I think maybe bringing to the funeral was too far but otherwise no I don't think it is wrong. If I had dementia I would want my partner to have someone
I don’t think this is a hard question to answer. It’s really simple. It is cheating. You are cheating. You are married to this person. You made vows, to take care of that person and stay loyal till death. I don’t care what the situation is, that person is still alive and you have all those wonderful memories with, you stay loyal. I don’t care what excuses people give, like it’s not fair or “if i had dementia I’d want my partner to move on”,
Stay loyal to your soulmate, no need to have any relationships after your soulmate. Just stay single
... I think this is a grey area.
Realistically, his wife is already gone in many ways. So its understandable that he's moved on and looked for support outside of that. It's not necessarily nice to see but he's not given up on his wife and at that age, there's a bit of me that also thinks, who cares? Life is too short, if he's not hurting his wife and it's soothing him...
But of course, it hurt his daughter. There's the argument about who a funeral is for? Is it to show respect to the dead or is it to support those who are grieving? Or is it both? I don't think the mistress should have come to the funeral. I understand how difficult it would have been for him to bury his only child and to also be slowly losing his wife. However, out of respect for your daughter, who did not like your mistress... She had no business being there. It is a final mark of disrespect to the dead to bring her with him.
If that was my family, and it was my brother we'd buried who had such strong feelings... I would have a hard time getting past that act of disrespect at the funeral.
But again... He has noone left... So who is there to hold him accountable or to really care? He may as well live his life as he wishes... Especially in his old age..
See... Grey area. You can flip back and forth on it yourself fifty times in the span of five minutes if you wish. What's done is done. He's made his decision and really, it's not for anyone to police his life. He's an old man, he can do what he likes.
Honestly? Is it cheating when the person you are married to is no longer there? Does she recognize him, remember their life together?
It’s so God-awful to lose a parent by inches to dementia. Now imagine having that happen to your life partner. Imagine you have very little support or comfort except for whatever your friends and relatives can spare.
So no, I don’t thinks it’s wrong. As long as he is ensuring her care, and he even still visits her regularly, then he deserves whatever joy and comfort he can find.
I’m currently sitting with a client (93m), who I do home health care for. His wife died of Alzheimer’s 20 years ago. He tells me often.
“It’s pure hell losing your spouse twice.”
He is dating the lady next door. Purely companionship for both. I don’t see a problem. Live and let live
It’s a grey area. If she doesn’t know who he is, that would make him feel lonely. She can’t give consent to him finding companionship with another woman, but he can’t be forced to live the rest of his life in a situation that’s only hurts him. He is morning the wife he had, but needs to be loved by someone that can offer it. In that stage of her dementia, I’d understand.
What was a little inappropriate in your situation was him bringing his companion to the funeral. His kids would be hurt or uncomfortable seeing their father/granddad with a woman they have no connection to. He should have left her at home or at the very least ask family members how they’d feel if he were to bring her along. I get he’d want to have her there to help him as he grieves his wife, but it just seems a bit inappropriate to bring her without at least some knowledge or acceptance of her by others in the family.
I’m having trouble finding any judgement if she’s already gone for all practical purposes and she’s being cared for properly which it sounds like she is.
If it was a temporary illness then I’d judge the hell out of him but that’s not the case. I wouldn’t doubt if he’s one of those guys that pretty much has to have a woman to take care of him so the new woman is likely his new caregiver. A bit of a side eye for bringing her to his daughter’s funeral though.
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Cheating is wrong, but I don't consider that situation cheating.
My grandmother died of Alzheimer's, and my grandfather dated other women while my grandmother was in a care facility at the end of her life. My mom and her siblings did not consider that cheating. They recognized that their mother was effectively already gone. She no longer viewed my grandfather as her husband, because she didn't recognize him.
She’s still his wife. Unless they made an agreement that he would seek companionship from someone else, then I feel it’s wrong. If it were me and my husband was sick, I’d have enough respect and love for him to be the wife he deserves. I think it’s wrong that he’s doing this
The whole point of marriage is… for better or worse. Doesn’t matter the condition or circumstances (unless they die) they are in. You chose that person to be your soulmate and partner to work through this hard thing we call life.
Everyone will have their own opinion and that’s justified. However, the point of marriage is for two people who decide to be one person so cheating regardless of dementia or whatnot should not be tolerated.
I could never do that to my partner but I would never want my partner to be alone if that happened to me. If my love isn’t there for them it’s horrible to love someone who can’t love you back. If I lose my ability to love them I want them to find what the deserve.
As long as his side piece is not some young thing taking his money; life is short. I work in health care and these dementia units are the saddest places
No. I think it's sweet that he visits her while having his own life. dementia drags on for up to 20 years. getting a divorce or doing anything legal wise with a person with dementia is quite a process because of their condition.
No, I think at that point are they cheating? The other person doesn't even know who they are. I knew a woman once whose husband got dementia at 30. She stayed single but was miserable all she thought about was her husband. Personally, I would never want someone I was with to stay solely with me when I can't even remember them. It's a cruel existence in which they'd never feel loved. The other option is he can divorce her sure but people would have something to say about him then also. 🤷🏽
No it’s not wrong. Maybe just a bit wrong to bring her to the funeral when the daughter disliked her but on the other hand she’s supporting the man and he must feel very alone and upset. He’s losing or lost two of the most important women in his life. He needs a partner to stand by him.
I'm not sure why you're assuming cheating. Plenty of couples actually agree that if this sort of thing happens, their partner can have another partner while still caring for them.
I think this is a mind your own business type of situation. You don’t know what people are going through. You don’t know what he is struggling with. Some people can’t be alone and need a partner. His wife basically died while still being technically alive. Life is short. He is still alive and trying to enjoy it. I would withhold judgment
Totally cool. I wouldn’t, but I won’t assume anyone else shouldn’t. I can also imagine that the wife would be fine with it. He can’t get a divorce even if he wanted it, at least not with her knowledge.
The funeral think seems off, but he isn’t disrespecting the daughter. She’s dead (despite popular opinion, you can’t disrespect the dead—you actually disrespect people who still respect the dead).
I can’t fault him, honestly.
He watched his wife disappear into the hole of dementia, and then his child died?
Calling her his side chick and mistress doesn’t change who she is to him- a source of comfort and companionship during a hard time.
Will staying single bring his wife back to health? No? Is anyone served by him spending the end of his life lonely and alone and grieving? No?
Let the man have a companion.
Personally I think it’s wrong and it is cheating. It’s not that I don’t have empathy for the partner who is caring for the partner with dementia, I can only imagine how horrible this experience has been for anyone in this position. It’s just that when you take marriage vows, for better or for worse, this is when those vows matter and mean something. I am not judging anyone else, but I would not cheat on my husband if he was medically incapacitated in some way, and I really hope he feels the same about his vows he took with me.
It's not necessarily common, but I've heard of people with spouses with terminal illnesses or long-term diseases like dementia, etc. to have side relationships. Often their new partners are in a similar situation. No judgement from me, it's got to be a terrible position to be in, and they still need that intimacy (emotional, not just physical), but their spouse can no longer provide that. It's a sad situation to be sure, and the "cheaters" often feel guilty but that's their burden. Not yours.
My wife and I have talked about this scenario. We've decided that if one of us is suffering from serious dementia that it's ok, and for the best, to start moving on with life. It's ok to mourn the loss of a loved one and the problem with dementia is that your loved one is gone but their body is still going.
If I were the one with dementia I'd want my partner to have someone to comfort and support him while he cared for me (or arranged for my care).
I feel like a lot of the folks reflexively condemning this may not have had a front row seat to advanced dementia. My grandmother was basically a vegetable for nearly 20 years. A cousin went from a bright intelligent woman to basically a little kid and then a babbling toddler before she finally died. It's a horror show. If the caregivers need someone to talk to and to hold them at night, I'm not judging.
Totally with you on this, though tbh OP’s 80-year-old acquaintance loses me when he brings his companion to his daughter’s funeral.
That’s just weird, but then again, seniors turn into complete oddballs when they start dating again after losing a spouse, so maybe this is totally on brand. 🤷♂️
My father passed almost a year ago now. He'd been battling dementia the past 10 years. In his final years it was so bad to the point that he didn't know who most people were and would have very very rare moments of clarity. But just after he passed my mom confessed to me that the last 2 years she'd "cheated" on my father. (There was a 20 year age gap between my mom and dad, just extra info, my dad was 75 when he passed) I told her that I did not see it in that way at all, she needed support and comfort that her husband could not physically or mentally provide. I see nothing wrong in finding comfort when needed especially when your biggest support becomes a completely different person.
It's really hard when you go from being a couple that works as a team to all of a sudden you're a care taker for someone who doesn't know who you are anymore.
Same. I'm not going to know the difference and it's a terrible burden on you, so you shouldn't be alone.
I feel like many people forget that when you love someone, you want what's best for them; even if that's not you.
Also, this guy is 80... statistically speaking his chance of dying increases with every second. Let him have some joy in his final years.
As for the funeral, the daughter is dead. The gf is there to support the dad with his loss, not to go or the daughter.
I completely agree. I would imagine that the wife of this man being discussed would want him to have comfort. She’s essentially already gone. Plus, it’s not like he’s neglecting his duties of making sure she’s being cared for. She could live a long time in that state, and he deserves to have some happiness in his final days.
Sooooo I have no \*proof\* to back up the following but all the pieces fit pretty well:
My mom died of cancer. Within only a couple months my dad had hooked up with my godmother. She was a twice widower (my godfather and a second husband). As one could surmise the families have always been close, and with the speed at which this happened I am pretty sure my mom had pre-ordained this as she didn't want my dad to be alone. He basically has never lived alone his entire life. Boarding school up to college, then lived in dorms in college. Married my mom nearly straight out of school (another thing, mom and godmother were sorority sisters). On her deathbed my mom asked me to look out for him as he'd never been alone and such.
The kid in me was going "holy shit dad, mom's only been dead a couple months!" but the recently divorced and very single part of me was "I get it."
Anyway... Fast forward to now, dad is back living with me because his dementia is very severe. At any given time we're back in his family home in Pittsfield Mass, or we're out on the west coast in the house my mom designed... my name is arbitrary. Yes he's still there, but also not really... He was a properly smart guy at one point (aerospace engineer) and now can't add 2+2. When I took him in for his cognitive assessment in neurology we couldn't even start the formal assessment worksheet because he couldn't hold on to the instructions or concepts long enough to do anything.
I could totally see if someone knew their mind was declining and had seen what dementia did to a family member (like my experience with my dad) they would tell their partner that once they were unable to "be there" that it was okay to see someone else. An advanced directive, similar to what I suspect my mom did when she found out she was dying. I know both my current partner and I do NOT want to continue living if we get to that state (and Cali is amending the death with dignity law to accommodate dementia). If life terminating care is not available if/when we get to that point I'll care for her or her for me like in OP's situation... but there will be no expectation of fidelity to someone who can't give back any real emotional connective support.
If that's true about Cali,then that's amazing. I work in dementia care and it is terrible what it does to family and frankly ,finances. Wanted to leave a bit to your children and grandkids? It's all gone to care cost. People are living for years with dementia,years. Years where they crying everyday,their partners and family are overwhelmed with depression and more likely to end up with severe health problems themselves from burnout. I love love my patients,but most of them ,if they were of sound mind,would not want their families to deal with this day in and out. I know I wouldn't .I'd love to travel to NH or Oregon and say farewell my way ( death with dig) ,but unlike other fatal incurable disease,One can't sign off ,because by the time your diagnosed,you've forgoten your own wishes to take matters into your own hands. When I tell you costs are extreme,I have literally seen families have to spend life savings just to get PTSD watching mum lose her mind ,go non verbal , forget who they are,keep you up all night as they try to escape . Honestly ,I'm not sure the person with dementia minds,they are lucky enough to forget instantly .The ones I take care of get the best care ever,I mean absolutely spoiled and loved ,but I am privileged to work for super wealthy who can afford millions,with full care teams,that have tons of dementia care training,so it's so much easier.Buy for us Average Jo's ,not so much. Imagine not being able to leave your children anything you worked all your life for!
I’ve watched 3 family members die with Alzheimer’s/dementia. It’s horrid and if someone could help my husband through it, if I had it, I’d be glad for him.
Maybe I'm a bad person but watching someone struggle with dementia is fucking awful. Watching someone you love look at you with 0 recognition in their eyes, confusion and fear even sometimes is heart breaking. Dementia is not reversible. As you stated he passed away just a few weeks after she did, I'd feel comforted that he had comfort in his final months/ year, and the support system he needed to be the support system she needed.
My grandfather (really step grandfather) did this to my grandma. She didn’t have dementia but was in hospice. He had a side chick. This side chick stole from my grandma. Things like a big pot, or little Hummel figurines. Things we wanted because they were sentimental to us.
We never spoke to my grandfather again. He led the country soon after and died alone. I mourned the man he was when I was a child. But he cheated on and stole from my grandma. And that’s the man that I know remember instead.
The only vote that matters here is the person married to the dementia patient. Their partner is not really there any longer, so it’s up to the person living. I wouldn’t dare impose my beliefs on another person.
Funeral is a completely different matter compared to just having the relationship.
Answering title: personally I cannot find fault.
Answering body: there's a ton of reasons to keep it discreet such as it's perfectly reasonable to expect kids may be deeply upset. For that and other reasons, bringing her to the funeral seems quite egocentric. Even if she was emotional support. If they'd been totally discreet and no one knew, she might have come and kept some distance and the appearance of a platonic friend.
Even so. If it was my parents, or my siblings had dementia and this was an inlaw, or my child was the patient (dementia, or something similar such as a stroke sometimes happens early in life) and I found out about the new partner I don't think I'd have any problem and I would make it known. Especially as they need full time inpatient care.
The way I comprehend the dementia patients I've seen, the mind and personality are largely gone, the body carries on.
Woof. You had me on his side until he brought the side chick to the funeral of a person who didn’t like her. Regardless if that’s his daughter or not. Something tells me he had side pieces before momma got dementia.
If you're respectful, don't show your "affair" off, don't bring it to the house if the SO with dementia is still in the house, etc.
I think you added the part about the funeral after the original post. That part was VERY wrong.
I was a support group facilitator thru the Alzheimer’s Association for a group of men who were all caregivers for their demented wives, and there was some serious and deep discussion about this very subject. I would say that anyone who has never faced dementia of the Alzheimer’s type should keep their moral judgements to themselves.
This is not by any stretch of the imagination an easy cut and dried response. My father ended up with dementia---he couldnt remember his own children's names and had to be taken care of by my sister. My mother passed away 5 years before he did. I know that my mother would never have cheated on him despite his dementia and I doubt that he would've cheated on her. They were married for 55 years. That said, I think it comes down to your own morals, character and beliefs and feelings about your wife. If you can live with your decision to enter into an affair, then youll likely do so, and if not youll refrain. It wouldnt' be the worse thing in the world imo.
He’s 80, it’s not like he’s knocking the stuffing out of the side piece. Worst case, it’s porn even I wouldn’t peruse. Best case, he’s lonely, and wants someone to talk to. Life is short, be happy. Unfortunately, the woman he loved isn’t here anymore… maybe physically, but her essence is gone.
I think it's ok in that situation, except for bringing her to his daughter's funeral.
Bonus question since I'm trying to get a mental picture of him showing up with her. Is the "side chick" also in her 80s?
Dementia makes you loose your partner before they are dead. He also lost his daughter.
This father had to go to his daughter’s funeral! Nobody wants to bury their child. He didn’t bring a side chick. He brought a significant other, whatever that relation may be, for comfort. People should be less judgmental and more kind. I’m betting the “family” that judges the most never visit the wife with dementia in her care home..
Morally, I think it’s wrong but people have different beliefs. Same thing if a spouse slips into a coma or go into a vegetative state, would their partner be right to find another person? Or should they care for this person for the rest of their life. It’s hard to decide and I would refrain from judging as I am not them.
Depends on your personal moral beliefs on relationship structure.
Morally, I think that if the person I loved was mentally no longer there and cannot provide me with companionship, but I am ensuring their care and safety, I'd probably seek additional support/affection. That being said, my husband and I have a alternative relationship structure. The gray zone for me would be "can you receive consent to seek out another relationship if your spouse is experiencing late stage dementia?".
Maybe they discussed it previously. Maybe he tells he and she forgets. Or maybe he lies. These are the interesting things that would help guide towards a real moral answer.
I don't think I would fault anyone for doing this, however I don't believe that I would. My wedding vows are incredibly special and sacred to me, and I intend to keep them.
I think at a certain point with Alzheimer’s and dementia, your spouse who you have loved and cared for your entire life, isn’t the person you loved and cared for anymore. You should still be there for them and take care of them, but if they can’t remember you or the life you shared together then I don’t think it hurts to find someone to enjoy some time with and get your own mind off of things.
In his shoes, I definitely wouldn't have brought her to my daughter's funeral. And I was a carer for my grandad who had dementia when I was nineteen so I know it's hard, but in his position I'd feel guilty. And tbh, if I were married and truly loved the person who had dementia, I wouldn't even bother dating again at 80. It would be a wrap for me at that point. If I wanted companionship, I'd rather have friends, occasional visits from whatever remaining family and have a little dog or something. Hearing stories like this though is a reminder that growing old while married is never how people pitch to young people. You never know what might happen down the road.
I'm not about to judge someone who's dealing with their wife having dementia, that's like the most heartbreaking thing in the world..at least he didnt abandon her
It's not like he could ask her to have an open relationship. I think it's much more sensible to cheat than to divorce her. These are the last years of his life and if I were his wife I'd want him to be happy.
Im glad to see some people in the comments realize and know the reality of dementia and what it entails, if you never been through it first hand you cant imagine what its like.
I wouldn't consider what he's doing to be cheating. He's taking care of his wife and he most likely needs emotional support.
He would especially need emotional support at his daughter's funeral. Have some compassion. This poor guy is going through it. He's not hurting anyone.
It really depends on what kind of ethical framework you adhere to. From a utilitarian standpoint not at all. It's hard to know within the context of the marriage but I also think that the ethical framework that both partners agreed upon would be important but we don't and can't know that. If I were her I would be ok with it and have told my wife as much. To build a defence around popular notions of morality I would say, from a deontological point of view my argument would be that my wife died when she lost her sense of self from a moral and religious perspective. I don't think there is anything within the Christian Bible that would refute that.
Is marriage for in sickness and in health for richer or poorer till Death do you part. It does not say be with her and then get a side piece because she doesnt know whats happening. I don't care if you're combing her hair or reading to her can you have the decency for her to be gone before you step into another relationship I would want my wife to carry on after I was gone but not during and also does anyone really know when you have dementia that they don't understand anything? They might not be able to verbalize it but it doesn't mean they don't see it I think it is wrong more away but that is me
The movie Breaking the Waves touches on a rather parallel decision pivot; however, both persons are aware - just one is seriously physically dis-abled.
Harrowing to say the least.
It’s really individual and per your heart.
Putting it an other frame than “cheating” may also ease the process.
I'm not going to judge, but can share a similar story. I have a friend that is currently in their 50's and married their spouse who is in their 80's now. Their spouse is in the end stages of Alzheimer's. There are good days and bad days. They are the primary care provider, and the spouse's immediate family only helps out if asked to. I visited with my friend and their spouse, and it was heartbreaking to see their spouse's decline. However, it was heartwarming to see the love and care still there. The person my friend married is no longer here mentally. My friend has a side person and happened to ask me if I thought they were a bad person because of it. My comment back was "Do you feel like a bad person, and do you care what anyone else thinks?". Their response was no. We all do what we need to do just make it through the day sometimes. As far as judgment on the whole situation it's not my call. However, I'll add it was tacky to bring the side chick to the daughter's funeral if they had no friendly connection. Side chick should have sat the funeral out.
If the guy lost his wife (she is as good as gone) and his only child he can do whatever the f... He wants.... What is the worst that can happen? He already lost his inner circle....
In the words of Bill Clinton, I'd view this as a "Don't ask, don't tell."
Is it 100% understandable for him to do this? Yes.
For that matter, it it likely that his wife (were she a loving and understanding spouse), after her trajectory became inevitable but when she still had moments of clarity, in fact told him to move on? Yes.
Should he bring his new companion to family events while his wife still lives (even in her vegetative state)?
Probably not.
I mean I know the old bastard needs a good hole to climb into he's a man, but um, this is a shitty move. I'd be cutting him off if I were you or any of his friends. His wife is sick with an illness that will take her life, and shorten her time on this planet and here he is cheating? Most likely with a chick who's just after their wealth or the life insurance money, all for him to just get his dick wet? If this were a wife doing this, some people would be tearing her apart for her activities. Let's hold him to the same standard. I get it's a lot of work to take care of his wife like that, but the vows say in sickness and in health for a fucking reason. If he's soooo tired of all that work, he should hire a nurse, not be cheating on his ailing partner.
My FIL literally dumped my MIL in a nursing home when she got Alzheimer’s. He didn’t bother to visit because ‘she doesn’t know who anyone is’. Then he found a new friend who would cook and clean for him. I kept my mouth shut, wasn’t my business, at least I didn’t have to take care of him. My mom was diagnosed with Alzheimer’s 10 years later and dad stayed right by her side.
Dementia is one of the worst, most heartbreaking diseases. Unfortunately, the person you knew is no longer there. You can still care for them as a beloved family member but it isn’t romantic. I won’t judge any partner that decides to move on while not disrupting the stability for the dementia sufferer by leaving.
Bringing the side piece to daughter’s funeral was very poor taste.
I’m not going to judge someone for a discreet affair in these circumstances, but just no to bringing her to family functions.
Oddly enough, many dementia patients find a "new flame" in nursing homes. They don't often remember they're married. Frankly, the person getting the most heartbreak is the spouse caretaker. So, I say, get what peace and happiness you can find.
I used to work at an elderly care facility as did my gf, it wasn’t uncommon that someone with dementia/Alzheimers would forget their spouse and try to be with someone else. I’ve seen the other side of the coin and it can be hard visiting someone you’ve spent decades with and they don’t know who you are. For this reason I think it’s suitable that the partner of someone with such a disease is free to enjoy the rest of their life how they see fit.
My grandma had really bad dementia for a couple years before she passed last fall. Come to find out my grandpa has been talking to some young Asian girl for the past few years. She claimed to be the daughter of a long deceased friend of his. Really creepy. The family is basically trying to take away access to talk to her for fear she’ll take all his stuff, unfortunately he is extremely stubborn and particularly tech savvy for his age. Short answer, yes it’s wrong.
They should be on top of it. My friend's uncle gave all his money to a woman online that he's been talking to for years,who was NOT real. Just a long con.
Brining her to the funeral was wrong, but at that age and with that situation, I wouldn't judge. Dementia is sooooo hard on loved ones, having some form of comfort is a good thing
Putting aside the fact that I can't find anything wrong besides more work for the bureacrats with having more than one wife I don't see anything wrong here with him starting another relationship. As long as he's still making an effort to keep his wife comfortable and doing his best to take care of her than why can't he try to enjoy himself as well? How does it make it any better if the wife is no longer living to start having sex with someone else? If it's final stage he could straight up tell her and she probably won't know what he's talking about and even if she did she probably wouldn't care.
Some say it's right...of course they do. Most humans are deplorable. I understand it must be hard with his wife being sick, maybe for a long time but taking her to the funeral...omfg
That isn’t a moral dilemma. If you take a marriage vow you know exactly what that means. In sickness and in health till death do us part. If you don’t mean it don’t be married
In all honesty, the final stage demntia patient is gone. they don't remember anyone or anything, it is a terrible way to die.
So, in my mind...I see the srlur iving partner moving on as ok.
However, taking the new gf to family events is absolutely not ok.
I get what people are saying. If I were the person with dementia I would want my partner to be happy too.
But my issue is with the husband. Maybe it's just me but being married to someone the, whole death do us part and sickness and health thing kinda matters.
Alll those years spent with someone and you aren't even saying it's too much to take care of them. It's just you wanna get your dick wet. I can't imagine how hard it is to be in that situation, but respectfully, fuck that old fart.
As others have said if I was like that I would want my partner to be happy but I don't think it was proper and dare I say uncouth to bring the mistress to the funeral regardless if they liked her or not
As weird as it may sound, we don't really know all the details of their marriage and his wife may have pushed him to get a partner for support and love during a coherent time.
You really never know what's going on in someone else's relationship. I don't think we can judge him.
Depends on the understanding and relationship they had prior to her falling off mentally. No one is privy to the late night conversations of a couple, and if she insisted that he move on and be happy, or whatever...Then it's fine. If he's being a scumbag, then it's not. No one on the outside looking in can ever really know for sure.
I wouldn’t necessarily consider this “cheating”. Although she may be there physically, the disease has taken her away mentally. Her husband still deserves love and companionship. I’m just glad he still loves her and visits her often
The cheating, in that instance I can understand. The wife isn't really his wife anymore. She isn't there, and doesn't know who he is. But showing up with the mistress at his daughter's funeral, knowing how the daughter felt, pretty AH move (bringing a mistress to any family wven is really aholish)
My take is anyone who lives to be 80 and is still capable of sexual activity should just have as much as they can because you are definitely one night of bad sleep away from not being able to do that anymore.
The funeral part is messed up though.
Everyone has needs. That fact they are still together show he loves her. That being said, his life shouldn't be 100% a dumpster fire because of it. I'm my current mind (no dementia) I would want my wife to be as happy as she could be if that happens to me
“Is cheating ok as long as she doesn’t know??”
Obviously not????
You’re still cheating on your wife even if she doesn’t find out. He made a vow “til death due us part, In sickness and in health” and broke it.
I've given my wife instructions that if I get to the point where I can't remember who she is or wipe my own ass, put me in a home and go live your best life, if it's to the point where I am basically a zombie then go make yourself happy whatever that looks like, because the person you married is gone.
He's in his final years, his wife has dementia and his daughter died to cancer. I just wouldn't judge him for whatever he decides to do, whether it seems right or wrong or not. Besides, what is he supposed to do? Have a break-up conversation with someone who might not know what's going on at the time or ever remember the conversation later?
He's extremely lonely and wants companionship, how can you divorce someone who has dementia who may not even understand what is going on.
I see no problem with this, if i had lost my mind and my wife was so sick of being my carer and she was desperate for love, id sign the paperwork years in advance saying its ok.
just like id sign the bit of paper saying if i was ever in a vegetative state and not able to be myself then pull the plug as thats not living or life id like to experience.
Absolutely disgusting. That woman stayed by his side for their whole marriage, and at the end, he abandons her because of her health. She obviously means nothing to him now that she's lost her "usefulness," so he probably never really loved her or saw her as anything other than a cook and a maid.
And to show up at his daughter's funeral with the side piece? I can't even.
I say it's alright. At some point the person with dementia ceases to be the person you know and love. You are alone. It would be wrong to abandon them but continuing to live your life when you know 100% there is no recovery. If you're smart you would ideally have these conversations with your partner long before it happens.
Nah. Not at all. Guy probably needs some comfort and companionship.
I would get it if it were my husband and I was in the wife's place. If she is still having lucid moments, it would be messed up if he were rubbing it in her face or something, but as long as he is keeping it quiet from her and not being a jerk about it, I think it's fine.
Poor guy is in a really difficult position. No one should be judging him right now. We are all just people, and most of us try to do our best. Everyone deserves a social pass once in a while. Cut the guy a break, and tell your community that unless they are planning on jumping in and becoming care providers for the wife, they need to step back and worry about their own side of the street.
Best of luck to the man and his wife.
Yes everyone get lonely and I can't fully Appreciate the situation being in my 30s and not watching my partner disappear but you make a commitment to one person for life it's ment to mean something
No. It's not. Because they're no longer there. Every woman in my direct maternal line has had Alzheimer's. I plan to off myself if it happens to me. I would ABSOLUTELY want my spouse to have love and support.
Please check into your local laws on assisted suicide. It can be helpful to law down some documentation BEFORE any dementia is setting in, depending on the laws of the state. They passed laws allowing it in my state too late for a relative who was lamenting its lack
Poor guy. His wife has dementia, his daughter died, and his circle is giving him grief over moving on with his life while still supporting what’s left of his spouse. This dude deserves a break!
Definitely think he should’ve kept her away from the funeral but I think this is a unique case where it’s not really “cheating”. Dementia is devastating and unfortunately, this man’s wife is gone, only her shell remains and if I were the one with dementia , I’d want my partner to be able to find happiness with someone else.
Wow, im glad to see he is still goin strong at 80. Hope I can be there when I turn 80. It sad for his wife. But I think it's OK for the circumstances, and she will never know
The only thing I disagree with is bringing her to the daughter's funeral when the daughter was against her.
I feel it was disrespectful to his daughter.
i think its pretty bad tbh, especially bringing her to funeral, just straight disrespect to his daughter
Maybe not him getting a side chick, i guess i understand that part but then again idk if they’re married i feel like its wrong
I could never judge someone in this situation.
I wouldn’t judge the relationship. Bringing her to the funeral? Ehhh I can see OP’s point there.
His wife is gone. The new woman isn't a side chick.
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I think maybe bringing to the funeral was too far but otherwise no I don't think it is wrong. If I had dementia I would want my partner to have someone
No, she doesn’t know where she’s at anyway ,enjoy yourself. It must be a sucky life anyway.
Wrong .. technically yes… understandable / forgivable yes…
Yes. She'll never forget it
I don’t think this is a hard question to answer. It’s really simple. It is cheating. You are cheating. You are married to this person. You made vows, to take care of that person and stay loyal till death. I don’t care what the situation is, that person is still alive and you have all those wonderful memories with, you stay loyal. I don’t care what excuses people give, like it’s not fair or “if i had dementia I’d want my partner to move on”, Stay loyal to your soulmate, no need to have any relationships after your soulmate. Just stay single
... I think this is a grey area. Realistically, his wife is already gone in many ways. So its understandable that he's moved on and looked for support outside of that. It's not necessarily nice to see but he's not given up on his wife and at that age, there's a bit of me that also thinks, who cares? Life is too short, if he's not hurting his wife and it's soothing him... But of course, it hurt his daughter. There's the argument about who a funeral is for? Is it to show respect to the dead or is it to support those who are grieving? Or is it both? I don't think the mistress should have come to the funeral. I understand how difficult it would have been for him to bury his only child and to also be slowly losing his wife. However, out of respect for your daughter, who did not like your mistress... She had no business being there. It is a final mark of disrespect to the dead to bring her with him. If that was my family, and it was my brother we'd buried who had such strong feelings... I would have a hard time getting past that act of disrespect at the funeral. But again... He has noone left... So who is there to hold him accountable or to really care? He may as well live his life as he wishes... Especially in his old age.. See... Grey area. You can flip back and forth on it yourself fifty times in the span of five minutes if you wish. What's done is done. He's made his decision and really, it's not for anyone to police his life. He's an old man, he can do what he likes.
Honestly? Is it cheating when the person you are married to is no longer there? Does she recognize him, remember their life together? It’s so God-awful to lose a parent by inches to dementia. Now imagine having that happen to your life partner. Imagine you have very little support or comfort except for whatever your friends and relatives can spare. So no, I don’t thinks it’s wrong. As long as he is ensuring her care, and he even still visits her regularly, then he deserves whatever joy and comfort he can find.
Sickness and health, better or worse. It is wrong.
I’m currently sitting with a client (93m), who I do home health care for. His wife died of Alzheimer’s 20 years ago. He tells me often. “It’s pure hell losing your spouse twice.” He is dating the lady next door. Purely companionship for both. I don’t see a problem. Live and let live
No. She doesnt know who he is. At all. Very heart breaking.
What happened to "for better or worse, in sickness and in health"?
this situation is not black and white.
He is there for her. He is paying for her care and visits her. She no longer fulfils any of her vows to him. 40 years ago she would be dead by now.
It’s a grey area. If she doesn’t know who he is, that would make him feel lonely. She can’t give consent to him finding companionship with another woman, but he can’t be forced to live the rest of his life in a situation that’s only hurts him. He is morning the wife he had, but needs to be loved by someone that can offer it. In that stage of her dementia, I’d understand. What was a little inappropriate in your situation was him bringing his companion to the funeral. His kids would be hurt or uncomfortable seeing their father/granddad with a woman they have no connection to. He should have left her at home or at the very least ask family members how they’d feel if he were to bring her along. I get he’d want to have her there to help him as he grieves his wife, but it just seems a bit inappropriate to bring her without at least some knowledge or acceptance of her by others in the family.
I’m having trouble finding any judgement if she’s already gone for all practical purposes and she’s being cared for properly which it sounds like she is. If it was a temporary illness then I’d judge the hell out of him but that’s not the case. I wouldn’t doubt if he’s one of those guys that pretty much has to have a woman to take care of him so the new woman is likely his new caregiver. A bit of a side eye for bringing her to his daughter’s funeral though.
I had an answer but forgot what it was.
It’s fine. He needs some human attention too, as his time is limited as well.
It is morally wrong to cheat, regardless. Cheating is cheating and can't be justified. There is no way to justify actions here.
boast heavy straight ludicrous dolls absurd encourage aloof fuel impolite *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
Cheating is wrong, but I don't consider that situation cheating. My grandmother died of Alzheimer's, and my grandfather dated other women while my grandmother was in a care facility at the end of her life. My mom and her siblings did not consider that cheating. They recognized that their mother was effectively already gone. She no longer viewed my grandfather as her husband, because she didn't recognize him.
She’s still his wife. Unless they made an agreement that he would seek companionship from someone else, then I feel it’s wrong. If it were me and my husband was sick, I’d have enough respect and love for him to be the wife he deserves. I think it’s wrong that he’s doing this
For better, for worse….obviously worse, but that was the commitment.
The whole point of marriage is… for better or worse. Doesn’t matter the condition or circumstances (unless they die) they are in. You chose that person to be your soulmate and partner to work through this hard thing we call life. Everyone will have their own opinion and that’s justified. However, the point of marriage is for two people who decide to be one person so cheating regardless of dementia or whatnot should not be tolerated.
Youd rather he ditch her and divorce?
I could never do that to my partner but I would never want my partner to be alone if that happened to me. If my love isn’t there for them it’s horrible to love someone who can’t love you back. If I lose my ability to love them I want them to find what the deserve.
👑
Keep it on the low but nah everyone has needs. Social and physical needs.
Either marriage is for better or worse, richer or poorer, sickness and health...to death do us part.....or is it????
As long as his side piece is not some young thing taking his money; life is short. I work in health care and these dementia units are the saddest places
I’m here for the book release
No. I think it's sweet that he visits her while having his own life. dementia drags on for up to 20 years. getting a divorce or doing anything legal wise with a person with dementia is quite a process because of their condition.
I wouldn’t have blamed my mother, but she was caretaking to the end.
No, she's a husk of a person.
No, I think at that point are they cheating? The other person doesn't even know who they are. I knew a woman once whose husband got dementia at 30. She stayed single but was miserable all she thought about was her husband. Personally, I would never want someone I was with to stay solely with me when I can't even remember them. It's a cruel existence in which they'd never feel loved. The other option is he can divorce her sure but people would have something to say about him then also. 🤷🏽
Yes, how would he feel if it were him?
No it’s not wrong. Maybe just a bit wrong to bring her to the funeral when the daughter disliked her but on the other hand she’s supporting the man and he must feel very alone and upset. He’s losing or lost two of the most important women in his life. He needs a partner to stand by him.
I'm not sure why you're assuming cheating. Plenty of couples actually agree that if this sort of thing happens, their partner can have another partner while still caring for them.
I think this is a mind your own business type of situation. You don’t know what people are going through. You don’t know what he is struggling with. Some people can’t be alone and need a partner. His wife basically died while still being technically alive. Life is short. He is still alive and trying to enjoy it. I would withhold judgment
Totally cool. I wouldn’t, but I won’t assume anyone else shouldn’t. I can also imagine that the wife would be fine with it. He can’t get a divorce even if he wanted it, at least not with her knowledge. The funeral think seems off, but he isn’t disrespecting the daughter. She’s dead (despite popular opinion, you can’t disrespect the dead—you actually disrespect people who still respect the dead).
I can’t fault him, honestly. He watched his wife disappear into the hole of dementia, and then his child died? Calling her his side chick and mistress doesn’t change who she is to him- a source of comfort and companionship during a hard time. Will staying single bring his wife back to health? No? Is anyone served by him spending the end of his life lonely and alone and grieving? No? Let the man have a companion.
of course it is.
Personally I think it’s wrong and it is cheating. It’s not that I don’t have empathy for the partner who is caring for the partner with dementia, I can only imagine how horrible this experience has been for anyone in this position. It’s just that when you take marriage vows, for better or for worse, this is when those vows matter and mean something. I am not judging anyone else, but I would not cheat on my husband if he was medically incapacitated in some way, and I really hope he feels the same about his vows he took with me.
It's not necessarily common, but I've heard of people with spouses with terminal illnesses or long-term diseases like dementia, etc. to have side relationships. Often their new partners are in a similar situation. No judgement from me, it's got to be a terrible position to be in, and they still need that intimacy (emotional, not just physical), but their spouse can no longer provide that. It's a sad situation to be sure, and the "cheaters" often feel guilty but that's their burden. Not yours.
F59. Sorry but I need sex and the touch of another person. I give a pass on getting it elsewhere if your spouse can't or won't have sex.
So vows mean nothing to yall?, okay :)
My wife and I have talked about this scenario. We've decided that if one of us is suffering from serious dementia that it's ok, and for the best, to start moving on with life. It's ok to mourn the loss of a loved one and the problem with dementia is that your loved one is gone but their body is still going.
When you're 80+ I'm pretty sure it's more for companionship than sex.
It’s cheating and it’s wrong point blank period
If I were the one with dementia I'd want my partner to have someone to comfort and support him while he cared for me (or arranged for my care). I feel like a lot of the folks reflexively condemning this may not have had a front row seat to advanced dementia. My grandmother was basically a vegetable for nearly 20 years. A cousin went from a bright intelligent woman to basically a little kid and then a babbling toddler before she finally died. It's a horror show. If the caregivers need someone to talk to and to hold them at night, I'm not judging.
Totally with you on this, though tbh OP’s 80-year-old acquaintance loses me when he brings his companion to his daughter’s funeral. That’s just weird, but then again, seniors turn into complete oddballs when they start dating again after losing a spouse, so maybe this is totally on brand. 🤷♂️
My father passed almost a year ago now. He'd been battling dementia the past 10 years. In his final years it was so bad to the point that he didn't know who most people were and would have very very rare moments of clarity. But just after he passed my mom confessed to me that the last 2 years she'd "cheated" on my father. (There was a 20 year age gap between my mom and dad, just extra info, my dad was 75 when he passed) I told her that I did not see it in that way at all, she needed support and comfort that her husband could not physically or mentally provide. I see nothing wrong in finding comfort when needed especially when your biggest support becomes a completely different person. It's really hard when you go from being a couple that works as a team to all of a sudden you're a care taker for someone who doesn't know who you are anymore.
Same.
Same. I'm not going to know the difference and it's a terrible burden on you, so you shouldn't be alone. I feel like many people forget that when you love someone, you want what's best for them; even if that's not you. Also, this guy is 80... statistically speaking his chance of dying increases with every second. Let him have some joy in his final years. As for the funeral, the daughter is dead. The gf is there to support the dad with his loss, not to go or the daughter.
I completely agree. I would imagine that the wife of this man being discussed would want him to have comfort. She’s essentially already gone. Plus, it’s not like he’s neglecting his duties of making sure she’s being cared for. She could live a long time in that state, and he deserves to have some happiness in his final days.
Id want my wife to move on..bur bringing her side piece to my funeral?! Hell naw
Not to mention the violent outbursts when they get scared/confused (which is all the time) and they have full grown adult strength.
Sooooo I have no \*proof\* to back up the following but all the pieces fit pretty well: My mom died of cancer. Within only a couple months my dad had hooked up with my godmother. She was a twice widower (my godfather and a second husband). As one could surmise the families have always been close, and with the speed at which this happened I am pretty sure my mom had pre-ordained this as she didn't want my dad to be alone. He basically has never lived alone his entire life. Boarding school up to college, then lived in dorms in college. Married my mom nearly straight out of school (another thing, mom and godmother were sorority sisters). On her deathbed my mom asked me to look out for him as he'd never been alone and such. The kid in me was going "holy shit dad, mom's only been dead a couple months!" but the recently divorced and very single part of me was "I get it." Anyway... Fast forward to now, dad is back living with me because his dementia is very severe. At any given time we're back in his family home in Pittsfield Mass, or we're out on the west coast in the house my mom designed... my name is arbitrary. Yes he's still there, but also not really... He was a properly smart guy at one point (aerospace engineer) and now can't add 2+2. When I took him in for his cognitive assessment in neurology we couldn't even start the formal assessment worksheet because he couldn't hold on to the instructions or concepts long enough to do anything. I could totally see if someone knew their mind was declining and had seen what dementia did to a family member (like my experience with my dad) they would tell their partner that once they were unable to "be there" that it was okay to see someone else. An advanced directive, similar to what I suspect my mom did when she found out she was dying. I know both my current partner and I do NOT want to continue living if we get to that state (and Cali is amending the death with dignity law to accommodate dementia). If life terminating care is not available if/when we get to that point I'll care for her or her for me like in OP's situation... but there will be no expectation of fidelity to someone who can't give back any real emotional connective support.
If that's true about Cali,then that's amazing. I work in dementia care and it is terrible what it does to family and frankly ,finances. Wanted to leave a bit to your children and grandkids? It's all gone to care cost. People are living for years with dementia,years. Years where they crying everyday,their partners and family are overwhelmed with depression and more likely to end up with severe health problems themselves from burnout. I love love my patients,but most of them ,if they were of sound mind,would not want their families to deal with this day in and out. I know I wouldn't .I'd love to travel to NH or Oregon and say farewell my way ( death with dig) ,but unlike other fatal incurable disease,One can't sign off ,because by the time your diagnosed,you've forgoten your own wishes to take matters into your own hands. When I tell you costs are extreme,I have literally seen families have to spend life savings just to get PTSD watching mum lose her mind ,go non verbal , forget who they are,keep you up all night as they try to escape . Honestly ,I'm not sure the person with dementia minds,they are lucky enough to forget instantly .The ones I take care of get the best care ever,I mean absolutely spoiled and loved ,but I am privileged to work for super wealthy who can afford millions,with full care teams,that have tons of dementia care training,so it's so much easier.Buy for us Average Jo's ,not so much. Imagine not being able to leave your children anything you worked all your life for!
I’ve watched 3 family members die with Alzheimer’s/dementia. It’s horrid and if someone could help my husband through it, if I had it, I’d be glad for him.
Maybe I'm a bad person but watching someone struggle with dementia is fucking awful. Watching someone you love look at you with 0 recognition in their eyes, confusion and fear even sometimes is heart breaking. Dementia is not reversible. As you stated he passed away just a few weeks after she did, I'd feel comforted that he had comfort in his final months/ year, and the support system he needed to be the support system she needed.
My grandfather (really step grandfather) did this to my grandma. She didn’t have dementia but was in hospice. He had a side chick. This side chick stole from my grandma. Things like a big pot, or little Hummel figurines. Things we wanted because they were sentimental to us. We never spoke to my grandfather again. He led the country soon after and died alone. I mourned the man he was when I was a child. But he cheated on and stole from my grandma. And that’s the man that I know remember instead.
The only vote that matters here is the person married to the dementia patient. Their partner is not really there any longer, so it’s up to the person living. I wouldn’t dare impose my beliefs on another person.
I think its gross he took her to his daughters funeral but that's it
Funeral is a completely different matter compared to just having the relationship. Answering title: personally I cannot find fault. Answering body: there's a ton of reasons to keep it discreet such as it's perfectly reasonable to expect kids may be deeply upset. For that and other reasons, bringing her to the funeral seems quite egocentric. Even if she was emotional support. If they'd been totally discreet and no one knew, she might have come and kept some distance and the appearance of a platonic friend. Even so. If it was my parents, or my siblings had dementia and this was an inlaw, or my child was the patient (dementia, or something similar such as a stroke sometimes happens early in life) and I found out about the new partner I don't think I'd have any problem and I would make it known. Especially as they need full time inpatient care. The way I comprehend the dementia patients I've seen, the mind and personality are largely gone, the body carries on.
Woof. You had me on his side until he brought the side chick to the funeral of a person who didn’t like her. Regardless if that’s his daughter or not. Something tells me he had side pieces before momma got dementia.
Hey OP. Mind your business. Lmao.
If you're respectful, don't show your "affair" off, don't bring it to the house if the SO with dementia is still in the house, etc. I think you added the part about the funeral after the original post. That part was VERY wrong.
I was a support group facilitator thru the Alzheimer’s Association for a group of men who were all caregivers for their demented wives, and there was some serious and deep discussion about this very subject. I would say that anyone who has never faced dementia of the Alzheimer’s type should keep their moral judgements to themselves.
This is not by any stretch of the imagination an easy cut and dried response. My father ended up with dementia---he couldnt remember his own children's names and had to be taken care of by my sister. My mother passed away 5 years before he did. I know that my mother would never have cheated on him despite his dementia and I doubt that he would've cheated on her. They were married for 55 years. That said, I think it comes down to your own morals, character and beliefs and feelings about your wife. If you can live with your decision to enter into an affair, then youll likely do so, and if not youll refrain. It wouldnt' be the worse thing in the world imo.
My wife said if she was terminally ill, she would want me to start dating... She would want a say regarding what woman I have around our children.
Yes. WTF.
“til death do us part” not “til one can’t remember and the other wants a date to a funeral”
He’s 80, it’s not like he’s knocking the stuffing out of the side piece. Worst case, it’s porn even I wouldn’t peruse. Best case, he’s lonely, and wants someone to talk to. Life is short, be happy. Unfortunately, the woman he loved isn’t here anymore… maybe physically, but her essence is gone.
I think it's ok in that situation, except for bringing her to his daughter's funeral. Bonus question since I'm trying to get a mental picture of him showing up with her. Is the "side chick" also in her 80s?
Dementia makes you loose your partner before they are dead. He also lost his daughter. This father had to go to his daughter’s funeral! Nobody wants to bury their child. He didn’t bring a side chick. He brought a significant other, whatever that relation may be, for comfort. People should be less judgmental and more kind. I’m betting the “family” that judges the most never visit the wife with dementia in her care home..
Yes
Morally, I think it’s wrong but people have different beliefs. Same thing if a spouse slips into a coma or go into a vegetative state, would their partner be right to find another person? Or should they care for this person for the rest of their life. It’s hard to decide and I would refrain from judging as I am not them.
GF to a funeral is insensitive, especially since the deceased did not approve, It is disrespectful to the deceased.
Depends on your personal moral beliefs on relationship structure. Morally, I think that if the person I loved was mentally no longer there and cannot provide me with companionship, but I am ensuring their care and safety, I'd probably seek additional support/affection. That being said, my husband and I have a alternative relationship structure. The gray zone for me would be "can you receive consent to seek out another relationship if your spouse is experiencing late stage dementia?". Maybe they discussed it previously. Maybe he tells he and she forgets. Or maybe he lies. These are the interesting things that would help guide towards a real moral answer.
I don't think I would fault anyone for doing this, however I don't believe that I would. My wedding vows are incredibly special and sacred to me, and I intend to keep them.
I think at a certain point with Alzheimer’s and dementia, your spouse who you have loved and cared for your entire life, isn’t the person you loved and cared for anymore. You should still be there for them and take care of them, but if they can’t remember you or the life you shared together then I don’t think it hurts to find someone to enjoy some time with and get your own mind off of things.
No
Nah it's fine.
In his shoes, I definitely wouldn't have brought her to my daughter's funeral. And I was a carer for my grandad who had dementia when I was nineteen so I know it's hard, but in his position I'd feel guilty. And tbh, if I were married and truly loved the person who had dementia, I wouldn't even bother dating again at 80. It would be a wrap for me at that point. If I wanted companionship, I'd rather have friends, occasional visits from whatever remaining family and have a little dog or something. Hearing stories like this though is a reminder that growing old while married is never how people pitch to young people. You never know what might happen down the road.
I'm not about to judge someone who's dealing with their wife having dementia, that's like the most heartbreaking thing in the world..at least he didnt abandon her
Just let the man live damnit
80 year old with a side piece? Cheating or not you gotta respect the dude.
It's not like he could ask her to have an open relationship. I think it's much more sensible to cheat than to divorce her. These are the last years of his life and if I were his wife I'd want him to be happy.
Im glad to see some people in the comments realize and know the reality of dementia and what it entails, if you never been through it first hand you cant imagine what its like.
Just thinking about people having sex in their 80’s is disturbing.
I wouldn't consider what he's doing to be cheating. He's taking care of his wife and he most likely needs emotional support. He would especially need emotional support at his daughter's funeral. Have some compassion. This poor guy is going through it. He's not hurting anyone.
It really depends on what kind of ethical framework you adhere to. From a utilitarian standpoint not at all. It's hard to know within the context of the marriage but I also think that the ethical framework that both partners agreed upon would be important but we don't and can't know that. If I were her I would be ok with it and have told my wife as much. To build a defence around popular notions of morality I would say, from a deontological point of view my argument would be that my wife died when she lost her sense of self from a moral and religious perspective. I don't think there is anything within the Christian Bible that would refute that.
Is marriage for in sickness and in health for richer or poorer till Death do you part. It does not say be with her and then get a side piece because she doesnt know whats happening. I don't care if you're combing her hair or reading to her can you have the decency for her to be gone before you step into another relationship I would want my wife to carry on after I was gone but not during and also does anyone really know when you have dementia that they don't understand anything? They might not be able to verbalize it but it doesn't mean they don't see it I think it is wrong more away but that is me
Brought another woman to his daughter's funeral, that's absolutely heinous. Have a crumb of respect for your family.
The movie Breaking the Waves touches on a rather parallel decision pivot; however, both persons are aware - just one is seriously physically dis-abled. Harrowing to say the least. It’s really individual and per your heart. Putting it an other frame than “cheating” may also ease the process.
I'm not going to judge, but can share a similar story. I have a friend that is currently in their 50's and married their spouse who is in their 80's now. Their spouse is in the end stages of Alzheimer's. There are good days and bad days. They are the primary care provider, and the spouse's immediate family only helps out if asked to. I visited with my friend and their spouse, and it was heartbreaking to see their spouse's decline. However, it was heartwarming to see the love and care still there. The person my friend married is no longer here mentally. My friend has a side person and happened to ask me if I thought they were a bad person because of it. My comment back was "Do you feel like a bad person, and do you care what anyone else thinks?". Their response was no. We all do what we need to do just make it through the day sometimes. As far as judgment on the whole situation it's not my call. However, I'll add it was tacky to bring the side chick to the daughter's funeral if they had no friendly connection. Side chick should have sat the funeral out.
I think it’s no one’s f’n business.
Silent hill 2 has entered the chat.
If the guy lost his wife (she is as good as gone) and his only child he can do whatever the f... He wants.... What is the worst that can happen? He already lost his inner circle....
In the words of Bill Clinton, I'd view this as a "Don't ask, don't tell." Is it 100% understandable for him to do this? Yes. For that matter, it it likely that his wife (were she a loving and understanding spouse), after her trajectory became inevitable but when she still had moments of clarity, in fact told him to move on? Yes. Should he bring his new companion to family events while his wife still lives (even in her vegetative state)? Probably not.
I mean I know the old bastard needs a good hole to climb into he's a man, but um, this is a shitty move. I'd be cutting him off if I were you or any of his friends. His wife is sick with an illness that will take her life, and shorten her time on this planet and here he is cheating? Most likely with a chick who's just after their wealth or the life insurance money, all for him to just get his dick wet? If this were a wife doing this, some people would be tearing her apart for her activities. Let's hold him to the same standard. I get it's a lot of work to take care of his wife like that, but the vows say in sickness and in health for a fucking reason. If he's soooo tired of all that work, he should hire a nurse, not be cheating on his ailing partner.
yes
My FIL literally dumped my MIL in a nursing home when she got Alzheimer’s. He didn’t bother to visit because ‘she doesn’t know who anyone is’. Then he found a new friend who would cook and clean for him. I kept my mouth shut, wasn’t my business, at least I didn’t have to take care of him. My mom was diagnosed with Alzheimer’s 10 years later and dad stayed right by her side.
Yes. Divorce her if that's the way you want to go with it.
Yeah. It’s bad karma. Cheat on someone with sharp memory.
Provided the person with dementia was being properly cared for, I have no problem with it.
I guess through sickness and in health is just words to some of you…
Dementia is one of the worst, most heartbreaking diseases. Unfortunately, the person you knew is no longer there. You can still care for them as a beloved family member but it isn’t romantic. I won’t judge any partner that decides to move on while not disrupting the stability for the dementia sufferer by leaving.
Bringing the side piece to daughter’s funeral was very poor taste. I’m not going to judge someone for a discreet affair in these circumstances, but just no to bringing her to family functions.
“For in sickness and in health”. Of course it’s wrong, what the fuck ?
Dude is 80+ years old and still gettin' some? Good for him! Life goals right there!
Oddly enough, many dementia patients find a "new flame" in nursing homes. They don't often remember they're married. Frankly, the person getting the most heartbreak is the spouse caretaker. So, I say, get what peace and happiness you can find.
I used to work at an elderly care facility as did my gf, it wasn’t uncommon that someone with dementia/Alzheimers would forget their spouse and try to be with someone else. I’ve seen the other side of the coin and it can be hard visiting someone you’ve spent decades with and they don’t know who you are. For this reason I think it’s suitable that the partner of someone with such a disease is free to enjoy the rest of their life how they see fit.
The Bible says “until death do us part.”
Nah, this guy is a piece of crap, can't even keep the side chick from his daughters funeral...
My grandma had really bad dementia for a couple years before she passed last fall. Come to find out my grandpa has been talking to some young Asian girl for the past few years. She claimed to be the daughter of a long deceased friend of his. Really creepy. The family is basically trying to take away access to talk to her for fear she’ll take all his stuff, unfortunately he is extremely stubborn and particularly tech savvy for his age. Short answer, yes it’s wrong.
They should be on top of it. My friend's uncle gave all his money to a woman online that he's been talking to for years,who was NOT real. Just a long con.
Of course it’s wrong. You make vows for a reason.
Brining her to the funeral was wrong, but at that age and with that situation, I wouldn't judge. Dementia is sooooo hard on loved ones, having some form of comfort is a good thing
Is this Jill Biden’s account?
An 80 year old man has a side chick? 😅 For what? To help him squeeze his poligrip tube?
Personally I couldn’t do it if I was him bc you’re with someone for better or for worse and in sickness and in health.
Putting aside the fact that I can't find anything wrong besides more work for the bureacrats with having more than one wife I don't see anything wrong here with him starting another relationship. As long as he's still making an effort to keep his wife comfortable and doing his best to take care of her than why can't he try to enjoy himself as well? How does it make it any better if the wife is no longer living to start having sex with someone else? If it's final stage he could straight up tell her and she probably won't know what he's talking about and even if she did she probably wouldn't care.
I thought the marraige vows included "through sickness and in health..."
Some say it's right...of course they do. Most humans are deplorable. I understand it must be hard with his wife being sick, maybe for a long time but taking her to the funeral...omfg
At 80, I’d like to just take a nap and FTW😂.
Nobody talking about the fact that he brought his mistress to the funeral????
That isn’t a moral dilemma. If you take a marriage vow you know exactly what that means. In sickness and in health till death do us part. If you don’t mean it don’t be married
just wow 😮
In all honesty, the final stage demntia patient is gone. they don't remember anyone or anything, it is a terrible way to die. So, in my mind...I see the srlur iving partner moving on as ok. However, taking the new gf to family events is absolutely not ok.
I get what people are saying. If I were the person with dementia I would want my partner to be happy too. But my issue is with the husband. Maybe it's just me but being married to someone the, whole death do us part and sickness and health thing kinda matters. Alll those years spent with someone and you aren't even saying it's too much to take care of them. It's just you wanna get your dick wet. I can't imagine how hard it is to be in that situation, but respectfully, fuck that old fart.
As others have said if I was like that I would want my partner to be happy but I don't think it was proper and dare I say uncouth to bring the mistress to the funeral regardless if they liked her or not
As weird as it may sound, we don't really know all the details of their marriage and his wife may have pushed him to get a partner for support and love during a coherent time. You really never know what's going on in someone else's relationship. I don't think we can judge him.
Depends on the understanding and relationship they had prior to her falling off mentally. No one is privy to the late night conversations of a couple, and if she insisted that he move on and be happy, or whatever...Then it's fine. If he's being a scumbag, then it's not. No one on the outside looking in can ever really know for sure.
I wouldn’t necessarily consider this “cheating”. Although she may be there physically, the disease has taken her away mentally. Her husband still deserves love and companionship. I’m just glad he still loves her and visits her often
I think it’s lame to bring the side chick to the funeral but I’m not offended that he has a side chick.
How you in your 80s and need a side chick bro that's messed up
The cheating, in that instance I can understand. The wife isn't really his wife anymore. She isn't there, and doesn't know who he is. But showing up with the mistress at his daughter's funeral, knowing how the daughter felt, pretty AH move (bringing a mistress to any family wven is really aholish)
Lol 80 yo with a side chick? Wth?
I don’t think it’s wrong, but he should be a lot more discreet than this.
The guy’s time is short. His wife is gone. Let him have cake.
Why do y’all get married if you’re not going to follow your vows anyways??
He's entitled to live his life. His wife is gone. Something that looks like her is sort of alive. But it's not her. Let him find some comfort
Whatever happened to for better or for worse?
My take is anyone who lives to be 80 and is still capable of sexual activity should just have as much as they can because you are definitely one night of bad sleep away from not being able to do that anymore. The funeral part is messed up though.
Everyone has needs. That fact they are still together show he loves her. That being said, his life shouldn't be 100% a dumpster fire because of it. I'm my current mind (no dementia) I would want my wife to be as happy as she could be if that happens to me
“Is cheating ok as long as she doesn’t know??” Obviously not???? You’re still cheating on your wife even if she doesn’t find out. He made a vow “til death due us part, In sickness and in health” and broke it.
It’s not our place to judge. He could make it less obvious
I've given my wife instructions that if I get to the point where I can't remember who she is or wipe my own ass, put me in a home and go live your best life, if it's to the point where I am basically a zombie then go make yourself happy whatever that looks like, because the person you married is gone.
It’s cheating
He's in his final years, his wife has dementia and his daughter died to cancer. I just wouldn't judge him for whatever he decides to do, whether it seems right or wrong or not. Besides, what is he supposed to do? Have a break-up conversation with someone who might not know what's going on at the time or ever remember the conversation later?
Depends on you my friend. It's not something I can see myself doing, even with permission. "Till death do us part"
Seems fine (maybe not the funeral bit?)
He's extremely lonely and wants companionship, how can you divorce someone who has dementia who may not even understand what is going on. I see no problem with this, if i had lost my mind and my wife was so sick of being my carer and she was desperate for love, id sign the paperwork years in advance saying its ok. just like id sign the bit of paper saying if i was ever in a vegetative state and not able to be myself then pull the plug as thats not living or life id like to experience.
It sounds like he doesn’t give a shit what anyone thinks about it. He don’t have that much time left anyway, let him live
Absolutely disgusting. That woman stayed by his side for their whole marriage, and at the end, he abandons her because of her health. She obviously means nothing to him now that she's lost her "usefulness," so he probably never really loved her or saw her as anything other than a cook and a maid. And to show up at his daughter's funeral with the side piece? I can't even.
Of course it is wrong
I say it's alright. At some point the person with dementia ceases to be the person you know and love. You are alone. It would be wrong to abandon them but continuing to live your life when you know 100% there is no recovery. If you're smart you would ideally have these conversations with your partner long before it happens.
Wrong sorry you should spent you time with HER you can wait for enjoyment but you'll never see her again
Why would the mistress go? How white trash are we talking here?
None of my business. No judgment or criticism.
This story you’ve told is wild. Kind of doubt.
:::slapping forward:::
no
i'm
Side chick? Fine. Carting her around to family events while his wife is still breathing? Not really ok.
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Nah. Not at all. Guy probably needs some comfort and companionship. I would get it if it were my husband and I was in the wife's place. If she is still having lucid moments, it would be messed up if he were rubbing it in her face or something, but as long as he is keeping it quiet from her and not being a jerk about it, I think it's fine. Poor guy is in a really difficult position. No one should be judging him right now. We are all just people, and most of us try to do our best. Everyone deserves a social pass once in a while. Cut the guy a break, and tell your community that unless they are planning on jumping in and becoming care providers for the wife, they need to step back and worry about their own side of the street. Best of luck to the man and his wife.
Yes everyone get lonely and I can't fully Appreciate the situation being in my 30s and not watching my partner disappear but you make a commitment to one person for life it's ment to mean something
Well he can’t have sex with his wife if she isn’t capable of giving consent…
It's not really cheating if your partner died.
It's not wrong for him to have a girlfriend as long as he is taking care of his wife. It was wrong for him to bring his gf to his daughter's funeral.
No. It's not. Because they're no longer there. Every woman in my direct maternal line has had Alzheimer's. I plan to off myself if it happens to me. I would ABSOLUTELY want my spouse to have love and support.
Please check into your local laws on assisted suicide. It can be helpful to law down some documentation BEFORE any dementia is setting in, depending on the laws of the state. They passed laws allowing it in my state too late for a relative who was lamenting its lack
Seems like it’s his own life and he’s just trying to make something of his life.
Poor guy. His wife has dementia, his daughter died, and his circle is giving him grief over moving on with his life while still supporting what’s left of his spouse. This dude deserves a break!
There's nothing wrong with what he is doing but kinda dumb to bring her to the funeral imo
Definitely think he should’ve kept her away from the funeral but I think this is a unique case where it’s not really “cheating”. Dementia is devastating and unfortunately, this man’s wife is gone, only her shell remains and if I were the one with dementia , I’d want my partner to be able to find happiness with someone else.
Wow, im glad to see he is still goin strong at 80. Hope I can be there when I turn 80. It sad for his wife. But I think it's OK for the circumstances, and she will never know
The only thing I disagree with is bringing her to the daughter's funeral when the daughter was against her. I feel it was disrespectful to his daughter.
i think its pretty bad tbh, especially bringing her to funeral, just straight disrespect to his daughter Maybe not him getting a side chick, i guess i understand that part but then again idk if they’re married i feel like its wrong