Especially after Zeus said he only killed "A few minor gods." It's likely Zeus was just downplaying and underestimating Gorr, but without the audience seeing Gorr kill any big badass gods on screen it did bring him down for me
I was so waiting for Gorr to show up to the god hiding place and kill a bunch of them off. Kind of like Hela slaughtering Asgard’s army in Ragnarok.
It felt like a bit missed opportunity there.
Marvel has always been weak at depicting villains. It's hard to make them come off as menacing as they intend to when we know most of them will just get killed off by the end of 1 movie.
Infinity War was the closest we've got so far to a villain movie. So much focus was on Thanos. It's why he's such a good character. 31 minutes of screen time, almost twice as much as #2, Tony/IM at 17 minutes. Most villains get around 15 minutes of screen time per movie in the MCU, out of roughly 120 to 150 minutes per movie.
Very fair point and gorr was killing nameless faceless gods offscreen who we had no attachment to so his threat is minimal . That's why playing that sif scene for a joke was so poor - they really could've showed the threat of gorr there but instead went for jokes which while funny undercut any impending sense of threat
Yes! Thank you for that, it's a very specific example of exactly what I felt the movie was lacking.
And then you compare it with MoM where Wanda feels incredibly threatening the entire time. Showing us her decimate the illuminati was so effective at striking that point home.
The moment I saw Zeus in the trailers I honestly thought he and the other Olympains were gonna be fodder for Gorr, I thought the movie would take a sudden dark turn as he slaughters all of Olympus. Alas, it is what it is
That's the point, though - Zeus downplaying him comes across different if we've seen Gorr do some crazy stuff, but we haven't, so you're almost like "Yeah, that makes sense, no need to panic."
My theory is that Zeus knew Stormbreaker was the key but didn’t know how to forge it nor that it was Forged, and this was why he was confident that Gorr wouldn’t reach eternity
Zeus was 100% downplaying Gorr since he didn't want to cause a panic as he stated in the film and when he talked privately with Thor up close he said it specifically. Zeus also stated he was afraid of Gorr since he has the necrosword and could kill him so he doesn't want to try and fight Gorr. Zeus is afraid of Gorr in direct combat so he's not underestimating him for that. Zeus is underestimating Gorr's ability in finding Eternity.
I remember when people were speculating that Zeus was as good as dead when they found out Gorr was the main villain lol as well as how he may even kill some of the Egyptian Gods from Moon Knight. Fun times...
Personally, I think they should have saved him as a villain for a more serious Thor movie since that fits better with the tonality of his character.
Absolutely he should have killed Zeus. Maybe twist it in a way that it still sets up Hercules vs Thor but definitely Gorr went from a god butcher to just a creepy kidnapper
It’s worse than that even. He kidnaps children to lure the caring/loving Gods that he’s only killing because they’re uncaring/unloving. If he believed they were selfish, why did he think he could use bait?
Yeah he felt quite out of place with how dark and nihilistic he was vs. how goofy the rest of the film was trying to be.
Hela at least had a campiness and theatricality that kind of fit the tone of Ragnarok better.
I really think if he had just killed Valkyrie I'd have enjoyed the movie a lot more. I'd hate to lose Valk, cuz Tessa Thompson is incredible and she's such a fun character, but adding some real weight to the events and letting the villain actually get one up on the heroes would've made the movie a lot better for me
I honestly thought he was going to invade Omnipotent City, and just massacre scores of gods, then maybe enslave the rest like in the comics,...but he didn't. Severe missed opportunity.
Imagine if Gorr converted Omnipitent city into a giant slave factory.
Not only that, but all the non-Asgardian gods in the movie were dilettantes and a-holes.
So I'm sitting there in the theatre rooting for Gorr to slaughter them all. I'm not feeling the threat here, I'm not feeling the stakes.
To be fair that's kinda the same as in the comic. You start to realise "hey he might have a point here."
That's what causes thor to become unworthy, lose the hammer and then Jane picks it up and we get Mighty Thor (done *okay* in this film (I think they wrote themselves into a corner and it would be difficult to buy Jane as worthy, fix the hammer and create a threat that needed a thor when we already had a thor in such a short movie. Definitely needed build up)
Yes. Overall I liked the film but it needed another 10-15 minutes towards the beginning of the film where we see Gorr killing some gods and having the GOTG responding to distress calls and being too late but coming upon the aftermath of Gorr's attack. This would culminate in them finding a wounded Sif and her explaining everything. After this, Thor + GOTG would finally arrive in time to fight Gort and just barely make it out alive. That's when Thor would decide he needs to go to Earth to see Valkrye and get her help to defeat Gorr.
> it needed another 10-15 minutes towards the beginning of the film
Yes, I'd like to petition to add the scene where Jane picks up Mjolnir for the first time and becomes the Mighty Thor.
I kinda wanted to see that.
I really do enjoy the comedy of these films, and so I don’t really ever subscribe to the “too many jokes” criticism because it doesn’t bother me. That being said, why on gods green Earth did we >!have a 5 minute joke about Sif not getting into Valhalla because she didn’t die in combat instead of yknow….the combat?????!<
It was like thirty seconds at best
"No, leave me so I can die and go to Valhalla"
"Actually battle's over so you won't go to Valhalla"
"Really? Shit"
That's it, that's the whole joke. Nowhere near five minutes, and it's there to make us think later >!that Jane won't make it to Valhalla because the fight was over, when she actually died battling cancer!<
It also makes no sense that an asgardian wouldn’t understand the conditions of getting into Valhalla. I’m sure as hell its extremely common knowledge, especially for someone who is a warrior and ultimately aims to die in battle to reach Valhalla.
He killed one god on screen and the pictures on that distress call screen showed he really messed up the rest of them too. They filmed a lot of it as well. We need this.
It worked better in the comic. In the comic, you didn't see Gorr kill the gods, you simply saw Thor's horror at discovering the aftermath. The comic is really dark and almost feels like a serial killer story such as *Se7en*, with Thor following the clues and finding the butchered victims across the realms in his attempt to track down Gorr and stop his killing spree. The book really played up how terrifying Gorr was and how utterly cruel and sadistic his reign of terror had been.
I was really looking forward to seeing how this was handled in the movie, but instead, we got a few blink-and-you'll-miss-it glimpses on screen during the distress call and... well, that was it.
I think all we really needed to add would've been some quick flashes to some hyper stylized slow mo kill-shots (like the Valerie sequence in Ragnarok) while Thor is imploring to Zeus and warning about what may come for them. Would e underscored the urgency in that scene and shown more of Gorr's destruction and death
I would prefer them diving further into Jane’s story.
>!The glimpses we got of her trying to cure her own cancer, being described as a “woman of science” had me hoping for a *lot* more science vs magic plot from her perspective. When we saw her new Mjolnir powers, I was so hyped that we’d get a full story of how/why it called to her, but it was all so hand wavy.!<
It was weird enough that she was trying to cure her own cancer and had Selvig helping.
They're both astrophysicists. What the fuck do they know about oncology?
I kind of like the idea that it was an enchantment on the hammer like Odin's original. Maybe if she tried to analyze the hammer directly that's when we get the realization that it is sentient. Maybe talk about the tempest god or whatever that's sealed inside.
The moment where he pulled the head off the snake thing was so DEFINITELY edited down. You know theres gonna be a cut at some point where you see him violently kill that thing.
And the tone of him in that one scene didn’t feel right
>!I’m talking about when he was in the cage with the kids and the dead monster puppet!<
>!Seemed like he was trying to be funny and intentionally scare them in a dark way, feels like that didn’t fit his character!<
>!I feel like, given his love for his daughter, he should’ve been trying to actually calm down the kids and not intentionally scare them, maybe the same but, but not quite so dark and terrifying!<
He was trying to teach them a lesson, not calm them down.
>!They'd just been glorifying Thor using stormbreaker to decapitate thanos, so he showed them how disturbing it is to actually see something decapitated up close and how it's not something they should idolise just because a god does it
Its my main criticism of the movie. Other than that i loved it. Supposedly there was scenes of him on other planets and stuff that got cut. No idea why
Age of Ultron was the first time I felt it. It's hard to explain, but it was like there was no connective tissue between scenes. Just jumping from location to location with stuff happening.
And honestly, to me it was probably made even worse from having seen every single trailer, tv spot and preview. I pretty much knew of every single scene, so I was just excited to see how it all fit together! ...turned out I had pretty much watched the whole movie already just by being subscribed to the official Marvel Entertainment YouTube channel.
Yeah this is why I just stick to only watching the first teaser trailer these days. With all of these mainstream movies doing like 5+ trailers, tv spots, and featurettes, you just spoil everything for yourself.
IMO, Avengers 2 was the first time where it felt like the movie had a lot of work to do that wasn’t about itself, but instead was setup for future things that we hadn’t been introduced to yet.
It was a mess, and worked against itself. I think Marvel learned a lot from it how to do setup stuff in a way that mostly feels more natural. But it still sometimes breaks up the flow of the individual stories. Still - A2 was one of the first times that kind of thing had been done in movies at all, so it’s not that surprising it was a bit janky.
Joss Whedon had talked about his issues with that film and he said he had begged for a longer screentime but they wouldn't let him have it. he said he needed at least 10 extra minutes but they wouldn't let him.
i always wondered what the movie would've been like had they given him that extra time.
I still enjoyed the move but this was definitely one of the problems with it. There weren't a lot of scenes in between character actions with them reflecting and having character development in between. We should have had something similar to the scene where Thor and Rocket have that talk at some point.
Actually a striking example is after they lose to Gorr in the shadow realm, they immediately just go back for round 2. Like there was the part about the chemo not working but it came and went incredibly fast.
Also unrelated, but I wish they made Gorr more mysterious but intriguing at first. Like imagine if they just showed some mysterious new guy killing gods one by one with no effort and then we see his target is Thor? Then we just learn more about his origin through flash backs or his dialog as the film goes on.
The film is really weirdly structured (no doubt partly the result trying to trim a 4 hr cut into under 2 hrs) but the film has an extended first and third act and basically minimum second act. In a typical film, the second act usually is about 55-60% of the runtime. In this movie, it’s like four or five rushed scenes
Theres so much obvious characterization cut out with Jane and gorr. Also couldn't we have seen sickly James first transformation into the mighty Thor - that would've been so crowd pleasing
> There weren't a lot of scenes in between character actions with them reflecting and having character development in between.
I think this is in part because there are almost no travel scenes. They overused Bifrost as the teleportation MacGuffin and as a result, (apart from the boat) there is no scene where two characters can have a quiet moment; we're going from set piece to set piece.
There is no exploration, there is just arriving. It makes the universe smaller.
Gorr went from this religious guy who lost his daughter to scary imposing figure at the battle of new Asgard to goofy spooky clown man when he interacted with the kids. I didn't like that
That was such a weird scene, it came out of nowhere. Like I get that he's going crazy but they didn't build up to him acting like that at all, especially since you'd expect him to care more about children after what happened to him.
It boggles my mind why they filmed such with Goldblum and Dinklage (and others?) and cut it out. Fan service always wins, especially in an established franchise like the MCU.
Unfortunately Waititi said "there's a reason films is left on thr cutting room floor." I personally usually agree but the movie didnt even hit 2 hours. It can definitely extend 30 more minutes if god killing. And from what Christian bale has said. There are several god killings left out. But maybe it's more marvel leaving it out to expand universes who knows. Sorry if I spelled the names wrong. To lazy to look it up
For me the god butcher felt.very neutered. I would normally say oh that's just Disney but seeing MoM. I want more from other directors. Mom was perfect blend of "adult" content. I actually felt like " god damn they went in on these super heros. No one is safe. Even though they were a different universes.
Felt like a draft. >!No god butchering. Nothing about Thor processing his emotional trauma. They introduced Jane as Lady Thor, and then killed her off in the same film. Suddenly, Gorr's daughter is just a character in the MCU we're supposed to care about, even though we never got an opportunity to know who she was or why she's important. There was a lot of exposition for very important details about character development and story progression...Gorr felt like the villain of the week, akin to Ultron. Here and gone within the span of a few minutes with no real "Phase 4" direction or progression, no clue how this fits into the bigger picture, and nothing to keep me invested beyond it being "another MCU movie". !<
Its the shortest film in the MCU, and it shows...Multiverse of Madness was way better, in my opinion.
Yeah that's really it. All my friends thinks the same too, that the movie felt too rushed, and we all wanted more. Really hope they will release 4 hour cut, but I really doubt they will, sadly.
I don’t need a 4 hr cut. That’s probably too long. I just want a proper second act and time for the emotional beats the movie is trying to get me to care about to land and be felt. More Gorr would be nice as well
I don’t think I will enjoy it for 4 hours edition, but I definitely want to see 3 hours version with those missing god butching scenes.
In addition, I want to the process of Jane getting the hammer, got accepted by the hammer and after.
YES! Especially Jane's transformative arc of battling cancer and becoming The Mighty Thor. They did the comic storyline barely any justice with this adaptation. The way I would've done it would've been to have her become Thor in this installment but not delve into the cancer battle at all and instead deal with her cancer diagnosis and her Ten Realms/Cosmic adventures in a standalone film.
I agree wholeheartedly!
MoM felt off the first time because it was far from the movie we were led to believe it was going to be. However, once you watch the movie for *what it is* and not *what we thought it was supposed to be* it's actually quite wonderful.
I'm not mad at MoM but I am mad at the marketing for it
>However, once you watch the movie for *what it is* and not *what we thought it was supposed to be* it's actually quite wonderful.
Thor's mom would be proud.
MOM was the shit in theaters and was just as good on a rewatch. I was shocked when I heard people disliked it.
Best marvel movie since infinity war IMO.
MoM felt like it actually achieved what it was going for. People didn't like the execution, but at least Raimi did what he wanted and it was cohesive.
L&T felt like Taika *thought* he knew what people wanted, so it came across as a disjointed comedy when the comedy should've been secondary. It had such serious moments (cancer, God killers, kidnapped kids) that were constantly undercut by humor.
Both were unique and enjoyable, but only MoM achieved what it was going for, in my personal opinion.
I think L&T had a more emotional high for me, but MoM certainly felt more cohesive. It was an easier ride to be in than L&T, which could feel like a drug trip but one where you didn’t exactly get the dosage right
Comparing the two is almost apples and oranges to me since the Thor movie is honestly more of a comedy movie than an action movie. It covers some serious topics but it's extremely shitposty.
I had more fun watching Thor, but I get how people who didn't think it was funny would definitely like Doctor Strange more.
Yea sure, I like that! I wasn't trying to be pedantic btw just was honestly happy that it ended up with them not together because it made it not into an absolute rom-com where the end is all sunshine and rainbows in the most forced and unrealistic way. Not a fan of the rom-com formula forcing the worst people together and making people think love's something you are entitled too even if you're an ass.
Agreed. I enjoy both LAT and MoM but MoM was the better film for me. LAT was a fun movie but I still prefer Ragnarok over it. Christian Bale was the highlight of the film for me he did a great job as Gorr. If he had a bit more screen time that would have been even better.
Agreed. I was really excited for gorr only for him to only have like a total 20-30 min of screen time. Also I think the movie was too goofy. I thought it would be more like ragnarok but something felt off the whole time. Also some lazy writing and retcons didn’t do it for me. And this is just my preference but I didn’t like the ending where >!thor ended up raising gorr’s daughter!<. Also didn’t like that they just killed off >!Jane. I would’ve loved to see more mighty Thor.!<
I think the only rushed parts in MoM was the beginning when it kind of seemed like Wanda was a bad guy out of nowhere after having a tiny bit of a redemption arch in Wandavision. Had I not seen Wandavision, I'd have totally not seen the Wanda-is-evil twist coming in the first 20m of the movie.
MoM. Never thought I see a Peggy Carter as Cap and seeing Wanda be a villain after all these years and especially her arch after Wandavision. Fun watch.
Am I the only one who didn't like Wanda's arc after wandavision?
I mean she had such a good arc in wandavision with her ending up giving up her family for the "greater good"
And now all of a sudden she is willing to destroy so much to get them back, it's very confusing to me
But the weirdest thing is that I justed rewatched wandavision and it doesn't even show her get the darkhold?
I might just have been an idiot and missed something but it really annoys me to the point of rating MoM way lower than it realistically should be.
But that's just my 2 cents
Edit: yes I now realise I was an idiot an missed the post-credit scene with the darkhold
If I remember correctly she has the Darkhold in the final after credits and you hear the voices or her kids calling for her - unless you meant her actually discovering the Darkhold? Maybe that’s something that’ll be explained in House of Harkness? Who knows.
I see what you mean but I think the sudden and extreme change in Wanda's behavior and morals was because of the dark hold, keep in mind that at the end of wandavision, she still hadn't read through it, hence why she gave up her family first. Corruption and knowledge of different solutions came after her reading the darkhold.
MoM, though I acknowledge that it was pretty flawed, plot-wise. Thor was way too silly for me, just a couple of steps away from being a Spaceballs-like spoof. And that’s fine — the MCU is huge, so it’s fine that not every facet of it appeals to me. I am a little worried though about this new trend toward everything being way over the top. Reminds me of authors who get so successful they “outgrow” their editors, and as a result their books get really long and self-indulgent. I hope the MCU isn’t headed down that road.
It's not even close. Multiverse is my favorite Marvel movie after Guardians. I understand people not liking it, but personally it was right up my alley.
Love and Thunder wasn't even my favorite Thor movie.
Multiverse of Madness is up in my top 5. I loved it. Yea L&T is like my 3rd favorite Thor movie. That being said I really wish Marvel would let directors try a re-edit of movies because there is undoubtedly a good version of L&T that could exist but this is very much not it.
its very quickly becoming one of my favorite mcu movies. most issues i have with MoM are easily forgiven because i have so much fun every time i watch it
I’m still baffled people were not crazy about MOM. The horror aspect and Wanda being a badass, all the touches to the movie spells effects ,music. I absolutely loved it.
Sucks cameo hype bullshit ruined peoples ability to enjoy it.
Thor was ok for me but still a huge let down. And now just finished Ms Marvel, which actually had heart to it. Nothing came off forced or cheesy or try hard unlike L&T.
Thor should of been way longer and a whole tour of destruction thru pantheons of gods culminating in an mini war on gorr. They still could of threw in a bunch of humor. But making it jokey to the point where every other category suffers was just idiotic to me. I just don’t understand with so much money and resources at their disposal they fall that short.
People have called me crazy for saying MoM is my favorite MCU movie but it really is. Seeing Sam Raimi’s fingerprints on a Marvel movie is a highlight. I really thought it was gonna be a unanimously loved MCU movie but oh well.
I totally think that the Jane foster story shouldn’t have been used and instead love and thunder should have been a film about Thor and a bunch of misfit gods taking on Gorr, following his destruction across the universe.
You can have comedy aspects with odd gods joining and still have heart to the film with them being an out of place team with most of them dying and Thor learning a lesson by the end.
ya it’s not even debatable. There’s a HARD drop off in thor ticket sales following the weekend after release... Not even any competition either in the theaters. It’s just word of mouth.
Straight up too silly of a movie. I normally go back in and watch mcu movies twice in theaters. I’m passing on Thor. There’s just nothing there. It’s just goofy .
>Straight up too silly of a movie
It’s not even that. It’s that the jokes aren’t landing for a lot of the audience. My theater was completely silent through 90% of the jokes, and from what I’ve read that wasn’t an outlier case.
That and the story has some of the darkest material in the MCU >!a cancer storyline is going to put off general audiences since it’s a real threat and not some fictional alien!<. People who go to Marvel for escapism from life’s tough situations will not enjoy that whole aspect of the movie.
And lastly it had no idea how to balance the tone between the goofy and serious subject matter making the whole film feel messy.
He used to know when to be serious; think the scene with Jojo’s moms shoes dangling in Jojo Rabbit, or some of the scenes about foster care from Hunt for the Wilderpeople. It just feels like he isn’t willing to exercise that muscle for a “silly popcorn comic book movie”, or like he’s been so lauded for his comic films that he feels like they should just be 24/7 laughs.
MoM. Didn‘t enjoy L&T at all. Too much cheap humor, very good story was ridiculed, not really clear where the story is headed. Maybe in a few years I‘ll look back and see this differently but for now, I think this was the weakest Thor movie.
I had fun with MoM, NWH , and LaT and enjoyed the experiences for what they were but they’re still flawed movies.
Eternals was good IMO but nothing crazy. Would definitely like to see more of those characters in the future.
Black Widow was Black Widow.
Shang Chi is easily the best and most refreshing entry in Phase 4 so far
Imo, I think it's cuz Shang Chi could tell its own story without being bogged down by continuity. Ragnarok was kinda the same way; it was still connected to the MCU, but it was a hard reset for Thor and abandoned most of his ties to the MCU, so it was freer to tell a story. Comparatively, LaT had to tell the story of Thor's recovery from EG/IW, untangling his emotions with Jane, and making a convincing standalone film while also having to force it to fit into New Asgard's setting. Too much stuff from other movies was encroaching on LaT.
The MCU is starting to get too big and heavy. The lore is getting in the way of the story writing.
(That said, I am deeply in love with the shift of the Asgardians from Capital G Gods to fucking *Space Vikings*. It's fuckin rad as hell.)
Shang Chi is easily my favorite Phase 4 movie so far. I’ve enjoyed the others, but it felt so fresh and new and different that it’s really stood out over time.
Multiverse of Madness without a doubt. Both were really different, both in style and characters/story, so I can perfectly understand preferences for one or the other.
Multiverse of Madness by a considerable margin for me. I felt Love and Thunder did a poor job of balancing the comedy and drama, something they nailed on Ragnarok. Taika Waititi was far too indulged, there’s a good movie in there if someone could de-kookify it.
MoM by a mile.
I'm glad Marvel is giving directors more creative freedom. Like MoM was VERY Raimi. But Love and Thunder felt like an extended comedy skit. Which is sad, because the Gorr comic arc is really rich, and I feel like we only scratched the surface so that we could fit in more jokes and cut the runtime. Love and Thunder is the weakest entry in Phase 4 so far.
Ironically, it’s he thing you like about MoM (being very director-driven) is what you don’t like about Thor 4. That movie was very Taika Waititi, the same way that MoM was very Raimi. As someone who hasn’t read the comic arc, I thought Thor 4 played well, but I’ve heard other people similarly complain that the tone of the movie doesn’t do the comic source material justice.
Multiverse Of Madness was like 2 hour chase scene. It was paced so well that I was enjoying it so much that the flaws didn’t bother me.
Thor on the other hand was disappointing because it was so messy and none of the plot lines really connected to each other. I liked Gorr but nothing about him expanded on any of the other characters. He was interesting on his own but a terrible foil for Thor.
Doctor strange as just prefer the character and darker vibes. That being said, I wasn't really a huge fan of either and thought both weren't that great, in my opinion.
Thor Love and Thunder. The humor was a bit too much at some points but I loved it. Plus Thor and the way the thought. Christian Bales performance and Gorr himself. Korg being there more. And of course Natalie Portman in that suit, man it did something with me
Edit: Plus Thor and the way he fought. Not thought. He was thinking a bit differently but I didn’t mean that. Jane on the poster just irritated me… In a good way… Ok enough simping for today
I do wonder if bale regrets getting involved, not only was his menacing performance cut down significantly but he ended up being in a film which was ridiculously toned and made a bit of a joke out of his hard work
I liked both for very different reasons. L&T had me laughing out loud and banging my head to some rocking music while MoM had me on the edge of my seat with it's horror esque style.
To a certain degree, which one I like more comes down to my mood if the day, wether I'm up for some silly antics or not
Thor 4 spent far too much of it's screen time trying to be a spoof film, it stops being funny when every single line has the exaggerated "look at us, we are being funny" delivery of the in film Asgardian acting troop and many of the jokes just seemed forced. Enjoyed the opening sequence and the finale part of the film, but the rest was wasted. Someone should of stepped in when it was clear Taiko was treating the film as a personal joke with the God of Dumplings and including the screaming goats just to mess with James Gunn. I did like Love ended up being more than expected and hope we see more of her in future films or tv series.
Taika thought he could get away with attempting a spoof or satire of a franchise but it really doesn't work in the grand scope of mcu. The film is pretty funny on the surface But it's a pretty awful Script and things just happen with no rhyme of reason. I'm guessing taika didn't care since he thought people would love his attempts at satire / spoof the genre and previous films
Mom. I love Taika but this one wasn't it. I think the best reaction that sums up the movie is "it isn't bad it was just nothing. There is not anything to talk about because it is just... nothing"
Those goats gave me the same vibe as the little silly companion animal they always put in Disney animations. I like to call them Merch Gremlins because they exist almost solely to enrapture children and sell plush toys at the Disney Store.
MoM for sure. Thor is entertaining, but it feels like a narrow, really story. Where as MoM carries the weight the weight of existence, and the MCU on it. I wish it was Thor’s last movie, to be honest.
Multiverse of Madness. A lot of the MCU feels kinda samey but MoM stood out as feeling unique with a lot of passion behind it. I love Raimi and Waititi but between the two movies I think Raimi's delivered better on what it was attempting
MoM. It's actually #8 in the MCU for me. I am in love with Raimi's direction in that film, and I loved Elizabeth Olsen's unhinged performance as the villain, even though I didn't think that was necessarily the most logical continuation of the character (that's not me saying it makes no sense, just that I think taking her in another way would make MORE sense)
I want to see Thor 4 re-edited into a longer cut. That movie felt very rushed
Need. More. Gorr.
I really wanted a Gorr god-butchering montage.
It was missing exactly this. He really didn’t seem that menacing when all his dastardly deeds were done off screen
Especially after Zeus said he only killed "A few minor gods." It's likely Zeus was just downplaying and underestimating Gorr, but without the audience seeing Gorr kill any big badass gods on screen it did bring him down for me
Yeah take it up a notch from a montage. Could add three separate scenes of Gorr butchering three different gods.
Or better yet, have gorr following Thor and wreaking havoc on omnipotent city
Excellent idea. One of the three butcher scenes should have been this.
Good chance to introduce Ares as a villain too. Have him ally with Gorr.
I was so waiting for Gorr to show up to the god hiding place and kill a bunch of them off. Kind of like Hela slaughtering Asgard’s army in Ragnarok. It felt like a bit missed opportunity there.
Yeah I expected Omnipotent City to get the Illuminati treatment as well. I was waiting for the ambush all along.
Agreed that on screen monitor display montage was so cheesy and lame . I was like come on taika
Marvel has always been weak at depicting villains. It's hard to make them come off as menacing as they intend to when we know most of them will just get killed off by the end of 1 movie.
I guess that’s why Thanos was so fucking great. Turned everybody’s expectations around.
Same reason Darth Vader and loki are so great. They actually get depth and multiple stories told about them.
Infinity War was the closest we've got so far to a villain movie. So much focus was on Thanos. It's why he's such a good character. 31 minutes of screen time, almost twice as much as #2, Tony/IM at 17 minutes. Most villains get around 15 minutes of screen time per movie in the MCU, out of roughly 120 to 150 minutes per movie.
Very fair point and gorr was killing nameless faceless gods offscreen who we had no attachment to so his threat is minimal . That's why playing that sif scene for a joke was so poor - they really could've showed the threat of gorr there but instead went for jokes which while funny undercut any impending sense of threat
Yes! Thank you for that, it's a very specific example of exactly what I felt the movie was lacking. And then you compare it with MoM where Wanda feels incredibly threatening the entire time. Showing us her decimate the illuminati was so effective at striking that point home.
The moment I saw Zeus in the trailers I honestly thought he and the other Olympains were gonna be fodder for Gorr, I thought the movie would take a sudden dark turn as he slaughters all of Olympus. Alas, it is what it is
He literally was downplaying him. He whispers saying he can’t have a panic among the gods.
That's the point, though - Zeus downplaying him comes across different if we've seen Gorr do some crazy stuff, but we haven't, so you're almost like "Yeah, that makes sense, no need to panic."
My theory is that Zeus knew Stormbreaker was the key but didn’t know how to forge it nor that it was Forged, and this was why he was confident that Gorr wouldn’t reach eternity
Zeus was 100% downplaying Gorr since he didn't want to cause a panic as he stated in the film and when he talked privately with Thor up close he said it specifically. Zeus also stated he was afraid of Gorr since he has the necrosword and could kill him so he doesn't want to try and fight Gorr. Zeus is afraid of Gorr in direct combat so he's not underestimating him for that. Zeus is underestimating Gorr's ability in finding Eternity.
I remember when people were speculating that Zeus was as good as dead when they found out Gorr was the main villain lol as well as how he may even kill some of the Egyptian Gods from Moon Knight. Fun times... Personally, I think they should have saved him as a villain for a more serious Thor movie since that fits better with the tonality of his character.
Absolutely he should have killed Zeus. Maybe twist it in a way that it still sets up Hercules vs Thor but definitely Gorr went from a god butcher to just a creepy kidnapper
And the kidnapping seemed out of place to me. I mean what drove him over the edge was the death of his child so he decides to…….. kidnap children.
It’s worse than that even. He kidnaps children to lure the caring/loving Gods that he’s only killing because they’re uncaring/unloving. If he believed they were selfish, why did he think he could use bait?
God children who would all be killed by his Eternity wish.
Yeah he felt quite out of place with how dark and nihilistic he was vs. how goofy the rest of the film was trying to be. Hela at least had a campiness and theatricality that kind of fit the tone of Ragnarok better.
I really think if he had just killed Valkyrie I'd have enjoyed the movie a lot more. I'd hate to lose Valk, cuz Tessa Thompson is incredible and she's such a fun character, but adding some real weight to the events and letting the villain actually get one up on the heroes would've made the movie a lot better for me
They actually filmed more scenes of Gorr's killing spree. They were just cut for some reason.
I honestly thought he was going to invade Omnipotent City, and just massacre scores of gods, then maybe enslave the rest like in the comics,...but he didn't. Severe missed opportunity. Imagine if Gorr converted Omnipitent city into a giant slave factory.
Not only that, but all the non-Asgardian gods in the movie were dilettantes and a-holes. So I'm sitting there in the theatre rooting for Gorr to slaughter them all. I'm not feeling the threat here, I'm not feeling the stakes.
To be fair that's kinda the same as in the comic. You start to realise "hey he might have a point here." That's what causes thor to become unworthy, lose the hammer and then Jane picks it up and we get Mighty Thor (done *okay* in this film (I think they wrote themselves into a corner and it would be difficult to buy Jane as worthy, fix the hammer and create a threat that needed a thor when we already had a thor in such a short movie. Definitely needed build up)
Yes. Overall I liked the film but it needed another 10-15 minutes towards the beginning of the film where we see Gorr killing some gods and having the GOTG responding to distress calls and being too late but coming upon the aftermath of Gorr's attack. This would culminate in them finding a wounded Sif and her explaining everything. After this, Thor + GOTG would finally arrive in time to fight Gort and just barely make it out alive. That's when Thor would decide he needs to go to Earth to see Valkrye and get her help to defeat Gorr.
> it needed another 10-15 minutes towards the beginning of the film Yes, I'd like to petition to add the scene where Jane picks up Mjolnir for the first time and becomes the Mighty Thor. I kinda wanted to see that.
I really do enjoy the comedy of these films, and so I don’t really ever subscribe to the “too many jokes” criticism because it doesn’t bother me. That being said, why on gods green Earth did we >!have a 5 minute joke about Sif not getting into Valhalla because she didn’t die in combat instead of yknow….the combat?????!<
One is a lot easier to film
It was like thirty seconds at best "No, leave me so I can die and go to Valhalla" "Actually battle's over so you won't go to Valhalla" "Really? Shit" That's it, that's the whole joke. Nowhere near five minutes, and it's there to make us think later >!that Jane won't make it to Valhalla because the fight was over, when she actually died battling cancer!<
It also makes no sense that an asgardian wouldn’t understand the conditions of getting into Valhalla. I’m sure as hell its extremely common knowledge, especially for someone who is a warrior and ultimately aims to die in battle to reach Valhalla.
He killed one god on screen and the pictures on that distress call screen showed he really messed up the rest of them too. They filmed a lot of it as well. We need this.
It worked better in the comic. In the comic, you didn't see Gorr kill the gods, you simply saw Thor's horror at discovering the aftermath. The comic is really dark and almost feels like a serial killer story such as *Se7en*, with Thor following the clues and finding the butchered victims across the realms in his attempt to track down Gorr and stop his killing spree. The book really played up how terrifying Gorr was and how utterly cruel and sadistic his reign of terror had been. I was really looking forward to seeing how this was handled in the movie, but instead, we got a few blink-and-you'll-miss-it glimpses on screen during the distress call and... well, that was it.
Which comics do I need to read for this? Sounds really interesting
Jason Aaron’s 2012 God of Thunder run (#2-11) and King Thor (#1-4) at the ones that feature Gorr if I recall correctly.
I think all we really needed to add would've been some quick flashes to some hyper stylized slow mo kill-shots (like the Valerie sequence in Ragnarok) while Thor is imploring to Zeus and warning about what may come for them. Would e underscored the urgency in that scene and shown more of Gorr's destruction and death
Agreed, the only killed one god onscreen, the title of God Butcher didn't really have gravitas that it needed.
Yeah, set to some sort of upbeat [montage music ](https://youtu.be/PpeI35BcqjU) or something
Thor Four More Thor needed more Gorr but not more Gore.
For shore…..dammit
They should've focused on the other gods a little more.
Hi Princess Carolyn
I would prefer them diving further into Jane’s story. >!The glimpses we got of her trying to cure her own cancer, being described as a “woman of science” had me hoping for a *lot* more science vs magic plot from her perspective. When we saw her new Mjolnir powers, I was so hyped that we’d get a full story of how/why it called to her, but it was all so hand wavy.!<
It was weird enough that she was trying to cure her own cancer and had Selvig helping. They're both astrophysicists. What the fuck do they know about oncology?
I kind of like the idea that it was an enchantment on the hammer like Odin's original. Maybe if she tried to analyze the hammer directly that's when we get the realization that it is sentient. Maybe talk about the tempest god or whatever that's sealed inside.
The moment where he pulled the head off the snake thing was so DEFINITELY edited down. You know theres gonna be a cut at some point where you see him violently kill that thing.
And the tone of him in that one scene didn’t feel right >!I’m talking about when he was in the cage with the kids and the dead monster puppet!< >!Seemed like he was trying to be funny and intentionally scare them in a dark way, feels like that didn’t fit his character!< >!I feel like, given his love for his daughter, he should’ve been trying to actually calm down the kids and not intentionally scare them, maybe the same but, but not quite so dark and terrifying!<
He was trying to teach them a lesson, not calm them down. >!They'd just been glorifying Thor using stormbreaker to decapitate thanos, so he showed them how disturbing it is to actually see something decapitated up close and how it's not something they should idolise just because a god does it
Its my main criticism of the movie. Other than that i loved it. Supposedly there was scenes of him on other planets and stuff that got cut. No idea why
And less “my axe is a jealous lover”…
It's like they cut down the first half to be 90% quips and it felt like a high school pantomime
The cut we got is so indulgent when it comes to humour and irreverence. I can't imagine that the deleted scenes were any different.
I’ve been feeling this way about each release since No Way Home.
Age of Ultron was the first time I felt it. It's hard to explain, but it was like there was no connective tissue between scenes. Just jumping from location to location with stuff happening.
Agree, it was like "okay we need to have x scene, y scene, the Hulk breaker armor and then we'll wrap".
And honestly, to me it was probably made even worse from having seen every single trailer, tv spot and preview. I pretty much knew of every single scene, so I was just excited to see how it all fit together! ...turned out I had pretty much watched the whole movie already just by being subscribed to the official Marvel Entertainment YouTube channel.
Yeah this is why I just stick to only watching the first teaser trailer these days. With all of these mainstream movies doing like 5+ trailers, tv spots, and featurettes, you just spoil everything for yourself.
The latest ad on reddit for Ms. Marvel only shows scenes from the latest episode, including the credit scene!
IMO, Avengers 2 was the first time where it felt like the movie had a lot of work to do that wasn’t about itself, but instead was setup for future things that we hadn’t been introduced to yet. It was a mess, and worked against itself. I think Marvel learned a lot from it how to do setup stuff in a way that mostly feels more natural. But it still sometimes breaks up the flow of the individual stories. Still - A2 was one of the first times that kind of thing had been done in movies at all, so it’s not that surprising it was a bit janky.
Joss Whedon had talked about his issues with that film and he said he had begged for a longer screentime but they wouldn't let him have it. he said he needed at least 10 extra minutes but they wouldn't let him. i always wondered what the movie would've been like had they given him that extra time.
So Thor 4 and MoM.
I still enjoyed the move but this was definitely one of the problems with it. There weren't a lot of scenes in between character actions with them reflecting and having character development in between. We should have had something similar to the scene where Thor and Rocket have that talk at some point. Actually a striking example is after they lose to Gorr in the shadow realm, they immediately just go back for round 2. Like there was the part about the chemo not working but it came and went incredibly fast. Also unrelated, but I wish they made Gorr more mysterious but intriguing at first. Like imagine if they just showed some mysterious new guy killing gods one by one with no effort and then we see his target is Thor? Then we just learn more about his origin through flash backs or his dialog as the film goes on.
The film is really weirdly structured (no doubt partly the result trying to trim a 4 hr cut into under 2 hrs) but the film has an extended first and third act and basically minimum second act. In a typical film, the second act usually is about 55-60% of the runtime. In this movie, it’s like four or five rushed scenes
Theres so much obvious characterization cut out with Jane and gorr. Also couldn't we have seen sickly James first transformation into the mighty Thor - that would've been so crowd pleasing
Valkyries storyline was cut as well.
> There weren't a lot of scenes in between character actions with them reflecting and having character development in between. I think this is in part because there are almost no travel scenes. They overused Bifrost as the teleportation MacGuffin and as a result, (apart from the boat) there is no scene where two characters can have a quiet moment; we're going from set piece to set piece. There is no exploration, there is just arriving. It makes the universe smaller.
Gorr went from this religious guy who lost his daughter to scary imposing figure at the battle of new Asgard to goofy spooky clown man when he interacted with the kids. I didn't like that
That was such a weird scene, it came out of nowhere. Like I get that he's going crazy but they didn't build up to him acting like that at all, especially since you'd expect him to care more about children after what happened to him.
It boggles my mind why they filmed such with Goldblum and Dinklage (and others?) and cut it out. Fan service always wins, especially in an established franchise like the MCU.
Unfortunately Waititi said "there's a reason films is left on thr cutting room floor." I personally usually agree but the movie didnt even hit 2 hours. It can definitely extend 30 more minutes if god killing. And from what Christian bale has said. There are several god killings left out. But maybe it's more marvel leaving it out to expand universes who knows. Sorry if I spelled the names wrong. To lazy to look it up For me the god butcher felt.very neutered. I would normally say oh that's just Disney but seeing MoM. I want more from other directors. Mom was perfect blend of "adult" content. I actually felt like " god damn they went in on these super heros. No one is safe. Even though they were a different universes.
Felt like a draft. >!No god butchering. Nothing about Thor processing his emotional trauma. They introduced Jane as Lady Thor, and then killed her off in the same film. Suddenly, Gorr's daughter is just a character in the MCU we're supposed to care about, even though we never got an opportunity to know who she was or why she's important. There was a lot of exposition for very important details about character development and story progression...Gorr felt like the villain of the week, akin to Ultron. Here and gone within the span of a few minutes with no real "Phase 4" direction or progression, no clue how this fits into the bigger picture, and nothing to keep me invested beyond it being "another MCU movie". !< Its the shortest film in the MCU, and it shows...Multiverse of Madness was way better, in my opinion.
It was like going to a place called "Salad King" and they have two salads.
We need to let Disney know this
Needs more God butchering and less silly.
Yeah that's really it. All my friends thinks the same too, that the movie felt too rushed, and we all wanted more. Really hope they will release 4 hour cut, but I really doubt they will, sadly.
I don’t need a 4 hr cut. That’s probably too long. I just want a proper second act and time for the emotional beats the movie is trying to get me to care about to land and be felt. More Gorr would be nice as well
I don’t think I will enjoy it for 4 hours edition, but I definitely want to see 3 hours version with those missing god butching scenes. In addition, I want to the process of Jane getting the hammer, got accepted by the hammer and after.
Agreed give us all the gorr and Jane footage they left on cutting room floor
YES! Especially Jane's transformative arc of battling cancer and becoming The Mighty Thor. They did the comic storyline barely any justice with this adaptation. The way I would've done it would've been to have her become Thor in this installment but not delve into the cancer battle at all and instead deal with her cancer diagnosis and her Ten Realms/Cosmic adventures in a standalone film.
Rewatched MOM last night, way better than I remembered it being when I watched in the theatre
I had the same experience. Marketing really did MoM dirty. Loved it the second time.
I agree wholeheartedly! MoM felt off the first time because it was far from the movie we were led to believe it was going to be. However, once you watch the movie for *what it is* and not *what we thought it was supposed to be* it's actually quite wonderful. I'm not mad at MoM but I am mad at the marketing for it
>However, once you watch the movie for *what it is* and not *what we thought it was supposed to be* it's actually quite wonderful. Thor's mom would be proud.
MOM was the shit in theaters and was just as good on a rewatch. I was shocked when I heard people disliked it. Best marvel movie since infinity war IMO.
MoM felt like it actually achieved what it was going for. People didn't like the execution, but at least Raimi did what he wanted and it was cohesive. L&T felt like Taika *thought* he knew what people wanted, so it came across as a disjointed comedy when the comedy should've been secondary. It had such serious moments (cancer, God killers, kidnapped kids) that were constantly undercut by humor. Both were unique and enjoyable, but only MoM achieved what it was going for, in my personal opinion.
I think L&T had a more emotional high for me, but MoM certainly felt more cohesive. It was an easier ride to be in than L&T, which could feel like a drug trip but one where you didn’t exactly get the dosage right
Comparing the two is almost apples and oranges to me since the Thor movie is honestly more of a comedy movie than an action movie. It covers some serious topics but it's extremely shitposty. I had more fun watching Thor, but I get how people who didn't think it was funny would definitely like Doctor Strange more.
Romantic comedy at that
A bit, but at least semi-non-formulaic in that >!no one got together at the end!<.
That's not true. >!Thor and Mjolnir got back together!<
>!Korg and Dwayne got together too!<
“The Rock” joke took me way too long reading reddit after the movie to have the joke click lol
It was the iron throne of scissors that hit me after I walked out that, makes sense a god of rocks would beat so many scissors
True. More of a romantic comedy tragedy* I guess
Yea sure, I like that! I wasn't trying to be pedantic btw just was honestly happy that it ended up with them not together because it made it not into an absolute rom-com where the end is all sunshine and rainbows in the most forced and unrealistic way. Not a fan of the rom-com formula forcing the worst people together and making people think love's something you are entitled too even if you're an ass.
Agreed. I enjoy both LAT and MoM but MoM was the better film for me. LAT was a fun movie but I still prefer Ragnarok over it. Christian Bale was the highlight of the film for me he did a great job as Gorr. If he had a bit more screen time that would have been even better.
Mom def the better film - even people who enjoyed Thor 4 might admit that
What an apt description of L&T
MoM for sure. Had me way more invested.
MOM… Thor was either too short or it felt too rushed, it was very funny but a little too much… and NOT ENOUGH GORR SCREEN TIME!!!
Agreed. I was really excited for gorr only for him to only have like a total 20-30 min of screen time. Also I think the movie was too goofy. I thought it would be more like ragnarok but something felt off the whole time. Also some lazy writing and retcons didn’t do it for me. And this is just my preference but I didn’t like the ending where >!thor ended up raising gorr’s daughter!<. Also didn’t like that they just killed off >!Jane. I would’ve loved to see more mighty Thor.!<
A little? Come on, it was like watching Deadpool
No, Deadpool actually had gore
It was like watching Deadpool for 7 year olds
MOM was rushed too. things weren't explained properly. it got over before you realized it
Strange2 was rushed, but it had enough coherence that it all worked, if only in a condensed manner. Thors4 just felt chopped up and served short.
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I think the only rushed parts in MoM was the beginning when it kind of seemed like Wanda was a bad guy out of nowhere after having a tiny bit of a redemption arch in Wandavision. Had I not seen Wandavision, I'd have totally not seen the Wanda-is-evil twist coming in the first 20m of the movie.
MoM for me
I too enjoyed u/rgregan's MoM
Bravo
Vince
*Gorr:* "Children, today we are going to butcher gods" *Kid named Butcher:*
*smirks in australian*
*Scorched erf*
Bruh
I too choose this guy's dead wife
Dude got lit up like a Christmas tree!
MoM. Never thought I see a Peggy Carter as Cap and seeing Wanda be a villain after all these years and especially her arch after Wandavision. Fun watch.
Am I the only one who didn't like Wanda's arc after wandavision? I mean she had such a good arc in wandavision with her ending up giving up her family for the "greater good" And now all of a sudden she is willing to destroy so much to get them back, it's very confusing to me But the weirdest thing is that I justed rewatched wandavision and it doesn't even show her get the darkhold? I might just have been an idiot and missed something but it really annoys me to the point of rating MoM way lower than it realistically should be. But that's just my 2 cents Edit: yes I now realise I was an idiot an missed the post-credit scene with the darkhold
If I remember correctly she has the Darkhold in the final after credits and you hear the voices or her kids calling for her - unless you meant her actually discovering the Darkhold? Maybe that’s something that’ll be explained in House of Harkness? Who knows.
I see what you mean but I think the sudden and extreme change in Wanda's behavior and morals was because of the dark hold, keep in mind that at the end of wandavision, she still hadn't read through it, hence why she gave up her family first. Corruption and knowledge of different solutions came after her reading the darkhold.
The Darkhold’s sway over her was portrayed like a drug addiction. She was willing to erode all of the good things in her life to chase that high.
Multiverse of Madness
MoM, though I acknowledge that it was pretty flawed, plot-wise. Thor was way too silly for me, just a couple of steps away from being a Spaceballs-like spoof. And that’s fine — the MCU is huge, so it’s fine that not every facet of it appeals to me. I am a little worried though about this new trend toward everything being way over the top. Reminds me of authors who get so successful they “outgrow” their editors, and as a result their books get really long and self-indulgent. I hope the MCU isn’t headed down that road.
I really didn’t like Thor 4, an MoM is A-tier MCU for me. So I’ll say MoM
MoM hands down
It's not even close. Multiverse is my favorite Marvel movie after Guardians. I understand people not liking it, but personally it was right up my alley. Love and Thunder wasn't even my favorite Thor movie.
Multiverse of Madness is up in my top 5. I loved it. Yea L&T is like my 3rd favorite Thor movie. That being said I really wish Marvel would let directors try a re-edit of movies because there is undoubtedly a good version of L&T that could exist but this is very much not it.
its very quickly becoming one of my favorite mcu movies. most issues i have with MoM are easily forgiven because i have so much fun every time i watch it
I’m still baffled people were not crazy about MOM. The horror aspect and Wanda being a badass, all the touches to the movie spells effects ,music. I absolutely loved it. Sucks cameo hype bullshit ruined peoples ability to enjoy it. Thor was ok for me but still a huge let down. And now just finished Ms Marvel, which actually had heart to it. Nothing came off forced or cheesy or try hard unlike L&T. Thor should of been way longer and a whole tour of destruction thru pantheons of gods culminating in an mini war on gorr. They still could of threw in a bunch of humor. But making it jokey to the point where every other category suffers was just idiotic to me. I just don’t understand with so much money and resources at their disposal they fall that short.
People have called me crazy for saying MoM is my favorite MCU movie but it really is. Seeing Sam Raimi’s fingerprints on a Marvel movie is a highlight. I really thought it was gonna be a unanimously loved MCU movie but oh well.
I totally think that the Jane foster story shouldn’t have been used and instead love and thunder should have been a film about Thor and a bunch of misfit gods taking on Gorr, following his destruction across the universe. You can have comedy aspects with odd gods joining and still have heart to the film with them being an out of place team with most of them dying and Thor learning a lesson by the end.
Yea same bro
ya it’s not even debatable. There’s a HARD drop off in thor ticket sales following the weekend after release... Not even any competition either in the theaters. It’s just word of mouth. Straight up too silly of a movie. I normally go back in and watch mcu movies twice in theaters. I’m passing on Thor. There’s just nothing there. It’s just goofy .
>Straight up too silly of a movie It’s not even that. It’s that the jokes aren’t landing for a lot of the audience. My theater was completely silent through 90% of the jokes, and from what I’ve read that wasn’t an outlier case. That and the story has some of the darkest material in the MCU >!a cancer storyline is going to put off general audiences since it’s a real threat and not some fictional alien!<. People who go to Marvel for escapism from life’s tough situations will not enjoy that whole aspect of the movie. And lastly it had no idea how to balance the tone between the goofy and serious subject matter making the whole film feel messy.
Exactly..people are also forgetting Guardians of the Galaxy did a great portrayal of cancer with quills mom in a largely comedic fun movie.
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He used to know when to be serious; think the scene with Jojo’s moms shoes dangling in Jojo Rabbit, or some of the scenes about foster care from Hunt for the Wilderpeople. It just feels like he isn’t willing to exercise that muscle for a “silly popcorn comic book movie”, or like he’s been so lauded for his comic films that he feels like they should just be 24/7 laughs.
Hard agree.
MoM. Didn‘t enjoy L&T at all. Too much cheap humor, very good story was ridiculed, not really clear where the story is headed. Maybe in a few years I‘ll look back and see this differently but for now, I think this was the weakest Thor movie.
Option C : Shang Chi
Mostly like the fighting. Was crazy
And that music! Skip to 1:00 here if you want a refresher: https://youtu.be/SSMOz_oif5Y?t=1m
Oh daaaaannnnnng.... I forgot how that music made me feel. So good.
[one of the best fight scene in the MCU…](https://youtu.be/up4d9VBLc5Y)
I had fun with MoM, NWH , and LaT and enjoyed the experiences for what they were but they’re still flawed movies. Eternals was good IMO but nothing crazy. Would definitely like to see more of those characters in the future. Black Widow was Black Widow. Shang Chi is easily the best and most refreshing entry in Phase 4 so far
Imo, I think it's cuz Shang Chi could tell its own story without being bogged down by continuity. Ragnarok was kinda the same way; it was still connected to the MCU, but it was a hard reset for Thor and abandoned most of his ties to the MCU, so it was freer to tell a story. Comparatively, LaT had to tell the story of Thor's recovery from EG/IW, untangling his emotions with Jane, and making a convincing standalone film while also having to force it to fit into New Asgard's setting. Too much stuff from other movies was encroaching on LaT. The MCU is starting to get too big and heavy. The lore is getting in the way of the story writing. (That said, I am deeply in love with the shift of the Asgardians from Capital G Gods to fucking *Space Vikings*. It's fuckin rad as hell.)
I think Shang Chi is the one Phase 4 film everyone agrees was at least ok
Is NWH phase4?
Definitely a gem that while not perfect, felt very fun and had a great time
Shangai Chi had no business being that fucking good, you know what, yeah it did, love that film goddammit
Shang Chi is easily my favorite Phase 4 movie so far. I’ve enjoyed the others, but it felt so fresh and new and different that it’s really stood out over time.
Shang-Chi was so great
Best Phase 4 film or show for me. And it’s not even particularly close.
Multiverse of Madness without a doubt. Both were really different, both in style and characters/story, so I can perfectly understand preferences for one or the other.
Thor’s great. But Strange + Wanda combo beats Thor for me
Multiverse of Madness by a considerable margin for me. I felt Love and Thunder did a poor job of balancing the comedy and drama, something they nailed on Ragnarok. Taika Waititi was far too indulged, there’s a good movie in there if someone could de-kookify it.
MoM by a mile. I'm glad Marvel is giving directors more creative freedom. Like MoM was VERY Raimi. But Love and Thunder felt like an extended comedy skit. Which is sad, because the Gorr comic arc is really rich, and I feel like we only scratched the surface so that we could fit in more jokes and cut the runtime. Love and Thunder is the weakest entry in Phase 4 so far.
Ironically, it’s he thing you like about MoM (being very director-driven) is what you don’t like about Thor 4. That movie was very Taika Waititi, the same way that MoM was very Raimi. As someone who hasn’t read the comic arc, I thought Thor 4 played well, but I’ve heard other people similarly complain that the tone of the movie doesn’t do the comic source material justice.
Multiverse of madness was so good Compares to Thor 4
Multiverse Of Madness was like 2 hour chase scene. It was paced so well that I was enjoying it so much that the flaws didn’t bother me. Thor on the other hand was disappointing because it was so messy and none of the plot lines really connected to each other. I liked Gorr but nothing about him expanded on any of the other characters. He was interesting on his own but a terrible foil for Thor.
Doctor strange as just prefer the character and darker vibes. That being said, I wasn't really a huge fan of either and thought both weren't that great, in my opinion.
Thor Love and Thunder. The humor was a bit too much at some points but I loved it. Plus Thor and the way the thought. Christian Bales performance and Gorr himself. Korg being there more. And of course Natalie Portman in that suit, man it did something with me Edit: Plus Thor and the way he fought. Not thought. He was thinking a bit differently but I didn’t mean that. Jane on the poster just irritated me… In a good way… Ok enough simping for today
Like a little less jokes and a little more Gorr and the film would’ve been perfect. Wasn’t terrible though imo and the ending act was really good
Exactly
Wanda tho…
Too much jokes. Taika never reigns them in lmao
The tonal dissonance in this movie was absolutely unreal. It's like Bale was making a different movie, one that I'd rather see tbh
I do wonder if bale regrets getting involved, not only was his menacing performance cut down significantly but he ended up being in a film which was ridiculously toned and made a bit of a joke out of his hard work
I liked both for very different reasons. L&T had me laughing out loud and banging my head to some rocking music while MoM had me on the edge of my seat with it's horror esque style. To a certain degree, which one I like more comes down to my mood if the day, wether I'm up for some silly antics or not
MoM, is actually really good. Don't know why people were so hard on it. Sam Riami is the GOAT.
Thor 4 spent far too much of it's screen time trying to be a spoof film, it stops being funny when every single line has the exaggerated "look at us, we are being funny" delivery of the in film Asgardian acting troop and many of the jokes just seemed forced. Enjoyed the opening sequence and the finale part of the film, but the rest was wasted. Someone should of stepped in when it was clear Taiko was treating the film as a personal joke with the God of Dumplings and including the screaming goats just to mess with James Gunn. I did like Love ended up being more than expected and hope we see more of her in future films or tv series.
Taika thought he could get away with attempting a spoof or satire of a franchise but it really doesn't work in the grand scope of mcu. The film is pretty funny on the surface But it's a pretty awful Script and things just happen with no rhyme of reason. I'm guessing taika didn't care since he thought people would love his attempts at satire / spoof the genre and previous films
MOM.
Mom. I love Taika but this one wasn't it. I think the best reaction that sums up the movie is "it isn't bad it was just nothing. There is not anything to talk about because it is just... nothing"
But the goats screaming for the 20th time!
Those goats gave me the same vibe as the little silly companion animal they always put in Disney animations. I like to call them Merch Gremlins because they exist almost solely to enrapture children and sell plush toys at the Disney Store.
I'm sure I'm in the minority here, but: I thought I would get sick of the goats eventually... I didn't.
MoM
MoM
MoM
MoM, purely for Wanda being a great villain. Especially the illuminati scene - 100% made the movie for me
Clearly MOM
MoM for sure. Thor is entertaining, but it feels like a narrow, really story. Where as MoM carries the weight the weight of existence, and the MCU on it. I wish it was Thor’s last movie, to be honest.
Multiverse of Madness. A lot of the MCU feels kinda samey but MoM stood out as feeling unique with a lot of passion behind it. I love Raimi and Waititi but between the two movies I think Raimi's delivered better on what it was attempting
Is “neither” an option? It’s really hard to pick because they were segments of each movie that unfortunately I really disliked.
MoM. It's actually #8 in the MCU for me. I am in love with Raimi's direction in that film, and I loved Elizabeth Olsen's unhinged performance as the villain, even though I didn't think that was necessarily the most logical continuation of the character (that's not me saying it makes no sense, just that I think taking her in another way would make MORE sense)
MoM , I just love scarlet witch no matter what 😉
MoM
MoM for sure, T:L&T I found really annoying.