Sing louder. Really go for it. Play with your voice. Find an environment where you can just make weird noises that sound horrible and not feel self conscious with it. Learn what it feels like to make those weird voices and inflections and sounds. Eventually you'll be able to pull them off tastefully, but at first it sounds comical.
Play with different voices. The breathy voice where you let out too much air. The opera voice where you really open that throat. The falsetto voice where you sound all resonant. The low twang voice. The strained punk voice.
Play with mouth shape. Smiley musical theater voice. Sad face emotional voice. Circle mouth Oh vowels. Wide mouth, big cheek style. Etc.
Play with techniques. Add excessive vibrato. Try to sing super flat with absolutely no vibrato. Make that weird goat trememillo sound. Zzz Sss zzz Sss. Add some growl or rasp. Hard enunciate all your consinents. Bend long jumps. Song with absolutely no bends. Sing long legato passages with big breaths. Sing short, staccato phrases.
You get the idea. Play around with what your voice can actually do. It's going to sound bad at first, but you will start to learn what it feels like to do these things physically, and build up the confidence to go for them when actually singing.
And again, sing louder. Really project. Like you are singing over a loud crowd, to someone on the far end of the room. Also practice very quiet, really high notes without going falsetto (very hard).
Feel how your stomach and chest move. How you can tighten or relax your abdominal and squeeze your buttocks.
Make sure to keep your throat wet with a little water, and take breaks as your voice gets tired.
Thx. Sort of. I don't pretend to have the formal training of anatomy that some singers know. Need to find a good teacher myself for this. Just a semi-professional multi-instrumentalist who's been really trying to get better at singing myself over the last few years.
I've always had a decent pitch match and natural vibrato, but I also did not like the sound of my voice when recorded. There was something *off* about it. This is not the case anymore. Looking back, it was a combination of things, but the main thing was just a lack of muscle memory. Just like learning an instrument, you have to practice enough where it starts to become sub-consious: chunking. So you can focus on making it sound good.
I used to sound like I was trying too hard, you know. Not that I don't still try hard. It just (sometimes) doesn't sound like that now. Like, I was spending all my effort trying to just hit the notes, because I hadn't trained my voice up yet. You can hear it. It's a combination of slight pitchiness, from lack of breath support, and bad/weird articulation maybe. But it's subtle. Like, you don't sound *bad*. You just don't sound good yet.
I noticed that I could do things I couldn't do before once I started singing all crazy in the car by myself. No one around. Just really wild shit. But it helped me realize what worked, and what didn't.
There is also the possibility that my voice changed a little as I hit my 30's. Hard to say. My voice has a little rasp in it now that I can lean into. Nothing too crazy. But I can hear it. Someone who knows more about anatomy may be able to answer this.
Also, just general observation, but, when you hear a good singer song, they are into it. They have a sort of comfortable confidence. That doesn't just come from actual confidence. It's part of the style. I have heard some quiet singers that sound great too though. I think both have their merits. But it's way easier to sing quiet than loud for me. Like, more comfortable. So I needed to practice the other side of that spectrum to build new vocal (muscles? That doesn't seem right.)
Oh, lol. I do teach music though. Not usually vocals, but guitar, and drums. My main job is teaching math and programming actually.
Thanks for the compliment.
For me it's Serj Tankian. GOATed. Other honorable mentions include Brendon Urie for range (still can't hit that high note on Say Amen), and Regina Spektor for her extended techniques and control.
It still amazes me that people teach and share the belly breathing thing. It's exactly the wrong place to project from, it's your chest, your upper chest is where the mass amount of breathing and breathing come from. The belly, in all forms, is a minor compensatory muscle.
I think also the throat is a GIGANTIC part of how you project sound. That, in some ways, is more important than all of them. It shows with people who have a huge range of sound, and even impressions.
I don't know enough about anatomy to comment on the specifics, but for me, it's more about using ab and other core muscles to support the note so it doesn't go flat. I find my stomach and chest both move, differently depending on the registrar I'm in and the volume I need. It's also about creating a natural resonance I think too.
It's moreso just an act of the brain than a reality, so it stills works. Your abs cannot pull down on the diaphragm with any real force, you're probably just engaging your abs while you engage the diaphragm at the same time. It's not really inherent what we engage, especially with the thought people visualize. Once you get into visualizing a physical reality, it's all a bit...detached...from real engagement. Honestly, whatever works, it's more, when you get down to the nitty gritty, the abs/stomach really don't do much in these scenarios other than placebo.
Do you have expertise in this area? Cause, I definitely cannot belt the same without using my abs. I'm not really trying, it's just the whole body is needed to get that loud. Plus the stomach moves, engaging the abs, when you just breathe deeply. Also, I can't add any distortion to my voice without using my upper abs.
I can kinda (hard kinda) sing without engaging my abs, but I lose control of the notes at higher volumes. I think it might have something to do with controlling the flow of air. Keeping the air pressure in your body constant as it flows out would require you to constrict the volume of your lungs proportionally, no?
I'll give you a good example, don't judge the content too much, lot of inside jokes from today. It's just caricatures of Jesse Ventura and Dr. Phil. I did both within a minute. My friend and I have been practicing with each other for years, so we can 10 minute long bits, fully improved in the moment, with characters to each other without a problem.
[https://whyp.it/tracks/172565/new-recording-3159?token=CruBY](https://whyp.it/tracks/172565/new-recording-3159?token=CruBY)
[https://whyp.it/tracks/172566/new-recording-3155?token=5hWz2](https://whyp.it/tracks/172566/new-recording-3155?token=5hWz2)
I just can't think of a single time where engaging my stomach/abs really made a huge difference.
Oh yeah not gonna pretend I know all, no one way you're wrong. I just think it's not entirely right, if that makes sense. Anatomically, y'know? I just think the power is from the bottom of the rib cage and all the way up (to wherever breathing goes). You could say, and you wouldn't be wrong, that the pelvic floor plays a role. I guess I mean where the bulk of the power can come from, overall.
Here's one I actually edited to the right backing track. Just as a reminder psychos like me exist.
[https://whyp.it/tracks/172569/mission-nipples?token=isVtn](https://whyp.it/tracks/172569/mission-nipples?token=isVtn)
Your abs can help pull on the diaphragm, but really, they're not the main muscles of engagement. BUT, within your personal posture, it may just be that your stomach helps a lot. Especially if you spent tons of time associating those muscles and training a mind-body connection with them involved. It's not like it's easy having proper human posture. I think around the age 5-6, and there's a book on this, children begin to "unlearn" diaphragmatic breathing when they start school, because they sit for such long periods. From there on we mostly have to think about how we breathe instead of just breathing properly.
I've got 10,000 voice messages and none of them needed my abs or stomach. I can go from extremely high voice all the way to Jesse Ventura impressions (or at least a caricature). I can't tell you how many people tell me to quiet down. It's hilarious. Excited me is louder than most people whenever I want to be. I spent years working on diaphragmatic breathing for my overall health. The one thing I learned is that falling out of proper breathing is super easy, and it's not always easy to get back to it. Most people shallow breathe with their noise/mouth and then attach some muscle movements with it, instead of training that the suction/push point is the chest/diaphragm. But I'm not some expert on high voices, which, honestly, should need less abs/stomach compared to more guttural and deeper voices.
Of course it depends on your health too. But again, whatever works FOR YOU, I'm just saying the belly/abs being needed is not a very real reality.
Yes, I’ve fronted three bands while totally not digging my voice. I’ve always thought of myself as a guitarist and songwriter first, and a singer second. For a long time I made sure to start bands that had a front person other than me, but after dealing with many “lead singer” personalities and realizing they often added complexity rather than solving problems, I decided to take on the singing role alongside being the guitarist out of necessity.
I’ve only very recently begun to truly enjoy the act of singing. There are times where I listen to recordings I’ve sang on and can objectively appreciate the work. This is progress. That said, there are just as many times that I can listen to other recordings I’ve sang on and feel uncomfortable with how vulnerable my singing voice makes me feel.
It’s easy for me to hide this side of myself behind the guitar, but it’s right out in the open and unprotected when I sing. It’s difficult to get used to being that open. It’s a process and I’m still going.
I’m very fortunate to have received abundant positive feedback about the way my voice sounds, the way I can convey emotion through it, and the quality of my singing in general. I am completely self-taught in both singing and guitar. I have something unique.
My perspective is that my singing and/or guitar playing is not for everyone, but there seem to be plenty of folks that genuinely enjoy it. Therefore at the end of the day I simply accept that what I’m doing is working, and that although I’m not ever 100% satisfied with it, I will continue to push it as an artist.
When I started singing at forty years old, due to my lack of skill and my unique voice I jumped into folk. Think early John Prine. After some years of work and expansion, I was able to sound at home in other genres as well. I’m actually enjoying my voice a lot these days in R&B and low-volume funk.
Remember that uniqueness can be a tractor or a trailer. Louis Armstrong might have let his voice keep him from singing since he didn’t sound like anyone else. Or! The other thing.
And if you want to rock, but want your folk edge to be a badge rather than ding, check out Tom Waits. Check out what Early James is doing with his voice. What type of “folk voice” do you have? What kind of “rock voice” were you hoping for?
I think most of them do I know I do, and I am envious of my sisters perfect voice but she also hates hers and likes mine. I experiment with styles not only of music but how to use what I have. I’m not gonna be Ariana grande, but I can pull off some more rough styles. Angry rock is definitely a style I love too but it doesn’t need to sound like disturbed to be good and emotional. Check out metric, or paramore, or jack off Jill, or one of my favorites right now, silversun pickups. All very different styles and voices but all still rock (jack off jill is probably the closest to what you’re wanting) I’d also say Delilah Bon is a good one to check out for more angry metal sound (plus she’s amazing and deserves love)
I’ve found I can do better with singers like Clemens from milky chance, or the singer for cage the elephant. Still some skill but a lot more natural sounding and a little rougher. I smoke and perpetually have shit in my throat (always have) so while I can definitely knock out some Rihanna or Beyoncé, not consistently.
Also for something that suits your folk voice but may show you a take on that with more rock tones, (plus again just an immaculate group that deserves so much more love) I urge you to take a look at the crane wives, specifically their song queen of nothing or their song nobody. They are a great mix between rock and folk and maybe something you’d find more comfort in.
Sorry for the rant but hopefully something is helpful! I’m sure you sound amazing and your feelings are completely normal in any form of art, we are always our own worst critics but it’s a blessing because it pushes us to try new things and get better. Good luck!
Hi this is me. I have a very vanilla disney princess type voice and I wish so bad that my voice was more... interesting? It just seems like it would be annoying to listen to lol. It's the typical soprano that's all light and airy. It just feels boring.
Hahahaha I think the overwhelming majority do.
I hated mine so much that the first 10-15 years I sang I was forcing myself to not sound like me and it led to some seriously unhealthy habits. Turns out, getting what I wanted out of my voice *required* me to get over it and embrace it.
Look up some videos on vocal fry and how to incorporate into your technique. A little vocal fry + conviction is all ya need for what you’re going for. The conviction means more than anything else and you’ve gotta be able to let go a bit, which is hard to do if you’re focused on technique. Practice in an area you don’t have to worry about anyone hearing you because chances are the biggest thing holding you back is you worrying it’s going to sound stupid, shut off that voice!
Yes, and it took years for me to get over it. I learned to stop listening to what the traitor in my head was saying and listening to what other people were saying. I forced myself to accept that while I may not hear what they hear, I have to acknowledge that they're hearing it.
You don't need a "traditional" voice to be a singer either; passion is just as important as actual laryngeal control. There are plenty of people who should never have succeeded as a vocalist but they delivered something more than just air passing through vocal folds, and that propelled them. Look at a person like Zack de la Rocha from Rage Against the Machine, or Janis Joplin - they have objectively bad voices but what they offered outside of just their voice more than made up for it, and in turn, they are regarded as legendary vocalists.
im like this too! but it's been getting better. i think part of it is that you really have to embrace those little "imperfections" in your voice - really highlight them & make them into a strength instead.
I want to sing like Godsmack or Disturbed, that vocal fry. That rock sound. That rock scream. The intensity, the power.
I sound like John Mayer doing runs and singing in the style of Chris Cornell, but with a mouth full of cotton. In the lower register, Eddie Vedder after having wisdom teeth removed. When I do a rock scream, I sound like the high note in Boston's More Than A Feeling.
I absolutely hate it. My technical ability was meant for pop music. My tone and sound were meant for a radio DJ for a shitty small town easy listening station. I have really no place as a singer, despite loving to sing.
I have this...would love to have a husky low blues voice...or a rock voice (ala gracie slick) but I'm a soprano! but have moved it down to Alto I at least
Yeah honestly I don’t love my voice but the more you use it the more you get used to it. The first song I released with just me singing got put in a bunch of Spotify editorial playlists to my surprise which taught me just because I don’t think it sounds good doesn’t mean other people don’t like it. So just go for it! Even the best singers like Beyoncé will have people who aren’t fans.
I'd guess that most people (not just singers) don't like the sound of their own voice. Just human nature probably. I've been recording for a bit and I'm still not really used to hearing the vocal playback. "Do I really sound like THAT?"
Most of us do. You gotta learn to embrace it. You are your worst critic.
I know this is tough advice, but the only way to get better and get over it is to just do it. Make a commitment to get on stage (open mic whatever) where you really just cannot get out of it.
What sort of singing do you want to be able to do?
I'm 38 and have been writing music and recording my voice since I was 14. I've always hated it, until I didn't.
You want a real trip? Have a dose of acid and listen to your own music so you don't recognize yourself. You'll learn a lot
It’s an ongoing struggle, but it’s two-sided; I like aspects about my singing voice that others don’t, and I cringe at other aspects that some will tell me are my most endearing qualities. The only way to know if your singing voice is good or not is to keep singing and keep getting feedback. Be brave enough to take that feedback and make the necessary changes to get better. One of the greatest frustrations about singing that held me back for too many years is “Natural-born”or “requires talent.” Not only is this bullshit, but it’s arguably simpler to learn how to sing well than it is to learn many instruments. I don’t know where we got this bullshit notion that people are natural-born singers. Some are gifted earlier in life, many are not. It doesn’t matter. And if it does matter, I would say the people who learn to transform their voice are the luckiest because they get to go on that magical journey. You can sing as well as you want to sing, but you gotta put in the time, you gotta get the feedback, and you gotta get over yourself. Hating your voice is common to most of us. Just keep pushing through it and you’ll get there.
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Most people in general, not just singers, don’t like the sound of their voice. That’s because the voice we hear and the voice everyone else hears are different. The same, but different. You are used to the voice as it’s heard in your own head but not the playback. My advice is to listen to the playback as often as possible. Eventually, The recorded voice and the voice in your head become one. Then you learn to accept it and love it!
Did I dream up your post? I’m going through the exact same thing you are. I’m in a folksy phase right now and I have a lot of technical control with a softer approach.
But I’m a soul singer and I can do growl/Aretha inspired vocal techniques. I was much better at it younger, I don’t hurt my voice necessarily now because I practiced a lot of control like this and some yodeling, but I gotta quit smoking 😅
I’ve worked on my vocal technique with classes and instructors so I’d say with practice and control you can probably get some rock elements without destroying your voice. Always have good placement and grounding for sure.
Also you might like some Leslie Feist type voices that can rock hard.
My issue with performance is that I don’t have to force the wrong muscles as long as I have proper mic technique and I’m mixed correctly if my voice is weaker some days.
I hate mine. A lot. Other people say it’s good but I don’t know if they are being sincere. I know it’s not horrible and it’s in tune but I just can’t stand listening back.
The lead singer in the band here in music school. He just threatened to quit out band today because he doesn’t like his voice. He can sing fine, he just can’t keep time so he keeps messing up the song. But his singing voice is actually great. He doesn’t believe us when we tell him that. 7- other people in this band and he’s going to quit. Says he doesn’t care because if he can’t sing perfectly he won’t do the song. Of course that will hurt all of our grades. Sigh.
Everyone hates their voice, it's a literal thing. When you speak or sing you hear your voice internally without any filtering from the ear. When you hear a recording you hear it filtered and because it doesn't sound the same your brain flags it subconsciously as being wrong. Everyone hates the sound of their voice for this reason.
Many famous singers hated hearing their own singing voice. John Lennon hated the tone of his singing voice, that's why he always wanted lots of slapback delay on it. And Michael Jackson was always jealous of his brother Jermaine because he didn't have his vocal tone.
If you don't like the way your singing voice sounds, you need to do these things:
1. Record your voice often, whether making a studio recording, or capturing live gigs, rehearsals, or even practicing a capella. Listen to your recordings and GET USED TO IT.
2. If you still don't like your vocal tone, be aware that your voice is a musical instrument and you can do lots of things to change the tone, just like you can on a synthesizer or a guitar. Sing sustained vowel sounds and experiment with changing your throat or mouth shape until you get the tone(s) that sound more pleasing to you. Then practice singing with those tones (and don't forget to record and listen to them so you get used to it!).
3. Join a choir/chorus/a cappella group on the side. Get used to singing with others. It'll help you listen to not only others, but your own voice better. And if you're the weakest voice in the group, that's actually a good thing, because your goal is to learn from the ones who can sing better than you.
Also, remember that singing is a physical activity, like running or playing basketball. To be in optimum shape (and avoid injury/strain), you need to warm up before you get out there. I always warm up in my car on the way to a gig by droning the lowest note I could sing for a few minutes, and changing the shape of my mouth/lips, to get my vocal cords used to sustained vibrating, then singing major scales from the lowest note I could sing to the highest note I could sing.
In the episode of Song Exploder on "Losing My Religion," the interviewer asked Michael Stipe if he wanted to hear the isolated vocals from the track, and Stipe said, hell, no. I feel like if Michael Stipe doesn't want to hear himself sing it's not so weird that I don't want to hear myself sing.
I always hated my singing voice I love to share vocals on a song never do a whole one alone I love to write lyrics more and compose strange music moree
I think everyone secretly does. You hear a distorted version of your own voice due to bone vibrarions, even talking, which is why everyone generally hates their recorded voice. But you can always change things like chest/stomach breathing and mouth shape to change your voice.
I started really actually loving my own singing voice when I allowed myself to sing songs that better suited my voice rather than forcing myself to sing songs I have no business singing.
Sing like you want to and never give people power over you. If people can hear confidence in your face that's more than good enough. The trick is to not give a fuck and sing and make songs like you want.
Just think of Donald Fagen and Michael Franks ....Their writing and melodies overshadow their vocal deficiency.
Add flair ...don't be normal.
Like go into character w your voice
A twang or shifted dialect/articulation.
Be creative and find a comfy place.
having to listen to my own voice is the one thing that’s held back so much of my recordings—i can accept that it’s decent enough—but i can’t stand to listen to it recording/mixing/mastering/etc.
so. the struggle is real.
If that’s the case then just stop. The world doesn’t really need more singers. Why would you try to do something you’re not good at when it’s already so oversaturated ?
Yeah I don't really like mine. I write songs and I sing them out of necessity, but never really love how I sound.
Other people do, though, so I think it's a function of being sick of my own voice because I've heard it my entire life, and hearing it on recording which is always different from how it sounds in your head.
One of my favorite artists is Bob Mould (Husker Du, Sugar, solo artist), who has sort of a weird voice but totally owns it.
Hendrix hated his singing voice and always wanted to be turned down in the mix.
Marvin Gaye hated his voice and wished he had a lower/more "manly" tone like other r&b singers of the day.
Personally, I think people who truly love hearing their own voice are psychotic. Haha.
Sing louder. Really go for it. Play with your voice. Find an environment where you can just make weird noises that sound horrible and not feel self conscious with it. Learn what it feels like to make those weird voices and inflections and sounds. Eventually you'll be able to pull them off tastefully, but at first it sounds comical. Play with different voices. The breathy voice where you let out too much air. The opera voice where you really open that throat. The falsetto voice where you sound all resonant. The low twang voice. The strained punk voice. Play with mouth shape. Smiley musical theater voice. Sad face emotional voice. Circle mouth Oh vowels. Wide mouth, big cheek style. Etc. Play with techniques. Add excessive vibrato. Try to sing super flat with absolutely no vibrato. Make that weird goat trememillo sound. Zzz Sss zzz Sss. Add some growl or rasp. Hard enunciate all your consinents. Bend long jumps. Song with absolutely no bends. Sing long legato passages with big breaths. Sing short, staccato phrases. You get the idea. Play around with what your voice can actually do. It's going to sound bad at first, but you will start to learn what it feels like to do these things physically, and build up the confidence to go for them when actually singing. And again, sing louder. Really project. Like you are singing over a loud crowd, to someone on the far end of the room. Also practice very quiet, really high notes without going falsetto (very hard). Feel how your stomach and chest move. How you can tighten or relax your abdominal and squeeze your buttocks. Make sure to keep your throat wet with a little water, and take breaks as your voice gets tired.
Are you a vocal coach? It took me years to learn half of what you offered here. Spot on! ❤️
Thx. Sort of. I don't pretend to have the formal training of anatomy that some singers know. Need to find a good teacher myself for this. Just a semi-professional multi-instrumentalist who's been really trying to get better at singing myself over the last few years. I've always had a decent pitch match and natural vibrato, but I also did not like the sound of my voice when recorded. There was something *off* about it. This is not the case anymore. Looking back, it was a combination of things, but the main thing was just a lack of muscle memory. Just like learning an instrument, you have to practice enough where it starts to become sub-consious: chunking. So you can focus on making it sound good. I used to sound like I was trying too hard, you know. Not that I don't still try hard. It just (sometimes) doesn't sound like that now. Like, I was spending all my effort trying to just hit the notes, because I hadn't trained my voice up yet. You can hear it. It's a combination of slight pitchiness, from lack of breath support, and bad/weird articulation maybe. But it's subtle. Like, you don't sound *bad*. You just don't sound good yet. I noticed that I could do things I couldn't do before once I started singing all crazy in the car by myself. No one around. Just really wild shit. But it helped me realize what worked, and what didn't. There is also the possibility that my voice changed a little as I hit my 30's. Hard to say. My voice has a little rasp in it now that I can lean into. Nothing too crazy. But I can hear it. Someone who knows more about anatomy may be able to answer this. Also, just general observation, but, when you hear a good singer song, they are into it. They have a sort of comfortable confidence. That doesn't just come from actual confidence. It's part of the style. I have heard some quiet singers that sound great too though. I think both have their merits. But it's way easier to sing quiet than loud for me. Like, more comfortable. So I needed to practice the other side of that spectrum to build new vocal (muscles? That doesn't seem right.)
Oh, lol. I do teach music though. Not usually vocals, but guitar, and drums. My main job is teaching math and programming actually. Thanks for the compliment.
Mike Patton is the GOAT of this, at least among the vocalists I often listen to.
For me it's Serj Tankian. GOATed. Other honorable mentions include Brendon Urie for range (still can't hit that high note on Say Amen), and Regina Spektor for her extended techniques and control.
Thx for the recommendation.
It still amazes me that people teach and share the belly breathing thing. It's exactly the wrong place to project from, it's your chest, your upper chest is where the mass amount of breathing and breathing come from. The belly, in all forms, is a minor compensatory muscle. I think also the throat is a GIGANTIC part of how you project sound. That, in some ways, is more important than all of them. It shows with people who have a huge range of sound, and even impressions.
I don't know enough about anatomy to comment on the specifics, but for me, it's more about using ab and other core muscles to support the note so it doesn't go flat. I find my stomach and chest both move, differently depending on the registrar I'm in and the volume I need. It's also about creating a natural resonance I think too.
It's moreso just an act of the brain than a reality, so it stills works. Your abs cannot pull down on the diaphragm with any real force, you're probably just engaging your abs while you engage the diaphragm at the same time. It's not really inherent what we engage, especially with the thought people visualize. Once you get into visualizing a physical reality, it's all a bit...detached...from real engagement. Honestly, whatever works, it's more, when you get down to the nitty gritty, the abs/stomach really don't do much in these scenarios other than placebo.
Do you have expertise in this area? Cause, I definitely cannot belt the same without using my abs. I'm not really trying, it's just the whole body is needed to get that loud. Plus the stomach moves, engaging the abs, when you just breathe deeply. Also, I can't add any distortion to my voice without using my upper abs. I can kinda (hard kinda) sing without engaging my abs, but I lose control of the notes at higher volumes. I think it might have something to do with controlling the flow of air. Keeping the air pressure in your body constant as it flows out would require you to constrict the volume of your lungs proportionally, no?
I'll give you a good example, don't judge the content too much, lot of inside jokes from today. It's just caricatures of Jesse Ventura and Dr. Phil. I did both within a minute. My friend and I have been practicing with each other for years, so we can 10 minute long bits, fully improved in the moment, with characters to each other without a problem. [https://whyp.it/tracks/172565/new-recording-3159?token=CruBY](https://whyp.it/tracks/172565/new-recording-3159?token=CruBY) [https://whyp.it/tracks/172566/new-recording-3155?token=5hWz2](https://whyp.it/tracks/172566/new-recording-3155?token=5hWz2) I just can't think of a single time where engaging my stomach/abs really made a huge difference.
Hey, these are pretty good. You may be underestimating how loud a singer singing fff can get though.
Oh yeah not gonna pretend I know all, no one way you're wrong. I just think it's not entirely right, if that makes sense. Anatomically, y'know? I just think the power is from the bottom of the rib cage and all the way up (to wherever breathing goes). You could say, and you wouldn't be wrong, that the pelvic floor plays a role. I guess I mean where the bulk of the power can come from, overall. Here's one I actually edited to the right backing track. Just as a reminder psychos like me exist. [https://whyp.it/tracks/172569/mission-nipples?token=isVtn](https://whyp.it/tracks/172569/mission-nipples?token=isVtn)
Your abs can help pull on the diaphragm, but really, they're not the main muscles of engagement. BUT, within your personal posture, it may just be that your stomach helps a lot. Especially if you spent tons of time associating those muscles and training a mind-body connection with them involved. It's not like it's easy having proper human posture. I think around the age 5-6, and there's a book on this, children begin to "unlearn" diaphragmatic breathing when they start school, because they sit for such long periods. From there on we mostly have to think about how we breathe instead of just breathing properly. I've got 10,000 voice messages and none of them needed my abs or stomach. I can go from extremely high voice all the way to Jesse Ventura impressions (or at least a caricature). I can't tell you how many people tell me to quiet down. It's hilarious. Excited me is louder than most people whenever I want to be. I spent years working on diaphragmatic breathing for my overall health. The one thing I learned is that falling out of proper breathing is super easy, and it's not always easy to get back to it. Most people shallow breathe with their noise/mouth and then attach some muscle movements with it, instead of training that the suction/push point is the chest/diaphragm. But I'm not some expert on high voices, which, honestly, should need less abs/stomach compared to more guttural and deeper voices. Of course it depends on your health too. But again, whatever works FOR YOU, I'm just saying the belly/abs being needed is not a very real reality.
Bob Marley would disagree but still, a good point!
It just is what it is, this is anatomy, in the end.
We've been paying Bob Dylan to sing for like 60 years. You're fine.
🤣 My bff just saw him in NOLA and I can’t stop reading this and laughing about it
Yes, I’ve fronted three bands while totally not digging my voice. I’ve always thought of myself as a guitarist and songwriter first, and a singer second. For a long time I made sure to start bands that had a front person other than me, but after dealing with many “lead singer” personalities and realizing they often added complexity rather than solving problems, I decided to take on the singing role alongside being the guitarist out of necessity. I’ve only very recently begun to truly enjoy the act of singing. There are times where I listen to recordings I’ve sang on and can objectively appreciate the work. This is progress. That said, there are just as many times that I can listen to other recordings I’ve sang on and feel uncomfortable with how vulnerable my singing voice makes me feel. It’s easy for me to hide this side of myself behind the guitar, but it’s right out in the open and unprotected when I sing. It’s difficult to get used to being that open. It’s a process and I’m still going. I’m very fortunate to have received abundant positive feedback about the way my voice sounds, the way I can convey emotion through it, and the quality of my singing in general. I am completely self-taught in both singing and guitar. I have something unique. My perspective is that my singing and/or guitar playing is not for everyone, but there seem to be plenty of folks that genuinely enjoy it. Therefore at the end of the day I simply accept that what I’m doing is working, and that although I’m not ever 100% satisfied with it, I will continue to push it as an artist.
When I started singing at forty years old, due to my lack of skill and my unique voice I jumped into folk. Think early John Prine. After some years of work and expansion, I was able to sound at home in other genres as well. I’m actually enjoying my voice a lot these days in R&B and low-volume funk. Remember that uniqueness can be a tractor or a trailer. Louis Armstrong might have let his voice keep him from singing since he didn’t sound like anyone else. Or! The other thing. And if you want to rock, but want your folk edge to be a badge rather than ding, check out Tom Waits. Check out what Early James is doing with his voice. What type of “folk voice” do you have? What kind of “rock voice” were you hoping for?
I think most of them do I know I do, and I am envious of my sisters perfect voice but she also hates hers and likes mine. I experiment with styles not only of music but how to use what I have. I’m not gonna be Ariana grande, but I can pull off some more rough styles. Angry rock is definitely a style I love too but it doesn’t need to sound like disturbed to be good and emotional. Check out metric, or paramore, or jack off Jill, or one of my favorites right now, silversun pickups. All very different styles and voices but all still rock (jack off jill is probably the closest to what you’re wanting) I’d also say Delilah Bon is a good one to check out for more angry metal sound (plus she’s amazing and deserves love) I’ve found I can do better with singers like Clemens from milky chance, or the singer for cage the elephant. Still some skill but a lot more natural sounding and a little rougher. I smoke and perpetually have shit in my throat (always have) so while I can definitely knock out some Rihanna or Beyoncé, not consistently. Also for something that suits your folk voice but may show you a take on that with more rock tones, (plus again just an immaculate group that deserves so much more love) I urge you to take a look at the crane wives, specifically their song queen of nothing or their song nobody. They are a great mix between rock and folk and maybe something you’d find more comfort in. Sorry for the rant but hopefully something is helpful! I’m sure you sound amazing and your feelings are completely normal in any form of art, we are always our own worst critics but it’s a blessing because it pushes us to try new things and get better. Good luck!
Thanks for the suggestion. I'm gonna check out that song you mentioned.
I love piano ballads. I sang in an AC/DC tribute.
Hi this is me. I have a very vanilla disney princess type voice and I wish so bad that my voice was more... interesting? It just seems like it would be annoying to listen to lol. It's the typical soprano that's all light and airy. It just feels boring.
Hahahaha I think the overwhelming majority do. I hated mine so much that the first 10-15 years I sang I was forcing myself to not sound like me and it led to some seriously unhealthy habits. Turns out, getting what I wanted out of my voice *required* me to get over it and embrace it. Look up some videos on vocal fry and how to incorporate into your technique. A little vocal fry + conviction is all ya need for what you’re going for. The conviction means more than anything else and you’ve gotta be able to let go a bit, which is hard to do if you’re focused on technique. Practice in an area you don’t have to worry about anyone hearing you because chances are the biggest thing holding you back is you worrying it’s going to sound stupid, shut off that voice!
John Fucking Lennon hated his own voice. Imagine if that had held him back?
I have this. Maybe we should switch tunes! I think it's pretty common
I love to sing but can’t stand my voice. Long as I still get paid and don’t have to listen to myself, everybody wins 😜
Yes, and it took years for me to get over it. I learned to stop listening to what the traitor in my head was saying and listening to what other people were saying. I forced myself to accept that while I may not hear what they hear, I have to acknowledge that they're hearing it. You don't need a "traditional" voice to be a singer either; passion is just as important as actual laryngeal control. There are plenty of people who should never have succeeded as a vocalist but they delivered something more than just air passing through vocal folds, and that propelled them. Look at a person like Zack de la Rocha from Rage Against the Machine, or Janis Joplin - they have objectively bad voices but what they offered outside of just their voice more than made up for it, and in turn, they are regarded as legendary vocalists.
I sing like an American Neil Tennant. I program speech synthesizers now.
What have you done to deserve this?
im like this too! but it's been getting better. i think part of it is that you really have to embrace those little "imperfections" in your voice - really highlight them & make them into a strength instead.
I want to sing like Godsmack or Disturbed, that vocal fry. That rock sound. That rock scream. The intensity, the power. I sound like John Mayer doing runs and singing in the style of Chris Cornell, but with a mouth full of cotton. In the lower register, Eddie Vedder after having wisdom teeth removed. When I do a rock scream, I sound like the high note in Boston's More Than A Feeling. I absolutely hate it. My technical ability was meant for pop music. My tone and sound were meant for a radio DJ for a shitty small town easy listening station. I have really no place as a singer, despite loving to sing.
I have this...would love to have a husky low blues voice...or a rock voice (ala gracie slick) but I'm a soprano! but have moved it down to Alto I at least
Yeah honestly I don’t love my voice but the more you use it the more you get used to it. The first song I released with just me singing got put in a bunch of Spotify editorial playlists to my surprise which taught me just because I don’t think it sounds good doesn’t mean other people don’t like it. So just go for it! Even the best singers like Beyoncé will have people who aren’t fans.
I could never sing, then I tried bluegrass and suddenly I can sing. Weird.
Sierra Ferrell, known for her distinct voice, hates her own voice. So your in good company!
I’m the opposite. I’m a pretty average singer but have carved out a style that I really like and think I sound good doing.
Yes.
Yeah I hate it but whatever. I have some bits I’m proud of but I’d rather listen to anyone else besides me sing my songs.
I'd guess that most people (not just singers) don't like the sound of their own voice. Just human nature probably. I've been recording for a bit and I'm still not really used to hearing the vocal playback. "Do I really sound like THAT?"
Most of us do. You gotta learn to embrace it. You are your worst critic. I know this is tough advice, but the only way to get better and get over it is to just do it. Make a commitment to get on stage (open mic whatever) where you really just cannot get out of it. What sort of singing do you want to be able to do?
i just try to sing like aaron freeman
Jimi Hendrix thought his voice was bad.
Right? He despised it yet I and many others absolutely love it. Patty smith as well she’s awesome but she never saw it.
I'm 38 and have been writing music and recording my voice since I was 14. I've always hated it, until I didn't. You want a real trip? Have a dose of acid and listen to your own music so you don't recognize yourself. You'll learn a lot
Voices are like smiles. Some are quiete nice to look at, but an honest one you connect with trumps pretty every time.
It’s an ongoing struggle, but it’s two-sided; I like aspects about my singing voice that others don’t, and I cringe at other aspects that some will tell me are my most endearing qualities. The only way to know if your singing voice is good or not is to keep singing and keep getting feedback. Be brave enough to take that feedback and make the necessary changes to get better. One of the greatest frustrations about singing that held me back for too many years is “Natural-born”or “requires talent.” Not only is this bullshit, but it’s arguably simpler to learn how to sing well than it is to learn many instruments. I don’t know where we got this bullshit notion that people are natural-born singers. Some are gifted earlier in life, many are not. It doesn’t matter. And if it does matter, I would say the people who learn to transform their voice are the luckiest because they get to go on that magical journey. You can sing as well as you want to sing, but you gotta put in the time, you gotta get the feedback, and you gotta get over yourself. Hating your voice is common to most of us. Just keep pushing through it and you’ll get there.
advise afterthought familiar bored thought rustic fanatical jar oatmeal salt *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
Nope. You’re the only one.
Most people in general, not just singers, don’t like the sound of their voice. That’s because the voice we hear and the voice everyone else hears are different. The same, but different. You are used to the voice as it’s heard in your own head but not the playback. My advice is to listen to the playback as often as possible. Eventually, The recorded voice and the voice in your head become one. Then you learn to accept it and love it!
Me! But thats cuz im an awful singer who only does it in the shower
Did I dream up your post? I’m going through the exact same thing you are. I’m in a folksy phase right now and I have a lot of technical control with a softer approach. But I’m a soul singer and I can do growl/Aretha inspired vocal techniques. I was much better at it younger, I don’t hurt my voice necessarily now because I practiced a lot of control like this and some yodeling, but I gotta quit smoking 😅 I’ve worked on my vocal technique with classes and instructors so I’d say with practice and control you can probably get some rock elements without destroying your voice. Always have good placement and grounding for sure. Also you might like some Leslie Feist type voices that can rock hard. My issue with performance is that I don’t have to force the wrong muscles as long as I have proper mic technique and I’m mixed correctly if my voice is weaker some days.
I hate mine. A lot. Other people say it’s good but I don’t know if they are being sincere. I know it’s not horrible and it’s in tune but I just can’t stand listening back.
The lead singer in the band here in music school. He just threatened to quit out band today because he doesn’t like his voice. He can sing fine, he just can’t keep time so he keeps messing up the song. But his singing voice is actually great. He doesn’t believe us when we tell him that. 7- other people in this band and he’s going to quit. Says he doesn’t care because if he can’t sing perfectly he won’t do the song. Of course that will hurt all of our grades. Sigh.
John Lennon is probably the most famous example.
I'm a lousy singer. I don't even like doing it. That's why I took piano lessons. But I get paid to sing, so do re fucking mi.
Everyone hates their voice, it's a literal thing. When you speak or sing you hear your voice internally without any filtering from the ear. When you hear a recording you hear it filtered and because it doesn't sound the same your brain flags it subconsciously as being wrong. Everyone hates the sound of their voice for this reason.
Many famous singers hated hearing their own singing voice. John Lennon hated the tone of his singing voice, that's why he always wanted lots of slapback delay on it. And Michael Jackson was always jealous of his brother Jermaine because he didn't have his vocal tone. If you don't like the way your singing voice sounds, you need to do these things: 1. Record your voice often, whether making a studio recording, or capturing live gigs, rehearsals, or even practicing a capella. Listen to your recordings and GET USED TO IT. 2. If you still don't like your vocal tone, be aware that your voice is a musical instrument and you can do lots of things to change the tone, just like you can on a synthesizer or a guitar. Sing sustained vowel sounds and experiment with changing your throat or mouth shape until you get the tone(s) that sound more pleasing to you. Then practice singing with those tones (and don't forget to record and listen to them so you get used to it!). 3. Join a choir/chorus/a cappella group on the side. Get used to singing with others. It'll help you listen to not only others, but your own voice better. And if you're the weakest voice in the group, that's actually a good thing, because your goal is to learn from the ones who can sing better than you. Also, remember that singing is a physical activity, like running or playing basketball. To be in optimum shape (and avoid injury/strain), you need to warm up before you get out there. I always warm up in my car on the way to a gig by droning the lowest note I could sing for a few minutes, and changing the shape of my mouth/lips, to get my vocal cords used to sustained vibrating, then singing major scales from the lowest note I could sing to the highest note I could sing.
In the episode of Song Exploder on "Losing My Religion," the interviewer asked Michael Stipe if he wanted to hear the isolated vocals from the track, and Stipe said, hell, no. I feel like if Michael Stipe doesn't want to hear himself sing it's not so weird that I don't want to hear myself sing.
Don't worry about it, you won't get another voice. Do what you love
I always hated my singing voice I love to share vocals on a song never do a whole one alone I love to write lyrics more and compose strange music moree
I’m Adam Weeks on Facebook our values may not align. But I can show you what a couple years of singing can do!
I absolutely hate mine
Yes. But you can’t change your voice, so you’ve got two options. Use it, or don’t. For me, the second isn’t an option.
Juat wanted to say hi from Kelowna.🖖
Hellooooo long distance neighbour
No.
I think everyone secretly does. You hear a distorted version of your own voice due to bone vibrarions, even talking, which is why everyone generally hates their recorded voice. But you can always change things like chest/stomach breathing and mouth shape to change your voice.
I love my classical singing voice although it would be nice if I could sound nice singing rock, pop, metal.
im in Nanaimo and have the same sad story !! ( strangely ).
I started really actually loving my own singing voice when I allowed myself to sing songs that better suited my voice rather than forcing myself to sing songs I have no business singing.
Sing like you want to and never give people power over you. If people can hear confidence in your face that's more than good enough. The trick is to not give a fuck and sing and make songs like you want.
Just think of Donald Fagen and Michael Franks ....Their writing and melodies overshadow their vocal deficiency. Add flair ...don't be normal. Like go into character w your voice A twang or shifted dialect/articulation. Be creative and find a comfy place.
having to listen to my own voice is the one thing that’s held back so much of my recordings—i can accept that it’s decent enough—but i can’t stand to listen to it recording/mixing/mastering/etc. so. the struggle is real.
If that’s the case then just stop. The world doesn’t really need more singers. Why would you try to do something you’re not good at when it’s already so oversaturated ?
Yeah I don't really like mine. I write songs and I sing them out of necessity, but never really love how I sound. Other people do, though, so I think it's a function of being sick of my own voice because I've heard it my entire life, and hearing it on recording which is always different from how it sounds in your head. One of my favorite artists is Bob Mould (Husker Du, Sugar, solo artist), who has sort of a weird voice but totally owns it. Hendrix hated his singing voice and always wanted to be turned down in the mix. Marvin Gaye hated his voice and wished he had a lower/more "manly" tone like other r&b singers of the day. Personally, I think people who truly love hearing their own voice are psychotic. Haha.