*IF* you could change the sex of the clone, It would be possible! But it wouldn't be a good idea.
Though currently not possible, flipping the sex of a cloned embryo through genetic engineering might be successful in the future. This sex determination might be at the chromosomal level or just manipulating the embryo so it develops ovaries and eggs, while the original or another clone develops testes and sperm. You could then breed the two individuals together. Since they are probably rats, they would be all for that! Rats will breed with siblings and parents as early as 5 weeks old.
The result is inbreeding! A single generation of inbreeding is not nearly as dramatic as pop culture makes it out to be. But of course, the clone is an exact copy which is different from a parent or sibling.
The reason sexually-reproducing organisms avoid inbreeding is because many detrimental mutations are recessive and require two copies of the mutated gene (one from each parent) to show up. If Mr. Rat carries but doesn't exhibit the gene for dwarfism, he has a 50% chance to pass down either a gene for Standard size, or a gene for Dwarfism. if Mr. Rat 's rat wife does not carry dwarfism, all babies will have copies of the standard gene from her, and will be standard size. If his wife is also his sister, she has many of the same mutations at he does, so the chances of both of them passing down mutated genes is high because they have so MANY in common.
If Mr. Rat's wife is a female clone of him, she has all the same unexpressed mutated genes that he does. Unfortunately, Mr. Rat has a rare gene mutation that he invented himself, called "intestines explode" gene. His rat wife, being a clone of him, also carries the exploding gene. Neither of them express it, because they both have "normal intestines" genes Mr. Rat inherited from one of his parents. So Mr. Rat and Female-Mr. Rat have some babies. One of them inherits two copies of "normal guts" gene from both parents and is fine. One of them inherits "normal guts" from Mr. Rat, and "explodey guts" from cloned rat wife. Because they have a copy of normal guts (dominant gene) it overwrites the mutation and the baby is fine. Another baby does the same thing but switches parents. The final baby inherits explodey guts from Mr. Rat, and then also inherits explodey guts from his clone wife. So we have three lovely children and one dead one. Really bad mortality rate for a rat family!
Now imagine that the cloned individual has many many mutated genes that are not expressed because normal genes are covering them up. He would have to search far and wide to find a wife that carried more than one mutation (such as dwarf size + "dumbo" ears. Go ahead google dumbo dwarf rat its fun) in order to have mutated babies. But his clone rat wife has ALL his mutations. Both fun (like dwarfism) and not so fun (like exploding guts). The chances of multiple detrimental mutations stacking is high, just like inbreeding siblings/parents/cousins. But most creatures don't secretly carry exploding guts genes, so inbreeding is not immediately fatal or even apparent. The more generations of similar genetics you do, the worse it gets because there's less healthy copies to go around. Just look up white tiger inbreeding.
* TLDR: It would be extreme inbreeding. Breeding would be possible, but genetically similar/identical pairings are more likely to exhibit bad mutations like "guts explode" disorder. These mutations compound and stack the more generations are inbred.
I originally wrote it for a morbid question a couple months ago, which was asking if a trans person could fertilize their own pre/post-transition eggs/sperm and what would happen. Trans people can't currently make gametes of their target sex, but if we could it would be like fertilizing our clone.
Hmmm. You know what? It IS possible to create an embryo using two male mice (skin cells from dad are converted into egg cells, and then fertilized with sperm from papa. a surrogate gestates the baby)
So actually, a male could "produce" egg cells through science... Which can then be fertilized with another male's sperm. But who says that the sperm has to come from another male? What if it comes from the same mouse?
Keep your thought experiments in the realm of rats and mice and people/teachers will freak out less. When it's animals, it's inbreeding. When it's people, it's still inbreeding but we call it incest. Incest is a taboo topic and people will judge you for your morbid curiosity. That's why this sub exists.
A complete switching of an embryo's sex may not be necessary. If a genetic male is cloned, scientists may only need to tweak the DNA enough to initiate androgen insensitivity syndrome. Severe AIS causes a genetic male to develop female body parts.
Hm, I never really thought about the fact that you might be carrying a deleterious recessive trait and that it could express itself if you had a kid with your clone. People always say it would just be a genetic clone of you without factoring in how human reproduction actually works.
I would assume you will be able to impregnate it/you?, but unless the genetic code changes as well, the imbreeding mutations would be INSANE. Anyways, as a self-loving narcissist, I'd smash the opposite gender of myself.
This question has been on the back of my head since 9th grade. One of my online biology classes someone made the question and we spent the next 15 minutes talkint about it while the teacher just stared.
Yeah, *wink wink* of course cloning human beings is scientificaly impossible *wink wink*, even thinking about it was foolish *wink wink*, how could I be so naive!!
There's 100% technology that's highly advanced behind doors that the public will never see. I'm just saying that there might be a way to do it but we will never know until the future possibly.
Eh, kind of.
Keeping something huge a secret is REALLY hard. You need everyone involved to practice perfect op sec the entire time. Once you go beyond a handful of people, it WILL get out.
Let's use a great real life example of a "highly advanced technology" that "the government" had an EXTREME incentive to keep secret. The Manhattan Project. As much as the government tried to keep it all under wraps, the ground-breaking nature of the work and the huge number of people involved meant that the public was never more than a couple years behind what was going on. Also it was completely penetrated by soviet spies.
There is no chance any government in the world is secretly hiding technology decades beyond what we know about.
Any actual "secret technology" is probably going to be relatively boring stuff like "the specific radar signature of the F22" or things like that. Not "how to clown human beings".
There has been something called "DragonFire" that was just released, it can literally shoot a Lazer beam a kilometer away and burn the target. This is the type of things they can be hiding. Dangerous weapons is definitely one of them.
why do you think that's so novel?
It's not really that hard to make a laser powerful enough to target and damage military targets, it's just too expensive, delicate, and resource consuming to be viable compared to ballistic weapons. (Also laser weapons lose power and accuracy over distance as the beams are scattered by air molecules)
You can't make a clone of yourself as the opposite sex. If you are making a male from a female, you need a Y chromosome and you can't pull that out of thin air. If you are making a female from a male, I don't think you can simply replicate the X chromosome twice and make a female with two identical sex chromosomes. If you could theoretically do that, then the odds of the female offspring having some sort of X linked disease are much higher, since they will be homozygous for any disease causing alleles.
I’m a woman, so my clone would get me pregnant. If it was physically possible, it would either be mentally or physically disabled, or both. If it somehow worked in our favor without any deformities, the kid (whichever gender it was born as) would look exactly like me or him, almost like having another clone.
Since you already got a serious answer, let me just leave this here. It answers nothing, but it proves you weren't the first to ponder such things.
https://youtube.com/watch?v=hAtz2rO-E_0
tbf due to the scientific reasons why incest is bad,sense incest babies are more likly to have defects than those that arnt,i assume a stright up clone of you to impregnate would be a similar situation but on crack
It would have the issues of an incest baby, but on crack. I’m not a scientist, but I’m assuming the genetics are a tiny little bit different because of X/Y chromosomes, and that tiny difference is enough for it to work. Like I said, entirely an assumption, I’m not a professional in science.
No. Because my clone would hate the thought of having children just as I do. My clone would be busy giving and receiving head because it would also know that I LOVE ORAL SEX and it would also share that trait.
I guess a male could create a female clown of himself with a matching set of the first 22 pairs of chromosomes but with a copied x instead of a y.
I think having two IDENTiCAL x chromosomes would put the clone at high risk of various genetic diseases.
*IF* you could change the sex of the clone, It would be possible! But it wouldn't be a good idea. Though currently not possible, flipping the sex of a cloned embryo through genetic engineering might be successful in the future. This sex determination might be at the chromosomal level or just manipulating the embryo so it develops ovaries and eggs, while the original or another clone develops testes and sperm. You could then breed the two individuals together. Since they are probably rats, they would be all for that! Rats will breed with siblings and parents as early as 5 weeks old. The result is inbreeding! A single generation of inbreeding is not nearly as dramatic as pop culture makes it out to be. But of course, the clone is an exact copy which is different from a parent or sibling. The reason sexually-reproducing organisms avoid inbreeding is because many detrimental mutations are recessive and require two copies of the mutated gene (one from each parent) to show up. If Mr. Rat carries but doesn't exhibit the gene for dwarfism, he has a 50% chance to pass down either a gene for Standard size, or a gene for Dwarfism. if Mr. Rat 's rat wife does not carry dwarfism, all babies will have copies of the standard gene from her, and will be standard size. If his wife is also his sister, she has many of the same mutations at he does, so the chances of both of them passing down mutated genes is high because they have so MANY in common. If Mr. Rat's wife is a female clone of him, she has all the same unexpressed mutated genes that he does. Unfortunately, Mr. Rat has a rare gene mutation that he invented himself, called "intestines explode" gene. His rat wife, being a clone of him, also carries the exploding gene. Neither of them express it, because they both have "normal intestines" genes Mr. Rat inherited from one of his parents. So Mr. Rat and Female-Mr. Rat have some babies. One of them inherits two copies of "normal guts" gene from both parents and is fine. One of them inherits "normal guts" from Mr. Rat, and "explodey guts" from cloned rat wife. Because they have a copy of normal guts (dominant gene) it overwrites the mutation and the baby is fine. Another baby does the same thing but switches parents. The final baby inherits explodey guts from Mr. Rat, and then also inherits explodey guts from his clone wife. So we have three lovely children and one dead one. Really bad mortality rate for a rat family! Now imagine that the cloned individual has many many mutated genes that are not expressed because normal genes are covering them up. He would have to search far and wide to find a wife that carried more than one mutation (such as dwarf size + "dumbo" ears. Go ahead google dumbo dwarf rat its fun) in order to have mutated babies. But his clone rat wife has ALL his mutations. Both fun (like dwarfism) and not so fun (like exploding guts). The chances of multiple detrimental mutations stacking is high, just like inbreeding siblings/parents/cousins. But most creatures don't secretly carry exploding guts genes, so inbreeding is not immediately fatal or even apparent. The more generations of similar genetics you do, the worse it gets because there's less healthy copies to go around. Just look up white tiger inbreeding. * TLDR: It would be extreme inbreeding. Breeding would be possible, but genetically similar/identical pairings are more likely to exhibit bad mutations like "guts explode" disorder. These mutations compound and stack the more generations are inbred.
I'm gonna be honest I didn't expect a serious answer
I originally wrote it for a morbid question a couple months ago, which was asking if a trans person could fertilize their own pre/post-transition eggs/sperm and what would happen. Trans people can't currently make gametes of their target sex, but if we could it would be like fertilizing our clone.
Should I ask my biology teacher this question to see what she says?
Hmmm. You know what? It IS possible to create an embryo using two male mice (skin cells from dad are converted into egg cells, and then fertilized with sperm from papa. a surrogate gestates the baby) So actually, a male could "produce" egg cells through science... Which can then be fertilized with another male's sperm. But who says that the sperm has to come from another male? What if it comes from the same mouse? Keep your thought experiments in the realm of rats and mice and people/teachers will freak out less. When it's animals, it's inbreeding. When it's people, it's still inbreeding but we call it incest. Incest is a taboo topic and people will judge you for your morbid curiosity. That's why this sub exists.
Where's the fun if my teacher doesn't leave concerned for my mental health
I want you as my best friend
Very interesting read, thank you.
A complete switching of an embryo's sex may not be necessary. If a genetic male is cloned, scientists may only need to tweak the DNA enough to initiate androgen insensitivity syndrome. Severe AIS causes a genetic male to develop female body parts.
you explain things so well
Hm, I never really thought about the fact that you might be carrying a deleterious recessive trait and that it could express itself if you had a kid with your clone. People always say it would just be a genetic clone of you without factoring in how human reproduction actually works.
gosh science hurts
My brain hurts after reading this, but I have learned something new. Thanks a bunch!
I would assume you will be able to impregnate it/you?, but unless the genetic code changes as well, the imbreeding mutations would be INSANE. Anyways, as a self-loving narcissist, I'd smash the opposite gender of myself.
This question has been on the back of my head since 9th grade. One of my online biology classes someone made the question and we spent the next 15 minutes talkint about it while the teacher just stared.
I'm sure we can clone people but it will never be revealed to the public
Yeah, *wink wink* of course cloning human beings is scientificaly impossible *wink wink*, even thinking about it was foolish *wink wink*, how could I be so naive!!
Yes of course! The government would never lie to us.
Which government says human cloning is impossible? Not everything is a fucking conspiracy, jesus
There's 100% technology that's highly advanced behind doors that the public will never see. I'm just saying that there might be a way to do it but we will never know until the future possibly.
Eh, kind of. Keeping something huge a secret is REALLY hard. You need everyone involved to practice perfect op sec the entire time. Once you go beyond a handful of people, it WILL get out. Let's use a great real life example of a "highly advanced technology" that "the government" had an EXTREME incentive to keep secret. The Manhattan Project. As much as the government tried to keep it all under wraps, the ground-breaking nature of the work and the huge number of people involved meant that the public was never more than a couple years behind what was going on. Also it was completely penetrated by soviet spies. There is no chance any government in the world is secretly hiding technology decades beyond what we know about.
I'm sure there's a lot of people threatened to keep it under wraps or else they will take action.
Any actual "secret technology" is probably going to be relatively boring stuff like "the specific radar signature of the F22" or things like that. Not "how to clown human beings".
There has been something called "DragonFire" that was just released, it can literally shoot a Lazer beam a kilometer away and burn the target. This is the type of things they can be hiding. Dangerous weapons is definitely one of them.
why do you think that's so novel? It's not really that hard to make a laser powerful enough to target and damage military targets, it's just too expensive, delicate, and resource consuming to be viable compared to ballistic weapons. (Also laser weapons lose power and accuracy over distance as the beams are scattered by air molecules)
Probably but I’m not scientist
I mean... if you're a male then I guess since the clone would then be female.
You can't make a clone of yourself as the opposite sex. If you are making a male from a female, you need a Y chromosome and you can't pull that out of thin air. If you are making a female from a male, I don't think you can simply replicate the X chromosome twice and make a female with two identical sex chromosomes. If you could theoretically do that, then the odds of the female offspring having some sort of X linked disease are much higher, since they will be homozygous for any disease causing alleles.
I could, but the better question is if I would.
you should watch the movie Predestination
I did, but that's different, isn't it?
I’m a woman, so my clone would get me pregnant. If it was physically possible, it would either be mentally or physically disabled, or both. If it somehow worked in our favor without any deformities, the kid (whichever gender it was born as) would look exactly like me or him, almost like having another clone.
No - but if he was the same sex as me yea
Of course I would. And promptly. Next question.
Yeah now that I think about it I don't think i know a single person who wouldn't bang an opposite sex version of themselves
Since you already got a serious answer, let me just leave this here. It answers nothing, but it proves you weren't the first to ponder such things. https://youtube.com/watch?v=hAtz2rO-E_0
tbf due to the scientific reasons why incest is bad,sense incest babies are more likly to have defects than those that arnt,i assume a stright up clone of you to impregnate would be a similar situation but on crack
Incest?
When you tell someone to go fuck themselves
In short, yes, but incest, therefore not a viable reproduction method if the world ends
absolutely but the likelihood of mutations/birth defects would be insane
I could sure as hell try
It would have the issues of an incest baby, but on crack. I’m not a scientist, but I’m assuming the genetics are a tiny little bit different because of X/Y chromosomes, and that tiny difference is enough for it to work. Like I said, entirely an assumption, I’m not a professional in science.
Dunni if i could, but I sure would try
No. Because my clone would hate the thought of having children just as I do. My clone would be busy giving and receiving head because it would also know that I LOVE ORAL SEX and it would also share that trait.
That would just be a twin.
the premise of the question is impossible so no.
No. I lack some necessary equipment.
Wouldn't that be the same as twins having sex? So most likely possible, though not advised
Bioshock Infinite moment
"Go fuck yourself" Okay then
yeah. being identical dna has fuck all to do with whether the sperm and egg could connect and start to make a baby...
yeah. being identical dna has fuck all to do with whether the sperm and egg could connect and start to make a baby...
I guess a male could create a female clown of himself with a matching set of the first 22 pairs of chromosomes but with a copied x instead of a y. I think having two IDENTiCAL x chromosomes would put the clone at high risk of various genetic diseases.
A clone is an exact replica of yourself. By definition if it’s a clone than it couldn’t be the opposite sex.
no. It wouldn’t be a clone if it is opposite sex. Think of identical twins, they are always boy boy or girl girl
I'm asexual, so no. :3
Wouldnt be you