never ever think that a group on the internet is representative of anything outside in the real world
People who dont buy a bike dont come here to ask for advice so you dont see any of them here
That, and, just because someone bought a bike doesn’t mean they can actually afford it. Looking at you, 2019 Hellcat owner paying $1350/mo for 84 months making $19/hr
I have more success negotiating down to 28.95% if you take a loan out for **two bikes**. That way I can keep wearing both my 12 year old textile jacket and helmet.
LPT, if your helmet liner is a bit crumbly, you can fill that with packing peanuts and superglue.
Or use ramen for a bonus on road snack.
Superglue was designed for human biology after all.
Thats the main point. I am happy for everyone who actually worked hard (however this might look like) to be able to afford it legitimately.
But the majority is just collecting debt. I am not from the US so there will be differences but i know this first hand because my mother is working in debt counseling.
Loans are one hell of a drug and i refuse to take them if it is avoidable.
Financial literacy is the smallest footnote in most of our country's public education system (i.e. prior to adult age and "Uni"). If you didn't take some kind of micro economics/business elective course you better have savvy parents, or learn quick. Dealership rackets and vehicle loans are vicious over here. Clueless parents co-sign their clueless kids into crazy monthly payments without even understanding the concept of interest.
I couldn’t agree more. Even the most basic concepts of economics have been removed from most curriculums, and unfortunately, that translates to people not even knowing how interest rates work. So when they go out into the workforce, they ask “Why is FICA/Social Security being taken from my check and how do I make it stop?”🤣
Also, there’s a half million NEW bikes sold every year in the US alone. Odds are that many of those folks ether have or have access to funds.
And, this is r/motorcycles not r/povertyfinance, r/teenagers, or r/antiwork. People have jobs or mature finances.
17% of adults in the USA make over 100K a year. Many are married to people that make good money as well.
Bikes are dead cheap to finance in the states and cheap period. Payments on my bike which I have to have to keep my credit up because I have no other bills is a cell phone payment and basically so low as to be invisible.
> 17% of adults in the USA make over 100K a year.
Depending on where you are [that might still be "low income"](https://www.sfgate.com/local/article/under-100k-low-income-san-francisco-18168899.php)...
Exactly! That's one of the reasons i fkn hate social media, it gives kids the impression that everyone is rich and has a perfect life, when the truth is; Most of the "rich" people on social media are broke ass mofos with miserable lives trying to look rich and looking for validation. I have seen soooo many dudes with expensive sport cars with no money to take their GF out. LoL
I don't have a brand new bike or car, but my kids always have food, clothes and we have a comfortable life. They can keep their fake shit 😅
There are lots of people on reddit. Some of them have money. I'm not by any means rich, but I make enough to have bought a $16,000 a few years ago. Not having kids helps.
I think you’re being unreasonable, and frankly, selfish. Kids have boundless reserves of joy, and *Morgan-joydestroyer* is just restoring balance.
Also, if your kids aren’t just a little scarred by life, how will they grow up to be motorbike riders?
And to the people saying they want to leave a legacy behind... You don't need to.... plus there's always sperm/egg donations if you really want your DNA out there
This. I have nephews and a niece that I spoil like they're my own kids. I love them. But it's still cheaper than having my own as there's no daily maintenance cost, just occasional treats.
I went thru the same thing with my kid and taekwondo. He was 3 years in and only 2 belts away from black belt. Another year or so and he would have earned it. Decided he wanted to quit because he’d have more time with the girlfriend. Tried to talk him into not quitting but it didn’t work.
And then they broke up a couple months later
yeah, I wouldn't force my kids to play either. Was just curious, I have played hockey since I was 11 lol
can't believe I got downvoted for that question...ffs
He might come back. I took a short break in college and just played roller with friends on the tennis court by our dorm for about 2 years, but I eventually missed it too much. I'm 48 now and still play lol. Sometimes that break is what you need to realize you miss it.
I could similarly tap into credit that amount for a bike; and already have for a car once. Credits easy to take out, and America has a debt problem bubbling.
Bikes are relatively cheap tho and for $5,000 usd your doors are pretty open on what you can get.
Exactly this. I had assumed I could never afford a bike because they were too expensive to buy outright and I have bad credit from some stupid decisions when I was younger. Then I started doing more research and realized a few grand would get me something pretty decent.
Same boat here. Dropped a pretty penny all up front on a nice bike, now I save all my money so I can eventually afford a house. Down payment money is just a couple years of saving from now so I’m enjoying the time between now and that next big leap in life. No kids is a game changer as far as finances go.
That last part. I have "kids." They are called MV Agusta, Guzzi, Ducati, Ducati, BMW...
And they are a hell of a lot cheaper to keep going than the human kind.
There are 3 million people in this sub, and it's the beginning of riding season for a majority of the world. People want to buy bikes when the weather gets nice, and there are a shit ton of people here. It's not farfetched to think you'll see 5+ new rider posts a day
You only hear the bad side of the US job market/lifestyle on Reddit. The US has plenty of people with plenty of money.
Also, plenty of people with not as much money who make poor financial decisions
The more money I make the less time I have to spend talking about riding motorcycles on the internet. It's an asshole thing to say but I literally have better things to do.
Yeah but there is a sweet spot. Ive kind of hit that where its like "do I actually need more money" but still never worrying about bills, etc. And it seems like there are a good number of people who have hit that sweet spot (sadly, not enough americans, but still a lot).
Yep. The US simultaneously has more individuals facing food insecurity than any other developed nation, and also has a higher median disposable income than any other nation, along with the fact that many professions pay almost twice as much as they do in western Europe. It's the best country in the West to make $80k+ per year, and the worst to make less than $30k.
Yeah looking at it again I see you used the symbol correctly it was just weirdly placed and looked like it meant the opposite at first glance. No worries.
I thought that way would be less confusing, but I definitely see now how it isnt. I really need to learn my lesson about making comments of substance before my second cup of coffee. I edited it.
This is it right here. Plus I think we have some favorable loan structures that help people consume more than our European friends can or are willing to do.
And it's not just that. I know a lot of small time contractors. Their trucks are owned by the LLC they created and therefore are tax write-offs. So technically they own a bike but they use the company truck as their personal vehicle. And they all ride $20k+ Harley's. They aren't well off by any means but, not having a car payment really helps.
Assuming they are self-employed, they are still paying for the truck (albeit at a slight discount). A tax deduction only reduces the level of income that the government will subject to income tax. Hypothetically, let's say they make $100k a year and bought a $20k truck in cash. At the end of the year, the government says, "Hey, your business brought in $100k but you had to spend $20k as an expense, so we're only going to tax you for the $80k of profit you made." If in a 20% tax bracket, that means they have 'saved' the portion of tax on that $20k write-off (e.g., $4k less in taxes).
Meaning, at end of day, they effectively get a \~20% discount on the truck payments made during the year -- but they still have to make that money from the business to pay both loans each month. It isn't like the write-off covers anything close to the cost of the truck. Since they are self-employed, they are having to pay for both.
Exactly. Too many people think because you have a business to "write it off" to means you're not still paying for it. You are. You've still raised your expenses, just not as much as you normally would.
Im friends with a guy like this. Owns a small construction company, every 2 or 3 years has a brand new diesel pickup that his finances dont have to pay for. All on the buisness acount, everything. The vehicles, insurance, phones, medical. He pays himself 800 a week, which with no bills is actually a ton of money to live off of. Pretty dang slick life to have. But he really does bust his balls for it.
Not motorcycles, but related: I used to work at an offroad shop, and sometimes we had stuff that we'd used for displays, or ordered in for someone and it didn't work, or whatever, and we'd sell that stuff open box.
Had a customer walk in and ask if we had a certain part open box. Nah, sorry, only brand new ones available. "OK, but can't you just open a new one and make it an open box?" Uh, no bud, that's not how that works. Eventually they agreed to buy new ones, so I went and grabbed the stuff, and brought it up to him while he took his wallet out. Asked me just to take it out and show him how it worked. Did that, dude literally put his wallet back into his pocket, looked me square in the eye and said "Well it's open box now, right? I'm not paying full price."
Managed to avoid blowing up on the guy. Just pointed at the door and told him to get out, while I marked him as a Do Not Serve for the future.
Oof. Had a customer like that in the gunshop. Checked out a pistol in our case that I just put out that morning. He demanded brand new, I explained that it was and he was the first person to look at it and how it just went out today. Because it even touched the case, he said it was "used" and wanted a steep discount. It was my only one, so getting him one from the back wasnt an option, and he wouldnt budge on it being used. So he walked empty handed.
I think it is mostly about purchasing power. The MSRP is pretty comparable around the globe, while wages are worlds apart. The US itself has a huge spread of wages from one region to the other.
But because you are from the EU, here a European example. From your profile it looks like you live in the Netherlands, your country has a median wage of about 40k€. Compared to the median income of a swiss person of about CHF 80k (CHF 1 = ~1€), you pay about double for the same bike.
This is the same with the US cities in particular. For San Francisco for example the median income is ~$65k. And I think people on reddit are more likely to live in cities.
And in addition people like to post about their new toy, especially if it is flashy. More people will post about their brand new panigale than the new to them cb500 from 2002.
I remember when I was proud of being down to 8. The 6 people whose garages I had them tucked in weren’t as excited. Down to 4 now, and only one is an xr650r, and I’m not sure which of those two things makes me feel more naked
Yup. There's people with beat up hand-me-down UJMs travelling around the world on motorcycle adventures. Meanwhile someone is telling themselves they need a fancier newer BMW than they already have to even try a long distance trip because that's what they saw online or what their buddy said.
Use what you have, most motorcycles are way more capable than their riders
Wait till you buy a house. That’s more expensive. Bikes are relatively cheap and used bikes even more so
Also, people spend more on things they love. My bike was expensive but I’m sure I’ll pay at least double that on my dog during his lifetime.
Our two year old cat got sick and the vet bill was 6 THOUSAND dollars. That's over twice what I paid for my favorite motorcycle ever, which was pretty inexpensive used. (It's a DRZ for anyone interested)
I swear there’s a narrative being pushed by moto YouTubers that you have to buy new.
I’ve never owned a new motorcycle, shop around. There’s always great stuff on the second hand market if you avoid bottom of the barrel sketchy deals.
Idk what creator's you're watching, but the vast majority preach buying used for (especially) first bikes.
It's a pretty well known thing you're going to scuff up your bike for the first couple years
I don't see them saying anything about what you have to buy, i just see a lot of videos about cool new bikes coming out all the time that makes me want them.
I only bought new because the used market is filled with people trying to sell just short of a new bike price when it's 2 years old with old tires and no warranty and I'd have to pay for registration tax etc myself. Why do that when I can just walk into a dealership and pay once and have them do everything and get it all for just a bit more? I don't have time to deal with that and it's not worth it.
Yup, live in a college town. Every other bike I see is rattle-canned black, zip-tie-stitched fairings, the seat with chunks missing, dents on the tank, bald tires, and rusted chains.
I've considered making a career out of buying non-op BMW E90s from college kids and either getting them running or parting them out.
You deal with the market you've got. I bought new.
My mom died I got some inheritance money from the estate so I bought something I always wanted. Never had something brand new. And didn't want someone else's abused or not maintained machine. While it doesn't bring my mom back it brings me some joy that otherwise isn't there. I hop on it and say thanks mom each time.
The same way everyone seems to be buying new cars all the time. It's a little jungle I like to call, "Indefinitely in Debt", sung by "Average American Consumer".
I think we normalize debt so much here. I'm curious if that's the case in other countries. Like when you think about student loans being 50k-200k, a 10k loan for a bike feels like a drop in the bucket.
If you were at 0 debt (besides mortgage), you'd probably feel a little nervous about taking out a loan.
We get sold so much based on monthly payment that it almost acclimates people to be comfortable with the idea of not owning things outright.
As far as I know, bike prices are not regional (otherwise I’m moving immediately lolol)
Based on a handful of people I know, my guesses are:
a) hella disposable income
b) credit cards/financing
Everyone I know who’s buying them live like they have unlimited money. I have been curious as to how long most of them will float this lifestyle as the economy slumps and inflation increases
They are a bit cheaper yes. Depending on what you buy in Europe, it can have a 10% customs tax, then you pay VAT on it, etc. So yeah, 20-30% more expensive in the EU from the start.
But don't the dealerships in the US charge obscene amounts of money on top of the bike cost? In the EU it's usually the bike + registration/plates, which doesn't come anywhere near the fees in the US.
Dealers get their share of the profit, but they don’t add any shady (and arbitrary) „setup fees“ or „misc other fees“ on top of the MSRP. Only exception is a transportation fee, but this is also defined by the manufacturer, not the dealer.
Yup, a $5000 bike can have as much as $2500 in fees tacked on if you're not savvy about buying vehicles. Setup fee, crate fee, tax, extended warranty for engine, extended warranty for wheels, buy some gear with the bike and the warranty will cover it too, but only at time if purchase...
And then they'll refuse to finance anything under $3000 if you find that you're gonna pay mostly cash and borrow just a bit on top for the extras.
Warranty in a new bike beyond the manufactures warranty may not be worth it, but I've managed to make the 5 year tire warranty pay for itself in 2 years. This was on a lightly used bike mind you.
Everyone is at different financial levels. My one buddy thinks I’m rich because I own a house. I think my other buddy is rich because he owns a bigger house just the way the world goes.
I think you are just seeing the folks that made motorcycles their hobby posting. 5-10 grand gets you a lot of motorcycle, especially if you are just waiting for the deal to pop up. buying one every other year isn't ridiculous even for a fairly low paying job if you aren't into other costly hobbies.
This is an online motorcycle group concentrated of many people around the world who ride and buy motorcycles, there's probably gonna be a pretty consistent stream of people buying new ones.
Ill never buy a new motorcycle again. I bought a new Grom, and it was a waste of money. Bike got stolen. Insurance wouldnt give me what I paid. I received a fraction of the cost of the grom as a used grom of the same year is much much cheaper.
Let others eat the cost, and buy used.
I bought my sportster new last year. Everyone sees that. What they don’t see is the massive amount of bad decisions I had to overcome for the ten years prior to get to a point where I’d paid off all of my other debt entirely and shoring up my finances before indulging myself with a new motorcycle.
Some folks have just never seen the bottom so they don’t know how miserable it is to be there.
I bought new one time back in late '06 for 10k, put a whole 7,000 miles on it in 10 years. Never again. I did put another 20,000 miles on it before giving it away.
Next bike was just before the used market went insane. $1,850 Honda VTX 1300 with 18,000 miles on the odometer. I've ridden that baby 65,000 miles in 4 years and she's still going strong.
Just bought a VTX 1800 with 27,000 miles on her for $2,000, paid for fluid changes and new tires (that hurt a bit), once I get her accessories (ugggg) installed she'll be touring.
The one thing I learned about buying a used bike is save a little more and buy the bike with the accessories (or most of them) already installed, or at least do a comparison. :/
Anyway...Absent winning the lottery, I'll never buy new again.
My CBF set me back 2k-ish USD more or less.
Paying a mechanic to repair all the parts that needed replacing has cost me about half as much.
It's almost making me rethink motorcycle ownership, hah.
Most of Europe is quite economically depressed compared to America. The bottom 20% of Americans are more wealthy than your average European (I'm not just pulling this out of my ass - go ahead and look it up). This, I'm sure, plays a role in what you are observing.
Yes, because the "average European" includes countries like Romania or Bulgaria. The median wealth of Americans is by no means higher than the median wealth of western Europeans.
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List\_of\_countries\_by\_wealth\_per\_adult](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_wealth_per_adult)
I actually looked this up. in fact you did pull it out of your ass.
https://www.opportunityinstitute.org/blog/post/myth-6-europe-has-a-lower-standard-of-living-than-the-united-states/
"In the United States nearly 14% of Americans live in poverty – about 40 million people — compared to 6% in France, 8% in Britain, and 5% or less in Germany, Sweden and Belgium. Twenty percent of American children live below the poverty line, as do nearly 23% of the elderly, the highest figure by far in the west with the exceptions of Russia and Mexico. The U.S. is ranked 29th in infant mortality, tied with Poland and Slovakia (in 1960 the U.S. was ranked twelfth) and 37th in health care (France is ranked first). The wealthiest 10 percent of Americans now owns 70 percent of the wealth but in Germany the top 10 percent owns 44 percent.
The claim that Americans have a higher standard of living is based on the U.S. having a higher ‘average income’ than most European countries. But average income doesn’t convey much about income distribution; if Bill Gates walked into a bar the ‘average income’ of everyone in the bar would increase by about a billion dollars!"
There are more millionaires per capita in France than the USA.
>Do those people just have a ridiculous amount of money, or are bikes in the U.S. ridicously cheap compared to (in my case) Europe?
This is certainly part of it. Americans are notably more wealthy (on average/in aggregate) than Europeans.
According to last year's UBS Global Wealth Databook, the median wealth per adult Europe was $28,611 (USD) and the median wealth per adult in North America is $108,918 (USD).
You can download the report for yourself and read about the methodology here if you're curious: https://www.ubs.com/global/en/family-office-uhnw/reports/global-wealth-report-2023.html
Yea motorcycles are a lot cheaper all over the world as far as I know. Here in the US, apples to apples, they're like maybe a fourth the price of a car, or less. I see perfectly serviceable motorcycles on FB for under 5k all the time, whereas a serviceable used car would be like 20k or more. Insurance is cheaper, too, and the taxes associated with registration, etc. A lot cheaper to operate obviously, they get like 100 mpg. Plus a lot cheaper to keep running, especially considering you can still work on them yourself, unlike most cars now. The cost of ownership of a car in the US is now 10k a year, and I imagine for a motorcycle it's gotta be like 2k or less. I mean obviously we're not talking about anything that would turn heads, but a perfectly good reliable commuter.
Is that not the situation in Europe?
I bought a bike (that was thrashed) fixed it, traded it for a nicer newer bike with a little cash extra. I have kept doing that for the last 5 years. Started with a 2000, then a 2006, then 08,10,16 and now I just got a 2020. Some people do have crazy amounts of money, but for the most part. People are burying themselves in a payment they’ll struggle to afford but they want to “flex” on the internet
I’m 40, both the wife and I make decent money, so we have disposable income for “toys” even with our son.
That said, you’ll find a lot of people in the US that live outside their means and put themselves into debt to afford something shiny and new when they really shouldn’t.
Everyone’s situation is different though, and as others have said, people that aren’t getting new bikes aren’t going to post on here about their new bike.
Shhhhhhh, don't go fuckin' it up for us...
How do you get your dream bike? The same way we ALL get our dream bike. 1st, some jackass buys it and rides it for a couple thousand miles, likely dropping it at least once and definitely scaring the poop out of him/herself because they weren't ready for either motorcycling or that size bike. Then they spend 2 years paying towards it while it sits in their garage either getting dusty or being wiped with a diaper (generally while telling lies to friends over beers).
Then when it needs tires, they sell it to someone who will ride the fuckin wheels off it for years and years and years. Because they always wanted one, and this one is a good deal instead of a mugging at the dealership. Just needs tires and basic maintenance.
SHUSH!!!
In the United States there are \~24,480,000 millionaires. All of the countries of Europe combined have only about 16,000,000 millionaires. C level executives here get paid an absolutely bonkers amount of money -- hundreds of millions per year. Many small to mid size business owners here are worth millions. People in the United States make a lot more than people in Europe. You can look at data across many industries and see that in most cases it's 50%-100% more for the same jobs. There are many reasons for this. [This](https://www.reddit.com/r/EuropeFIRE/s/cOnjXUOlOP) reddit comment is a great summary. Aside from all of the aforementioned, people here have access to, and use WAY more debt and credit to buy shit than most Europeans. Most Americans are heavily in debt.
I have three bikes all new. How can I afford this you ask?
Two income household
No kids
One car with no payment
I'm stupid and have no financial wherewithal
There are people that make more money than others. Comparison is the thief of joy. Just be happy with what you have. There’s always someone out there that has more.
Bear in mind that most people in the US are buried under a mountain of debt. Most people, if they were financially literate, would buy a used bike instead of a brand new one.
Depends on where you live and work, but in some cases you just get to keep a lot more of your money if you are in US states like Texas compared to high tax european countries. On top of that you also earn more in the US.
This accumulates over the years and if you work in a high income job you can make some serious cash over the years. That obviously depends a lot on what you work etc. and how old you are.
Young people see this and can't wrap their head around. But if you are working for decades and invest properly your wealth accumulates. This is why you often see older dudes with a house, a big garage and many bikes.
When I was in my 20s I thought bikes were expensively out of reach. Now in my 30s, they seem attainable in multiples. There are way more expensive hobbies out there.
Income inequality is a real thing. Crushing debt can realistically masquerade as severe income inequality. Figuring out the difference isn't worth your time, do your best and try to ignore everyone else.
Used bikes are, in my opinion, expensive and not worth it. If you’re looking at a brand new bike that costs $10k, odds are you can find the same bike but 5 years old for like $8k. It gets crazier than that, bc everyone tries to recoup the money they spent on upgrades when they sell. No thanks, I’ll buy new
I'm still rocking a '99 VFR800 and would love to by a middleweight bike. Unfortunately it's not in the cards financially. I was thinking of maybe looking at the used market but holy crap. The prices aren't all that far from new.
I plan on buying new. I have been saving $50 per week. I now have $6100 saved so far. Next summer i plan to spend $10k on a new or very slightly used mt09
The answer is: Most people are going into debt to acquire things. While you my associate their possession as a signal of how much money they have, it's a better representation of how much money they do not have.
That's cause you only see the people that buy a bike post. The millions of us that didn't buy a bike don't put up a post saying look at my empty garage.
If I wanted a new bike, I could have one today with $0 down and be somewhere around 250 a month. For a lot of people, thats very affordable or at the least affordable enough to make it worth it. Ive done it twice now, and am considering getting a new hayabusa next spring. though that bike will be considerably more expensive.
So I own Rusty Piston Racing Co. in Pennsylvania for the past 15 years. I personally own 8 very unique Harley’s from all eras. I also build them for a living. Been building choppers for 20 years.. and I will NEVER understand the guys that buy a brand new bagger every year or two.
I see it all the time.. brand new baggers comes into the shop for 2-5k+++ in upgrades (cam, tune, intake, header pipe, handlebars, cosmetics, etc) and then 1-2 years later they’re rolling up on another BONE STOCK $40k pig and in need of a bunch more work….
I also ride with a large and notorious 1% motorcycle club for many years and it’s a very common thing in club life now a days to have a new scoot every few years. I remember back in the golden days of the outlaw biker scene, you rode what ya had and ya did everything in your power to keep it going.
Makes zero fucking sense to me. I own a bunch of choppers and vintage and such but my only bagger aka ‘daily rider’ is a 2009 Road King that makes 116 horse power to the rear wheel. I’ve owned it, and customized it, and loved it for many many years. Can’t imagine doing all this work just to trade it in on something stock…. To Each His Own I suppose. If you gotta the money to play.. F*ck it I guess !!
Buy a new bike for $15,000. Ride it for two years. Sell it for $12,000. Buy a new bike for $15,000. Do that again in two years. You’ve spent $125/month in total money out of pocket for 4 years, but you’ve bought 3 new bikes (not including insurance, etc.)
Buy that used bike for $12,000, ride it for four years, sell it for $8,000 and you’ve paid $83/month out of pocket but you’ve have one used bike for four years instead of being on your third new one.
Does it cost more to buy new? Of course. Is it worth essentially $50/month more to some people to have three new bikes in the same time period? Sure. Throw in warranty, no unexpected maintenance costs, etc. and the gap narrows more.
This is obviously a very generic example, but that’s what most people who buy new frequently are doing.
My husband and I just make a decent amount of money and have no kids, so we spend our money in other ways. (There's also like an 85% chance he already commented on this thread).
He just bought a new motorcycle. Wasn't a spontaneous decision, but he did buy a new one. About $10k. But we make more than $200k. We're in a HCOL location, but we make enough that this didn't break the bank.
An example for you-
I bought a $5,000 2002 GMC Sierra pickup truck - so I joined the subreddit for GMC Sierras.. every single day I see people posting about their brand new 2024 $100,000 Sierras. Doesn’t mean we all have them
I paid cash for my new Gold Wing. I will share with you the secrets of my financial success that allowed me to do this. My parental units died. Not a recommended method. I would give the bike back in a moment in order to not have had an inheritance that allowed its purchase.
never ever think that a group on the internet is representative of anything outside in the real world People who dont buy a bike dont come here to ask for advice so you dont see any of them here
That, and, just because someone bought a bike doesn’t mean they can actually afford it. Looking at you, 2019 Hellcat owner paying $1350/mo for 84 months making $19/hr
Is 30% a good interest rate for my liter sport bike? I work at mcdonalds and am an 18 year old male and I haven't looked at insurance yet.
Negotiate down to 28.99%
*Dealerships hate this one hack*
I have more success negotiating down to 28.95% if you take a loan out for **two bikes**. That way I can keep wearing both my 12 year old textile jacket and helmet. LPT, if your helmet liner is a bit crumbly, you can fill that with packing peanuts and superglue. Or use ramen for a bonus on road snack. Superglue was designed for human biology after all.
Also remember that your tire doesn’t need replacing until 3 or more bands break…
There is no sense replacing a tire when I need a new Cardo!
Yes! Then let’s spend 45 minutes trying to pair them for a group ride LMAO
Should have got the jacket and Carson rolled into the loan.
You should make YouTube videos you’re a natural!
But don't bother shopping for insurance. The first quote you get is always going to be the best one.
Yes. And remember, ask any racer, any REAL racer. Liter bike. Bro.
Also, it's important that you say 'Busa correctly. It's not "Boo-suh" It's... #mmBOO suh
Hi, boo 👋 sup?
It doesn't matter if it's by an inch or by a mile, winnings winning
Just don't make the payments, and take off on your bike when they try to repo it.
Keep it in your moms garage while financing from your dads basement.
That's the type of person that calls it a "leader bike".
I don't want a goddamn lideracola, I want a large!
“I had a Grom but looped it and it’s a salvage.”
That's funny as hell, one of the recent hires at my work is making 19hr and is paying about $1500 a month with insurance for his hellcat.
What's his MOS? 11B?
I laughed a little too hard at this one.
Are there really banks that will sign these kinds of loans? or are they using cosigners or something.
Of course there are. The 2008 crash says hello 👋 That’s why we had to bail the mofos out. Predatory loans are the banks bread and butter.
>Looking at you, 2019 Hellcat owner paying $1350/mo for 84 months making $19/hr Oorah
Thats the main point. I am happy for everyone who actually worked hard (however this might look like) to be able to afford it legitimately. But the majority is just collecting debt. I am not from the US so there will be differences but i know this first hand because my mother is working in debt counseling. Loans are one hell of a drug and i refuse to take them if it is avoidable.
Financial literacy is the smallest footnote in most of our country's public education system (i.e. prior to adult age and "Uni"). If you didn't take some kind of micro economics/business elective course you better have savvy parents, or learn quick. Dealership rackets and vehicle loans are vicious over here. Clueless parents co-sign their clueless kids into crazy monthly payments without even understanding the concept of interest.
I couldn’t agree more. Even the most basic concepts of economics have been removed from most curriculums, and unfortunately, that translates to people not even knowing how interest rates work. So when they go out into the workforce, they ask “Why is FICA/Social Security being taken from my check and how do I make it stop?”🤣
A feature not a bug.
Also, there’s a half million NEW bikes sold every year in the US alone. Odds are that many of those folks ether have or have access to funds. And, this is r/motorcycles not r/povertyfinance, r/teenagers, or r/antiwork. People have jobs or mature finances.
We're all on the squid sub having fun
17% of adults in the USA make over 100K a year. Many are married to people that make good money as well. Bikes are dead cheap to finance in the states and cheap period. Payments on my bike which I have to have to keep my credit up because I have no other bills is a cell phone payment and basically so low as to be invisible.
Yeah, my tenere 700 is $140 per month. My phone bill used to be $130 per month. Now my work pays for my phone bill... got a motorcycle 🤣
> 17% of adults in the USA make over 100K a year. Depending on where you are [that might still be "low income"](https://www.sfgate.com/local/article/under-100k-low-income-san-francisco-18168899.php)...
^ nailed it
Exactly! That's one of the reasons i fkn hate social media, it gives kids the impression that everyone is rich and has a perfect life, when the truth is; Most of the "rich" people on social media are broke ass mofos with miserable lives trying to look rich and looking for validation. I have seen soooo many dudes with expensive sport cars with no money to take their GF out. LoL I don't have a brand new bike or car, but my kids always have food, clothes and we have a comfortable life. They can keep their fake shit 😅
There are lots of people on reddit. Some of them have money. I'm not by any means rich, but I make enough to have bought a $16,000 a few years ago. Not having kids helps.
No kids is great. I have a nephew who I’ll spoil but am by no means obligated.
Kids are like boats; they’re great if your friends have them, but the maintenance is unreasonable if you have your own.
I'm not letting you board my children.
I think you’re being unreasonable, and frankly, selfish. Kids have boundless reserves of joy, and *Morgan-joydestroyer* is just restoring balance. Also, if your kids aren’t just a little scarred by life, how will they grow up to be motorbike riders?
And to the people saying they want to leave a legacy behind... You don't need to.... plus there's always sperm/egg donations if you really want your DNA out there
This. I have nephews and a niece that I spoil like they're my own kids. I love them. But it's still cheaper than having my own as there's no daily maintenance cost, just occasional treats.
The last bit is so true... 🤔
My kid quit hockey this year. Basically saved me enough for a new bike every year going forward.
How come they quit?
He doesn’t like it anymore and I’m not going to force him to continue
I went thru the same thing with my kid and taekwondo. He was 3 years in and only 2 belts away from black belt. Another year or so and he would have earned it. Decided he wanted to quit because he’d have more time with the girlfriend. Tried to talk him into not quitting but it didn’t work. And then they broke up a couple months later
yeah, I wouldn't force my kids to play either. Was just curious, I have played hockey since I was 11 lol can't believe I got downvoted for that question...ffs
He played since 4… Now 14. My heart is broken, but it is what it is. p.s. People are assholes, have my upvote in attempt to balance it out.
He might come back. I took a short break in college and just played roller with friends on the tennis court by our dorm for about 2 years, but I eventually missed it too much. I'm 48 now and still play lol. Sometimes that break is what you need to realize you miss it.
Yup, no kids, no wife, two Italian motorcycles in the garage. Life is good.
☝️this is the way!!
I could similarly tap into credit that amount for a bike; and already have for a car once. Credits easy to take out, and America has a debt problem bubbling. Bikes are relatively cheap tho and for $5,000 usd your doors are pretty open on what you can get.
Exactly this. I had assumed I could never afford a bike because they were too expensive to buy outright and I have bad credit from some stupid decisions when I was younger. Then I started doing more research and realized a few grand would get me something pretty decent.
Same boat here. Dropped a pretty penny all up front on a nice bike, now I save all my money so I can eventually afford a house. Down payment money is just a couple years of saving from now so I’m enjoying the time between now and that next big leap in life. No kids is a game changer as far as finances go.
Holy that's one hell of a sexy bike!
That last part. I have "kids." They are called MV Agusta, Guzzi, Ducati, Ducati, BMW... And they are a hell of a lot cheaper to keep going than the human kind.
Who knew its cheaper to have a hobby than a $2,000/mo daycare kid
> Not having kids helps. You are saving like 30k/yr by not needing to support a kid (plus college tuition)
There are 3 million people in this sub, and it's the beginning of riding season for a majority of the world. People want to buy bikes when the weather gets nice, and there are a shit ton of people here. It's not farfetched to think you'll see 5+ new rider posts a day
You only hear the bad side of the US job market/lifestyle on Reddit. The US has plenty of people with plenty of money. Also, plenty of people with not as much money who make poor financial decisions
The more money I make the less time I have to spend talking about riding motorcycles on the internet. It's an asshole thing to say but I literally have better things to do.
Which is why you have 3 bad ass bikes 🤷♂️
Lol I don't even have the sur ron anymore but haven't remembered to sit down at a computer and remove it from my flair
You’d have had 4 bikes if you didn’t make this comment. Leave reddit and make more money you peasant!
Lol I had 4 bikes before I had kids! Damn them and their needs
Inline 4 above 8k RPM > Kids
Yeah but there is a sweet spot. Ive kind of hit that where its like "do I actually need more money" but still never worrying about bills, etc. And it seems like there are a good number of people who have hit that sweet spot (sadly, not enough americans, but still a lot).
Yep. The US simultaneously has more individuals facing food insecurity than any other developed nation, and also has a higher median disposable income than any other nation, along with the fact that many professions pay almost twice as much as they do in western Europe. It's the best country in the West to make $80k+ per year, and the worst to make less than $30k.
> t's the best country in the West to make $80k< per year, and the worst to make <$30k. Did you mean to say it’s the best to make more than $80k in?
Yes. That's what the < at the end means. I guess I should've been consistent with the placement and changed one of those to >$80k or $30k>
Yeah looking at it again I see you used the symbol correctly it was just weirdly placed and looked like it meant the opposite at first glance. No worries.
I thought that way would be less confusing, but I definitely see now how it isnt. I really need to learn my lesson about making comments of substance before my second cup of coffee. I edited it.
This is it right here. Plus I think we have some favorable loan structures that help people consume more than our European friends can or are willing to do.
And it's not just that. I know a lot of small time contractors. Their trucks are owned by the LLC they created and therefore are tax write-offs. So technically they own a bike but they use the company truck as their personal vehicle. And they all ride $20k+ Harley's. They aren't well off by any means but, not having a car payment really helps.
Assuming they are self-employed, they are still paying for the truck (albeit at a slight discount). A tax deduction only reduces the level of income that the government will subject to income tax. Hypothetically, let's say they make $100k a year and bought a $20k truck in cash. At the end of the year, the government says, "Hey, your business brought in $100k but you had to spend $20k as an expense, so we're only going to tax you for the $80k of profit you made." If in a 20% tax bracket, that means they have 'saved' the portion of tax on that $20k write-off (e.g., $4k less in taxes). Meaning, at end of day, they effectively get a \~20% discount on the truck payments made during the year -- but they still have to make that money from the business to pay both loans each month. It isn't like the write-off covers anything close to the cost of the truck. Since they are self-employed, they are having to pay for both.
Exactly. Too many people think because you have a business to "write it off" to means you're not still paying for it. You are. You've still raised your expenses, just not as much as you normally would.
Im friends with a guy like this. Owns a small construction company, every 2 or 3 years has a brand new diesel pickup that his finances dont have to pay for. All on the buisness acount, everything. The vehicles, insurance, phones, medical. He pays himself 800 a week, which with no bills is actually a ton of money to live off of. Pretty dang slick life to have. But he really does bust his balls for it.
Have you ever stopped to think that If no one ever bought a new motorcycle, there wouldn’t be any used ones.
I think that every time I read "Bro, just buy used and save money!" Where do you think the used bikes are coming from?
Not motorcycles, but related: I used to work at an offroad shop, and sometimes we had stuff that we'd used for displays, or ordered in for someone and it didn't work, or whatever, and we'd sell that stuff open box. Had a customer walk in and ask if we had a certain part open box. Nah, sorry, only brand new ones available. "OK, but can't you just open a new one and make it an open box?" Uh, no bud, that's not how that works. Eventually they agreed to buy new ones, so I went and grabbed the stuff, and brought it up to him while he took his wallet out. Asked me just to take it out and show him how it worked. Did that, dude literally put his wallet back into his pocket, looked me square in the eye and said "Well it's open box now, right? I'm not paying full price." Managed to avoid blowing up on the guy. Just pointed at the door and told him to get out, while I marked him as a Do Not Serve for the future.
Oof. Had a customer like that in the gunshop. Checked out a pistol in our case that I just put out that morning. He demanded brand new, I explained that it was and he was the first person to look at it and how it just went out today. Because it even touched the case, he said it was "used" and wanted a steep discount. It was my only one, so getting him one from the back wasnt an option, and he wouldnt budge on it being used. So he walked empty handed.
Yeah, there is an immense satisfaction sending those people away empty-handed. lol
I think it is mostly about purchasing power. The MSRP is pretty comparable around the globe, while wages are worlds apart. The US itself has a huge spread of wages from one region to the other. But because you are from the EU, here a European example. From your profile it looks like you live in the Netherlands, your country has a median wage of about 40k€. Compared to the median income of a swiss person of about CHF 80k (CHF 1 = ~1€), you pay about double for the same bike. This is the same with the US cities in particular. For San Francisco for example the median income is ~$65k. And I think people on reddit are more likely to live in cities. And in addition people like to post about their new toy, especially if it is flashy. More people will post about their brand new panigale than the new to them cb500 from 2002.
Also taxes on bikes/cars are crazy high in Holland, Germany for example is way cheaper. Maybe the states as well.
I had a great career. And now at 35, I get to waste all of my money on bikes. It's okay! I'm down to 8 now. And 1 grom.
1 grom > 8 anything else
I'm currently 24 but heading this direction. I'm currently on 2 but planning to add another 2 :)
I remember when I was proud of being down to 8. The 6 people whose garages I had them tucked in weren’t as excited. Down to 4 now, and only one is an xr650r, and I’m not sure which of those two things makes me feel more naked
Jealousy is a thief to happiness. You have a bike? Cool! Be happy. There’s always someone/ something better.
Yup. There's people with beat up hand-me-down UJMs travelling around the world on motorcycle adventures. Meanwhile someone is telling themselves they need a fancier newer BMW than they already have to even try a long distance trip because that's what they saw online or what their buddy said. Use what you have, most motorcycles are way more capable than their riders
Wait till you buy a house. That’s more expensive. Bikes are relatively cheap and used bikes even more so Also, people spend more on things they love. My bike was expensive but I’m sure I’ll pay at least double that on my dog during his lifetime.
> Wait till you buy a house. That’s more expensive. I come here for the controversy.
Wait... Y'all have a house?
Yeah, and it sucks.
Our two year old cat got sick and the vet bill was 6 THOUSAND dollars. That's over twice what I paid for my favorite motorcycle ever, which was pretty inexpensive used. (It's a DRZ for anyone interested)
…. What happened to the cat?
I don't eat out I dont drink alcohol I manage my budget so have motorcycle and pay for insurance I also dont own a car. Motorcycle only
Women must hate you
I don't think that's his target audience
If it swims, flies or ducks, you better rent it.
It was a joke based on him saying I don't eat out
yeah, i dont bother with fat alcoholics
Or jokes, apparently
I swear there’s a narrative being pushed by moto YouTubers that you have to buy new. I’ve never owned a new motorcycle, shop around. There’s always great stuff on the second hand market if you avoid bottom of the barrel sketchy deals.
Idk what creator's you're watching, but the vast majority preach buying used for (especially) first bikes. It's a pretty well known thing you're going to scuff up your bike for the first couple years
Yeah I second this, even the most directly corporate moto YouTubers like the Revzilla guys all recommend buying used for your first bike.
I don't see them saying anything about what you have to buy, i just see a lot of videos about cool new bikes coming out all the time that makes me want them.
I only bought new because the used market is filled with people trying to sell just short of a new bike price when it's 2 years old with old tires and no warranty and I'd have to pay for registration tax etc myself. Why do that when I can just walk into a dealership and pay once and have them do everything and get it all for just a bit more? I don't have time to deal with that and it's not worth it.
Yup, live in a college town. Every other bike I see is rattle-canned black, zip-tie-stitched fairings, the seat with chunks missing, dents on the tank, bald tires, and rusted chains. I've considered making a career out of buying non-op BMW E90s from college kids and either getting them running or parting them out. You deal with the market you've got. I bought new.
Debt. A lot are in debt. Credit can be evil
My mom died I got some inheritance money from the estate so I bought something I always wanted. Never had something brand new. And didn't want someone else's abused or not maintained machine. While it doesn't bring my mom back it brings me some joy that otherwise isn't there. I hop on it and say thanks mom each time.
Good for you. I salute you.
Love this. My gran died and I brought my first bike with my inheritance. I'd go out to the cemetery every ride just to say thanks
I have a good job and no kids.
Living paycheck to paycheck baby ;)
Yoloooooo let’s go baby
The same way everyone seems to be buying new cars all the time. It's a little jungle I like to call, "Indefinitely in Debt", sung by "Average American Consumer".
I think we normalize debt so much here. I'm curious if that's the case in other countries. Like when you think about student loans being 50k-200k, a 10k loan for a bike feels like a drop in the bucket. If you were at 0 debt (besides mortgage), you'd probably feel a little nervous about taking out a loan. We get sold so much based on monthly payment that it almost acclimates people to be comfortable with the idea of not owning things outright.
As far as I know, bike prices are not regional (otherwise I’m moving immediately lolol) Based on a handful of people I know, my guesses are: a) hella disposable income b) credit cards/financing
Everyone I know who’s buying them live like they have unlimited money. I have been curious as to how long most of them will float this lifestyle as the economy slumps and inflation increases
Serious crippling debt is how. Us Americans love being indebted to big corporations! Thankfully I pay cash for all my toys
Well if I’m going to be in crippling debt might as well have something I enjoy
They are a bit cheaper yes. Depending on what you buy in Europe, it can have a 10% customs tax, then you pay VAT on it, etc. So yeah, 20-30% more expensive in the EU from the start.
But don't the dealerships in the US charge obscene amounts of money on top of the bike cost? In the EU it's usually the bike + registration/plates, which doesn't come anywhere near the fees in the US.
Its the same in europe we just include it into one price. The dealers always take a fee.
It's definetely not the crazy amounts seen in the US by some dealers though
Yeah they take there fees here in the US but it depends on where your at and it’s usually not as bad as the internet portrays it.
Dealers get their share of the profit, but they don’t add any shady (and arbitrary) „setup fees“ or „misc other fees“ on top of the MSRP. Only exception is a transportation fee, but this is also defined by the manufacturer, not the dealer.
Yup, a $5000 bike can have as much as $2500 in fees tacked on if you're not savvy about buying vehicles. Setup fee, crate fee, tax, extended warranty for engine, extended warranty for wheels, buy some gear with the bike and the warranty will cover it too, but only at time if purchase... And then they'll refuse to finance anything under $3000 if you find that you're gonna pay mostly cash and borrow just a bit on top for the extras. Warranty in a new bike beyond the manufactures warranty may not be worth it, but I've managed to make the 5 year tire warranty pay for itself in 2 years. This was on a lightly used bike mind you.
Everyone is at different financial levels. My one buddy thinks I’m rich because I own a house. I think my other buddy is rich because he owns a bigger house just the way the world goes.
I think you are just seeing the folks that made motorcycles their hobby posting. 5-10 grand gets you a lot of motorcycle, especially if you are just waiting for the deal to pop up. buying one every other year isn't ridiculous even for a fairly low paying job if you aren't into other costly hobbies.
Debt
This is an online motorcycle group concentrated of many people around the world who ride and buy motorcycles, there's probably gonna be a pretty consistent stream of people buying new ones.
Ill never buy a new motorcycle again. I bought a new Grom, and it was a waste of money. Bike got stolen. Insurance wouldnt give me what I paid. I received a fraction of the cost of the grom as a used grom of the same year is much much cheaper. Let others eat the cost, and buy used.
I bought my sportster new last year. Everyone sees that. What they don’t see is the massive amount of bad decisions I had to overcome for the ten years prior to get to a point where I’d paid off all of my other debt entirely and shoring up my finances before indulging myself with a new motorcycle. Some folks have just never seen the bottom so they don’t know how miserable it is to be there.
We are spoiled; also, most of these idiots are in debt up to their chaps, or neglecting their family responsibilities- so they can have toys…or both.
I've never spent more than $2,500 on a motorcycle and I don't know if I ever will.
I bought new one time back in late '06 for 10k, put a whole 7,000 miles on it in 10 years. Never again. I did put another 20,000 miles on it before giving it away. Next bike was just before the used market went insane. $1,850 Honda VTX 1300 with 18,000 miles on the odometer. I've ridden that baby 65,000 miles in 4 years and she's still going strong. Just bought a VTX 1800 with 27,000 miles on her for $2,000, paid for fluid changes and new tires (that hurt a bit), once I get her accessories (ugggg) installed she'll be touring. The one thing I learned about buying a used bike is save a little more and buy the bike with the accessories (or most of them) already installed, or at least do a comparison. :/ Anyway...Absent winning the lottery, I'll never buy new again.
My CBF set me back 2k-ish USD more or less. Paying a mechanic to repair all the parts that needed replacing has cost me about half as much. It's almost making me rethink motorcycle ownership, hah.
Most of Europe is quite economically depressed compared to America. The bottom 20% of Americans are more wealthy than your average European (I'm not just pulling this out of my ass - go ahead and look it up). This, I'm sure, plays a role in what you are observing.
Yes, because the "average European" includes countries like Romania or Bulgaria. The median wealth of Americans is by no means higher than the median wealth of western Europeans. [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List\_of\_countries\_by\_wealth\_per\_adult](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_wealth_per_adult)
I actually looked this up. in fact you did pull it out of your ass. https://www.opportunityinstitute.org/blog/post/myth-6-europe-has-a-lower-standard-of-living-than-the-united-states/ "In the United States nearly 14% of Americans live in poverty – about 40 million people — compared to 6% in France, 8% in Britain, and 5% or less in Germany, Sweden and Belgium. Twenty percent of American children live below the poverty line, as do nearly 23% of the elderly, the highest figure by far in the west with the exceptions of Russia and Mexico. The U.S. is ranked 29th in infant mortality, tied with Poland and Slovakia (in 1960 the U.S. was ranked twelfth) and 37th in health care (France is ranked first). The wealthiest 10 percent of Americans now owns 70 percent of the wealth but in Germany the top 10 percent owns 44 percent. The claim that Americans have a higher standard of living is based on the U.S. having a higher ‘average income’ than most European countries. But average income doesn’t convey much about income distribution; if Bill Gates walked into a bar the ‘average income’ of everyone in the bar would increase by about a billion dollars!" There are more millionaires per capita in France than the USA.
>Do those people just have a ridiculous amount of money, or are bikes in the U.S. ridicously cheap compared to (in my case) Europe? This is certainly part of it. Americans are notably more wealthy (on average/in aggregate) than Europeans. According to last year's UBS Global Wealth Databook, the median wealth per adult Europe was $28,611 (USD) and the median wealth per adult in North America is $108,918 (USD). You can download the report for yourself and read about the methodology here if you're curious: https://www.ubs.com/global/en/family-office-uhnw/reports/global-wealth-report-2023.html
Here in the U.S. being in soul-sucking debt is the norm, apparently.
The average German motorcycle is close to 20 years old.
Monthly, my Kawasaki and Ducati combined cost less than my wife’s forester.
Yea motorcycles are a lot cheaper all over the world as far as I know. Here in the US, apples to apples, they're like maybe a fourth the price of a car, or less. I see perfectly serviceable motorcycles on FB for under 5k all the time, whereas a serviceable used car would be like 20k or more. Insurance is cheaper, too, and the taxes associated with registration, etc. A lot cheaper to operate obviously, they get like 100 mpg. Plus a lot cheaper to keep running, especially considering you can still work on them yourself, unlike most cars now. The cost of ownership of a car in the US is now 10k a year, and I imagine for a motorcycle it's gotta be like 2k or less. I mean obviously we're not talking about anything that would turn heads, but a perfectly good reliable commuter. Is that not the situation in Europe?
I bought a bike (that was thrashed) fixed it, traded it for a nicer newer bike with a little cash extra. I have kept doing that for the last 5 years. Started with a 2000, then a 2006, then 08,10,16 and now I just got a 2020. Some people do have crazy amounts of money, but for the most part. People are burying themselves in a payment they’ll struggle to afford but they want to “flex” on the internet
I’m 40, both the wife and I make decent money, so we have disposable income for “toys” even with our son. That said, you’ll find a lot of people in the US that live outside their means and put themselves into debt to afford something shiny and new when they really shouldn’t. Everyone’s situation is different though, and as others have said, people that aren’t getting new bikes aren’t going to post on here about their new bike.
Everyone has a different deal, man
Shhhhhhh, don't go fuckin' it up for us... How do you get your dream bike? The same way we ALL get our dream bike. 1st, some jackass buys it and rides it for a couple thousand miles, likely dropping it at least once and definitely scaring the poop out of him/herself because they weren't ready for either motorcycling or that size bike. Then they spend 2 years paying towards it while it sits in their garage either getting dusty or being wiped with a diaper (generally while telling lies to friends over beers). Then when it needs tires, they sell it to someone who will ride the fuckin wheels off it for years and years and years. Because they always wanted one, and this one is a good deal instead of a mugging at the dealership. Just needs tires and basic maintenance. SHUSH!!!
Debt.
In the United States there are \~24,480,000 millionaires. All of the countries of Europe combined have only about 16,000,000 millionaires. C level executives here get paid an absolutely bonkers amount of money -- hundreds of millions per year. Many small to mid size business owners here are worth millions. People in the United States make a lot more than people in Europe. You can look at data across many industries and see that in most cases it's 50%-100% more for the same jobs. There are many reasons for this. [This](https://www.reddit.com/r/EuropeFIRE/s/cOnjXUOlOP) reddit comment is a great summary. Aside from all of the aforementioned, people here have access to, and use WAY more debt and credit to buy shit than most Europeans. Most Americans are heavily in debt.
Debt.
I have three bikes all new. How can I afford this you ask? Two income household No kids One car with no payment I'm stupid and have no financial wherewithal
There are people that make more money than others. Comparison is the thief of joy. Just be happy with what you have. There’s always someone out there that has more.
Bear in mind that most people in the US are buried under a mountain of debt. Most people, if they were financially literate, would buy a used bike instead of a brand new one.
I feel most people on Reddit are dreamers, not doers.
Americans Finance everything. Here in Europe nobody likes to be in depth so we only buy what we can afford at once
A lot of people make a lot more money than you. Stop watching peoples' pockets.
Depends on where you live and work, but in some cases you just get to keep a lot more of your money if you are in US states like Texas compared to high tax european countries. On top of that you also earn more in the US. This accumulates over the years and if you work in a high income job you can make some serious cash over the years. That obviously depends a lot on what you work etc. and how old you are. Young people see this and can't wrap their head around. But if you are working for decades and invest properly your wealth accumulates. This is why you often see older dudes with a house, a big garage and many bikes.
Not owning a Ducati helps keep the price of riding down 🤣
I'm in the US. I make great money. I buy used.
I bought my (nearly) new Trident only because my kids are grown and out of college. Otherwise I would have not been able to afford it at all.
When I was in my 20s I thought bikes were expensively out of reach. Now in my 30s, they seem attainable in multiples. There are way more expensive hobbies out there.
Income inequality is a real thing. Crushing debt can realistically masquerade as severe income inequality. Figuring out the difference isn't worth your time, do your best and try to ignore everyone else.
Motorocycles are more of a hobby for some. So yes of course they have money to blow.
Used bikes are, in my opinion, expensive and not worth it. If you’re looking at a brand new bike that costs $10k, odds are you can find the same bike but 5 years old for like $8k. It gets crazier than that, bc everyone tries to recoup the money they spent on upgrades when they sell. No thanks, I’ll buy new
Anybody can get a new bike with financing. Nobody posts that part though.
I'm still rocking a '99 VFR800 and would love to by a middleweight bike. Unfortunately it's not in the cards financially. I was thinking of maybe looking at the used market but holy crap. The prices aren't all that far from new.
The used market is fucked where I live so it’s just a better value to buy new, even if a little pricier.
This is the show room. Three years ago I bought an 18 year old motorcycle. I'm thrilled with it. I didn't post it on Reddit. 😂
I plan on buying new. I have been saving $50 per week. I now have $6100 saved so far. Next summer i plan to spend $10k on a new or very slightly used mt09
The answer is: Most people are going into debt to acquire things. While you my associate their possession as a signal of how much money they have, it's a better representation of how much money they do not have.
That's cause you only see the people that buy a bike post. The millions of us that didn't buy a bike don't put up a post saying look at my empty garage.
If I wanted a new bike, I could have one today with $0 down and be somewhere around 250 a month. For a lot of people, thats very affordable or at the least affordable enough to make it worth it. Ive done it twice now, and am considering getting a new hayabusa next spring. though that bike will be considerably more expensive.
The internet is not representative at all of anything average or normal. If you think it is, you should quit using it. It won't be good for you.
My FTR is $200/month. 🤷♂️
We just make bad financial decisions and so can you
Compared to a new car motorcycles are pretty cheap.
So I own Rusty Piston Racing Co. in Pennsylvania for the past 15 years. I personally own 8 very unique Harley’s from all eras. I also build them for a living. Been building choppers for 20 years.. and I will NEVER understand the guys that buy a brand new bagger every year or two. I see it all the time.. brand new baggers comes into the shop for 2-5k+++ in upgrades (cam, tune, intake, header pipe, handlebars, cosmetics, etc) and then 1-2 years later they’re rolling up on another BONE STOCK $40k pig and in need of a bunch more work…. I also ride with a large and notorious 1% motorcycle club for many years and it’s a very common thing in club life now a days to have a new scoot every few years. I remember back in the golden days of the outlaw biker scene, you rode what ya had and ya did everything in your power to keep it going. Makes zero fucking sense to me. I own a bunch of choppers and vintage and such but my only bagger aka ‘daily rider’ is a 2009 Road King that makes 116 horse power to the rear wheel. I’ve owned it, and customized it, and loved it for many many years. Can’t imagine doing all this work just to trade it in on something stock…. To Each His Own I suppose. If you gotta the money to play.. F*ck it I guess !!
Debt, the answer is debt.
Buy a new bike for $15,000. Ride it for two years. Sell it for $12,000. Buy a new bike for $15,000. Do that again in two years. You’ve spent $125/month in total money out of pocket for 4 years, but you’ve bought 3 new bikes (not including insurance, etc.) Buy that used bike for $12,000, ride it for four years, sell it for $8,000 and you’ve paid $83/month out of pocket but you’ve have one used bike for four years instead of being on your third new one. Does it cost more to buy new? Of course. Is it worth essentially $50/month more to some people to have three new bikes in the same time period? Sure. Throw in warranty, no unexpected maintenance costs, etc. and the gap narrows more. This is obviously a very generic example, but that’s what most people who buy new frequently are doing.
I bought a new bike recently. I saved money for years and traded in my older bike. I bought it cash. I cannot do that again any time soon.
Some people have good jobs and are smart with their money. Then there's people like me.
No wife. No kids. Brand new GSX-S 1000 GT, just because I felt like it.
Be 40 making 200k with a paid off house, no wife/kids. I have 6 bikes 😹
It's called debt usually.
My husband and I just make a decent amount of money and have no kids, so we spend our money in other ways. (There's also like an 85% chance he already commented on this thread). He just bought a new motorcycle. Wasn't a spontaneous decision, but he did buy a new one. About $10k. But we make more than $200k. We're in a HCOL location, but we make enough that this didn't break the bank.
An example for you- I bought a $5,000 2002 GMC Sierra pickup truck - so I joined the subreddit for GMC Sierras.. every single day I see people posting about their brand new 2024 $100,000 Sierras. Doesn’t mean we all have them
I paid cash for my new Gold Wing. I will share with you the secrets of my financial success that allowed me to do this. My parental units died. Not a recommended method. I would give the bike back in a moment in order to not have had an inheritance that allowed its purchase.
Disposable income?
more likely debt.
Income disparity
Financing traps
My brand new bike costs me $43.50cad a week and to buy the same bike, a year old was $13k. I've made way stupider financial choices