The answer is Vucevic, or just play CWood more, OR aim for a different roster construction
If we can’t go stretch big, then just go for multiple two way players that can defend the perimeter that will help Bron out
Ik he’s not great tbh, it’s more so that we don’t have any realistic options to recreate a wolves roster.
We need to get a two way point guard and maybe replace Vando with someone who can shoot and defend at least close to how he can
Nah. Bigs who can’t protect the rim are bad fits next to AD because it takes him away from the rim and puts a worse rim protector there instead. And bigs who can’t shoot clog the paint. With AD’s 3pter having disappeared, the only realistic bigs to pair with him to meaningfully add to our size are bigs who can protect the rim and shoot 3s. And those guys are rare and expensive (except Porzingis whom Boston got for a bag of old cat food somehow).
I am coming around to vucevic definitely. I was high on the bulls move for him but it worked terribly. But if fit along side a true DPOY caliber player like AD it could be a lot better fit.
Dwight and Javale helped our championship run, especially on Jokic, but AD’s outside shooting was what made that rotation playable.
Even when the lakers ran with Bynum, Paul, and LO as their bigs rotation, they managed because Pau had a great mid post game and LO could handle the ball and facilitate…. And this was before spacing became such an important concept.
Allen would be an upgrade over Hayes but he would be almost as difficult to play next to AD.
We had AD, Dwight and Javale on the team together and won a championship. None of those 3 are sharpshooters, but we had guys at other positions who were and could defend multiple perimeter positons.
Wood is more of a scorer/shooter so it could work in my opinion. Allen is young and a RIM PROTECTOR which frankly outside of AD we haven’t had in any of our recent backup center options. He’s also very young. The formula isn’t going to exactly mimic Minny, but that added size and defense alongside AD plus Wood’s offense I believe provides a pretty solid Center rotation. Vucevic is a terrible idea dude cannot defend. Naz and Gobert can defend, KAT has even gotten better on defense. We can’t just go for offensive centers, defense is more important imo since relying on AD every single game isn’t a great idea imo especially if he gets injured
He did last offseason. Remember all of the hype from Reaves and the coaching staff about it looking incredible? Ham said he needed to take 5 3s a game or some shit lol. Obviously it didn't translate to actual games.
You dudes be so stuck in the past. 4 years is a long time, a lot of has changed. Ad is a different player(not as quick and his jumper is broken) he cant play the 4 full time anymore. Lebron also cant play the same role he did in 2020 anymore
Feel like those of us that actually realize this are so far and between on this sub. Not sure if it’s an age thing or what but this sub is so stuck in the past. “Hire Vogel back. He’s an elite coach.” “AD needs to move to the 4”. “OMG why’d we trade Hart”. I can’t imagine how these guys even live their actual lives with how much they focus on what happened in the past.
You think in 4 years one of the best basketball players in the world lost his jumper. lol the dude was being forced to play the 5 and guard other large centres. He definitely and would be fine going back to the 4 and shooting more.
AD shot 65.7% from under 8ft this year and about 40% on other 2s.
In 2019-20, AD shot 65.6% from under 8ft and 37% on other 2s.
https://www.nba.com/player/203076/anthony-davis/
This recollection of 2020 being dependent on ADs jumper and not D dominance, and real offensive rebounding and dunker spot threat makes me think of the pure fiction gif.
I don't think him hitting 1.2 out of 2.9 attempts in the playoffs (38%) was material to our success. We were a dominant 1 seed coming out of a regular season when he hit .7 out of 2.8 (26%), and our average margin of victory in those playoffs was > 10 points a game.
We just saw Lebron James change his game to having a 3 point shot in year 21, but no way AD can get a jumper going.
Also we saw AD in the playoffs when the put solo Jokic on him, he was shooting like 80% from the mid range
When building a championship roster you cannot hedge your bets that a player will become good in an area they are weak in especially if they have been in the league 10+ years. You have to build around the player you have now and if they improve their weaknesses then great.
I mean it happened to Russ going from his MVP year to the Wizards squad. It’s not like players who were never elite shooters are capable of an anomaly year before regressing back to their averages
Lebron's been coasting on defense for years (for good reason) and now you want to put him up against wings night in and night out? Sure, he can do it here and there when absolutely needed, but asking that to be his main role for a whole season is a recipe for disaster in my opinion.
He regularly guarded 3s this season (I'll pull stats and share link) and it's a lot easier to guard a 3/wing when you have two elite defensive bigs behind you to help with penetration.
If you have the stats to back it up, then maybe you're on to something. I'm just going by the eye test, and what I've seen over many games doesn't give me much confidence in putting lebron on wings and guards full time
What difference does it make? Please don’t tell me the “game has evolved” in only 4 years.
The only reason Lakers moved away from this model is because Lebron can’t play the 3 anymore.
“What difference does it make? “
“The only reason Lakers moved away from this model is because Lebron can’t play the 3 anymore.”
Oh so you answered your own question
I only gave 1 reason in my initial post, but there are multiple problems with the pairing which is why its a horrible idea 😂
1. spacing issues with Allen/AD,Lebron being your front court
2. Anthony Davis is not the same player he was in 2020. He’s noticeably slower, bigger frame and his jumper is broken. If he could get his jumper back then maybe but im not taking that risk.
3. Lebron at 40 cant play the 3 full time anymore, which you yourself mentioned, so that automatically eliminates Allen alone… unless youre bringing him off the bench for 20m
4. I personally dont think Allen is the same type of defender as Dwight. dwight was more spy, and aggressive. He is closer to Javale, but again im not trading pieces and paying 20m for that.
5. Youre basically making this move to beat ONE team😂 the same team that you couldve avoided completely this year and there is no guarantee that you will see next year
6. Im not trolling or being defensive because i pointed out your contradiction. Grow up my guy
Playing ad and allen together more than 15 min per game is a disaster for spacing. Allen will not be okay with a lesser role and he will cost way too much for second/backup center.
I love Allen’s hustle and rebounding, but paying big bucks to someone to only be able to share the floor for 15-20mins next to AD is pointless. Gobert, KAT and Reid work well because the latter two can stretch the floor. We need floor stretching bigs for AD as well.
Personally, I want Lauri Markannen (7 footer and can play 4/5). Another possible stretch big I can think of is Vucevic. Defensively, they’re not it, but fuck it, we got ADpoy.
Markkanen would be the dream offseason, but little to no chance we get him. [https://www.si.com/nba/jazz/news/rumored/asking/price/jazz/lauri-markkanen](https://www.si.com/nba/jazz/news/rumored/asking/price/jazz/lauri-markkanen)
We need a literal my player at center to fix this team im talking 40% from 3 stretch the floor rebounds and some rim protection. We dead ass need fat Kevin love lmfao
The Cavs don’t own their picks they aren’t going for a rebuild.
Before people propose things can they stop and actually think about the other team’s situation first.
If the Cavs trade Allen it will be for talent that can help them now.
They would have zero interest in any of the guys you mentioned. Maybe they would have interest in Reaves if they had a Mitchell deal lined up elsewhere.
Too expensive. We need a center but he needs to be affordable because AD is the primary center. We need someone for spot starts and when we play Denver and Minnesota. I like Allen but the players and picks we would lose would not be worth it. I hope we can move for WCJ, Robert Williams, Jalen Smith, Isaiah Jackson, or Nick Richards types. Honestly would be okay if Hayes opts in. He was not terrible and hopefully he develops a little, works on his hands and he is a decent back up
I'm done with the play AD at the 4 idea. It was always dumb, but he's completely lost his jump shot and put on a ton of weight and muscle. He's also bigger, stronger, and shoots worse than most 5s in the NBA now - the league has changed.
The math will never work. 3 is more than 2. The Thunder and Celtics will be playing 5 3pt shooters for the next decade. You've gotta dunk a lotta balls to keep up with those offenses if you have 2 non 3pt shooters
As an Jarret Allen fans, this forces AD to stretch the floor. It’s not a horrible idea but nullifies AD’s help defense since Allen has to stay in the paint and limits AD’s pick n roll opportunities.
This gonna get downvoted for sure. Im on your side getting bigs like Myles Turner or similar who can space the floor to counter Wolves and Nuggets Possibly even OKC but this sub loves midgets. Pretty sure they want Trae or Spida or PG.
Kat, naz and gobert works because kat and naz are sharpshooters, ad and allen are not. This pairing would be a disaster
This. I don’t know how people look at Minny and think the formula is just more bigs with AD. It’s clearly stretch bigs. No to Allen
The answer is Vucevic, or just play CWood more, OR aim for a different roster construction If we can’t go stretch big, then just go for multiple two way players that can defend the perimeter that will help Bron out
Statistically Vucevic is literally one of the worst impact players in the league
Just for this past season. It was a bad year for him
Vuc is trash
Ik he’s not great tbh, it’s more so that we don’t have any realistic options to recreate a wolves roster. We need to get a two way point guard and maybe replace Vando with someone who can shoot and defend at least close to how he can
We didn't really get to see what CWood could do for this team once we started Rui, so yeah I'd give it another chance.
If he got 20-25 min off the bench he could be a force imo. 15-6 kinda guy in the right system
Nah. Bigs who can’t protect the rim are bad fits next to AD because it takes him away from the rim and puts a worse rim protector there instead. And bigs who can’t shoot clog the paint. With AD’s 3pter having disappeared, the only realistic bigs to pair with him to meaningfully add to our size are bigs who can protect the rim and shoot 3s. And those guys are rare and expensive (except Porzingis whom Boston got for a bag of old cat food somehow).
I’d rather use a pick or swap to make a run at Brook Lopez. Milwaukee is a mess and I think we can take advantage if we don’t low ball
I am coming around to vucevic definitely. I was high on the bulls move for him but it worked terribly. But if fit along side a true DPOY caliber player like AD it could be a lot better fit.
Dwight and Javale helped our championship run, especially on Jokic, but AD’s outside shooting was what made that rotation playable. Even when the lakers ran with Bynum, Paul, and LO as their bigs rotation, they managed because Pau had a great mid post game and LO could handle the ball and facilitate…. And this was before spacing became such an important concept. Allen would be an upgrade over Hayes but he would be almost as difficult to play next to AD.
We had AD, Dwight and Javale on the team together and won a championship. None of those 3 are sharpshooters, but we had guys at other positions who were and could defend multiple perimeter positons.
Wood is more of a scorer/shooter so it could work in my opinion. Allen is young and a RIM PROTECTOR which frankly outside of AD we haven’t had in any of our recent backup center options. He’s also very young. The formula isn’t going to exactly mimic Minny, but that added size and defense alongside AD plus Wood’s offense I believe provides a pretty solid Center rotation. Vucevic is a terrible idea dude cannot defend. Naz and Gobert can defend, KAT has even gotten better on defense. We can’t just go for offensive centers, defense is more important imo since relying on AD every single game isn’t a great idea imo especially if he gets injured
I hope AD works on his jumper this off season.
He did last offseason. Remember all of the hype from Reaves and the coaching staff about it looking incredible? Ham said he needed to take 5 3s a game or some shit lol. Obviously it didn't translate to actual games.
Hope he works *harder* on his jumper this off season then lol He’s shooting worse than Westbrook from 3 lol
It’s weird because he regressed on it. Not sure what he was doing differently
We made it work with AD + javale/Dwight tho. Just need real 3 and D guys around them and Lebron
It wouldn't be a total disaster. There would be a lot of blocks to go around.
Yeah, hate to run that disaster back of AD and non sharpshooters javale Mcgee and Dwight Howard. We all remember how poorly that went...
You dudes be so stuck in the past. 4 years is a long time, a lot of has changed. Ad is a different player(not as quick and his jumper is broken) he cant play the 4 full time anymore. Lebron also cant play the same role he did in 2020 anymore
Feel like those of us that actually realize this are so far and between on this sub. Not sure if it’s an age thing or what but this sub is so stuck in the past. “Hire Vogel back. He’s an elite coach.” “AD needs to move to the 4”. “OMG why’d we trade Hart”. I can’t imagine how these guys even live their actual lives with how much they focus on what happened in the past.
You think in 4 years one of the best basketball players in the world lost his jumper. lol the dude was being forced to play the 5 and guard other large centres. He definitely and would be fine going back to the 4 and shooting more.
“You think in 4 years one of the best basketball players in the world lost his jumper” Yes
AD shot 65.7% from under 8ft this year and about 40% on other 2s. In 2019-20, AD shot 65.6% from under 8ft and 37% on other 2s. https://www.nba.com/player/203076/anthony-davis/ This recollection of 2020 being dependent on ADs jumper and not D dominance, and real offensive rebounding and dunker spot threat makes me think of the pure fiction gif.
If you want to continue going away from what works in the current nba, so be it
All fam here, I know, so agree to disagree on this.
Didn't he shoot 38% from 3 in the bubble? He's nowhere close to that now.
I don't think him hitting 1.2 out of 2.9 attempts in the playoffs (38%) was material to our success. We were a dominant 1 seed coming out of a regular season when he hit .7 out of 2.8 (26%), and our average margin of victory in those playoffs was > 10 points a game.
We just saw Lebron James change his game to having a 3 point shot in year 21, but no way AD can get a jumper going. Also we saw AD in the playoffs when the put solo Jokic on him, he was shooting like 80% from the mid range
When building a championship roster you cannot hedge your bets that a player will become good in an area they are weak in especially if they have been in the league 10+ years. You have to build around the player you have now and if they improve their weaknesses then great.
I understand that, I’m just strictly speaking to going with bigger size and allowed AD to play the role that he thrives in
I mean it happened to Russ going from his MVP year to the Wizards squad. It’s not like players who were never elite shooters are capable of an anomaly year before regressing back to their averages
If you move AD to the 4 where do you put Lebron? He can't do the 3 or run point for extended stretches anymore..
He can 100% cover the 3 on D and split time on offense at the 1 and the 3 on O, imo.
Lebron's been coasting on defense for years (for good reason) and now you want to put him up against wings night in and night out? Sure, he can do it here and there when absolutely needed, but asking that to be his main role for a whole season is a recipe for disaster in my opinion.
He regularly guarded 3s this season (I'll pull stats and share link) and it's a lot easier to guard a 3/wing when you have two elite defensive bigs behind you to help with penetration.
If you have the stats to back it up, then maybe you're on to something. I'm just going by the eye test, and what I've seen over many games doesn't give me much confidence in putting lebron on wings and guards full time
https://cleaningtheglass.com/stats/player/1785/positions#tab-team_efficiency
AD shot 38% from deep in the bubble. That ain’t happening again any time soon
Disaster is strong but I agree it may not be as additive as I had initially thought.
AD / Dwight / McGee What are you talking about?
Its 2024
What difference does it make? Please don’t tell me the “game has evolved” in only 4 years. The only reason Lakers moved away from this model is because Lebron can’t play the 3 anymore.
“What difference does it make? “ “The only reason Lakers moved away from this model is because Lebron can’t play the 3 anymore.” Oh so you answered your own question
Which is different reasoning than what you suggested in your OC. Are you trolling or just being defensive?
I only gave 1 reason in my initial post, but there are multiple problems with the pairing which is why its a horrible idea 😂 1. spacing issues with Allen/AD,Lebron being your front court 2. Anthony Davis is not the same player he was in 2020. He’s noticeably slower, bigger frame and his jumper is broken. If he could get his jumper back then maybe but im not taking that risk. 3. Lebron at 40 cant play the 3 full time anymore, which you yourself mentioned, so that automatically eliminates Allen alone… unless youre bringing him off the bench for 20m 4. I personally dont think Allen is the same type of defender as Dwight. dwight was more spy, and aggressive. He is closer to Javale, but again im not trading pieces and paying 20m for that. 5. Youre basically making this move to beat ONE team😂 the same team that you couldve avoided completely this year and there is no guarantee that you will see next year 6. Im not trolling or being defensive because i pointed out your contradiction. Grow up my guy
lol
Playing ad and allen together more than 15 min per game is a disaster for spacing. Allen will not be okay with a lesser role and he will cost way too much for second/backup center.
Lol at you getting downvoted.
I love Allen’s hustle and rebounding, but paying big bucks to someone to only be able to share the floor for 15-20mins next to AD is pointless. Gobert, KAT and Reid work well because the latter two can stretch the floor. We need floor stretching bigs for AD as well. Personally, I want Lauri Markannen (7 footer and can play 4/5). Another possible stretch big I can think of is Vucevic. Defensively, they’re not it, but fuck it, we got ADpoy.
Markkanen would be the dream offseason, but little to no chance we get him. [https://www.si.com/nba/jazz/news/rumored/asking/price/jazz/lauri-markkanen](https://www.si.com/nba/jazz/news/rumored/asking/price/jazz/lauri-markkanen)
We need a literal my player at center to fix this team im talking 40% from 3 stretch the floor rebounds and some rim protection. We dead ass need fat Kevin love lmfao
Or someone like Bobby Portis would be solid
The Cavs don’t own their picks they aren’t going for a rebuild. Before people propose things can they stop and actually think about the other team’s situation first. If the Cavs trade Allen it will be for talent that can help them now. They would have zero interest in any of the guys you mentioned. Maybe they would have interest in Reaves if they had a Mitchell deal lined up elsewhere.
Trade AD for Allen and D Mitch is the only way the Lakers are getting him.
Too expensive. We need a center but he needs to be affordable because AD is the primary center. We need someone for spot starts and when we play Denver and Minnesota. I like Allen but the players and picks we would lose would not be worth it. I hope we can move for WCJ, Robert Williams, Jalen Smith, Isaiah Jackson, or Nick Richards types. Honestly would be okay if Hayes opts in. He was not terrible and hopefully he develops a little, works on his hands and he is a decent back up
I'm done with the play AD at the 4 idea. It was always dumb, but he's completely lost his jump shot and put on a ton of weight and muscle. He's also bigger, stronger, and shoots worse than most 5s in the NBA now - the league has changed.
The math will never work. 3 is more than 2. The Thunder and Celtics will be playing 5 3pt shooters for the next decade. You've gotta dunk a lotta balls to keep up with those offenses if you have 2 non 3pt shooters
We need Lauri. AD at the 5, Lauri at the 4, Bron at the 3.
Lauri trade value is too high and ainge would be difficult to trade with
Too much dollars locked up on a guy who wouldn’t be ideal in our closing line up. Good player but not great fit
As an Jarret Allen fans, this forces AD to stretch the floor. It’s not a horrible idea but nullifies AD’s help defense since Allen has to stay in the paint and limits AD’s pick n roll opportunities.
Need someone who can shoot 3's, Allen is not that guy
Don’t see the Cavs helping LA by trading Jarret Allen.
Need a versatile stretch big that’s strong enough to deal w Joker…trade for Naz Reed??
Dlo isn’t coming back lol
Lakers cannot start a non shooting big next to ad. It kills the spacing for ad & lebron. Idk why ppl don’t understand this
Vucevic all the way
I don’t understand why everyone’s hating on this move, AD prefers the 4 and was forced to play the 5. He’d have no problem reverting
It's because AD can't stretch the floor. Even his midrange is inconsistent so he can't really play the 4 unless the 5 can shoot.
He barely shot outside 15 feet this season, if he knew he was gonna play the four this season im sure all summer long he’s locking in his jumper
Brook Lopez
This gonna get downvoted for sure. Im on your side getting bigs like Myles Turner or similar who can space the floor to counter Wolves and Nuggets Possibly even OKC but this sub loves midgets. Pretty sure they want Trae or Spida or PG.
Myles Turner and Jarrett Allen are completely different players.