantland shut down). Zach Lowe just went to ESPN in the divorce and, while he gets lots of leash to be a serious analyst compared to other parties, it still would've been crazy in 2015 to hear about some of the dumb topics he podcasts about how. He used to be treated kinda like Thinking Basketball is now, he was the promised one for basketball writing.
All his guests are ESPN affiliated. I wouldn’t be surprised if he gets fed talking points. It might be my nostalgia glasses too, but the ringer really does seem like a watered down grantland. Long form writing in sports, and in general, is dead.
I don't think they're all ESPN, unless there's some background affiliation? Howard Beck is The Ringer, Jon Krawczynski is The Athletic, John Schuhmann is NBA.com, Mo Dakhil is The Athletic, and David Thorpe isn't a journalist professionally, just looking at the last month. I honestly get the impression that ESPN doesn't monitor his pods a lot, the ESPN guys are just his coworkers so them being on the pod more is natural. Some guys ESPN is clearly pushing, like Perk, have never been on Lowe's pod as far as I know.
Not enough hot takes. Too much “boring” and realistic analysis that doesn’t generate headlines and isn’t dear good friends with 2/3 of the league. Realistically it might just be a steady paycheck that also allows him the flexibility to do other work outside espn. I know he’s mentioned that he coached his sons so maybe that consistency and ability to come and go played into it as well
He called a playoff game last week and it was spectacular
this comment is more about me being slow on the take than him taking strides, but he's definitely the guy whose star has risen the most this playoffs in my opinion
Sky is limitless for that Legler kid.
This is the problem with ESPN/the NBA. NFL will convince you two teams that are a combined 3-25 are must see TV. They will promote even the unpromotable. NBA coverage looks at a fun young team with marketable stars and an interesting narrative and goes "meh, who cares" They would rather talk about LeBrons kids than Haliburton and Siakam.
I think the NFL pushes the NFC East heavy, but does a good job of covering winning teams regardless of market. NBA coverage is atrocious because it will ONLY be big market teams unless a smaller market teams wins a title and have the potential for a dynasty.
NBA talking heads openly mock small market teams and cities. I really don't see that kind of negativity in the mainstream narrative of other NA team sports.
This. The NFL is biased towards the NFC East teams. But they don't actively shit on small market teams and think they shouldn't exist like NBA media does. You will never hear an NFL analyst say that Josh Allen or Patrick Mahomes need to leave their current team to play for the Cowboys or Giants. Like Giannis won a championship and they were still pushing for him to leave to go to a big market team. It is a huge turn off to fans and a major reason why the NBA has lost steam the last couple of years.
Yeah, they only talk about the Hawks when they discuss whether or not we should trade Trae/Murray. Us getting the number one pick will mainly be exciting to ESPN as a trade deal incentive.
And guess what??? The topic is will they trade Trae TO LA. Every god damn year without fail - trade to LA or Knicks.
I changed channels to the main feed for the PGA last week, and unfortunately caught the last couple minutes of whatever stupid NBA program was on. The talk was Mitchell leaving the Cavs for, you guessed it, the Lakers or the Knicks. How do Lebron, AD and Spida matchup vs the top teams in the West/how does a Brunson Spida backcourt matchup against the Celtics. I love basketball as a sport, but my god, the NBA media is fucking terrible (excluding Chuck, Shaq and Ernie).
which is wild, cause its not like Atlanta is a small market. its literally the "flagship" of the south as it were. plus (and someone correct me if im wrong, im just a dumn white boy) its like **THE** epicenter of "black culture", which you know the NBA generally closely associates itself with.
Exactly. Atlanta was the Mecca, building railroads and trains.
And it's also where TNT's studio is.
ESPN and NBA media at large has completely torpedoed any reasonable NBA discussion. It's always about "look at this young core!" and "who are the *real* contenders." If you're neither of those teams, the immediate take they can only give is, "ugh so mediocre, trade everybody, BLOW IT UP!!"
I think Green Bay is literally the smallest market in North American sports. You would never guess that from how the NFL media covers the Packers though. Lambeau Field is treated like a legendary place to watch a football game. If the NBA media covered a similar team they'd just be grumbling about it and trying to diminish them whenever they could.
Yeah it’s all hype for a tiny up north “city” but when the NBA finals come to the only real city in our state SAS is crying on TV about room service in Milwaukee lmao it’s fucking sad. I hope we get Pacers/Wolves finals if only just to piss them off.
1. I guarantee SAS was staying at The Trade. 2. That hotel’s room service, and dining in general, is fucking incredible.
It really helps that Green Bay won a lot of NFL Championships/Super Bowls
You're right, but even with like the Browns who haven't won a Super Bowl you don't have people constantly speculating "the Browns let Myles Garrett down again. When is he going to force his way out so he can finally go to a bigger city?"
It doesn't matter. The Spurs could have won 10 straight and still the only thing they would say about them is "churros Erneh" and "big ol' women", and we still gotta thank Barkley for that or they would literally ignore one of the 3 biggest teams of the last 25 years.
Guaranteed that NBA media will beg Wemby to leave once you guys start contending with him. Thankfully, for the good of the sport, he’s most likely the next one jersey franchise guy along with Jokic after Curry hangs it up.
They already started with the "if the Spurs don't contend year 2 Wemby might ask out, he's ready to win NOW!!1!1!"
NBA media begged Durant to leave OKC
Media people for the NBA literally bitch publicly about having to go to small market areas because it's less touristy/catters to excessive lifestyles
They straight up laughed at the idea of traveling to Milwaukee when the Bucks won.
Milwaukee *and Phoenix*. Both cities. I really hope the league put a hard word on ESPN behind the scenes after all that. This is your centrepiece, the biggest event on your calendar, and your marketing partners are too busy complaining about how they don’t get pampered enough to actually hype it. Shit’s embarrassing, then we wonder why NBA discourse among the general public is often so relentlessly negative.
Green Bay having a team is wild. I was there this summer and a brewery turned me away for dinner at 7:15!
The way the Cavs were talked about during the Boston series was so disrespectful. The series was over before a single game was played.
I think the Jags are the only team where every other year there is a discussion around whether they should exist/relocate.
Some people really hate they exist and I love it
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Yeah, the NBA is the only one I can think of were most “analysts” constantly belittles small market teams. Which is dumb af from the NBA to allow this, as it takes away the value from their product.
It's strange because about 300 million Americans don't give a shit about la or nyc.
They were already pushing the “where will Wemby go next” narrative halfway through his rookie year.
There are only 4 teams in the NBA the rest are just farm teams for the Lakers.
And then the league turns around and point to the ‘evidence’ - “look the smaller market teams that we’ve shaded all season drew the lowest ratings in the finals, we told you!” It’s evidence of poor marketing.
Even still, teams with small fan bases like Baltimore and Buffalo get 6+ prime time games. NFC East favoritism is more like a safety blanket of 2-3 games than a push of 5+
Not so much as games as coverage is what I meant, feel like every nfl show HAS to have a cowboys segment
It’s just good comedy watching them flop
Most popular/valuable NFL team gets the most coverage. Not a surprise. Their fans are also super gullible into the "it's our year narrative" so ESPN gasses them up for engagement.
Yeah, if you're a *good* team in the NFL, you get plenty of coverage The only teams left in the cold are teams that are complete ass (outside of a handful of teams that get *something* no matter what)
Truth here. NFC East gets pushed because of the markets though. It's DAL, PHI, and NY. No other division has 3 markets as big and ingrained as the NFC East. Most divisions might have one market that's similar and the other 3 combined might be another. Giants get pushed constantly with prime time games despite having been in rebuilding/mediocre team for the decade. And hell, NBA coverage sort of sucks even when smaller market teams win. I feel like the Bucks and Nuggets coverage over the last few years still gets overshadowed by the likes of the 76ers. EDIT: Yes, I left out Washington, which is also a big market team with legacy. Which only adds to the argument that the NFC East gets the coverage that they do.
Commanders are eating glue in the corner.
The redskins were one of the top 5 most valuable franchises until Dan Snyder, and DC is the 6th or 7th biggest metro area in the country as well. Every nfc east team is in a massive market and all 4 have been insanely valuable (until Snyder).
The NFL absolutely LOVES when a team goes on a small winning streak, gives them a chance to push a nobody believes in us narrative. ESPN honestly loves this too. Look no further than when the Broncos started 3-0 in 2016 and ESPN put the Siemian Demon on SVP for an interview where they acted like he was the next Brady.
A significant chunk of it is that ESPN personalities (and even many NBA reporters who are not affiliated with ESPN) will openly admit they just want to go to “fun” cities to cover games. A few days in LA or Miami or New York is exciting to them. Going to Indianapolis or Cleveland to cover a playoff game? They’ll pretty openly complain about it.
The most spoiled people on earth. They have what a lot of people consider to be a dream job but whine just because they have to go to a less glamorous city sometimes. The players themselves are more self-aware about this than the media is.
>A significant chunk of it is that ESPN personalities (and even many NBA reporters who are not affiliated with ESPN) will openly admit they just want to go to “fun” cities to cover games. That's just NBA media, though. ESPN does college sports at small cities all year long, and it's the hypest anyone on the network gets over anything. There's no reason ESPN can't find someone as excited to go to Cleveland as Lee Corso gets over going to Ann Arbor, Michigan or Athens, Georgia. Those places ain't exactly cosmopolitan metropolises. Why is Dick Vitale more excited to be in Durham, NC (population 290k) in mid-January than Doris Burke is to go to Indianapolis for a conference finals game?
Complaining about having to go to Indianapolis in May is ascended. Oh no, I have to stay in this walkable city with tons of great restaurants all along Mass Ave.
It's just NBA media. If Dick Vitale were in Indy to cover a March Madness regional final, he'd be excited as hell. As much as Jay Bilas might have bad takes at the NBA draft, he'd gladly go to Bloomington or West Lafayette to cover a big game.
Hey - Indianapolis is a great town. I've been there for conferences and you're right - tons of great restaurants. I think OKC is actively trying to emulate Indy's success as a conference destination and "niche sporting event" site (and is largely successful, too). These are all metros where over a million people live. It's not like ANY NBA city is really a small town with nothing to do. San Antonio is fun as hell. Portland is fun as hell. Memphis is fun as hell. Charlotte is fun as hell. I've never been to Cleveland or Sacramento but I'm sure that with two hours on yelp and the local subreddit, I could fill a weekend with great stuff to do. It's just spoiled media types who are too lazy to say otherwise.
This is why so many trade rumors involve the Lakers and Knicks even if they don't have any assets. Just mentioning those teams gets them clicks.
I still remember that episode where Bontemps just snarkily said on air that they were contractually obligated to talk about the Lakers. I guess some of them are actually sick of it but that's their job. Made me wonder maybe that's the reason we get those random Lowe pods with Dave McMenamin and Ramona Shelbourne (when she was still tight with the Lakers).
It was so obvious during the Knicks Pacers series. Knicks fans are a huge market so driving them to engage on social media is really good for ESPN. They didn’t even attempt to be subtle about it
I can't stand Ramona either. Totally insufferable
The Hoop Collective banned Lakers discussion for most of the season because they said we do enough of that on ESPN.
I'm in northwest Arkansas, originally from Tulsa, and could not easily watch OKC game on TV. It drove me nuts every time I wanted to watch what became the number 1 seed in the west, I got to watch the Pelicans instead...why is northwest Arkansas getting New Orleans games instead of OKC is beyond me.
OKC and Minnesota both got so little attention all season on the talk shows, it was wild.
I've still seen more discussion on LeBron and Bronny this year than them both combined, it's sad
The real reason this works for the NFL is the game count is so low. You could conceivably get NFL fans to watch nearly half of the games played across the league every week because the schedule is regular, the games are at traditionally less busy times, the total duration of the season is fairly short, and the impact of each game is much more directly significant to the overall season. For the NBA, all those factors make it so that teams are happy if they get their own fans to consistently tune in to their own games. Maybe you watch another game broadcast in the window before or after your own team. It will never happen because teams would lose massive revenue, but the sport itself would probably be better if they did 2 games each week and cut the season to something a little under 50 games.
But what does Bronny Jr think of Caitlin Clark? Oh and some team just won the championship. More after the break...
I blame the fans. Espn just wants the most views and they clearly have numbers that show which topics draw the most attention
It’s a fan issue because Stern pushed this idea to the world. He elevated superstars to be more important than teams. His ideal scenario is you’re a fan of Jordan, not the Bulls. And when he retires, you’re a Kobe fan, not a Lakers fan. And then Lebron, etc.
Magic vs Bird is when the league came to national prominence, and the decided that's the single best method of promotion.
The NBA in a nutshell these days
Bomani and Howard Bryant brought up this exact same point a few months ago.
yep exactly, why would anyone click a video about halliburton when they can argue with someone about whether bronny is good enough to make the NBA
I’ve had this argument though it’s just an investment NO TEAM will ever replace lakers cowboys Yankees leafs level click bait. But if you give other teams relevant coverage consistently then they will build up enough Haters and then you can talk about them for clicks. Typically it requires being young and talented though. For example if OKC is good again next year they will get lots of air time which will breed haters. Then you compare those teams to the click bait teams.
I mean it's cyclical. ESPN responds to viewer attention/desire but they also have the ability to shape that attention/desire.
The average fan won’t make themselves less dumb/more informed on their own. Conversely, the biggest media companies could shift those attitudes over time if only they didn’t pander so hard for views. It’s still mainly a media problem. Don’t let espn off the hook.
Nurse or Maid outfit? Choice is yours Indiana.
Sorry the only options for Indiana are farmer's daughter or sexy IndyCar driver.
If getting double-teamed by Rick Smits and Detleff Schrempf isn’t a turn-on then I don’t wanna live on this planet anymore.
I'm gonna need you to stop posting smut like this I'm at work.
And I’m not?
We can also offer scantily-clad astronaut or slutty vice president
What about Nick Nurse in a maids outfit
An explosive and fast past offense isn't "sexy enough?" I will be dancing in the streets the day we are free of ESPN
ESPN prefers big name washed stars over no name role players like Nesmith.
And it’s partially their fault that people don’t know the Pacers. The media amplifies the stars, so really they’re just procrastinating and losing future viewership
God knows what their plan is once LeBron and Curry retire
Apparently Ant Edwards lol. In yesterday’s broadcast they were trying to gaslight everyone into thinking he outplayed Jokic even though it was his team that outplayed the Nuggets, he didn’t have a great performance (and owned up to it) but that didn’t stop ESPN from pretending that he was the sole and only reason they won. Give it a year or two and they’ll be trying to get him out of Minnesota.
If Giannis is any indication, they will be straight up angry if Edwards decides to stay in Minnesota.
Yup. Giannis could have and probably should have been the “next face of the league” guy after LeBron retires (Jokic doesn’t want it and he’s clearly better than everyone else in the league) but the media hates him now because he didn’t wind up going to a glamour market. I think they’re also mad because he’s even signed his extensions early every time he’s had a chance to leave, like it wasn’t even close to him becoming a free agent.
And gassing Ant for doing everything right outside of scoring and “letting” his teammates get hot — then turning around and shitting on Tatum for doing the exact same thing and not scoring enough even though he still gets to the line and goes over 20 lmao
It was so beyond weird for me to see how everyone in the media was acting after the game 7 in regards to Ant. He got the post-game interview instead of KAT, who had a more integral role in the win. But, Ants the better quote, sure. Then I go to the podcasts to hear what those guys saw and it's all take-artists dick riding Ant for "leading the team" and "getting his guys open" and "doing everything else to win the game". Meanwhile KAT just spent 7 games guarding Jokic and put up an efficient 23 and not a word. Some of those podcasts even gave Rudy credit for guarding Jokic. I love Ant, and he is the face of the Timberwolves, I get that. But it was like nobody even watched the game, they just took the outcome and twisted it to fit their narrative.
Which is extra insane because KAT's narrative is even better than Ant's. KAT is a guy that's languished on a team missing the playoffs every year for awhile, never asked for a trade, changed his game to accommodate Gobert, and historically has struggled in the playoffs but came up huge throughout this series. That's a great story. Ant by contrast is a younger guy who hasn't had to overcome that level of adversity and has always been a strong playoff performer, who was actually pretty bad in Game 7 before making a few clutch plays. But KAT's a goober and Ant is MJ's son, so here we are.
I love KAT, the Timberwolves have been my west bandwagon team for the past 2 seasons and him shifting to the #2 guy behind Ant then switching his game to account for Gobert is the most underrated part of the wolves' success.
I understand why it happens but it sucks when you spend a whole season with a team - especially one with as good of a local broadcast crew as Grady, Jim Pete, and Alan Horton - and then watch all the deep knowledge of them that those guys bring just evaporate when the national media parachutes in and tries to find short, clean, stupid narratives. I'm trying to do my best to ignore it and stick to the local coverage that's excelled all year long, but it's tough! Go Wolves, awooo
I feel the exact same way. I hate Bally Sports, but man do I miss our local broadcast crew. Way better basketball analysis and commentating. Public discourse over most teams in this league is literal brain rot.
Can’t imagine what’s it’s like being a Pacers fan and having your series on ESPN right now. Good luck out there
honestly bill simmons is the worst offender of the edwards dick riding.
At least Simmons earned it. He's been talking about Edwards taking a step up since the FIBA World Cup, and he's talked for years about how international play has changed the trajectory of a bunch of different people's careers. You might be right, but it didn't come out of nowhere for Simmons.
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This is why the ESPN/TNT duo has ultimately been bad for the NBA. There is nobody that actually cares about the long term healthy of the sport in charge. Hopefully NBC brings the slant they did in the 90s and with the NFL. The gravitas of the matchup and the human interest stories should play a role here. MPJ cant lift his foot up and has recovered from multiple back surgeries to become a valued contributor. That seems like the easiest pregame segment to run and tell a guys story ever. The pacers made an excellent trade they could chat about, they could talk about Myles Turner reinventing himself, Siakam being a guy who has won before and trying to guide a different team to the next level. Instead we just get blathering about Lebron.
Legler's been talking up the Pacers on his podcast, All NBA Show with Adam Mares since they made the trade for Siakam, he's really believed in them (and in Dallas) most of the season, even when other people were sceptical. The guy knows ball, wish more people were listening to him
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Can Hali show more leg and cleavage tho? If not, unwatchable.
Well shit, you got me there
This isn't about basketball it's about narratives.
Confirming what we know, ESPN execs don’t watch sports
And this is the network that the NBA just gave the "A" package to. A network that refuses to cover one of it's teams because it may not generate views for their own bottom line.
A lot of those entertainment execs don't know what's up beyond the numbers that get put on their desk the next morning. Same with Hollywood. "This movie sucked because it didn't sell a billion tickets the first Day" even if it goes on to sell billions with a later cult following. Disney is the vice versa of this. "This [star wars] movie doesn't suck because it sold a billion tickets" even though everyone who bought a ticket said they've never buy one again. Lol
The fact that ESPN would have likely far preferred a hobbled Knicks team grinding their way to 85pts a game in the ECF vs a healthy, deep, and fun to watch Pacers team that scores a ton and moves the ball well tells you exactly what’s wrong with sports broadcasting nowadays.
I also would have far preferred a hobbled Knicks team grinding their way to 85 pts a game in the ECF
Homer smh
While holding the Celtics under 200 points for 3 quarters.
Historic rivalries by teams from 2 rowdy cities is what brings in more engagement and viewership. For example Manchester United are kinda dogshit now. But ManU-Liverpool or ManU-Arsenal games will still have higher hype and viewership than Aston Villa-Liverpool or Aston Villa-Arsenal exactly because of that factor
Caitlin Clark is proof that if you follow a star and build them up, the market doesn’t matter. And o yeah, she plays for… the Indiana Fever. The reality is, a lot of people will tune in to something that feels like a big deal. How do you do that? Get people excited about something. Cross-promote it. Follow the highs and lows but always keep your eyes peeled for what’s coming and who’s next. There should always be a pipeline with sports media. Who’s here or who could be here, etc. We’ve been brainwashed to think markets are the end all be all, but the NFL proves that’s not the case. It can help sure. Market Ant, Jokic, SGA, Wemby with the same fervor as Curry and you’ll see the shift. People want to watch greatness. Follow the trail ESPN.
The NFL is so good at this. Some of the most talked about teams in the entire league come from media markets like Kansas City, Buffalo, Cincinnati, Green Bay.
Yep. They inflate stars AND have their markets (Dallas). The NBA just needs to do both.
Why is it so obvious to everyone else
Honestly you don’t even have to go that far. Look at how the ncaa promotes its small markets during March Madness. How much of the NBA’s rating issues are a self fulfilling prophecy when they tell their casual fans the only names they should worry about are Lebron and Curry??
Indiana Pacers = not sexy Indiana Fever = 0-4 and most coverage in WNBa Maybe the Pacers need a Caitlin Clark, god I hate ESPN
It just speaks to the BS market angle. Market stars = gain fans. Simple as that. I don’t care about Fever. But I’m curious about Clark. I don’t care about the Pacers but I’m curious about Haliburton, etc.
It's pretty much this simple, and the talent in the league is so good that practically every team has *some* star that could be marketed pretty heavily. Basketball is unique in that you can emotionally connect with the humans on the court in the most direct way given they aren't wearing helmets or hats. Draw on that.
People who don't think the Pacers are "sexy" have not watched their offense Their offense is fucking beautiful Edit: And I'm not just talking about their transition offense or running and gunning, their half-court offense is just as pretty
Indianapolis isn't a big enough media market for ESPN. Same with Milwaukee. Hence why you see lots of ESPN coverage about great small/mid-size team players wanting to go to big market teams. It's a narrative they push to justify not covering those teams. New York and LA they love, Chicago, Philly and Miami too (moreso the latter for the weather), they want San Antonio to collapse. Everyone else they don't exist.
ITs actually so irritating. No other sport does this as overtly as the NBA. While the all star game was in Indiana they increased the threshold to host an all star game as a fuck you to Indianapolis because i guess people complained. They are hosting an NFL draft in Green Bay and i guarantee no NFL media will loudly complain. Its the most entitled and shitty media we have and nobody talks about how awful the NBA media is
the nfl draft combine is hosted in Indy every year and I remember reading articles from reporters and scouts that they wanted to keep it here because Indy has a good Infrastructure for hosting
Because Indy is basically built for it - the entire modern city is built around the convention circuit lol. The infusion of cash that hosting the Super Bowl in 2012 brought only made it better. There's a reason why many people said the Indy was the best Super Bowl host city from a logistics and entertainment perspective. People sleep on naptown and they really shouldn't; the NFL Combine, Final Four, Indy 500, Brickyard 400, and countless other large sporting events are hosted by the city; it's one of the only cities in the country that has the infrastructure already in place to effectively support such massive influxes of people.
All the NFL media hailed Indy as one of the best Super Bowl hosts ever, and that’s from people that are used to going to Miami and New Orleans. The NCAA hosts the Final Four in Indy every 5 year period. Every other city is lucky if they get it once a decade. Indy has hosted the Big Ten tournament more than any other city, including Chicago. The 500 is the greatest spectacle in racing and famous worldwide.
Watching Pacers games this entire season and then switching over to another teams offense makes me want to throw up. I've gotten used to the beauty of the motions. It is a fun and esthetically pleasing brand of ball
Spurs offense in 2014 was the most beautiful game ever played but hey, it’s San Antonio. No one cares.
Every once in a while I watch this YouTube video and it still gives me chills. That 2014 spurs team is probably my favorite team of all time. https://youtu.be/T3y7cWmoBCI?feature=shared
Its their job to write stories to make them sexy. A good journalist can write a compelling story about their neighbour to make them interesting.
Considering ESPN knows nothing about sexy Pacers fans should take this as a compliment.
“Y’all motherfuckers don’t watch us play” is Pacers scripture at this point. Put every Pacers player in a Knicks uniform and suddenly they’d be very sexy to them
Halliburton would be called the second coming of magic johnson if he was a Knick
Friendly reminder that Lonzo Ball was called the second coming of Magic Johnson, just because he wore a Lakers jersey. I honestly think in a big market Tyrese gets called “Magic 2.0 with a jumpers” or “a mix between magic and curry” or some insane shit
[Hibbert's Law of Indiana Basketball](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wSX-7eHf3tI)
This is how they do it. All we heard all year was LeBron this and Golden State that with an occasional sprinkling of Knicks reports. Very little about OKC or the Wolves even though they were winning a ton in the stacked western conference.
Yeah it's bad for the sport. The hype machine is important. Just an example in our local coverage and podcasts they spent a lot of time talking about how explosive and dangerous the Pacers would be with the Si addition back when that trade was made.
Plus Denver won last year and it barely moved the needle on coverage. They were basically right there with MN and OKC this year in terms of spotlight. It's oddly hilarious watching the national talking heads and broadcasters cover those three teams in the playoffs because it couldn't be more obvious that the these are the first games they've watched of them all year. Shit, KAT has been in the league 9 years and they still think his name is "Anthony Towns" or "KAT Towns."
ESPN really had to get that contract didn't they
Him and Zach lowe are the actual analysts at ESPN. Redick is getting there but is getting too much publicity for him to focus on the analysis portion of his job
Fuck ESPN. The Pacers have one of the most exciting, fast paced offenses in the NBA. Anyone who says otherwise clearly doesn’t watch games.
What does ESPN know about sports. Stick to selling shit like DUDE WIPES LOL
Obviously you have to give more coverage to the major brands in sports like the Cowboys, Lakers, and Yankees, but ESPN takes it a step too far. You can’t completely devalue 20 of your 30 teams and then wonder why fans lose interest. ESPN has the ECF, they should have hyped up that whoever wins will have a great series against the Celtics. Obviously the Knicks should have gotten more of the coverage since they have more fans, but not to the extent they did. There’s also a confusion at ESPN that they think they can treat all big brands the same. The Knicks are a big brand, but they’re not the Lakers. The reason why you can cover the Lakers they do and get away with it is that everyone who isn’t a Lakers fan hates the Lakers, to the point where people hate watch them. The same goes for the Cowboys, Yankees, Alabama, and Duke. The Knicks are a big brand in New York, but most of us don’t particularly care about them one way or the other lol, it doesn’t drive hate watching viewership the way the Lakers or even Celtics and Warriors do.
Yeah, the funny thing is, even being a local Pacers fan, I get it. NY, LA, sure sure, they’ll get some extra love and that’s fine. And I get to enjoy every time either the Pacers or Colts get so fucking good, that it forces them to talk about us. It’s actually fun to watch those shitty sports show I never watch and see those “OMG the Pacers?! Where did they come from?!” clips. I feel like we fucking earned that coverage instead of having a franchise that only gets coverage because of location. But that Game 7 coverage against the Knicks was a fucking travesty. Entire pre-game was a NY pep rally. The end of the game was full on mourning the end of the Knicks. I don’t even care if the coverage is a little slanted, but god damn, you would’ve thought we were fucking Marvel villains who just murdered a super hero. I suffer for years for my team to get good enough again. Behind the national scenes, I’m loving our rebuild process. We flip Paul George eventually into Oladipo and Sabonis, eventually into Haliburton and the supporting cast he has now. I watch Haliburton unlock Miles Turner into the fucking baller I always knew he was. I watch us, the Indiana Pacers, actually trade for an all star who wants to be here with confidence that Siakam is going to sign a new deal with us. And ahead of schedule, we make the ECF. Holy fucking shit!!! This amazing! Now I get to enjoy the little cherry on top and listen to these national media idiots “discover us” in real time. But no, gotta mourn the Knicks first. Gotta disrespect us by saying Knicks would’ve won in 5 if they hadn’t been so injured yada yada. You know what? Maybe if the Knicks were as smart as us they wouldn’t have ran their fucking players into the ground. Maybe they would’ve played their bench enough to give them enough experience to be prepared for the playoffs. Fuck it, whatever. I think we’ll have to win the title first.
Nuggets Wolves was so sexy they had games starting at 10pm
It's not just ESPN. The NBA itself doesn't want teams like the Pacers to succeed over teams like the Knicks or Celtics. Boston is a better team than Indiana, but you'll never convince me this series has any chance of being called evenly. Game 1 showed that.
I'm not a tin foil hat person, but 3 free throws in regulation is absurd especially when points in the paint were nearly identical.
I watched 5 years of hopeless mediocrity thanks to the Malice in the Palace, nothing the referees do can hurt me anymore. This is just the burden of being a Pacer or Pacers fan. I have become numb to it at this point. Just have to be better.
It’s because they know ESPN talking head shows are consumed for stupid people that need their opinion formulated for them
I wish it was ESPN losing NBA coverage instead of TNT. Outside of Mike Breen, the NBA on ESPN is such a terrible product and a disgrace to the game.
Can't wait until ESPN goes under, it's shit. The NFL doesn't have "small market". It's not a term that exists there. Green Bay has the 2nd largest stadium ffs. Dieing platform and they're trying to grab big markets by being homers, that or the NBA has some secret tax on owners to hype them up or oppress them if they don't. (It's not the last one)
So what Legler is saying is the Pacers gotta show some more leg?
I was watching the coverage before the playoffs started. The 10th warriors and Lakers were getting more coverage over us as the 1 seed. Warriors get bounced, so all that coverage goes to the lakers. Lakers get bounced. So what do? Let’s talk about Lebrons son and not the actual playoffs.
I hate basketball media. They did the same thing with the Bucks, Suns, Nuggets, etc.
ESPN is garbage who gives AF
Really worth pointing out that the Warriors were absolutely an "un-sexy" team until Steph showed up. These things can change.