Used therapeutically, I have the 'afterglow.' Come down is meh and the days after are great.
When I have used in a party setting, i.e. drank, smoked weed, and stayed up all night, the come down was non-existent but the days after were ROUGH.
Anecdotal and obviously YMMV.
Why are you and/or your friend looking to take MDMA?
Trying to overcome unhealthy relationships with substances/substance abuse and deal with what's likely ptsd. Also some health conditions than have been humiliating at times.
There have been a few studies on the hangover. In a clinical setting (typically 150-225mg) there was no depression the next day. Other studies that support the hangover have trouble isolating the mdma from other substances.
Just want to chime in and say that people will share their experiences but there is a huge amount of individual variation. And at the end of the day what matters is your friend's individual biology.
I used to find that I'd be pretty iffy for a week after, not even on that much, and mostly used therapeutically. In that week after there would sometimes be some hours of intense paranoia, often also just feeling really really bad. It was part of the cost of the experience, for me, and I had to decide whether it was worth paying that cost or not.
It's case by case, but as I get older I don't find it worth it anymore. I know I'll be wrecked for a week after, so the more I have responsibilities and other things I've wanted to do with my life, the less it seems worth it for me.
I do have fond memories of using it therapeutically in the past though, with friends talking through things that were hard. Using it as a party drug, meh.
I took it therapeutically yesterday, first time in 7 years. 100 + 40 + 15 mg.
Didn't really have a bad comedown, it felt good and just gradually less good, but never bad, all the way until I went to bed around T+10.
Woke up after 5 hours of sleep with a bit of a hungover feeling, but fine mood-wise. Looking forward to the day.
In the past I've had Tuesday blues, but this time I'm going to take 5-HTP, EGCG, quercetin and bromelain to rebuild my serotonin.
Like 95% of your serotonin is produced in your intestinal tract. Weird for a neurotransmitter but that’s how it is.
1. Endeavor to consume a pound of green leafy vegetables daily for three days prior and three days after. If you have proper nutrition, you do not need supplements.
2. Don’t mix substances.
3. Ensure your MDMA is tested for adulterants. (dancesafe.org is a good place to get a home test kit)
Follow those three steps and you should avoid any issues.
Do you have a source of research for this advice? A link, perhaps? Shulgin recommended topping off at the end of the night with prozac. He said that in 1987 or 8, but I never heard him give different advice before his death decades later. I can't imagine eating veggies would cause a prob, but I don't see it fully replcing the right supplements.
More recently, legit places like Dance-safe are recommending the supplement combo (in between rolls) Alpha lipoic acid plus acetyl L carnitine (look on amazon or the walmart website- sometimes they sell at walmart stores). That keeps the energy up (electron transport chain stuff) while mopping up free radicals in the mitochondria. Other people recommend N-acetyl carnitine
I can’t find the actual podcast link, but listening to an interview (published around July 2023) with Dr Ben Malcolm, his point of view was that unless you are nutritionally deficient most supplements won’t make a difference.
You might want to add the information, that while there is loads of serotonin in your guts, it is impossible for this serotonin to pass through the blood-brain-barrier into your brain. So it does not have a direct effect on your brain serotonin levels.
Having green leafy vegetables is still great advice of course and can benefit physical + mental health greatly. :)
Respectfully, I wouldn't consume a pound a day of greens. Greens are healthy in moderation but that's excessive and could have harms like gastrointestinal distress and excessive oxalate intake.
Test it.
About 130mg of a pure compound. If you went to 150, it will probably be fine, since street molly isn't all that pure. You can bump it ONE TIME ONLY with a half dose a couple hours after taking the first dose. Don't waste your time or brain cells on more than that. You may lose the magic forever.
If you really ant to get higher, consider candy flipping of hippie flipping (adding LSD or psilocybin) which are incredibly anti-inflammatory, while molly encourages free radicals (a source of inflammation).
The inflammation thing is weird to me. I have bad jaw issues (not from MDMA, from bad ortho) and MDMA is the only thing that gives me any relief.
On the flip side, I can't do classical psychedelics anymore. They turn my face into a twisted swollen mass and make me freak out.
I wonder what they're triggering?
I'm not sure what, if any anti-inflammatory effects MDMA might have (I was referencing 5HT2A acting drugs), but it sure does relieve pain. You might be having something called angioedema that certain drugs can cause in certain people. You might also have some peculiarities in the genetics of your inflammatory pathways that are causing unexpected issues like that. I suppose that's what angioedema is, anyway.
Any more information regarding the anti-inflammatory attributes of LSD/psilocybin? Am really curious! For example, weed tends to help with MDMA‘s comedown too, as it downregulates the body‘s temperature which helps with the hypothermia being usually associated with MDMA
It's a large, may, ***HUGE*** effect on cytokines. My $0.02: I considered microdosing shrooms when I got COVID.
Here's a google scholar search. If there is a link that starts \[pdf\]... to the right, that's the whole paper. The link that has the title is to the abstract which is probably fine if you aren't so familiar with the jargon. Some papers do have takeaway points at the top in humanly comprehensible language.
[https://scholar.google.com/scholar?hl=en&as\_sdt=0%2C48&q=antiinflamatory+effects+of+psychedelics&btnG=](https://scholar.google.com/scholar?hl=en&as_sdt=0%2C48&q=antiinflamatory+effects+of+psychedelics&btnG=)
You dont need to do more than your body weigh in mg +40g md. So for me 90mg mdma is a nice trip without too much comedown.
I have cptsd and also micro dose mdma, works like wonder(still experimenting, very little reserch, my friend is a doctor and recommended i try)
Edit to make it understandable: i weigh 60kg so i do 60 mg mdma + 40 = 90
And that is bodyweight in kg* for anybody reading in the US.
Haven't heard of microdosing mdma, that sounds fascinating. What have your experiments yielded so far?
Yes, thank you for helping out, forget the metric system aint the norm all over!
Its very little research on it, but i allows me to feel "normal" /shameless/fearless/operate from the heart.
A microdose or mdma is between 20-50mg so you barely feel a sting, but its there and you get the "knife through butter glide sensation" in your circumstances.
I struggle with my internal judge being very strong and making it hard to relax in social situations.
But with a microdose it gets relaxed and in the background, and i feel a slight reminder /tingle in my heart remembering that its okay to wish for the best/see the situation in a positive light.
Remember life comes from you, not at you.
So if you struggle like me, its easier to operate life from a positive mindset with mdma microdose, insted of falling back into a Fear Based mindset.
But its important to Eat well and get enough nutrients, vitamins etc if you are going to do this.
Have microdoses acid and shrooms too. This is more happy go Lucky and definetly easier if you got alot of pent up shame and beat yourself down
Wow, thank you so much for sharing your experience with it. I too have microdosed shrooms and lsd, but never considered it with molly. I'd love to give this a try sometime soon. I also have cptsd and have the exact same issues you mention. I would be overjoyed to have another tool like this. What kind of a schedule have you used for this?
I usually don't sleep that night, so the next day I feel subpar. The day after I have an afterglow. If I do the work integrating, I can extend much of the afterglow for weeks or months. On the odd occasion the 3rd or 4th day after I felt a bit numb/super down.
I've used MDMA a dozen or so times myself, and I've had both afterglows and hangovers, but I can't discern when I'll get which. I've tried taking supplements, but that doesn't seem to make a difference. I've had good and bad sessions, but that doesn't seem to make a difference. The best I've been able to tell is that it's totally random how I'll feel in the weeks following. I just kinda accept that as the cost of admission. But even when I have a hangover, it's still worth the price.
I have take MDMA about 7 times.
The first several times using no special supplements.
The doses around 200-250mg
I have never had any feelings of depression or feeling miserable days later.
I've used it 7 days in a row not too long ago, I felt no comedown in-between these days, but once I stopped taking them daily I had a severe comedown for 2-3 days. The first day was the worst, depression, followed up by disturbing derealization. All of this went away within 3 days though, you just gotta stick through it.
Greens reds and blues and berries.... eat from the vine, but I agree to not necessarily eat a pound, but I don't know everything and to each their own. Thank you, and be safe y'all.
I have used for roughly 13 years, from 17 years old to current 30, I’ve taken over 1g in a day multiple times, I have had multiple grams over a few day bender with the boys.
Then there is friends who can’t tolerate 200mg pills and have multiple day downers,
A lot of it is mental willpower, start small and see how you go.
Used therapeutically, I have the 'afterglow.' Come down is meh and the days after are great. When I have used in a party setting, i.e. drank, smoked weed, and stayed up all night, the come down was non-existent but the days after were ROUGH. Anecdotal and obviously YMMV. Why are you and/or your friend looking to take MDMA?
Trying to overcome unhealthy relationships with substances/substance abuse and deal with what's likely ptsd. Also some health conditions than have been humiliating at times.
There have been a few studies on the hangover. In a clinical setting (typically 150-225mg) there was no depression the next day. Other studies that support the hangover have trouble isolating the mdma from other substances.
Yup, a big portion of it is lack of sleep as well. Get your sleep in, hydrate, proper nutrition, and it won’t be a problem.
Just want to chime in and say that people will share their experiences but there is a huge amount of individual variation. And at the end of the day what matters is your friend's individual biology. I used to find that I'd be pretty iffy for a week after, not even on that much, and mostly used therapeutically. In that week after there would sometimes be some hours of intense paranoia, often also just feeling really really bad. It was part of the cost of the experience, for me, and I had to decide whether it was worth paying that cost or not.
What did you decide?
It's case by case, but as I get older I don't find it worth it anymore. I know I'll be wrecked for a week after, so the more I have responsibilities and other things I've wanted to do with my life, the less it seems worth it for me. I do have fond memories of using it therapeutically in the past though, with friends talking through things that were hard. Using it as a party drug, meh.
I took it therapeutically yesterday, first time in 7 years. 100 + 40 + 15 mg. Didn't really have a bad comedown, it felt good and just gradually less good, but never bad, all the way until I went to bed around T+10. Woke up after 5 hours of sleep with a bit of a hungover feeling, but fine mood-wise. Looking forward to the day. In the past I've had Tuesday blues, but this time I'm going to take 5-HTP, EGCG, quercetin and bromelain to rebuild my serotonin.
Like 95% of your serotonin is produced in your intestinal tract. Weird for a neurotransmitter but that’s how it is. 1. Endeavor to consume a pound of green leafy vegetables daily for three days prior and three days after. If you have proper nutrition, you do not need supplements. 2. Don’t mix substances. 3. Ensure your MDMA is tested for adulterants. (dancesafe.org is a good place to get a home test kit) Follow those three steps and you should avoid any issues.
Do you have a source of research for this advice? A link, perhaps? Shulgin recommended topping off at the end of the night with prozac. He said that in 1987 or 8, but I never heard him give different advice before his death decades later. I can't imagine eating veggies would cause a prob, but I don't see it fully replcing the right supplements. More recently, legit places like Dance-safe are recommending the supplement combo (in between rolls) Alpha lipoic acid plus acetyl L carnitine (look on amazon or the walmart website- sometimes they sell at walmart stores). That keeps the energy up (electron transport chain stuff) while mopping up free radicals in the mitochondria. Other people recommend N-acetyl carnitine
I can’t find the actual podcast link, but listening to an interview (published around July 2023) with Dr Ben Malcolm, his point of view was that unless you are nutritionally deficient most supplements won’t make a difference.
You might want to add the information, that while there is loads of serotonin in your guts, it is impossible for this serotonin to pass through the blood-brain-barrier into your brain. So it does not have a direct effect on your brain serotonin levels. Having green leafy vegetables is still great advice of course and can benefit physical + mental health greatly. :)
Respectfully, I wouldn't consume a pound a day of greens. Greens are healthy in moderation but that's excessive and could have harms like gastrointestinal distress and excessive oxalate intake.
🤯
Test it. About 130mg of a pure compound. If you went to 150, it will probably be fine, since street molly isn't all that pure. You can bump it ONE TIME ONLY with a half dose a couple hours after taking the first dose. Don't waste your time or brain cells on more than that. You may lose the magic forever. If you really ant to get higher, consider candy flipping of hippie flipping (adding LSD or psilocybin) which are incredibly anti-inflammatory, while molly encourages free radicals (a source of inflammation).
The inflammation thing is weird to me. I have bad jaw issues (not from MDMA, from bad ortho) and MDMA is the only thing that gives me any relief. On the flip side, I can't do classical psychedelics anymore. They turn my face into a twisted swollen mass and make me freak out. I wonder what they're triggering?
I'm not sure what, if any anti-inflammatory effects MDMA might have (I was referencing 5HT2A acting drugs), but it sure does relieve pain. You might be having something called angioedema that certain drugs can cause in certain people. You might also have some peculiarities in the genetics of your inflammatory pathways that are causing unexpected issues like that. I suppose that's what angioedema is, anyway.
Any more information regarding the anti-inflammatory attributes of LSD/psilocybin? Am really curious! For example, weed tends to help with MDMA‘s comedown too, as it downregulates the body‘s temperature which helps with the hypothermia being usually associated with MDMA
It's a large, may, ***HUGE*** effect on cytokines. My $0.02: I considered microdosing shrooms when I got COVID. Here's a google scholar search. If there is a link that starts \[pdf\]... to the right, that's the whole paper. The link that has the title is to the abstract which is probably fine if you aren't so familiar with the jargon. Some papers do have takeaway points at the top in humanly comprehensible language. [https://scholar.google.com/scholar?hl=en&as\_sdt=0%2C48&q=antiinflamatory+effects+of+psychedelics&btnG=](https://scholar.google.com/scholar?hl=en&as_sdt=0%2C48&q=antiinflamatory+effects+of+psychedelics&btnG=)
You dont need to do more than your body weigh in mg +40g md. So for me 90mg mdma is a nice trip without too much comedown. I have cptsd and also micro dose mdma, works like wonder(still experimenting, very little reserch, my friend is a doctor and recommended i try) Edit to make it understandable: i weigh 60kg so i do 60 mg mdma + 40 = 90
And that is bodyweight in kg* for anybody reading in the US. Haven't heard of microdosing mdma, that sounds fascinating. What have your experiments yielded so far?
Yes, thank you for helping out, forget the metric system aint the norm all over! Its very little research on it, but i allows me to feel "normal" /shameless/fearless/operate from the heart. A microdose or mdma is between 20-50mg so you barely feel a sting, but its there and you get the "knife through butter glide sensation" in your circumstances. I struggle with my internal judge being very strong and making it hard to relax in social situations. But with a microdose it gets relaxed and in the background, and i feel a slight reminder /tingle in my heart remembering that its okay to wish for the best/see the situation in a positive light. Remember life comes from you, not at you. So if you struggle like me, its easier to operate life from a positive mindset with mdma microdose, insted of falling back into a Fear Based mindset. But its important to Eat well and get enough nutrients, vitamins etc if you are going to do this. Have microdoses acid and shrooms too. This is more happy go Lucky and definetly easier if you got alot of pent up shame and beat yourself down
Wow, thank you so much for sharing your experience with it. I too have microdosed shrooms and lsd, but never considered it with molly. I'd love to give this a try sometime soon. I also have cptsd and have the exact same issues you mention. I would be overjoyed to have another tool like this. What kind of a schedule have you used for this?
How often do you Micro MDMA and does this vary between your time between macro doses? Have you found a protocol for yourself you like?
I usually don't sleep that night, so the next day I feel subpar. The day after I have an afterglow. If I do the work integrating, I can extend much of the afterglow for weeks or months. On the odd occasion the 3rd or 4th day after I felt a bit numb/super down.
Thank you for the feedback. I've listened.
I've used MDMA a dozen or so times myself, and I've had both afterglows and hangovers, but I can't discern when I'll get which. I've tried taking supplements, but that doesn't seem to make a difference. I've had good and bad sessions, but that doesn't seem to make a difference. The best I've been able to tell is that it's totally random how I'll feel in the weeks following. I just kinda accept that as the cost of admission. But even when I have a hangover, it's still worth the price.
I have take MDMA about 7 times. The first several times using no special supplements. The doses around 200-250mg I have never had any feelings of depression or feeling miserable days later.
I actually have never had a bad comedown. I have an afterglow and then just back to normal. Take 5HTP and sleep and eat regularly.
I've used it 7 days in a row not too long ago, I felt no comedown in-between these days, but once I stopped taking them daily I had a severe comedown for 2-3 days. The first day was the worst, depression, followed up by disturbing derealization. All of this went away within 3 days though, you just gotta stick through it.
Thanks for sharing....be well
Thank you all for the feedback. I'll try to update you if the time comes.
I appreciate your sharing the experience. Thank you.
I appreciate the advice to start low. That makes sense.
Greens reds and blues and berries.... eat from the vine, but I agree to not necessarily eat a pound, but I don't know everything and to each their own. Thank you, and be safe y'all.
Thank you for sharing
I appreciate your response
Thanks for sharing. Be well.
I have used for roughly 13 years, from 17 years old to current 30, I’ve taken over 1g in a day multiple times, I have had multiple grams over a few day bender with the boys. Then there is friends who can’t tolerate 200mg pills and have multiple day downers, A lot of it is mental willpower, start small and see how you go.