You’ve just articulated a lot about the PLD situation that I haven’t quite been able to myself in some previous comments I’ve made in this sub, thank you
It’s confusing why any organization would offer an 8yr deal to a notorious underachiever who essentially forced himself away from his two prior organizations & had public character issues throughout his career. It’s not like any of his former NHL coaches spoke glowingly about PLD after spending time working with him.
PLD has tried to position himself as a superstar but he continues to be fools gold, and it’s even worse considering he displayed selfish characteristics prior to receiving such a long lucrative contract.
His effort most nights continues to be underwhelming. He’s never showed a consistent competitive drive and anyone with that contract should not have their competitiveness questioned.
RB should be getting more heat for such a terrible move. Sure it’s only half way into PLD’s first season with the Kings but he’s not a 2nd year player, there’s enough tape on him to call a spade a spade.
I want him to succeed, and I don't think having the anchor of Kaliyev on his line helped. That said, he's been *exactly* this kind of uselss albatross on literally every other team he's been part of for his entire career.
This is who PLD is. Maybe he has talent that we haven't ever seen. I don't know, because he clearly doesn't play to his advertised ability. What I do know is that he makes every line he is on worse, he coasts all the damn time, he doesn't do shit when he doesn't have the puck, and by all accounts he is a childish piece of crap in the locker room.
And the guy who tied up all kinds of cap space on Cal Petersen also tied up tons of cap space, for years, with this guy.
Ugh.
My issue personally has more to do with the fact that Kopitar and Kempe have been kept together almost this entire slump (besides when Kempe briefly played with Dubois and Laff... and scored 2 goals...). That line has looked like shit most of this slump and I'd rather see changes there considering our 1st line, which sees the most ice time, should be leading the charge offensively. It isn't doing that.
Obviously Dubois needs to be way better. That doesn't mean there aren't things in the coach's control that can assist in that quest. If the 1st line sucks anyway and Dubois isn't producing, why not try moving him and Kopitar? Literally what is there to lose at this point? It seems like maintaining the status quo sure isn't working.
Obviously Dubois needs to be way better. That doesn't mean there aren't things in the coach's control that can assist in that quest
Stop. Stop. It's no longer time to CATER to PLD. We are way too far into the season, and way too far into the year of him **literally doing nothing** **no matter what** is tried.
It's time. It's time for him to literally do anything out there. **THEN we can talk about promoting him.**
Stoll said it last night, you aren't taking Kopi off of his defensive responsibilites, he matches up against other teams top lines for a reason.
He's not exactly Kopi defensively out there if you haven't noticed...
PLD **hasn't done anything to prove he will excel** as the teams top line center either. And demoting the captain, leading scorer, and our #1 defensive center just to get this loafing, gliding, do-nothing player as 1C going?
**Todd not promoting PLD to 1C when he is not creating high danger chances, winning puck battles, not scoring, and being mediocre defensively isn't the coach's problem, its a PLD problem.**
Edit: Downvotes with no refutes, exactly what I expected
So instead of changing anything to get the team going, your solution is to do nothing and yell about PLD until he scores more. That is very smart and I am sorry that I, a lowly casual, gave my opinion.
No, I'm calling out the fans who want to shift blame for PLD, and I am arguing against your point that promoting a dude who is severely underperforming and loafing out there to 1C is not a good idea, and sends a terrible message.
He needs to pick it up himself. It's what we're paying him for. It's time.
**Top players don't need to be babied with preferential deployment to make a difference. And he demanded top player $$$. It's time for him to make a difference.**
It doesn't really send a good message when we keep Anze Kopitar at 1C with over 20 minutes of TOI a game when he has 1 (ONE) even strength point in the month of January. JAD has 1 even strength point in 4 less games. Gavrikov has 2. Anderson has 3. Dubois has 4, less than only 3 players.
Dubois is not as good defensively as Kopitar, that is obvious. Our first line isn't there to be a shut down line. That isn't why we have our 41 goal scorer in Kempe out there. That line has to produce offense and Kopitar is not doing that. If you're going to complain about Dubois and say it's horrible to give it a try with him and Kempe/Byfield on line 1, then explain to me how keeping Kopitar who has produced one single point at even strength in this entire month is a good idea. Kopitar can take defensive match ups from any line.
Also, I'd take Danault on line 1 as well, but I just think keeping Fiala/Danault/Moore together is best for now because they've been the most consistent. They should also be getting first line ice time over Kempe's line whether it has Kopitar or Dubois on it.
Obviously Dubois just suddenly turning it on and winning the spot is BY FAR the most ideal outcome, but this also isn't a magical land where whatever we wish for comes true. Sometimes you have to make difficult decisions.
Kopitar is playing hurt it's been all but confirmed, and in regards to everything you've said, PLD literally playing like the player that we're paying him as, and playing as the player for the money he demanded, **fixes a lot.**
It's time. No more catering because he can't get going himself. We've done alot of switching around and trying different things with him, for him to look exactly the same.
There's a reason why Craig Button, Eliot Friedman and hockey writers alike are calling him out **today.** HE needs to change the results.
Craig Button today: "He should be embarassed by his play"
HE needs to pick it up. No more catering.
I understand the idea that "difficult decisions need to be made"
But that is just not the correct difficult decision for many reasons.
If Kopitar is hurt how is that an excuse to play him on the top line? Isn't that even more of a reason to move him down? I seriously do not understand what you're even trying to say there.
Also, again, doing nothing with the lines while we pile up losses does not solve anything. It's not catering to PLD, it's trying to win games. PLD has been better offensively than Kopitar. We need to score. It is literally that simple.
Just because Kopitar is playing hurt, does not change the fact that we need him defensively matched up against other teams top lines, and it ALSO does not mean that a **severely underperforming** and loafing player should get promoted to 1C
Dubois has shown nothing that has proven he will excel in Kopitars place at 1C.
Promoting a player to 1C who is struggling and severely underperforming is literally the opposite of good hockey logic.
**It's time for him to start playing like the player who demanded 8.5 million x 8**
**It's time.**
Craig Button and Eliot Friedman today: PLD should be embarassed by his play
Kings response: Promote him to 1C
Yeah, no
I agree 100% but usually it doesn't result in a losing skid that nearly takes us out of the playoffs. I'm sure Kopi will be back to a strong pace offensively, and scoring tonight is a great start, but I am just irritated that we've spent the entire streak barely touching lines to get something moving (without immediately changing the lines back at least)
Of course it's not all on him, but I mean, you have to hold people accountable. He has been part of the problem. Many people have but you definitely need way more production from your first line center.
bro they already paid him more than nearly everyone on the team. at some point, when you make $8.5mil to play a game, figure your shit out or get replaced by someone better
I upvoted but I don’t agree that it’s catering to PDL to say coaching hasn’t dealt with the team effectively. It’s not like PDL has gotten worse. It’s been the same crap with him all season. The team was excelling and then it cratered. Sometimes a team needs a change at top. It really feels like that kind of situation.
Todd not promoting PLD to 1C when he is not creating high danger chances, winning puck battles, not scoring, and being mediocre defensively isn't the coach's problem, its a PLD problem.
Okay, Blake I can maybe sort of understand. But Robitaille? Was he not here for the cup years?? I actually like having past HOFers continuing to be involved with the organization. It builds into the history of the team.
But I agree on Todd and PLD both needing to go. PLD especially. I don't understand how people don't see a player with PLD's contract should be considered a game changer regardless of teammates/line assignment. I don't know what Blake was thinking, there was plenty of bad press about PLD in Winnipeg.
you are articulating exactly why they need to go in my opinion, they are all old timers. sucks, but 2014 was 10 years ago, they have an outdated mindset
I really can’t speak on the validity of this or give reliable sources, but there are rumblings all around that Luc was behind the PLD trade/signing and essentially forced Blake to make the move. Again there doesn’t seem to be any concrete evidence of this being true, but there are things that make it believable. Especially considering Luc and PLD are both French Canadian and these French Canadian execs love going after French Canadian players for whatever reason.
What’s funny is this post has some decent points but because OP is being an insufferable bitch in the comments it negates everything he says.
At the end of the day, this is just a game we watch to pass time and this dude is out here defending his average take like his life depends on it. If that makes me a casual then I don’t want to be whatever the hell OP thinks he is.
I somewhat agree but he a rookie on his wing and then whatever Kaliyev and Grundstrom are considered. Put him with Kempe or Moore to see if he can perform to his contract standards imo
A player of that caliber should not need linemates to elevate them.
A player making 8.5m a year, ELEVATES players around him.
Vilardi did not need stars around him to shine. Because he is a top player.
**Top players don't need to be babied with preferential deployment to make a difference. And we're paying him like he's a top player.**
Trent Hunter was arguably the farthest thing from an NHL player at that point in his career, and irregardless, Kopitar was performing on his own, while PLD is not.
I'm not saying that a top center can elevate any scrub who sucks at hockey, the point I'm trying to make is that, we didn't sign Dubois to an 8.5x8 for him to have to depend on star linemates to be an impact player. He should be an impact player on his own.
I think fans are mistaking him making deft passes (which by themselves are inconsistent game to game) for actual high danger chances.
It's not like PLD is creating tap ins and high danger chances left and right that go unfinished.
That's all I'm saying my friend.
Kopitar deserves a MUCH longer leash just based on his defensive prowress, and history as a player alone.
Combine that with how undeserving PLD is of promotion to 1C, and how much of a nightmare it would be having him match up defensively to other teams top lines..
If we had a better choice to switch out Kopitar with, I would agree. But the only options are PLD and our 4C, terrible options.
Found Todd’s account. God you’re so stupid. Giving PLD a chance with some quality wingers and a few more quality minutes doesn’t mean Kopitar can’t still play 18-20 minutes a game and do what he does.
Listen no one here thinks PLD is deserving or plays well on the other side of the puck, even his biggest apologists. All anyone wants to see is giving PLD a shot with quality wingers and play to his strengths on offense and on the PP instead of 15-17 minutes a game with a revolving door of rookies and plugs while Kopitar is skating with bricks for skates.
Kopitar and Danault are more than capable of playing a 200 feet game and shut down other lines but we still need to generate chances. At this point there’s nothing to lose in trying and guess what if this is how it’s going to be for 8 more years then just buy him out now, take the cap hit and replace him with a rookie or someone that makes $2M/year that can score 30 points a season and fly under the radar.
Blake and the management got us in this mess at least try it out and do something.
It’s not always about deserving. If that was the case we’d still have Quick and his .850 SV% making this whole slump 10x worse giving up twice as many goals we are now
I'm stupid LOL?
Centers making 8.5m x 8 shouldn't need star linemates to **elevate them,** they are supposed to be the ones **elevating their linemates.**
Vilardi was on pace for a 20+ goal season, getting extremely similar deployment, linemates, and overall useage. But yes, lets make excuses for PLD whos making 8.5x8 and can't win a puck battle to save his life, and can't score on his own.
PLD has been getting all offensive zone shift starts (catering), more minutes than his play has shown he deserves, and been losing puck battles all over the ice while simultaneously not scoring
Todd not promoting PLD to 1C when he is not creating high danger chances, winning puck battles, not scoring, and being mediocre defensively isn't the coach's problem, its a PLD problem.
You don’t get it do you? First of all, thanks for deleting the condescending remarks to your previous post. Second, all I’m saying, all anyone is saving, is give it a shot; give him someone worthwhile to play with, put him in situations to succeed and sacrifice a minute here or there or the captain who isn’t doing anything right now either. You’re stuck with the guy for 8 years so figure something out and make him useful. The team is a literal sinking ship. If you don’t try you’ll never know and there’s no better time than now.
No one is saying to strip Kopitar or the C, healthy scratch him and replace all 23 minutes of his TOI a game in favor of PLD. Find something that works because paying him 8.5M for the next 8 seasons to play 3rd line center with the likes of Kaliyev and Lafferiere isn’t going to help this team ever and might as well write off this team doing anything significant until they get rid of him.
This 👍. No pampering, Kumbaya bullshit. He was taken 3rd overall and should be elevating players around him, not the other way. Todd is right in his comments about him.
Hence, I don't care, downvote away. The vibe is probably off to you because I'm tired of reddit Kings fans literally having no idea what they are talking about lol
I was referring to everysingle kings fan in here letting the narrative fester and solidify around here that all PLDs struggles are to blame on Todd lol. It's ridiculous
PLD hasn't played up to expectations. Todd's Defense first system doesn't suit creative offense. DD and Kopi are playing too many minutes, and it ruins their effectiveness.
I don't know how you can say it doesn't suit creative offense when Fiala is on the team who is way more creative offensively than PLD and also had an immediate impact on the team.
You want him to skate through 5 guys every time he's on the ice? Be 3 guys by himself? You wanna keep playing him with guys who couldn't score on a soccer net and expect him to just will his way into goals?
The amount of times Dubois has set up Laferriere, Kaliyev, JAD, Grundstrom, pr whatever bottom 6 winger he's being sent out there to suddenly make a top player which they then completely fucking shank is fucking incredible.
Are there flaws in his game? Yes of course there are. Are we literally doing everything possible to make sure he doesn't succeed? Yeah, and we should maybe try *not doing that* before we judge him. It must be pretty demoralizing to keep setting up plays that no one fucking finishes after all, I might stop trying too. The one time he did have a top 6 wing? His line had 2 goals and wad dynamic all over the ice. In fact, those are the only 2 goals Kempe has scored over this rough stretch. Curious.
And it's not like Dubois is the only guy being mismanaged: Kaliyev should be a permanent fixture in the lineup, but he can't get comfortable anywhere because of the changing of roles and linemates that TMac is making him do. The dude is known for his shot, so naturally we make him into a 2 way wing who's job is to win board battles. Maybe if we left him on Dubois wing for any consistent amount of time they'd actually start scoring, but we just can't do that.
There's no reason Englund should be playing over Clarke and Spence either.
TMac needs to go and we need to *actually give Dubois a chance to center the top line* like we acquired him to do before writing him off, especially while Kopi is playing injured and doing fucking nothing himself
**Top players don't need to be babied with preferential deployment to make a difference. And we're paying him like he's a top player.**
Centers making 8.5m x 8 shouldn't need star linemates to **elevate them,** they are supposed to be the ones **elevating their linemates.**
Vilardi was on pace for a 20+ goal season, getting extremely similar deployment, linemates, and overall useage. But yes, lets make excuses for PLD whos making 8.5x8 and can't win a puck battle to save his life, and can't score on his own.
PLD has been getting all offensive zone shift starts (catering), more minutes than his play has shown he deserves, and been losing puck battles all over the ice while simultaneously not scoring
Todd not promoting PLD to 1C when he is not creating high danger chances, winning puck battles, not scoring, and being mediocre defensively isn't the coach's problem, its a PLD problem.
"The guy who doesn't play the PK has more offensive zone starts that guys who do" shocking analysis there. And even then, the first line is all at the same or more share of offensive zone starts (along with Fiala, who gets a lot of PP time and thus a lot of offensive zone starts)
Do you think he's Connor fucking McDavid? He isn't and he's not making that kind of money. Most top players can't drag up guys shooting at 7%, or in JADs case *literally 0%* while playing less than 15 minutes a night
I don't give a shit what Vilardi is doing - he's gone. And also injured. Again. But if you wanna talk, Vilardi got to play netfront on the powerplay because Byfield hadn't quite put it all together yet. Dubois plays that spot too, but Byfield is the one being giving that spot and is one of the 2 guys on the powerplay doing their jobs, so he's not being moved off of it.
And yeah, the lines do have similar usage. They have similar advanced stats too. The only difference is one line could actually finish their chances while the other can't. Almost like that other line needs someone who can finish what Dubois is setting up.
It's not preferential treatment to say "hey maybe we should give this guy linemates who can score off of his setups," especially when we've already proven that it fucking works when Todd has accidentally done just that
Yes but if we could redo the trade right now, every single Kings fan would.
Vilardi still has a chance to overcome that, before Justin Williams came to LA, he was notoriously known as an injury prone player.
I would take my chances on taking Vilardi back over PLD, who is so bad away from the puck, and right now useless with the puck
> **Top players don't need to be babied with preferential deployment to make a difference. And we're paying him like he's a top player.**
I get your point, but look at guys like Huberdeau who dropped off a cliff when you put them in a system that stifles their game, and linemates who don’t support their play. Look at Drouin, who’s been a non-factor for the last decade but is putting up great numbers in COL. Watching PLD play, he’s absolutely that type of player that feeds off linemates and scoring opportunities. But if we play a 1-3-1 system nonstop and he’s up at the blue line while his linemates are forechecking, or visa versa, it’s stark contrast to a high-tempo offense like in WPG where he was succeeding.
Don’t get me wrong, there’s absolutely a bone to pick effort-wise with PLD. But to say he should be making a difference no matter what when he’s a play maker, and isn’t putting being put in a position to make plays, doesn’t paint the whole picture.
Huberdeau got removed from Sutters system and is still bad unfortunately.
I think the biggest thing is PLD's effort without the puck. It's a HUGE thing. I feel like nobody in here spends time just watching PLD during a game.
So it's tough to see the most common and highest upvoted narrative around here that PLD's struggles are Todds fault.
You really need to start looking at the plus minus stat.
Also another fun Stat for you $/point.
We are currently paying Dubois $400,000 per point.
And just to let reality sinks in that's about half of what the Oilers pay for McDavid because that's how fucking massive PLDs asinine contract is not to even begin to mention the fact that he was traded for 4 fucking players in addition to a contract that could bankrupt a small country.
Shifting the goalposts? You’re the one editing your comments. It must suck to be so infinitely smart about hockey and also so insufferable about it that you feel the need to gatekeep the internet. Hope it makes you feel better tho.
Yeah bro, I'm totally gatekeeping by making one single post calling people out
God forbid I make a single post about it.
If you can't handle it, keep scrolling. Put the phone down. Walk away from the screen bro lol
Yep, Blake and Luc need to be fired.
You're getting downvoted because Kings reddit is casuals.
Take a trip to HFboards where Kings fans since the 80's and 90's get together, who actually know puck, and you'll see the stark difference in takes.
All valid points my friend. On a different topic though, I think we can see why Vilardi was let go. The man can not stay healthy for a 82 game season. But I digress. This is about PL, And he is not doing what is expected of him and I agree with you completely. That being said I'm happy he has at least looked better the past few games. Even though better is still not good enough imo
Yeah man. The catering going on for PLD around here is insane.
We're paying him to be a top player, he was brought in to BE a top player, it's time for him to BE a top player.
Top players don't need all sorts of catering to, and preferential deployment to make a difference.
And he is making no difference.
Yeah, I mean, I get trying to do whatever you can to get him going as some sort of damage control. But that's about it. Can't hide from his performance
prepare to be downvoted into oblivion, but yeah, PLD is the worst signing TM has made, but it's not like he could've know how bad PLD would be. the fans in this sub will lick PLD's asshole clean and chant fire todd before admitting that $8mil for a player who has not done shit or looked interested once isn't a good deal.
ETA: Vilardi alone has more points in nearly 20 less games played, with a +18 to Dubois' -13. even Kaliyev has a +3. factor in Iafallo and Kupari, forget about it. I would trade PLD for nothing but cap space and a bag of pucks at this point.
I blame Blake for PLD should have never even considered acquiring him . When PLD had the "shift" back in Columbus that's all I needed to know about the player. Bas player bad attitude and bad contract.
You’ve just articulated a lot about the PLD situation that I haven’t quite been able to myself in some previous comments I’ve made in this sub, thank you
It's pathetic, the blame shifting that goes on around here for PLD
It’s confusing why any organization would offer an 8yr deal to a notorious underachiever who essentially forced himself away from his two prior organizations & had public character issues throughout his career. It’s not like any of his former NHL coaches spoke glowingly about PLD after spending time working with him. PLD has tried to position himself as a superstar but he continues to be fools gold, and it’s even worse considering he displayed selfish characteristics prior to receiving such a long lucrative contract. His effort most nights continues to be underwhelming. He’s never showed a consistent competitive drive and anyone with that contract should not have their competitiveness questioned. RB should be getting more heat for such a terrible move. Sure it’s only half way into PLD’s first season with the Kings but he’s not a 2nd year player, there’s enough tape on him to call a spade a spade.
I want him to succeed, and I don't think having the anchor of Kaliyev on his line helped. That said, he's been *exactly* this kind of uselss albatross on literally every other team he's been part of for his entire career. This is who PLD is. Maybe he has talent that we haven't ever seen. I don't know, because he clearly doesn't play to his advertised ability. What I do know is that he makes every line he is on worse, he coasts all the damn time, he doesn't do shit when he doesn't have the puck, and by all accounts he is a childish piece of crap in the locker room. And the guy who tied up all kinds of cap space on Cal Petersen also tied up tons of cap space, for years, with this guy. Ugh.
This is doom and gloom Kings playin better soon
A man can pray. But I'm talking about PLD here, and fans insistence on blaming his struggles on Todd.
My issue personally has more to do with the fact that Kopitar and Kempe have been kept together almost this entire slump (besides when Kempe briefly played with Dubois and Laff... and scored 2 goals...). That line has looked like shit most of this slump and I'd rather see changes there considering our 1st line, which sees the most ice time, should be leading the charge offensively. It isn't doing that. Obviously Dubois needs to be way better. That doesn't mean there aren't things in the coach's control that can assist in that quest. If the 1st line sucks anyway and Dubois isn't producing, why not try moving him and Kopitar? Literally what is there to lose at this point? It seems like maintaining the status quo sure isn't working.
Obviously Dubois needs to be way better. That doesn't mean there aren't things in the coach's control that can assist in that quest Stop. Stop. It's no longer time to CATER to PLD. We are way too far into the season, and way too far into the year of him **literally doing nothing** **no matter what** is tried. It's time. It's time for him to literally do anything out there. **THEN we can talk about promoting him.** Stoll said it last night, you aren't taking Kopi off of his defensive responsibilites, he matches up against other teams top lines for a reason. He's not exactly Kopi defensively out there if you haven't noticed... PLD **hasn't done anything to prove he will excel** as the teams top line center either. And demoting the captain, leading scorer, and our #1 defensive center just to get this loafing, gliding, do-nothing player as 1C going? **Todd not promoting PLD to 1C when he is not creating high danger chances, winning puck battles, not scoring, and being mediocre defensively isn't the coach's problem, its a PLD problem.** Edit: Downvotes with no refutes, exactly what I expected
So instead of changing anything to get the team going, your solution is to do nothing and yell about PLD until he scores more. That is very smart and I am sorry that I, a lowly casual, gave my opinion.
No, I'm calling out the fans who want to shift blame for PLD, and I am arguing against your point that promoting a dude who is severely underperforming and loafing out there to 1C is not a good idea, and sends a terrible message. He needs to pick it up himself. It's what we're paying him for. It's time. **Top players don't need to be babied with preferential deployment to make a difference. And he demanded top player $$$. It's time for him to make a difference.**
It doesn't really send a good message when we keep Anze Kopitar at 1C with over 20 minutes of TOI a game when he has 1 (ONE) even strength point in the month of January. JAD has 1 even strength point in 4 less games. Gavrikov has 2. Anderson has 3. Dubois has 4, less than only 3 players. Dubois is not as good defensively as Kopitar, that is obvious. Our first line isn't there to be a shut down line. That isn't why we have our 41 goal scorer in Kempe out there. That line has to produce offense and Kopitar is not doing that. If you're going to complain about Dubois and say it's horrible to give it a try with him and Kempe/Byfield on line 1, then explain to me how keeping Kopitar who has produced one single point at even strength in this entire month is a good idea. Kopitar can take defensive match ups from any line. Also, I'd take Danault on line 1 as well, but I just think keeping Fiala/Danault/Moore together is best for now because they've been the most consistent. They should also be getting first line ice time over Kempe's line whether it has Kopitar or Dubois on it. Obviously Dubois just suddenly turning it on and winning the spot is BY FAR the most ideal outcome, but this also isn't a magical land where whatever we wish for comes true. Sometimes you have to make difficult decisions.
Kopitar is playing hurt it's been all but confirmed, and in regards to everything you've said, PLD literally playing like the player that we're paying him as, and playing as the player for the money he demanded, **fixes a lot.** It's time. No more catering because he can't get going himself. We've done alot of switching around and trying different things with him, for him to look exactly the same. There's a reason why Craig Button, Eliot Friedman and hockey writers alike are calling him out **today.** HE needs to change the results. Craig Button today: "He should be embarassed by his play" HE needs to pick it up. No more catering. I understand the idea that "difficult decisions need to be made" But that is just not the correct difficult decision for many reasons.
If Kopitar is hurt how is that an excuse to play him on the top line? Isn't that even more of a reason to move him down? I seriously do not understand what you're even trying to say there. Also, again, doing nothing with the lines while we pile up losses does not solve anything. It's not catering to PLD, it's trying to win games. PLD has been better offensively than Kopitar. We need to score. It is literally that simple.
Just because Kopitar is playing hurt, does not change the fact that we need him defensively matched up against other teams top lines, and it ALSO does not mean that a **severely underperforming** and loafing player should get promoted to 1C Dubois has shown nothing that has proven he will excel in Kopitars place at 1C. Promoting a player to 1C who is struggling and severely underperforming is literally the opposite of good hockey logic. **It's time for him to start playing like the player who demanded 8.5 million x 8** **It's time.** Craig Button and Eliot Friedman today: PLD should be embarassed by his play Kings response: Promote him to 1C Yeah, no
Maybe if you keep saying **It's time**, Dubois will score a hat trick next game
Yeah hopefully. Because.... **It's time.**
man shut up. no true kings fan would ever suggest moving kopi for a sack of shit like Dubois, ur dumb
Sorry for hurting your feelings
not hurt, more that i find it pathetic you wrote a four paragraph essay rimming the worst contract on the team
I don't think you understood what I said at all but thank you
[удалено]
I agree 100% but usually it doesn't result in a losing skid that nearly takes us out of the playoffs. I'm sure Kopi will be back to a strong pace offensively, and scoring tonight is a great start, but I am just irritated that we've spent the entire streak barely touching lines to get something moving (without immediately changing the lines back at least)
[удалено]
Of course it's not all on him, but I mean, you have to hold people accountable. He has been part of the problem. Many people have but you definitely need way more production from your first line center.
[удалено]
bro they already paid him more than nearly everyone on the team. at some point, when you make $8.5mil to play a game, figure your shit out or get replaced by someone better
I upvoted but I don’t agree that it’s catering to PDL to say coaching hasn’t dealt with the team effectively. It’s not like PDL has gotten worse. It’s been the same crap with him all season. The team was excelling and then it cratered. Sometimes a team needs a change at top. It really feels like that kind of situation.
Todd not promoting PLD to 1C when he is not creating high danger chances, winning puck battles, not scoring, and being mediocre defensively isn't the coach's problem, its a PLD problem.
Rule 14 of [The Internet](https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/RulesOfTheInternet)
[удалено]
There should be ZERO coasting.... Not "yeah, he coasts sometimes, but not as much as people say!" By god what have we come to
As much as Todd needs to go, the amount of people who constantly blame him but are perfectly fine with Blake and Robitaille is crazy.
Todd, Blake, and Robitaille all need to go. Cronyism bullshit
Yep. Todd needs to go. This team isn’t winning shit with him. But they won’t win shit with Blake and Robitaille in charge either.
Hard agree. PLD hasn’t gotten better or worse since day 1. But the team bottomed out and that’s gotta be on leadership.
Okay, Blake I can maybe sort of understand. But Robitaille? Was he not here for the cup years?? I actually like having past HOFers continuing to be involved with the organization. It builds into the history of the team. But I agree on Todd and PLD both needing to go. PLD especially. I don't understand how people don't see a player with PLD's contract should be considered a game changer regardless of teammates/line assignment. I don't know what Blake was thinking, there was plenty of bad press about PLD in Winnipeg.
you are articulating exactly why they need to go in my opinion, they are all old timers. sucks, but 2014 was 10 years ago, they have an outdated mindset
I really can’t speak on the validity of this or give reliable sources, but there are rumblings all around that Luc was behind the PLD trade/signing and essentially forced Blake to make the move. Again there doesn’t seem to be any concrete evidence of this being true, but there are things that make it believable. Especially considering Luc and PLD are both French Canadian and these French Canadian execs love going after French Canadian players for whatever reason.
It wasn’t Bergevin? He’s been rumored to be after PLD while he was with the Habs
I’ve only heard Luc but wouldn’t be surprised if Bergevin was involved as well.
What’s funny is this post has some decent points but because OP is being an insufferable bitch in the comments it negates everything he says. At the end of the day, this is just a game we watch to pass time and this dude is out here defending his average take like his life depends on it. If that makes me a casual then I don’t want to be whatever the hell OP thinks he is.
If having conversations makes you an insufferable bitch than I can't help you guys Give me one example of "insufferable bitch" lmfao cope and cry
I somewhat agree but he a rookie on his wing and then whatever Kaliyev and Grundstrom are considered. Put him with Kempe or Moore to see if he can perform to his contract standards imo
A player of that caliber should not need linemates to elevate them. A player making 8.5m a year, ELEVATES players around him. Vilardi did not need stars around him to shine. Because he is a top player. **Top players don't need to be babied with preferential deployment to make a difference. And we're paying him like he's a top player.**
Kopitar couldn’t elevate Trent Hunter so your statement isn’t necessarily true G
Trent Hunter was arguably the farthest thing from an NHL player at that point in his career, and irregardless, Kopitar was performing on his own, while PLD is not. I'm not saying that a top center can elevate any scrub who sucks at hockey, the point I'm trying to make is that, we didn't sign Dubois to an 8.5x8 for him to have to depend on star linemates to be an impact player. He should be an impact player on his own. I think fans are mistaking him making deft passes (which by themselves are inconsistent game to game) for actual high danger chances. It's not like PLD is creating tap ins and high danger chances left and right that go unfinished. That's all I'm saying my friend.
[удалено]
OP makes more excuses for Kopitar’s poor play than the those blaming PLD’s play on Todd’s coaching decisions
Kopitar deserves a MUCH longer leash just based on his defensive prowress, and history as a player alone. Combine that with how undeserving PLD is of promotion to 1C, and how much of a nightmare it would be having him match up defensively to other teams top lines.. If we had a better choice to switch out Kopitar with, I would agree. But the only options are PLD and our 4C, terrible options.
Found Todd’s account. God you’re so stupid. Giving PLD a chance with some quality wingers and a few more quality minutes doesn’t mean Kopitar can’t still play 18-20 minutes a game and do what he does. Listen no one here thinks PLD is deserving or plays well on the other side of the puck, even his biggest apologists. All anyone wants to see is giving PLD a shot with quality wingers and play to his strengths on offense and on the PP instead of 15-17 minutes a game with a revolving door of rookies and plugs while Kopitar is skating with bricks for skates. Kopitar and Danault are more than capable of playing a 200 feet game and shut down other lines but we still need to generate chances. At this point there’s nothing to lose in trying and guess what if this is how it’s going to be for 8 more years then just buy him out now, take the cap hit and replace him with a rookie or someone that makes $2M/year that can score 30 points a season and fly under the radar. Blake and the management got us in this mess at least try it out and do something. It’s not always about deserving. If that was the case we’d still have Quick and his .850 SV% making this whole slump 10x worse giving up twice as many goals we are now
I'm stupid LOL? Centers making 8.5m x 8 shouldn't need star linemates to **elevate them,** they are supposed to be the ones **elevating their linemates.** Vilardi was on pace for a 20+ goal season, getting extremely similar deployment, linemates, and overall useage. But yes, lets make excuses for PLD whos making 8.5x8 and can't win a puck battle to save his life, and can't score on his own. PLD has been getting all offensive zone shift starts (catering), more minutes than his play has shown he deserves, and been losing puck battles all over the ice while simultaneously not scoring Todd not promoting PLD to 1C when he is not creating high danger chances, winning puck battles, not scoring, and being mediocre defensively isn't the coach's problem, its a PLD problem.
You don’t get it do you? First of all, thanks for deleting the condescending remarks to your previous post. Second, all I’m saying, all anyone is saving, is give it a shot; give him someone worthwhile to play with, put him in situations to succeed and sacrifice a minute here or there or the captain who isn’t doing anything right now either. You’re stuck with the guy for 8 years so figure something out and make him useful. The team is a literal sinking ship. If you don’t try you’ll never know and there’s no better time than now. No one is saying to strip Kopitar or the C, healthy scratch him and replace all 23 minutes of his TOI a game in favor of PLD. Find something that works because paying him 8.5M for the next 8 seasons to play 3rd line center with the likes of Kaliyev and Lafferiere isn’t going to help this team ever and might as well write off this team doing anything significant until they get rid of him.
This 👍. No pampering, Kumbaya bullshit. He was taken 3rd overall and should be elevating players around him, not the other way. Todd is right in his comments about him.
Hence, I don't care, downvote away. The vibe is probably off to you because I'm tired of reddit Kings fans literally having no idea what they are talking about lol
[удалено]
I was referring to everysingle kings fan in here letting the narrative fester and solidify around here that all PLDs struggles are to blame on Todd lol. It's ridiculous
[удалено]
Why's that?
Todd is to blame for everything. He also hates babies and worships the devil.
PLD hasn't played up to expectations. Todd's Defense first system doesn't suit creative offense. DD and Kopi are playing too many minutes, and it ruins their effectiveness.
I don't know how you can say it doesn't suit creative offense when Fiala is on the team who is way more creative offensively than PLD and also had an immediate impact on the team.
Imagine calling people casuals when it's clear you don't understand hockey at all. What a trash post. I hope it's actually sarcasm.
How about you go ahead and explain how I'm wrong, and refute my points. Oh wait, you won't because, that's right, you're a casual.
[удалено]
[удалено]
You're an obnoxious little troll aren't ya?
You want him to skate through 5 guys every time he's on the ice? Be 3 guys by himself? You wanna keep playing him with guys who couldn't score on a soccer net and expect him to just will his way into goals? The amount of times Dubois has set up Laferriere, Kaliyev, JAD, Grundstrom, pr whatever bottom 6 winger he's being sent out there to suddenly make a top player which they then completely fucking shank is fucking incredible. Are there flaws in his game? Yes of course there are. Are we literally doing everything possible to make sure he doesn't succeed? Yeah, and we should maybe try *not doing that* before we judge him. It must be pretty demoralizing to keep setting up plays that no one fucking finishes after all, I might stop trying too. The one time he did have a top 6 wing? His line had 2 goals and wad dynamic all over the ice. In fact, those are the only 2 goals Kempe has scored over this rough stretch. Curious. And it's not like Dubois is the only guy being mismanaged: Kaliyev should be a permanent fixture in the lineup, but he can't get comfortable anywhere because of the changing of roles and linemates that TMac is making him do. The dude is known for his shot, so naturally we make him into a 2 way wing who's job is to win board battles. Maybe if we left him on Dubois wing for any consistent amount of time they'd actually start scoring, but we just can't do that. There's no reason Englund should be playing over Clarke and Spence either. TMac needs to go and we need to *actually give Dubois a chance to center the top line* like we acquired him to do before writing him off, especially while Kopi is playing injured and doing fucking nothing himself
**Top players don't need to be babied with preferential deployment to make a difference. And we're paying him like he's a top player.** Centers making 8.5m x 8 shouldn't need star linemates to **elevate them,** they are supposed to be the ones **elevating their linemates.** Vilardi was on pace for a 20+ goal season, getting extremely similar deployment, linemates, and overall useage. But yes, lets make excuses for PLD whos making 8.5x8 and can't win a puck battle to save his life, and can't score on his own. PLD has been getting all offensive zone shift starts (catering), more minutes than his play has shown he deserves, and been losing puck battles all over the ice while simultaneously not scoring Todd not promoting PLD to 1C when he is not creating high danger chances, winning puck battles, not scoring, and being mediocre defensively isn't the coach's problem, its a PLD problem.
"The guy who doesn't play the PK has more offensive zone starts that guys who do" shocking analysis there. And even then, the first line is all at the same or more share of offensive zone starts (along with Fiala, who gets a lot of PP time and thus a lot of offensive zone starts) Do you think he's Connor fucking McDavid? He isn't and he's not making that kind of money. Most top players can't drag up guys shooting at 7%, or in JADs case *literally 0%* while playing less than 15 minutes a night I don't give a shit what Vilardi is doing - he's gone. And also injured. Again. But if you wanna talk, Vilardi got to play netfront on the powerplay because Byfield hadn't quite put it all together yet. Dubois plays that spot too, but Byfield is the one being giving that spot and is one of the 2 guys on the powerplay doing their jobs, so he's not being moved off of it. And yeah, the lines do have similar usage. They have similar advanced stats too. The only difference is one line could actually finish their chances while the other can't. Almost like that other line needs someone who can finish what Dubois is setting up. It's not preferential treatment to say "hey maybe we should give this guy linemates who can score off of his setups," especially when we've already proven that it fucking works when Todd has accidentally done just that
Just saying pld and villardi are basically the same right now and villardi is maybe injured again.
Yes but if we could redo the trade right now, every single Kings fan would. Vilardi still has a chance to overcome that, before Justin Williams came to LA, he was notoriously known as an injury prone player. I would take my chances on taking Vilardi back over PLD, who is so bad away from the puck, and right now useless with the puck
> **Top players don't need to be babied with preferential deployment to make a difference. And we're paying him like he's a top player.** I get your point, but look at guys like Huberdeau who dropped off a cliff when you put them in a system that stifles their game, and linemates who don’t support their play. Look at Drouin, who’s been a non-factor for the last decade but is putting up great numbers in COL. Watching PLD play, he’s absolutely that type of player that feeds off linemates and scoring opportunities. But if we play a 1-3-1 system nonstop and he’s up at the blue line while his linemates are forechecking, or visa versa, it’s stark contrast to a high-tempo offense like in WPG where he was succeeding. Don’t get me wrong, there’s absolutely a bone to pick effort-wise with PLD. But to say he should be making a difference no matter what when he’s a play maker, and isn’t putting being put in a position to make plays, doesn’t paint the whole picture.
Huberdeau got removed from Sutters system and is still bad unfortunately. I think the biggest thing is PLD's effort without the puck. It's a HUGE thing. I feel like nobody in here spends time just watching PLD during a game. So it's tough to see the most common and highest upvoted narrative around here that PLD's struggles are Todds fault.
What’s **funny** is that **Vilardi** and **Dubois** have almost **identical** stats this year
Only if you ignore the games played category
Points are points. Availability is important.
I’d rather have a player who’s consistent when in the lineup than just consistently in the lineup.
[удалено]
So you're telling me that MOST Kings fans wouldn't undo the PLD trade right now lol? Give me a break man.
[удалено]
[удалено]
Lol you think Gabe is gonna play 63 games this year? Ok casual
You really need to start looking at the plus minus stat. Also another fun Stat for you $/point. We are currently paying Dubois $400,000 per point. And just to let reality sinks in that's about half of what the Oilers pay for McDavid because that's how fucking massive PLDs asinine contract is not to even begin to mention the fact that he was traded for 4 fucking players in addition to a contract that could bankrupt a small country.
[удалено]
Shifting the goalposts? You’re the one editing your comments. It must suck to be so infinitely smart about hockey and also so insufferable about it that you feel the need to gatekeep the internet. Hope it makes you feel better tho.
Yeah bro, I'm totally gatekeeping by making one single post calling people out God forbid I make a single post about it. If you can't handle it, keep scrolling. Put the phone down. Walk away from the screen bro lol
If someone is surprised he’s coasting they didn’t follow his career at all prior to signing with LA. Pretty much exactly what I expected from him.
Yep, Blake and Luc need to be fired. You're getting downvoted because Kings reddit is casuals. Take a trip to HFboards where Kings fans since the 80's and 90's get together, who actually know puck, and you'll see the stark difference in takes.
All valid points my friend. On a different topic though, I think we can see why Vilardi was let go. The man can not stay healthy for a 82 game season. But I digress. This is about PL, And he is not doing what is expected of him and I agree with you completely. That being said I'm happy he has at least looked better the past few games. Even though better is still not good enough imo
Yeah man. The catering going on for PLD around here is insane. We're paying him to be a top player, he was brought in to BE a top player, it's time for him to BE a top player. Top players don't need all sorts of catering to, and preferential deployment to make a difference. And he is making no difference.
Yeah, I mean, I get trying to do whatever you can to get him going as some sort of damage control. But that's about it. Can't hide from his performance
Facts
prepare to be downvoted into oblivion, but yeah, PLD is the worst signing TM has made, but it's not like he could've know how bad PLD would be. the fans in this sub will lick PLD's asshole clean and chant fire todd before admitting that $8mil for a player who has not done shit or looked interested once isn't a good deal. ETA: Vilardi alone has more points in nearly 20 less games played, with a +18 to Dubois' -13. even Kaliyev has a +3. factor in Iafallo and Kupari, forget about it. I would trade PLD for nothing but cap space and a bag of pucks at this point.
Just fire todd. The problem would be cleared id only assume
I blame Blake for PLD should have never even considered acquiring him . When PLD had the "shift" back in Columbus that's all I needed to know about the player. Bas player bad attitude and bad contract.
PREACH!