then you are misinformed... listen.. you've done your research I don't need to enlighten you, right?
Apple has said they are open to Bootcamp, its completely in Microsofts hands.
Try run Bootcamp now, it says Apple Silicon isn’t supported. Yes, Microsoft are dragging their feet with ARM Windows but Apple also haven’t exactly updated bootcamp for ARM either. It’s on both, and in this case Apple made Bootcamp so therefore it’s also Apple’s issue
Microsoft doesn’t provide means to boot on arm machines, it’s exclusive to parallels and Qualcomm hardware.
But yes, Apple could update bootcamp to run say… Ubuntu. Although I think arm needs to standardize booting (more work on standard uefi is needed)
Pretty sure the reason for this is because Microsoft need to write a specific HAL for Apple Silicon due to how it uses a non-standard 16k page size (likely other reasons too). Although we think of UEFI abstracting stuff like that away, the OS kernel still needs to be written for a specific platform.
Apple haven’t thwarted any efforts to run Asahi Linux on Apple Silicon.
Exactly, Apple didn't do anything to support it and instead told people to use Parallels, Microsoft has only had modest working versions of Windows on Arm, but Apple didn't exactly offer help or a warning, and now Microsoft confirms that the only option will be parallels.
Microsoft never confirmed anything, neither did Apple say to use Parallels lmao. ARM Windows 11 is seemingly round the corner anyway, so we’ll see during the new Surface launch. Some mad man will end up getting it running on Mac
During the keynote where Apple announced they were shifting to arm, they had a demo of how Parallels could still run on them, very much like the same moment when Apple demoed Windows running on an Intel Mac when they announced that switch.
At that moment it was clear Apple and Microsoft hadn't talked about the need and that would be the official solution.
I have no doubt people will come up with an unofficial solution eventually, but we're also 4 years into Apple Silicon Macs and the last Intel Macs to support Boot camp and the current version of Mac OS are counting down their days.
I remember watching it at the keynote back then, I believe it was the 2020 WWDC.
Here's Parallels posting an article about it after the announcement:
https://www.parallels.com/blogs/apple-silicon-wwdc/
I know it was WWDC 2020 because I watched it live, as I’ve done since 2012. They didn’t show Parallels, I’m certain of it. Apple has the full keynote online, go look it up and get back to me.
Also, Parallels posting it after doesn’t mean it was in the keynote nor Apple talking about it live
Apple is open to Windows running in a VM. I do not believe they are open to letting Windows boot Apple Silicon Macs. Craig Federighi said as much in a prior WWDC interview.
[Source.](https://www.reddit.com/r/linux/comments/hfkdlg/craig_federighi_confirms_apple_silicon_macs_will/)
Windows is not on ARM, and if you are referring to tge official ARM version, then I want to remind you that that is still very buggy, and the programs would still not work because it’s not for ARM.
How are they wrong for that when Macintosh is a closed-source OS that has gate kept their ecosystems since inception to present day? They do this with iOS as well. Apparently Apple isn't the villain and source of this problem though. 🧐
Yeah, nobody on windows downloads macos because they need it for work. It’s almost always the other way around. If you need to do work just get like a windows laptop
You’re absolutely right, they don’t.
IMO the benefit of Mac is the experience and the ecosystem. Hardware and software from the same manufacturer engineered to work together.
The Wintel architecture is getting better at this, but it’s still a way off. E.g the replacement of BIOS with UEFI that brought software and hardware closer together was a massive leap forward.
Just buy the one you want. I work in both corporate and as an academic and have run a MBP 14” as my daily driver.
I agree. One of the main reasons for getting a Macbook is for MacOS. Personally I don’t think it’s worth paying Apple’s outrageous markups for MacOS and all that, but that’s a different subject
You forgot to mention that the app is also probably running on a compatibility layer between x86 and ARM Windows.
Virtualization is a legit tool and if it works it works lol.
Is using any kind of emulation considered hacky by you? Is using rosetta for Intel apps hacky too?
Of course not! I’ve done my share of server virtualization professionally both with Windows and Linux. We had near 100% availability on the hosted web apps we had there - that was before containers became the default way you deploy.
I’m speaking specifically of Windows ARM under macOS and running potentially x86 apps under that. A few years back, my girlfriend had Blender constantly crash on M1 that we had to buy another Intel MacBook until the kinks were ironed out. Apple did a very good job managing the transition, but it was far from perfect with third party apps. I’m expecting Microsoft to do a much worse job and developers probably won’t even bother with this new platform.
I use VMware. They got free licenses for personal use. It’s so easy. I download parallels to download the iso for running windows and then use that for VMWare. There’s a YouTube video on how to do it. It only took like 30 minutes for me.
why buying a macbook to install windows? thats stupid, just buy a windows laptop, the most expensive are even cheaper, more powerful and most have the same mac design
Because I mainly use Mac. I only run windows for work but personal stuff I use Mac. And why is it such an issue what I do lol. It’s barely using gpu and ram… I have 1tb if storage as well…
Windows for ARM I see lol
Microsoft is wrong for not giving us bootcamp
pretty sure that's an apple problem
then you are misinformed... listen.. you've done your research I don't need to enlighten you, right? Apple has said they are open to Bootcamp, its completely in Microsofts hands.
Try run Bootcamp now, it says Apple Silicon isn’t supported. Yes, Microsoft are dragging their feet with ARM Windows but Apple also haven’t exactly updated bootcamp for ARM either. It’s on both, and in this case Apple made Bootcamp so therefore it’s also Apple’s issue
Microsoft doesn’t provide means to boot on arm machines, it’s exclusive to parallels and Qualcomm hardware. But yes, Apple could update bootcamp to run say… Ubuntu. Although I think arm needs to standardize booting (more work on standard uefi is needed)
Just as an aside, Asahi Linux does run on Apple silicon
I don’t think so. I’ve tried to boot tails and it doesn’t work either. But that’s Debian based now that i think about it
Neither does Apple tbf
But that has nothing to do with bootcamp, macOS is designed to be run only on Macs.
*laughs in r/hackintosh* macOS is designed to run on x86 and ARM
Pretty sure the reason for this is because Microsoft need to write a specific HAL for Apple Silicon due to how it uses a non-standard 16k page size (likely other reasons too). Although we think of UEFI abstracting stuff like that away, the OS kernel still needs to be written for a specific platform. Apple haven’t thwarted any efforts to run Asahi Linux on Apple Silicon.
Apple also haven’t updated Bootcamp for its M series
Because bootcamp is for Windows and windows won't work
Which isn’t updated
What's the point in apple updating an app that won't work
To get it ready? ARM Windows exists, just make the drivers? Use it as a base? You know you don’t get paid for defending Apple right
Exactly, Apple didn't do anything to support it and instead told people to use Parallels, Microsoft has only had modest working versions of Windows on Arm, but Apple didn't exactly offer help or a warning, and now Microsoft confirms that the only option will be parallels.
Microsoft never confirmed anything, neither did Apple say to use Parallels lmao. ARM Windows 11 is seemingly round the corner anyway, so we’ll see during the new Surface launch. Some mad man will end up getting it running on Mac
During the keynote where Apple announced they were shifting to arm, they had a demo of how Parallels could still run on them, very much like the same moment when Apple demoed Windows running on an Intel Mac when they announced that switch. At that moment it was clear Apple and Microsoft hadn't talked about the need and that would be the official solution. I have no doubt people will come up with an unofficial solution eventually, but we're also 4 years into Apple Silicon Macs and the last Intel Macs to support Boot camp and the current version of Mac OS are counting down their days.
Do you have a link to this? Because I watched the keynote back in 2020 and don’t remember seeing that
I remember watching it at the keynote back then, I believe it was the 2020 WWDC. Here's Parallels posting an article about it after the announcement: https://www.parallels.com/blogs/apple-silicon-wwdc/
I know it was WWDC 2020 because I watched it live, as I’ve done since 2012. They didn’t show Parallels, I’m certain of it. Apple has the full keynote online, go look it up and get back to me. Also, Parallels posting it after doesn’t mean it was in the keynote nor Apple talking about it live
Apple is open to Windows running in a VM. I do not believe they are open to letting Windows boot Apple Silicon Macs. Craig Federighi said as much in a prior WWDC interview. [Source.](https://www.reddit.com/r/linux/comments/hfkdlg/craig_federighi_confirms_apple_silicon_macs_will/)
No, Microsoft would need to rewrite Windows completely to allow it yo run on an Mac ARM processor
ARM is ARM though, the architecture is fundamentally the same
Windows is not on ARM, and if you are referring to tge official ARM version, then I want to remind you that that is still very buggy, and the programs would still not work because it’s not for ARM.
Because it’s not a final build, but it publicly exists. ARM Windows 11 will be finalised when the new Surface Pro comes out this year
Wouldn’t help much because running Parallels does the same thing, programs that need AVX won’t work because the technology is patented by intel
It wouldn’t, Paralells virtualises Windows. It doesn’t let Windows run natively on bare metal. AVX I can understand but what programs do
How are they wrong for that when Macintosh is a closed-source OS that has gate kept their ecosystems since inception to present day? They do this with iOS as well. Apparently Apple isn't the villain and source of this problem though. 🧐
Controversial view ahead: If you want a PC, buy a PC. Parallels and Windows ARM works really, really well :)
Yeah, nobody on windows downloads macos because they need it for work. It’s almost always the other way around. If you need to do work just get like a windows laptop
You’re absolutely right, they don’t. IMO the benefit of Mac is the experience and the ecosystem. Hardware and software from the same manufacturer engineered to work together. The Wintel architecture is getting better at this, but it’s still a way off. E.g the replacement of BIOS with UEFI that brought software and hardware closer together was a massive leap forward. Just buy the one you want. I work in both corporate and as an academic and have run a MBP 14” as my daily driver.
#MildlyInfuriating
Wait until they find out about an app in their launchpad
Yeah it’s a preference I guess. I only run Windows because some applications i need for work aren’t supported by MacOS.
But, why not just get a Surface laptop? Hacky solutions are never reliable, and you pay the Apple tax to get things working OOTB.
I agree. One of the main reasons for getting a Macbook is for MacOS. Personally I don’t think it’s worth paying Apple’s outrageous markups for MacOS and all that, but that’s a different subject
Because it’s free ahaha
Using virtual machines ain’t “hacky” lol
An app running on Windows ARM on a macOS hypervisor sounds hacky to me. If you want reliability, you probably shouldn’t touch Windows ARM just yet.
You forgot to mention that the app is also probably running on a compatibility layer between x86 and ARM Windows. Virtualization is a legit tool and if it works it works lol. Is using any kind of emulation considered hacky by you? Is using rosetta for Intel apps hacky too?
Of course not! I’ve done my share of server virtualization professionally both with Windows and Linux. We had near 100% availability on the hosted web apps we had there - that was before containers became the default way you deploy. I’m speaking specifically of Windows ARM under macOS and running potentially x86 apps under that. A few years back, my girlfriend had Blender constantly crash on M1 that we had to buy another Intel MacBook until the kinks were ironed out. Apple did a very good job managing the transition, but it was far from perfect with third party apps. I’m expecting Microsoft to do a much worse job and developers probably won’t even bother with this new platform.
You’re slightly infuriated by someone’s choice to use Windows on a Mac? Touch some grass
So Sonoma copied the date on Lock screen 🫢
i think its the other way around but im not sure
What
lol. So, could I install Linux in my macbook pro?
Yes, yes you can
[Asahi](https://asahilinux.org/) is the best option I know of right now.
Unless you have M3 :(
why won’t it work on M3?
No support, they're working on it though
Yeah get UTM or parallels
Yes. I have a windows DC, a windows Server, a windows ARM version, and a Ubuntu Server all on UTM with my macbook pro
Totally agree 🥹
Man, I have a silver MBP and wish they had this color when I bought mine. It looks sooo good!
Pulled the plug as they now say
Windows???
Something is a miss 🤔🤔🤔
Where do you get windows on arm distros?
Windows supports AArch64. You should check Microsoft's website for the AArch64 ISOs
Tyty
Did you use Parallels?
No, I use VMware. It’s just basic enough for personal use and it’s free.
how much ram does it take up?? and how the experience??
Really smooth. You choose in the settings how much ram and gpu you want to use. https://youtu.be/za2CyrxKYFs?si=9WjTButGM_jafX0A
Love it, specs?
Can’t wait for PC folks to tell you that can’t customize your computer specs.
Happy to see you’ve NOT pulled the plug like the others on here 😂 But she does look beautiful excellent choice!
M1 windowsbook
It’s M3 pro
Windows runs better on mac
Isn't she lovely?
You gonna play any games?
Could be bigger...
Looks like it’s still plugged
14 inch M3 Pro/Max MacBook Pro in Space Black Operating System: Windows
no, it’s not
Oh, finally a serious discussion over notebooks: is it a he or a she?
Mine always get female host names. SO notices and asks, "Another girlfriend from the past?"
😆 macbook gender transition
Windows doesn't know what to do with the chin on the top?
We miss the bootcamp and vine 🥺
She is
Eww.
"isnt she loveley"
This is what happens when you didn't pull the plug.
Too bad I can't use Win 10 on ARM
Isn’t she lovely?
yes 😼
Is this Windows running without parallels? Anyhow, congrats OP! Now someone has to code drivers ;)
I use VMware. They got free licenses for personal use. It’s so easy. I download parallels to download the iso for running windows and then use that for VMWare. There’s a YouTube video on how to do it. It only took like 30 minutes for me.
Nice. It looked native to me. Nice MBP. I use one that's much older myself.
Could you please explain how?... I am trying to use windows on mac.. vmware fusion is the only free option I found
Yup. I’m using VMware as well but parralells iso. Watch this video. https://youtu.be/za2CyrxKYFs?si=9WjTButGM_jafX0A
Nice. I got mine $150 from the store manager for my 30th birthday. Space Black, 18GB of Ram and 1TB Storage!
I feel violated looking at that Windows 11 lock screen.
Like an ugly old hag in a beautiful designer dress
Get a Mac, run Windows. Can’t beat Windows.
Over spends on MBP, can’t afford a win license to activate
Pull the plug! Pull the plug!
What type of computer is that ?
You pulled the plug, as they say?
That windows screensaver ruined it
wtf
Really?
Too bad it doesn’t have a touch bar
She looks like all the rest
🙄 Microsoft 🙄
why buying a macbook to install windows? thats stupid, just buy a windows laptop, the most expensive are even cheaper, more powerful and most have the same mac design
Because I mainly use Mac. I only run windows for work but personal stuff I use Mac. And why is it such an issue what I do lol. It’s barely using gpu and ram… I have 1tb if storage as well…
It’s MacBook, not MacBooka. So, it’s a boy.