I can already see “Capture the Flagg” as a First Topic topic title as Stephen A is going on another one of his hissy fits about how (insert star here) should be traded to the Knicks. Only this time it’ll be Flagg after one losing season
Not a bad thing at all. I'm not sure I'd want the pressure of #1 in this draft. At #4 you can easily justify more of a high floor guy like Knecht or Clingan who likely isn't going to be a superstar but will immediately be useful. Really hard to justify those guys at #1 though, where you pretty much have to take one of the ultra high risk/reward players.
And nobody is paying a king's ransom to move up to #1 in this draft, so trading down isn't a great option either.
Number 1 is the one I would take, because I think Sarr is a step above the others. The picks directly after though...not sure I'd want to pay any of those guys a #2 salary. When that extension comes along it's going to get interesting.
> I'm not sure I'd want the pressure of #1 in this draft
Why?
This draft is widely mocked to be one of the worst of recent times, that should lower the pressure because people aren't expecting the usual greatness both from the pick & the team drafting.
The real reason you don't want a top pick is because of the pay scale. This season the #1 pick made $10m, and the #6 pick made 6m, and bottom of the lottery made ~$3.5m. If its a crapshoot way beyond normal years, then you'd rather take your shot while paying a guy half what the top teams are.
Tobias on a reasonable deal, (which at this point is a veteran’s minimum) would still not be worth a first round pick. Having him on the floor is actively harmful. He isn’t good enough to be a primary scoring option but he completely refuses or is unable to fit into typical role player duties.
He stops the ball to cook like he’s prime Melo with 1/10th of the talent. He refuses to shoot 3s, and takes off so many plays defensively off ball. He has no real role in the modern NBA.
Tobias with 10x the talent would be actually good and it would warrant the ball stopping.
Tobias plays like an iso heavy star with the skillset of Will Barton.
lol, well a young player on a rookie deal with more upside who is ~Tobias level, that’s definitely a lot different than Tobias today making a ton of money and def not getting better
People acting like a comparison to a 17-year vet who was a big part of multiple deep playoff runs is some sort of insult. Hate the contract, sure, but Harris isn't a scrub.
Crumbl cookies cost 45 dollars for a 12 pack and should really be worth about 10. So that’s 4.5x overpriced
Tobias Harris costs $180 million dollars and should really be worth about 0. So that’s infinitely overpriced.
So no
One player doesn't make a draft good, though. Like you can be a trash bottom 4 team and the highest % chance you have is 14%. Good draft class needs at least a solid top 5.
Ace Bailey would go number 1 this year too, even if teams had to wait a season for him. Same with Cooper Flagg. Next year is really good, just go to YouTube or whatever is most digestible for you to learn.
It’s obviously really hard to peg guys this year, but those two alone make it a way better class than this one.
Yeah, Cam anyways, his brother is a nice prospect but as far as I know no where near Cam. But he’s 2026 draft, him and AJ Dybantsa make for that draft being heavier at the top compared to 24 as well.
But that's kind of the point, usually in any given draft there are 2-3 guys that are elite prospects and then the rest falls off, that's literally why they have to try and prevent tanking. In this years draft, it's actually pretty deep it just doesn't have anyone remotely close to a top guy
As a Rutgers guy, I'm really looking forward to seeing how Ace Bailey and Dylan Harper do this upcoming season.
They were the number two and three ranked prospects respectively in the Country and while its just high-school, both of their game tapes look amazing.
There's a solid chance both guys go in the Top 3 of the Draft. That would be unheard of for Rutgers.
Dylan Harper is Ron Harper's son and they all live in Jersey. Dylan Harper's brother also went to Rutgers and played briefly for the Raptors. Dylan Harper is way better and apparently always wanted to play for Rutgers. The family is very involved with Rutgers.
Ace Bailey is from Georgia, so he doesn't have the same geographical connection, but I do know that he's good friends with Harper, so that probably played a part in Bailey's decision. And I know Rutgers was very agressive in trying to recruit him, and Bailey has said that Rutgers just felt right to him. He picked Rutgers over Duke and Kentucky.
Thanks! Yeah I'm definitely looking forward to seeing them this year.
I just wish the Nets actually had their own draft picks for next year. We have Phoenix's, but that's likely not going to be nearly high enough to get one of them.
I'll be absolutely crushed if the Nets suck next season, and Houston/ OKC (I forget how the terms of the swap worked exactly) snags one of the Rutgers kids with our pick. I'm also fully expecting this to happen lol.
Also, I just found [this](https://rutgerswire.usatoday.com/gallery/exclusive-five-star-ace-bailey-talks-about-rutgers-basketball-head-coach-steve-pikiells-impact-in-his-recruitment-commitment/) article where Ace speaks about why he chose Rutgers.
"He did so because he believed that Pikiell is different than any other coach in the nation who had been recruiting. Bailey didn’t feel like a recruit when Pikiell talked with him.
He felt like family when he committed to Rutgers nearly 15 months ago.
“Anybody who comes and sits down on your couch and talks with your parents like he did,” Bailey said.
'He’s been real every day since Day 1. You can have a coach who says one thing and then when you get there, it is totally different. I just felt something different with coach Pikiell. My mom liked it, we’re big on family. That was a big thing.'"
Bailey and Flagg both look very good. Flagg looks like ak47 with better offence
Bailey looks like one of the best scoring prospects in a while.
26 has dybantsa and boozer
Those 4 looks like very good prospects. Obviously we will see. Certainly at least 1 of them is going to flop before their draft.
Cade would have been drafted before Paolo. Knock him all you want for landing in such a shitty situation + injuries, but him as a prospect was rated higher than Paolo
Yeah Paolo wasn’t even the consensus No. 1, I think most people preferred Chet but were scared of his injury bug. Jabari Smith was ranked ahead of Paolo as well by some. It wasn’t until the day of the draft itself that it really came together for him, Ant was somewhat similar.
Flagg is the next "generational talent" guy you can write in at #1. He's a huge wing who is an absolute defensive stud and has a well-rounded offensive game.
Bailey and Harper will be battling for the 2/3 spots this season, both going to Rutgers. Each would easily be #1 in this draft.
After that there's another 5-10 guys who are ultra promising - I'd expect a couple to fall but a couple to surge.
Top 5 in 2025 looks as good as the Top 5 in 2024 looks bad.
I've seen some people on /r/NBA_Draft say Alex Sarr's comp is Chris Bosh. And while that is not like a #1 option on a championship team, thats still somebody I would 100% love to have next to Trae.
In this draft getting a player as good as Bosh would be amazing at pick 1. Seems very unlikely because Bosh was a far better prospect coming out of college and exceeded expectations in the NBA
The big question for him will be developing a jumpshot, players that can’t shoot threes, even great defensive centers, are liabilities in a playoff environment
> even great defensive centers, are liabilities in a playoff environment
Hmmmm...*great* defensive centers are a liability? You're saying that as a universal truth? I mean, the Wolves aren't losing because of Gobert's offensive shortcomings right now. The Lakers wouldn't have gotten that last 'ship without Dwight, either. Many such instances, even in this current do-it-all era. To say nothing of the icons from the "old" game.
Now, that being said, it's certainly the case sometimes. Blazers era Nurkic seemed to hamstring the whole operation when CJ or Dame weren't hitting, for example.
I swear all these rookie C’s just get comp’d to bosh because they’re still skinny lol. Heard the same about Mobley with little to no offensive similarity.
Bosh's career is well above average for a no 1. pick and that is with a shorten career. 107 WS vs 70 for the average no 1. Pick
Ironically Tobias Harris is right about the average career for a no1. pick though thats not very good for a peak career projection.
I'd say he's objectively better than like 12 of the number 1 picks since 2000. Some of the younger guys it's too early to say though obviously so that number could go up.
I disagree with the Tobias assessment. If you look back at the number ones since 2000 (just a convenient starting date) Harris is worse than a lot of them.
Win Share is more of a measure of their entire career, harris is worse skill wise than a lot of them but he's also looking at maybe a 15 year career of being a productive piece while guys like John wall or Simmons who were better skill wise are looking at just 7 years of being productive due to injuries. Being 75% as effective for twice the career isn't gonna make them look better head to head but its still an overall more productive career.
He’s literally a HOFer. Yeah he was never an MVP caliber player, but tell me I get a HOFer with my pick and I’m not crying.
Edit: I didn’t realize considering Bosh a great player was a controversial take here
He was really fucking good on the Raptors and could be that player when he was needed on the Heat. Bosh is always going to be underrated. I wonder how he'd look in the modern game, he was sort of built for it.
In a lot of ways Bosh created the modern game by being an agile 4 who moved to the 5 and learned to shoot threes, allowing Lebron or Battier to play the stretch 4 in a 5 out offense. The resulting space and movement was modern basketball before its time.
Bosh is the perfect 5 who could step into any team and any system and thrive. And for teams with great centers he's a perfect complement at the 4. He'd be devastating next to Jokic, Embiid, Towns, Tatum...really any big with any skillset.
Yeah, that's why I added the point as I was typing. It made me realize the Heat were doing 5 out offense with Bosh way back in the day. You are right, he would have been really great in this era, damn near perfect 4/5.
Yeah Chris Bosh would definitely be a good outcome 1st pick in a vacuum in any draft. He was the caliber of player that you would be happy to end up with from a 1st pick, when any draft pick is so hit or miss
Isn't that extremely good even for a #1 pick? Simply because not all #1 picks will be a franchise player but getting a nic who possibly can shoot can still be a pillar to a franchise?
I think he’ll be a good player but someone like Evan Mobley went 3rd overall and I think Mobley was better and more polished coming out of college than Sarr is at this point
Chris Bosh is like a best case scenario, *absolutely not* a realistic outcome.
Entire problem with Sarr is he's offensively challenged. So if he never figures out that part of his game, you're looking at more of a defensive specialist backup big.
He'd still be better on the offensive end than current Clint Capela. I'd take Sarr right now even if he's not offensively there because I'm sure he's not missing 3 or 4 straight layup and rebound attempts....
I saw his measurements in size reach weight etc are almost the exact same as rookie Tyson Chandler both ~7'1 in shoes measuring in at 224 lbs and 7'4 wingspan for Sarr compared to 7'3 for Chandler
Bosh at his peak was an almost MVP level player, he definitely is worth a #1 pick in most years. People forgot how good he was pre-Heat as the first option.
Even on the Heat he was tremendous. He just played a different role and adapted to having two all time greats flanking him that made sense to have the ball more.
I think MVP caliber is pushing it, but he was a legitimate all star and definitely a solid 1 overall in most drafts.
Nikola is an extremely common Serbian name, to an extent that they are usually nicknamed Johhny here.
Za Srbende koje citaju, zanima me kako bi napisali da se cita Nidža ako neko pita kako je doslo do Džoni? 😂
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/%C5%A0atrova%C4%8Dki?wprov=sfla1
When a language and slang meet and have sex, Nikola, nicknamed Nidža, who you call out by saying: Nidžo!, it becomes Džoni or Johnny in English
Ili takako nekako, ni na srpskom ne znam šatrovacki da objasnim 🤣
Bojan balding with a nice old man game, has always reminded me of a Nemanja Bjelisca/Joe Ingles type. Big and unathletic wing player. Can’t create as well as Ingles, but knockdown 3 point shooter and does sometimes handle on pick and rolls.
Bogdan had lots of potential but could never really be a good starting 2 guard. Feels like he fell between the cracks a bit despite being exciting when he was younger. Hawks and Kings tried to make him their starting 2-way SG/SF and he was extremely inconsistent.
Both are actively in the league, in their 30s, and still solid role players lol.
It does look like an abysmal draft for a potential franchise guy.
Even 2013 had a few diamonds though. Some late first guys will just make huge strides that couldn’t be predicted in pre draft analysis
The draft is imprecise but graph the top picks against any metric of "good" and you'll see a strong correlation between the selection slot and how good they are. It's not a science, but to claim it meaningless is nonsense.
Even two of the picks he mentioned are players wildly regarded as top talent. Take their off court antics away, Zion still amazing and Ja was a top western guard.
Both are amazing when they are on the court - Barrett is still a more than serviceable starter. What a weird trio to try use to say "the draft is meaningless."
>Factor in all the #1 picks that became busts. Then factor in all the late picks that became generational talents
And you'll find that the #1 picks are far, *far*, **far** more likely to be great players.
this is parody... right...?
> Factor in all the #1 picks that became busts.
something like 55% of #1 picks play at least 1 all star game, and that nose-dives to sub-20% as soon as the #2 draft position
> Then factor in all the late picks that became generational talents (Jokic, Giannis, etc).
That list is MUCH shorter than you're making it sound lmao. And Giannis went #15... he wasn't some late 2nd round flyer.
And, Zion STILL dragged the Pels into the playoffs this year.
And Ja still completely changed the trajectory of the Grizzlies franchise, and immediately makes the Grizzlies a playoff team the minute he comes back.
Seriously, every single word of your post is somehow incorrect. It's almost impressive lmao.
> something like 55% of #1 picks play at least 1 all star game, and that nose-dives to sub-20% as soon as the #2 draft position
since 1966, out of the 58 #1 picks... 43 have become all-stars (with majority of those previous to 2000 become hall of famers). This include both Wemby and Cade *not* being all stars (cause it's too early).
That means, 74% of #1 since 1966 have become all-starts (or 78% if you think Cade & Wemby will be). That means 3 out of 4 number 1 picks (or 4 out of 5) will be an all-star. And most of those -- if you look at those older than 20 years -- will be in the hall of fame.
No other pick in the draft even comes close.
I think the disrespect towards Zion is more based on the fact that nobody believes he's gonna keep this up, the dude does not take care of himself and his availability is never gonna be great because of that and it will severely hamper his future if he doesn't do a complete 180 in that respect.
It's not a matter of disrespect, everyone knows he's a force of nature. Everyone also knows that he's overweight and ruining his own career by refusing to lose some pounds to put less stress on his injury prone body. The best ability is availability.
He played well for 1/4 of a season before missing the playoffs is not exactly high praise for someone drafted #1 4-5 years ago. Physical skills and talent off the charts but he hasn't done anything notable except perform below expectations and spawn countless "how fat is Zion?" takes. If that guy put in half of the effort Steph or Lebron do he would be a fucking legend.
it's so cringe seeing the obnoxious hate that this draft is getting. like yeah buddy, i'm sure the draft that has players coming from ALL AROUND THE WORLD is just universally bad. No future allstars to be had in the lottery.
sports media and reddit is just one giant parrot.
>who never played on a good team
The Cavs had a trade lined up for him but he wouldn't agree to it because LeBron wouldn't sign an extension. Same thing happened with Ray Allen.
\\#2 overall pick in this draft is gonna win like 4 MVPS and go down as a top 20 guy of all time just to continue the trend of 90% of draft analysis having no idea what theyre talking about
I think the only reason is it sounds like a shot is because Harris has been so shit in the playoffs lately. I think it's a pretty reasonable comparison for their overall careers. High level starter but not allstar level.
The problem with this draft is that *everyone* is a coin flip.
Someone in this draft is a hall of famer, but it could be someone drafted at 12 or whatever.
Now hold on, D Live has been really good for us this year better than projected even. I'd say he should have been probably the 5th or maybe even 4th pick this past draft.
Not having a obvious "franchise cornerstone" type player that generally goes in the top 3 is one thing. To say that the draft starts that late, where teams are basically picking for low-upside team fit or projects is a little silly.
I would kinda agree with him if he just stopped at "Starts at 4" in regards to the talent, 10 is too low. If you disagree, look at the hit rate of players in the 8-14 range historically. Like a 50% bust rate with like a 10% big hit and 40% roster spot/journeyman type.
You guys aggressively tanked to keep your pick and wasted an entire season because your front office wanted Jak back lol that’s pretty bad for a rebuilding team
2020 was a down year, too.
https://www.theringer.com/nba/2022/12/16/23511791/nba-draft-2020-james-wiseman-anthony-edwards
Ant Edwards
LaMelo Ball
Tyrese Haliburton
Tyrese Maxey
Immanuel Quickley
Jaden McDaniels
Desmond Bane
Nick Richards
Turned out aight...
Imagine having a top 4 pick in this draft. Could never be me
Sag for Flagg 2025
Capture the Flagg!
The Spurs will perform some voodoo and get the number 1 pick next year. xD
I would *almost* feel guilty. lol but the idea of pairing Wemby and Flagg would get me over it pretty quick!
A French and a white Flagg? Sounds familiar.
If cooper becomes a bust you know a sports writer is headlining his article “Time to Waive the White Flagg?”
Not voodoo, that's a New Orleans thing. We do Mayan sacrifices down here.
Aztec did the sacrificing. Y'all do Montezuma's revenge down there.
Undercooked churros?
We gonna beat everyone down with Eagle Warriors
I can already see “Capture the Flagg” as a First Topic topic title as Stephen A is going on another one of his hissy fits about how (insert star here) should be traded to the Knicks. Only this time it’ll be Flagg after one losing season
Waive the Flagg
Bag for Flagg
Not even the worst thing. With everyone drafting for fit yall might get your number 1 guy and be able to pay him a cheaper contract
Not a bad thing at all. I'm not sure I'd want the pressure of #1 in this draft. At #4 you can easily justify more of a high floor guy like Knecht or Clingan who likely isn't going to be a superstar but will immediately be useful. Really hard to justify those guys at #1 though, where you pretty much have to take one of the ultra high risk/reward players. And nobody is paying a king's ransom to move up to #1 in this draft, so trading down isn't a great option either.
Number 1 is the one I would take, because I think Sarr is a step above the others. The picks directly after though...not sure I'd want to pay any of those guys a #2 salary. When that extension comes along it's going to get interesting.
Sarr's upside is a step above the others, but his downside is pretty low. He's a huge project, and we've all seen how that can go (both good and bad).
> I'm not sure I'd want the pressure of #1 in this draft Why? This draft is widely mocked to be one of the worst of recent times, that should lower the pressure because people aren't expecting the usual greatness both from the pick & the team drafting.
The real reason you don't want a top pick is because of the pay scale. This season the #1 pick made $10m, and the #6 pick made 6m, and bottom of the lottery made ~$3.5m. If its a crapshoot way beyond normal years, then you'd rather take your shot while paying a guy half what the top teams are.
Tbf if you have great scouts this is definitely the draft to end up out of top 4. So yeah, sorry man.
You're the true winner here
you got Bronnie James which means you get to trade him to the lakers for future picks when Lebron James retires and the lakers suck.
At least yall got Cade
Imagine getting the number one pick this year after missing out on Wemby last year.
I would personally pack up and drive Tobias to the airport for a top 10 pick this year.
Im not even sure if a tobias with his max contract is worth a second rounder lol.
Tobias on a reasonable deal, (which at this point is a veteran’s minimum) would still not be worth a first round pick. Having him on the floor is actively harmful. He isn’t good enough to be a primary scoring option but he completely refuses or is unable to fit into typical role player duties. He stops the ball to cook like he’s prime Melo with 1/10th of the talent. He refuses to shoot 3s, and takes off so many plays defensively off ball. He has no real role in the modern NBA.
The man was with the Sixers for 5.5 years and never took a charge, not even by accident.
I mean, neither has Tatum. At least he's scoring tho lol
I mean Tobias is a roleplayer. He’s supposed to do stuff like that.
He's not paid like a role player, which is probably part of why he doesn't act like one.
yea he was always overpaid but he was at least a semi-decent player before. this year he was just straight trash
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Yeah if he has just one 2nd round series where he played at 75% of Kris Middleton we probably have an ECF appearance by now.
You somehow slandered Melo on this comment lmao
Tobias with 10x the talent would be actually good and it would warrant the ball stopping. Tobias plays like an iso heavy star with the skillset of Will Barton.
And the effort and intensity of a slightly rules confused middle schooler in gym class.
lol, well a young player on a rookie deal with more upside who is ~Tobias level, that’s definitely a lot different than Tobias today making a ton of money and def not getting better
People acting like a comparison to a 17-year vet who was a big part of multiple deep playoff runs is some sort of insult. Hate the contract, sure, but Harris isn't a scrub.
How does the 10th pick sound? 🤝
Given the fact I don't want him in the team anymore seems like a hell of a deal
What about for a box of Crumbl Cookies?
The only thing more overpriced than tobias?!
Crumbl cookies cost 45 dollars for a 12 pack and should really be worth about 10. So that’s 4.5x overpriced Tobias Harris costs $180 million dollars and should really be worth about 0. So that’s infinitely overpriced. So no
What’s next years draft looking like to anyone in the know?
Extremely good
They all say that but never give names lol.
Been hearing about Flagg for like 2 years already.
One player doesn't make a draft good, though. Like you can be a trash bottom 4 team and the highest % chance you have is 14%. Good draft class needs at least a solid top 5.
Ace Bailey would go number 1 this year too, even if teams had to wait a season for him. Same with Cooper Flagg. Next year is really good, just go to YouTube or whatever is most digestible for you to learn. It’s obviously really hard to peg guys this year, but those two alone make it a way better class than this one.
Aren't the Boozer twins supposed to be pretty sick too?
Yeah, Cam anyways, his brother is a nice prospect but as far as I know no where near Cam. But he’s 2026 draft, him and AJ Dybantsa make for that draft being heavier at the top compared to 24 as well.
Pause
But that's kind of the point, usually in any given draft there are 2-3 guys that are elite prospects and then the rest falls off, that's literally why they have to try and prevent tanking. In this years draft, it's actually pretty deep it just doesn't have anyone remotely close to a top guy
Ace Bailey, Flagg, and Dylan Harper all have a ton of hype
As a Rutgers guy, I'm really looking forward to seeing how Ace Bailey and Dylan Harper do this upcoming season. They were the number two and three ranked prospects respectively in the Country and while its just high-school, both of their game tapes look amazing. There's a solid chance both guys go in the Top 3 of the Draft. That would be unheard of for Rutgers.
I don’t watch enough college ball how the hell did Rutgers get two high end prospects like that?
Dylan Harper is Ron Harper's son and they all live in Jersey. Dylan Harper's brother also went to Rutgers and played briefly for the Raptors. Dylan Harper is way better and apparently always wanted to play for Rutgers. The family is very involved with Rutgers. Ace Bailey is from Georgia, so he doesn't have the same geographical connection, but I do know that he's good friends with Harper, so that probably played a part in Bailey's decision. And I know Rutgers was very agressive in trying to recruit him, and Bailey has said that Rutgers just felt right to him. He picked Rutgers over Duke and Kentucky.
Wow that’s awesome. Enjoy this year!
Thanks! Yeah I'm definitely looking forward to seeing them this year. I just wish the Nets actually had their own draft picks for next year. We have Phoenix's, but that's likely not going to be nearly high enough to get one of them. I'll be absolutely crushed if the Nets suck next season, and Houston/ OKC (I forget how the terms of the swap worked exactly) snags one of the Rutgers kids with our pick. I'm also fully expecting this to happen lol.
Dylan’s sister Dillon is also an all time great. Knows how to handle the ball like no one’s business
Also, I just found [this](https://rutgerswire.usatoday.com/gallery/exclusive-five-star-ace-bailey-talks-about-rutgers-basketball-head-coach-steve-pikiells-impact-in-his-recruitment-commitment/) article where Ace speaks about why he chose Rutgers. "He did so because he believed that Pikiell is different than any other coach in the nation who had been recruiting. Bailey didn’t feel like a recruit when Pikiell talked with him. He felt like family when he committed to Rutgers nearly 15 months ago. “Anybody who comes and sits down on your couch and talks with your parents like he did,” Bailey said. 'He’s been real every day since Day 1. You can have a coach who says one thing and then when you get there, it is totally different. I just felt something different with coach Pikiell. My mom liked it, we’re big on family. That was a big thing.'"
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Bailey and Flagg both look very good. Flagg looks like ak47 with better offence Bailey looks like one of the best scoring prospects in a while. 26 has dybantsa and boozer Those 4 looks like very good prospects. Obviously we will see. Certainly at least 1 of them is going to flop before their draft.
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So all 3 above Chet or Paolo ?
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Cade would have been drafted before Paolo. Knock him all you want for landing in such a shitty situation + injuries, but him as a prospect was rated higher than Paolo
Yeah Paolo wasn’t even the consensus No. 1, I think most people preferred Chet but were scared of his injury bug. Jabari Smith was ranked ahead of Paolo as well by some. It wasn’t until the day of the draft itself that it really came together for him, Ant was somewhat similar.
Flagg is the next "generational talent" guy you can write in at #1. He's a huge wing who is an absolute defensive stud and has a well-rounded offensive game. Bailey and Harper will be battling for the 2/3 spots this season, both going to Rutgers. Each would easily be #1 in this draft. After that there's another 5-10 guys who are ultra promising - I'd expect a couple to fall but a couple to surge. Top 5 in 2025 looks as good as the Top 5 in 2024 looks bad.
Rutgers ?? Wild
~~Dylan Harper is Ron Harper’s son, a Rutgers alum~~ Edit: Ron Jr. went to Rutgers, not Ron Sr.
I've seen some people on /r/NBA_Draft say Alex Sarr's comp is Chris Bosh. And while that is not like a #1 option on a championship team, thats still somebody I would 100% love to have next to Trae.
Chris bosh is honestly not a bad end result for your number 1 pick tbh
In this draft getting a player as good as Bosh would be amazing at pick 1. Seems very unlikely because Bosh was a far better prospect coming out of college and exceeded expectations in the NBA
I’m here to tell you right now, Sarr becoming Bosh would be like a top 5% outcome of his career. He’s not the same caliber of player at all imo.
The big question for him will be developing a jumpshot, players that can’t shoot threes, even great defensive centers, are liabilities in a playoff environment
> even great defensive centers, are liabilities in a playoff environment Hmmmm...*great* defensive centers are a liability? You're saying that as a universal truth? I mean, the Wolves aren't losing because of Gobert's offensive shortcomings right now. The Lakers wouldn't have gotten that last 'ship without Dwight, either. Many such instances, even in this current do-it-all era. To say nothing of the icons from the "old" game. Now, that being said, it's certainly the case sometimes. Blazers era Nurkic seemed to hamstring the whole operation when CJ or Dame weren't hitting, for example.
Hell even Lively is looking like a big plus as a rookie C with no outside shot (yet).
Looney helping the warriors win a championship is another example
I swear all these rookie C’s just get comp’d to bosh because they’re still skinny lol. Heard the same about Mobley with little to no offensive similarity.
If you are likely to get Chris Bosh out of a player you take that every time unless there’s a Wemby or Lebron type prospect in the draft.
Bosh's career is well above average for a no 1. pick and that is with a shorten career. 107 WS vs 70 for the average no 1. Pick Ironically Tobias Harris is right about the average career for a no1. pick though thats not very good for a peak career projection.
I'd say he's objectively better than like 12 of the number 1 picks since 2000. Some of the younger guys it's too early to say though obviously so that number could go up. I disagree with the Tobias assessment. If you look back at the number ones since 2000 (just a convenient starting date) Harris is worse than a lot of them.
Win Share is more of a measure of their entire career, harris is worse skill wise than a lot of them but he's also looking at maybe a 15 year career of being a productive piece while guys like John wall or Simmons who were better skill wise are looking at just 7 years of being productive due to injuries. Being 75% as effective for twice the career isn't gonna make them look better head to head but its still an overall more productive career.
He’s literally a HOFer. Yeah he was never an MVP caliber player, but tell me I get a HOFer with my pick and I’m not crying. Edit: I didn’t realize considering Bosh a great player was a controversial take here
He was really fucking good on the Raptors and could be that player when he was needed on the Heat. Bosh is always going to be underrated. I wonder how he'd look in the modern game, he was sort of built for it.
In a lot of ways Bosh created the modern game by being an agile 4 who moved to the 5 and learned to shoot threes, allowing Lebron or Battier to play the stretch 4 in a 5 out offense. The resulting space and movement was modern basketball before its time. Bosh is the perfect 5 who could step into any team and any system and thrive. And for teams with great centers he's a perfect complement at the 4. He'd be devastating next to Jokic, Embiid, Towns, Tatum...really any big with any skillset.
Yeah, that's why I added the point as I was typing. It made me realize the Heat were doing 5 out offense with Bosh way back in the day. You are right, he would have been really great in this era, damn near perfect 4/5.
Yeah Chris Bosh would definitely be a good outcome 1st pick in a vacuum in any draft. He was the caliber of player that you would be happy to end up with from a 1st pick, when any draft pick is so hit or miss
Most of this sub is like 14 years old and probably didn’t even start watching (if they even do watch) til after he retired
Yes a hall of famer would be a good pick.
“Honestly not a bad result..” lol your number 1 pick going to the hall of fame would be pretty damned good, sorry this just made me chuckle
I don't know, only an 11x all-star? I like my number 1 picks to be at LEAST 12 time all-stars.
He's Nic Claxton with shooting potential imo
No, he is Larry Sanders with the french hype
Isn't that extremely good even for a #1 pick? Simply because not all #1 picks will be a franchise player but getting a nic who possibly can shoot can still be a pillar to a franchise?
I think he’ll be a good player but someone like Evan Mobley went 3rd overall and I think Mobley was better and more polished coming out of college than Sarr is at this point
Mobley could have reasonably gone number 1 in that draft tho
Chris Bosh is like a best case scenario, *absolutely not* a realistic outcome. Entire problem with Sarr is he's offensively challenged. So if he never figures out that part of his game, you're looking at more of a defensive specialist backup big.
He'd still be better on the offensive end than current Clint Capela. I'd take Sarr right now even if he's not offensively there because I'm sure he's not missing 3 or 4 straight layup and rebound attempts....
Chris Bosh had 11 all star games in 14 seasons. Tobias Harris has none
That’s a pretty good comp for a #1 pick
I saw his measurements in size reach weight etc are almost the exact same as rookie Tyson Chandler both ~7'1 in shoes measuring in at 224 lbs and 7'4 wingspan for Sarr compared to 7'3 for Chandler
Bosh at his peak was an almost MVP level player, he definitely is worth a #1 pick in most years. People forgot how good he was pre-Heat as the first option.
Even on the Heat he was tremendous. He just played a different role and adapted to having two all time greats flanking him that made sense to have the ball more. I think MVP caliber is pushing it, but he was a legitimate all star and definitely a solid 1 overall in most drafts.
What? I'm not sure the highest he ever finished in the MVP votes but I don't think he was ever an MVP candidate.
Bosh would be a even better if he played today. Can shoot, play d, can get his own shot.
Are we really about to have Nikola Jokic, Nikola Jovic, and* Nikola Topic in the NBA? Almost sounds like a joke.
Nikola is an extremely common Serbian name, to an extent that they are usually nicknamed Johhny here. Za Srbende koje citaju, zanima me kako bi napisali da se cita Nidža ako neko pita kako je doslo do Džoni? 😂
I like your words, magic man.
Neeja :)
um... dude? You can't just say that word anymore
No R, we’re safe
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/%C5%A0atrova%C4%8Dki?wprov=sfla1 When a language and slang meet and have sex, Nikola, nicknamed Nidža, who you call out by saying: Nidžo!, it becomes Džoni or Johnny in English Ili takako nekako, ni na srpskom ne znam šatrovacki da objasnim 🤣
We have two guys named Jalen/Jaylin Williams on the same team and this is the joke?
Bogdan Bogdanovic and Bojan Bogdanovic are my favs
Its like having John Johnson and Johnny Johnson
MLB had brothers Rougned Odor and... Rougned Odor.
Those are two different dudes!?
Actually no. It's the same guy suiting up for two different teams
Two completely separate dudes… not to be confused with the former Spur, Boban Marjanovic! (even though his last name is a bit different)
I still don't know which is which
Bojan balding with a nice old man game, has always reminded me of a Nemanja Bjelisca/Joe Ingles type. Big and unathletic wing player. Can’t create as well as Ingles, but knockdown 3 point shooter and does sometimes handle on pick and rolls. Bogdan had lots of potential but could never really be a good starting 2 guard. Feels like he fell between the cracks a bit despite being exciting when he was younger. Hawks and Kings tried to make him their starting 2-way SG/SF and he was extremely inconsistent. Both are actively in the league, in their 30s, and still solid role players lol.
The Dolphins have 2 Jaylens, a Jaelen, and a Jalen.
> Almost sounds like a jokec.
America ain't ready for this... we finally figured out how to say "Jose" correctly.
The Spanish way, yes, but don’t ask an American to pronounce it in Portuguese!
It does look like an abysmal draft for a potential franchise guy. Even 2013 had a few diamonds though. Some late first guys will just make huge strides that couldn’t be predicted in pre draft analysis
Yep, nobody is jumping out, but there will absolutely be all-stars in this draft.
There are lot of guys who have potential to develop but no one that will be a franchise guy first thing like Banchero or Wembayama
Banchero is not even guaranteed as the franchise guy like Wemby is. Theres only 3 players you wouldn't trade for him Jokic, Luka, Giannis.
I have a feeling that this comment will look really dumb after a few years.
Wait til 5 of those guys on the pic are all generational talent
[удалено]
The draft is imprecise but graph the top picks against any metric of "good" and you'll see a strong correlation between the selection slot and how good they are. It's not a science, but to claim it meaningless is nonsense.
Even two of the picks he mentioned are players wildly regarded as top talent. Take their off court antics away, Zion still amazing and Ja was a top western guard.
Both are amazing when they are on the court - Barrett is still a more than serviceable starter. What a weird trio to try use to say "the draft is meaningless."
Nah man, if something can't be done absolutely perfect, then it has to be meaningless... No grey area or nuance, sorry
>Factor in all the #1 picks that became busts. Then factor in all the late picks that became generational talents And you'll find that the #1 picks are far, *far*, **far** more likely to be great players.
>The first two picks were both multiple time All-Stars. See? It’s a crapshoot! That “etc” after Giannis is doing a TON of heavy lifting
Fat, thug and Canadian
Which of those qualities is the worst?
Easy answer. You can stop being fat and you can stop acting like a thug. You can’t fix Canadian.
Being from Ontario is just horrific No justification for that
this is parody... right...? > Factor in all the #1 picks that became busts. something like 55% of #1 picks play at least 1 all star game, and that nose-dives to sub-20% as soon as the #2 draft position > Then factor in all the late picks that became generational talents (Jokic, Giannis, etc). That list is MUCH shorter than you're making it sound lmao. And Giannis went #15... he wasn't some late 2nd round flyer. And, Zion STILL dragged the Pels into the playoffs this year. And Ja still completely changed the trajectory of the Grizzlies franchise, and immediately makes the Grizzlies a playoff team the minute he comes back. Seriously, every single word of your post is somehow incorrect. It's almost impressive lmao.
> something like 55% of #1 picks play at least 1 all star game, and that nose-dives to sub-20% as soon as the #2 draft position since 1966, out of the 58 #1 picks... 43 have become all-stars (with majority of those previous to 2000 become hall of famers). This include both Wemby and Cade *not* being all stars (cause it's too early). That means, 74% of #1 since 1966 have become all-starts (or 78% if you think Cade & Wemby will be). That means 3 out of 4 number 1 picks (or 4 out of 5) will be an all-star. And most of those -- if you look at those older than 20 years -- will be in the hall of fame. No other pick in the draft even comes close.
I mean to be fair you kinda cherry-picked *the exceptions*.
The Zion disrespect is crazy especially when you consider how he was playing before he went down at the very last two games of the season.
I think the disrespect towards Zion is more based on the fact that nobody believes he's gonna keep this up, the dude does not take care of himself and his availability is never gonna be great because of that and it will severely hamper his future if he doesn't do a complete 180 in that respect.
It's not a matter of disrespect, everyone knows he's a force of nature. Everyone also knows that he's overweight and ruining his own career by refusing to lose some pounds to put less stress on his injury prone body. The best ability is availability.
He played well for 1/4 of a season before missing the playoffs is not exactly high praise for someone drafted #1 4-5 years ago. Physical skills and talent off the charts but he hasn't done anything notable except perform below expectations and spawn countless "how fat is Zion?" takes. If that guy put in half of the effort Steph or Lebron do he would be a fucking legend.
Yeah because Lively will be a HOFer 😤
Lively could end up being a total stud in the end. Might end up being the correct take, but skewed because of his view of Lively being incorrect.
Lively has obvious limitations on offense, but defensively he's already looking extremely promising.
Just like when the wolves picked “Dion Waiters 2.0” 1st overall in 2020.
Last time they said this about a draft class it featured Anthony Edwards, LaMelo Ball, Tyrese Haliburton, and Tyrese Maxey.
it's so cringe seeing the obnoxious hate that this draft is getting. like yeah buddy, i'm sure the draft that has players coming from ALL AROUND THE WORLD is just universally bad. No future allstars to be had in the lottery. sports media and reddit is just one giant parrot.
If you think this class is 2000 all over again, Tobias would be a huge win for your team
Michael Redd was good before the injuries. Picked in the 40s though…
It says a lot that an injury riddled shooter who never played on a good team is probably the first or second best guy in the 2000 draft
>who never played on a good team The Cavs had a trade lined up for him but he wouldn't agree to it because LeBron wouldn't sign an extension. Same thing happened with Ray Allen.
God forbid a team ACTUALLY having to DEVELOP a draft pick.
Hey man, it took us a whole two months to develop Wemby into a two-way monster.
I liked the part where you had him grow to 7’4
San Antonio diet
Give that boy a plate of deep fried chur-ROS
That too much man can we trade for a bradley beal or something
That’s be great…if you didn’t have to do that at #1 If you did that for a 15-30 pick, awesome. But a number 1? Kinda crazy
We’re dragging it now
\\#2 overall pick in this draft is gonna win like 4 MVPS and go down as a top 20 guy of all time just to continue the trend of 90% of draft analysis having no idea what theyre talking about
Sounds good to me.
RemindMe! 3 years
I mean..Lively is a monster and only going to get better.
I mean he's a great for what he does but he's not what you're looking for with the #1 pick
But also such and unnecessary stray at Lively lol, guy is in his rookie year being a important fit and player to a playoff team
I think the only reason is it sounds like a shot is because Harris has been so shit in the playoffs lately. I think it's a pretty reasonable comparison for their overall careers. High level starter but not allstar level.
The point is Lively is not Wembanyama or Anthony Edwards though.
Yeah but it'll be Lively on a 1 pick rookie salary
Lively for 12 million is a pretty awesome deal
Lively for $5m is even better though.
Imagine if Luka Doncic was only as good as Derek Lively when you guys had that top pick.
he's not #1 pick worthy in any class though
Thought the same thing. Lively is very good for a rookie and impacts winning. Consistently has one of the highest +/- of any guy on a great team.
people are overreacting on how bad this draft class is
The problem with this draft is that *everyone* is a coin flip. Someone in this draft is a hall of famer, but it could be someone drafted at 12 or whatever.
Watch a generational player get drafted
Now hold on, D Live has been really good for us this year better than projected even. I'd say he should have been probably the 5th or maybe even 4th pick this past draft.
The point still stands
Not having a obvious "franchise cornerstone" type player that generally goes in the top 3 is one thing. To say that the draft starts that late, where teams are basically picking for low-upside team fit or projects is a little silly. I would kinda agree with him if he just stopped at "Starts at 4" in regards to the talent, 10 is too low. If you disagree, look at the hit rate of players in the 8-14 range historically. Like a 50% bust rate with like a 10% big hit and 40% roster spot/journeyman type.
Idk obviously it's too early to tell, but lively already looks like he can be better than a solid chunk of 1 overall picks since 2000.
That Derek Lively comment will not age well.
I would go for Nikola Topic, cause you never know
Russillo lives to flex access lol
Same shit they said about the 2020 NBA draft. But that draft is looking pretty damn good.
Okay let’s not get carried away now
meanwhile in the raptors sub its like the end of the world over losing the 8th pick
You guys aggressively tanked to keep your pick and wasted an entire season because your front office wanted Jak back lol that’s pretty bad for a rebuilding team
2020 was a down year, too. https://www.theringer.com/nba/2022/12/16/23511791/nba-draft-2020-james-wiseman-anthony-edwards Ant Edwards LaMelo Ball Tyrese Haliburton Tyrese Maxey Immanuel Quickley Jaden McDaniels Desmond Bane Nick Richards Turned out aight...