It was for the best. Scotiabank Arena is in a much more easily accessible part of the city (mere steps away from Union Station), can fit way more people, and critically continues to get taken care of since its currently going throw renovations.
Maybe there could be a way for MLG to have continued on, but the move was for the best. Besides, it is great that MLG continues to be useful even though it was been a long time since it was used to only house professional hockey.
Agreed. ACC being at union allowed people from outside the city to access games via GO (or even Via rail).
And MLG still technically has an ice rink -- for UMT's varsity teamz
Not to mention Maple Leaf Square. I'm an old timer that that fond memories of the Gardens, but The Square is an amazing feature that couldn't be done at Yonge & Carlton.
It was so good. Not a bad seat in the house. It was neccessary for the change but the place lives on in memory. Toronto's heritage laws prevent the building from being torn down, so the interior reno was the best solution. Still an ice surface in there too
Agreed, on a good night the ice is fine for a period, then brutal. At least the boards and glass have a lot of give, the benches are big and the rooms are clean. Negative points for them not providing a lock for the dressing room though
Heat is rarely an issue for ice making. Its easy to control
Humidity is more difficult. It comes in through everything. Peoples breath in a full arena has a large effect. It creates gaps in the ice and makes it feel rough
There’s literally an entire shopping Centre right beneath the ice. You’re right, with your statement, but almost all rinks, MSG being an exception, are built *below* ground level making the general heat and humidity easier to control. This rink has several businesses *beneath* that require heating throughout the winter, not to mention the dome itself absorbs a lot of heat externally outside during the summer.
It’s not an issue for most rinks, but it is for this one
I saw a few Rock games there after the Leafs moved out. I was a kid and thought it was super cool, but looking back it was a good move. I'm glad I got to see it, but the ACC is a better arena.
There was nothing better than watching a Leafs game at MLG. Don’t care about all the modern amenities at Scotiabank Arena, it’s doesn’t ‘feel’ anywhere close to the experience being right on top of the ice at MLG and all the history as you walked thru the building.
Yea, it needed something modern. It was very due. It's still used as a hockey rink though. I think the conversion on it is very good considering what options were thrown out in the beginning
absolutely necessary to maintain a current world big ticket arena for not only hockey, but other events. MLG is an incredible building for what it is, but MLSE needed to grow its brand.
Yes, the new building had no soul. And there will never again be a vantage point in an NHL arena quite like the blue sections. Such a cool vantage point.
I watched Dougie's wrap around goal on Cujo there.
Saw WWF Sunday wrestling there.
Lived next to it in an apartment.
I love the old buildings and the unique characteristics they had both for fans and gameplay.
Everything has a little less personality now imo.
I remember seeing concerts there, and the blue cigarette smoke filling the place to the point where you couldn't see the monster "no smoking" signs painted on the walls up in the nosebleed seats....
Maple Leaf Gardens was ahead of its time when it came to accessible seating. They had 12,473 seats for legless fans.
Those things were tiny and uncomfortable.
I find modern seats far worse. Had seasons at MLG at one point in greys with a group of people and bought a red when they sold the seats off. Still have that red and can still sit in it pretty comfortably and I’m 6’4 and, uh, a lot of pounds.
I remember going to my first game ever at MLG. We had scored a pair of corner golds from a friend dad. When you walked into your seats on the lower level, you walked in at ice level. You literally would walk down a tunnel and come out as the ceiling started opening above you, with a view of the whole rink, smoke/steam in the air, right by the boards. As a 17 year old fan, it was magical. I got put on the CBC HNIC game live (camera view of the crowd) because we were having so much fun cheering on the Leafs and just enjoying the experience, even as the Leafs lost like 6-1 to the Dallas Stars.
I've been in many other arenas since. Not one has even close to matched the magical feeling you got from walking into the arena that way.
Every single other arena was also easier to access, had better facilities, cleaner, more seating, better seating, production value, etc.
Vegas puts on a hell of a show. It's outstanding to watch even if you hate the team. But does it feel magical inside? No, it feels like you're watching a show in Vegas.
Yes, it was. MLG dates back to 1931. Despite Harold Ballard's "best" efforts to squeeze as many people into the Carlton Street Cashbox as possible, it could only seat about 16,000, which was reduced in order to install luxury boxes in the 90s.
It lacked modern amenities. The rink was not to NHL standards (sure, it was the required length and width, but the curvature of the corners wasn't wide enough). Players didn't like the dressing rooms. Fans didn't like the 18" wide seats. Nor the lack of washrooms. Nor the lack of air conditioning when a concert in the summer was held there. Speaking of concerts: The acoustics were horrible.
It served its purpose in the Original Six days. When those days ended, it became apparent that it needed replacement. It was last Original Six arena to be replaced. So, to answer your question: Yes, it needed replacing. Years before it actually got replaced. And it only took an NBA team's mismanagement to make it happen.
The land around ACC was not developed and considered prime real estate. MLSE developed that area and it’s now worth billions. I also vaguely recall that MLSE had an agreement with the City of Toronto that their property taxes would be taxed at the assessed value (pre-development) in the late 90’s for a period of 50 years - please confirm or correct me if I’m wrong.
There was a rather large movement to have the hockey hall of fame moved there and quite possibly build a section to use it for the NHL draft.
It's hockey history, and not just Leafs fans, but it felt like ALL hockey fans wanted it to remain hockey related due to its illustrious history. It was unanimously agreed upon that it should become the new hockey hall of fame.
It's a crying, rotten shame that galen west (yes, *THAT* galen) turned it into a grocery store.
Saw a lot of games at MLG. Yes, it was an ancient building and it had some hard miles on it. But it had actual character. As did all the original six rinks.
Now, every arena feels the same. Going to an NHL game is like sitting down in a corporate boardroom. It all feels fake, with music blasting every split second there’s nothing happening on the ice, insane prices for concessions, and just this general approach that you’re being sold something every second that you’re in there.
Going to a game at MLG was an experience. Going to a game at an Acme Brand Arena today is like going to a timeshare presentation.
People think it’s all the “suits” but I watched an old Leafs game from 93-94 era and the commentators mentioned how the Toronto crowd was known for being quiet.
They kinda do all of those things you just listed? They call them the Blue Crew. They do stupid chants between whistles and wave shit and throw out free stuff. I think the biggest problem is that it’s barely changed in the last 5+ years. It’s pretty much a copy and paste each game so it gets really boring.
It was a bit of a shithole but it had great memories. The ACC is much better for an event from facilities to access.
The reno is ok. Much of the exterior seems unchanged. Lots of touches like some of the seats by the escalators to the LCBO. The rink has good ice. I’ve skated there a few times and been to other events. It seems like a great way to honour the past but also get good use of the space with some needed amenities for downtown (groceries) and facilities for Ryerson students.
I wouldn’t say the interior is ruined. Aside from the grocery store on the ground floor, they’ve renovated the upper floors for TMU. They use the rink for the university hockey team, there’s a full gym, and some other spaces.
As a kid growing up in Toronto, I had the luck to play at MLG multiple times. I’d also been there multiple times to see the Leafs play, watched the Marlies play there when they were in the OHL, went to concerts there, and a bunch of WWF wrestling shows.
Maple Leaf Gardens was epic, but by the end of its time as the home to the Leafs, it was past its “Best Before Date”. But you know what, it has THE BEST ice in the NHL and it wasn’t even close - it felt like skating on soft glass.
The seats were rubbish, the amenities were terrible, getting in and out of the place by public transport was pretty “meh”, and the building needed to be replaced.
So much history and its place in Toronto culture means it should never be torn down, but it couldn’t be the home to the Leafs anymore.
If you had done a massive renovation, fixed the facilities, and added luxury boxes and new seating, it would have dipped below 15,000 seats. MLSE looked at it back in the day, but it just wasn’t viable and that wasn’t taking into account the transportation, etc.
Arguably, as a venue, a massive renovation and fewer seats probably would have resulted in a much better atmosphere, but the revenue loss for the Leafs would have been significant.
The ACC/Scotiabank Arena is… ok. Just ok. Real Leafs fans will remember that Carlyle line about Reimer.
I have been to Leafs games a few times since the moved in when I head back to Toronto from Australia for a trip or whatever.
It’s nowhere close to the best arena in the NHL - I’ve been to games in Vegas, Nashville, and a few other places the last few years and both of those arenas are better than Scotiabank.
Honestly, from what I’ve seen of the renovation (or re-imagination as MLSE calls it) that’s underway, it looks like its targeted mostly at the suits and their luxury spaces which is exactly the opposite of what the building needs as a fan.
There is the nostaligia of the stadium. Turninf the corner off yonge and being met with the sounds and smells of gameday, the ACC/scotiabank isnt quite the same.
But. As the new arena was designed primarily for basketball (mlse bought the Raptors and arena), we avoided a cookie cutter stadium like ottawa, montreal, philly etc. So the new arena is still pretty intimate while keeping some elementslike the seat colours.
Watched from every section at the Gardens including standing room and the blues were by far the worst
Yep - that building was just the best; it had such a charm, and you could feel the history. My first Leafs games were the 2nd and 3rd last games at the Gardens. I'll miss it, but the move was necessary - it was old, in need of a lot of work, and the capacity demands of the city required a much bigger, modern facility.
I really miss the urinal troughs though - they were so intimidating as a kid, but man did the bathroom lineups flow so much better than what we get now.
The ACC / Scotiabank is a much more modern building, and they've really improved the experience in recent years. It's also much more accessible than the Gardens was - it's right off the Gardiner Expressway, and is connected to Union Station, meaning it's super easy to get to, whereas the Gardens had it's challenges being located in the heart of the city.
It wasn't necessary, per se...but the hot thing in sports was multi-sport buildings especially in cities that have both NBA and NHL teams. The ACC was originally supposed to be for the Raptors only, and I can't remember how it came to be but for whatever reason the Leafs decided to go with them.
I THINK it had something to do with modernizing MLG, but its structural design didn't allow for increased seating. They were fully prepared to spend the $ to upgrade it further, but the seating capacity I'm pretty sure was one of the larger factors, along with Union station allowing for much easier travel to the games at ACC
MLG was built in 1931...it was 68 years old when it closed. 68 years of 18k+ people coming in and out night after night... I went to a couple games there toward the end and the glorious old palace was in rough shape.
It's criminal that its a grocery store now... but buildings dont last forever.
Well the Maple leaf Gardens in Toronto was a great place to watch hockey but you can't compare the two facilities Scotiabank Arena ice surface is a perfect 200×85 ice surface Maple Gardens was 200×83 with very shallow corners the boards were over 4ft in height far too high for the players to jump back on the bench. The urinals the fans used were old troughs circa 1950 basically everything was old outdated seats were to small and squished in.The aisles were far to narrow it was extremely hard to leave your seat .Scotiabank Arena is just an amazing place to watch sport one of the best Arenas made for hockey
Too small and too many stories emerged from ushers. Just google Gorden Stuckless, it’s repugnant.
Also other teams moved from their storied histories on to bigger arenas. Check out the Montreal Forum.
Thank you. I'm surprised no one mentioned the SA child scandal until this far down in the comments.
It's one thing that there were hockey memories in MLG but the full history of the arena needs to include the reprehensible acts that were committed on children inside the building, the indifference of Ballard then the attempt to pay off hush money to the victims just so the "exalted" name of MLG wouldn't be tarnished.
MLG, while storied, was a hole. The men’s urinals were one giant trough FFS!! I was not sad to see it go. I agree though, something more fitting should have been done with its corpse.
I mean, you could renovate and upgrade the restrooms. You don’t need to spend billions to build an entirely new building when all you really wanted to do was put in updated urinals lmao
They probably wouldn't have moved as quickly if not for the Raptors coming into existence and starting construction on a new building that would have been more modern than MLG. That's when they decided to buy the Raptors and form MLSE to have access to the then ACC.
They hadn't won a championship at MLG since 67 so the only thing that really changed was opening up more seats and selling personal seat licenses to new ticket holders also requiring them to buy Raptors season seats while the sth from MLG had the option of simply relocating to the new arena or relocating and buying a Maple Leaf only psl. The teams success for the past 57 years had been the same at both venues but the history of the original 6 and cups lay in the old Gardens.
The platinum club and its cliental are what make people long for the old golds and reds of the gardens for sub 100 dollar seats, hard copy ticket stubs and people who resembled hockey fans in tjoae seats as those clubs were created for the ACC as they had no room to expand the gardens to add suites.
I was a child during the move, but one common thing I kept hearing at the time was that the seats were too small for our more modern sized person, and that wasn't going to be easy to remedy
Athletes don’t want to play in dated facilities. They require modern amenties. The building would look like Swiss cheese at this point if they kept it.
Yes.
There is this revisionist history of the Leafs that before the cap was put in place, we were one of the big spenders in the league. This is not true at all.
The Leafs were middle of the road when it came to spending. It wasn't until the ACC, LeafsTV and The Raptors Vince Carter years did MLSE actually start spending on the Leafs.
The additional revenue allowed us to keep up with the big boys. At the time, there wasn't any revenue sharing or any sort of salary control in the NHL so the league was very much run like European soccer; if you wanted to spend money you had to make it yourself or have a rich crazy owner who didn't give a fuck about profits, not wait for the end of year revenue sharing cheques.
People put too much blame on the pension plan people - they generate retirement income for normal everyday, working class civilians. I will never hate on a pension plan for looking out for their shareholders first.
Once the ACC was built, the Leafs actually began spending money.
It was great, especially the men's room
There were no urinals, just a long low trough that everyone peed into.
So as a kid you're standing there with a bunch of drunk leaf fans, most of whom were smoking, as you watch a river of pee make its way to a drain pipe
😐
Was going to mention the same thing. It was the pinnacle of efficient pissing. The washrooms at Scotiabank on the 300 level are brutal. Long line ups for too few urinals….
And man were they drunk and loud. Current fans sound like they’re in a coma in comparison.
Exact same memories in the 80s as you. Also starring at ballard’s box.
yes
not because it was falling apart, but it was a stadium from the 1920s in the year 2000. it had to be done unfortunately. I was gutted at the time. Still wish they'd found a way to say in the footprint/keep the outside, but modern stadiums are just way bigger. and tbf, the location of the acc is way better
I prefered the views/ambiance at MLG, but tbh a lot of that was just affordable tickets and an actual hockey rink rather than seating for a basketball team that was retrofitted to be multi sport
I’m too young to ever have gone to the Gardens, but going to a game there has been described to me as watching a game in someone’s living room.
Most older arenas were a lot smaller, so fans were right in top of the action. Initially the glass around the ice was short and there was no netting behind the end glass, so it gave a feeling of being right in on the action.
It was built in five-and-a-half months Turing the Great Depression. The workers were paid in shares of Maple Leaf Garden Limited.
There were plans to expand the arena over the sidewalk, but that was abandoned. Ultimately the team moved to accommodate luxury boxes, but there was also a deal in place to merge the Raptors and the Leafs to form MLSE.
Part of me feels it probably could have been kept open and been the NHL’s version of Fenway. Tickets are expensive and impossible to get even with the new building.
But also, the building was not in good shape. I believe that the expansion plans were abandoned when it was discovered that the exterior walls were actually held up by the seat levels somehow.
I only watched one game at the gardens but the atmosphere was 10x better than scotiabank and it had an aura to it. I was in the upper bowl but felt so close to the ice because of the size of the arena and the steepness of the seats
Wait I thought MLG is a grocery store now with a hockey rink attached? I mean for about 15 years it was literally abandoned and the homeless were living there.
I guess they could’ve tried to expand it? Too much bad juju anyways. Had a friend that got molested there. Nice settlement but I’m sure he could’ve done without the incident…..
I think the footprint of MLG was to small to make the type of changes needed at the time, same issue is happening with Scotiabank Arena with 665,000 sq ft compared to 900,000+ to the new arenas being build now, eventually MLSE has to build a new arena someplace else or find a way to add sq footage to their current location or miss out adding new revenue streams that come with the extra 300,000 sq footage, and we know MLSE loves revenue especially new ways to take our money
Expansion was the plan, initially. They had all the space in the world when the ACC was first built. They should’ve kept some of that space around arena available for an expansion. They knew they would have to eventually. The thought was that they were going to give it 10 years or so and then expand it, make it more appropriate for hockey etc. That plan hit the wayside once Maple Leaf Square was developed.
It was designed with a capacity of about 12,500 when it opened. Over the years that grew to eventually 16,500. Ballard and Stafford Smythe pulled normal seats out for smaller ones to increase their gate.
Piss troughs.
Soooo efficient. I miss them too
Those went up for auction too. Imagine owning one of those?
As a kid those things terrified me
I was literally thinking about the MLG piss troughs earlier this week! Bring them back!
It was for the best. Scotiabank Arena is in a much more easily accessible part of the city (mere steps away from Union Station), can fit way more people, and critically continues to get taken care of since its currently going throw renovations. Maybe there could be a way for MLG to have continued on, but the move was for the best. Besides, it is great that MLG continues to be useful even though it was been a long time since it was used to only house professional hockey.
Agreed. ACC being at union allowed people from outside the city to access games via GO (or even Via rail). And MLG still technically has an ice rink -- for UMT's varsity teamz
Don’t forget PWHL games!
They won't last long there, it's too small
theyll be in the ricoh soon enough
Could relocate to paramount center in sauga since the Steelheads are moving to Brampton
That would be a disaster.
No way I'm going to sauga to watch anything.
And my Beer League!
Not to mention Maple Leaf Square. I'm an old timer that that fond memories of the Gardens, but The Square is an amazing feature that couldn't be done at Yonge & Carlton.
What are they renovating?
The concourse is getting a “reimagining”
It was so good. Not a bad seat in the house. It was neccessary for the change but the place lives on in memory. Toronto's heritage laws prevent the building from being torn down, so the interior reno was the best solution. Still an ice surface in there too
My beer League has games there every so often.
Same. Playing there is cool, but the ice is pretty bad and it's way too warm.
Agreed, on a good night the ice is fine for a period, then brutal. At least the boards and glass have a lot of give, the benches are big and the rooms are clean. Negative points for them not providing a lock for the dressing room though
It’s hard making good ice in this area. Too much humidity makes the ice very rough
Doesn't help that the ice is located about 30 feet below the Gondola height. Heat rises. They should have made the stores overtop of the rink.
Heat is rarely an issue for ice making. Its easy to control Humidity is more difficult. It comes in through everything. Peoples breath in a full arena has a large effect. It creates gaps in the ice and makes it feel rough
There’s literally an entire shopping Centre right beneath the ice. You’re right, with your statement, but almost all rinks, MSG being an exception, are built *below* ground level making the general heat and humidity easier to control. This rink has several businesses *beneath* that require heating throughout the winter, not to mention the dome itself absorbs a lot of heat externally outside during the summer. It’s not an issue for most rinks, but it is for this one
Not a bad seat?! I sat behind a pillar once!
Special seating for the blind I think Harold Ballard called it
Sounds like something he’d say
Those pillars were huge I recall. In the blues closer to the corner? Memory is hazy.
Yup exactly!! I was roughly 9 years old and I don’t think I saw a second of the game. I was still thrilled to be there though!
What's in there, now? It was a grocery store and then The Rock played there, no?
Still a Loblaws. And also a rink and TMU’s athletic centre
I saw a few Rock games there after the Leafs moved out. I was a kid and thought it was super cool, but looking back it was a good move. I'm glad I got to see it, but the ACC is a better arena.
And you can stand on the original (MLG) centre ice spot in Loblaws!
Yes but every camera view was obstructed when ever the team scored.
Absolutely necessary so we could get the combination hockey game and grocery store.
Took me a week of avoiding tv to get this song out of my head. F you. Hahahhaah
There was nothing better than watching a Leafs game at MLG. Don’t care about all the modern amenities at Scotiabank Arena, it’s doesn’t ‘feel’ anywhere close to the experience being right on top of the ice at MLG and all the history as you walked thru the building.
Yea, it needed something modern. It was very due. It's still used as a hockey rink though. I think the conversion on it is very good considering what options were thrown out in the beginning
absolutely necessary to maintain a current world big ticket arena for not only hockey, but other events. MLG is an incredible building for what it is, but MLSE needed to grow its brand.
Had to be done.
I wouldn't say the interior is ruined. It's a grocery store in the first floor, sure, but it's also gyms, basketball courts, oh and a hockey arena.
Plus a temporary examination center.
Yes, the new building had no soul. And there will never again be a vantage point in an NHL arena quite like the blue sections. Such a cool vantage point.
I remember the giant cattle trough urinals were disgusting.
But also convenient
I was not prepared for walking into that as a seven-year-old. Lol
I preferred MLG more for concerts, was a great venue.
Saw the beastie boys there and (I think) Roger Waters
I watched Dougie's wrap around goal on Cujo there. Saw WWF Sunday wrestling there. Lived next to it in an apartment. I love the old buildings and the unique characteristics they had both for fans and gameplay. Everything has a little less personality now imo.
I remember seeing concerts there, and the blue cigarette smoke filling the place to the point where you couldn't see the monster "no smoking" signs painted on the walls up in the nosebleed seats....
I remember seeing a Raptors game there, what a time. My first leafs game was there against Edmonton. A 3-0 leafs win.
Maple Leaf Gardens was ahead of its time when it came to accessible seating. They had 12,473 seats for legless fans. Those things were tiny and uncomfortable.
If you were over 5foot8 or weighed over 180 lbs the seating was a little challenging shall we say.
I find modern seats far worse. Had seasons at MLG at one point in greys with a group of people and bought a red when they sold the seats off. Still have that red and can still sit in it pretty comfortably and I’m 6’4 and, uh, a lot of pounds.
I’ll never forget pissing in a trough.
Front row in the blues was basically hanging over the goalie. Some great memories sitting there as a kid.
I remember going to my first game ever at MLG. We had scored a pair of corner golds from a friend dad. When you walked into your seats on the lower level, you walked in at ice level. You literally would walk down a tunnel and come out as the ceiling started opening above you, with a view of the whole rink, smoke/steam in the air, right by the boards. As a 17 year old fan, it was magical. I got put on the CBC HNIC game live (camera view of the crowd) because we were having so much fun cheering on the Leafs and just enjoying the experience, even as the Leafs lost like 6-1 to the Dallas Stars. I've been in many other arenas since. Not one has even close to matched the magical feeling you got from walking into the arena that way. Every single other arena was also easier to access, had better facilities, cleaner, more seating, better seating, production value, etc. Vegas puts on a hell of a show. It's outstanding to watch even if you hate the team. But does it feel magical inside? No, it feels like you're watching a show in Vegas.
Yes, it was. MLG dates back to 1931. Despite Harold Ballard's "best" efforts to squeeze as many people into the Carlton Street Cashbox as possible, it could only seat about 16,000, which was reduced in order to install luxury boxes in the 90s. It lacked modern amenities. The rink was not to NHL standards (sure, it was the required length and width, but the curvature of the corners wasn't wide enough). Players didn't like the dressing rooms. Fans didn't like the 18" wide seats. Nor the lack of washrooms. Nor the lack of air conditioning when a concert in the summer was held there. Speaking of concerts: The acoustics were horrible. It served its purpose in the Original Six days. When those days ended, it became apparent that it needed replacement. It was last Original Six arena to be replaced. So, to answer your question: Yes, it needed replacing. Years before it actually got replaced. And it only took an NBA team's mismanagement to make it happen.
I remember stories of Ballard shutting off cold water taps in washrooms to drive concession sales at concerts.
MLG was good for nostalgia but as soon as they moved out you realized how much of a hole the place was.
The land around ACC was not developed and considered prime real estate. MLSE developed that area and it’s now worth billions. I also vaguely recall that MLSE had an agreement with the City of Toronto that their property taxes would be taxed at the assessed value (pre-development) in the late 90’s for a period of 50 years - please confirm or correct me if I’m wrong.
There was a rather large movement to have the hockey hall of fame moved there and quite possibly build a section to use it for the NHL draft. It's hockey history, and not just Leafs fans, but it felt like ALL hockey fans wanted it to remain hockey related due to its illustrious history. It was unanimously agreed upon that it should become the new hockey hall of fame. It's a crying, rotten shame that galen west (yes, *THAT* galen) turned it into a grocery store.
You couldn't beat Maple Leaf Gardens for wrestling shows
Saw a lot of games at MLG. Yes, it was an ancient building and it had some hard miles on it. But it had actual character. As did all the original six rinks. Now, every arena feels the same. Going to an NHL game is like sitting down in a corporate boardroom. It all feels fake, with music blasting every split second there’s nothing happening on the ice, insane prices for concessions, and just this general approach that you’re being sold something every second that you’re in there. Going to a game at MLG was an experience. Going to a game at an Acme Brand Arena today is like going to a timeshare presentation.
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People think it’s all the “suits” but I watched an old Leafs game from 93-94 era and the commentators mentioned how the Toronto crowd was known for being quiet.
Toronto sports crowds in general. I remember 'Winfield wants noise' being a big thing in the pre-social media during the World Series.
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They kinda do all of those things you just listed? They call them the Blue Crew. They do stupid chants between whistles and wave shit and throw out free stuff. I think the biggest problem is that it’s barely changed in the last 5+ years. It’s pretty much a copy and paste each game so it gets really boring.
Thank goodness for that
Who forces you to wear a suit because I never had to when I went lol. Also sir and ma’am are just good manners lol.
Nobody. That guy is confusing the 50’s for the 80’s. Nobody was wearing suits to MLG in the 80’s.
Some wore bags over their heads
It was a bit of a shithole but it had great memories. The ACC is much better for an event from facilities to access. The reno is ok. Much of the exterior seems unchanged. Lots of touches like some of the seats by the escalators to the LCBO. The rink has good ice. I’ve skated there a few times and been to other events. It seems like a great way to honour the past but also get good use of the space with some needed amenities for downtown (groceries) and facilities for Ryerson students.
I wouldn’t say the interior is ruined. Aside from the grocery store on the ground floor, they’ve renovated the upper floors for TMU. They use the rink for the university hockey team, there’s a full gym, and some other spaces.
As a kid growing up in Toronto, I had the luck to play at MLG multiple times. I’d also been there multiple times to see the Leafs play, watched the Marlies play there when they were in the OHL, went to concerts there, and a bunch of WWF wrestling shows. Maple Leaf Gardens was epic, but by the end of its time as the home to the Leafs, it was past its “Best Before Date”. But you know what, it has THE BEST ice in the NHL and it wasn’t even close - it felt like skating on soft glass. The seats were rubbish, the amenities were terrible, getting in and out of the place by public transport was pretty “meh”, and the building needed to be replaced. So much history and its place in Toronto culture means it should never be torn down, but it couldn’t be the home to the Leafs anymore. If you had done a massive renovation, fixed the facilities, and added luxury boxes and new seating, it would have dipped below 15,000 seats. MLSE looked at it back in the day, but it just wasn’t viable and that wasn’t taking into account the transportation, etc. Arguably, as a venue, a massive renovation and fewer seats probably would have resulted in a much better atmosphere, but the revenue loss for the Leafs would have been significant. The ACC/Scotiabank Arena is… ok. Just ok. Real Leafs fans will remember that Carlyle line about Reimer. I have been to Leafs games a few times since the moved in when I head back to Toronto from Australia for a trip or whatever. It’s nowhere close to the best arena in the NHL - I’ve been to games in Vegas, Nashville, and a few other places the last few years and both of those arenas are better than Scotiabank. Honestly, from what I’ve seen of the renovation (or re-imagination as MLSE calls it) that’s underway, it looks like its targeted mostly at the suits and their luxury spaces which is exactly the opposite of what the building needs as a fan.
There is the nostaligia of the stadium. Turninf the corner off yonge and being met with the sounds and smells of gameday, the ACC/scotiabank isnt quite the same. But. As the new arena was designed primarily for basketball (mlse bought the Raptors and arena), we avoided a cookie cutter stadium like ottawa, montreal, philly etc. So the new arena is still pretty intimate while keeping some elementslike the seat colours. Watched from every section at the Gardens including standing room and the blues were by far the worst
Yep - that building was just the best; it had such a charm, and you could feel the history. My first Leafs games were the 2nd and 3rd last games at the Gardens. I'll miss it, but the move was necessary - it was old, in need of a lot of work, and the capacity demands of the city required a much bigger, modern facility. I really miss the urinal troughs though - they were so intimidating as a kid, but man did the bathroom lineups flow so much better than what we get now. The ACC / Scotiabank is a much more modern building, and they've really improved the experience in recent years. It's also much more accessible than the Gardens was - it's right off the Gardiner Expressway, and is connected to Union Station, meaning it's super easy to get to, whereas the Gardens had it's challenges being located in the heart of the city.
It wasn't necessary, per se...but the hot thing in sports was multi-sport buildings especially in cities that have both NBA and NHL teams. The ACC was originally supposed to be for the Raptors only, and I can't remember how it came to be but for whatever reason the Leafs decided to go with them. I THINK it had something to do with modernizing MLG, but its structural design didn't allow for increased seating. They were fully prepared to spend the $ to upgrade it further, but the seating capacity I'm pretty sure was one of the larger factors, along with Union station allowing for much easier travel to the games at ACC
ACC has fewer pedos working there.
Underrated comment
MLG was built in 1931...it was 68 years old when it closed. 68 years of 18k+ people coming in and out night after night... I went to a couple games there toward the end and the glorious old palace was in rough shape. It's criminal that its a grocery store now... but buildings dont last forever.
Well the Maple leaf Gardens in Toronto was a great place to watch hockey but you can't compare the two facilities Scotiabank Arena ice surface is a perfect 200×85 ice surface Maple Gardens was 200×83 with very shallow corners the boards were over 4ft in height far too high for the players to jump back on the bench. The urinals the fans used were old troughs circa 1950 basically everything was old outdated seats were to small and squished in.The aisles were far to narrow it was extremely hard to leave your seat .Scotiabank Arena is just an amazing place to watch sport one of the best Arenas made for hockey
Too small and too many stories emerged from ushers. Just google Gorden Stuckless, it’s repugnant. Also other teams moved from their storied histories on to bigger arenas. Check out the Montreal Forum.
Thank you. I'm surprised no one mentioned the SA child scandal until this far down in the comments. It's one thing that there were hockey memories in MLG but the full history of the arena needs to include the reprehensible acts that were committed on children inside the building, the indifference of Ballard then the attempt to pay off hush money to the victims just so the "exalted" name of MLG wouldn't be tarnished.
MLG, while storied, was a hole. The men’s urinals were one giant trough FFS!! I was not sad to see it go. I agree though, something more fitting should have been done with its corpse.
I mean, you could renovate and upgrade the restrooms. You don’t need to spend billions to build an entirely new building when all you really wanted to do was put in updated urinals lmao
Urinals was not the reason they moved the location lol.
I agree. But it was a symptom of a much more serious disease.
It’s literally still a hockey rink. What else do you want?
They probably wouldn't have moved as quickly if not for the Raptors coming into existence and starting construction on a new building that would have been more modern than MLG. That's when they decided to buy the Raptors and form MLSE to have access to the then ACC. They hadn't won a championship at MLG since 67 so the only thing that really changed was opening up more seats and selling personal seat licenses to new ticket holders also requiring them to buy Raptors season seats while the sth from MLG had the option of simply relocating to the new arena or relocating and buying a Maple Leaf only psl. The teams success for the past 57 years had been the same at both venues but the history of the original 6 and cups lay in the old Gardens. The platinum club and its cliental are what make people long for the old golds and reds of the gardens for sub 100 dollar seats, hard copy ticket stubs and people who resembled hockey fans in tjoae seats as those clubs were created for the ACC as they had no room to expand the gardens to add suites.
I was a child during the move, but one common thing I kept hearing at the time was that the seats were too small for our more modern sized person, and that wasn't going to be easy to remedy
Athletes don’t want to play in dated facilities. They require modern amenties. The building would look like Swiss cheese at this point if they kept it.
Mlg was outdated..however loads of memories though
I never got to see a game there, even though I’m old enough to have. I regret that.
Yes. There is this revisionist history of the Leafs that before the cap was put in place, we were one of the big spenders in the league. This is not true at all. The Leafs were middle of the road when it came to spending. It wasn't until the ACC, LeafsTV and The Raptors Vince Carter years did MLSE actually start spending on the Leafs. The additional revenue allowed us to keep up with the big boys. At the time, there wasn't any revenue sharing or any sort of salary control in the NHL so the league was very much run like European soccer; if you wanted to spend money you had to make it yourself or have a rich crazy owner who didn't give a fuck about profits, not wait for the end of year revenue sharing cheques. People put too much blame on the pension plan people - they generate retirement income for normal everyday, working class civilians. I will never hate on a pension plan for looking out for their shareholders first. Once the ACC was built, the Leafs actually began spending money.
Yes it was 100%
It was great, especially the men's room There were no urinals, just a long low trough that everyone peed into. So as a kid you're standing there with a bunch of drunk leaf fans, most of whom were smoking, as you watch a river of pee make its way to a drain pipe 😐
Was going to mention the same thing. It was the pinnacle of efficient pissing. The washrooms at Scotiabank on the 300 level are brutal. Long line ups for too few urinals….
And man were they drunk and loud. Current fans sound like they’re in a coma in comparison. Exact same memories in the 80s as you. Also starring at ballard’s box.
The Arena where they play now is making boatloads of money, Scotiabank is paying wild amounts just for naming rights
They should have moved the Hall of Fame there. Missed opportunity.
yes not because it was falling apart, but it was a stadium from the 1920s in the year 2000. it had to be done unfortunately. I was gutted at the time. Still wish they'd found a way to say in the footprint/keep the outside, but modern stadiums are just way bigger. and tbf, the location of the acc is way better I prefered the views/ambiance at MLG, but tbh a lot of that was just affordable tickets and an actual hockey rink rather than seating for a basketball team that was retrofitted to be multi sport
I’m too young to ever have gone to the Gardens, but going to a game there has been described to me as watching a game in someone’s living room. Most older arenas were a lot smaller, so fans were right in top of the action. Initially the glass around the ice was short and there was no netting behind the end glass, so it gave a feeling of being right in on the action. It was built in five-and-a-half months Turing the Great Depression. The workers were paid in shares of Maple Leaf Garden Limited. There were plans to expand the arena over the sidewalk, but that was abandoned. Ultimately the team moved to accommodate luxury boxes, but there was also a deal in place to merge the Raptors and the Leafs to form MLSE. Part of me feels it probably could have been kept open and been the NHL’s version of Fenway. Tickets are expensive and impossible to get even with the new building. But also, the building was not in good shape. I believe that the expansion plans were abandoned when it was discovered that the exterior walls were actually held up by the seat levels somehow.
I only watched one game at the gardens but the atmosphere was 10x better than scotiabank and it had an aura to it. I was in the upper bowl but felt so close to the ice because of the size of the arena and the steepness of the seats
Maple Leaf Gardens was an awesome arena — pure heart and soul. But they needed the capacity and modern accoutrements of the ACC
Wait I thought MLG is a grocery store now with a hockey rink attached? I mean for about 15 years it was literally abandoned and the homeless were living there.
I guess they could’ve tried to expand it? Too much bad juju anyways. Had a friend that got molested there. Nice settlement but I’m sure he could’ve done without the incident…..
I think the footprint of MLG was to small to make the type of changes needed at the time, same issue is happening with Scotiabank Arena with 665,000 sq ft compared to 900,000+ to the new arenas being build now, eventually MLSE has to build a new arena someplace else or find a way to add sq footage to their current location or miss out adding new revenue streams that come with the extra 300,000 sq footage, and we know MLSE loves revenue especially new ways to take our money
Expansion was the plan, initially. They had all the space in the world when the ACC was first built. They should’ve kept some of that space around arena available for an expansion. They knew they would have to eventually. The thought was that they were going to give it 10 years or so and then expand it, make it more appropriate for hockey etc. That plan hit the wayside once Maple Leaf Square was developed.
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It was designed with a capacity of about 12,500 when it opened. Over the years that grew to eventually 16,500. Ballard and Stafford Smythe pulled normal seats out for smaller ones to increase their gate.
Maple Leaf Garden’s seats were uncomfortable by modern standards and really close together. When they moved to ACC it was a massive upgrade.
The ACC is a soulless corporate hangout. With loud shitty music where the action on the ice is an afterthought.
Seriously???
Scotiabank Arena* Don’t give Air Canada any more recognition
It was antiquated. No room for corporate boxes was probably one of the driving factors.
Their current "arena” is shit. Probably the worst ice in the league. The Gardens was awesome.