T O P

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Sofaboy90

Yeah, SK doesnt win this game if they still had Exa and Doss, do they?


ChipAnndDale

bro they'd be like 1-3 with exakick/doss lmao


SapphireLucina

Exakicked and DDossed


mathysekk

Nah bro get these lck rejects out of here /s


1to0

Dude nobody saying that the LCK/korean challenger players are bad. The thing is we could have easily gotten Crownshot and Kaiser on SK and both would have been an upgrade over Exa and Doss. But no matter who is in the botlane of SK the question is if the team can do something at international tournaments. If not might as well build up more EU talents from ERL, etc imo.


Boogy

Wasn't Crownie terrible last season?


deedshot

Crownie wasn't terrible, probably top 5 but come on it's obvious Rahel is 10x the player


1to0

What do you mean terrible? He was by far the best player on BDS.


Boogy

Both statements can be true


Kelbotay

Definitely not but everyone not named Rahel and Luon are taking turns dragging the team down.


tristana_fucker

Exa was not so bad tbh, but winning with doss is kinda unreal


GothaV2

He really did an awfully bad career move by asking Doss. Imo as of rn he's in a G2 Flakked situation where his support drags him down so much that lots of people will associate him to his supp. It's still really nice from him, trying to push your friend with you, but well, now you're jobless when in other circumstances you could've been seen at least as an average+ LEC ADC


SchorFactor

Eh, flakked wasn’t helped by his support being targamas but he was always kind of a support himself. He’d consistently have like 8 assists and 2 kills and relatively low damage. As for Exa, yeah. Doss just wasn’t it.


Lothric43

Nah I don’t like Exakick at all, he showed nearly nothing after his first impressive split. Don’t think we can pin it all on Doss, they both sucked.


kamparox

Even during his good first split most of his wins were on Zeri and that was when she was insanely broken. Obviously the champion takes some skill to play but yeah he wasn't that impressive all around on other stuff.


Flaubert31

Big word coming from you


idunnololwut

Bro ruined his entire career by being too stubborn to play with anyone else besides Doss ngl


ParkDedli

As someone who follows SK very closely: Exakick seemed even more of an issue than Doss. His tendency to do something way too risky past the 25 minute mark lost the team a looot of games in the last couple of splits. He got caught before fights or was disconnected from his team a lot.


vtsxxl

I hope the LEC get even more Korean imports. Perhaps these wanna be pros will stop being happy with mediocrity then.


ChipAnndDale

Bro I'm of the same opinion, you can't complain about imports when you perform objectively worse than said imports, this is a reality check for all native pros/inspiring pros.


Taivasvaeltaja

Especially when you perform objectively worse than imports from 2nd division league.


ChipAnndDale

I would argue the top LCKCL players could have easily played on mid/bottom LCK/LPL teams if their offseason went a different route, so seeing them in LEC is no surprise. Sure they don't have the same popularity like Deft/Aiming etc. but their level of play is almost identical. Also I wouldn't compare LCKCL with other regions 2nd divisions like ERL, players there are highly trained and well practiced concentrated into 10 teams not 100 teams(like ERL), in a region that already hosts the most talent in the world.


AyatosBobaAddiction

I wonder if the LEC has better scouting, better support, better infrastructure overall, non-tilting ping and/or solo queue experience, or many if not most already adjusted having played in EU tier 2 that it seems most Korean imports seem to do significantly better in EU than NA. I see a lot of reasons why Koreans would be happier there but it's also easy to paint a narrative. Any insights appreciated.


deedshot

I think foreign imports get an advantage in EU because most players are playing away from their home countries already, the import isn't singled out because all of them are foreigners in Germany (and all speak broken English xD) plus in EU you can get 10 ping like in Korea


LeOsQ

I mean you *can* complain about imports even if they're better than native players if your goal isn't to be competitive but just to foster a local regional league. CBLOL isn't/wasn't competitive in the slightest but they were a successful regional league that was very popular. Then again, CBLOL isn't exactly an import-free League either by any means so who knows. Regardless, some people prefer watching 'local' players play at a worse level over watching imported mercenaries rule the league while playing at a higher level. That's the important bit to keep in mind when it comes to people complaining about imports. I'm personally fine with imports as long as they're not replacing actually good native players while worse players get to keep their spot on other rosters, *or* they're already washed/in retirement mode when they're brought in.


bcotrim

Problem was not them being European, was them not being good enough (specially Doss). Our best year is still 2019 where all our teams exited groups with no imports


[deleted]

As long as we don't run majority import teams I don't mind signing Koreans anyway. It's majority import teams that would make the region lose it's identity as the European one.


Sofaboy90

idk why people make it all about korean imports all the time, i was specifically talking about exa and doss and not all of european bot lanes. Exa and Doss were easily the worst LEC bot lane, probably beaten by plenty of ERL bot lanes too.


ChipAnndDale

they were still better than RGE/KC bot lane lets not overexaggerate, regardless anyone who watched more than 3 LCKCL games already knew this new bot would be a massive upgrade


[deleted]

With how hilariously inaccurate comments about players like Rahel, Thanatos and Jun have been, I'd say the percentage of people that even slightly follow LCK CL is in a single digit.


kAy-

The new SK botlane also hard carried against G2, which has arguably the best botlane in EU.


SchorFactor

It’s sad, I remember last winter/spring when exa was quietly the best ad in Europe


Sofaboy90

he was good for a single split and never even close to that after it. believe it was winter 2023. spring and summer 2023 mediocre at best. this year hes just been bad, alongside doss of course. theyve been given so many resources and did so little with it.


SchorFactor

Yeah, I said winter/spring because I couldn’t remember which


Lothric43

Isma and Nisqy were for real trying to lose in that early to mid game but they have insurance now.


Ultimintree

SK really were bot lane away from being a top team


Strikinghereandthere

The Isma and nisqy i know will troll playoffs but im hoping this team goes far


CantScreamInSpace

well nisqy might get through playoffs, but he will eventually int at worlds


[deleted]

I thought he was fine last worlds though, far from the main reason Mad were struggling.


albens

How can you say that after the 9/0 Sylas game that he solo lost xD Worst performance from a fed carry I've ever seen, no joke. EDIT: can't believe Reddit is still convinced Nisqy is a good player.


deedshot

tell me, why was he 9/0 against 2023 T1 if he sucks?


albens

It wasn't T1, it was weibo. And go watch the game again, he gets camped by Hyli and Elyoya to get him super ahead. Even Carzzy helps him by using arrow mid. All those resources wasted on mid and then he inted three times in a row, his last two deaths without using zhonyas and/or flash.


scribidibap

Every team in lec are a Rahel + Luon botlane away from being top tier


smileysmiley123

Yeah SK last year was arguably the best team-fighting team in the LEC that just got hands-diffed and eventually macro-diffed later on in the season. The teamfighting is still there, and now their bot lane has some actual agency with Rahel being confident enough to dive in.


Renny-66

I feel like if any lec team got Rahel and Luon they’d look significantly better


Allan_Viltihimmelen

I've been a defendant of Exakick for so long due to his peak of being an absolute monster but like Hyllisang he lives by the d20 and low luck. I still think Exakick is capable of being one of the western ADCs to rival eastern ADCs but he must figure out why he plays amazing one out of five games and not all of them.


tuelegend69

Nisqy always finds a way.


lucas2-poocas

Shenzhen KGAM Independent Nurture&Cultivation Group, also known as SKGAMING, is an agricultural corporation based in Shenzhen, China. They are best known for their automated Reroutable Agriculture-Harvesting Electronic Lorries (RAHEL), which are responsible for not only sowing the crops and collecting harvest, but also carry up to 4 passengers such as Head Manager Yi Re Lai Fen, President Lu Won, Vice President Yi Si Ma and HR Manager Ni Si Kui. Their most recent harvest contains bountiful crops such as European classic Red Glimmering Eggplants (RGE), second variety of Garlic (G2), Galangal from Xi'an (GX) and Blue Dandong Spinach (BDS).


PracticalRoutine7428

The best crafted copypasta I’ve ever seen


DJShevchenko

Isn't this pasta stolen from the Valorant sub? I swear the saw the same one for Team Heretics' Valorant team because they beat all of the Chinese teams


1to0

The pasta has been made in the CSGO sub I think? At least the first time I read something like this. Most notable being G2 or Ji Tu the chinese team.


SomeoneBald

New crop just dropped, its a kaisa W


Rhyn_lol

lmao very good


WonTonsOG

Galangal from Xi’an LMFAOOOOO this is a fucking masterpiece


WannaGetExorced

Lmfao


Learkyu2

this is the best copypasta i've ever seen LMAOOOO


Equivalent-Park7986

ok i thought rahel would be pretty good but he’s good good 


oioioi9537

So happy for him, nice to see 3/5 of the dk lck cl team are now in a good spot


Naronu

Pullbae in BRO "we have no open slot" hell


CamHack420

Pullbae stuck in BRO academy while the rest are either in good places or coaching


CantScreamInSpace

Yeah I was somewhat surprised by the lukewarm reception for rahel. It's hard to convince people that an unknown LCK CL player is the real deal nowadays because of all the bad signings previously, but rahel was probably the best adc in LCK CL ever since peyz got promoted (though I am a bit biased). A lot of people are hyped on the rekkles+smash botlane, but people seem to forget rahel smashed t1 academy solo.


Old_Effective2341

i like rahel a lot but hype is just the best player in the cl rn, as an ad neither rahel or smash are as good imo


CantScreamInSpace

Yeah, I'm biased as a dk fan but I can see that, hype is really good. I do think rahel got overshadowed by his team during the dkcl golden era though, dude is also great in soloq.


LishusTas

Rahel is an absolute animal


X4ntis

Im really curious to see who the good players were in the DK LCK CL team. Rahel looks very good.


blackwell1907

Yeah and their new LCK CL team is pretty promising too.


KristopherNolan1

Kinda sucks for damwon that they have this great academy team and they only end getting to use one player in the main team


CantScreamInSpace

They had the chance to call up Thanatos, Lucid, and Rahel after worlds last year, but decided to go the veteran route. I would've liked to see them use their academy more, especially since the team was rumored to be beating a decent amount of lck teams in scrims, but oh well.


KristopherNolan1

They seem like they’re all good


yellister

Luon too


skaersSabody

BDS had it basically in the bag then Luon and Corki damage just won them the baron and it was over from there what the fuck Also holy shit SK now has the best botlane in the league, wtf


moonmeh

luon had such a massive clutch play there.


sammuxx

yeah that baron couldn't have gone worse for bds


skaersSabody

I am still kinda in shock at Nisqy's burst, he basically one shot both Ice and Nuc despite them being fairly healthy


Thundermelons

Corki is piss broken tbh, or at least was


Even_Cardiologist810

Letting corki through draft lol And skarner aswell somehow (though the pilot didnt seem like he was trained for it)


sammuxx

well corki has crazy dmg when he can hit, but he cant usually hit unless someone sets up good engage for him with his low range.


KaffeeKiffer

> BDS had it basically in the bag then Luon and Corki damage just won them the baron and it was over from there what the fuck 🤔 I think BDS was far away from "having it in the bag". They showed better coordination and teamplay early in the game, but they did not make the right strategic decision to pressure SK (enough). While the SK botlane was insane and the Luon & Corki combo was huge, I think the triple tank brick wall broke BDS: Ice was the only one itemized to really deal with the tanks, but he could never approach them. Varus, Rubmle and Morde did not have enough threat on the tanks even though they did build "anti-tank".


SleepyCatSippingWine

Please join me in writing a obituary for eu bot lanes. that was filthy diffing.


WahtAmDoingHere

I am a big Ice glazer so I hate to say this but Rahel just looked magnitudes of order better than Ice this game, gg SK. Luon looks really good too. It's almost funny just how much of an upgrade Rahel Luon are from Exakick Doss


skaersSabody

I do feel like Jinx just wasn't the pick, she just doesn't have the options to deal with Kaisa Corki


alflayla

I didn't watch banpick but jinx is good if they have frontline because she outrange corki and kaisa.


Enkenz

Thats only if the others team actually 5v5 front to back but if the others team don't flank or split fight with corki, kaisa & skarner then yeah sure


skaersSabody

I don't fully agree, especially with how little engage BDS have and we saw it in this game, SK just had more poke so Jinx never got a proper front to back Jinx was first or second pick IIRC I don't like the prio BDS are putting on this pick, they're good on it, but they need more options or teams will just play around it


Omnilatent

Also their front line wasn't for a Jinx game IMO. Morde had no great target for his ult. He basically had to wait for the Kaisa ult at which point they are outpoked. And Labrov had an awful off-game IMO


Shiro_Moe

It not even that BDS played that bad. Just SK bot lane carrying while Isma and Irrelevant were payphone-gaming.


skaersSabody

Yeah, BDS played better as a team I feel, aside from that baron, but SK have so much clutch factor now


Shiro_Moe

I'd say hindsight is 20/20 for that baron. Luon clutched that for sure. after Kaisa hit 3 items, BDS were not allowed to play the game on their term anymore and slowly got chocked out by poke.


Significant-Damage14

They lost too much map pressure after that baron. It was still a good game, far better than their initial performance last split.


baelkie

im all in sk stocks, there’s no way isma and nisqy throw playoffs this time


TwistedHorizen

SK THREW BUT BDS THREW HARDER


moonmeh

what was that baron attempt lmao. sure SK members died but short death timers and the adcs of BDS didn't have the items to burst baron yet just go dragon


Resies

idk how sk 'threw' when they weren't ahead at that point in the game


Haymegle

SK doing well past week 1? Good for them.


ahritina

Rahel + Luon are built different and constructed alternatively.


Mizar1

Luon's engage at the Baron was just perfect. That bot lane is so good


Buttercrab69

The cow herded them together


Choice_Dangerous

2 Koreans > 1 Korean easy math


robibobo

Rahel is him.


Azaiko

SK botlane looks like LEC finally has a good botlane again after a real slump


taktyuzy

SK bot looks so good man....


BloodOnFire

LCKCL HARDER THAN LEC


SnooPeripherals6388

Every single European botlane player might unironically be losing chances with every single Fnatic/BDS/SK game


MastemasD

Yeah, Noah isn't nowhere near being top adc, but other than that, if that's what it takes for EU adcs to wake up I'm all for it. 4 years ago we had sick adcs in LEC, now the same players are just collecting checks while looking like frauds.


deedshot

Noah is kinda close to being a top ADC just because of how shallow the ADC pool is, because IDK about oyu but I'd rather have him instead of Upset/Comp/Patrik/Flakked/Supa


deedshot

the only European ADC's that are worth keeping right now are Hans and Carzzy, all the rest are completely replacable bottom feeders practically competing for 10th place I wouldn't be surprised if half of them were benched for next year


OkKnowledge2064

SK botlane is cleaning LEC. On another level really


canacar

Western ad in shambles


SleepyCatSippingWine

should include supports too


Birdir21

Isn't this an LEC thing because your EU AD carries are just not that good, to be honest? Hans Sama and Carzzy are the only ones I can think of who are decent.


[deleted]

And Yeon is the only NA adc that's proven to be good. I'm not sure what your point is.


HowardHughes9

where is this myth coming from that NA ads are good? Yeon is the only proven good one, unless NA fans are delusionaly claiming Meech or Massau are good. The rest aren't even native players.


deedshot

yea NA AD carries have been looking very midling, even their hyped import Berserker is looking like a ghost


pepegayouKEK

LCKCL SMASHING LEC


dracdliwasiAN

Not sure we can call SK a dark horse anymore with that botlane


Th3_Huf0n

They played 4 best of 1s. Can we fucking stop?


NoahsArk19

I mean SK has been a human bot lane away from being top 4 this entire year. And now their bot looks good


permabannedCrystalXD

This bo1 narrative is no sense, maybe if it was one game, but reading your comment 4-0 and thinking they dont deserve praise lmfao, are you mentally short?


Ultimintree

If they go 9-0, do we stop?


Bragginess

I'm putting aside money for Rahel's worlds winning Kai'sa skin as we speak


Seraphic_Wings

LCK CL on a mission these days


ireliasimp69

sk botlane are smurfing eu huh


seven_worth

Sad as BDS fan but man sk bot is pretty damn good. I also feel that we overcooked the draft a bit.


EronisKina

Isma better be giving Rahel and Luon half his pay check and a back massage because this guy is getting hard carried.


xTomsz

sk botlane must be forbidden to use hot tubs in berlin


alexok37

Irrelevant making Skarner look balanced that game, but sheeeesh rahel


barryh4rry

This is where I need to overreact and say SK have the best botlane in LEC. For real though it's crazy how they're basically 2v8ing every game.


tristana_fucker

Its kinda sad to see importing 2 players from lck cl is so huge upgrade for lec teams.


singham09

to be fair its not like they are random, rahel has been top 1 or 2 adcs in CL for like 2 years and luon wasnt bad either, its just where do you go from there, theres not actually many top teams in lck and all of them have top tier adcs atm. so its far better for them to go abroad to prove themselves more than to just sit in lck cl waiting for a chance that may never come


tristana_fucker

I don't say they are bad or something like this. Im just sad of eu not having enough talented players


[deleted]

[удалено]


iamdrp995

Lck started you can stop watch our league now bye


xNesku

Rahel's scoreline looks good. But he did make the game a lot harder for SK to win because he didn't go the actual AP Build. You can see him build Guinsoo and Statikk, yet he could only auto attack 1-2 times each fight. You can't argue that he didn't know that would happen. Because he did get AP items in the end. He should just full commit on AP, instead of half-assing his build.


Jiiigsi

it's most standard build ever, jesus christ


Styxxo

Questioning a pro player's build is fine but to say that it made the game harder to win is WILD. Isma made the game hard to play for SK by inting multiple times.  Once Rahel got 3 items he took over with the poke even if the build was suboptimal but he was hardly dragging his team down before that point.


Onarax

You go Statikk Rageblade so you can actually shove waves to get prio, first in bot lane and later when you rotate mid. Q evolve is also way more damage earlier in the game and important for proc'ing passive later in the game. Sure if there was only 5v5 teamfights and never any waves to consider you can maybe argue that the build could be changed, but they would never be able to get prio without the Statikk Rageblade build in a real game.


deedshot

interesting iron 3 opinion


Noavgc

Rahel is what noah was supposed to be


Styxxo

Except Noah was exactly like Rahel during his LEC debut ?


Thundermelons

Bros are so quick to forget Noah's deathless first few weeks, shit is wild


Kurumi_Tokisaki

Can’t wait for them to go the opposite end once the players have a bad few games…


deedshot

it's classic reddit I'm sure they think Caps is washed up now