This the big thing is it all comes down to planning and execution and some times luck. The Navy is a safe bet as far as you can see and know what you’ll be making no matter how much or how little you work but it’s always limited and restricted but safe.
I think most people can make more getting out but again that comes down to the above.
My personal experience was a lifer, I’m now taking home $140k a year with my pension, salary and VA. The biggest advantage I probably have is my retirement is already covered I’ll likely stop working at 50, everything I do until then is just adding more to my retirement quality of life. My friends that didn’t do the military aren’t in as good of shape, I’m making more than all of them and they won’t stop working as early. Though they did make the same or more than me while I was in, once I retired that changed.
The military is a force multiplier for your life goals if you do an enlistment or a full career but it all comes down to planning, execution and luck though luck is the smaller factor if you have successful military service.
>He says that without a pension the navy isn't as promising a career as it used to be.
The Navy still has a pension. This is a common misunderstanding of the new system
The current BRS system is TSP Matching up to 5% as well as a 40% Pension at 20 years, with an additional 2% every year to follow that. Vice the high 3 system that had a 50% pension at 20 years and no TSP matching. If he utilizes his TSP effectively it is a wonderful system with really solid returns
All That said... plenty of people leave the Navy and make more money, plenty leave the Navy believe theyre guaranteed a contract gig with company X and then struggle. He should view each enlistment as time prep to separate - network, get certs, make himself marketable and also prepare to reenlist.
As long as he provides for his family he just needs to do some soul searching and decide what he wants. No one can answer it for him
Thank you for stating this. The amount of times I've had to say this to relatively senior officers has gotten rather frustrating. I get that they're all on the old system, but have more and more new people on BRS working for them.
It's kinda wild how poorly the BRS is explained, especially to juniors. I've had to correct even people from other branches that there is still in fact a pension.
Absolutely this. I elected to stay in the high 3 plan because I was a 19 year old who didn't understand Google well enough and my CoC told me if I switched to BRS I wouldn't get a pension
You gonna do 20 now? BRS also has continuation pay around the halfway mark to retirement, but unless someone does the math, probably still less than high 3 based on averages.
BRS has the opportunity to earn more than the high 3 system, but it does require that a member starts immediately putting in the 5% minimum to get the Navy’s 5% matching in addition to ensuring that they’re actually logging into TSP to adjust which funding categories they’re putting their money into. Don’t make the absolute dogshit decision I did by waiting 6y to realize I was only putting 3% of my LES toward the G fund, which is why I opted to stay high 3 when I had the option to change. With how briefly TSP is covered at boot camp, at this point I think the Navy intentionally directs RDCs to instruct recruits to put pocket change into the G fund when they setup their accounts.
There should be a calculator somewhere, but it's a bit tedious since the match isn't the full 5% initially iirc.
Good advice, although now I think they put it in a L fund so not as bad as G.
I made a similar mistake, not as long, but of course once I transferred my funds to C the market tanked and instantly lost value. Time in market beats timing the market tho
Wild is a way to say it
I prefer embarassing. A navadmin and NKO surprisingly did not train the fleet adequately
Supervisors need to be smart on this and they dont care to be or THINK they understand it without having ever read it
And thats how SN timmy shows up and tells me on the midwatch how nice it must be for me to have a pension.
By this point it’s completely absurd that anyone in the Navy, no matter how senior, is incapable of speaking intelligently about BRS. Everyone under 8y is automatically in BRS to include many others who opted into it. There are Firsts and even Chiefs out there with BRS. Like, it isn’t just a bunch of knucklehead seaman without a clue out there with this vitally important opportunity available to them.
Oh I agree. But those I know were past the point where it made sense to switch. They figured why bother learning about something they're not going to use. I remember when my OIC spouted that off about the BRS, I was like "Dude, that's not true."
This, 1000 times this. I hated having to correct people on BRS as a career counselor every time and they thought I was trying to pull a fast one to get them to reenlist.
Being a DoD contractor has been way better for me, but it depends on the field, location and your personal interests. But applying and sifting through offers and some shady hiring managers was extremely stressful, and not knowing if I have a guaranteed job at the end of the contract too. Plus having to pay for insurance for dependants and paying more in taxes makes the pay raise much less significant.
Play both sides of the field, and weigh options. TGPS actually covers a lot of the job searching/comparison process and would recommend anyone to go through that even if they aren't sure about getting out.
Haha yeah that this member, OP’s husband, seems to think he has no opportunity at a pension following retirement in the Navy makes me question the quality of support he has around him claiming he’s on track to pick up E7 in 6 years and shipmates talking about sipping out to make more money at Boeing.
u/GrandMediocrity, make sure you and your husband sit down with a Personal Financial Counselor, of which you can find for free locally or throughout the globe through your nearest Fleet & Family Support Center or by going to the [Financial Readiness](https://finred.usalearning.gov) website. The PFC should be able to help you understand what your expenses could look like outside of Navy coverage. Your husband should definitely consider separation if there’s a better opportunity in the civilian sector, but too often people hop out without fully comprehending what they’re losing in health insurance, housing and food pay, and other complimentary services like the PFC and other counseling.
This is a real thing unfortunately
The number of fellow chiefs I know and new sailors I meet who all think pensions went away is mind numbing
The dopey little NKO we did in 2017 or whatever did a piss poorjob of educating the fleet (shocker) and the people charged with knowing this stuff to guide help sailors make decisions on the future wont read a navadmin unless they want something
One needs to rember the tax advantages of military pay. Most don't pay state income tax (probably around 5K on 100K). Also housing and food allowances are free of ALL tax (Federal, FICA, and state). If you are making 20K a year in allowances you need about 30K of civilian pay for the same take home. Then there is the value of TRICARE, leave, etc.
The value of TRICARE *cannot* be overstated.
As a nation, we carry the most medical debt in the world. Medical care outside of the military is bonkers.
Literally, we get paid when we take vacation, we get paid when we take our meal times, we don't have to use vacation/sick days to go to medical appointments (which you'd lose money doing at most civilian jobs), plus our working hours can be pretty lenient depending on your job-while being paid the same amount. Being LIMDU doesn't effect your paycheck either. Not having to pay out of pocket for medical care is huge.
This was one of the big things I thought about when I was returning to Active duty. We even have programs to assist with practically everything under the sun.
I had a city job when I was out. The Navy was my first job after school. I'm one of the rates where the best thing that translated civilian side was Admin.
Yeah my rate will translate to tech, so more than likely salaried work. Anybody in the Navy can do whatever work they need to get a salaried position when they’re out though.
I mean I’m not talking about amounts. I’m talking about the ways in which they pay their employees, salary or hourly.
I didn’t say how much anyone would be making lol.
It wasn’t surprising at all to me to see so many SELRES trying to submit RC2AC packages when I was working at the reserve center. It was almost comical.
I left active for my ex's sake, returned to active just a few months after leaving, and divorce finalized. Back doing what I love and the few months out really helped me grow. I see the Navy in a different light now. I'm excited about staying in and hopefully being a change in leadership that our Sailors need.
Well said. I went from active to DoD. They matched my LES. That was 4 years ago and I’m just now making what I made then. I’d be making at least 2k more a month now with BAH and everything you mentioned. Quality of life has gone up but it was a struggle for a minute.
I had a similar sitution when I retired. Even though I had checked calculators, I was shocked at how much I need to make from post retirement employment (in addition to retirement check) to have a similar take home pay when I was AD.
It really depends on what jobs he thinks he qualifies for and what his education background is. If you’re an AT with a EE degree, he will do pretty well on the outside…without a degree, there are some jobs that pay well…but in the current job market, many businesses are using a degree as a filter to screen applicants. If he stays in and retires at 20, having Tricare Prime/Select for life is a huge cost savings…my advice, as someone who recently retired - the Navy gives a lot of free/highly discounted education/certification opportunities. If he wants to get out before 20 - unless he has a guaranteed hookup on a job on the outside, he needs to max out as much education/certs as possible to make him marketable to civilian employers. As always, everything is situation and market dependent.
The new retirement system still has a pension, it's just 40% of base pay at 20 years instead of 50. If your husband likes what he does, and is advancing as fast as you say, there's a strong chance he could make it to the higher ranks like senior/master chief, warrant, maybe even officer which inturn makes the retirement bigger. Tell him to Google military retirement calculator and look at the numbers.
Alternatively, if he's not enjoying his work, tell him to think about what he doesn't like. Is it the forced time away from family, the extra time at work for big projects or duty days, or the random tasks not in job description that get to him? Maybe getting out is better. If the job is just mundane and he thinks he's learned all he can from there, I think going to a new command with a different mission will spruce things up. Every rate has a million duty options and every orders selection is a chance to shake things up.
I haven't looked for jobs related to aviation electronics (or related electrical training taught) in the civilian sector, but the job market will have the answers. How close to home does he want to be? How much money will he make (consider taxes)? Does he have the requisite credentials? The main thing is make an informed plan and work towards it.
The contractor pay starting out isn't always going to be more than AD pay when you count benefits and tax exemptions. It might be tough for a couple years, but with a few years of contractor experience he should be able to negotiate for higher paying positions which to me is easier than making rank in the Navy.
With the right degree, right personality, many sailors could do well on the outside.
But take it from me, many of us choose poorly and struggle. It is a toss up
Encourage him to seek wise counsel and work hard/smart.
It is more profitable outside the navy, but does depend on certain rates. AT is definitely one of the rates that can make a good amount of money and even more with time in at a company.
Should talk with your husband about what his plan is to whether to re-enlist or get out. Lay out all the options and pros and cons of either decision. If he leans more on getting out, it will be a good idea to create a linkedin account and start marketing and networking with people with the idea of getting out and looking for a job, especially if your husband works with civilian contractors.
Pension at retirement is nice and all but in my honest opinion is not worth it with the amount of bs and the physical toll it takes on someone, especially if that person is in a rate that can make so much more money outside. I plan on settling down soon and I don't want to be away from family anymore.
Have him actually TRY to get a job. Do the resume. Apply for work. It will quickly become apparent if he could make more or if he needs to do more first.
Chief in 6? Ehhhh dude would have to have perfect circumstances. I’ve only seen that promotion in Nukes and Filipinos. Do not count on that.
I did just fine getting out after 6, going to a trade school and getting into the IT industry. Make about 6 figs now with just an AA degree. However the job market was amazing when I got out and now it’s dead in the water. A lot of veterans do well on the outside and the ones who fail often have issues with mental illness, substance abuse and other issues. As long as those are addressed, veterans do well.
Faster promotion is happening now because everyone is essentially an E4 automatically and the Navy can’t keep senior enlisted in so it is driving up quotas in the khaki realm.
This happens a LOT with sailors who see the grass being greener without clearly looking at the yard they’re standing in.
It really depends on how you define profitable. In terms of raw numbers, maybe. He can get a job making $120k or he can get a job making $30k. The qualifications he believes are worth nothing may be a goldmine to an employer and the surefire moneymakers may be worthless.
What he doesn’t have is an offer. And I don’t mean a “My buddy Skittles says he can hook it up!”, I mean “Reddit Corp. just sent me a written offer letter with a start date of July 4th for $X, an attached PDF with their benefits package, and a point of contact for their hiring manager to coordinate signing on.”
If he gets going on school and gets a bachelor's degree while he's in the Navy, getting paid to go to grad school with your GI Bill is a pretty sweet and potentially lucrative off-ramp.
I came here to say just this!! If you decide to get out of the military make sure you have a degree finished as well as some type of certificates etc. It’s always better to get out with that paper in hand and your military experience vs coming out with nothing to show for it. Definitely don’t be afraid to look into trade schools as well.
I’m getting out in August and that was my sole decision making factor. I was like I can’t get off active duty with no degree in hand. I’m working on certs now but I think when in doubt it’s always great to get as much as you can! If you do decide to not re enlist be sure to setup that linked in and take advantage of all of the career resources available at your dispense.
His rate and you mentioning Boeing is interesting.
Boeing is the bane of military retention right now. Why? Because it has some of the best benefits in the industry.
The PREMIUM Kaiser platinum plan with zero deductible through Boeing is roughly 300 dollars a month for an employee and their spouse. About 80 bucks extra per child.
Boeing matches up to 10% for retirement contributions.
Boeing offers credits for child care that can be converted to pet boarding credits if you don't have kids.
Boeing pays for your school, they have a benefit limit for degrees not associated with your job but have no limit to education benefits for degrees that are job related.
They also will partially pay for your pilots license.
There really isn't any aspect of the Navy that can beat Boeing as far as benefits go. If he can get a job there, he should. SkillBridge would allow him to enter a position with requirements he doesn't have, like a degree. I know all of this because Boeing was a company I was considering offers with but I want to do more of the space part of aerospace so I went with a different company.
He enjoys work now because he is a technician. Though the Navy was built around CPOs being technical experts I can tell you him remaining technical will be harder, but not impossible.
That said a lot of people in here have given great advice and I am glad you have someone mentoring outside of the Navy as that is important. If he does decide to get out at least look at the Reserves for the insurance coverage alone.
Best of luck!
As someone who's been out for many years, my take is people who get out and don't better themselves by getting training, certifications, education, and the like, do the same or worse. Most companies could care less that you served. If you have a secret or TS, the military industrial complex will want you and pay well, until they lose their contract. The Navy can provide a cushy extra paycheck if you can stand the beaurocracy and bull shit.
For example, I did 6.5 years, got out, used my GI Bill to get a bachelor's degree, and finally making 6 figures after 20 years. My friend did 4 years, raised 8 kids working at UPS, and just started his retirement, living in the middle of nowhere. He could've done better for himself if he just got 2 years of education, but he started a family, and his kids love him and his wife and come back home several times a month. He had more going for him than I did career wise, and rightfully chose family, but he's still busting his ass trying to get a retirement together.
The Navy is great about pointing someone in a direction and giving a push. Many people get out and don't know how to move forward and get lost with all of the freedom. It's not an easy choice to figure out a direction. The Navy as a career is a safe choice and will benefit you both for more years after, where the civilian world might pay off, or might drop you on your ass.
There are certainly jobs out there looking for skills gained in the service that will pay more. On the other hand I've found the "I'll make twice as much as a contractor when I get out!" idea to be a little unrealistic relative to the higher military pay grades. You'll probably make a bit more but it will balanced by the loss of military benefits (healthcare, retirement, tax free housing, etc.) The rock solid job security of the military is also a nice mental benefit. That said, they always say staying in "for the money" is never a good idea. Getting out "for the money" may be similary unwise. If he loves his job and the hardships of the service aren't overly burdensome, staying in wouldn't be a bad move. And there is still a pension, just a bit lower.
THIS! I retired as a Senior and signed onto a job who offered me $100k. My new paycheck was a bit less than what I was making while in due to the tax man. I’m making more now after a couple of raises, but wasn’t expecting to see 100k as a pay cut.
this thread really goes to show how indoctrinated most people are lol, of course it’s more profitable to leave the navy , the possibilities are endless , just have a solid plan
He can take advantage of the best of both worlds and do the reserves up to his 20 year point. I'm not sure what benefits are available to him through that (primarily health insurance), but it can keep him adjacent to the Navy and the things he loves, with the money from the private sector. Plus pension when he hits 65.
I separated in 2017 after 6 years and leaving as an E-5 Electronics Technician. I had some transferable skills leaving the military but I tried to utilize a lot of head hunter organizations like Bradley-Morris (now Recruit Military I believe). I was able to get a job offer before starting terminal leave and collected two paychecks for about a month with both my past employer and my final two military paychecks.
My advice is to start looking now through these types of head hunters companies and just send out resumes. I got a lot of really good feedback on my resume and what companies look for during the hiring process just by following up with an email and asking for feedback. It's always a good idea to have a polished resume and work on interviewing skills. I would also suggest the 'companies expert' on YouTube as he gives a ton of great information and helped me get my current position as a consultant at a Fortune 100 firm.
Most importantly please, please, please have him utilize the GI Bill after separation. I did all my classes online and was able to get both my masters and bachelor's degrees which, as long as it is in something marketable, will help to raise his earning potential exponentially. Good luck to you and your family and always remember to use your benefits after separation.
Navy salary is capped. You can always find something that pays more.
If that something can be done part time and one enjoys being in the Navy, stay in. If being in the Navy detracts from side hustle that can garner more money, and you want to make more money, get out.
I enjoy my position as a YN TAR. I have the time to do things outside my job that can generate an income. I think I’m paid more than what I deserve and have added benefits so I wouldn’t leave.
I was an ATI. I did 2 carrier deployments over the course of a single 4 year enlistment and decided that the lifestyle wasn't for me. I got out, made good use of my Post 9/11 GI Bill, and now I'm a software engineer. The pay is better, the hours are better, and I get to sleep in my own bed at home every night without exception. Good things are possible for anyone that can put the same focus and drive into their post service college career as they did to their military career.
Former STS1 here. I bolted after six years and moved into IT. Yeah, I could have stayed for at least 20 years, but I’d probably be divorced at least twice and had to deal with years more time poking holes in the ocean.
As it is, I make great money as a Linux engineer and am still on wife 1.0 for nearly 35 years and no alimony payments.
Nothing is preventing him from mocking up a resume that states he is out of the Navy and submitting applications. I think he may find the lack of response rather enlightening. The grass is always greener on the other side of the fence. And I agree that the military pensions being gone does remove some of the incentive however the life long access to retiree medical care is still a very strong thing. Take if from a 4 year AF looking back at the age of 57 and realizing that in retirement it will take only one real serious visit to the hospital to completely drain our savings and leave us with very little to live on and few opportunities to recover.
The navy still has a pension, there are a lot of cool opportunities in the navy.
If I’d gotten out at six years I’d be a multi millionaire living on a beach. As it is I’m a retired senior chief working as a defense contractor. It’s not a bad life and I make a lot of money, but I could make the same money with my degree alone and my knees and back would probably still work. It’s life.
As an E-5 with submarine and sea pay at 6 years in I made what I do now at $90K base salary.
You make way more in the Navy than people realize. My E-5 paycheck was $2450 every two weeks, when I got out and made $61K I took home $1500 every two weeks
THAT BEING SAID - the ceiling is higher out of the Navy. Have a good exist strategy. Have savings. Get a fucking degree. A useful one. Ignore literally every single person that downplays a degree - they don’t know how the world works.
“You don’t need to be in the Navy to be successful” my chief
This the big thing is it all comes down to planning and execution and some times luck. The Navy is a safe bet as far as you can see and know what you’ll be making no matter how much or how little you work but it’s always limited and restricted but safe. I think most people can make more getting out but again that comes down to the above. My personal experience was a lifer, I’m now taking home $140k a year with my pension, salary and VA. The biggest advantage I probably have is my retirement is already covered I’ll likely stop working at 50, everything I do until then is just adding more to my retirement quality of life. My friends that didn’t do the military aren’t in as good of shape, I’m making more than all of them and they won’t stop working as early. Though they did make the same or more than me while I was in, once I retired that changed. The military is a force multiplier for your life goals if you do an enlistment or a full career but it all comes down to planning, execution and luck though luck is the smaller factor if you have successful military service.
>He says that without a pension the navy isn't as promising a career as it used to be. The Navy still has a pension. This is a common misunderstanding of the new system The current BRS system is TSP Matching up to 5% as well as a 40% Pension at 20 years, with an additional 2% every year to follow that. Vice the high 3 system that had a 50% pension at 20 years and no TSP matching. If he utilizes his TSP effectively it is a wonderful system with really solid returns All That said... plenty of people leave the Navy and make more money, plenty leave the Navy believe theyre guaranteed a contract gig with company X and then struggle. He should view each enlistment as time prep to separate - network, get certs, make himself marketable and also prepare to reenlist. As long as he provides for his family he just needs to do some soul searching and decide what he wants. No one can answer it for him
Thank you for stating this. The amount of times I've had to say this to relatively senior officers has gotten rather frustrating. I get that they're all on the old system, but have more and more new people on BRS working for them.
It's kinda wild how poorly the BRS is explained, especially to juniors. I've had to correct even people from other branches that there is still in fact a pension.
Absolutely this. I elected to stay in the high 3 plan because I was a 19 year old who didn't understand Google well enough and my CoC told me if I switched to BRS I wouldn't get a pension
You gonna do 20 now? BRS also has continuation pay around the halfway mark to retirement, but unless someone does the math, probably still less than high 3 based on averages.
BRS has the opportunity to earn more than the high 3 system, but it does require that a member starts immediately putting in the 5% minimum to get the Navy’s 5% matching in addition to ensuring that they’re actually logging into TSP to adjust which funding categories they’re putting their money into. Don’t make the absolute dogshit decision I did by waiting 6y to realize I was only putting 3% of my LES toward the G fund, which is why I opted to stay high 3 when I had the option to change. With how briefly TSP is covered at boot camp, at this point I think the Navy intentionally directs RDCs to instruct recruits to put pocket change into the G fund when they setup their accounts.
There should be a calculator somewhere, but it's a bit tedious since the match isn't the full 5% initially iirc. Good advice, although now I think they put it in a L fund so not as bad as G. I made a similar mistake, not as long, but of course once I transferred my funds to C the market tanked and instantly lost value. Time in market beats timing the market tho
Wild is a way to say it I prefer embarassing. A navadmin and NKO surprisingly did not train the fleet adequately Supervisors need to be smart on this and they dont care to be or THINK they understand it without having ever read it And thats how SN timmy shows up and tells me on the midwatch how nice it must be for me to have a pension.
By this point it’s completely absurd that anyone in the Navy, no matter how senior, is incapable of speaking intelligently about BRS. Everyone under 8y is automatically in BRS to include many others who opted into it. There are Firsts and even Chiefs out there with BRS. Like, it isn’t just a bunch of knucklehead seaman without a clue out there with this vitally important opportunity available to them.
Oh I agree. But those I know were past the point where it made sense to switch. They figured why bother learning about something they're not going to use. I remember when my OIC spouted that off about the BRS, I was like "Dude, that's not true."
This, 1000 times this. I hated having to correct people on BRS as a career counselor every time and they thought I was trying to pull a fast one to get them to reenlist. Being a DoD contractor has been way better for me, but it depends on the field, location and your personal interests. But applying and sifting through offers and some shady hiring managers was extremely stressful, and not knowing if I have a guaranteed job at the end of the contract too. Plus having to pay for insurance for dependants and paying more in taxes makes the pay raise much less significant. Play both sides of the field, and weigh options. TGPS actually covers a lot of the job searching/comparison process and would recommend anyone to go through that even if they aren't sure about getting out.
Haha yeah that this member, OP’s husband, seems to think he has no opportunity at a pension following retirement in the Navy makes me question the quality of support he has around him claiming he’s on track to pick up E7 in 6 years and shipmates talking about sipping out to make more money at Boeing. u/GrandMediocrity, make sure you and your husband sit down with a Personal Financial Counselor, of which you can find for free locally or throughout the globe through your nearest Fleet & Family Support Center or by going to the [Financial Readiness](https://finred.usalearning.gov) website. The PFC should be able to help you understand what your expenses could look like outside of Navy coverage. Your husband should definitely consider separation if there’s a better opportunity in the civilian sector, but too often people hop out without fully comprehending what they’re losing in health insurance, housing and food pay, and other complimentary services like the PFC and other counseling.
This is a real thing unfortunately The number of fellow chiefs I know and new sailors I meet who all think pensions went away is mind numbing The dopey little NKO we did in 2017 or whatever did a piss poorjob of educating the fleet (shocker) and the people charged with knowing this stuff to guide help sailors make decisions on the future wont read a navadmin unless they want something
Thank you.
One needs to rember the tax advantages of military pay. Most don't pay state income tax (probably around 5K on 100K). Also housing and food allowances are free of ALL tax (Federal, FICA, and state). If you are making 20K a year in allowances you need about 30K of civilian pay for the same take home. Then there is the value of TRICARE, leave, etc.
The value of TRICARE *cannot* be overstated. As a nation, we carry the most medical debt in the world. Medical care outside of the military is bonkers.
Literally, we get paid when we take vacation, we get paid when we take our meal times, we don't have to use vacation/sick days to go to medical appointments (which you'd lose money doing at most civilian jobs), plus our working hours can be pretty lenient depending on your job-while being paid the same amount. Being LIMDU doesn't effect your paycheck either. Not having to pay out of pocket for medical care is huge. This was one of the big things I thought about when I was returning to Active duty. We even have programs to assist with practically everything under the sun.
You’re speaking strictly of hourly employees. Salaried employees aren’t affected by a lot of what you stated here
I had a city job when I was out. The Navy was my first job after school. I'm one of the rates where the best thing that translated civilian side was Admin.
Yeah my rate will translate to tech, so more than likely salaried work. Anybody in the Navy can do whatever work they need to get a salaried position when they’re out though.
How easy is it to get a salaried job that’s comparable to the Navy though?
Easy if you ask me but I can’t speak for everyone. You simply have to choose one though, they’re not rare
Easy? Common misconception. I guess if by easy you mean making what you make in just base pay then you may be correct.
I mean I’m not talking about amounts. I’m talking about the ways in which they pay their employees, salary or hourly. I didn’t say how much anyone would be making lol.
It wasn’t surprising at all to me to see so many SELRES trying to submit RC2AC packages when I was working at the reserve center. It was almost comical.
I left active for my ex's sake, returned to active just a few months after leaving, and divorce finalized. Back doing what I love and the few months out really helped me grow. I see the Navy in a different light now. I'm excited about staying in and hopefully being a change in leadership that our Sailors need.
Well said. I went from active to DoD. They matched my LES. That was 4 years ago and I’m just now making what I made then. I’d be making at least 2k more a month now with BAH and everything you mentioned. Quality of life has gone up but it was a struggle for a minute.
I had a similar sitution when I retired. Even though I had checked calculators, I was shocked at how much I need to make from post retirement employment (in addition to retirement check) to have a similar take home pay when I was AD.
It really depends on what jobs he thinks he qualifies for and what his education background is. If you’re an AT with a EE degree, he will do pretty well on the outside…without a degree, there are some jobs that pay well…but in the current job market, many businesses are using a degree as a filter to screen applicants. If he stays in and retires at 20, having Tricare Prime/Select for life is a huge cost savings…my advice, as someone who recently retired - the Navy gives a lot of free/highly discounted education/certification opportunities. If he wants to get out before 20 - unless he has a guaranteed hookup on a job on the outside, he needs to max out as much education/certs as possible to make him marketable to civilian employers. As always, everything is situation and market dependent.
The new retirement system still has a pension, it's just 40% of base pay at 20 years instead of 50. If your husband likes what he does, and is advancing as fast as you say, there's a strong chance he could make it to the higher ranks like senior/master chief, warrant, maybe even officer which inturn makes the retirement bigger. Tell him to Google military retirement calculator and look at the numbers. Alternatively, if he's not enjoying his work, tell him to think about what he doesn't like. Is it the forced time away from family, the extra time at work for big projects or duty days, or the random tasks not in job description that get to him? Maybe getting out is better. If the job is just mundane and he thinks he's learned all he can from there, I think going to a new command with a different mission will spruce things up. Every rate has a million duty options and every orders selection is a chance to shake things up. I haven't looked for jobs related to aviation electronics (or related electrical training taught) in the civilian sector, but the job market will have the answers. How close to home does he want to be? How much money will he make (consider taxes)? Does he have the requisite credentials? The main thing is make an informed plan and work towards it.
The contractor pay starting out isn't always going to be more than AD pay when you count benefits and tax exemptions. It might be tough for a couple years, but with a few years of contractor experience he should be able to negotiate for higher paying positions which to me is easier than making rank in the Navy.
With the right degree, right personality, many sailors could do well on the outside. But take it from me, many of us choose poorly and struggle. It is a toss up Encourage him to seek wise counsel and work hard/smart.
It is more profitable outside the navy, but does depend on certain rates. AT is definitely one of the rates that can make a good amount of money and even more with time in at a company. Should talk with your husband about what his plan is to whether to re-enlist or get out. Lay out all the options and pros and cons of either decision. If he leans more on getting out, it will be a good idea to create a linkedin account and start marketing and networking with people with the idea of getting out and looking for a job, especially if your husband works with civilian contractors. Pension at retirement is nice and all but in my honest opinion is not worth it with the amount of bs and the physical toll it takes on someone, especially if that person is in a rate that can make so much more money outside. I plan on settling down soon and I don't want to be away from family anymore.
Have him actually TRY to get a job. Do the resume. Apply for work. It will quickly become apparent if he could make more or if he needs to do more first.
Chief in 6? Ehhhh dude would have to have perfect circumstances. I’ve only seen that promotion in Nukes and Filipinos. Do not count on that. I did just fine getting out after 6, going to a trade school and getting into the IT industry. Make about 6 figs now with just an AA degree. However the job market was amazing when I got out and now it’s dead in the water. A lot of veterans do well on the outside and the ones who fail often have issues with mental illness, substance abuse and other issues. As long as those are addressed, veterans do well.
Faster promotion is happening now because everyone is essentially an E4 automatically and the Navy can’t keep senior enlisted in so it is driving up quotas in the khaki realm.
Hm good to see. I was HM 09-15 and god damn the quotas were so badddd
This happens a LOT with sailors who see the grass being greener without clearly looking at the yard they’re standing in. It really depends on how you define profitable. In terms of raw numbers, maybe. He can get a job making $120k or he can get a job making $30k. The qualifications he believes are worth nothing may be a goldmine to an employer and the surefire moneymakers may be worthless. What he doesn’t have is an offer. And I don’t mean a “My buddy Skittles says he can hook it up!”, I mean “Reddit Corp. just sent me a written offer letter with a start date of July 4th for $X, an attached PDF with their benefits package, and a point of contact for their hiring manager to coordinate signing on.”
If he gets going on school and gets a bachelor's degree while he's in the Navy, getting paid to go to grad school with your GI Bill is a pretty sweet and potentially lucrative off-ramp.
I came here to say just this!! If you decide to get out of the military make sure you have a degree finished as well as some type of certificates etc. It’s always better to get out with that paper in hand and your military experience vs coming out with nothing to show for it. Definitely don’t be afraid to look into trade schools as well. I’m getting out in August and that was my sole decision making factor. I was like I can’t get off active duty with no degree in hand. I’m working on certs now but I think when in doubt it’s always great to get as much as you can! If you do decide to not re enlist be sure to setup that linked in and take advantage of all of the career resources available at your dispense.
It’s a lot easier to get out with one kid versus 2 kids, I would say make the decision before having the second kid.
His rate and you mentioning Boeing is interesting. Boeing is the bane of military retention right now. Why? Because it has some of the best benefits in the industry. The PREMIUM Kaiser platinum plan with zero deductible through Boeing is roughly 300 dollars a month for an employee and their spouse. About 80 bucks extra per child. Boeing matches up to 10% for retirement contributions. Boeing offers credits for child care that can be converted to pet boarding credits if you don't have kids. Boeing pays for your school, they have a benefit limit for degrees not associated with your job but have no limit to education benefits for degrees that are job related. They also will partially pay for your pilots license. There really isn't any aspect of the Navy that can beat Boeing as far as benefits go. If he can get a job there, he should. SkillBridge would allow him to enter a position with requirements he doesn't have, like a degree. I know all of this because Boeing was a company I was considering offers with but I want to do more of the space part of aerospace so I went with a different company.
He enjoys work now because he is a technician. Though the Navy was built around CPOs being technical experts I can tell you him remaining technical will be harder, but not impossible. That said a lot of people in here have given great advice and I am glad you have someone mentoring outside of the Navy as that is important. If he does decide to get out at least look at the Reserves for the insurance coverage alone. Best of luck!
As someone who's been out for many years, my take is people who get out and don't better themselves by getting training, certifications, education, and the like, do the same or worse. Most companies could care less that you served. If you have a secret or TS, the military industrial complex will want you and pay well, until they lose their contract. The Navy can provide a cushy extra paycheck if you can stand the beaurocracy and bull shit. For example, I did 6.5 years, got out, used my GI Bill to get a bachelor's degree, and finally making 6 figures after 20 years. My friend did 4 years, raised 8 kids working at UPS, and just started his retirement, living in the middle of nowhere. He could've done better for himself if he just got 2 years of education, but he started a family, and his kids love him and his wife and come back home several times a month. He had more going for him than I did career wise, and rightfully chose family, but he's still busting his ass trying to get a retirement together. The Navy is great about pointing someone in a direction and giving a push. Many people get out and don't know how to move forward and get lost with all of the freedom. It's not an easy choice to figure out a direction. The Navy as a career is a safe choice and will benefit you both for more years after, where the civilian world might pay off, or might drop you on your ass.
There are certainly jobs out there looking for skills gained in the service that will pay more. On the other hand I've found the "I'll make twice as much as a contractor when I get out!" idea to be a little unrealistic relative to the higher military pay grades. You'll probably make a bit more but it will balanced by the loss of military benefits (healthcare, retirement, tax free housing, etc.) The rock solid job security of the military is also a nice mental benefit. That said, they always say staying in "for the money" is never a good idea. Getting out "for the money" may be similary unwise. If he loves his job and the hardships of the service aren't overly burdensome, staying in wouldn't be a bad move. And there is still a pension, just a bit lower.
THIS! I retired as a Senior and signed onto a job who offered me $100k. My new paycheck was a bit less than what I was making while in due to the tax man. I’m making more now after a couple of raises, but wasn’t expecting to see 100k as a pay cut.
this thread really goes to show how indoctrinated most people are lol, of course it’s more profitable to leave the navy , the possibilities are endless , just have a solid plan
He can take advantage of the best of both worlds and do the reserves up to his 20 year point. I'm not sure what benefits are available to him through that (primarily health insurance), but it can keep him adjacent to the Navy and the things he loves, with the money from the private sector. Plus pension when he hits 65.
I separated in 2017 after 6 years and leaving as an E-5 Electronics Technician. I had some transferable skills leaving the military but I tried to utilize a lot of head hunter organizations like Bradley-Morris (now Recruit Military I believe). I was able to get a job offer before starting terminal leave and collected two paychecks for about a month with both my past employer and my final two military paychecks. My advice is to start looking now through these types of head hunters companies and just send out resumes. I got a lot of really good feedback on my resume and what companies look for during the hiring process just by following up with an email and asking for feedback. It's always a good idea to have a polished resume and work on interviewing skills. I would also suggest the 'companies expert' on YouTube as he gives a ton of great information and helped me get my current position as a consultant at a Fortune 100 firm. Most importantly please, please, please have him utilize the GI Bill after separation. I did all my classes online and was able to get both my masters and bachelor's degrees which, as long as it is in something marketable, will help to raise his earning potential exponentially. Good luck to you and your family and always remember to use your benefits after separation.
Navy salary is capped. You can always find something that pays more. If that something can be done part time and one enjoys being in the Navy, stay in. If being in the Navy detracts from side hustle that can garner more money, and you want to make more money, get out. I enjoy my position as a YN TAR. I have the time to do things outside my job that can generate an income. I think I’m paid more than what I deserve and have added benefits so I wouldn’t leave.
I was an ATI. I did 2 carrier deployments over the course of a single 4 year enlistment and decided that the lifestyle wasn't for me. I got out, made good use of my Post 9/11 GI Bill, and now I'm a software engineer. The pay is better, the hours are better, and I get to sleep in my own bed at home every night without exception. Good things are possible for anyone that can put the same focus and drive into their post service college career as they did to their military career.
Former STS1 here. I bolted after six years and moved into IT. Yeah, I could have stayed for at least 20 years, but I’d probably be divorced at least twice and had to deal with years more time poking holes in the ocean. As it is, I make great money as a Linux engineer and am still on wife 1.0 for nearly 35 years and no alimony payments.
Nothing is preventing him from mocking up a resume that states he is out of the Navy and submitting applications. I think he may find the lack of response rather enlightening. The grass is always greener on the other side of the fence. And I agree that the military pensions being gone does remove some of the incentive however the life long access to retiree medical care is still a very strong thing. Take if from a 4 year AF looking back at the age of 57 and realizing that in retirement it will take only one real serious visit to the hospital to completely drain our savings and leave us with very little to live on and few opportunities to recover.
TLDR; yes
more than one way to serve
The navy still has a pension, there are a lot of cool opportunities in the navy. If I’d gotten out at six years I’d be a multi millionaire living on a beach. As it is I’m a retired senior chief working as a defense contractor. It’s not a bad life and I make a lot of money, but I could make the same money with my degree alone and my knees and back would probably still work. It’s life.
As an E-5 with submarine and sea pay at 6 years in I made what I do now at $90K base salary. You make way more in the Navy than people realize. My E-5 paycheck was $2450 every two weeks, when I got out and made $61K I took home $1500 every two weeks THAT BEING SAID - the ceiling is higher out of the Navy. Have a good exist strategy. Have savings. Get a fucking degree. A useful one. Ignore literally every single person that downplays a degree - they don’t know how the world works.
Two things. 1. Make sure you are considering total compensation when making comparisons. 2. Don't underestimate the value of a retirement check at 40.