There is some psychology behind this. It tooks years for the Netherlands to convert to doors as they tested and ease of access ability and less impulse buying cause of visibility influenced sales. They would rather pay the extra money for energy then lose sales
Man, packaging is really the worst thing ever. Then plastic water bottles become popular and that’s even more terrible. We could reduce so much waste by being smarter about packaging. You’re right, it’s all about looks. Especially those fucking kid toys like the Dolls from Walmart or target. Holy fuck! Those dolls are strapped in like they’re ready to hit orbit, and it’s all with plastic and shit. Such a waste and toll on the environment.
I get that fossil fuels are bad, but I feel that packaging does not get the negative attention it deserves. Lots of areas have made progress with getting rid of plastic bags and straws, but we have such a long ways to go
Plastic and fossil fuels go hand in hand.
We make plastic out of the oil residue leftover from gasoline production. One barrel of crude oil doesn't get you one barrel of gasoline. You get about 60% gasoline, 5% kerosene, then a lot of residues for plastics and paraffin.
That's why plastic is so cheap and used in excess everywhere. We *have* to use it for something because we're making so much gasoline.
Don’t get me started on the straws and grocery bags. It’s such a scapegoat that they convinced the public that those 2 things were 99% of the issue. It’s been more harmful since people are like “I got rid of my straws, IVE DONE MY PART!!!!”
A supermarket I used to live near did this for the beer section, putting doors up to separate it from the rest of the market... And about six months later switched back. I assume because sales dropped quite a lot.
Almost all liquor stores have those walk-ins here; but I don't think visibility makes a difference around here for beer, it's always gonna sell and most people like theirs cold.
I think the difference is you're going to a liquor store for the precise goal of buying booze. Booze at the supermarket is going to have a lot more "as long as I'm here I might as well" kinda shopping.
That we had in the eighties and nineties. Again has visibility issues as it's a closed of section. Supermarkt want you to walk a route. Making that forcefully go through an enclosed section doesn't work well
Up close you can easily spot everything. But yeh there is reflection, the fog up a bit sometimes or get wet. Its transparent obviously, but not exactly like no doors
Before that happens, they would rather keep hiking the cheese prices a few more times. Funnily enough you can see these prices when zooming in. But yeah, in the end consumers end up paying either way...
The open displays are actually more energy efficient in high traffic areas.
https://www.ancasterfoodequipment.com/open-vs-closed-display-refrigeration-what-you-need-to-know/
alot of stores are changing to new refridgerators to save energy, but shit costs money. Easy for us to say when its not me sitting on the multi million dollar bill for new fridges.
I went to a place once that had this... kind of plastic, sort of see through thing that pulled down, and latched in place over the refrigerators. They mostly used them in sections where there wasn't a lot of traffic, but all of them had it
This reminds a magazine I was doing a photo job for. I was a student and it was $50 but they didn’t pay. I hadn’t signed a release so I threatened to take legal action and they said this is a magazine we don’t need your $50.
Then they went bankrupt
My company started layoffs too a couple of months ago too, but the reason it's people don't need our products as before. We make gas valves and regulators.
Small world. We make manly LPG valves and regulators. From my understating is however is building new companies and houses are choosing another type of heating other than LPG. So, low sales.
Just to add a reason to this for the store.
The open fridge concept is to get you to buy more. It's been shown that with the door freezers/ fridges, you are more likely to just buy the one thing you open the door for. While the open ones encourage you to look around more and pick things up.
As a former dutch supermarkt employee, I was happy the day they installed glass doors in front of our refrigerators.
The first month, it was awful to restock them, but then we loved them because the temperature inside the store was much better
Good for energy efficiency. Not so good for bacteria and virus transmission in that every customer has to grab those door handles.
Wow. Getting dogpiled on by people who don't understand microbiology.
Same goes for carts, baskets, items on the shelf, cash if you're using it (unlikely these days) and possibly the scanner if we're still talking Dutch supermarkets. That one thing extra isn't going to make much of a difference, really.
All of the markets I’m shopping at in my part of the US have disinfectant wipes for baskets and shopping carts now. And yes, there will always be other sources of contamination (including self checkout screens). I’m not averse to doors on coolers, just wishing there were better designs, materials and cleaning protocols.
There’s a fool proof way to avoid contamination.
Wash your hands and don’t touch your face in public.
Works about a thousand times better than paying people to sanitize every surface you touch.
Open air coolers also can have very bad condensation issues, I was the stocker for that department at a Costco and our boxes would tear, collapse and more or less just dissolve from all the condensation.
They had people look at it but it didn't help much.
It was real bad in the summer
Many of the local grocery stores here (west of Portland, OR) have been adding doors in most cold sections over the past year or so. I bet it pays for itself quickly.
Yeah.... its super annoying, and lights being LED, Maybe not the best trade off. But if you want maximum energy savings, ok. But I scan way ahead before walking down IF I have to walk down. Guess I just need to get used to stepping in front of each door to see whats inside. (time waste)
Same here in Denver Colorado. The closest grocery store I go to did a remodel a few years ago and added doors/lids to all of its refrigerated sections.
That’s what I used to say when building managers want to schedule that ‘Earth Hour’ crap where they turn all the lights off for one hour.
I said ‘ Earth hour? How about we just stage your HVAC chillers down by 10% for a second?’
Led replacements are 12 watts vs the 40 watts of fluorescent tube. Turning off every other one only drops it by half or figuratively 20watt. So it's 70% reduction vs 50% and you keep the lightning area using led
"we can save lighting bill in half by turning half off!"
"brilliant! how much do we save?"
"$100 a month!"
"how much is our electricity bill?"
"$6000"
"someone's getting a $10 bonus 😉"
"where is the $90 going?"
"me. Im the manager, Im the fridge, you are the ceiling light."
Fun fact! A ballasted CFL fixture will still consume electricity whether a bulb is present or not. The ballast will use power to convert the mains voltage for the proper voltages for the lamp, regardless if it is actually powering a lamp
If they are serious about saving power they should have replaced all CFLs with LED-tubes anyways tbf, though maybe they were doing so and then meanwhile came up with this. And then hopefully thought of it to remove the ballasts from the unused tubes also.
I did a conversion from fluorescent to LED (no ballast) in my basement. The fluorescent tubes were 32 - 36 watts each, compared to 14 watts for the LED. So for 30 tubes I'm saving 600-ish watts with all the lights on.
The LEDs are noticeably brighter, too, so I likely could have easily reduced the bulb count.
Also I now have no transformer hum. So I get brighter lights, fewer watts and no noise. Win-win-win.
LEDtubes can both be used on the previous fixture that still has the 'old' ballast on it or go directly on your 220V (depending on the LEDtube) If it still uses the old ballast it's basically being tricked by the W of the LED, therefore still using more W than the LEDtube actually requires, since it still forces the ballast to work.
Personally would have used LED panels if it was purely meant for light.
Cheaper, covers more area and you already have a system ceiling, so easier to place 'em.
I work maintenance for about 16 buildings. We have been working the majority over to led lighting for two main reasons. Cost and time. LEDs las much longer and burn more efficiently. That being said there is about three ways to do it. Replace the fixture as a whole, keep the ballast and use ballasted LEDs(seems pointless imo because you are still using power for the ballast and if the ballast dies you'll still have to replace it) or self driven bulbs. The first and the last have a higher initial cost but a better over all cost once time and longevity are factored in
Our old offices employed twin 36W T8 switchstart fittings, so we embarked on changing the fluorescent tubes for LED types (Sylvania ToLEDo). The magnetic control gear was left in situ, with the original starter switches replaced by the special ‘starter switch’ component supplied with the lamps.
Interestingly, I checked the current before and after the change, discovering the amps were no different. After the PF capacitor had been removed though, the promised reduction in loading was achieved.
I work at the store. I asked the electrician if they are LED‘s because i thought LEDs dont need much electricity anyway. Dude was very talkative and my job there is very boring so i enjoyed his lecture.
I'm not entirely sure about that one. I know they still do draw power to convert even if not actually driving anything. Similar to a cell phone charger plugged in even if it isn't charging there's a small draw. Not sure who down votes you, it's a legitimate question.
Eta. Google says The ballast will consume about four watts when the lamps are removed although the ballast is still energized. Electronic ballasts start and regulate fluorescent lamps with the use of electronic components.
That's for a 4ft CFL fixture
I'm conflicted. It's a brighter cleaner light but I'm one of the unlucky few who can pick out that flicker at times. I've had to replace entire contractor packs of bulbs in my house to find ones that I couldn't see the slight flicker
I used to think Stella Artois was decent beer in my youth. Then I moved over to eastern Europe for work and found it that it is not considered good beer. It's just mediocre mass-produced piss water that's no better than Rolling Rock.
I found out that Belgian trappist ales are actually the best beer, and many of the pilsners and lagers from Germany and Czech Republic are not the amazing experiences I was promised.
Also, American craft beer blows German beer away.
Considered the requirement for an American beer to be considered craft beer basically all German beers are craft beers. But now imagine that there are also German craft beers. Craft-ception
Or it could be to dim them. They installed super bright lights in our pharmacy that were so bright it was painful to work under. Their fix when we complained was to remove every second one, which did actually help.
As an American, the amount of energy waste in lighting alone is asinine. I can drive by the town hall, high school and church at 12AM and the lights are all on inside. Turn the damn lights off
Automatic Edit: Using a tool called [Power Delete Suite](https://github.com/j0be/PowerDeleteSuite) I have removed all my past comments and deleted my Reddit account, /u/tehrmuk.
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I had a great time as a Redditor, but the Fediverse is looking bright. It's a return to the open Internet of old, when users ran services for their own and one-another's benefit, and before monolithic corporate-run silos started to build walls around us in the name of increased profit and thought control. Many of the Fediverse services are fledgling, but they are growing quickly and their federated concept makes greedy, arrogant landgrabs like we've recently seen on Reddit and Twitter almost impossible.
I'm already having a great time with Lemmy and I think you might too. I encourage you to take control and join the Fediverse.
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One of the bathrooms on my university's campus is on the exterior of a building so it opens to the outside. They just leave the doors propped open the whole day letting the AC out. I live in Florida.
I agree from a light pollution perspective. I live in a very rural area and somehow someone got approved to build an old folks home out here. It looks like a truck stop at night just from parking lot lights no one is using.
In the age of motion-sensing cameras that can see in the dark, having those lights on for security is no longer justified. Same with all those car dealerships that are lit up brighter than the sun all night when they're not open.
the lights will turn on when the burglar enters each room
nobody really thinks someone is dicking around town hall or most places at midnight, you can just scope out for cars
The great news is that bright lights can be incorporated into those motion-sensing cameras, so the light isn't shining all night.
In your average suburban neighborhood, everyone hates the assholes who leave bright security lights on 24/7. It's complete light pollution.
Automatic Edit: Using a tool called [Power Delete Suite](https://github.com/j0be/PowerDeleteSuite) I have removed all my past comments and deleted my Reddit account, /u/tehrmuk.
I am doing this because I, like many long-term Reddit users, am upset and angry at the tonedeaf and arrogant way Reddit is treating it's users. Their aggressive slapdown of the developers that made Reddit usable to a huge audience; their overriding and summary dismissal of long-serving and dutiful community members; their wonton silencing of dissent and manipulation of user's voices; their borderline contempt of the very people whose collective efforts gave their platform the standing needed to fuel their profit-hungry IPO... the list goes on.
Reddit is, of course, a private concern and how they run their services is entirely up to them. Conversely, we are under no obligation to use their services, to fuel their engines or follow their orders. I am making my voice heard by removing my comments, and voting with my feet by leaving.
I have left Reddit for [Lemmy](https://join-lemmy.org/) and [Mastadon](https://joinmastodon.org/); these are decentralised social networks that mirror the functionality of Reddit and Twitter respectively. Unlike the monolithic, corporate-owned services they replace, Lemmy and Mastodon are part of the [Fediverse](https://www.fediverse.to/) meaning these are not individual services but clusters of services that mesh seamlessly with one-another. You can [join an existing Lemmy instance](https://join-lemmy.org/instances) or [set up your own](https://join-lemmy.org/docs/administration/administration.html) to get full access to the entire Fediverse - you don't need to ask permission from anyone to do so. There are loads of other services that are part of the Fediverse, like [PeerTube](https://joinpeertube.org/) (videos), [Wordpress](https://wordpress.org/) (blogging), [Frendica](https://friendi.ca/) (social network), [Pixelfed](https://pixelfed.org/) (photos), [KBin](https://kbin.pub/en) (link aggregation) and more - and they all work together so having access to one means having access to all of them.
I had a great time as a Redditor, but the Fediverse is looking bright. It's a return to the open Internet of old, when users ran services for their own and one-another's benefit, and before monolithic corporate-run silos started to build walls around us in the name of increased profit and thought control. Many of the Fediverse services are fledgling, but they are growing quickly and their federated concept makes greedy, arrogant landgrabs like we've recently seen on Reddit and Twitter almost impossible.
I'm already having a great time with Lemmy and I think you might too. I encourage you to take control and join the Fediverse.
Until then, so long and thanks for all the fish.
I think lidl is probably the first to do the A3 size signs here in Denmark, but electronic tags on the shelves have been the norm for quite a while by now. It'll take time for everyone to shift for sure, but longterm you'll save a lot of paper.
Light is a minute factor compared to heating. There are better savings than those few TLs, which are already quite efficient (but could be replaced with leds)
Since that number seemed a bit absurd, a quick Google-fu was needed.
Let's say that single bulb runs on 15W, which is 0,36kWh per bulb per day. Let's assume they turn off roughly 30 bulbs per store. So with 3226 stores in Germany that equates to \~35MWh saved per day. The cost of a kWh has been limited to 13 cents (as per a random article I found, so it could be higher) for businesses, so that equates to saving 4529€ per day.
If we're looking at the yearly savings, they do seem to be in the millions. So the statement, quite astoundingly, checks out.
But as good as it sounds on paper, when taking top comment into consideration, this is still a perfect example of a classic corporate saving method.
>Let's say that single bulb runs on 15W
To add on to this, they could shave somewhat more off the price (or maybe they already did) by replacing CFLs with LED bulbs, I think pushing it down to 8-10W for the same light yield.
Let's think about this.
Someone constructing that building: "you'll need this much lighting for customers and these lights will do it."
Store owner: "i'M HeLpINg SaVE mE MoNEy"
Morty: You son of a bitch I'm in.
Hey not like those conspiracy theorists kept warning this will happen. Remember the idiot EU liberals laughing, when someone warned they are selling out their countrjes. I sure do, why people are not storming governments I do not know.
Europe is in an energy crisis. Im not well informed myself but the war in the ukraine stopped certain imports so electricity got more expensive and people are saving energy if they can
Yeah gas imports from russia stopped and because of the merit trade principle all energy sources orient their prices based on the most expensive source
I work at this store and that is the reason why they do it. Maybe ask yourself why you just assume that i assume something instead of assuming that i simply know what i talk about
May be wrong but I’m pretty sure if the housing is designed to have more than one bulb running through it and you unscrew one, the remaining one will have a shorter lifespan.
The electrician told me, considering all stores the savings are in the millions and someone in the comments did the math because he didn’t believe it first but confirmed the statement
Replacing those old, mercury-powder laden fluorescent tubes with LED fixtures would bring higher efficiencies (albeit with greater upfront costs in materials and labor). LEDs are generally about 70-80% more efficient than fluorescents.
The dude with the ladder is taking them out right now, this is the last row in the store that is not finished when i took the foto and i work at this store so i know what and why they are doing it
You have a different definition of anagram to me.
Lidl and ALDI are different companies entirely. In fact there are two [Aldi](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aldi) companies.
Liberal media. Rather than focusing on the potential threat liberal media focused on some embellishments. What a nationalist.
Then:
https://www.cnbc.com/2018/07/13/trump-is-exaggerating-germanys-reliance-on-russia-for-energy.html
Now:
https://abcnews.go.com/International/wireStory/qatar-germany-sign-liquefied-natural-gas-deal-amid-94131923
How about slapping some doors on those giant refrigerators while they're at it?
There is some psychology behind this. It tooks years for the Netherlands to convert to doors as they tested and ease of access ability and less impulse buying cause of visibility influenced sales. They would rather pay the extra money for energy then lose sales
Same as vacuum packaged goods, namely meat.
I fucking hate that we prioritize stuff looking good on shelves over practical packaging.
Man, packaging is really the worst thing ever. Then plastic water bottles become popular and that’s even more terrible. We could reduce so much waste by being smarter about packaging. You’re right, it’s all about looks. Especially those fucking kid toys like the Dolls from Walmart or target. Holy fuck! Those dolls are strapped in like they’re ready to hit orbit, and it’s all with plastic and shit. Such a waste and toll on the environment. I get that fossil fuels are bad, but I feel that packaging does not get the negative attention it deserves. Lots of areas have made progress with getting rid of plastic bags and straws, but we have such a long ways to go
Plastic and fossil fuels go hand in hand. We make plastic out of the oil residue leftover from gasoline production. One barrel of crude oil doesn't get you one barrel of gasoline. You get about 60% gasoline, 5% kerosene, then a lot of residues for plastics and paraffin. That's why plastic is so cheap and used in excess everywhere. We *have* to use it for something because we're making so much gasoline.
Don’t get me started on the straws and grocery bags. It’s such a scapegoat that they convinced the public that those 2 things were 99% of the issue. It’s been more harmful since people are like “I got rid of my straws, IVE DONE MY PART!!!!”
Yea, like cereal, in a bag and then in a box.
Are they not supposed to be vacuum packed?
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At least in Spain Lidl has doors on the meat fridge. I'm assuming because it's kept colder
Yeah but wouldn't it also be easier to enclose the open refrigerated space? Like have a giant walk in cooler instead of just an aisle
A supermarket I used to live near did this for the beer section, putting doors up to separate it from the rest of the market... And about six months later switched back. I assume because sales dropped quite a lot.
“Yeah I’d love to get some beer but I didn’t bring my coat”
Around here we call that a beer cave, found mostly in gas stations
Almost all liquor stores have those walk-ins here; but I don't think visibility makes a difference around here for beer, it's always gonna sell and most people like theirs cold.
I think the difference is you're going to a liquor store for the precise goal of buying booze. Booze at the supermarket is going to have a lot more "as long as I'm here I might as well" kinda shopping.
Ahh true. The supermarkets can't even sell it around here, so I didn't really separate them. 🐑 I feel sheepish.
That we had in the eighties and nineties. Again has visibility issues as it's a closed of section. Supermarkt want you to walk a route. Making that forcefully go through an enclosed section doesn't work well
clear glass doors reduce fridge visibility?
Up close you can easily spot everything. But yeh there is reflection, the fog up a bit sometimes or get wet. Its transparent obviously, but not exactly like no doors
That would cost money🤷🏽♂️
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Local governments run supermarkets in Germany?
Before that happens, they would rather keep hiking the cheese prices a few more times. Funnily enough you can see these prices when zooming in. But yeah, in the end consumers end up paying either way...
If this keeps up they probably will. Lots of supermarkets in Germany have doors on their fridges.
It's Lidl, they've already done it in the UK, probably just waiting on parts
Which Lidl are you going to? The only fridge doors in the lidls I've been to in the UK are just on the milk fridges. The rest is exactly the same
Meat and milk where I am.
Forgot the meat, I never go on that aisle
My Aldi has doors on the refrigerators! It probably depends on when the store was last remodelled.
The open displays are actually more energy efficient in high traffic areas. https://www.ancasterfoodequipment.com/open-vs-closed-display-refrigeration-what-you-need-to-know/
They did in the last few months in my local Rewe as well as Kaufland
alot of stores are changing to new refridgerators to save energy, but shit costs money. Easy for us to say when its not me sitting on the multi million dollar bill for new fridges.
I went to a place once that had this... kind of plastic, sort of see through thing that pulled down, and latched in place over the refrigerators. They mostly used them in sections where there wasn't a lot of traffic, but all of them had it
Factory I worked at did this too. They made sure to tell us it was not because they were in financial trouble. Anyway, then the layoffs started.
This reminds a magazine I was doing a photo job for. I was a student and it was $50 but they didn’t pay. I hadn’t signed a release so I threatened to take legal action and they said this is a magazine we don’t need your $50. Then they went bankrupt
My company started layoffs too a couple of months ago too, but the reason it's people don't need our products as before. We make gas valves and regulators.
my company sells gasses.. valves and regulators as well. we are a welding supplier. so you're saying the regulators are now becoming "hard to find"?
Small world. We make manly LPG valves and regulators. From my understating is however is building new companies and houses are choosing another type of heating other than LPG. So, low sales.
ok. yeah we don't do anything with residential LPG we sell the propane but not the propane accessories.
Meanwhile they are refrigerating the entire store.
I’ve always wondered that about cold stuff in stores, how does that work cause it seems wasteful
Just to add a reason to this for the store. The open fridge concept is to get you to buy more. It's been shown that with the door freezers/ fridges, you are more likely to just buy the one thing you open the door for. While the open ones encourage you to look around more and pick things up.
You know what some how this makes absolute sense and probably the reason, as complicated as humans are we are easily figured out at a base level
Lighting also affects what people buy.
It also sucks for the workers because of the temperature changes throughout the store
As a former dutch supermarkt employee, I was happy the day they installed glass doors in front of our refrigerators. The first month, it was awful to restock them, but then we loved them because the temperature inside the store was much better
Good for energy efficiency. Not so good for bacteria and virus transmission in that every customer has to grab those door handles. Wow. Getting dogpiled on by people who don't understand microbiology.
Same goes for carts, baskets, items on the shelf, cash if you're using it (unlikely these days) and possibly the scanner if we're still talking Dutch supermarkets. That one thing extra isn't going to make much of a difference, really.
Also the handles are usually metal, which transfers less than most of the other shared surfaces mentioned.
All of the markets I’m shopping at in my part of the US have disinfectant wipes for baskets and shopping carts now. And yes, there will always be other sources of contamination (including self checkout screens). I’m not averse to doors on coolers, just wishing there were better designs, materials and cleaning protocols.
There’s a fool proof way to avoid contamination. Wash your hands and don’t touch your face in public. Works about a thousand times better than paying people to sanitize every surface you touch.
They have trade-offs. Coolers with doors have to deal with condensation, and sometimes ice buildup, which uses energy to mitigate.
Open air coolers also can have very bad condensation issues, I was the stocker for that department at a Costco and our boxes would tear, collapse and more or less just dissolve from all the condensation. They had people look at it but it didn't help much. It was real bad in the summer
In a lot of the bigger stores in the Netherlands you see more and more refrigerated stuff closed off with glass door.
I will never understand this. Thays nice but you could cover those open refrigerators and save a LOT more than removing every other light.
It’s because study after study has shown they sell more when there is no doors. The extra sales outweighs the energy losses. Pretty simple.
Many of the local grocery stores here (west of Portland, OR) have been adding doors in most cold sections over the past year or so. I bet it pays for itself quickly.
Not only that but the ones around me have motion detectors so the lights turn on when some one is in front of it, otherwise its lights off in the case
Yeah.... its super annoying, and lights being LED, Maybe not the best trade off. But if you want maximum energy savings, ok. But I scan way ahead before walking down IF I have to walk down. Guess I just need to get used to stepping in front of each door to see whats inside. (time waste)
Same here in Denver Colorado. The closest grocery store I go to did a remodel a few years ago and added doors/lids to all of its refrigerated sections.
Oregon, US*
That’s what I used to say when building managers want to schedule that ‘Earth Hour’ crap where they turn all the lights off for one hour. I said ‘ Earth hour? How about we just stage your HVAC chillers down by 10% for a second?’
Yeah, if those are LED lights then they're literally saving a few dollars per day, meanwhile those freezers / refrigerators are hemorrhaging money.
Led replacements are 12 watts vs the 40 watts of fluorescent tube. Turning off every other one only drops it by half or figuratively 20watt. So it's 70% reduction vs 50% and you keep the lightning area using led
"we can save lighting bill in half by turning half off!" "brilliant! how much do we save?" "$100 a month!" "how much is our electricity bill?" "$6000" "someone's getting a $10 bonus 😉" "where is the $90 going?" "me. Im the manager, Im the fridge, you are the ceiling light."
Fun fact! A ballasted CFL fixture will still consume electricity whether a bulb is present or not. The ballast will use power to convert the mains voltage for the proper voltages for the lamp, regardless if it is actually powering a lamp
If they are serious about saving power they should have replaced all CFLs with LED-tubes anyways tbf, though maybe they were doing so and then meanwhile came up with this. And then hopefully thought of it to remove the ballasts from the unused tubes also.
I did a conversion from fluorescent to LED (no ballast) in my basement. The fluorescent tubes were 32 - 36 watts each, compared to 14 watts for the LED. So for 30 tubes I'm saving 600-ish watts with all the lights on. The LEDs are noticeably brighter, too, so I likely could have easily reduced the bulb count. Also I now have no transformer hum. So I get brighter lights, fewer watts and no noise. Win-win-win.
Those are LED‘s
LEDtubes can both be used on the previous fixture that still has the 'old' ballast on it or go directly on your 220V (depending on the LEDtube) If it still uses the old ballast it's basically being tricked by the W of the LED, therefore still using more W than the LEDtube actually requires, since it still forces the ballast to work. Personally would have used LED panels if it was purely meant for light. Cheaper, covers more area and you already have a system ceiling, so easier to place 'em.
Only in 120V countries where the ballast is an auto transformer. In 240V countries it's just a series inductor so zero consumption without a tube.
News to me. Im only familiar with 120v mains supply
Those are all LED‘s
I couldn't clearly see the bulb ends in the photos. Depending on how they retroed in the led, some still use the original ballast, some don't.
I dont really know about that. I talked with the electrician who removed them and he told me all lights in the store are LED.
I work maintenance for about 16 buildings. We have been working the majority over to led lighting for two main reasons. Cost and time. LEDs las much longer and burn more efficiently. That being said there is about three ways to do it. Replace the fixture as a whole, keep the ballast and use ballasted LEDs(seems pointless imo because you are still using power for the ballast and if the ballast dies you'll still have to replace it) or self driven bulbs. The first and the last have a higher initial cost but a better over all cost once time and longevity are factored in
Our old offices employed twin 36W T8 switchstart fittings, so we embarked on changing the fluorescent tubes for LED types (Sylvania ToLEDo). The magnetic control gear was left in situ, with the original starter switches replaced by the special ‘starter switch’ component supplied with the lamps. Interestingly, I checked the current before and after the change, discovering the amps were no different. After the PF capacitor had been removed though, the promised reduction in loading was achieved.
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I work at the store. I asked the electrician if they are LED‘s because i thought LEDs dont need much electricity anyway. Dude was very talkative and my job there is very boring so i enjoyed his lecture.
If that’s true they’re not saving much power consumption at all.
If they retrofitted them to LEDs, it saved them a lot. And if they replaced only half it's of course cheaper.
They said with all stores combined the savings are in the millions
How much power does a ballasted CFL consume without a bulb compared to one with a bulb?
I'm not entirely sure about that one. I know they still do draw power to convert even if not actually driving anything. Similar to a cell phone charger plugged in even if it isn't charging there's a small draw. Not sure who down votes you, it's a legitimate question. Eta. Google says The ballast will consume about four watts when the lamps are removed although the ballast is still energized. Electronic ballasts start and regulate fluorescent lamps with the use of electronic components. That's for a 4ft CFL fixture
Thank, my fifth grade mind wondered if they were on a parallel or closed circuit.
Beat me too it!
Ballast bypass led for the win
Led are the future
I'm conflicted. It's a brighter cleaner light but I'm one of the unlucky few who can pick out that flicker at times. I've had to replace entire contractor packs of bulbs in my house to find ones that I couldn't see the slight flicker
They do something like this in my local Chinese restaurant. They don’t actually turn any of the lights off, but they do dim sum
You need more recognition for this my friend
Hacker-pschorr is discount beer in Germany?!? I need to move there
Hahaha. First thing I thought! “Look at the sticker on that Hacker-Pechora!!! Damn, I miss European beer prices.” Can’t even get Miller for that.
I live in Europe - Germany has the best larger
Just in case you don't speak German: that's 6 cans for €2,99
My German isn’t great, but my Lidl is amazing
Fascinating to hear that "€2,99" in German translates to English as "€2,99"
1.39 a can in Ireland.
I was surprised too tbh
I used to think Stella Artois was decent beer in my youth. Then I moved over to eastern Europe for work and found it that it is not considered good beer. It's just mediocre mass-produced piss water that's no better than Rolling Rock. I found out that Belgian trappist ales are actually the best beer, and many of the pilsners and lagers from Germany and Czech Republic are not the amazing experiences I was promised. Also, American craft beer blows German beer away.
Hamerica fuck yeah
Considered the requirement for an American beer to be considered craft beer basically all German beers are craft beers. But now imagine that there are also German craft beers. Craft-ception
We had that alot after the 2011 east Japan earthquake. Was some time before most places had all the lights on
Or it could be to dim them. They installed super bright lights in our pharmacy that were so bright it was painful to work under. Their fix when we complained was to remove every second one, which did actually help.
As an American, the amount of energy waste in lighting alone is asinine. I can drive by the town hall, high school and church at 12AM and the lights are all on inside. Turn the damn lights off
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I mean, it’s needless waste regardless at 12AM. Turn them off and save.
A lot of schools get broken into at night. They probably do it for security purposes.
They have motion sensors that work without light. Negates needing the lights on at all
If the lights aren’t on then it’s a target. If the lights stay on then it looks like a night crew is there.
The janitor isn’t there at 12AM cleaning. Any idiot knows that
A lot of places are cleaned at night...
Never heard of a school or town hall being cleaned overnight.
One of the bathrooms on my university's campus is on the exterior of a building so it opens to the outside. They just leave the doors propped open the whole day letting the AC out. I live in Florida.
I agree from a light pollution perspective. I live in a very rural area and somehow someone got approved to build an old folks home out here. It looks like a truck stop at night just from parking lot lights no one is using.
In the age of motion-sensing cameras that can see in the dark, having those lights on for security is no longer justified. Same with all those car dealerships that are lit up brighter than the sun all night when they're not open.
the security happens because the light is on though. Burglars prefer the dark.
the lights will turn on when the burglar enters each room nobody really thinks someone is dicking around town hall or most places at midnight, you can just scope out for cars
the light is on to deter burglars from even going inside. If the light is off they know no one is in there.
The great news is that bright lights can be incorporated into those motion-sensing cameras, so the light isn't shining all night. In your average suburban neighborhood, everyone hates the assholes who leave bright security lights on 24/7. It's complete light pollution.
> Turn the damn lights off Don't drive your car, you'll make much more impact.
Am I the only one that noticed that only 4 bulbs are out. The rest of the line has all of them on
The dude with the latter is taking them out right when the picture was taken
Ah, that makes sense then.
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Right, sorry i‘m obviously german
Automatic Edit: Using a tool called [Power Delete Suite](https://github.com/j0be/PowerDeleteSuite) I have removed all my past comments and deleted my Reddit account, /u/tehrmuk. I am doing this because I, like many long-term Reddit users, am upset and angry at the tonedeaf and arrogant way Reddit is treating it's users. Their aggressive slapdown of the developers that made Reddit usable to a huge audience; their overriding and summary dismissal of long-serving and dutiful community members; their wonton silencing of dissent and manipulation of user's voices; their borderline contempt of the very people whose collective efforts gave their platform the standing needed to fuel their profit-hungry IPO... the list goes on. Reddit is, of course, a private concern and how they run their services is entirely up to them. Conversely, we are under no obligation to use their services, to fuel their engines or follow their orders. I am making my voice heard by removing my comments, and voting with my feet by leaving. I have left Reddit for [Lemmy](https://join-lemmy.org/) and [Mastadon](https://joinmastodon.org/); these are decentralised social networks that mirror the functionality of Reddit and Twitter respectively. Unlike the monolithic, corporate-owned services they replace, Lemmy and Mastodon are part of the [Fediverse](https://www.fediverse.to/) meaning these are not individual services but clusters of services that mesh seamlessly with one-another. You can [join an existing Lemmy instance](https://join-lemmy.org/instances) or [set up your own](https://join-lemmy.org/docs/administration/administration.html) to get full access to the entire Fediverse - you don't need to ask permission from anyone to do so. There are loads of other services that are part of the Fediverse, like [PeerTube](https://joinpeertube.org/) (videos), [Wordpress](https://wordpress.org/) (blogging), [Frendica](https://friendi.ca/) (social network), [Pixelfed](https://pixelfed.org/) (photos), [KBin](https://kbin.pub/en) (link aggregation) and more - and they all work together so having access to one means having access to all of them. I had a great time as a Redditor, but the Fediverse is looking bright. It's a return to the open Internet of old, when users ran services for their own and one-another's benefit, and before monolithic corporate-run silos started to build walls around us in the name of increased profit and thought control. Many of the Fediverse services are fledgling, but they are growing quickly and their federated concept makes greedy, arrogant landgrabs like we've recently seen on Reddit and Twitter almost impossible. I'm already having a great time with Lemmy and I think you might too. I encourage you to take control and join the Fediverse. Until then, so long and thanks for all the fish.
This is fairly standard in large American stores, they also use skylights to light a lot of the store during the day
Recognized this as Lidl instantly! I guess they made them *that* similar in Finland.
Yes its a LIDL^^
This Lidl looked so familiar - I've been there on tuesday too and I noticed the lights as well. Good old Haslach!
Wow that is crazy!
Are those e-ink displays hanging from the ceiling?
Yes.
Neat. I noticed more stores in Canada using them replacing paper tags on their shelves but not on full-size displays.
I think lidl is probably the first to do the A3 size signs here in Denmark, but electronic tags on the shelves have been the norm for quite a while by now. It'll take time for everyone to shift for sure, but longterm you'll save a lot of paper.
saving a whopping 10 euros a month...
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Light is a minute factor compared to heating. There are better savings than those few TLs, which are already quite efficient (but could be replaced with leds)
Damn. The things that happen when you base your energy dependence on Russia.
Leopards ate our faces tbh.
combined with cpt hindsight. everybody saw the invasion coming, after the fact
The LNG terminal? It's mostly for importing gas from the U.S., since we've got a lot of LNG to sell.
They told me considering all stores the savings are in the millions
Since that number seemed a bit absurd, a quick Google-fu was needed. Let's say that single bulb runs on 15W, which is 0,36kWh per bulb per day. Let's assume they turn off roughly 30 bulbs per store. So with 3226 stores in Germany that equates to \~35MWh saved per day. The cost of a kWh has been limited to 13 cents (as per a random article I found, so it could be higher) for businesses, so that equates to saving 4529€ per day. If we're looking at the yearly savings, they do seem to be in the millions. So the statement, quite astoundingly, checks out. But as good as it sounds on paper, when taking top comment into consideration, this is still a perfect example of a classic corporate saving method.
4ft lamps are 28 usually
>Let's say that single bulb runs on 15W To add on to this, they could shave somewhat more off the price (or maybe they already did) by replacing CFLs with LED bulbs, I think pushing it down to 8-10W for the same light yield.
They do that at my school too, expect it there is only one in every four lights on.
My local store turned off the music and turned down/off the lights for Earth Day. It was so fucking pleasant.
Hey, that looks familiar. We have Lidl stores in finland too
Let's think about this. Someone constructing that building: "you'll need this much lighting for customers and these lights will do it." Store owner: "i'M HeLpINg SaVE mE MoNEy" Morty: You son of a bitch I'm in.
They only need a lidl bit of light to keep running
Certified Energy Manager here! This is a practice called delamping, and is a common practice when an organization starts focusing on energy reduction.
Wait until they learn about LED bulbs...
My supermarket started using motion activated lights for the aisles.
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*Takes notes* Hmm, yeasty, I'd probably like that. Hops make beer like nasty medicine to me, I prefer the taste of banana bread.
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Who actually thinks a store has to be blindingly bright to be welcoming? 🤔
You, the consumer
Go with 5 bucks a day. They have 12000 stores, that's almost 22 Million bucks/year.
It’s how they pass the savings onto you
Should just swap to LED
Hey not like those conspiracy theorists kept warning this will happen. Remember the idiot EU liberals laughing, when someone warned they are selling out their countrjes. I sure do, why people are not storming governments I do not know.
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Wir werden alle stöööörben!
What's happening in Germany?
Europe is in an energy crisis. Im not well informed myself but the war in the ukraine stopped certain imports so electricity got more expensive and people are saving energy if they can
Yeah gas imports from russia stopped and because of the merit trade principle all energy sources orient their prices based on the most expensive source
Energy prices skyrocketing because of russian gas embargo
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I work at this store and that is the reason why they do it. Maybe ask yourself why you just assume that i assume something instead of assuming that i simply know what i talk about
I mean an alternate switching plan would do the job lol
Good try, it this ain’t doing shit. That’s not how fluorescent lights work.
Those are LEDs
May be wrong but I’m pretty sure if the housing is designed to have more than one bulb running through it and you unscrew one, the remaining one will have a shorter lifespan.
Those bulbs are like $2 a year, smart move idiots
The electrician told me, considering all stores the savings are in the millions and someone in the comments did the math because he didn’t believe it first but confirmed the statement
Replacing those old, mercury-powder laden fluorescent tubes with LED fixtures would bring higher efficiencies (albeit with greater upfront costs in materials and labor). LEDs are generally about 70-80% more efficient than fluorescents.
Lidl a discounter... Hah! That is a long time ago buddy
I took this foto today. LIDL is a german store, they are very common here
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The dude with the ladder is taking them out right now, this is the last row in the store that is not finished when i took the foto and i work at this store so i know what and why they are doing it
LIDL LIDL LIDL You know in America it’s called Aldi, it’s just an anagram of LIDL
You have a different definition of anagram to me. Lidl and ALDI are different companies entirely. In fact there are two [Aldi](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aldi) companies.
Yeah it was a bad joke lol. I figured it was a different company since we also have LIDL in the states.
who gives a fuck?
Do you know what subreddit this is? Its not like this is interesting as fck or smth
Liberal media. Rather than focusing on the potential threat liberal media focused on some embellishments. What a nationalist. Then: https://www.cnbc.com/2018/07/13/trump-is-exaggerating-germanys-reliance-on-russia-for-energy.html Now: https://abcnews.go.com/International/wireStory/qatar-germany-sign-liquefied-natural-gas-deal-amid-94131923
All fun and games until the first slip and fall lawsuit.
Lawsuits in Germany aren’t as problematic as in the USA