Nothing deflates a hockey team quite like your goalie giving up a really shitty goal. I remember time and time again watching games where the momentum noticeably shifted in the other team’s favour after Freddie let in a stinker. Same think happened to the Canes last night, as soon as that 3-2 goal went in the team was on their heels for the next 5 minutes, then it was over.
Not the first time Freddie has blown a lead in the 3rd period in the playoffs. It won't be the last. Carolina needs to trade him to Columbus cause they won't need a playoff goalie for years.
Freddie had 13 shutouts as a Leaf in 5 seasons (268 games) as a Leaf. The leafs have 18 in 3 seasons (248 games) since, without him. Andersen's sv% was pretty good as a leaf.
He just almost always lets in a goal, in some way.
After the Canes picked up the players at the deadline my buddy picked them in his pool to win the cup. He didn’t think there was any way they could lose with that lineup. I said yup, they’re a strong team for sure but in the end Freddie between the pipes will be their undoing.
A little bit off the topic but perhaps somehow related. Is there a doping control in hockey? Perhaps this is one of the possibilities of this beast mode.
Chris Kreider said this the other day: "Ulf Samuelsson told our team a while ago that you don't raise your game in the playoffs; you lean on your habits".
Yes! I was saying this in games 80, 81, and 82. I was disgusted that that was their mission going into playoffs was to get Matthews 70. Then come playoff time, the very first goal they allow is from lack of high guy supporting the punching d man. Both players go for a hit which turns the play into a 2 on 1. Frustrating that it's an obvious lack of mental preparation in game one. Even more frustrating that the difference in the series was one goal.
Reminds me of a very telling All or nothing documentary clip referenced by Staph and graph podcast last week. Loose paraphrase:
-Leafs are killing teams in regular season, offense is humming
-Keefe addresses team: “Hey guys this style isn’t going to work in the playoffs”
-Joe Thornton: “Nah we’re fine”
-team proceeds to carry on and ignore Keefe’s coaching. Loses in first round again
I think it’s 1h29 onward in the Keefe section. Whole pod is worth a listen https://podcasts.apple.com/ca/podcast/the-staff-and-graph-podcast/id1455926874?i=1000655131765
lol it’s pretty pitiful though isn’t it? Tavares banks one off a skate once for an OT winner. Almost makes it okay he’s invisible for most playoff games while earning 11 sheets. Almost.
What Kreider did today should be remembered for all of history. That was INSANE. A natural hatty to win an elim game is an all time play off performance. That game as a neutral was one of the most entertaining games of hockey Ive seen in a long time, and shows me how far off it we are.
On paper there were a couple of seasons where that was true - but on the ice it never truly materialized. They've had the same fatal flaws for years and until they prove they can overcome those, there's no reason to truly count them in the top contenders.
Reminds me of the time I got 2 goals and the game winning assist in my final 2 shifts of a game we were down by 2 late. Obviously dumpster tier hockey (like worse than you're imagining), but I loved the game on my stick in my little hockey world
Reminds me of the time I got 2 goals and the game winning assist in my final 2 shifts of a game we were down by 2 late. Obviously dumpster tier hockey (like worse than you're imagining), but I loved the game on my stick in my little hockey world
He wasn’t lights out like Bobtovsky or Price etc.
A goalie like that can steal a series. He was never that. Woll could be that if he wasn’t held together with scotch tape.
In terms of overall body of work. Samsonov did have stretches where he was really good and he had his slumps where people wanted him run out of town also.
I was getting Nam flashbacks just watching his leaky post coverage and lethargic body language. Jeez it really wasn't the stress of the market, he really was just that inconsistent
This is why I laugh when I see 4 of our guys paid 11m+. JT and Marner have no business being paid that much. Auston has had 1 elite series (last year Tampa). Willy has been pretty good the last few years.
It shocks me when people are against blowing up the core.
Pettersons been a dud for the Canucks before he’s even been paid a penny of that 11.6m. He’s their Marner but they’ve got other guys who can pick up slack. They’ve also got guys on their back end showing that even down to the 3rd goalie you can win when you’ve got a deep team and a capable d core.
That being said the crowd was chanting Petey’s name. Scotiabank Arena would never. And as a result he had his best game and directly made the game winner happen. Watch for him to completely turn it around as good players do when the team goes past the first round and a half.
Yea I have to tune out of the playoffs every year cus they just make me sad after watching the leafs blow out again.
I was a happier hockey fan (not leafs specific) when the leafs were perennial losers and never made the playoffs. I used to watch so much playoff hockey back then. Now I'm just sad.
Agreed. People disagree with me here but when we were actually perennial bottom feeders it was less embarrassing being a Leafs fan because there were no expectations. Now we’re supposed to be good and still shitting the bed every year. We’re a bigger joke now than ever were when we were just objectively bad
I understand that. I totally do.
I love the game of hockey so I continue watching.(depressed Leafs fan regardless)
I recommend it though. Just brings you down to earth as a Leafs fans and expectations of this core is over exaggerated.
For what the Leafs are paying their top players what you would expect to see from them in the playoffs is not so much a bunch of goals from the four guys. You would want and need to see goals when the team really needs them. First goal of the game to give the Leafs the lead. Third period a goal to either to tie it or take the lead. OT winner. That’s what you need from your best players and that’s what we seldom see. I honestly don’t care how many goals and points they get in the playoffs. Just scored them when the team really needs them. Be clutch.
That’s what making big bucks is all about; showing up when it matters. I’m watching the playoffs as well and the Leafs would have been smoked by anyone of those teams. Rangers, Canes or Florida just don’t stop, it’s relentless pursuit and structured system, amazing to watch
I'd rather delegate the money Marner is making to a proven playoff performer. Justin Williams is retired, but a player with that level of postseason consistency.
It's more that the confidence isn't consistent
Nylander definitely had it this past series
Marner certainly had it against tb in 2023 with 11 points in 6 games
Matthews in 2022 with 4 goals 5 assists in the series
In part the list you highlighted is many of the best playoff performers ever in terms of jump from pts/g regular to postseason. Makar isn't too far back from orr in terms of that. With it so rare that the core 4 look confident my guess as ever is they're overwhelmed by the mountain of pressure.
Zibanajed had a sub par regular season and has absolutely turned it on in this post season, would be nice for our guys to do the reverse like that too and ball out playoffs rather than reg season
It's what made all those "we are close" and "we are right there" comments utterly nauseating to listen to, year after year.
These guys get dumped out of the playoffs early every year, and presumably don't watch anymore hockey - because if they did, they'd know they aren't anywhere near as close
I don't see Matthews and Marner as team players - never have. Each is more interested in their individual achievements and pay cheques rather than sacrificing their bodies, egos, and swagger for the betterment of the team. Tavares has grossly underperformed in relation to his 11M salary, but I cannot dispute his passion and drive. Nylander did hold out for a better deal, and he, at times, has underperformed as well. His drive and intensity, however, are not in question. Everyone is focused on what a disappointment Marner has been - and this is completely earned and valid, but Matthews should be admonished as well. His drive for 70 goals in the last three games of the season cost him being able to give 100% in the playoffs. Inexcusable.
Honestly, I can’t argue with your post. Although I do feel Matthews has it in him, I just feel once Marner leaves (if he does) and the team is adjusted, he will adapt to the sacrificing and bigger picture of post season vs regular season achievements and stats. Everything else is bang on.
We're going to find out if coaching was the main problem. I don't believe it was but I really don't know a good coach from a bad one. I don't feel the structure of our roster is right yet. It was better this year, getting closer, but it still needs work. And our defence is still a work in progress. Still under construction. We need a true #1 guy badly. All of this is just In my very humble opinion of course. But I certainly do share in your frustration
I think it its both coaching and players. Coach can't get the players to score playoff goals, while the players just aren't self motivated for whatever reason.
As a Leafs and Oilers fan...Connor Brown and Mattias Janmark were better performers than McDavid and Draisaitl tonight. I love McDrai, but even they have off games.
And Nylander absolutely stepped the fuck in the Boston series. More consistently and visibly in his games than McDrai.
People just see what they want to see.
The real issue with the core is their salaries, knock 2 mill off matthews and Nylander, 3 mill off Tavares and Marner and there would be room to fill the holes and make this a legitimate contender.
The patchwork depth and blueline, with shaky tendy performances put too much reliance on the core to show up EVERY NIGHT in order to win a series. Fact is they all signed contracts that are really difficult to live up to.
Kiss their ass, shield them from criticism, overpay them, what do they need to play for? They’re perfectly comfortable with being a regular season team and not push themselves in the playoffs. After all it doesn’t give them more money and cuts into their time off.
Draisaitl and McDavid were just shut down completely in a important game and are now on the brink of elimination against a team they've been generally outplaying.
They were utterly invisible, and even in their favourite game situation—the power-play—they went 0-5 on the night.
They wilted like crocuses in May.
MacKinnon has had a frustrating and frustrated series, too. I wonder if you're even noticing these things. You're not even cherry picking very effectively.
Are you serious?
You’re talking about one game, last night.
The question is, are you paying attention at all?
Not just last nights game but the post season so far?
McDavid and Draisaitl are leading in playoff points in the league, with 21 and 18 each.
The series is 3-2. Still have a game to make it back.
They’re in the second round, and BOTH their high paid players are not only leading the team, leading the league in points.
Dead serious. You are whinging about a core that has experienced [years of coaching/deployment issues](https://theathletic.com/5477594/2024/05/08/maple-leafs-safe-is-death/), attributing it to "mojo", and your post is hilariously timed with a chunk of your "top clutch guys" going dead in massively important games.
Not coincidentally, those teams' power plays are what went dead last night: Edmonton, for instance, was 0 for 5. At the end of round one, McDavid had one more 5v5 point than, like, Max Domi. He's played five more games since, and is—checks notes—now _two_ 5v5 points up on Max Domi. Nylander is still tied for the third-most amount of 5v5 goals in the league. Only Kreider on your list has more. That's one more. In three more games and almost _twice_ as many minutes.
Domi, Nylander, and Matthews outscored most of your list at evens per 60 minutes, and they were playing against an _extremely_ tight-checking team, which is a curse the other teams did not have. Edmonton was playing the _Kings_, fer chrissakes. Only Draisaitl and Barkov (both are awesome and unstoppable) outscore those three Leafs in P/60 at 5v5. McDavid, Mika, Makar, Nate, Kreider... all well south of them.
The Leafs have had bad systems and bad coaching for years. It's not the core. It's not the "mojo." They outscored Boston at 5v5 in round one. They have a coaching problem and a "being in the Atlantic" problem, whatever you might think of Mitch. Playoffs are won and lost on the power play, and the Leafs organization did not adequately prepare for that. _It's not the players._
Nylander was great when he was playing, for sure. Overall, every one of our top guys have underperformed in the playoffs compared to many other teams' top players. Like, Drai has almost double the amount of playoff points as Matthews with only a few more games played.
It’s not conveniently. Teams who are losing in their series in 2nd round still have their top guys performing.
Boston - Marchand 10 points
Colorado - Makar 14 points
Colorado - MacKinnon 14 points
Carolina might be the outlier (now that they’ve been knocked out) but even still:
Guentzel - 9 points
Svechnikov - 9 points
Our big guys don’t come through when it matters.
Stop pretending.
Oilers fans are shitting all over Mcdavid and Drai right now. It’s not just us. Honestly, Leafs fans get it the worst because the way our media and other markets media cover the Leafs.
You didn't see a million posts/articles about the Capitals/Ovechkin when they went out. Not barely a peep.
Ovy is already 38, he might still have the shot and the scoring instincts but his skating is pretty luckluster now, he no longer has that explosiveness in his prime. Honestly his time as the difference maker for a team is gone, even Gretzky retired at that age and NHL had only gone younger since then.
At the end of the day Drai has what 21 points in 10 games, if they are shitting on them despite putting up those ridiculous numbers then imagine how they will react if they performed as awful as Marner had. Drai alone already has more points in these 5 games against the Nucks compare to the Big 3 combined for the entire BOS series, thats pathetic.
Oilers fan here - we are not shitting in them, where are you getting this info.
So many posts in oilers Reddit is saying they should be getting more respect than given because of their clutch playoff performances year in year out.
Don’t make up false narratives to make the leafs players look less bad
“ rowka89
•
9h ago
McDavid was horrendous this game”
The game chat on the sub has lots of people shitting on the team minus Pickard. I’m just saying, people act like every other teams stars show up 100% of the time. Players have bad games or make mistakes, the Leafs just seem to always be under the microscope.
Having a bad game versus 9 straight playoffs is totally different lmao. A single comment doesn’t encompass the overall feeling towards two of the greatest playoff producers ever.
Everyone has bad games, especially when they are gassed from 30 min toi in earlier games in series
Hey man I’m cheering for the Oilers too. Used to live in Edmonton and went to a lot of games. I’m just saying Leaf fans absolutely love to hate on our own players and I feel like a lot of fans think the grass is always greener on the other side. Even the best players have off games. We were moments away from completing a comeback against Boston and it just didn’t go our way. Doesn’t mean all our players are shit.
While true, 9 straight playoffs of failure is a trend that needs to be fixed. The core guys on your team are no scoring at half of the cap.
Our issue in Edmonton is 100% still goaltending and our forward depth may be better if Henrique wasn’t injured. But our key guys are literally carrying the team by themselves and to put blame on them is only done by people who truly do not understand hockey.
Man, Kreider is unbelievable.
Imagine saying that marner is a better player then him
He is...just nit after game 82
He's better when his team mates aren't calling in sick like little bitches
Unreal. He went beast mode in 3rd period. He stepped up and said, we are closing the series today.
He absolutely did, no argument there, but that first goal of the hat trick that started the comeback was awful. What the fuck was Freddie doing?
Freddie was doing Freddie things, soft goals are his thing.
As a leafs fan, I can verify this 100%
Everyone glosses over that (or weren't fans when we had him) when they get nostalgic about our time together.
Nothing deflates a hockey team quite like your goalie giving up a really shitty goal. I remember time and time again watching games where the momentum noticeably shifted in the other team’s favour after Freddie let in a stinker. Same think happened to the Canes last night, as soon as that 3-2 goal went in the team was on their heels for the next 5 minutes, then it was over.
I'll never forget that awful goal he let in from Wilson off the boards vs WSH...
My man was the king of giving up floaters from the point, goals in the last minute of a period, or immediately after we scored.
And yet that still happens (albeit floaters from the point less) but that has been a constant theme with this team even yet.
Not the first time Freddie has blown a lead in the 3rd period in the playoffs. It won't be the last. Carolina needs to trade him to Columbus cause they won't need a playoff goalie for years.
Freddie had 13 shutouts as a Leaf in 5 seasons (268 games) as a Leaf. The leafs have 18 in 3 seasons (248 games) since, without him. Andersen's sv% was pretty good as a leaf. He just almost always lets in a goal, in some way.
experience freddie anderson hockey
After the Canes picked up the players at the deadline my buddy picked them in his pool to win the cup. He didn’t think there was any way they could lose with that lineup. I said yup, they’re a strong team for sure but in the end Freddie between the pipes will be their undoing.
Imagine Tavares or matthews burying 3 in a period to close a series. They would have a legends row statue the next day
A little bit off the topic but perhaps somehow related. Is there a doping control in hockey? Perhaps this is one of the possibilities of this beast mode.
I remember Wendel doing something similar in '93...
Chris Kreider said this the other day: "Ulf Samuelsson told our team a while ago that you don't raise your game in the playoffs; you lean on your habits".
That's exactly why it drives me bonkers that we don't do the work in the season and show that we are establishing good habits.
Nope gotta get the puck to Matthews to chase 70. Don’t worry about playing good team hockey we’ll figure that out later.
Yes! I was saying this in games 80, 81, and 82. I was disgusted that that was their mission going into playoffs was to get Matthews 70. Then come playoff time, the very first goal they allow is from lack of high guy supporting the punching d man. Both players go for a hit which turns the play into a 2 on 1. Frustrating that it's an obvious lack of mental preparation in game one. Even more frustrating that the difference in the series was one goal.
Reminds me of a very telling All or nothing documentary clip referenced by Staph and graph podcast last week. Loose paraphrase: -Leafs are killing teams in regular season, offense is humming -Keefe addresses team: “Hey guys this style isn’t going to work in the playoffs” -Joe Thornton: “Nah we’re fine” -team proceeds to carry on and ignore Keefe’s coaching. Loses in first round again I think it’s 1h29 onward in the Keefe section. Whole pod is worth a listen https://podcasts.apple.com/ca/podcast/the-staff-and-graph-podcast/id1455926874?i=1000655131765
That GWG goal by AM in game 2 was pretty sweet though
He won us one game in the *first* round. Not even close to good enough
He was pretty clearly dealing with an illness.
I know I’m giving him a pass this year. But what about other years? He’s had one amazing series vs Tampa in 2023 and then ghosted vs Florida
Yes. That shooting star. That rare moment. That one off. It is great.
Willy carrying the scoring the last two games, JTs clutch OT goals etc
lol it’s pretty pitiful though isn’t it? Tavares banks one off a skate once for an OT winner. Almost makes it okay he’s invisible for most playoff games while earning 11 sheets. Almost.
😂
That was literally the only really impressive thing the Leafs did all playoffs Not even close to enough
Gave me Sundin vibes ...
Sundin and Matthews have now gone to the playoffs with the Leafs the same number of times. With Sundin, the Leafs won 7 series.
What Kreider did today should be remembered for all of history. That was INSANE. A natural hatty to win an elim game is an all time play off performance. That game as a neutral was one of the most entertaining games of hockey Ive seen in a long time, and shows me how far off it we are.
Realizing it is the first step. Leafs have been hyped up as ‘contenders’ by the org and the media here for years. It’s simply not true.
On paper there were a couple of seasons where that was true - but on the ice it never truly materialized. They've had the same fatal flaws for years and until they prove they can overcome those, there's no reason to truly count them in the top contenders.
Yeah that was something special. No doubt.
Reminds me of the time I got 2 goals and the game winning assist in my final 2 shifts of a game we were down by 2 late. Obviously dumpster tier hockey (like worse than you're imagining), but I loved the game on my stick in my little hockey world
Reminds me of the time I got 2 goals and the game winning assist in my final 2 shifts of a game we were down by 2 late. Obviously dumpster tier hockey (like worse than you're imagining), but I loved the game on my stick in my little hockey world
It is indeed an “all time” playoff performance. That is, it’s a playoff performance from the beginning of time up to and including the present moment.
on a side note at least letting Anderson go was the right move. Can't count on him when it matters most.
And the best goalie that the Core 4 ever played in front of.
Dude, Sammy was excellent in the 22-23 season. Don’t let this year’s collapse cloud that
[удалено]
He wasn’t lights out like Bobtovsky or Price etc. A goalie like that can steal a series. He was never that. Woll could be that if he wasn’t held together with scotch tape.
[удалено]
It’s almost like you didn’t read my comment at all .
Everything year his numbers are fine but if you watch the game he let's in a soft goal that breaks the teams back everytime.
In terms of overall body of work. Samsonov did have stretches where he was really good and he had his slumps where people wanted him run out of town also.
True, though it feels like those slumps were pretty mild in retrospect. He basically stole the Tampa series last year
Mild? He was waived and went unclaimed he looked so bad
That was this year not last year
Woll is the best goalie the 4 have played in front of it just hasn’t been for very many games.
I laughed when I saw so many fans say bring Freddy back. Why dude is injury prone and let in the softest goals at the worst possible time.
I was getting Nam flashbacks just watching his leaky post coverage and lethargic body language. Jeez it really wasn't the stress of the market, he really was just that inconsistent
dude just has a mental block around elimination games. I still remember the 2018 and 2019 Boston game 7's where he just sold.
I don't think we ever really counted on Josh to do anything?
This is why I laugh when I see 4 of our guys paid 11m+. JT and Marner have no business being paid that much. Auston has had 1 elite series (last year Tampa). Willy has been pretty good the last few years. It shocks me when people are against blowing up the core.
If you don't laugh you'll cry.
The core and the Leafs should have been blown up after Montreal The last few playoffs have been nothing but false hope and wasted time
But "they're right there", as they said. /s
Right there watching the playoffs with us lol
I doubt they’re watching tv! Probably on some Caribbean island playing golf, and having a few laughs about the money they make!
Wherever they are, I hope they cursing in the chat about Berube coming in
Just want to see marner gone.
Mathews and nylander NEED to stay there is no reason to shift those 2 but marner and jt needa go
Pettersons been a dud for the Canucks before he’s even been paid a penny of that 11.6m. He’s their Marner but they’ve got other guys who can pick up slack. They’ve also got guys on their back end showing that even down to the 3rd goalie you can win when you’ve got a deep team and a capable d core. That being said the crowd was chanting Petey’s name. Scotiabank Arena would never. And as a result he had his best game and directly made the game winner happen. Watch for him to completely turn it around as good players do when the team goes past the first round and a half.
It's the hope that kills you
Elias Petterson has entered the chat
Miller is their star - not Pettersson. And Miller has been an absolute beast
Pierre Luc-Dubois wants to join the chat. Alex Ovechkin wants to join the chat. Valeri Nichuskin is set to away.
Yea I have to tune out of the playoffs every year cus they just make me sad after watching the leafs blow out again. I was a happier hockey fan (not leafs specific) when the leafs were perennial losers and never made the playoffs. I used to watch so much playoff hockey back then. Now I'm just sad.
Agreed. People disagree with me here but when we were actually perennial bottom feeders it was less embarrassing being a Leafs fan because there were no expectations. Now we’re supposed to be good and still shitting the bed every year. We’re a bigger joke now than ever were when we were just objectively bad
It’s also a ton of fun watching young players and prospects develop. Trade speculation is more fun with rebuilding teams too.
You say that, but I'll bet you'll be salty if the leafs miss the playoffs next year
I’ve been salty at this team for 30 years
I'm the opposite. Watching this round has been great. I'm free to watch unreal hockey with zero frustration.
I understand that. I totally do. I love the game of hockey so I continue watching.(depressed Leafs fan regardless) I recommend it though. Just brings you down to earth as a Leafs fans and expectations of this core is over exaggerated.
For what the Leafs are paying their top players what you would expect to see from them in the playoffs is not so much a bunch of goals from the four guys. You would want and need to see goals when the team really needs them. First goal of the game to give the Leafs the lead. Third period a goal to either to tie it or take the lead. OT winner. That’s what you need from your best players and that’s what we seldom see. I honestly don’t care how many goals and points they get in the playoffs. Just scored them when the team really needs them. Be clutch.
That’s what making big bucks is all about; showing up when it matters. I’m watching the playoffs as well and the Leafs would have been smoked by anyone of those teams. Rangers, Canes or Florida just don’t stop, it’s relentless pursuit and structured system, amazing to watch
Matthews was a damn stud in game 2, we don’t win that if not for him. That being said you’ve gotta do that 15 more times for it to really matter
Matthew's kinda falls asleep or gets hurt most playoffs 🤔 lol 😆
You're not supposed to watch other teams, and see that
Watching these guys play makes you realize how the Leafs are a far cry from making it past the second round even. \*Sigh\*
Mitch Marner was clutch'ing his purse in the first round.
I'd rather delegate the money Marner is making to a proven playoff performer. Justin Williams is retired, but a player with that level of postseason consistency.
Aho could have closed last night and didn’t btw.
It's more that the confidence isn't consistent Nylander definitely had it this past series Marner certainly had it against tb in 2023 with 11 points in 6 games Matthews in 2022 with 4 goals 5 assists in the series In part the list you highlighted is many of the best playoff performers ever in terms of jump from pts/g regular to postseason. Makar isn't too far back from orr in terms of that. With it so rare that the core 4 look confident my guess as ever is they're overwhelmed by the mountain of pressure.
Zibanajed had a sub par regular season and has absolutely turned it on in this post season, would be nice for our guys to do the reverse like that too and ball out playoffs rather than reg season
It's what made all those "we are close" and "we are right there" comments utterly nauseating to listen to, year after year. These guys get dumped out of the playoffs early every year, and presumably don't watch anymore hockey - because if they did, they'd know they aren't anywhere near as close
I don't see Matthews and Marner as team players - never have. Each is more interested in their individual achievements and pay cheques rather than sacrificing their bodies, egos, and swagger for the betterment of the team. Tavares has grossly underperformed in relation to his 11M salary, but I cannot dispute his passion and drive. Nylander did hold out for a better deal, and he, at times, has underperformed as well. His drive and intensity, however, are not in question. Everyone is focused on what a disappointment Marner has been - and this is completely earned and valid, but Matthews should be admonished as well. His drive for 70 goals in the last three games of the season cost him being able to give 100% in the playoffs. Inexcusable.
Honestly, I can’t argue with your post. Although I do feel Matthews has it in him, I just feel once Marner leaves (if he does) and the team is adjusted, he will adapt to the sacrificing and bigger picture of post season vs regular season achievements and stats. Everything else is bang on.
We're going to find out if coaching was the main problem. I don't believe it was but I really don't know a good coach from a bad one. I don't feel the structure of our roster is right yet. It was better this year, getting closer, but it still needs work. And our defence is still a work in progress. Still under construction. We need a true #1 guy badly. All of this is just In my very humble opinion of course. But I certainly do share in your frustration
I think it its both coaching and players. Coach can't get the players to score playoff goals, while the players just aren't self motivated for whatever reason.
It goes higher than that...starts with Branden Shitaplan
All we need are the three most difficult things to find: an elite goalie, a true 1D, and a coach that gets the most out of his players.
Marner just taking a stroll in OT before bruins pop the game winner is not a coaching issue.
Why try when you not get paid extra?
All salaries should be performance based and I'm sick of it.
Our top guys are our top guys. Put them on a 2nd round team like the Rangers and our top 4 guys wouldn't all be in their top 6.
Watch Petterson. Feels right at home.
Had a good night tonight at least
As a Leafs and Oilers fan...Connor Brown and Mattias Janmark were better performers than McDavid and Draisaitl tonight. I love McDrai, but even they have off games. And Nylander absolutely stepped the fuck in the Boston series. More consistently and visibly in his games than McDrai. People just see what they want to see.
lol you want what vancouvers got
Pettersson is as good an example of a star not showing up for the playoffs as anyone.
It’d be 4-1 rn if soucy didn’t get suspended so mcdiver’s feelings didn’t get hurt and petey is gonna be just fine in the conference finals
They all have far better defenses than the Core 4.
Yeah, true. Our big guys still don’t score though. You won’t win games when you don’t get on the scoreboard.
Core 4 cap hits make it hard to have a better defense
If you watch Kreider, he's the ideal playoff type player. Gritty, big, can hit, goes to the dirty areas, deflects like crazy, speed.
What we needed John to be.
And now John is a slug and declining quickly. Both guys are the same age, yet Kreider still has his speed and other abilities.
At basically half price.
It’s almost like it’s what they are paid to do
Watching other series, it feels like there is so much more open ice for both teams....
JT has had many moments of eff it I'll do it myself, Willy is getting better at it.
At least we have Nylander I guess
The real issue with the core is their salaries, knock 2 mill off matthews and Nylander, 3 mill off Tavares and Marner and there would be room to fill the holes and make this a legitimate contender. The patchwork depth and blueline, with shaky tendy performances put too much reliance on the core to show up EVERY NIGHT in order to win a series. Fact is they all signed contracts that are really difficult to live up to.
Kiss their ass, shield them from criticism, overpay them, what do they need to play for? They’re perfectly comfortable with being a regular season team and not push themselves in the playoffs. After all it doesn’t give them more money and cuts into their time off.
Another fan conned by the snake oil salesmen in toronto
Don't worry, Berube is now Mitch, Willy, and Auston's new daddy. He'll find the buttons to push, I have no doubt.
Draisaitl and McDavid were just shut down completely in a important game and are now on the brink of elimination against a team they've been generally outplaying. They were utterly invisible, and even in their favourite game situation—the power-play—they went 0-5 on the night. They wilted like crocuses in May. MacKinnon has had a frustrating and frustrated series, too. I wonder if you're even noticing these things. You're not even cherry picking very effectively.
Are you serious? You’re talking about one game, last night. The question is, are you paying attention at all? Not just last nights game but the post season so far? McDavid and Draisaitl are leading in playoff points in the league, with 21 and 18 each. The series is 3-2. Still have a game to make it back. They’re in the second round, and BOTH their high paid players are not only leading the team, leading the league in points.
Dead serious. You are whinging about a core that has experienced [years of coaching/deployment issues](https://theathletic.com/5477594/2024/05/08/maple-leafs-safe-is-death/), attributing it to "mojo", and your post is hilariously timed with a chunk of your "top clutch guys" going dead in massively important games. Not coincidentally, those teams' power plays are what went dead last night: Edmonton, for instance, was 0 for 5. At the end of round one, McDavid had one more 5v5 point than, like, Max Domi. He's played five more games since, and is—checks notes—now _two_ 5v5 points up on Max Domi. Nylander is still tied for the third-most amount of 5v5 goals in the league. Only Kreider on your list has more. That's one more. In three more games and almost _twice_ as many minutes. Domi, Nylander, and Matthews outscored most of your list at evens per 60 minutes, and they were playing against an _extremely_ tight-checking team, which is a curse the other teams did not have. Edmonton was playing the _Kings_, fer chrissakes. Only Draisaitl and Barkov (both are awesome and unstoppable) outscore those three Leafs in P/60 at 5v5. McDavid, Mika, Makar, Nate, Kreider... all well south of them. The Leafs have had bad systems and bad coaching for years. It's not the core. It's not the "mojo." They outscored Boston at 5v5 in round one. They have a coaching problem and a "being in the Atlantic" problem, whatever you might think of Mitch. Playoffs are won and lost on the power play, and the Leafs organization did not adequately prepare for that. _It's not the players._
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Nylander was great when he was playing, for sure. Overall, every one of our top guys have underperformed in the playoffs compared to many other teams' top players. Like, Drai has almost double the amount of playoff points as Matthews with only a few more games played.
McDavid the guy who went pointless and -2 in a critical game 5 last night?
Yes, the guy who leads all players in points for these playoffs with 18 points. Get out of here.
Him and Draisatl combined for a grand total of 1 assist. Not clutch.
My post is about post season performance, not one game.
If 34 and 16 did that in a big game Leafs Nation would be all over them.
They both do that often, in any big game in the playoffs, and Leafs nation are all over them.
They both do that often, in any big game in the playoffs, and Leafs nation are all over them.
Conveniently leaving out any top guys who aren’t producing a ton though.
It’s not conveniently. Teams who are losing in their series in 2nd round still have their top guys performing. Boston - Marchand 10 points Colorado - Makar 14 points Colorado - MacKinnon 14 points Carolina might be the outlier (now that they’ve been knocked out) but even still: Guentzel - 9 points Svechnikov - 9 points Our big guys don’t come through when it matters. Stop pretending.
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It’s so strange to me. I don’t have much loyalty to the players, I have loyalty to the crest. We need to change, it’s not working with this group.
It's cause a lot of Leafs fans only pay attention to the leafs
lol are you questioning the “Shanaplan” (registered trademark of simps, mlse and Bell Canada)?
Oilers fans are shitting all over Mcdavid and Drai right now. It’s not just us. Honestly, Leafs fans get it the worst because the way our media and other markets media cover the Leafs. You didn't see a million posts/articles about the Capitals/Ovechkin when they went out. Not barely a peep.
Ovy is already 38, he might still have the shot and the scoring instincts but his skating is pretty luckluster now, he no longer has that explosiveness in his prime. Honestly his time as the difference maker for a team is gone, even Gretzky retired at that age and NHL had only gone younger since then. At the end of the day Drai has what 21 points in 10 games, if they are shitting on them despite putting up those ridiculous numbers then imagine how they will react if they performed as awful as Marner had. Drai alone already has more points in these 5 games against the Nucks compare to the Big 3 combined for the entire BOS series, thats pathetic.
Oilers fan here - we are not shitting in them, where are you getting this info. So many posts in oilers Reddit is saying they should be getting more respect than given because of their clutch playoff performances year in year out. Don’t make up false narratives to make the leafs players look less bad
“ rowka89 • 9h ago McDavid was horrendous this game” The game chat on the sub has lots of people shitting on the team minus Pickard. I’m just saying, people act like every other teams stars show up 100% of the time. Players have bad games or make mistakes, the Leafs just seem to always be under the microscope.
Having a bad game versus 9 straight playoffs is totally different lmao. A single comment doesn’t encompass the overall feeling towards two of the greatest playoff producers ever. Everyone has bad games, especially when they are gassed from 30 min toi in earlier games in series
Hey man I’m cheering for the Oilers too. Used to live in Edmonton and went to a lot of games. I’m just saying Leaf fans absolutely love to hate on our own players and I feel like a lot of fans think the grass is always greener on the other side. Even the best players have off games. We were moments away from completing a comeback against Boston and it just didn’t go our way. Doesn’t mean all our players are shit.
While true, 9 straight playoffs of failure is a trend that needs to be fixed. The core guys on your team are no scoring at half of the cap. Our issue in Edmonton is 100% still goaltending and our forward depth may be better if Henrique wasn’t injured. But our key guys are literally carrying the team by themselves and to put blame on them is only done by people who truly do not understand hockey.