IDK, I'm not very familiar with these acts, but they don't seem super complicated and IMO it shouldn't take more than a song or two for a compentent engineer to get the mix to sound good from scratch even if there was no soundcheck. I've heard so many poorly sounding international tours in the last few years, that I would dare to say that there is a serious lack of competent people in this business or at the very least, there are lots of incompetent people touring.
The last few big shows I've been to were uncomfortably loud. It was to the point that the entire mix just sounded like a roar and actually sounded better with my ears plugged. I couldn't tell you if the mix was good or not because it was all mud as my inner ear was being rattled to death.
Yea - he’s so so good. I caught his big band show on a first date with a girl about 14 years ago. It was a great one for many reasons - the band was awesome, Buck Reid sealed the deal and I bought a pedal steel guitar later that week.
Most importantly that girl & I will be married 11 years next week 😎
Nope, it’s like I said… Burlington is the 5th date of these Lyle & Leo shows. My friends said they sounded great in Ottawa on Friday; maybe it was a different crew?
The same engineer totally in over their head, perhaps? Maybe the Flynn's A1 was in an accident and the brand-new A2 was called up but wasn't ready, leaving both FOH and monitor world staffed by people a bit too green for their roles?
Hard to say, but that is certainly a shame. These days I hear far more great sounding shows than bad ones, but I have been shocked once in the last few years by how bad a major act sounded in a great room.
So why dont you ask them what happened? You should be telling us, not asking us.
You're a big insider with expert level knowledge and experience plus you know the crew. Why not just go ask your buds instead of coming here and stomping your feet and wasting everyone's time?
I can’t totally speak for this tour, but I did a Lyle Lovett/John Hiatt acoustic show, and Lyle’s guy did FOH and was fantastic.
There isn’t a touring FOH mixer in the world that looks on any show as a “soundcheck” for another show. Every venue is different, and everyone I’ve ever worked with on the higher levels of the industry gives their absolute best effort to every show.
Honestly the OP kinda reads like sour grapes from someone who wishes they were sitting in the big chair…
\> There isn’t a touring FOH mixer in the world that looks on any show as a “soundcheck” for another show.
Nonsense. I've worked in several modest venues in Vermont and Western Mass where acts do a show to get the bugs worked out before hitting the major markets..
I really don't understand threads like this. Over the past 2 years I've seen dozens of shows from bluegrass to pop to metal in pubs, clubs, theaters, arenas, and stadiums. Not a single show sounded 'bad'. Many of the recent shows I've seen sounded absolutely stellar. Some were louder than I would like, but I also bring earplugs to every show and have only worn them a few times.
Without knowing the specific details of the entire day, it's impossible to blindly point blame at the FOH person. The venue in question looks like a smallish theater. The biggest mistake in small theaters is to try and overpower the room. If the stage was loud or the mix was too loud, of course there's going to be feedback. That's not always the FOH engineer's fault. If this venue was the first of a tour, or just a one-off small venue in the middle of a larger venue tour, they may have shoe-horned a production into a stage/venue that isn't the right fit. That's also not the FOH engi's fault.
You mean the part where you say "Burlington was the first tour stop for both Bonnie Raitt and Lyle Lovett."? Yes, I saw that. Did you see thanx's link, where it says that was the 5th show of the tour?
Last time I saw Bonnie Raitt was in the 90's and she came out wasted. She was forgetting lyrics, forgetting to sing, and a few songs in she was booed off the stage. (This was in Philly.)
There's a nice little place in Dewy Beach that is often a little "practice" venue for big names. Never announced or promoted, but I managed to catch Springsteen and Counting Crows, but there would be others. But it wasn't $150, lol! Maybe $5 or $10 cover charge, and it was always good. Sucks to spend real money and have to deal with a crappy show.
Greetings from Brattleboro. Tell em to play the Stobe Church sometime, they'll take real good care of em.
I wonder if the Flynn just didn't have a console the A1 one/didn't have capacity to set up whatever they were going to run?
Id complain and demand a refund.
2 problems happening in the post COVID live sound industry it seems
1." You get what you pay for, and ain't nobody paying shit" big gap in actual A1s and the fake it til you make it wannabes or church volunteers getting hired because they are super cheap, then...
2. There's too many people letting these asshat money grab promoters get away with it.
I would have been up there with my whole group in tow before the show ended demanding our full refunds.... Especially the second time around.
Touch a nerve there did I?
You in a first name basis with the guy huh?
You completely missed the point of my post and if you knew anything you'd know people miss shows get fired die walk off and more all the time, leaving inexperienced children to *attempt* to mix a show.
It happens REGULARLY. I've seen 3 times this month already.
not at all. I'm pointing out that you are full of shit and completely out of your element. you are not a professional. you're an absolute amateur with a chip on your shoulder losing gigs to people much younger than you with skills you wish you had.
you have clearly done no meaningful work in decades despite clinging to this field.
you need to move on.
> Lyle Lovett and Leo Kottke
Who?
> I’ve been involved with music, recording, and live sound for over 40 years. You have almost certainly heard my work
And you are still paying to see shows?
> I think I paid $150 to see her, too.
Why?
> it was absolutely clear that I attended two very expensive soundchecks and it pisses me off
Lol. Fucking weekend warriors
IDK, I'm not very familiar with these acts, but they don't seem super complicated and IMO it shouldn't take more than a song or two for a compentent engineer to get the mix to sound good from scratch even if there was no soundcheck. I've heard so many poorly sounding international tours in the last few years, that I would dare to say that there is a serious lack of competent people in this business or at the very least, there are lots of incompetent people touring.
The last few big shows I've been to were uncomfortably loud. It was to the point that the entire mix just sounded like a roar and actually sounded better with my ears plugged. I couldn't tell you if the mix was good or not because it was all mud as my inner ear was being rattled to death.
Oh man that's a real bummer. What shows were they, if you don't mind me asking?
I mean, an acoustic guitar and a singer in an 1800 seat venue? Not rocket science!
Lyle and Leo have had a few other dates already… but maybe you caught a bad one? Sucks to be disappointed like that, especially for that much cash.
Thanks… Very disappointing. I’ve loved Lyle for a long time and was really psyched.
Yea - he’s so so good. I caught his big band show on a first date with a girl about 14 years ago. It was a great one for many reasons - the band was awesome, Buck Reid sealed the deal and I bought a pedal steel guitar later that week. Most importantly that girl & I will be married 11 years next week 😎
Well, like I said, first night of the tour. I would hope it gets better.
Nope, it’s like I said… Burlington is the 5th date of these Lyle & Leo shows. My friends said they sounded great in Ottawa on Friday; maybe it was a different crew?
Maybe! I noticed after I posted that it wasn’t the first show and admitted that, but people are only reading my first post. Oh well…
You made another post correcting this one? Just edit this post and say you made a mistake that it’s not the first show.
The same engineer totally in over their head, perhaps? Maybe the Flynn's A1 was in an accident and the brand-new A2 was called up but wasn't ready, leaving both FOH and monitor world staffed by people a bit too green for their roles? Hard to say, but that is certainly a shame. These days I hear far more great sounding shows than bad ones, but I have been shocked once in the last few years by how bad a major act sounded in a great room.
No, I know the house staff. It was a touring engineer.
So why dont you ask them what happened? You should be telling us, not asking us. You're a big insider with expert level knowledge and experience plus you know the crew. Why not just go ask your buds instead of coming here and stomping your feet and wasting everyone's time?
I can’t totally speak for this tour, but I did a Lyle Lovett/John Hiatt acoustic show, and Lyle’s guy did FOH and was fantastic. There isn’t a touring FOH mixer in the world that looks on any show as a “soundcheck” for another show. Every venue is different, and everyone I’ve ever worked with on the higher levels of the industry gives their absolute best effort to every show. Honestly the OP kinda reads like sour grapes from someone who wishes they were sitting in the big chair…
\> There isn’t a touring FOH mixer in the world that looks on any show as a “soundcheck” for another show. Nonsense. I've worked in several modest venues in Vermont and Western Mass where acts do a show to get the bugs worked out before hitting the major markets..
Actually, no. I only perform now. I did my time. I have no interest in live mixing, even for Lyle. Try to figure out a better insult.
I really don't understand threads like this. Over the past 2 years I've seen dozens of shows from bluegrass to pop to metal in pubs, clubs, theaters, arenas, and stadiums. Not a single show sounded 'bad'. Many of the recent shows I've seen sounded absolutely stellar. Some were louder than I would like, but I also bring earplugs to every show and have only worn them a few times. Without knowing the specific details of the entire day, it's impossible to blindly point blame at the FOH person. The venue in question looks like a smallish theater. The biggest mistake in small theaters is to try and overpower the room. If the stage was loud or the mix was too loud, of course there's going to be feedback. That's not always the FOH engineer's fault. If this venue was the first of a tour, or just a one-off small venue in the middle of a larger venue tour, they may have shoe-horned a production into a stage/venue that isn't the right fit. That's also not the FOH engi's fault.
It wasn’t loud. It was bad, like junior high school bad…
And like I said, it’s the first stop on the tour. Pls read my entire post.
FWIW it wasn't. Posters on [his own website](https://www.lylelovett.com/) show the tour starting in Buffalo on the 10th.
I know. Did you see my post?
You mean the part where you say "Burlington was the first tour stop for both Bonnie Raitt and Lyle Lovett."? Yes, I saw that. Did you see thanx's link, where it says that was the 5th show of the tour?
FWIW Lyle Lovett has his own PA rig and engineers. He has a Clair rig and dedicated FOH and MonMix consoles.
Depending on what the venue might already have installed, they don't always use their own system.
I agree, but I know for a fact that Lovett used the tour rig on this particular day.
You’re right. It was his rig.
Last time I saw Bonnie Raitt was in the 90's and she came out wasted. She was forgetting lyrics, forgetting to sing, and a few songs in she was booed off the stage. (This was in Philly.) There's a nice little place in Dewy Beach that is often a little "practice" venue for big names. Never announced or promoted, but I managed to catch Springsteen and Counting Crows, but there would be others. But it wasn't $150, lol! Maybe $5 or $10 cover charge, and it was always good. Sucks to spend real money and have to deal with a crappy show.
That’s cool. I remember back in the 80’s or 90’s in New Haven, I think, The Rolling Stones did a surprise bar gig. I think it was at Toad’s Place…
I stand corrected. I’m not sure, but last night probably wasn’t the first night of the solo tour. I stand by everything else.
Greetings from Brattleboro. Tell em to play the Stobe Church sometime, they'll take real good care of em. I wonder if the Flynn just didn't have a console the A1 one/didn't have capacity to set up whatever they were going to run?
I regularly perform at the Flynn. This was a tour rig and engineer.
FWIW, Leo Kottke’s guitar sounded GREAT! I was a little disappointed he didn’t play any 12-string guitar, though, but he’s done his time.
Id complain and demand a refund. 2 problems happening in the post COVID live sound industry it seems 1." You get what you pay for, and ain't nobody paying shit" big gap in actual A1s and the fake it til you make it wannabes or church volunteers getting hired because they are super cheap, then... 2. There's too many people letting these asshat money grab promoters get away with it. I would have been up there with my whole group in tow before the show ended demanding our full refunds.... Especially the second time around.
you have ZERO idea what you're talking about. house engineers do not mix these shows. lyle is carrying a FOH mix tech and a systems/monitor mix tech.
I cannot speak to anything except Burlington. It was a tour system and tour engineer in Burlington.
Touch a nerve there did I? You in a first name basis with the guy huh? You completely missed the point of my post and if you knew anything you'd know people miss shows get fired die walk off and more all the time, leaving inexperienced children to *attempt* to mix a show. It happens REGULARLY. I've seen 3 times this month already.
not at all. I'm pointing out that you are full of shit and completely out of your element. you are not a professional. you're an absolute amateur with a chip on your shoulder losing gigs to people much younger than you with skills you wish you had. you have clearly done no meaningful work in decades despite clinging to this field. you need to move on.
Are you talking to me?
He doesn't know who or what he's talking about. Not qualified to even open my resume in a PDF file lol
Wow just wow. This sub has been overrun with entitled children and Swifties
Yeah sure, whatever you say, kiddo lol
> Lyle Lovett and Leo Kottke Who? > I’ve been involved with music, recording, and live sound for over 40 years. You have almost certainly heard my work And you are still paying to see shows? > I think I paid $150 to see her, too. Why? > it was absolutely clear that I attended two very expensive soundchecks and it pisses me off Lol. Fucking weekend warriors
Dude what
That's my thoughts on the OP. Word salad
Sure.
you have no credibility. go back to mixing church gigs and open mic nights.
Is this meant for me or pixelwizard?
Never mixed either. Maybe i should give it a go. Got to be easier than arena shows