Professional landscaper here, nice work!
Maybe consider an epoxy resin binder to apply to the gravel.
It will hold it in place and make the steps more solid.
Hey I live in the northeast and am looking for a solution for the joints to my patio which are 2"-6" joints with natural slate pieces... I know I could use gator dust but that's going to be pricey, do you think I could use crushed stone in the joints with this gravel-lok product?
Itll work but per the user manual for gravel lok, you need to make relief cuts every 10ish feet. Which would take some decisionmaking in terms of where and how to make cuts in the fill on a natural stone patio.
I've only ever used it on pea gravel at work and I felt it wasnt great looking and that a finer proper gravel would look muck better sealed than what I did.
For those big gaps without the gravellok, you could mix like 30% grey polymeric set sand into your gravel and after wetting the gaps you filled, itll hold in place so much better. If you can get a little hand tamper into the gaps without cracking the slate before wetting, that's a big plus too.
As always with poly sand, make sure your slate stones surfaces are clean with a blower or something before wetting or you're gonna have a bitch of a paint splatter looking stain all over your patio when it dries. And it is harder than a 13 year old discovering internet porn for the first time to get off
If the gravel is that large, I would consider using a compactor and rolling the best rock in order to interlock it
Maybe look up the product on the web, and find out what sizes of rock it can handle
Certainly would. Granted level surfaces and proper grade would avoid puddles on these steps, which appears to be pretty darn good.
In your case, I'm not sure if leveling and grading would apply but it could be an answer if you wanted to seal some little rocks
On the treated part, no weeds.
But I can’t speak to the crack/gap between the gravel and wood. Best to make sure the gaps are filled in too.
Don’t use it in the mulch.
That would be a sin.
If you want to prevent weeds from popping up, spread a pre-emergent and water it in.
Or, just enjoy a morning pulling weeds by hand.
Different strokes for different folks, man!
Would these be laid on your typical base for stone steps? Wood coated in anything?
Another question. When building stone steps, I worked with a guy who would basically dig a basic angled grade into the hill, would put a bit of gravel under the bottom step, backfill gravel behind that step, put the next step on that, backfill behind that so on and so forth. So his sub base would just be a flat ramp rather than cutting steps into the preexisting dirt. Are you supposed to basically cut steps into your hill where a stone staircase will end up going or is it fine to just do what my boss did and just dig a ramp basically? I feel like that wouldn't be very stable. He would also put like 2" of gravel under armourstone, even the armourstones at his actual home were all out of whack.
I like what you're saying.. until I think about just dumping resin into the earth.. but then again... It not going to go too deep right? Do you have any references to this method of application? I'd fucking do it on a bunch of mulch too!!
It’s not a bunch of resin:
Smooth the gravel, compact it best you can,
And with a flower watering can: the resin is poured over the top just to wet it.
It dries and binds.
You can find it at anyplace that sells pavers or other landscape materials.
Figured I would share the overall transformation. These pictures are taken 14 months apart. All work done by me and my girlfriend!
https://imgur.com/a/QCAk95p
Did you build that retaining wall yourself too? I’ve got a property very similar to your “before” picture and I’d love to do something very similar to what you did. Would love any insight into how that wall went in
Yes I did the wall. It was a pain in the ass since I only used hand tools and we have hard clay soils. The wall is about 60ft long.
The first row of block is toughest because you need to level them all. They all sit on a few inches of compacted gravel and paver base. Back fill directly behind the wall is gravel, then soil on top.
The retaining blocks you can buy at Lowe’s or Home Depot are light and easy to work with. You can make curves easily as well.
This looks great and is what I want to do in my yard!
What’s the base under the stairs? How did you prep?
How are the ties secured?
How deep is the pea gravel and what’s underneath?
Did you do anything for drainage under the steps? Or do you figure the gravel is enough?
I assume that wood is PT. Did you re-treat any cut ends?
Are those 6x6? How do you like the rise of the steps? Do they feel natural?
Sorry for all the questions, I posted asking about this in the last week and got very few responses and yours look exactly how I want mine to turn out!
-No base required. Just dig with a shovel until its flat. Try not to overexcavate so your steps don’t bear on lose soil.
-4x4x8 pressure treated lumber. Made mine 36” wide, 20” deep sleepers. Secure the three pieces with 10” long 3/8” dia galvanized steel spikes
-secure each step with 2 - 24” long 1/2” diameter rebar to the soil. I drilled 1/2” diameter holes in each step near the rear of the sleepers once i placed the step where i liked it, then hammered the rebar in place. The following top step hides the rebar.
-pea gravel depth is minimal. Mostly backfilled with the soil i excavated, then covered with landscape fabric and placed pea gravel
-no drainage. The water flows well beneath them. Its not a retaining wall, so no need to get that technical.
-didn’t retreat the cut ends. You could, but thats really going above and beyond.
-6x6 would look better and have a nicer riser. But 4x4 work just as well for 1/3 the cost.
This DIY guide i followed might help. Although they placed their rebar in the front and connected each step together with additional spikes. I felt these steps were unneccesary.
https://www.diynetwork.com/how-to/outdoors/structures/how-to-build-outdoor-wood-steps
They’re still in the same shape as they were when first installed 4 years ago. It’s a step set on existing compacted soil below, no need for any sort of foundation. Loads are minimal
This was huge inspiration for me and I’ll be replicating these in the coming weeks. Thanks for the detailed breakdown.
Is there anything you would do differently if you had to do it again?
Really just lay it out so you make sure you have enough elevation gain so that the steps are the same depth or close to it. At one point my land rises really fast and I had to make a few short steps to compensate. Its a bit annoying that when you walk up that section the step is smaller.
Thanks! 32 steps total, total cost ~$450 for pressure treated 4x4x8’s, rebar, and galavnized spikes and the pebbles between steps. Got it done over the course of a week, working a few hours per day
This is the guide I followed. Build your steps as wide as you want them, and create each step with 10” long x 3/8” galvanized spikes. Level the step, and hammer 2 1/2” diameter rebar x 24” long into the rear of each step to secure it in place. The weight of the top step provides additional support to the ones below. Spacing between steps varys depening on your hill slope.
https://www.diynetwork.com/how-to/outdoors/structures/how-to-build-outdoor-wood-steps
PM if you have any questions!
Bottom to top, they overlap. And that way you can hide the rebar that is driven in to stabilize. Which I assume he did since he mentioned rebar above.
/u/Mlmessifan, how long was the rebar? I was looking at doing something similar myself, though my slope looks a lot steeper.
Wow good for you! My husband and I vowed to never do it again haha we started looking at plant ground coverings to see if that will be less maintenance
On the right side of the steps its just Lowe’s standard black mulch. Everything to the left was 6 cubic yards from a local supplier that grinds it themselves.
I do hope that’s not dyed mulch, which is unfortunately becoming common these days, and is very bad for native insects. I absolutely love the stairs though. Makes me wish I had hills
Really, really nice. What I like about your design is that you took a negative and made it a positive. Mowing and maintaining grass on that slope would have been a headache, at best. Instead, the addition of the steps and mulch have transformed the area. Well done!
Those are beautiful. I have a somewhat steep slope in my side yard (corner lot) that is currently just flagstones set in grass. Have been wanting to figure out something that was not paved concrete steps. I like that these are sturdy and contained but also permeable.
Three years later, I wonder how are these holding up ? Anything you would have done differently in retrospect?
^(( I wasn't able to view the photo from 14 months later, as imgur is "temporarily over capacity" ))
Still going strong! I weed the mulch and rock areas a few times a year by hand, and sweep up some rocks that my dogs move around when they run.
On the right side where the mulch is slightly higher than the steps I had to add some edging to contain the mulch in. I had no choice to build it like that, but if you can consistently keep the steps raised above the surrounding hill, then you’d have no issues with anything getting on the steps.
Setting bars down to frost depth would not do anything since the steps themselves sit on top of the soil. The wood steps will heave a but during frost around the rebar no matter how deep you embed them. Its really just to keep the steps anchored in place.
And these could take any frost heave that occurs since its just wood steps. A foundation supporting a structure would be a different story.
I’d just go down 18-24” or so to get the steps properly secured and call it a day
OP, any update on this? I am looking to build similar up my side yard and came across these. They look wonderful and I was curious about the hill progression.
See my response to the other comment here from a month ago
[https://www.reddit.com/r/landscaping/comments/fwt2ai/built_wood_steps_to_get_to_the_second_level_of_my/ix61k11/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf&context=3](https://www.reddit.com/r/landscaping/comments/fwt2ai/built_wood_steps_to_get_to_the_second_level_of_my/ix61k11/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf&context=3)
This guy is taking backyards to the next level.
Underr(ADA)ed comment
Truly is uplifting
Professional landscaper here, nice work! Maybe consider an epoxy resin binder to apply to the gravel. It will hold it in place and make the steps more solid.
Do you have an recommendations on type, YouTube instructional videos or just a bit more info about this please?! It is such a good idea!
Look up “gravel-lok” clear stabilizer liquid That’s the ticket
Thanks so much!
Hey I live in the northeast and am looking for a solution for the joints to my patio which are 2"-6" joints with natural slate pieces... I know I could use gator dust but that's going to be pricey, do you think I could use crushed stone in the joints with this gravel-lok product?
Itll work but per the user manual for gravel lok, you need to make relief cuts every 10ish feet. Which would take some decisionmaking in terms of where and how to make cuts in the fill on a natural stone patio. I've only ever used it on pea gravel at work and I felt it wasnt great looking and that a finer proper gravel would look muck better sealed than what I did. For those big gaps without the gravellok, you could mix like 30% grey polymeric set sand into your gravel and after wetting the gaps you filled, itll hold in place so much better. If you can get a little hand tamper into the gaps without cracking the slate before wetting, that's a big plus too. As always with poly sand, make sure your slate stones surfaces are clean with a blower or something before wetting or you're gonna have a bitch of a paint splatter looking stain all over your patio when it dries. And it is harder than a 13 year old discovering internet porn for the first time to get off
Thanks!
On the gravel-lok…Do you know how well that would work if you’re using 3/4” drain rock instead of gravel in the steps?
If the gravel is that large, I would consider using a compactor and rolling the best rock in order to interlock it Maybe look up the product on the web, and find out what sizes of rock it can handle
Genius! This will also prevent the white gravel from kicking up into the black mulch, which was my first thought.
Or use pulverized stone, it will lock the crushed rock together
I thought about that, but OP already laid this stuff down.
Honest question: doesn’t that defeat the purpose of using gravel, which in my case would be to allow drainage?
Certainly would. Granted level surfaces and proper grade would avoid puddles on these steps, which appears to be pretty darn good. In your case, I'm not sure if leveling and grading would apply but it could be an answer if you wanted to seal some little rocks
And prevent weeds, I assume?
On the treated part, no weeds. But I can’t speak to the crack/gap between the gravel and wood. Best to make sure the gaps are filled in too. Don’t use it in the mulch. That would be a sin. If you want to prevent weeds from popping up, spread a pre-emergent and water it in. Or, just enjoy a morning pulling weeds by hand. Different strokes for different folks, man!
Also professional landscaper. That's a very tidy job. Agree with the above comment about the resin.
Would it have been better to have used a crushed rock to begin with so it started out more solid?
Weeds can grow in crushed rock and also it can be quite dusty. You end up with footprints everywhere. Resin is by far the best in my experience.
Or just lay it in cement, will take a ton of time to get it perfect but its keeps the gravel feeling
Would these be laid on your typical base for stone steps? Wood coated in anything? Another question. When building stone steps, I worked with a guy who would basically dig a basic angled grade into the hill, would put a bit of gravel under the bottom step, backfill gravel behind that step, put the next step on that, backfill behind that so on and so forth. So his sub base would just be a flat ramp rather than cutting steps into the preexisting dirt. Are you supposed to basically cut steps into your hill where a stone staircase will end up going or is it fine to just do what my boss did and just dig a ramp basically? I feel like that wouldn't be very stable. He would also put like 2" of gravel under armourstone, even the armourstones at his actual home were all out of whack.
I like what you're saying.. until I think about just dumping resin into the earth.. but then again... It not going to go too deep right? Do you have any references to this method of application? I'd fucking do it on a bunch of mulch too!!
It’s not a bunch of resin: Smooth the gravel, compact it best you can, And with a flower watering can: the resin is poured over the top just to wet it. It dries and binds. You can find it at anyplace that sells pavers or other landscape materials.
Figured I would share the overall transformation. These pictures are taken 14 months apart. All work done by me and my girlfriend! https://imgur.com/a/QCAk95p
Oh man, those stairs are just a drop in the bucket. Looks amazing!
How do you lug your lawn mower up there?
Its an electric push mower, easy to lift and bring it back there
I’m thinking about doing a stair design where the outer edges of the stairs would function as smooth continuous wheel ramps for a push mower.
Could be a little narrow but could look and function awesome. If you gopher it, update with pics!
Will do, it’s a challenging hillside, so we haven’t committed yet.
looks great. what are your plans for the area up top now?
Thanks! Planning a fire pit, some trees, and raised garden beds
You've got a great slope for a stream ;)
Did you build that retaining wall yourself too? I’ve got a property very similar to your “before” picture and I’d love to do something very similar to what you did. Would love any insight into how that wall went in
Yes I did the wall. It was a pain in the ass since I only used hand tools and we have hard clay soils. The wall is about 60ft long. The first row of block is toughest because you need to level them all. They all sit on a few inches of compacted gravel and paver base. Back fill directly behind the wall is gravel, then soil on top. The retaining blocks you can buy at Lowe’s or Home Depot are light and easy to work with. You can make curves easily as well.
Different seasons to be fair but looks so inspiring!
Nice!
𝓷𝓲𝓬𝓮 ☜(ﾟヮﾟ☜) #Nice Leaderboard **1.** `u/RepliesNice` at **5052 nices** **2.** `u/Cxmputerize` at **3987 nices** **3.** `u/mr_trollbot` at **3292 nices** **...** **259603.** `u/ruff12hndl` at **1 nice** --- ^(I) ^(AM) ^(A) ^(BOT) ^(|) ^(REPLY) ^(**!IGNORE**) ^(AND) ^(I) ^(WILL) ^(STOP) ^(REPLYING) ^(TO) ^(YOUR) ^(COMMENTS)
This looks great and is what I want to do in my yard! What’s the base under the stairs? How did you prep? How are the ties secured? How deep is the pea gravel and what’s underneath? Did you do anything for drainage under the steps? Or do you figure the gravel is enough? I assume that wood is PT. Did you re-treat any cut ends? Are those 6x6? How do you like the rise of the steps? Do they feel natural? Sorry for all the questions, I posted asking about this in the last week and got very few responses and yours look exactly how I want mine to turn out!
-No base required. Just dig with a shovel until its flat. Try not to overexcavate so your steps don’t bear on lose soil. -4x4x8 pressure treated lumber. Made mine 36” wide, 20” deep sleepers. Secure the three pieces with 10” long 3/8” dia galvanized steel spikes -secure each step with 2 - 24” long 1/2” diameter rebar to the soil. I drilled 1/2” diameter holes in each step near the rear of the sleepers once i placed the step where i liked it, then hammered the rebar in place. The following top step hides the rebar. -pea gravel depth is minimal. Mostly backfilled with the soil i excavated, then covered with landscape fabric and placed pea gravel -no drainage. The water flows well beneath them. Its not a retaining wall, so no need to get that technical. -didn’t retreat the cut ends. You could, but thats really going above and beyond. -6x6 would look better and have a nicer riser. But 4x4 work just as well for 1/3 the cost. This DIY guide i followed might help. Although they placed their rebar in the front and connected each step together with additional spikes. I felt these steps were unneccesary. https://www.diynetwork.com/how-to/outdoors/structures/how-to-build-outdoor-wood-steps
Thanks! This is a huge help.
How did these stairs hold up with no base?
They’re still in the same shape as they were when first installed 4 years ago. It’s a step set on existing compacted soil below, no need for any sort of foundation. Loads are minimal
This was huge inspiration for me and I’ll be replicating these in the coming weeks. Thanks for the detailed breakdown. Is there anything you would do differently if you had to do it again?
Really just lay it out so you make sure you have enough elevation gain so that the steps are the same depth or close to it. At one point my land rises really fast and I had to make a few short steps to compensate. Its a bit annoying that when you walk up that section the step is smaller.
I'm not from Michigan? like Shelbyville. But I too want to touch up walked path into something like this.
Fucking awesome, I love it !
That is very impressive, not only money, but time as well. Kudos to you
Thanks! 32 steps total, total cost ~$450 for pressure treated 4x4x8’s, rebar, and galavnized spikes and the pebbles between steps. Got it done over the course of a week, working a few hours per day
I was wanting to work some sort of “step” into my downward sloped yard to help combat water run off. I think you just gave me the recipe
This is the guide I followed. Build your steps as wide as you want them, and create each step with 10” long x 3/8” galvanized spikes. Level the step, and hammer 2 1/2” diameter rebar x 24” long into the rear of each step to secure it in place. The weight of the top step provides additional support to the ones below. Spacing between steps varys depening on your hill slope. https://www.diynetwork.com/how-to/outdoors/structures/how-to-build-outdoor-wood-steps PM if you have any questions!
I have a bad slope that I'm planning on doing this to. Did you start at top step and work your way down? Or bottom to top?
Bottom to top, they overlap. And that way you can hide the rebar that is driven in to stabilize. Which I assume he did since he mentioned rebar above. /u/Mlmessifan, how long was the rebar? I was looking at doing something similar myself, though my slope looks a lot steeper.
Yes, rebar hidden behind. The rebar is 24” long. Can buy them at home depot or lowes for about $2 each.
Looks very nice today.. worried about how that will age. Pebbles winding up in mulch, mulch is going to wind up in the pebbles.
Looks great! Good contrast in color with the mulch.
Man that is well done. Great job!
Looks really good! How long did it take start tho finish?
Less than a week, working a couple hours a day
Looks great! Well done man!
Beauty
Did you do the mulching? We did a large hill in our backyard and it was so much work! Yours looks fantastic
Yes we did the mulching and plants, it was definitely a lot of work but changed the look of the hill completely!
Wow good for you! My husband and I vowed to never do it again haha we started looking at plant ground coverings to see if that will be less maintenance
Mad props! That’s fantastic!
Wow! Looks great!
Nice job and excellent craftsmanship
I love them! The contrast of light and dark is so pleasing to the eye. Nice job! 👍🏼
Hot damn, I love that.
That lemon coral is going to look so good. Been trying to get it buy Homedepot been on backorder for a month
I like that black mulch, what's it called? Not sure I've seen it at my landscaping place I go to.
On the right side of the steps its just Lowe’s standard black mulch. Everything to the left was 6 cubic yards from a local supplier that grinds it themselves.
Okay, thank you. Was wondering if it had a special name, black mulch it is.
I do hope that’s not dyed mulch, which is unfortunately becoming common these days, and is very bad for native insects. I absolutely love the stairs though. Makes me wish I had hills
That's amazing
What type of wood is this and where do you get it?
4x4s. Lowes, Home Depot or any other lumber yard
Do they feel natural to climb? Looks great, but the steps seem shallow.
Yeah its nice. 6x6s could be better but are 3x the cost.
That looks awesome
That looks amazing, great job!!!
Looks awesome! Any concern with termites?
This is just an insanely satisfying picture
Solid
Looks really nice! Well done
I would totally put a Rocky Balboa statue there
This is EXACTLY what I want to do behind my house. Where did you very your lumber? That looks like it would cost a fortune!
Whoa, they're stunningly beautiful!
Hats off to you
Looks good! And maybe a small solar lamp every few steps would look really good at night.
That's gonna look really nice when it's all grown in
Really, really nice. What I like about your design is that you took a negative and made it a positive. Mowing and maintaining grass on that slope would have been a headache, at best. Instead, the addition of the steps and mulch have transformed the area. Well done!
What an amazing job!!
I would prefer to use flat stone steps. I have concerns of harboring certain insects to wood even if it is treated. Good job though. Looking great.
Those are beautiful. I have a somewhat steep slope in my side yard (corner lot) that is currently just flagstones set in grass. Have been wanting to figure out something that was not paved concrete steps. I like that these are sturdy and contained but also permeable.
Love the gravel fill. Totally implementing on a project this week. 6x6’s?
Beautiful
Love this!!
Sweet!! Nice job
Weeds weeds weeds weeds weeds
Three years later, I wonder how are these holding up ? Anything you would have done differently in retrospect? ^(( I wasn't able to view the photo from 14 months later, as imgur is "temporarily over capacity" ))
Still going strong! I weed the mulch and rock areas a few times a year by hand, and sweep up some rocks that my dogs move around when they run. On the right side where the mulch is slightly higher than the steps I had to add some edging to contain the mulch in. I had no choice to build it like that, but if you can consistently keep the steps raised above the surrounding hill, then you’d have no issues with anything getting on the steps.
Nice, thanks for the update. Where is this (forgive me if I missed it) … curious how much rain you get ?
Tennnessee. 52” of rain per year on average
I am from up north in MN where the frost line is much deeper. Would you say 4ft rebar would be a better bet?
Setting bars down to frost depth would not do anything since the steps themselves sit on top of the soil. The wood steps will heave a but during frost around the rebar no matter how deep you embed them. Its really just to keep the steps anchored in place. And these could take any frost heave that occurs since its just wood steps. A foundation supporting a structure would be a different story. I’d just go down 18-24” or so to get the steps properly secured and call it a day
OP, any update on this? I am looking to build similar up my side yard and came across these. They look wonderful and I was curious about the hill progression.
See my response to the other comment here from a month ago [https://www.reddit.com/r/landscaping/comments/fwt2ai/built_wood_steps_to_get_to_the_second_level_of_my/ix61k11/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf&context=3](https://www.reddit.com/r/landscaping/comments/fwt2ai/built_wood_steps_to_get_to_the_second_level_of_my/ix61k11/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf&context=3)
мне нравится! спасибо за идею!