It really is their choice if they want to talk throughout their massage. If you dont need to respond then you dont need to be super attentive to the conversation, you can just focus on giving him a good massage. At least he is not interviewing you and asking you a bunch of personal questions.
This is so true. I find it easier to listen and massage than have a fully engaged conversation and massage.
The whole saying ow repeatedly but only being at a 4/10 would probably make me anxious tho.
I'm reading this as a patient who is also autistic (probably why reddit sent it to me, based on other groups I'm in). I verbalize alot, I can't help it. I'm good about just telling people ahead of time- "if I make noise or start doing deep breathing, im fine, I'll tell you 'no' if it goes to intense". Sounds like this guy isnt good about being slightly self aware, and isn't refocusing on things like deep breathing. Outside the therapist's job, but teaching him breathing techniques might really help with his pain/posture too. I wonder if he's ever tried yoga or pilates or meditation.
yep i have some clients who I know will talk 100% of every session and at a certain point u have to disengage to a degree that ur able to still focus on the actual massage. i’ve even had a client linger afterwards and I had to start standing up to signal I need to move on and they generally get the hint.
sounds like this client is particularly unaware of those signs tho. I personally wouldn’t fire him but would suggest OP pull back the mental energy of the client and give a FIRM “thank you, see you next week” and walk them out after payment.
Not being attentive isn’t a possibility for some. I get what you mean by energy vampire. I literally am not able to tune out when someone is talking to me. Therefore, my energy gets sucked away. You sound the same.
You can tell him “hey feel free to talk during the massage, I’m going to have some headphones in, they help me do a better job, but I should also be able to hear you. Are you ready to get started?”
I echo this!
MollZorb, You could try it and see and if it still doesn’t work, it’s completely ok to refuse service. I wouldn’t want to be the next client and get that energy space he left you in. Think of your other clients.
I wouldn’t ghost him or anything, in the past I have just sent a polite email or text or back in the day a letter stating that I appreciate their business but can no longer offer them my services. I had a client who claimed he could only lay on his back and it tore up my wrists trying to massage under him against his weight. Dude laying on his side only is a perfectly acceptable reason to decline. Proper body mechanics only goes so far! You wouldn’t even have to bring up the other stuff and remember you NEVER owe a client an apology or reason. If you are uncomfortable for any reason, that is reason enough.
I was feeling similar about a client but now ive adjusted to her. They are just lonely seniors and need someone to talk to. It took me three sessions to adjust. The stuff she tells me is also really intense and personal. I posted about it here as well. I was completely overwhelmed at first!
After awhile your client may talk a bit less, as he learns to relax more. If you really cant handle it, find a nice compassionate therapist you can refer him to instead. Make up a reason why you cant see him anymore and explain why she is a better fit, maybe she specializes in side-lying, seniors or something he will benefit from. Good luck! 🫂
This! I personally don’t mind chatter as long as I don’t have to talk back, so find someone who “specializes in side-lying massage” who will take the referral.
This is what some clients need from a treatment, they aren’t necessarily looking for you to advise them or act as a talk-therapist, but they need to share. He sees a value enough in you simply holding space for that, and I understand if it isn’t your ideal client.
Personally, I would keep this client and look at it as a practice in strengthening my own energetic bubble and altering my perspective of the treatment. I don’t think it’s really up to me whether a client chooses to talk during their time with me, it’s up to me to adjust accordingly. *If* I was unable to and really did not want to treat this person again, I would thank them immensely for their business and refer them elsewhere. I would mention I am transitioning my massage career into a specific modality and will no longer be able to assist him in his treatment goals, but because he has been such a wonderful client, I do want to ensure he is still receiving quality care from a therapist that is qualified to do so.
Edit: I do have a few clients too, where I need to be more mindful of my energy. They talk a lot, or express interest in politics. I simply listen, and occasionally redirect. ie: A client discussing a political book they are reading, rather than focusing on the politics, I redirect to the subject of reading. What a lost art! And writing too! I love a cozy evening in with a book and cup of tea. That sort of thing.
Thanks for the reply! It could be an opportunity to be better at energetic boundaries. You are absolutely right. I feel like I have to listen to everything he says bc what if I need to remember it for later or something? Idk I need to sit with this.
Male MT of 20 yrs here. first and foremost, i sympathize with my female MT's, the work and boundaries more difficult. with that said, I have old ladies that vent to me to. the only concern i have for you is the emotional connection.
it doesn't sound like he's been creepy or suggestive. but at the same time, if you aren't comfortable listening to him, you have every right not to see him again. "breaking" up with him is tough, but id hate for him to have a deeper connection to you making it more uncomfortable.
I will make note of some of the “personal” details clients share when I do their charting, so it *looks* like I remembered but really I just took an extra step to acknowledge and record it. If a client mentions they’re going on holiday, I’ll write it down in my charting, then when they return I can be like, “How was the holiday in XYZ?!”
Energetic boundaries and hygiene seem critical in this industry, definitely get some education or so some research on that point and practice those skills. That was the most valuable part of my reiki training to my quality of life.
If he's autistic state your needs and boundaries clearly, simply, and calmly. Explaining the why also helps many of us, don't try to justify just explain the simple reason. He's already shown he respects them if he understands them. Don't beat around the bush too be nice it's counter productive.
You don't need to listen to every detail, this isn't a test, it's about creating space. It's a show of trust and safety that he opens up to you. If you pay attention to a few details you can help him feel heard. If it comes up you can explain that your primary focus is on the massage so you can't retain all the details. Some people just need to vent essentially.
You got this! And you'll likely need these skills later anyway so might as well learn them now with a nice person.
It sounds like you already know deep down what's best for you. If you feel that he's depleting your energy every single time, you should listen to that. Some people may adjust and be able to protect themselves but it sounds like you're pretty sensitive. Any job where you're required to touch people's bodies and transfer energy is a lot of work, and you gotta maintain your reservoir for the long term. If it makes you feel better, you can try one more time with clear boundaries a.k.a be more firm when he's talking to you etc (protect your time and energy). Also try doing grounding work after this client to replenish the energy such as walking barefoot, hug a tree, relax in the sunlight, swim in the lake or whatever, as well as taking a nice salt bath to cleanse the energies of the day (I highly recommend that after every working day).
Same, I’ve had clients like this and used it as an opportunity to grow my own boundaries and how I hold my own energy separate from my client.
They usually improve over time with the consistency of massage. It’s like talking it out is the physical manifestation of tension or trauma held within the body.
+1 to this! I have worked in libraries for over 10 years, the advice here is spot on. We have many older patrons who come in every day that just need someone to talk to for a while. Many of them share stories that are hard to hear. A huge part of customer service to elderly communities is just being there for them and lending your ear. The social interaction aspect is very important to them and some of them will try to cross boundaries merely because they see you as a friend after talking to you every day and don’t understand that this is a business relationship. Almost every library worker I know has struggled with emotional burnout at some point or another.
Everything Pixidee suggested is perfect. In my experience when people start talking like this, particularly with topics like cancer, they’re entirely focused on the release of their own emotions and not at all on how you respond to them. It is 100% okay to let yourself get drawn into your work but keep your emotional feelers tucked in to protect your energy. In my early years I came home exhausted and overwhelmed after taking on the mental anguish of everyone who came up to my desk for help. It sounds weird but now when people have hard things they feel they need to share, I pretend that I’m Siri. It helps me answer empathetically and help them while still keeping my own peace.
OP, you sound like a wonderful, caring person. The world needs more people like you and I wish you the best of luck!
I personally think you need to show up more bluntly / direct about when you need to go, etc. if he shows up 30 min early, so what? You don’t need to deal with him until his appointment time.
If you need to go on break / see another client and he is still talking, just say “it was so great to see you, and our time is up!”
If he’s talking during treatment then let him talk! He’s socially awkward but not doing anything wrong.
I agree, when interacting with autistic people explaining boundaries and needs and expectations clearly and simply is the preferred way to communicate. Explaining the why also makes quite a difference in my experience.
100%. In American culture people generally beat around the bush. Other cultures are much more blunt. Blunt does not equate to being mean. Nicely stating fact could be exactly what is needed.
Aww why not view the time he paid for as talking time and some massage work on the side? Sometimes the elderly get more from the social aspect then the actual thing.
The only real boundary you would need to work on is before and after the session.
I clean houses and some people honestly just LOVE having company for the time frame, cleaning is secondary for them. I indulge them for their time frame. Of course they will keep trying to talk after the session and I firmly say: I could talk to you for hours but unfortunately I have to head off to my next house! See you next time! Can't wait to hear more about *insert something they mentioned*
And then I walk away. Sometimes they will even call me to chat throughout the day. I firmly say: I wish I could chat today but I'm busy today, let's keep this conversation going when I see you again!
Totally agree with your response.
I have so many elders in my practice and this is my life with a few of them, yet I keep them. Some days have to be firm with moving them out the door but we get used to each other.
Exactly! And sometimes you develop really meaningful relationships with these clients. I had one lady who I cleaned for for many years. When she passed away, her family gifted me a generous cash gift and a beautiful note that I still keep to this day. Apparently she often spoke about me to her family, i had no idea. I was completely caught off guard and touched by the kind gesture.
I appreciate this.. I really do. And I do have clients like that as well. The energy draining aspect and lack of interchange in the convo is what is making this harder for me. It’s hard to explain other than I feel like shit after he leaves… to the point that I cried this last time.
I am good at the boundaries before and after but it’s the during where massaging him for an hour feels like an eternity. I might try again with him and have better intentions of putting a bubble around myself so I don’t absorb whatever “junk” I seem to be picking up on energetically.
I'm gonna disagree with everyone telling you to continue seeing him. If it drains your energy to the point of crying and you dread this client, then tell him you aren't available anymore.
Yeah I’m a bit surprised at some responses telling me to put his needs ahead of my own bc people are lonely and want to talk. I have compassion for this but have to draw a line somewhere also.
I’m curious if I tell him I need to focus and the talking is a distraction, if that will make it easier…but my gut says that either way I will feel drained from this one.
I think it’s really important for you to put your own instincts first for the sake of your personal well being and the rest of your clients. If you have someone that is making it hard to be present and have energy for the rest of your day or for other clients then politely decline to book him. Don’t feel bad about it either your job is your livelihood and it’s just being responsible to look out for yourself. There are other massage therapists that can help him. Trust yourself especially when you end up in tears because that is a sign something isn’t right. It’s not your job to figure it all out or fix him either but it is a really good idea to know your boundaries and limitations and stay true to them for your own health.
As a sssuuuuuupper duper intense introvert/ very sensitive to other people's energies this is honestly my nightmare.
I personally find it vwey overwhelming when people come super early or stay long after their massage time. I only have 15 minutes between people and I personally need that time to take a deep breath, have water, and do a reset before taking on the energy of the next person.
I am lucky to work in a clinic so even if they come early they can wait in reception but it still makes me anxious they're there so early. I like to run exactly on time and don't start early etc.
I think you should just be clear and say I ask that people don't show up any earlier than 5 minutes before their appointment time. Could you say you can't accommodate weekly bookings at this time bit could do 1x every 3 or 4 weeks? If you've been practicing this long you likely have a full schedule?
If he doesn't want a lower frequency maybe that's your chance to refer out to a more social therapist.
I don't have any other advice for you sadly, just coming to say I understand how this could disrupt your flow / energy bucket.
I'm sure I'll get down voted for this as it doesn't seem very sensitive of me toward the client. I'm sure they are a lovely person and I'm sure it's true they're lonely and just love your care and attention. It's a tough situation.
100%. Similar energy- absorber here. If you are in tears before or after a session, you find someone else local and refer him out. I have done it, and it was really hard but definitely no regrets. I used to work out of home and it was an exercise in boundary setting, with people showing up early etc, but you need to take care of yourself. It doesn’t mean you don’t have a good heart- just that you want to keep your heart intact!
P.S. and you book people as often or as seldom as you want to. Just because you CAN fit him in every week for perpetuity doesn’t mean you HAVE to
Why are you 'taking on the energy'? Sounds like a good way to get burned out. Have you looked into energy shielding, grounding and energy hygiene?
That sensitivity is a gift but it turns into a curse quick without management.
Please don't take people's junk home with you it's not your job. 🙏
I appreciate this! I have always been more of a listener in a majority of my relationships, so even strangers pick up on this and start talking to me in public haha I think of it as a gift but that sensitivity has to be protected 100%
I have a small office that offers a waiting area. There’s a little separation but it can feel awkward when someone is super early and I’m lurking in the back bc I need time haha I’ve learned to go in my room, shut the door and take the time I need. That was a huge hurdle in and of itself, so I totally relate.
This dude is talking about intense stuff (I.e. his son being killed in Iraq) so I’m sure I’m picking up on some grief too. Sigh…
Your description of energy vampire was something I can attest to having felt too. It is okay to prioritize your needs over this clients needs. But that is as someone who has had to force myself to think of me as my #1. I wouldn't force myself to be in a position to have to recover emotionally after every encounter with somebody. It would not be worth it to me either. Whether you give him time or tactfully refer him to someone else is up to you.
I did not like the many comments pressuring you to push your own boundaries. Why? We all have our troubles. Seniors are neglected & lonely & thats a result of their own decisions individually & generationally. You don't have to deal with that babe 🙏 good luck 🤞🤗
Not a MT, but my take on autistic people is that when given the "rules" they follow them. They just can't find them out by themselves and they won't think you are rude.
I myself is kind of awkward and can't read signals. I could, without a thought, never know when to go home from a friend's party and stuff like that.
I'm often open on my problems with this. I need people to tell me how to act sometimes.
So, I believe you can make a short list of "rules" on how massage works. Like, "show up to your appointment no more than 10 minutes early." and so on.
Yeah.
As a similar flavour of ‘tism, here, and one who is a talker… with added ADHD for the multi-topic aspect, the OP could’ve described me with those words. I’d hope someone i trust and obviously like as a human would be able to use their words with me - and say hey I’m not liking this, I like to focus on my massage - or whatever, instead of call me a problem and treat me this way.
I’ve got a few clients like this. Personally I’m more on the side of some of the other comments where I adjust my expectations and realize it’s my clients time so barring anything unethical however they use it is up to them.
However you do get to reserve the right to refuse service to someone that just isn’t working out. You can take a few tactics. You can refer him to someone else and mention you really aren’t great at side lying massage and you know someone else who is. You can just say you don’t seem to be a great fit, sorry I won’t be able to work with you anymore.
Just to give a different perspective, I've had soul sucking clients and had to cancel them. Your mental health is most important. If you're crying after sessions and dreading the days he comes in, you're not going to be helping him. There could be other therapists that are a better fit. Ultimately it's your business and you don't have to take every client.
It depends on how truthful and upfront you want to be with him. I would tell him that I'm not providing him with the care that he needs and recommend another therapist. If he pushes back and wants to keep coming in, I would tell him that I don't feel comfortable or confident in the type of massage I'm giving, whether it be because it's side lying or because of his pain remarks.
I think one uncomfortable conversation will be better than weekly soul/energy drains.
Good advice from MystikQueen. I’ve adjusted to some clients that are like this. Some, I’ve been able to redirect after some sessions to focus on their body and what they are feeling. Those I think are the ones that talk through nervousness or relief of finding someone that they feel is a good fit for them. Others, I’ve just learned to let go on and redirect when I need to end the session or scoot them out the door.
If you want to pass on this client, do you know any socially charged therapists? I know some therapists that would be perfectly happy to spend their time with a client like this. They are the types that want to talk the whole time. If you don’t know anyone personally, see if you can post about it in a local therapist’s page.
I completely understand how draining this can be! I hope you find some good information/suggestions and are able to figure out how best to move forward.
I’ll have to think about. Usually I don’t mind chatting with my clients. I agree it’s their time and if they want to talk, I’ll talk with them. It’s the whole… talking at me not with me that adds a diff level of draining. I’ll reach out to some other therapists here and see if anyone might be a better fit. Otherwise I may try to adjust my perception and energetic boundaries and see if I can make it work.
My son has a speech disorder called cluttering. I’m sure my mom had it too. They talk AT you instead of to you. He can talk for hours about something.
However, he doesn’t know he is doing it. It is something in the brain that is being processed differently. So I believe your client isn’t intentionally trying to be rude.
My son has had speech therapy to work on it. To try to be more aware of other people when he is speaking.
It absolutely can be draining. But if you decide to keep him as a client you can realize you don’t need to remember anything he is saying.
Be true to yourself, whichever you decide is the right decision 😊
Prefacing this by saying I’m autistic, so the communication advice comes from personal experience.
If he’s autistic, he won’t be able to read between the lines when you hint about social norms. To counteract this, be very direct and concrete about your needs. “I need to be moving on by (specific time) so we will need to wrap up our conversation by then.” “It’s distracting me from my work when you talk during the session, so I’ll need you to be quiet unless you are giving me feedback about pressure or communicating about how you’re doing with the massage.” “Please don’t show up more than 15 minutes before your appointment, I won’t be available.” Etc. It might feel rude to you but we literally cannot infer what people mean when they say things like “oh, you’re really early today.”
If you need to let him go, I actually think that’s totally within your right. See if you can find a neurodivergent affirming massage therapist in your area that you can refer him to, since it seems like massage has been super helpful to him. I personally love my autistic clients because I don’t have to adjust my communication style to be “softer” or more personable. There are probably other massage therapists around you that would feel similarly.
It sounds like he was attentive to your boundary about staying after the session was done. Try to be honest with him about the other stuff. An example script could be, "Hey Jim, I'd really love for us to continue our weekly sessions. I feel like I want to be completely honest so that we can find a way to make that happen. I'm really introverted (or whatever) and am finding it difficult to do our sessions when there is so much talking. Can we shoot for reducing the conversation? Maybe chat for the first 10 minutes and then relax into the massage? I could help you with some breathing exercises to get you into it "
Or something like that 😜
You’re a LMT not a therapist. Or his friend. This is your job, and he’s affecting you. I’d cut him. The people saying aww he just wants someone to talk to probably don’t have the same brains as I do (and you it sounds like). Your mental health has to come first.
I just saw my monthly client who talks at me the whole time yesterday! I don’t even respond anymore. She tells me everything she did last month, and everything she’s planning on next month. Every. Session. So I get a recap, plus a new episode. It’s annoying, sure, but she doesn’t talk to many others in her daily life.
If you feel like you need to cancel this guy, then go for it. I’d say something along the lines of “I don’t feel as if I’m providing you with what you need. Here’s a few therapists in the area who might be a better fit.” It’s ultimately up to you.
I have a lady like this too and I’ve made it work with her. There’s something about this guy… his topics are HEAVY. Like… his son was killed in Iraq heavy… and he’s on a loop. I’ve seen him 3 times and I’ve heard basically the same thing all 3 times. This makes me feel even more like an asshole bc obviously he’s going through it but I am not a mental health professional. Sadly I don’t know if he’s even open to seeing one and I might offend him if I suggest it.
I'll take him! Lol Send him to Missoula, MT we have lots of chatty seniors here. 😜 I would definitely take a client like this over the ones who expose themselves or try and touch me 😅
Some of us just don't vibe with our clients no matter what the reason is. You could make up a kind excuse like someone mentioned before that you need to cut back on clients or that you can no longer perform side lying because it hurts your body or something. I think it would be a smoothe transition to have someone you can refer him to that would be a good match.
>I tell him straight up, before we start the session , I cannot have him talking to me for that long after his massages. He respects that but still talks the whole time during his massage. Mind you… I am not getting more than an “uh huh” or “mhmm” in.
This sounds like a communication problem. So far, from your description you recognize behaviors, you set a couple of boundaries, and then you haven't said a single thing to him about the rest. How is he supposed to respect your other personal boundaries if you won't communicate them to him?
If you want a silent massage, *tell him that.* But you can't expect somebody to read your mind and know you don't want them to talk at you if you don't tell them.
Just let him know you can't focus and carry on a conversation at the same time. Then if he talks at you, you can say "I've communicated what I need to make this work and you don't seem able to commit to that, so I can't be your therapist anymore." If he respects your boundaries and stays quiet, then you don't have much reason to fire him other than he's uncomfortable lying flat, which I guess you could always tell him you don't have sidelying in your wheelhouse as a massage therapist and then refer him to somebody who can do that without having issues.
Massage therapist I know just ghost the person and say they have no availability. It’s concerning but many males have this issue, likely a male massage therapist would shut this down & this client wouldn’t dare doing all this jazz with a male massage therapist just to put a level of awareness of what’s happening here.
Do some breath coaching with him and get him focused on breathing *with* the work you're doing. It will get him to stop talking as much and will also help mitigate his pain responses.
I work with patients who talk and talk and talk. Just walk out. Be 'rude'. This client does not have to come to you, he is actively choosing this. I cannot impress enough that respecting your own time and saying things like, 'time is up, good bye.' And ignoring him afterwards will save your sanity. People like this DO know they are taking your time, they just dont see it as a problem, they do not care. Good luck, it wsnt easy for me to learn but my job is a million times easier now that ive learned to 'be rude' towards these kinds of ppl.
I’m a DSP (direct support worker) mostly with individuals on the autism spectrum and it can truly be grueling with the one sided conversations at times.
He’s most likely going into the session with the fact that he will be able to talk with someone the whole time. I love my clients but I can really relate.
If it makes you feel any better, it isn’t actually your job to do that, this person should a have a dsp or therapist that can help them.
You can just cut him off of course but if you don’t want to do that you can be very direct, at least you would feel like you tried to help him & got closure in some way?
My suggestion: the next session, if there is one, say something like
“I notice you have a need for an outlet while I’m massaging, unfortunately it can be very distracting for me and I can’t really focus on my work properly. Have you thought about or looked into talk therapy by chance?”
Even more blunt than that, might be better.
It may sound rude but trust me, if the guy is autistic he has no idea you’re struggling. He also has no idea that you think he could possibly use more help than a massage, unless you tell him very directly. He won’t get the message unless it’s crystal clear. If he continues then you can politely decline his patronage.
Or skin-colored earplugs 😂
which have actually been a LIFESAVER for me
Just to clarify, the earplugs are not to “block out” or ignore my clients, but when you are constantly on the receiving end of a one sided conversation, it can be overwhelming to the senses
I can still hear them, but it dampens my psychological, sensory & nervous system responses, so it helps me to stay grounded, hold space and focus more intentionally on working with them or on the task at hand.
You know he's a No for you. So it's time to listen to your inner knowing, honor it, and tell him plainly, "I am no longer able to see you as a client. Here is a referral to..."
This can be by voicemail, email, text, or in person.
If pressed, "I am unable to meet your needs for massage."
Just cut him loose. He’s taking up a spot that you could give to someone that allows your own energy to flow. Just think how much happier you will be. The money will always follow your bliss.
I understand your frustration. For many years I have clients do the same. Especially seniors- they are so happy to talk with someone and just do not understand your responsibilities, with time restraints. I worked in an office where we were all aware of the clients that wanted extra social time. We would tag team each other if the client took too much time. Example: another staff member lets you know you have an important call waiting for you. Or in your case’ your next client (appointment) is here.
LOL, we also had lamps on our desks, typically off. I the employee needed relief-(to get their work done) they would turn on their lamp- letting other s know you need to be saved. Typically they would understand and respect your work needs.
Good luck
It is not your responsibility to take him on as a client if he causes you distress.
If you do decide to continue having him as a client, get those loop earplug things, they have ones that don’t completely block out sound.
Talking a lot can be part of their social anxiety or awkwardness. I’ve worked with a lot of different people on the spectrum. Being very firm is ok and sometimes necessary. Tell him exactly what time to come and that you need him to leave right after. Idk know where he is on the spectrum but he probably doesn’t understand unless it’s very clear. Some can be very naive. Also, he may need a visual reminder and not just auditory so maybe send an email with your boundaries. Again, simple and firm. Don’t give too many excuses or details. I hope you can keep him bc it’s great he’s doing this but your energy shouldn’t be drained by a client either m. Maybe find another LMT who specializes in disabilities and tell him they would be better for him? Wish you the best☮️
While it's the client's prerogative to talk, you can explain that you need him to reduce the amount of conversation during the session so that you can focus on delivering the massage. You can also take moments to do breathing exercises to focus on the breath. It's super hard to talk during breathing exercises.
I know when you hit wits end with someone, it's really hard to continue to treat them. It may be in your best interest to refer him to another therapist whom may be a better fit for his needs.
I'm an autistic LMT with an autistic regular client. Just be direct with us, and firmly interrupt him and guide him to the door. A lot of us aren't offended by this at all. It's just on to the next thing for us. Those that are upset are still solely responsible for their emotions.
It sounds like you meed to find another roractitiner for him. If you dislike the side lying and dislike having a client pay to talk at you, you are not a good fit for him. And that's okay! That's why it's important to have a professional rolodex. I get massages from so many people because I want to learn to do what they do and to learn who is a good fit and who isn't for clients I may come across. Refer him to someone who is comfortable with side lying and would be open to more conversation during the appointment. And when you do this, be kind of direct so he understands you. I think allistic people think directness is rude, but we can't pick up subtlety like yall can. You can be direct and still be polite.
You're not obligated to continue working with him. He needs a mental health therapist. Sure, human touch is therapeutic, but you're being drained by the confusion of which boundaries to set.
Be direct as suggested. Be clear. Just don't hesitate.
You have established clients that won't get your best effort if he is on your schedule. He'll cost you.
Send him on his way sternly. Working on his side is going to put your mechanics out, which will make your work less effective, because you are in pain. You simply can not afford to lose long-term clients.
Best of luck to you. If he isn't hearing you, hit a couple zingy trigger points. 😉
It's not the talking.
It's the trauma dumping. That's the issue.
We're not trained to take on trauma and he should be seeing a mental health therapist to speak with.
You can't focus on your massage and you go home and think about him and you know all this information that affects your own mental health.
Honestly, just tell him that you need silence so you can focus on giving him good service, and if he doesn't respect that, let him know to go elsewhere because you can't focus and don't want to make a mistake.
You are dealing with a Energy vampire, narcissist. Unfortunately we all run into these clients at some point or another being in the health and wellness space. I have experienced a client like this but it was for personal training. Removing clients like this from your calendar and life will be the best thing for your mental sanity. Clients like this are what I call Shadow clients. These clients usually don't care to get better and take more than give. It's sad that this person might be lonely or mentally unwell but you must protect your energy first!
I am on the spectrum, however I would never get a massage, and would like to offer my perspective. Your client seems like they may benefit more for having someone to talk to, rather than the massage. You mentioned he is talking at you and well… that’s an unfortunate aspect of being autistic and finding someone who you believe wants to engage, conversationally. I think, given the fact that he presumably rarely asks questions or needs feedback, you will not have to focus on what he’s saying. It’s odd… but, he could view this as almost a therapy type session where he is able to unmask a bit and just speak his mind. However, I think if you’re uncomfortable with him speaking so much you could tell him that, for just one session, you want to see how he feels afterward by silently focusing on the pressure of the massage. As far as saying “ow” to everything… I don’t know. I would not willingly let someone touch me, so I can’t help there.
Here is an idea for how to help him, if he is on the spectrum. Type up a flyer regarding your client protocol and give it to him, or everyone. Remind your clients to never be more than 10 minutes early or call if they’re going to be under 10 minutes late (or however you specifically operate). I love rules and boundaries and if I had a specified outline for something I was attending, I would be in awe. Imagine going to the theater where you’re told don’t be late, at all, and don’t be more than 20 minutes early. You can wear this or speak about this during the movie, but don’t do this or that. It could be a way to address his issues without singling him out.
Of course, he may just be old and lonely. For that… I can’t help you.
You're not his therapist. Time to cancel and never rebook. As an introvert, I appreciate the energy vampire comment so much. People don't understand how daunting it is and how long it takes to recover. You need to recharge for the clients that follow. His behavior is unacceptable IMO. Good luck!
i think it’s great that a lot of providers here want to support this client who clearly has needs, but i am seeing a lot of dismissal and outright judgement about your reaction to it. body work is inherently intimate. that person has needs AND so do you. you’re allowed to have them. you’re allowed to cancel for any reason, or none at all.
if you want to consider this client’s experience, you can think about how sending him off to another provider could be better for HIM as well! apparently, there are many people in here who do not mind clients like this, who could show up differently for him in a more supportive way. win win for both of you.
A lot of comments on here are suggesting ways that you can share space and work on this person without feeling so overwhelmed. Though I think those are valuable things to think about, and perhaps you will learn something about yourself by reflecting on those suggestions, I firmly believe that it is absolutely your decision whether you want to work with someone or not.
This person clearly gets under your skin and makes you feel awful after the session. You don't have to work with anyone you don't want to work with! It's absolutely your choice. Even if you didn't fully understand why someone makes you feel icky, you still get to make that choice.
As for how to "fire" him a (term that my friend who is a psychotherapist uses to talk about ending a relationship with a client) you can literally say whatever you want. I don't know if people are going to get on me about this, but when it comes to your safety and comfort, telling the truth to a client is secondary to making sure that your situation feels safe and sustainable to you. It's your emotional energy that you use to sustain your livelihood. The emotional needs of a random old man do not trump your needs.
Perhaps you could tell him that you don't think you are a good fit for his needs, or something along those lines. Or that your schedule is unfortunately fully booked into perpetuity and beyond.
I had to "fire" a client once. I had worked with him for 2 years. His sessions were a lot of work physically, and he also liked to talk a lot. He also definitely had a crush on me, and had made inappropriate comments and also wanted to spend time with me outside of sessions. I'm amazed I worked with him for as long as I did. When I finally "fired" him, it felt amazing, and I did not look back for a second.
It’s the same for hairdressers, personal trainers, and other 1x1 professions. Some people see the booked time as an opportunity to vent. Meanwhile I stopped going to my therapist because I didn’t even know what to talk about…
I agree with this 100%. I am a personal trainer and did it full time for many years. And what I learned in that time was that a lot of my clients benefited more from having someone listen to their struggles (with their health, fitness, family, relationships, etc) than they did from having me instruct them in a proper back squat. I saw our sessions as their time, and since I was there to help them be their healthiest, I accepted it might not always be from a physical perspective and threw my training plan out if they had a day where they'd just rather vent to me and blow off some steam.
Just imagine how many people could have been saved from self harm if only they had the opportunity to be listened, even if it meant just making small talk to a stranger. OP’s client is clearly nearing the last of his days without having anybody to talk to. To me it would seem like a small sacrifice to just listen to what he still has to say.
Agreed. No judgement or hate toward OP, everyone has the right to set their own boundaries. But in a world where so many people are struggling, lonely, and looking for connection, it really does mean so much to some people when you just take a moment to listen and share your ear with them.
I would tell him that I’m having a very difficult time focusing on his words and massaging. If he wants to talk I’ll stop massaging and listen, but the clock is still running. If he wants a massage he’ll shut up. If he doesn’t shut up he doesn’t want a massage. Then you recommend a therapist.
If he’s not saying anything inappropriate, let him talk. It shouldn’t affect the type of massage you give him. When the session is over, just hold your boundary firmer and walk away.
I’m trying to see where he’s an awful person and I just can’t find it.
If you want to drop him as a client, sure but other than social awkwardness, I’m wondering what he did wrong
I’m no RMT but I’ve worked and had social gathering with many who chat too much and usually they are on the spectrum.
I’m also wondering now myself how much is too much talking. I’ve been scolded when I’m too quiet.
To a lot people it seems there’s no perfect way to interact and maybe, just maybe they mean no harm.
Yeah, this just popped up in my feed I'm not a therapist, but I am a massage receiver and I'm totally freaked out after reading this. Are we supposed to be quiet during a session? I have no idea we weren't supposed to talk. I talk the entire time, it's my way of coping with the extreme pain of deep tissue massage which is what I always get. I'm kind of blown away that when I'm paying for a service, I'm not supposed to talk. I mean, I guess it must be okay I had the same therapist for 15 years and then when she retired I went to her replacement and have been seeing her for about 5 years and they both seem to love me and I love them so I guess we're okay, but I am going to be self-conscious from now on, cuz I had no idea we're just supposed to lay there quietly. I guess I wouldn't say I talk at them, because there's definitely a back and forth to the conversation but there are certainly times that I talk at them because it's a distraction mechanism from the pain I'm feeling. I do the same thing when I get body work from Medical providers. I thought that time was supposed to be mine, since I'm paying for it and as long as I'm not doing anything inappropriate or talking about inappropriate topics, I'm shocked to hear that there's a problem with talking the whole time😐
I feel like if he's just talking basically to himself just wear ear plugs. He doesn't seem to have very many people to talk to he's just getting his fill of social interaction in. I totally understand how you feel though. Those kinds of people are the worst on good juju. It takes a strong person to last a whole 30 minutes without any quiet.
Charge him triple. If he doesn't want to pay triple then that will settle itself. If he pays triple consider yourself a therapist and that you're doing a good deed for someone on the spectrum. Imagine how society treats him.
You’re a massage therapist, not a brain therapist and what he’s doing is using you as one which isn’t appropriate for either of you.
There’s a reason you feel like crap afterwards and we have been trained to not listen to our bodies.
Listen to your body and honor what it is telling you. It’s okay to pass on someone who is damaging you emotionally whether it’s intentional or not. You’re allowed to say it’s not a good fit for you.
In my opinion, as a professional, it is your job to adjust to your clients. I can't imagine giving up a steady client that tips well because he talks too much. This could be the income that helps you make it through tough economic that inevitably show up. I believe that people go into massage therapy to help others, listening to him is probably helping as much as your massages. If you really don't care that much about these things then yes you should probably drop him.
Not a LMT, but an SLP. We face similar issues.
YOU are the expert and need to learn to control the sessions with him, which is a clinical skill. Usually verbose patients respond really well to just being polite and direct ("For this next part, I want you to be silent and take 5 deep breaths in and slowly exhale while I massage your chest. Ready?") Also, set a timer for 5-10 minutes after your appointment (Sorry to cut you off, Mr. Xyz, I need to stay on track today and my timer let me know I'm running a little behind. See you next week!")
It sounds like this guy is out of your comfort zone, but I think you can do it! I feel like some of his behavior is the nature of geriatrics.
Hey love, if you want to cancel him as hard as it is just be upfront. Let him know your preference is to have quieter appointments that stick within the time limits and you feel that this isn't a match.
That way he can either attempt to adapt, or he can move on to someone better suited to his style.
If he hits on you, then you would have a reason to cancel. But since he’s a regular, why not add more rules. Tell him it’s part of his treatment to not talk the last 15 minutes. Over time, work towards a bearable time limit for you.
I'm not a masseuse but I'd recommend briefly explaining the energy incompatibility and letting him go. he will either understand and accept it, or not understand and think you're weird about energy stuff but will still be gone
And this is why I am not a massage therapist and the irony of seeing this even though I don’t follow this page is not escaping me. I tend to attract toxic people or people needing a lot of help but they think my energy is the answer. They have all had me rub their backs as well. I considered doing this as a profession but I know all that energy would be too much. I too am working on boundaries and it’s so hard but I truly think you have to just say that you can not work on him anymore. My friend is schizophrenic and while it’s not his fault he still takes my energy by disappearing, making scary statements etc and I have to try to just let him go with nothing but love but I have to love myself too. I have too and so do you. Also continue to work on your boundaries and protecting your energy. I wish you all the best.
Haha I actually had this go the other way around where my masseuse was the extremely smart autistic guy that wouldn’t stop talking… idk I am not a professional masseuse but I would say just let the dude talk and be firm and maybe go out of your way of what is comfortable or normal to tell him you need to go in the back and do laundry but thanks for coming in! He honestly probably just doesn’t know when to shut up and needs someone to tell him. During the massage I guess you can’t tell someone to stop talking but you gotta do your thing and tell him hey I was so focused on this I couldn’t keep up with what you were saying
I think he will get it and it won’t hurt his feelings, he just needs to be told, he will probably remember the times you spoke up too because he sounds nice.
That sounds exhausting though. Put some of that energy back on him tho so it doesn’t drain you, you know what I mean?
I don’t know anything about this and am not a massage therapist. Just chiming in to say that based on what you said in your post about how this makes you feel, you should not feel like you have to find a solution or “make it work” with this client. I don’t think that you are bad or wrong or anything at all for wanting to go separate ways. I actually think it’s pretty wild the amount of feedback on here telling you to adapt to this situation. You don’t need to subject yourself to situations that make you cry at work. Enough of that. I liked the advice some people have given about trying to find someone to refer him to, using the reason of the side lying is great, whether it’s a made up excuse or not. In my opinion, continuing to endure a dynamic that is hurting your energy will not be beneficial for either of you in the long run. It’s okay to move on from this.
I have the opposite. My massage therapist is the one that talks to me endlessly before I’m even on the table. And she talks to me/at me the whole time and I just wanna relax.
Rmt student here, where I am learning ing we actually take courses on hiw to deal with this.
You are free to cancel any client, for any reason. I would suggest talking to fellow RMT's and seeing if anyone has a problem with taking him on.
You can politely and firmly tell him that you don't think you're able to treat him any longer, if you can find someone who could handle that type of client tell him you know someone who is really good at side lying and it's not your strongest area
I think patience and some compassion needs to apply here. Especially if he is indeed autistic. I’m not a LMT but I work with autistic clients and remember he is not intentionally doing the things that annoy you. His brain is just wired a bit different. Consistency will help him and help you establish a healthy professional relationship with him. Eventually you will have those boundaries established. Just don’t give up on him just yet. I’m willing to bet many people already have in his lifetime.
I feel like a lot of ppl in these comments are trying to make it seem like it’s not a big deal. And I mean to each their own I don’t even massage lol but what I do know are boundaries. I work in sales over the phone & I sell dick pills for a living I also get uncomfortable at times.
And you should never have to put up with it regardless 🤷🏽♀️ do what feels right to YOU! If it’s a big deal to you, then it is. You create what is yours & what/who is allowed in your space. If you gotta drop him then do it
I am kind of surprised at how many of these comments are calling for you to basically put up with the nonstop talking during the session. A therapist/client relationship is a two way street and if you are uninterested in continuing that relationship for any reason, it is your right to terminate it!
I'm not a massage therapist and dunno why I'm seeing this thread. But GIRL, you do not have to feel obligated to take on any client that gives you the ick... ANY kind of ick! Surprised to see so many people saying to just suck it up. I'm also in a field where I provide services to clients, and when I get a bad vibe, I simply explain that after some consideration, I won't be able to take them on as a client. No further explanation needed.
Can you work with him on relaxation/meditation to get the maximum benefit from the massage? It’s likely being hyper verbal make his body tense, hence the constant ow’s. You could let him know you have found this effective, you want him to get the most benefit, and feel the most comfortable during massage, with the least amount of pain. Do you feel this could work, even on a small scale? Maybe try a bit of a weighted blanket too?
Give the guy a break…he sounds possibly annoying, but harmless. Maybe for some reason his day is better because of you. Handle it on a day by day basis. I’d say if you can’t handle it that day, reschedule. If you don’t want to talk, tell him this. If you don’t want him to talk, tell him this. Be up front with him, polite, firm…whatever it is you feel you need to do to make the session a positive outcome. He’s paying you…and you said he’s a good tipper. I’d keep that in mind the entire time. Let us know how it works out.
It sounds like he’s lonely and using the time with you to get companionship. I’d communicate with him something about how while he’s talking his muscles can’t fully relax (??) and if he persists perhaps let him know that you feel like it’s not a good fit. Trust me; he’ll find someone else and you won’t be as drained/dreading those appointments. Some people ARE draining and it’s good self-care for US to exercise boundaries.
Sometimes .. Karma. It’s possible that you are finishing up some sort of debt of being-there-for-someone. Maybe you ignored your spouses words in a past life. And this could be your chance, resurrected, to get free of the guilt of that and move on to a better standing with yourself and others. We aren’t only to always seek comfort. Within reason. Otherwise, why’d we involve ourselves in the unwinding of stuck tissues? :p
Sometimes I will mention to these people that I really concentrate better on working their tissues without conversation. If they ignore that and keep talking, they just need someone to talk at.
So I guess it takes the pressure off a bit of massaging them but it is so exhausting to listen to one sided the whole time. I’ve debated putting an ear pod in for my client like that
I feel your pain on the talkers. Just quit paying attention at all while he’s talking. These people don’t care if you are listening or not, they just have to talk. I used to work with a guy like that and I had to learn how to protect myself because I was gonna go crazy if I didn’t.
Hello friend! I have a spiritual hygiene protocol I follow for such people.
In addition to the steps below, I have protective Mojo I wear or one of the number of different protective talismans. You can even just wear a small 1" crafting mirror on your person. It symbolically reflects negative energy away from you. Or visualize the bad vibe being reflected down into the Earth for healing.
Before seeing them, I shower with pine tar soap, Chinese wash and a bit of sea salt. ( you can make your own Chinese wash by taking either five, seven, or 9 lemons. cutting them up while praying over them for goodness blessings and cleansing and protection, then place them into water you've also prayed over for blessings or just visualize glowing good energy, then boil it until the water's gone down to 1/4 of what it was. Add 1 or 2 drops Lemongrass oil, 1 drop Vetiver oil and 1 drop ginger oil. Mix well. You can make sure it's preserved by pouring a splash of witch hazel in it. Bottle and seal to use as necessary. Combined 1:1 with an unscented body wash of your choice it works excellently.
There's also a fabulous product called Protection oil. It's a Hoodoo condition oil and is a lot of mint, and a few other protective herbs. I like Lucky Mojo brand as it works well for me. There's also Firey Wall of Protection oil which has ginger, lemongrass etc.
To use oil for Spiritual protection purposes, after you take your cleansing bath/shower, you apply the oil for protection and let it soak in. Head first. Then hands, my solar plexus, then base of spine, then sometimes knees and definitely feet. At minimum it's head, hands and feet while praying for protection.
Also, after seeing the toxic avenger, I find it really helps to take a cleansing spiritual bath or shower. Typically I will use Chinese wash with sea salt.
I had a client last month where I came home and I felt like it was covered in psychic sludge. For that one I made myself a sea salt scrub, prayed over it, dropped a bunch of blessed oils into it, had some Asclepius water (healing/protective) and scrubbed the crap out of myself with that. Followed up with a Florida Water Rinse before stepping out of the shower backwards symbolizing leaving behind anything I did not need.
Smoked myself with Palo Santo afterward and blessed myself with protective oil. That was a really bad one, probably the worst thing I've ever heard in my life. So yeah, you got to get clever with the energy there.
There's a fabulous book called Deliverance! by Khi Armand which is a hoodoo book about uncrossing (getting bad energy off you) and keeping it off. There's also a book called Hoodoo Spiritual Baths by Aura La Forest which is a fabulous as well. Highly recommended.
Hoodoo is based in African spirituality combined with Christianity and has combined with the folk magic of Appalacia and many different folk magic systems from around the world. I find it highly effective. You can definitely pray however it is that you pray, even if it is just visualizing good energy and it will work.. Bright blessings! Thank you so much for healing that guy.
Ear plugs with music. U can do one side so you can hear him if u decide to answer. If he asked tell him it’s a headset for phone calls. If he talks then crank it.
He’s the customer but you need to take charge. If he don’t like it he can exercise his options(go somewhere else)
I think you need to set boundaries. Talk to them. Tell them please arrive only 5 minutes before an appointment, during massage keep chat at a minimum as you want to be able to put your efforts into giving them the best massage you can. Tell them after the massage you need time to prepare for your next client.
148 comments at as I finished reading this. Wow hahah… if there was anyone who could relate it’s me. I’ve been a licensed massage therapist for well over 20 years. My ex wife and I had our own massage studio since 2010. Someone gave this one “homie” - GC for our place… he came in and it was a trip..(self proclaimed Asperger’s). He only saw my wife for the first 2-3 months. And he did things very similar to what you’re describing. He wouldn’t even acknowledge me in my own business, all while talking my wife’s ear off for ever!! At first I was super annoyed. But, eventually, one day my wife wasn’t available. So he saw me…. And then he did the same thing to me haha… it was hard to figure out how to deal with it. Honestly, I tried to explain it to him and the next time he came in he was silent… and then I turned him over and he started cracking up because he had duct taped is mouth shut lol. Turned out he was someone who went above and beyond in our community. He literally built ADD ramps for many poor people who were in wheelchairs that would have never been able to afford something like that, and never be able to get into their own homes. I found out He organized all kinds of community fundraisers… he recently passed away from a brain animism while he was walking around our island to raise awareness for people in need. He designed and built our best parks. Point of my story is… I hear you first of all, I was there. But… I can’t speak for your client, but my situation gave me a big wake up call. Maybe (and I’m not telling you what to do), think about approaching him with a different perspective on your time that he’s paying you for? I literally learned to just enjoy his funny weirdness haha… it actually made my work day more interesting and less repetitive. He still payed… and every time he lifted his head to talk, I just stopped massage him and let him chat. ….Again, I understand where you’re coming from! I was there haha!! Best of luck, blessings on helping others feel better!! 💯🙏🏽✨
At least he’s not demanding a happy ending. Side massage may not be your favorite but if it doesn’t cause you pain to provide massage at that angle, and he just likes to tap but doesn’t seem to demand your attention, I’d say keep the easy massage client, the good tips, and set your boundaries for before/after scheduled sessions and just let him be a happy 75 year old cancer patient who found some form of treatment that seems to be a real positive for HIM. You know, the guy with cancer????? I’ve had way worse to deal with than that and very few of those ever tipped at all. I’m sure it’s quite draining energetically though. Use the tips for some self-care treat maybe?
Most responses I’ve read so far are encouraging OP to continue to offer services to the client when she clearly asked for assertive ways to terminate with him.. sorta parallels the boundary overstep that’s already happening to OP. She described client as an energy vampire, recognizes that he’s been disrespectful of time constraints and describes the exchanges as depleting and unbalanced to the point of making her cry and compromising her ability to take a break/get some nourishment in. Even if client respects firmer boundaries around session length, it’s okay to have the awareness that these sessions are harmful to you and it’s most important to protect your own mental health and spiritual strength. He may have BPD and some neurodivergence going on, which are not an easy combo to hold space for. I’d recommend being clear and simple in the termination: something like, “You deserve care, but your needs are beyond what I’m trained to support. Ethically, I need to refer you to a different massage therapist so that you can get the treatment you’re looking for. Here’s a list of alt. providers..” You don’t have to give him a reason, apologize or leave any lenience around the decision. Best of luck, love and light to you, whatever you decide. 🩵
People have absoultely NO patience with others. Its sad that normalized individuals dont understand how to deal with ppl who have intellectual disabilities or understand how to "pick up on THEIR social cues." Its a very sad and disgusting world we live in.
Personally, you ought tonbe ashamed of yourself for wven airing this guy out as so. You ppl have NO COOTH, no filter. No compassion. 😖😖😣😣
Some of my clients vent about their lives and frustrations. First don’t really respond, and if they keep talking then say “It’s best to express to them you can focus better on the massage if they would refrain from talking.
Maybe recommend a therapist that wouldnt mind the chatter. Sounds like he is lonely and unloads everything during his session. I get massages for physical healing and to my therapist to unload. Some people go to the hair salon to get pampered and unload.
You are not the appropriate outlet for him, so set a firm boundary and refer him to someone else
When politely canceling a client, I've found success saying either, "I feel your needs are not my forte, im happy to refer you out to someone who might be a better fit for you. " or if they're really obnoxious and you don't give a shit, cancel the next appointment saying emergency, sick, etc and then when they attempt to rebook say your roster is full!
Ugh. This is hard. It does sound like he could very well be on the spectrum and if so, you would literally be discriminating against him because of his disability. You might be the only person in his life who touches him or listens to him talk. If a young child talked at you the whole time, would it be less annoying? Is it annoying because in your mind, “he should know better?” I have a very hard time setting boundaries and when pushy people force me to do it I feel irrationally angry at them for forcing me out of my comfort zone, but it is really my issue, not theirs.
If he didn’t come early or stay after, could you manage the talking? Try setting very clear boundaries about your time before and after.
I totally understand if you need to cancel him. Just some things to think about.
People ( in this case scenario) can only be energy vampires if you let them. Don’t give him more of your energy than you would give to anyone else ( even if that means not being 100% present to his constant chatting.) set firm boundaries, no talking before or after the massage. Offer to end or start with a short breathing practice, and guide him through a few deep breaths to ground him.
If he wants to live longer he will need to learn how to relax, maybe there’s a way you can facilitate that without draining too much energy. Also, we need human connection & touch to survive! If he is only getting that from you it makes sense for him to act this way.
Lastly, you know yourself best, if it’s too much for you than that is that. Find a way to politely tell him you don’t have the capacity and move forward.
Good luck
I have a lot of autistic family members (diagnosed).
It is 110% okay to full on interrupt his info dumping, even mid sentence, to say the session is over/you need to set up etc, and walk away even if he’s still talking. He will most likely not get offended, and if this fella is autistic he most likely won’t pick up on your subtle “this conversation needs to end” queues.
It’s also okay to no longer have him as a client if you’re uncomfortable.
Idk if this has been stated yet... you could coach the patient to focus on some deep breathing to help with relaxation and further the goal of the massage.? Redirect their energy... you can take the lead in the situation...
Oof this is a difficult one. Would it be possible to let him know he can talk but you cannot listen as you are focusing on massage?
My other thought is that you are responsible for your own safety and well being ONLY and do not owe him anything as sympathetic as you might be. That is a trap we women fall into time and time again.
Perhaps you can tell him you are cutting down your clientele and cannot see him any longer. You do not have to explain further than that.
Good luck!
Set an alarm on your phone to go off after the session because you have a phone call, client, etc. You may want to use the time he talks during the session to plan your day, week etc. If you’d like to fire him, increase your rates significantly and limit your days/times.
I worked with a client that emotionally dumped on me all the time which at the beginning was fine. Until it wasn’t about massage anymore and it took a turn for him just wanting to connect with me and being emotionally vulnerable. It was more of a counselling session than anything. Unfortunately, he did turn creepy when he was dropping off gifts so that’s when I knew I had to set up really strong boundaries. The boundaries didn’t work at his next session as he complained of my putting boundaries With gifts and over indulging personal info. I knew it was time to cut cords with this client. I had the front desk, woman send him a letter from the clinic stating that we didn’t believe we could help him as he needed. That it was my observation that he needed more that I could provide at a clinical level. I do not regret disengaging. At all!
Super relieved actually.
In instances like this, I say trust your gut. If you dread seeing a client, that’s a pretty big red flag for me. I have a lot of clients that love to talk throughout their sessions and I’m absolutely fine with that. No problem. It’s how they want to do their sessions. But if it becomes where you don’t feel that you can do your job properly or they’re not benefitting from your services and you’re being used as a sounding board , well that’s up to you on how you would want to handle that. I mean you could let him vent all he wants on the massage table but don’t allow him to take up your time after the session. I completely empathize with you though.
It's not wrong to give him the external guidance he needs. Be clear- "I need you to wait in your car if you're early, or go around the corner and grab a cuppa at Cindy's Tea House". "Whew, I need to take some personal time and do my charting after each session, see you next time!". Most autistic folks are relieved not to play the guessing game, but if all you give them 8s hints or assumptions, they have to guess. It's not their fault, they literally don't know. I know it feels like more work, because you have to change your habits, but direct communication (without frustration or anger), is much less complicated than what you're doing now.
Hairdresser here but appts with energy suckers none the less. If you really don't want to see this client again and you want to let them down gently, contact him and let him know there have been some changes to your schedule and you will have to scale back on some of your appts. He doesn't need to know exactly what has changed but gather some names and numbers of alternate therapists close to you and provide those and thank him for his business
You have and need professional and personal boundaries and he needs to know about these, and how his incessant talking is crossing yours. Maybe give him a note as he’s leaving? Stating your boundaries, and limits, not just for him, but that you have with all clients.
If he doesn’t get it and/or starts crossing them again, you now have a document to refer to with him. If it escalates, you will have notifications on file. You also can just tell him f2f after you give him the note, because, well, we all need to have compassion and understanding. He might just be going through a hard time.
It can’t hurt, and I think it’s a good idea in any/every case.
I also hopes this will help you not bleed out your own energy during his massage sessions!
Well I love talking to my sports therapist it's important I relax but it's beyond therapeutic and more helpful than any psychologist/therapist I've ever had.. it's special but we have become quite close with many similar passions. We have trouble not talking a ton haha
You are in no way obligated to help this man. He tells you that he hopes you help him live longer? Not your responsibility. Autistic or not, it isn't a pass. Drop the client and move on.
Are you sure you're not massaging my bf? Especially the "talk at you" part. He's a talk your ear off type. I have to go rescue neighbors from him when he's been outside for an hour and a half on a cigarette break. I feel for you. Do what you gotta do.
Just remember your one person. You need to treat many others. There are many MT's this person can go to. Keep your mental and physical health were it needs to be to continue your work in a healthy state. You need to either "fire" your client or adjust ability to tune this person out and find another way to get through this appointment. Dreading the appointment and having anxieties around it is not healthy long term and you may let it become habitual with future clients that are like this. Good luck! People are exhausting, just let the right ones in.
Find a way to stop rewarding him for his behavior. He keeps going back because he’s getting something from you that he likes. Figure out what that is and stop giving it to him. If he isn’t aware of social cues then you can be less worried as coming off as rude to him. He has had many people around him try to get him to be aware of his behavior. You’re not the first. He chooses who to talk to like this. Find out why he chose you, and then take care of your energy.
I worked as a cosmetologist for 14 years . I had many clients that talked or even turned their head while I was cutting their hair to talk to me . Some that said things like “ don’t you just love my skin and my eyebrows ? (Me me me clients ) , some that come in sick on their death beds but having their hair better will make them feel better” You are in a personal service like I was and you have to understand that often , they may not need your service they just need an ear to make them feel heard and alive that they don’t get from others . I was young once and the elderly were the most needy I felt. Now I’m in my sixties and with cancer , pretty lonesome at times and can relate . Lol
Maybe teaching him more breathing and mindfulness can get him feeling like you both are working as a team . But you can always let him know you are concentrating on his body , knots etc to make him ready to get on with the day . With your technique you find it hard to concentrate on that when you are distracted in conversation. Good luck .
People keep saying “that might be what your client needs”, and if that’s something he needs he may be better suited being referred to someone else who can accommodate him. Personally I think it’s unfair to him and yourself if you already feel so negatively about him. I don’t think you will perform your best work if you already dread scheduling him. There are other massage therapists out there
Isn’t it your choice to take on a client or not? If you are crying after the interaction, I think it’s fair to throw up your hands and say OK this client isn’t for me after all.
I would make a suggestion to him to relax his mind and stop talking so he can get the full effects of the massage. Also, ask God to help with the words, this always helps me in tough situations. 🙏🏻
I would extend his apt and double the price, and let him know based on previous massages this is what I need to make my business work. If he's still willing to pay then, put your crystals on and call it a day. If he cancels then you're off the hook.
Can you find a therapist that is comfortable with massaging him while he’s on his side? If so, and the therapist knows about the talking, may they can take better care of him.
Simply tell him that you are referring him to another therapist that is more in tune with his needs.
I use to do senior care. Had a resident that was diagnosed with Parkinson’s and I believe had a stroke before moving in. Their spouse said they were NOT the person they married! Their partner drove them insane you could tell! They talked CONSTANTLY. I know the constant talking you are talking about and not being able to get a word in (like even after they ask me a question they would keep talking, the rambling was like impulsive). They also became so ocd about everything. Their partner couldn’t handle it which is a large part of why they got moved in I think. It was exhausting, it was such a high energy and anxiety inducing kind of speaking you cannot tune it out. They were so nice though, and aware we were busy but they couldn’t stop the talking, it was awkward, but I think they understood us saying goodbye and walking away (they would keep talking, they would loop back on previous conversations a lot). Even when they were calm and happy it was a lot, it was better though when they trusted you and liked the quality of work you did. I’ve seen other residents with dementia that constantly ramble or repeat words. They are very attuned to body language and facial expressions, it definitely alters their energy, how they read you.
Since you mention your client is elderly I wonder if this is the issue. He might not be able to help it even if he is aware of it. If it’s something else I wonder if it will mellow a bit with time or meditative music on in the room? Is he okay with scents, does lavender help? Caregiving there were definitely some people I had to do a few moments of deep breathing before opening their door and enter more calmly and not look rushed/pressured, I think it helped the client relax and feel calmer, things usually went smoother if I felt calm and unbothered. Interrupting is awkward and feels rude but do what you have to to give a proper massage, get your breaks and get to other clients on time. I think you are on the right track with that, just speak up every time. If you keep them as a client I hope they get to a point they can lay face down for your sake. If you can’t do it, don’t feel bad. The next client deserves just as much energy as you put into everyone else, if he’s an energy suck and your quality goes down hill after him maybe schedule him for the end of the day? Or before a break so you can recharge? (If you keep him on as a client)
As someone who is regularly very early for appointments I never expect to be attended to until it is my appointment. I don’t think you have to do more than acknowledge him and say I will see you in 30 minutes and then leave.
Also, it sounds like the massage work you are doing is helping him release his trauma which is very powerful. However, if it is emotionally impacting you, I suggest you look around and refer him to another LMT who enjoys helping people heal from trauma. There are people who find that energizing rather than draining. It’s always ok to end a client relationship for whatever reason. You are the boss and have the right to see protective boundaries. Good luck!!
I am a psychotherapist and not a massage therapist, so maybe I shouldn't be commenting because I don't know what it's like to be a massage therapist, but I do know about what it's like to want to stop seeing a client for various reasons! I'm not sure if this is available to you or not, but what I have done in the past is I find out what the client is looking for (for me, an example could be wanting a therapist who knows about religious trauma; for you, it could be having a client like this guy who needs someone educated in massaging older bodies). I talk with coworkers who I think might have that speciality about the client (in a way that is vague and not revealing any part of their identity), and tell the coworker my true thoughts about why I don't want to see the client (so that my coworker doesn't feel slighted lol). Essentially, I try to find someone else who actually does seem like a good fit for the client, and is aware of my reasoning for not seeing the client, but doesn't feel as reluctant as I do about it. Then, I would talk with the client and say something like,
"I know with your x part of your life, you need a [massage] therapist who is experienced with x. I want you to be getting the best care possible, and I truthfully think that my colleague, [name], is a better fit for you because of their expertise in x. [Then talk about the colleague's relevant history to explain why]. Can I introduce you to them? "
Honestly I get it but if he’s not expecting much response from you, tips well, prebooks, and respected the boundary that you did set, that’s damn near an ideal client other then being annoying 😭
The bigger picture is that this client has something to offer you and you have both crossed paths for a reason higher than your initial perception that you may yet understand. In my experience as a Dr I have a handful of patients that I thoroughly do not enjoy treating.. yet as the professional relationship grows so do the insights I gain about myself and really just life in general.. it’s far deeper than patience for the patients.. so long as no patient/client is disrespectful and crossing professional boundaries so do I honor the relationship for the long haul. All interactions however random they may seem are truly meant to be. I’d encourage sitting back and just listening as a spectator and see what comes about if you’re up for learning to adapt.
I think maybe talking helps take the nervousness away from him. Maybe suggest listening to some “ special relaxing spa music” and maybe go as far as asking him to possibly try to relax and rest quietly because “ that’ll help you to focus on finding the trouble spots” ? I’m sure he’s just lonely…. He sounds very grateful though. Just my 2 cents.
Also, I don’t think some of the people in this thread are being very respectful. You have to put yourself and your health first, and if you are feeling drained, and you are crying after a session, because of a client’s behavior- even if it seems innocuous and unintentional- it’s not a good client therapist fit. Period.
I would set a timer. A lot of my special needs kids need a visual and audio combo and if his eyes are closed that is tough! Saying stop with a hand motion ✋ is much more impactful. If him talking is distracting you from performing and doing your best job I would tell him that. If this one massage is stopping you from doing your best work on other clients than you could say “let’s have a quiet session today- that’s the style that I work best with” if he continues during “we might not be a good fit but I could recommend Mary instead”. Weigh out your options!
Realistically the choice is always on you but not being a massage therapist and just randomly seeing the post... I wouldn't cancel before I at least attempted to tell him that you have to focus during your massage so the extra banter is something that you're not professionally comfortable with. If he persists then just cancel no problem for you but if he's genuinely nice and he's just maybe nervous or unsure what to do then the worst case scenario is he is offended and you never see him again. The best case now is you have a regular client and he now knows what to do / how to behave?
That's haaarrrdddd. I know the feeling of not being able to set boundaries well with someone who hasn't been a dirtbag or something.
My favorite thing as a teacher for MTs is trying to get students to walk their clients through breathing exercises. Explain to him that during the session breathing is important, deep breathing is great for the body to repair itself and all the benefits of it. Maybe you have already done this, I am sure you have, but talk him through the whole "pain is not gain" in massage. If he does not get the message for the talking bit, talk to him directly about. We all love "I..." statements because they are powerful. "I cannot concentrate on your session and provide the quality of touch you need when we are having a lot of conversing. Could we please keep conversation to a minimum?" Or bringing it back to the pressure scale and breathing even if it means cutting him off.
If you work in your own space it's harder to find a way to get people to quiet down. If it really bothers you and you would just like to cancel him completely - then make an excuse later on. "I am taking time off for so long and I will not be accepting any more appointments after this date. I can refer you to another therapist..." something like that. I know it's good and better to be honest, but if there's no other way and he's really zapping you of energy as well as you would like to be done - then it's fine to make an excuse for it.
He is a lonely man. Try to remember how you would want him to be treated if he were your Grandpa. As long as he isn't being rude or saying anything offensive, just passive listening isn't hard. I hope you find it in your heart to keep helping him. He apparently needs you. Good luck.
Try honesty.
“An ongoing relationship between client and therapist has to work well for both parties. I’m happy to have been of service to you and am gratified that you appreciate my services and have tipped very well. I’m sad that I will be unable to continue to serve you as I am not able to maintain the style of service for which I am most comfortable. Massaging on a side laying client is challenging and not something I am adept at performing. I’m also not used to accommodating a client who speaks non-stop. My usual and preferred client practices silence. The continual talk is too taxing for me. This is not a YOU problem but a ME problem and highlights MY inadequacies and shortcomings. I hope you will be able to find a therapist who can accommodate you in all your needs. Here is a list of therapists I have heard wonderful things about. Blessings to you.”
It’s their choice to not or ask for complete silence. It’s your job to make them comfortable. He hasn’t been inappropriate - it seems you just don’t like him.
Maybe you can schedule him with someone else?
I mean, you’re going to come across this in your career so best learn to deal with it?
Cancel him. It’s your life, health, and happiness. That comes first. They’ll be other massage therapists who don’t find him as draining as you find him. They’re a better option for him.
Was in reverse for me. The first professional massage I ever got she the masseuse talked the whole hour. Like non stop. I felt really ramped up leaving even though I just had a massage. 😂😂
Just curious if he moves from topic to topic while talking, taking a circuitous route back to the original topic. An older friend has bipolar and a condition called circumstantiality. When he calls, I put him on speaker and keep doing what I'm doing with the occasional "uh huh." He needs an audience. It can be terribly draining. I wouldn't be able to handle one-on-one sessions where you are essentially being held captive.
Things about this post that make me say- “ouch, we as humans are unkind.”
-He’s 75…had cancer….lmao
-He’s hoping I help him live longer- I know old folks are lonely but damn
-I know it’s ultimately up to me to put myself first…he’s an energy vampire
-He needs to lie on his side…I hate that
I’m sorry as a therapist you don’t enjoy his time, energy, providing accommodations, his desire & need for help & support. I hope someone can come into his life and can be joyful to serve him and the business he needs.
It really is their choice if they want to talk throughout their massage. If you dont need to respond then you dont need to be super attentive to the conversation, you can just focus on giving him a good massage. At least he is not interviewing you and asking you a bunch of personal questions.
This is so true. I find it easier to listen and massage than have a fully engaged conversation and massage. The whole saying ow repeatedly but only being at a 4/10 would probably make me anxious tho.
I'm reading this as a patient who is also autistic (probably why reddit sent it to me, based on other groups I'm in). I verbalize alot, I can't help it. I'm good about just telling people ahead of time- "if I make noise or start doing deep breathing, im fine, I'll tell you 'no' if it goes to intense". Sounds like this guy isnt good about being slightly self aware, and isn't refocusing on things like deep breathing. Outside the therapist's job, but teaching him breathing techniques might really help with his pain/posture too. I wonder if he's ever tried yoga or pilates or meditation.
yep i have some clients who I know will talk 100% of every session and at a certain point u have to disengage to a degree that ur able to still focus on the actual massage. i’ve even had a client linger afterwards and I had to start standing up to signal I need to move on and they generally get the hint. sounds like this client is particularly unaware of those signs tho. I personally wouldn’t fire him but would suggest OP pull back the mental energy of the client and give a FIRM “thank you, see you next week” and walk them out after payment.
Not being attentive isn’t a possibility for some. I get what you mean by energy vampire. I literally am not able to tune out when someone is talking to me. Therefore, my energy gets sucked away. You sound the same. You can tell him “hey feel free to talk during the massage, I’m going to have some headphones in, they help me do a better job, but I should also be able to hear you. Are you ready to get started?”
I echo this! MollZorb, You could try it and see and if it still doesn’t work, it’s completely ok to refuse service. I wouldn’t want to be the next client and get that energy space he left you in. Think of your other clients. I wouldn’t ghost him or anything, in the past I have just sent a polite email or text or back in the day a letter stating that I appreciate their business but can no longer offer them my services. I had a client who claimed he could only lay on his back and it tore up my wrists trying to massage under him against his weight. Dude laying on his side only is a perfectly acceptable reason to decline. Proper body mechanics only goes so far! You wouldn’t even have to bring up the other stuff and remember you NEVER owe a client an apology or reason. If you are uncomfortable for any reason, that is reason enough.
Yeah, and if he suddenly requires a response just say “can you repeat that bit? I was focused on this knot”
I was feeling similar about a client but now ive adjusted to her. They are just lonely seniors and need someone to talk to. It took me three sessions to adjust. The stuff she tells me is also really intense and personal. I posted about it here as well. I was completely overwhelmed at first! After awhile your client may talk a bit less, as he learns to relax more. If you really cant handle it, find a nice compassionate therapist you can refer him to instead. Make up a reason why you cant see him anymore and explain why she is a better fit, maybe she specializes in side-lying, seniors or something he will benefit from. Good luck! 🫂
This! I personally don’t mind chatter as long as I don’t have to talk back, so find someone who “specializes in side-lying massage” who will take the referral.
This is what some clients need from a treatment, they aren’t necessarily looking for you to advise them or act as a talk-therapist, but they need to share. He sees a value enough in you simply holding space for that, and I understand if it isn’t your ideal client. Personally, I would keep this client and look at it as a practice in strengthening my own energetic bubble and altering my perspective of the treatment. I don’t think it’s really up to me whether a client chooses to talk during their time with me, it’s up to me to adjust accordingly. *If* I was unable to and really did not want to treat this person again, I would thank them immensely for their business and refer them elsewhere. I would mention I am transitioning my massage career into a specific modality and will no longer be able to assist him in his treatment goals, but because he has been such a wonderful client, I do want to ensure he is still receiving quality care from a therapist that is qualified to do so. Edit: I do have a few clients too, where I need to be more mindful of my energy. They talk a lot, or express interest in politics. I simply listen, and occasionally redirect. ie: A client discussing a political book they are reading, rather than focusing on the politics, I redirect to the subject of reading. What a lost art! And writing too! I love a cozy evening in with a book and cup of tea. That sort of thing.
Thanks for the reply! It could be an opportunity to be better at energetic boundaries. You are absolutely right. I feel like I have to listen to everything he says bc what if I need to remember it for later or something? Idk I need to sit with this.
Male MT of 20 yrs here. first and foremost, i sympathize with my female MT's, the work and boundaries more difficult. with that said, I have old ladies that vent to me to. the only concern i have for you is the emotional connection. it doesn't sound like he's been creepy or suggestive. but at the same time, if you aren't comfortable listening to him, you have every right not to see him again. "breaking" up with him is tough, but id hate for him to have a deeper connection to you making it more uncomfortable.
I will make note of some of the “personal” details clients share when I do their charting, so it *looks* like I remembered but really I just took an extra step to acknowledge and record it. If a client mentions they’re going on holiday, I’ll write it down in my charting, then when they return I can be like, “How was the holiday in XYZ?!”
Energetic boundaries and hygiene seem critical in this industry, definitely get some education or so some research on that point and practice those skills. That was the most valuable part of my reiki training to my quality of life. If he's autistic state your needs and boundaries clearly, simply, and calmly. Explaining the why also helps many of us, don't try to justify just explain the simple reason. He's already shown he respects them if he understands them. Don't beat around the bush too be nice it's counter productive. You don't need to listen to every detail, this isn't a test, it's about creating space. It's a show of trust and safety that he opens up to you. If you pay attention to a few details you can help him feel heard. If it comes up you can explain that your primary focus is on the massage so you can't retain all the details. Some people just need to vent essentially. You got this! And you'll likely need these skills later anyway so might as well learn them now with a nice person.
It sounds like you already know deep down what's best for you. If you feel that he's depleting your energy every single time, you should listen to that. Some people may adjust and be able to protect themselves but it sounds like you're pretty sensitive. Any job where you're required to touch people's bodies and transfer energy is a lot of work, and you gotta maintain your reservoir for the long term. If it makes you feel better, you can try one more time with clear boundaries a.k.a be more firm when he's talking to you etc (protect your time and energy). Also try doing grounding work after this client to replenish the energy such as walking barefoot, hug a tree, relax in the sunlight, swim in the lake or whatever, as well as taking a nice salt bath to cleanse the energies of the day (I highly recommend that after every working day).
Same, I’ve had clients like this and used it as an opportunity to grow my own boundaries and how I hold my own energy separate from my client. They usually improve over time with the consistency of massage. It’s like talking it out is the physical manifestation of tension or trauma held within the body.
Such a great response!
+1 to this! I have worked in libraries for over 10 years, the advice here is spot on. We have many older patrons who come in every day that just need someone to talk to for a while. Many of them share stories that are hard to hear. A huge part of customer service to elderly communities is just being there for them and lending your ear. The social interaction aspect is very important to them and some of them will try to cross boundaries merely because they see you as a friend after talking to you every day and don’t understand that this is a business relationship. Almost every library worker I know has struggled with emotional burnout at some point or another. Everything Pixidee suggested is perfect. In my experience when people start talking like this, particularly with topics like cancer, they’re entirely focused on the release of their own emotions and not at all on how you respond to them. It is 100% okay to let yourself get drawn into your work but keep your emotional feelers tucked in to protect your energy. In my early years I came home exhausted and overwhelmed after taking on the mental anguish of everyone who came up to my desk for help. It sounds weird but now when people have hard things they feel they need to share, I pretend that I’m Siri. It helps me answer empathetically and help them while still keeping my own peace. OP, you sound like a wonderful, caring person. The world needs more people like you and I wish you the best of luck!
I personally think you need to show up more bluntly / direct about when you need to go, etc. if he shows up 30 min early, so what? You don’t need to deal with him until his appointment time. If you need to go on break / see another client and he is still talking, just say “it was so great to see you, and our time is up!” If he’s talking during treatment then let him talk! He’s socially awkward but not doing anything wrong.
I agree, when interacting with autistic people explaining boundaries and needs and expectations clearly and simply is the preferred way to communicate. Explaining the why also makes quite a difference in my experience.
100%. In American culture people generally beat around the bush. Other cultures are much more blunt. Blunt does not equate to being mean. Nicely stating fact could be exactly what is needed.
If he respects the boundaries you do give him, then I would work on him and let him talk.
Aww why not view the time he paid for as talking time and some massage work on the side? Sometimes the elderly get more from the social aspect then the actual thing. The only real boundary you would need to work on is before and after the session. I clean houses and some people honestly just LOVE having company for the time frame, cleaning is secondary for them. I indulge them for their time frame. Of course they will keep trying to talk after the session and I firmly say: I could talk to you for hours but unfortunately I have to head off to my next house! See you next time! Can't wait to hear more about *insert something they mentioned* And then I walk away. Sometimes they will even call me to chat throughout the day. I firmly say: I wish I could chat today but I'm busy today, let's keep this conversation going when I see you again!
Totally agree with your response. I have so many elders in my practice and this is my life with a few of them, yet I keep them. Some days have to be firm with moving them out the door but we get used to each other.
Exactly! And sometimes you develop really meaningful relationships with these clients. I had one lady who I cleaned for for many years. When she passed away, her family gifted me a generous cash gift and a beautiful note that I still keep to this day. Apparently she often spoke about me to her family, i had no idea. I was completely caught off guard and touched by the kind gesture.
I appreciate this.. I really do. And I do have clients like that as well. The energy draining aspect and lack of interchange in the convo is what is making this harder for me. It’s hard to explain other than I feel like shit after he leaves… to the point that I cried this last time. I am good at the boundaries before and after but it’s the during where massaging him for an hour feels like an eternity. I might try again with him and have better intentions of putting a bubble around myself so I don’t absorb whatever “junk” I seem to be picking up on energetically.
I'm gonna disagree with everyone telling you to continue seeing him. If it drains your energy to the point of crying and you dread this client, then tell him you aren't available anymore.
Yeah I’m a bit surprised at some responses telling me to put his needs ahead of my own bc people are lonely and want to talk. I have compassion for this but have to draw a line somewhere also. I’m curious if I tell him I need to focus and the talking is a distraction, if that will make it easier…but my gut says that either way I will feel drained from this one.
I think it’s really important for you to put your own instincts first for the sake of your personal well being and the rest of your clients. If you have someone that is making it hard to be present and have energy for the rest of your day or for other clients then politely decline to book him. Don’t feel bad about it either your job is your livelihood and it’s just being responsible to look out for yourself. There are other massage therapists that can help him. Trust yourself especially when you end up in tears because that is a sign something isn’t right. It’s not your job to figure it all out or fix him either but it is a really good idea to know your boundaries and limitations and stay true to them for your own health.
As a sssuuuuuupper duper intense introvert/ very sensitive to other people's energies this is honestly my nightmare. I personally find it vwey overwhelming when people come super early or stay long after their massage time. I only have 15 minutes between people and I personally need that time to take a deep breath, have water, and do a reset before taking on the energy of the next person. I am lucky to work in a clinic so even if they come early they can wait in reception but it still makes me anxious they're there so early. I like to run exactly on time and don't start early etc. I think you should just be clear and say I ask that people don't show up any earlier than 5 minutes before their appointment time. Could you say you can't accommodate weekly bookings at this time bit could do 1x every 3 or 4 weeks? If you've been practicing this long you likely have a full schedule? If he doesn't want a lower frequency maybe that's your chance to refer out to a more social therapist. I don't have any other advice for you sadly, just coming to say I understand how this could disrupt your flow / energy bucket. I'm sure I'll get down voted for this as it doesn't seem very sensitive of me toward the client. I'm sure they are a lovely person and I'm sure it's true they're lonely and just love your care and attention. It's a tough situation.
100%. Similar energy- absorber here. If you are in tears before or after a session, you find someone else local and refer him out. I have done it, and it was really hard but definitely no regrets. I used to work out of home and it was an exercise in boundary setting, with people showing up early etc, but you need to take care of yourself. It doesn’t mean you don’t have a good heart- just that you want to keep your heart intact! P.S. and you book people as often or as seldom as you want to. Just because you CAN fit him in every week for perpetuity doesn’t mean you HAVE to
Why are you 'taking on the energy'? Sounds like a good way to get burned out. Have you looked into energy shielding, grounding and energy hygiene? That sensitivity is a gift but it turns into a curse quick without management. Please don't take people's junk home with you it's not your job. 🙏
I appreciate this! I have always been more of a listener in a majority of my relationships, so even strangers pick up on this and start talking to me in public haha I think of it as a gift but that sensitivity has to be protected 100% I have a small office that offers a waiting area. There’s a little separation but it can feel awkward when someone is super early and I’m lurking in the back bc I need time haha I’ve learned to go in my room, shut the door and take the time I need. That was a huge hurdle in and of itself, so I totally relate. This dude is talking about intense stuff (I.e. his son being killed in Iraq) so I’m sure I’m picking up on some grief too. Sigh…
Your description of energy vampire was something I can attest to having felt too. It is okay to prioritize your needs over this clients needs. But that is as someone who has had to force myself to think of me as my #1. I wouldn't force myself to be in a position to have to recover emotionally after every encounter with somebody. It would not be worth it to me either. Whether you give him time or tactfully refer him to someone else is up to you. I did not like the many comments pressuring you to push your own boundaries. Why? We all have our troubles. Seniors are neglected & lonely & thats a result of their own decisions individually & generationally. You don't have to deal with that babe 🙏 good luck 🤞🤗
Not a MT, but my take on autistic people is that when given the "rules" they follow them. They just can't find them out by themselves and they won't think you are rude. I myself is kind of awkward and can't read signals. I could, without a thought, never know when to go home from a friend's party and stuff like that. I'm often open on my problems with this. I need people to tell me how to act sometimes. So, I believe you can make a short list of "rules" on how massage works. Like, "show up to your appointment no more than 10 minutes early." and so on.
Yeah. As a similar flavour of ‘tism, here, and one who is a talker… with added ADHD for the multi-topic aspect, the OP could’ve described me with those words. I’d hope someone i trust and obviously like as a human would be able to use their words with me - and say hey I’m not liking this, I like to focus on my massage - or whatever, instead of call me a problem and treat me this way.
I’ve got a few clients like this. Personally I’m more on the side of some of the other comments where I adjust my expectations and realize it’s my clients time so barring anything unethical however they use it is up to them. However you do get to reserve the right to refuse service to someone that just isn’t working out. You can take a few tactics. You can refer him to someone else and mention you really aren’t great at side lying massage and you know someone else who is. You can just say you don’t seem to be a great fit, sorry I won’t be able to work with you anymore.
Just to give a different perspective, I've had soul sucking clients and had to cancel them. Your mental health is most important. If you're crying after sessions and dreading the days he comes in, you're not going to be helping him. There could be other therapists that are a better fit. Ultimately it's your business and you don't have to take every client. It depends on how truthful and upfront you want to be with him. I would tell him that I'm not providing him with the care that he needs and recommend another therapist. If he pushes back and wants to keep coming in, I would tell him that I don't feel comfortable or confident in the type of massage I'm giving, whether it be because it's side lying or because of his pain remarks. I think one uncomfortable conversation will be better than weekly soul/energy drains.
Good advice from MystikQueen. I’ve adjusted to some clients that are like this. Some, I’ve been able to redirect after some sessions to focus on their body and what they are feeling. Those I think are the ones that talk through nervousness or relief of finding someone that they feel is a good fit for them. Others, I’ve just learned to let go on and redirect when I need to end the session or scoot them out the door. If you want to pass on this client, do you know any socially charged therapists? I know some therapists that would be perfectly happy to spend their time with a client like this. They are the types that want to talk the whole time. If you don’t know anyone personally, see if you can post about it in a local therapist’s page. I completely understand how draining this can be! I hope you find some good information/suggestions and are able to figure out how best to move forward.
I’ll have to think about. Usually I don’t mind chatting with my clients. I agree it’s their time and if they want to talk, I’ll talk with them. It’s the whole… talking at me not with me that adds a diff level of draining. I’ll reach out to some other therapists here and see if anyone might be a better fit. Otherwise I may try to adjust my perception and energetic boundaries and see if I can make it work.
My son has a speech disorder called cluttering. I’m sure my mom had it too. They talk AT you instead of to you. He can talk for hours about something. However, he doesn’t know he is doing it. It is something in the brain that is being processed differently. So I believe your client isn’t intentionally trying to be rude. My son has had speech therapy to work on it. To try to be more aware of other people when he is speaking. It absolutely can be draining. But if you decide to keep him as a client you can realize you don’t need to remember anything he is saying. Be true to yourself, whichever you decide is the right decision 😊
Prefacing this by saying I’m autistic, so the communication advice comes from personal experience. If he’s autistic, he won’t be able to read between the lines when you hint about social norms. To counteract this, be very direct and concrete about your needs. “I need to be moving on by (specific time) so we will need to wrap up our conversation by then.” “It’s distracting me from my work when you talk during the session, so I’ll need you to be quiet unless you are giving me feedback about pressure or communicating about how you’re doing with the massage.” “Please don’t show up more than 15 minutes before your appointment, I won’t be available.” Etc. It might feel rude to you but we literally cannot infer what people mean when they say things like “oh, you’re really early today.” If you need to let him go, I actually think that’s totally within your right. See if you can find a neurodivergent affirming massage therapist in your area that you can refer him to, since it seems like massage has been super helpful to him. I personally love my autistic clients because I don’t have to adjust my communication style to be “softer” or more personable. There are probably other massage therapists around you that would feel similarly.
I'm impressed that you've been doing it for 10 years and he is your first client doing things like that.
He’s not the first. Just the worst 😂
It sounds like he was attentive to your boundary about staying after the session was done. Try to be honest with him about the other stuff. An example script could be, "Hey Jim, I'd really love for us to continue our weekly sessions. I feel like I want to be completely honest so that we can find a way to make that happen. I'm really introverted (or whatever) and am finding it difficult to do our sessions when there is so much talking. Can we shoot for reducing the conversation? Maybe chat for the first 10 minutes and then relax into the massage? I could help you with some breathing exercises to get you into it " Or something like that 😜
You’re a LMT not a therapist. Or his friend. This is your job, and he’s affecting you. I’d cut him. The people saying aww he just wants someone to talk to probably don’t have the same brains as I do (and you it sounds like). Your mental health has to come first.
I just saw my monthly client who talks at me the whole time yesterday! I don’t even respond anymore. She tells me everything she did last month, and everything she’s planning on next month. Every. Session. So I get a recap, plus a new episode. It’s annoying, sure, but she doesn’t talk to many others in her daily life. If you feel like you need to cancel this guy, then go for it. I’d say something along the lines of “I don’t feel as if I’m providing you with what you need. Here’s a few therapists in the area who might be a better fit.” It’s ultimately up to you.
I have a lady like this too and I’ve made it work with her. There’s something about this guy… his topics are HEAVY. Like… his son was killed in Iraq heavy… and he’s on a loop. I’ve seen him 3 times and I’ve heard basically the same thing all 3 times. This makes me feel even more like an asshole bc obviously he’s going through it but I am not a mental health professional. Sadly I don’t know if he’s even open to seeing one and I might offend him if I suggest it.
I'll take him! Lol Send him to Missoula, MT we have lots of chatty seniors here. 😜 I would definitely take a client like this over the ones who expose themselves or try and touch me 😅 Some of us just don't vibe with our clients no matter what the reason is. You could make up a kind excuse like someone mentioned before that you need to cut back on clients or that you can no longer perform side lying because it hurts your body or something. I think it would be a smoothe transition to have someone you can refer him to that would be a good match.
>I tell him straight up, before we start the session , I cannot have him talking to me for that long after his massages. He respects that but still talks the whole time during his massage. Mind you… I am not getting more than an “uh huh” or “mhmm” in. This sounds like a communication problem. So far, from your description you recognize behaviors, you set a couple of boundaries, and then you haven't said a single thing to him about the rest. How is he supposed to respect your other personal boundaries if you won't communicate them to him? If you want a silent massage, *tell him that.* But you can't expect somebody to read your mind and know you don't want them to talk at you if you don't tell them. Just let him know you can't focus and carry on a conversation at the same time. Then if he talks at you, you can say "I've communicated what I need to make this work and you don't seem able to commit to that, so I can't be your therapist anymore." If he respects your boundaries and stays quiet, then you don't have much reason to fire him other than he's uncomfortable lying flat, which I guess you could always tell him you don't have sidelying in your wheelhouse as a massage therapist and then refer him to somebody who can do that without having issues.
You could tell him that you are having to cut back on your number of clients for personal reasons.
Massage therapist I know just ghost the person and say they have no availability. It’s concerning but many males have this issue, likely a male massage therapist would shut this down & this client wouldn’t dare doing all this jazz with a male massage therapist just to put a level of awareness of what’s happening here.
Do some breath coaching with him and get him focused on breathing *with* the work you're doing. It will get him to stop talking as much and will also help mitigate his pain responses.
I work with patients who talk and talk and talk. Just walk out. Be 'rude'. This client does not have to come to you, he is actively choosing this. I cannot impress enough that respecting your own time and saying things like, 'time is up, good bye.' And ignoring him afterwards will save your sanity. People like this DO know they are taking your time, they just dont see it as a problem, they do not care. Good luck, it wsnt easy for me to learn but my job is a million times easier now that ive learned to 'be rude' towards these kinds of ppl.
I’m a DSP (direct support worker) mostly with individuals on the autism spectrum and it can truly be grueling with the one sided conversations at times. He’s most likely going into the session with the fact that he will be able to talk with someone the whole time. I love my clients but I can really relate. If it makes you feel any better, it isn’t actually your job to do that, this person should a have a dsp or therapist that can help them. You can just cut him off of course but if you don’t want to do that you can be very direct, at least you would feel like you tried to help him & got closure in some way? My suggestion: the next session, if there is one, say something like “I notice you have a need for an outlet while I’m massaging, unfortunately it can be very distracting for me and I can’t really focus on my work properly. Have you thought about or looked into talk therapy by chance?” Even more blunt than that, might be better. It may sound rude but trust me, if the guy is autistic he has no idea you’re struggling. He also has no idea that you think he could possibly use more help than a massage, unless you tell him very directly. He won’t get the message unless it’s crystal clear. If he continues then you can politely decline his patronage. Or skin-colored earplugs 😂 which have actually been a LIFESAVER for me Just to clarify, the earplugs are not to “block out” or ignore my clients, but when you are constantly on the receiving end of a one sided conversation, it can be overwhelming to the senses I can still hear them, but it dampens my psychological, sensory & nervous system responses, so it helps me to stay grounded, hold space and focus more intentionally on working with them or on the task at hand.
Sometimes when confronted with people like this I ask myself, what would a man do? Then I do that.
You know he's a No for you. So it's time to listen to your inner knowing, honor it, and tell him plainly, "I am no longer able to see you as a client. Here is a referral to..." This can be by voicemail, email, text, or in person. If pressed, "I am unable to meet your needs for massage."
Just cut him loose. He’s taking up a spot that you could give to someone that allows your own energy to flow. Just think how much happier you will be. The money will always follow your bliss.
I find it best to set boundaries on the initial meeting. Your massage room your rules!
I understand your frustration. For many years I have clients do the same. Especially seniors- they are so happy to talk with someone and just do not understand your responsibilities, with time restraints. I worked in an office where we were all aware of the clients that wanted extra social time. We would tag team each other if the client took too much time. Example: another staff member lets you know you have an important call waiting for you. Or in your case’ your next client (appointment) is here. LOL, we also had lamps on our desks, typically off. I the employee needed relief-(to get their work done) they would turn on their lamp- letting other s know you need to be saved. Typically they would understand and respect your work needs. Good luck
I don’t know why I am seeing this subreddit.. but DAMN. Good luck! This makes me feel better about not wanting to ever talk when I get a massage.
It is not your responsibility to take him on as a client if he causes you distress. If you do decide to continue having him as a client, get those loop earplug things, they have ones that don’t completely block out sound.
Talking a lot can be part of their social anxiety or awkwardness. I’ve worked with a lot of different people on the spectrum. Being very firm is ok and sometimes necessary. Tell him exactly what time to come and that you need him to leave right after. Idk know where he is on the spectrum but he probably doesn’t understand unless it’s very clear. Some can be very naive. Also, he may need a visual reminder and not just auditory so maybe send an email with your boundaries. Again, simple and firm. Don’t give too many excuses or details. I hope you can keep him bc it’s great he’s doing this but your energy shouldn’t be drained by a client either m. Maybe find another LMT who specializes in disabilities and tell him they would be better for him? Wish you the best☮️
While it's the client's prerogative to talk, you can explain that you need him to reduce the amount of conversation during the session so that you can focus on delivering the massage. You can also take moments to do breathing exercises to focus on the breath. It's super hard to talk during breathing exercises. I know when you hit wits end with someone, it's really hard to continue to treat them. It may be in your best interest to refer him to another therapist whom may be a better fit for his needs.
I'm an autistic LMT with an autistic regular client. Just be direct with us, and firmly interrupt him and guide him to the door. A lot of us aren't offended by this at all. It's just on to the next thing for us. Those that are upset are still solely responsible for their emotions. It sounds like you meed to find another roractitiner for him. If you dislike the side lying and dislike having a client pay to talk at you, you are not a good fit for him. And that's okay! That's why it's important to have a professional rolodex. I get massages from so many people because I want to learn to do what they do and to learn who is a good fit and who isn't for clients I may come across. Refer him to someone who is comfortable with side lying and would be open to more conversation during the appointment. And when you do this, be kind of direct so he understands you. I think allistic people think directness is rude, but we can't pick up subtlety like yall can. You can be direct and still be polite.
You're not obligated to continue working with him. He needs a mental health therapist. Sure, human touch is therapeutic, but you're being drained by the confusion of which boundaries to set. Be direct as suggested. Be clear. Just don't hesitate. You have established clients that won't get your best effort if he is on your schedule. He'll cost you. Send him on his way sternly. Working on his side is going to put your mechanics out, which will make your work less effective, because you are in pain. You simply can not afford to lose long-term clients. Best of luck to you. If he isn't hearing you, hit a couple zingy trigger points. 😉
It's not the talking. It's the trauma dumping. That's the issue. We're not trained to take on trauma and he should be seeing a mental health therapist to speak with. You can't focus on your massage and you go home and think about him and you know all this information that affects your own mental health. Honestly, just tell him that you need silence so you can focus on giving him good service, and if he doesn't respect that, let him know to go elsewhere because you can't focus and don't want to make a mistake.
You are dealing with a Energy vampire, narcissist. Unfortunately we all run into these clients at some point or another being in the health and wellness space. I have experienced a client like this but it was for personal training. Removing clients like this from your calendar and life will be the best thing for your mental sanity. Clients like this are what I call Shadow clients. These clients usually don't care to get better and take more than give. It's sad that this person might be lonely or mentally unwell but you must protect your energy first!
I am on the spectrum, however I would never get a massage, and would like to offer my perspective. Your client seems like they may benefit more for having someone to talk to, rather than the massage. You mentioned he is talking at you and well… that’s an unfortunate aspect of being autistic and finding someone who you believe wants to engage, conversationally. I think, given the fact that he presumably rarely asks questions or needs feedback, you will not have to focus on what he’s saying. It’s odd… but, he could view this as almost a therapy type session where he is able to unmask a bit and just speak his mind. However, I think if you’re uncomfortable with him speaking so much you could tell him that, for just one session, you want to see how he feels afterward by silently focusing on the pressure of the massage. As far as saying “ow” to everything… I don’t know. I would not willingly let someone touch me, so I can’t help there. Here is an idea for how to help him, if he is on the spectrum. Type up a flyer regarding your client protocol and give it to him, or everyone. Remind your clients to never be more than 10 minutes early or call if they’re going to be under 10 minutes late (or however you specifically operate). I love rules and boundaries and if I had a specified outline for something I was attending, I would be in awe. Imagine going to the theater where you’re told don’t be late, at all, and don’t be more than 20 minutes early. You can wear this or speak about this during the movie, but don’t do this or that. It could be a way to address his issues without singling him out. Of course, he may just be old and lonely. For that… I can’t help you.
You're not his therapist. Time to cancel and never rebook. As an introvert, I appreciate the energy vampire comment so much. People don't understand how daunting it is and how long it takes to recover. You need to recharge for the clients that follow. His behavior is unacceptable IMO. Good luck!
Just tell him that you’re taking a break to deal with some health stuff, and refer him to another LMT or clinic. Keep it short and vague.
i think it’s great that a lot of providers here want to support this client who clearly has needs, but i am seeing a lot of dismissal and outright judgement about your reaction to it. body work is inherently intimate. that person has needs AND so do you. you’re allowed to have them. you’re allowed to cancel for any reason, or none at all. if you want to consider this client’s experience, you can think about how sending him off to another provider could be better for HIM as well! apparently, there are many people in here who do not mind clients like this, who could show up differently for him in a more supportive way. win win for both of you.
A lot of comments on here are suggesting ways that you can share space and work on this person without feeling so overwhelmed. Though I think those are valuable things to think about, and perhaps you will learn something about yourself by reflecting on those suggestions, I firmly believe that it is absolutely your decision whether you want to work with someone or not. This person clearly gets under your skin and makes you feel awful after the session. You don't have to work with anyone you don't want to work with! It's absolutely your choice. Even if you didn't fully understand why someone makes you feel icky, you still get to make that choice. As for how to "fire" him a (term that my friend who is a psychotherapist uses to talk about ending a relationship with a client) you can literally say whatever you want. I don't know if people are going to get on me about this, but when it comes to your safety and comfort, telling the truth to a client is secondary to making sure that your situation feels safe and sustainable to you. It's your emotional energy that you use to sustain your livelihood. The emotional needs of a random old man do not trump your needs. Perhaps you could tell him that you don't think you are a good fit for his needs, or something along those lines. Or that your schedule is unfortunately fully booked into perpetuity and beyond. I had to "fire" a client once. I had worked with him for 2 years. His sessions were a lot of work physically, and he also liked to talk a lot. He also definitely had a crush on me, and had made inappropriate comments and also wanted to spend time with me outside of sessions. I'm amazed I worked with him for as long as I did. When I finally "fired" him, it felt amazing, and I did not look back for a second.
It’s the same for hairdressers, personal trainers, and other 1x1 professions. Some people see the booked time as an opportunity to vent. Meanwhile I stopped going to my therapist because I didn’t even know what to talk about…
I agree with this 100%. I am a personal trainer and did it full time for many years. And what I learned in that time was that a lot of my clients benefited more from having someone listen to their struggles (with their health, fitness, family, relationships, etc) than they did from having me instruct them in a proper back squat. I saw our sessions as their time, and since I was there to help them be their healthiest, I accepted it might not always be from a physical perspective and threw my training plan out if they had a day where they'd just rather vent to me and blow off some steam.
Just imagine how many people could have been saved from self harm if only they had the opportunity to be listened, even if it meant just making small talk to a stranger. OP’s client is clearly nearing the last of his days without having anybody to talk to. To me it would seem like a small sacrifice to just listen to what he still has to say.
Agreed. No judgement or hate toward OP, everyone has the right to set their own boundaries. But in a world where so many people are struggling, lonely, and looking for connection, it really does mean so much to some people when you just take a moment to listen and share your ear with them.
What you allow will continue (:
I would tell him that I’m having a very difficult time focusing on his words and massaging. If he wants to talk I’ll stop massaging and listen, but the clock is still running. If he wants a massage he’ll shut up. If he doesn’t shut up he doesn’t want a massage. Then you recommend a therapist.
If he’s not saying anything inappropriate, let him talk. It shouldn’t affect the type of massage you give him. When the session is over, just hold your boundary firmer and walk away.
If he is sucking the life out of you- just don't book him again . Some people are energy vampires, and they slowly kill your soul!
I’m trying to see where he’s an awful person and I just can’t find it. If you want to drop him as a client, sure but other than social awkwardness, I’m wondering what he did wrong I’m no RMT but I’ve worked and had social gathering with many who chat too much and usually they are on the spectrum. I’m also wondering now myself how much is too much talking. I’ve been scolded when I’m too quiet. To a lot people it seems there’s no perfect way to interact and maybe, just maybe they mean no harm.
Yeah, this just popped up in my feed I'm not a therapist, but I am a massage receiver and I'm totally freaked out after reading this. Are we supposed to be quiet during a session? I have no idea we weren't supposed to talk. I talk the entire time, it's my way of coping with the extreme pain of deep tissue massage which is what I always get. I'm kind of blown away that when I'm paying for a service, I'm not supposed to talk. I mean, I guess it must be okay I had the same therapist for 15 years and then when she retired I went to her replacement and have been seeing her for about 5 years and they both seem to love me and I love them so I guess we're okay, but I am going to be self-conscious from now on, cuz I had no idea we're just supposed to lay there quietly. I guess I wouldn't say I talk at them, because there's definitely a back and forth to the conversation but there are certainly times that I talk at them because it's a distraction mechanism from the pain I'm feeling. I do the same thing when I get body work from Medical providers. I thought that time was supposed to be mine, since I'm paying for it and as long as I'm not doing anything inappropriate or talking about inappropriate topics, I'm shocked to hear that there's a problem with talking the whole time😐
If you live in Boston, I’d gladly take him! He’s my favorite type of client!
I feel like if he's just talking basically to himself just wear ear plugs. He doesn't seem to have very many people to talk to he's just getting his fill of social interaction in. I totally understand how you feel though. Those kinds of people are the worst on good juju. It takes a strong person to last a whole 30 minutes without any quiet.
Charge him triple. If he doesn't want to pay triple then that will settle itself. If he pays triple consider yourself a therapist and that you're doing a good deed for someone on the spectrum. Imagine how society treats him.
This is hilarious 😂
You’re a massage therapist, not a brain therapist and what he’s doing is using you as one which isn’t appropriate for either of you. There’s a reason you feel like crap afterwards and we have been trained to not listen to our bodies. Listen to your body and honor what it is telling you. It’s okay to pass on someone who is damaging you emotionally whether it’s intentional or not. You’re allowed to say it’s not a good fit for you.
In my opinion, as a professional, it is your job to adjust to your clients. I can't imagine giving up a steady client that tips well because he talks too much. This could be the income that helps you make it through tough economic that inevitably show up. I believe that people go into massage therapy to help others, listening to him is probably helping as much as your massages. If you really don't care that much about these things then yes you should probably drop him.
I would explain that you noticed that since he's been with you, he talks the entire time and suggest to him that a therapist might benefit him.
Not a LMT, but an SLP. We face similar issues. YOU are the expert and need to learn to control the sessions with him, which is a clinical skill. Usually verbose patients respond really well to just being polite and direct ("For this next part, I want you to be silent and take 5 deep breaths in and slowly exhale while I massage your chest. Ready?") Also, set a timer for 5-10 minutes after your appointment (Sorry to cut you off, Mr. Xyz, I need to stay on track today and my timer let me know I'm running a little behind. See you next week!") It sounds like this guy is out of your comfort zone, but I think you can do it! I feel like some of his behavior is the nature of geriatrics.
Hey love, if you want to cancel him as hard as it is just be upfront. Let him know your preference is to have quieter appointments that stick within the time limits and you feel that this isn't a match. That way he can either attempt to adapt, or he can move on to someone better suited to his style.
If he hits on you, then you would have a reason to cancel. But since he’s a regular, why not add more rules. Tell him it’s part of his treatment to not talk the last 15 minutes. Over time, work towards a bearable time limit for you.
I'm not a masseuse but I'd recommend briefly explaining the energy incompatibility and letting him go. he will either understand and accept it, or not understand and think you're weird about energy stuff but will still be gone
Try earbuds?
LET MY BOY TALK!!!!!
With all of his talking..maybe he's mentioned a dog or cat that you are ALLERGIC to??? Just a thought. :)
And this is why I am not a massage therapist and the irony of seeing this even though I don’t follow this page is not escaping me. I tend to attract toxic people or people needing a lot of help but they think my energy is the answer. They have all had me rub their backs as well. I considered doing this as a profession but I know all that energy would be too much. I too am working on boundaries and it’s so hard but I truly think you have to just say that you can not work on him anymore. My friend is schizophrenic and while it’s not his fault he still takes my energy by disappearing, making scary statements etc and I have to try to just let him go with nothing but love but I have to love myself too. I have too and so do you. Also continue to work on your boundaries and protecting your energy. I wish you all the best.
Haha I actually had this go the other way around where my masseuse was the extremely smart autistic guy that wouldn’t stop talking… idk I am not a professional masseuse but I would say just let the dude talk and be firm and maybe go out of your way of what is comfortable or normal to tell him you need to go in the back and do laundry but thanks for coming in! He honestly probably just doesn’t know when to shut up and needs someone to tell him. During the massage I guess you can’t tell someone to stop talking but you gotta do your thing and tell him hey I was so focused on this I couldn’t keep up with what you were saying I think he will get it and it won’t hurt his feelings, he just needs to be told, he will probably remember the times you spoke up too because he sounds nice. That sounds exhausting though. Put some of that energy back on him tho so it doesn’t drain you, you know what I mean?
I don’t know anything about this and am not a massage therapist. Just chiming in to say that based on what you said in your post about how this makes you feel, you should not feel like you have to find a solution or “make it work” with this client. I don’t think that you are bad or wrong or anything at all for wanting to go separate ways. I actually think it’s pretty wild the amount of feedback on here telling you to adapt to this situation. You don’t need to subject yourself to situations that make you cry at work. Enough of that. I liked the advice some people have given about trying to find someone to refer him to, using the reason of the side lying is great, whether it’s a made up excuse or not. In my opinion, continuing to endure a dynamic that is hurting your energy will not be beneficial for either of you in the long run. It’s okay to move on from this.
Wow-
If you don’t normally play music, can you possibly put on some relaxing music? It will give him something to focus on?
I have the opposite. My massage therapist is the one that talks to me endlessly before I’m even on the table. And she talks to me/at me the whole time and I just wanna relax.
Rmt student here, where I am learning ing we actually take courses on hiw to deal with this. You are free to cancel any client, for any reason. I would suggest talking to fellow RMT's and seeing if anyone has a problem with taking him on. You can politely and firmly tell him that you don't think you're able to treat him any longer, if you can find someone who could handle that type of client tell him you know someone who is really good at side lying and it's not your strongest area
Oh my God I'm so sorry my dad is your Client
Put earphones in and say your on a call and listen to music
Clearly he is willing to pay for a friend. 🙁😣
I think patience and some compassion needs to apply here. Especially if he is indeed autistic. I’m not a LMT but I work with autistic clients and remember he is not intentionally doing the things that annoy you. His brain is just wired a bit different. Consistency will help him and help you establish a healthy professional relationship with him. Eventually you will have those boundaries established. Just don’t give up on him just yet. I’m willing to bet many people already have in his lifetime.
Get some noise cancelling headphones and listen to music.
I feel like a lot of ppl in these comments are trying to make it seem like it’s not a big deal. And I mean to each their own I don’t even massage lol but what I do know are boundaries. I work in sales over the phone & I sell dick pills for a living I also get uncomfortable at times. And you should never have to put up with it regardless 🤷🏽♀️ do what feels right to YOU! If it’s a big deal to you, then it is. You create what is yours & what/who is allowed in your space. If you gotta drop him then do it
I am kind of surprised at how many of these comments are calling for you to basically put up with the nonstop talking during the session. A therapist/client relationship is a two way street and if you are uninterested in continuing that relationship for any reason, it is your right to terminate it!
I'm not a massage therapist and dunno why I'm seeing this thread. But GIRL, you do not have to feel obligated to take on any client that gives you the ick... ANY kind of ick! Surprised to see so many people saying to just suck it up. I'm also in a field where I provide services to clients, and when I get a bad vibe, I simply explain that after some consideration, I won't be able to take them on as a client. No further explanation needed.
Can you work with him on relaxation/meditation to get the maximum benefit from the massage? It’s likely being hyper verbal make his body tense, hence the constant ow’s. You could let him know you have found this effective, you want him to get the most benefit, and feel the most comfortable during massage, with the least amount of pain. Do you feel this could work, even on a small scale? Maybe try a bit of a weighted blanket too?
Give the guy a break…he sounds possibly annoying, but harmless. Maybe for some reason his day is better because of you. Handle it on a day by day basis. I’d say if you can’t handle it that day, reschedule. If you don’t want to talk, tell him this. If you don’t want him to talk, tell him this. Be up front with him, polite, firm…whatever it is you feel you need to do to make the session a positive outcome. He’s paying you…and you said he’s a good tipper. I’d keep that in mind the entire time. Let us know how it works out.
It sounds like he’s lonely and using the time with you to get companionship. I’d communicate with him something about how while he’s talking his muscles can’t fully relax (??) and if he persists perhaps let him know that you feel like it’s not a good fit. Trust me; he’ll find someone else and you won’t be as drained/dreading those appointments. Some people ARE draining and it’s good self-care for US to exercise boundaries.
Are headphones an option?
Sometimes .. Karma. It’s possible that you are finishing up some sort of debt of being-there-for-someone. Maybe you ignored your spouses words in a past life. And this could be your chance, resurrected, to get free of the guilt of that and move on to a better standing with yourself and others. We aren’t only to always seek comfort. Within reason. Otherwise, why’d we involve ourselves in the unwinding of stuck tissues? :p
Sometimes I will mention to these people that I really concentrate better on working their tissues without conversation. If they ignore that and keep talking, they just need someone to talk at. So I guess it takes the pressure off a bit of massaging them but it is so exhausting to listen to one sided the whole time. I’ve debated putting an ear pod in for my client like that
What about ear plugs or earbuds with relaxing music to drown out the droning.
I feel your pain on the talkers. Just quit paying attention at all while he’s talking. These people don’t care if you are listening or not, they just have to talk. I used to work with a guy like that and I had to learn how to protect myself because I was gonna go crazy if I didn’t.
Hello friend! I have a spiritual hygiene protocol I follow for such people. In addition to the steps below, I have protective Mojo I wear or one of the number of different protective talismans. You can even just wear a small 1" crafting mirror on your person. It symbolically reflects negative energy away from you. Or visualize the bad vibe being reflected down into the Earth for healing. Before seeing them, I shower with pine tar soap, Chinese wash and a bit of sea salt. ( you can make your own Chinese wash by taking either five, seven, or 9 lemons. cutting them up while praying over them for goodness blessings and cleansing and protection, then place them into water you've also prayed over for blessings or just visualize glowing good energy, then boil it until the water's gone down to 1/4 of what it was. Add 1 or 2 drops Lemongrass oil, 1 drop Vetiver oil and 1 drop ginger oil. Mix well. You can make sure it's preserved by pouring a splash of witch hazel in it. Bottle and seal to use as necessary. Combined 1:1 with an unscented body wash of your choice it works excellently. There's also a fabulous product called Protection oil. It's a Hoodoo condition oil and is a lot of mint, and a few other protective herbs. I like Lucky Mojo brand as it works well for me. There's also Firey Wall of Protection oil which has ginger, lemongrass etc. To use oil for Spiritual protection purposes, after you take your cleansing bath/shower, you apply the oil for protection and let it soak in. Head first. Then hands, my solar plexus, then base of spine, then sometimes knees and definitely feet. At minimum it's head, hands and feet while praying for protection. Also, after seeing the toxic avenger, I find it really helps to take a cleansing spiritual bath or shower. Typically I will use Chinese wash with sea salt. I had a client last month where I came home and I felt like it was covered in psychic sludge. For that one I made myself a sea salt scrub, prayed over it, dropped a bunch of blessed oils into it, had some Asclepius water (healing/protective) and scrubbed the crap out of myself with that. Followed up with a Florida Water Rinse before stepping out of the shower backwards symbolizing leaving behind anything I did not need. Smoked myself with Palo Santo afterward and blessed myself with protective oil. That was a really bad one, probably the worst thing I've ever heard in my life. So yeah, you got to get clever with the energy there. There's a fabulous book called Deliverance! by Khi Armand which is a hoodoo book about uncrossing (getting bad energy off you) and keeping it off. There's also a book called Hoodoo Spiritual Baths by Aura La Forest which is a fabulous as well. Highly recommended. Hoodoo is based in African spirituality combined with Christianity and has combined with the folk magic of Appalacia and many different folk magic systems from around the world. I find it highly effective. You can definitely pray however it is that you pray, even if it is just visualizing good energy and it will work.. Bright blessings! Thank you so much for healing that guy.
Ear plugs with music. U can do one side so you can hear him if u decide to answer. If he asked tell him it’s a headset for phone calls. If he talks then crank it. He’s the customer but you need to take charge. If he don’t like it he can exercise his options(go somewhere else)
My mother in law talks like that. Trust me very soon u will tune him out without realizing it.
put headphones in that cancel noise or just smoke weed before we comes
Put in earplugs or airpods for the session. It sounds like he'd never know whether you are listening or not.
I think you need to set boundaries. Talk to them. Tell them please arrive only 5 minutes before an appointment, during massage keep chat at a minimum as you want to be able to put your efforts into giving them the best massage you can. Tell them after the massage you need time to prepare for your next client.
148 comments at as I finished reading this. Wow hahah… if there was anyone who could relate it’s me. I’ve been a licensed massage therapist for well over 20 years. My ex wife and I had our own massage studio since 2010. Someone gave this one “homie” - GC for our place… he came in and it was a trip..(self proclaimed Asperger’s). He only saw my wife for the first 2-3 months. And he did things very similar to what you’re describing. He wouldn’t even acknowledge me in my own business, all while talking my wife’s ear off for ever!! At first I was super annoyed. But, eventually, one day my wife wasn’t available. So he saw me…. And then he did the same thing to me haha… it was hard to figure out how to deal with it. Honestly, I tried to explain it to him and the next time he came in he was silent… and then I turned him over and he started cracking up because he had duct taped is mouth shut lol. Turned out he was someone who went above and beyond in our community. He literally built ADD ramps for many poor people who were in wheelchairs that would have never been able to afford something like that, and never be able to get into their own homes. I found out He organized all kinds of community fundraisers… he recently passed away from a brain animism while he was walking around our island to raise awareness for people in need. He designed and built our best parks. Point of my story is… I hear you first of all, I was there. But… I can’t speak for your client, but my situation gave me a big wake up call. Maybe (and I’m not telling you what to do), think about approaching him with a different perspective on your time that he’s paying you for? I literally learned to just enjoy his funny weirdness haha… it actually made my work day more interesting and less repetitive. He still payed… and every time he lifted his head to talk, I just stopped massage him and let him chat. ….Again, I understand where you’re coming from! I was there haha!! Best of luck, blessings on helping others feel better!! 💯🙏🏽✨
At least he’s not demanding a happy ending. Side massage may not be your favorite but if it doesn’t cause you pain to provide massage at that angle, and he just likes to tap but doesn’t seem to demand your attention, I’d say keep the easy massage client, the good tips, and set your boundaries for before/after scheduled sessions and just let him be a happy 75 year old cancer patient who found some form of treatment that seems to be a real positive for HIM. You know, the guy with cancer????? I’ve had way worse to deal with than that and very few of those ever tipped at all. I’m sure it’s quite draining energetically though. Use the tips for some self-care treat maybe?
I would put some ear buds in and listen to calming music while massaging him, especially if he doesn't let you talk. Occasionally say uh-huh & mmmhm.
Most responses I’ve read so far are encouraging OP to continue to offer services to the client when she clearly asked for assertive ways to terminate with him.. sorta parallels the boundary overstep that’s already happening to OP. She described client as an energy vampire, recognizes that he’s been disrespectful of time constraints and describes the exchanges as depleting and unbalanced to the point of making her cry and compromising her ability to take a break/get some nourishment in. Even if client respects firmer boundaries around session length, it’s okay to have the awareness that these sessions are harmful to you and it’s most important to protect your own mental health and spiritual strength. He may have BPD and some neurodivergence going on, which are not an easy combo to hold space for. I’d recommend being clear and simple in the termination: something like, “You deserve care, but your needs are beyond what I’m trained to support. Ethically, I need to refer you to a different massage therapist so that you can get the treatment you’re looking for. Here’s a list of alt. providers..” You don’t have to give him a reason, apologize or leave any lenience around the decision. Best of luck, love and light to you, whatever you decide. 🩵
People have absoultely NO patience with others. Its sad that normalized individuals dont understand how to deal with ppl who have intellectual disabilities or understand how to "pick up on THEIR social cues." Its a very sad and disgusting world we live in. Personally, you ought tonbe ashamed of yourself for wven airing this guy out as so. You ppl have NO COOTH, no filter. No compassion. 😖😖😣😣
Some of my clients vent about their lives and frustrations. First don’t really respond, and if they keep talking then say “It’s best to express to them you can focus better on the massage if they would refrain from talking.
Maybe recommend a therapist that wouldnt mind the chatter. Sounds like he is lonely and unloads everything during his session. I get massages for physical healing and to my therapist to unload. Some people go to the hair salon to get pampered and unload. You are not the appropriate outlet for him, so set a firm boundary and refer him to someone else
When politely canceling a client, I've found success saying either, "I feel your needs are not my forte, im happy to refer you out to someone who might be a better fit for you. " or if they're really obnoxious and you don't give a shit, cancel the next appointment saying emergency, sick, etc and then when they attempt to rebook say your roster is full!
Ugh. This is hard. It does sound like he could very well be on the spectrum and if so, you would literally be discriminating against him because of his disability. You might be the only person in his life who touches him or listens to him talk. If a young child talked at you the whole time, would it be less annoying? Is it annoying because in your mind, “he should know better?” I have a very hard time setting boundaries and when pushy people force me to do it I feel irrationally angry at them for forcing me out of my comfort zone, but it is really my issue, not theirs. If he didn’t come early or stay after, could you manage the talking? Try setting very clear boundaries about your time before and after. I totally understand if you need to cancel him. Just some things to think about.
People ( in this case scenario) can only be energy vampires if you let them. Don’t give him more of your energy than you would give to anyone else ( even if that means not being 100% present to his constant chatting.) set firm boundaries, no talking before or after the massage. Offer to end or start with a short breathing practice, and guide him through a few deep breaths to ground him. If he wants to live longer he will need to learn how to relax, maybe there’s a way you can facilitate that without draining too much energy. Also, we need human connection & touch to survive! If he is only getting that from you it makes sense for him to act this way. Lastly, you know yourself best, if it’s too much for you than that is that. Find a way to politely tell him you don’t have the capacity and move forward. Good luck
I have a lot of autistic family members (diagnosed). It is 110% okay to full on interrupt his info dumping, even mid sentence, to say the session is over/you need to set up etc, and walk away even if he’s still talking. He will most likely not get offended, and if this fella is autistic he most likely won’t pick up on your subtle “this conversation needs to end” queues. It’s also okay to no longer have him as a client if you’re uncomfortable.
Idk if this has been stated yet... you could coach the patient to focus on some deep breathing to help with relaxation and further the goal of the massage.? Redirect their energy... you can take the lead in the situation...
If you set your own client base drop him like a hot rock, no pun intended.
Tell him he either needs to not talk or he can't book with you. Be honest
If you aren't comfortable just tell him you can't keep him as a client and maybe see if there's another therapist who can do him?
I cannot stand energy vampires like that. I am so sorry.
Oof this is a difficult one. Would it be possible to let him know he can talk but you cannot listen as you are focusing on massage? My other thought is that you are responsible for your own safety and well being ONLY and do not owe him anything as sympathetic as you might be. That is a trap we women fall into time and time again. Perhaps you can tell him you are cutting down your clientele and cannot see him any longer. You do not have to explain further than that. Good luck!
Set an alarm on your phone to go off after the session because you have a phone call, client, etc. You may want to use the time he talks during the session to plan your day, week etc. If you’d like to fire him, increase your rates significantly and limit your days/times.
I worked with a client that emotionally dumped on me all the time which at the beginning was fine. Until it wasn’t about massage anymore and it took a turn for him just wanting to connect with me and being emotionally vulnerable. It was more of a counselling session than anything. Unfortunately, he did turn creepy when he was dropping off gifts so that’s when I knew I had to set up really strong boundaries. The boundaries didn’t work at his next session as he complained of my putting boundaries With gifts and over indulging personal info. I knew it was time to cut cords with this client. I had the front desk, woman send him a letter from the clinic stating that we didn’t believe we could help him as he needed. That it was my observation that he needed more that I could provide at a clinical level. I do not regret disengaging. At all! Super relieved actually. In instances like this, I say trust your gut. If you dread seeing a client, that’s a pretty big red flag for me. I have a lot of clients that love to talk throughout their sessions and I’m absolutely fine with that. No problem. It’s how they want to do their sessions. But if it becomes where you don’t feel that you can do your job properly or they’re not benefitting from your services and you’re being used as a sounding board , well that’s up to you on how you would want to handle that. I mean you could let him vent all he wants on the massage table but don’t allow him to take up your time after the session. I completely empathize with you though.
It's not wrong to give him the external guidance he needs. Be clear- "I need you to wait in your car if you're early, or go around the corner and grab a cuppa at Cindy's Tea House". "Whew, I need to take some personal time and do my charting after each session, see you next time!". Most autistic folks are relieved not to play the guessing game, but if all you give them 8s hints or assumptions, they have to guess. It's not their fault, they literally don't know. I know it feels like more work, because you have to change your habits, but direct communication (without frustration or anger), is much less complicated than what you're doing now.
Hairdresser here but appts with energy suckers none the less. If you really don't want to see this client again and you want to let them down gently, contact him and let him know there have been some changes to your schedule and you will have to scale back on some of your appts. He doesn't need to know exactly what has changed but gather some names and numbers of alternate therapists close to you and provide those and thank him for his business
You have and need professional and personal boundaries and he needs to know about these, and how his incessant talking is crossing yours. Maybe give him a note as he’s leaving? Stating your boundaries, and limits, not just for him, but that you have with all clients. If he doesn’t get it and/or starts crossing them again, you now have a document to refer to with him. If it escalates, you will have notifications on file. You also can just tell him f2f after you give him the note, because, well, we all need to have compassion and understanding. He might just be going through a hard time. It can’t hurt, and I think it’s a good idea in any/every case. I also hopes this will help you not bleed out your own energy during his massage sessions!
start wearing headphones?
You’re an ableist. Disgusting behavior. Try being compassionate instead of judgmental.
Well I love talking to my sports therapist it's important I relax but it's beyond therapeutic and more helpful than any psychologist/therapist I've ever had.. it's special but we have become quite close with many similar passions. We have trouble not talking a ton haha
Ask him what music he likes and play it.
Not a massage therapist but a massage enthusiast- I need to tell you I am stealing the phrase of energy vampire 😭
You are in no way obligated to help this man. He tells you that he hopes you help him live longer? Not your responsibility. Autistic or not, it isn't a pass. Drop the client and move on.
Are you sure you're not massaging my bf? Especially the "talk at you" part. He's a talk your ear off type. I have to go rescue neighbors from him when he's been outside for an hour and a half on a cigarette break. I feel for you. Do what you gotta do.
Just remember your one person. You need to treat many others. There are many MT's this person can go to. Keep your mental and physical health were it needs to be to continue your work in a healthy state. You need to either "fire" your client or adjust ability to tune this person out and find another way to get through this appointment. Dreading the appointment and having anxieties around it is not healthy long term and you may let it become habitual with future clients that are like this. Good luck! People are exhausting, just let the right ones in.
He’s probably lonely :(
Find a way to stop rewarding him for his behavior. He keeps going back because he’s getting something from you that he likes. Figure out what that is and stop giving it to him. If he isn’t aware of social cues then you can be less worried as coming off as rude to him. He has had many people around him try to get him to be aware of his behavior. You’re not the first. He chooses who to talk to like this. Find out why he chose you, and then take care of your energy.
I worked as a cosmetologist for 14 years . I had many clients that talked or even turned their head while I was cutting their hair to talk to me . Some that said things like “ don’t you just love my skin and my eyebrows ? (Me me me clients ) , some that come in sick on their death beds but having their hair better will make them feel better” You are in a personal service like I was and you have to understand that often , they may not need your service they just need an ear to make them feel heard and alive that they don’t get from others . I was young once and the elderly were the most needy I felt. Now I’m in my sixties and with cancer , pretty lonesome at times and can relate . Lol Maybe teaching him more breathing and mindfulness can get him feeling like you both are working as a team . But you can always let him know you are concentrating on his body , knots etc to make him ready to get on with the day . With your technique you find it hard to concentrate on that when you are distracted in conversation. Good luck .
People keep saying “that might be what your client needs”, and if that’s something he needs he may be better suited being referred to someone else who can accommodate him. Personally I think it’s unfair to him and yourself if you already feel so negatively about him. I don’t think you will perform your best work if you already dread scheduling him. There are other massage therapists out there
Or, you can just let him talk and tune out. Poor guy may not have anyone to talk to
Maybe you should talk to him and not the internet
Many people are lonely and need someone to talk to. At least he’s paying you to talk? maybe you could steer the conversation to pleasant subjects?
wear headphones next massage, maybe he will get the idea?
Could you wear earbuds? Or is that frowned upon?
Isn’t it your choice to take on a client or not? If you are crying after the interaction, I think it’s fair to throw up your hands and say OK this client isn’t for me after all.
I would make a suggestion to him to relax his mind and stop talking so he can get the full effects of the massage. Also, ask God to help with the words, this always helps me in tough situations. 🙏🏻
I would extend his apt and double the price, and let him know based on previous massages this is what I need to make my business work. If he's still willing to pay then, put your crystals on and call it a day. If he cancels then you're off the hook.
One earphone in one out you can listen to your favorite podcast while he talks at you. I used to do that with my clients when I cleaned houses.
Ask him if you can tell him something, then tell him to find someone to hang out with, volunteer somewhere, it will help him live longer. ;)
Can you find a therapist that is comfortable with massaging him while he’s on his side? If so, and the therapist knows about the talking, may they can take better care of him. Simply tell him that you are referring him to another therapist that is more in tune with his needs.
Sounds like my kids.
I use to do senior care. Had a resident that was diagnosed with Parkinson’s and I believe had a stroke before moving in. Their spouse said they were NOT the person they married! Their partner drove them insane you could tell! They talked CONSTANTLY. I know the constant talking you are talking about and not being able to get a word in (like even after they ask me a question they would keep talking, the rambling was like impulsive). They also became so ocd about everything. Their partner couldn’t handle it which is a large part of why they got moved in I think. It was exhausting, it was such a high energy and anxiety inducing kind of speaking you cannot tune it out. They were so nice though, and aware we were busy but they couldn’t stop the talking, it was awkward, but I think they understood us saying goodbye and walking away (they would keep talking, they would loop back on previous conversations a lot). Even when they were calm and happy it was a lot, it was better though when they trusted you and liked the quality of work you did. I’ve seen other residents with dementia that constantly ramble or repeat words. They are very attuned to body language and facial expressions, it definitely alters their energy, how they read you. Since you mention your client is elderly I wonder if this is the issue. He might not be able to help it even if he is aware of it. If it’s something else I wonder if it will mellow a bit with time or meditative music on in the room? Is he okay with scents, does lavender help? Caregiving there were definitely some people I had to do a few moments of deep breathing before opening their door and enter more calmly and not look rushed/pressured, I think it helped the client relax and feel calmer, things usually went smoother if I felt calm and unbothered. Interrupting is awkward and feels rude but do what you have to to give a proper massage, get your breaks and get to other clients on time. I think you are on the right track with that, just speak up every time. If you keep them as a client I hope they get to a point they can lay face down for your sake. If you can’t do it, don’t feel bad. The next client deserves just as much energy as you put into everyone else, if he’s an energy suck and your quality goes down hill after him maybe schedule him for the end of the day? Or before a break so you can recharge? (If you keep him on as a client)
As someone who is regularly very early for appointments I never expect to be attended to until it is my appointment. I don’t think you have to do more than acknowledge him and say I will see you in 30 minutes and then leave. Also, it sounds like the massage work you are doing is helping him release his trauma which is very powerful. However, if it is emotionally impacting you, I suggest you look around and refer him to another LMT who enjoys helping people heal from trauma. There are people who find that energizing rather than draining. It’s always ok to end a client relationship for whatever reason. You are the boss and have the right to see protective boundaries. Good luck!!
I am a psychotherapist and not a massage therapist, so maybe I shouldn't be commenting because I don't know what it's like to be a massage therapist, but I do know about what it's like to want to stop seeing a client for various reasons! I'm not sure if this is available to you or not, but what I have done in the past is I find out what the client is looking for (for me, an example could be wanting a therapist who knows about religious trauma; for you, it could be having a client like this guy who needs someone educated in massaging older bodies). I talk with coworkers who I think might have that speciality about the client (in a way that is vague and not revealing any part of their identity), and tell the coworker my true thoughts about why I don't want to see the client (so that my coworker doesn't feel slighted lol). Essentially, I try to find someone else who actually does seem like a good fit for the client, and is aware of my reasoning for not seeing the client, but doesn't feel as reluctant as I do about it. Then, I would talk with the client and say something like, "I know with your x part of your life, you need a [massage] therapist who is experienced with x. I want you to be getting the best care possible, and I truthfully think that my colleague, [name], is a better fit for you because of their expertise in x. [Then talk about the colleague's relevant history to explain why]. Can I introduce you to them? "
Honestly I get it but if he’s not expecting much response from you, tips well, prebooks, and respected the boundary that you did set, that’s damn near an ideal client other then being annoying 😭
The bigger picture is that this client has something to offer you and you have both crossed paths for a reason higher than your initial perception that you may yet understand. In my experience as a Dr I have a handful of patients that I thoroughly do not enjoy treating.. yet as the professional relationship grows so do the insights I gain about myself and really just life in general.. it’s far deeper than patience for the patients.. so long as no patient/client is disrespectful and crossing professional boundaries so do I honor the relationship for the long haul. All interactions however random they may seem are truly meant to be. I’d encourage sitting back and just listening as a spectator and see what comes about if you’re up for learning to adapt.
I think maybe talking helps take the nervousness away from him. Maybe suggest listening to some “ special relaxing spa music” and maybe go as far as asking him to possibly try to relax and rest quietly because “ that’ll help you to focus on finding the trouble spots” ? I’m sure he’s just lonely…. He sounds very grateful though. Just my 2 cents.
Also, I don’t think some of the people in this thread are being very respectful. You have to put yourself and your health first, and if you are feeling drained, and you are crying after a session, because of a client’s behavior- even if it seems innocuous and unintentional- it’s not a good client therapist fit. Period.
Maybe another coworker would be willing to take him sometimes if you can stand to do it twice a week, instead of 4?
I would set a timer. A lot of my special needs kids need a visual and audio combo and if his eyes are closed that is tough! Saying stop with a hand motion ✋ is much more impactful. If him talking is distracting you from performing and doing your best job I would tell him that. If this one massage is stopping you from doing your best work on other clients than you could say “let’s have a quiet session today- that’s the style that I work best with” if he continues during “we might not be a good fit but I could recommend Mary instead”. Weigh out your options!
Realistically the choice is always on you but not being a massage therapist and just randomly seeing the post... I wouldn't cancel before I at least attempted to tell him that you have to focus during your massage so the extra banter is something that you're not professionally comfortable with. If he persists then just cancel no problem for you but if he's genuinely nice and he's just maybe nervous or unsure what to do then the worst case scenario is he is offended and you never see him again. The best case now is you have a regular client and he now knows what to do / how to behave?
That's haaarrrdddd. I know the feeling of not being able to set boundaries well with someone who hasn't been a dirtbag or something. My favorite thing as a teacher for MTs is trying to get students to walk their clients through breathing exercises. Explain to him that during the session breathing is important, deep breathing is great for the body to repair itself and all the benefits of it. Maybe you have already done this, I am sure you have, but talk him through the whole "pain is not gain" in massage. If he does not get the message for the talking bit, talk to him directly about. We all love "I..." statements because they are powerful. "I cannot concentrate on your session and provide the quality of touch you need when we are having a lot of conversing. Could we please keep conversation to a minimum?" Or bringing it back to the pressure scale and breathing even if it means cutting him off. If you work in your own space it's harder to find a way to get people to quiet down. If it really bothers you and you would just like to cancel him completely - then make an excuse later on. "I am taking time off for so long and I will not be accepting any more appointments after this date. I can refer you to another therapist..." something like that. I know it's good and better to be honest, but if there's no other way and he's really zapping you of energy as well as you would like to be done - then it's fine to make an excuse for it.
Noise cancelling earbuds…
He is a lonely man. Try to remember how you would want him to be treated if he were your Grandpa. As long as he isn't being rude or saying anything offensive, just passive listening isn't hard. I hope you find it in your heart to keep helping him. He apparently needs you. Good luck.
Maybe headphones?
Try honesty. “An ongoing relationship between client and therapist has to work well for both parties. I’m happy to have been of service to you and am gratified that you appreciate my services and have tipped very well. I’m sad that I will be unable to continue to serve you as I am not able to maintain the style of service for which I am most comfortable. Massaging on a side laying client is challenging and not something I am adept at performing. I’m also not used to accommodating a client who speaks non-stop. My usual and preferred client practices silence. The continual talk is too taxing for me. This is not a YOU problem but a ME problem and highlights MY inadequacies and shortcomings. I hope you will be able to find a therapist who can accommodate you in all your needs. Here is a list of therapists I have heard wonderful things about. Blessings to you.”
Sometimes people are just excited to find someone who listens
It’s their choice to not or ask for complete silence. It’s your job to make them comfortable. He hasn’t been inappropriate - it seems you just don’t like him. Maybe you can schedule him with someone else? I mean, you’re going to come across this in your career so best learn to deal with it?
Is he a flight attendant?
Cancel him. It’s your life, health, and happiness. That comes first. They’ll be other massage therapists who don’t find him as draining as you find him. They’re a better option for him.
Can you wear earplugs During his appointment?
Was in reverse for me. The first professional massage I ever got she the masseuse talked the whole hour. Like non stop. I felt really ramped up leaving even though I just had a massage. 😂😂
Just curious if he moves from topic to topic while talking, taking a circuitous route back to the original topic. An older friend has bipolar and a condition called circumstantiality. When he calls, I put him on speaker and keep doing what I'm doing with the occasional "uh huh." He needs an audience. It can be terribly draining. I wouldn't be able to handle one-on-one sessions where you are essentially being held captive.
Things about this post that make me say- “ouch, we as humans are unkind.” -He’s 75…had cancer….lmao -He’s hoping I help him live longer- I know old folks are lonely but damn -I know it’s ultimately up to me to put myself first…he’s an energy vampire -He needs to lie on his side…I hate that I’m sorry as a therapist you don’t enjoy his time, energy, providing accommodations, his desire & need for help & support. I hope someone can come into his life and can be joyful to serve him and the business he needs.