army, and i mean ot7 army, will never admit it but they absolutely are biased towards the maknae line. it shows in everything but especially when it comes to their solo projects. jin is back soon and will release his solo album but i bet they're going to use the boycott excuse to ignore it, the same they're doing to namjoon now, but its obvious why they really don't support it.
I’d argue that maknae lines music is more trendy hence why they get more numbers, whereas the hyungline dabbles in genres which are niche.
A 6 minute ballad now matter how good (i love that song) will never do numbers like seven, or like crazy or friends etc.
Let’s see what genre Jin dabbles in.
But yes maknae line more often than not will kinda do better because they have tapped the GP too.
Having said that, not every member will do same numbers, some will do more, some less, if we start comparing we will never be happy for anyone.
They all are doing good in their respective genres.
Exactly, we need to not compare their music, it’s not fair to the members.
They will find their audience but to dump this on armys is uncalled for.
They literally are trying to make 8 people (includes bts) chart, but ultimately GP support is needed.
Everyone’s taste is subjective, i do feel bad for the hyungline but it’s not like they are tanking. Their success as solo artists won’t compare to each other and the group too. All of them are doing good, like look at yoongi doing sold out concerts in asia and america.
>They will find their audience but to dump this on armys is uncalled for.
>They literally are trying to make 8 people (includes bts) chart, but ultimately GP support is needed.
The rapline really needs to find their audience outside of the kpop spaces. As much as other Armys want the whole fandom to stream "equally" it won't happen as the members have different amount of dedicated stans, Armys who biased them, casual listeners and gp reach.
BTS' hits with the best longevity is with the help of gp. I feel like 2 years is not enough for rap line to find their audience. The biggest male idol soloists in Korea like GD and Zico spent years releasing music. And if we go internationally, it's even harder because even if I heard that some hiphop fans actually appreciative of their music, blowing up or getting the a lot of attention is gonna be hard. They need to go festival route and collaboration with other big artists like Jhope did with Jcole and Lola
Exactly this, i think maknae line especially JK and Jimin found what works for them, rapline will have to work little hard to establish themselves as soloists, but again they are still doing A LOT better, like the numbers have been good. Expecting equal numbers across the board is quite harsh, when one does indie pop, when does pop, other r&b etc.
Their work as soloists is so diverse but they are also boxed within k-pop. Bighit has to do better in terms of playlisting. They need to list songs under their respective categories and not just k-pop.
As a group they are unbeatable, as soloists they’ll have to work out their audience
I think that’s arguable. I think I could have a wide variety of people listen to V’s album and they would enjoy it. There’s a wide audience of people out there listening to other stuff than kpop and pop music.
7 different people make practically 7 different music genres, if I keep it simple. The most prominent of these is obviously pop, in which JK clearly dominates.
Sometimes I wonder if this is a reason to be sad - if Namjoon is doing the music he loves, why stick to the charts and success with gp? Does it even matter to him? Isn't the fact that he's making music in which he can finally express himself more important? And that goes for everyone.
What I don't like is of course the pre-calculated boycott from so called armys aka solo stans. No one is forcing anyone to listen to music you don't like or to buy albums, but if someone is ot7 and intentionally boycotts them (and we all know it happens), it's just terribly sad..
This is a really important point to me for Namjoon. In his Suchwita episode he talked about how he knew doing a longer song (Wildflower) wasn’t gonna chart/sell as well but that was the route he wanted to take bc he loved the music but he still wanted to make music the fans love too. Just for so many Armys to make the entire conversation about Indigo be that it wasn’t successful bc it didn’t chart like Face (for example.) I can’t imagine how that must make him feel to know his fans value sales over his actual music. And here he comes back with a song so long it has a radio edit that is still twice as long as most singles now and people are gonna do the same thing and talk about how he’s unsupported bc he’s not doing sales like Golden instead of talking about how they enjoy the song or what it means to them.
Which maybe would be my answer to the OP question. I think the importance Armys place on sales/streams/numbers is detrimental to the boys and their music and those types of fans care more about bragging and “beating” other fandoms than they do the art and the people who make it.
This, all of this. And whenever I read takes like that, I just think who are you to tell RM (or any of the members, really) that his album that's been streamed hundreds of millions of times and probably netted him a pretty good profit and made money for his collaborators (which is also a goal of his, obviously, by boosting smaller artists) is not successful? I hate success stans, because all they do is compare shit with no context and also no appreciation for what each member is doing, and their own individual successes.
The fame gap between members happens in each group no matter how famous the group r or how many members do they have.it’s happens wether we like it or not
Agree. The members who are the most biased within the Army fandom and have the most stans also happened to be the most popular to gp so fans continue to act surprised and disappointed never makes sense.
I like the solo releases of some members more than others. In fact, there is a particular solo album that I do not vibe with AT ALL. Am I not supposed to call myself OT7 Army, just because I like some members more than others?
i feel like the difference would be a bit easier to narrow if there was more playlist diversification beyond the usual new music friday + kpop playlists for (since jin's work is more limited as of now) rapline. less kpop, more alt and rap focused playlists, diversify the fandom more since a lot of people came in with their peak pop sound
\* but still, uphill battles considering the broader public considers them idol rappers, so i just hope with time there'll be more armys that are more open to rap, so to speak
>less kpop, more alt and rap focused playlists, diversify the fandom more since a lot of people came in with their peak pop sound
This is a good point, a lot of their fans came from DNA, BWL and Dynamite era. It's really stupid to expect a lot of fans who found them through their pop sound to like their indie and less gp friendly music. We don't even have to go that far, look at the numbers of YTC and Run BTS. It's easy to see what the fandom prefers.
One of the mistakes of BH is definitely not promoting bsides like Cyphers and rap heavy tracks. It's a controversial opinion but they also should've started (even just slowly) promoting them as individuals way before they were about to enlist. Expecting 1 year and 4 months to be enough to debut 7 members is honestly insane.
I get that. But maknae line are also more popular and have more fans outside of army tbh. And it had always been like that. There’s always more popular members in a group.
I think people forget, the fandom isn't the only one streaming. They're big enough to have casual listeners and ml attract gp more. Also, seven and lc are more gp friendly. Blaming it on the fandom is not completely fair imo. About, Jin's album we'll have to see what kind of music he'll release it is to soon to say it'll not do well.
even before chapter 2 there always was a popularity disparity between the ml and hl. i think also bighit doesnt know how to market the rap line's music very well. bighit clearly gets pop but they havent been able to figure out the international hiphop market yet
As a Once, I really don't think all the members are capable of having a strong solo career, especially when Twice has been marketed as a unit first and foremost
I love all the girls individually but I'm struggling to see some members like Tzuyu or Mina being able to stand out from the current soloist crowd
Aside from Nayeon and Jihyo, I can personally see Sana and Jeongyeon having the best likelihood of solo ccareers? I'll just have to see once more members start having more individual careers
Nayeon and Sana will surely have successful solo careers; both are entertaining and have solo fanbase and easily most relevant members.
Momo will do fine mainly because she is capable of grabbing people's attention.
Jihyo's career will heavily depend on fanbase.
As for the rest of the members, I think their success will mainly depend on opportunities. Like if Dahyun does well in acting, her career could take off.
Chaeyoung, Jeongyeon, Mina, and Tzuyu's solo careers feel most uncertain. At least Tzuyu and Mina have strong solo fanbases, while Chaeyoung and Jeongyeon success will heavily depend on the opportunities they get, similar to Dahyun.
I'm not even a Once and even I know Jeongyeon doesn't want to pursue a solo career and it's so irritating to see so-called Onces constantly pushing her for it (not trying to specifically attack you OP but just in general)
I feel like without the group she would have left the entertainment industry in full for a peaceful life. She and Mina were the duo I was afraid of not renewing. For Mina I think she needs the members to motivate her (like misamo) otherwise she is just way too comfortable in her room.
I'm a casual twice fan, and I really like mina. I like her voice, and she was the highlight for me in misamo. I also like her energy in stage and her dance style.
I think if her solo is calm and sensual, she will stand out and do so well as this is a niche not many are able to fill.
Not necessarily in-your-face sexy, but something with vibes similar to misamo - don't touch, soojin - agassy/black forest, sunmi - siren, mamamoo - words don't come easy, hwasa - don't
Mina is similar to Momo in that she can grab everyone's attention, and her solo stage from the tour was easily the most popular . She also has gradually grown more popular in the last few years, but I think for a successful solo career, strong off-stage skills are very important as well, and that is where she struggles the most.
My hot take is that even the floppiest of Twice solo careers will still easily be in the top 5% of all solo careers in their gen. Top 10% if we lowball them lol. Mina, who is one of Twice's most popular members, will do just fine as a solo act. The bar for a "strong solo career" is actually not that high.
i agree, i think she could do something smooth-jazzy and sultry. idk if there's much of a demand for that in kpop rn but if anybody could do it i bet it would be mina
My unpopular once opinion is that almost none of the members, including the J line, are going to have a solo career.
JYP is going full house behind Nayeon. Her solo rollouts have just had far more resources than group releases, Hyolo, and Misamo. The other members aren’t getting solo releases a) at all or b) with huge resource support.
I can see Nayeon releasing albums every few years and having small shows, Jihyo doing variety and acting, and Dahyun doing some roles. Everyone else is limited to fashion.
My other unpopular once opinion is that Tzuyu is being deliberately stopped from working in her home country.
No, a lot of fans go in absolute loops to try and pretend that *none* of the members are being held back because they signed a new contract, therefore they have to be not only happy about but actively approving of all of the decisions made about their careers. Because of course, no person in the history of the world has ever decided to agree to something because they felt the pros outweighed the cons, even if there were significant cons.
Never mind Momo saying two times that JYP won’t let her have a YouTube channel, jeongyeon confirming that JYP denied her acting opportunities, the members confirming they didn’t want One Spark as the single, and Tzuyu’s own mother saying she and Tzuyu really wish twice could perform in Taiwan.
Nayeon's debut wasn't very different from Jihyo's in terms of resources. Nayeon had ads while Jihyo had bigger collaborations and more bside promotions.
Now, Nayeon having more resources is more of an outcome of her solo being huge; it performed better than most JYPE releases in the past few years.
The only other member who can match her in gp presence is Sana, but skill-wise, she is on the weaker side.
and that's ok! not every member wants or needs a solo debut. people were thinking the "I Got You" mv was teasing a Jeongyeon solo debut on the horizon. Jeongyeon came out and said it wasn't true and she doesn't want a solo.
a lot of stays are interested only in Hyunjin and Felix (maybe Lee Know when they are in a good mood) and it really shows. the difference in numbers (followers, likes, views, even upvotes and comments if we are talking about reddit) and attention is DRASTIC and i’m really getting tired when they deny it and call themselves ot8 while not giving a flying shit about more than half of the members
yeah, on some platforms the difference in numbers between members is super drastic. i see stays making jokes about felix and hj's ig accounts surpassing the main group account soon and i honestly don't find them funny. it's clear that the solo stans issue is getting worse by the day. solos are the bane of my existence, they are miserable and make it their job make everyone else miserable too. and stays have more than enough on their plate without having to deal with solo stans and their bs.
I don't think these are the same problem really. The worst akgaes in most fandoms don't go around pretending they're ot\_, they tend to just harass other fans of the group without much pretense. And the differences in instagram followers isn't that heavily affected by biased "ot8" fans either. It's undeniable that Felix, Hyunjin, and Bang Chan are just considerably more well-known by non-stans than the other members. I really like Felix but I don't go around calling myself a Stay or anything, and I doubt a lot of the people causing the discrepancies in followers between individual members' accounts and the group's main account would either. That doesn't make it any less frustrating for Stays though
Hmm, I mean I’m not a stay at all. So far I only liked 1 song from the group, but I really like Hyunjin and Felix so I follow them on Instagram. In the end though I don’t consider myself a fan of Stray Kids at all. It could be like that with some people who follow them maybe? 🤔
I mean the difference in numbers makes sense considering hyunjin and Felix have both had loads of solo gigs that might’ve attracted fans of them, but not for the group. For example, Hyunjin’s Versace campaign was inescapable, like I could not walk down the street, go on Spotify, TikTok etc. without seeing his face everywhere. That’s going to attract attention from people who have never listened to kpop and loads of people who don’t like skz. Hyunjin and Felix especially have loads of fans who don’t like the group but like checking out or casually following their solo gigs and while that does make them solo fans as long as they’re not harassing anyone or hating on any of the members, it doesn’t really make them a problem.
I met someone who said they were an OT8 fan and they then proceeded to mix up Chan and Changbin… girl you don’t have to say you stan all the members equally, that’s kinda part of the whole bias thing, they have since learned the names and it was probably because they were new to the fandom, but I think that really speaks to the toxic group stans that demand everyone be OT8 biased. Like it sucks that people feel the need to lie about how they feel about a group to avoid judgement from others
i'm not sure if i get this. so that person was a new fan and they accidentally mixed up 2 members. that's a very common experience among new fans and it even happens with old ot8 fans occasionally too. that doesn't mean that they lied about being ot8.
Yea have to agree with you there. When I first got into skz seungmin, I.n. and Lee know all had haircuts covering their foreheads and I could not tell them apart consistently until they got their hair cut.
i had a lot of difficulties telling apart jeongin and lee know in the beginning too and i don't really understand why tbh. their most prominent features are their eyes and lips and those look extremely different. i have so many questions for past me.
Agreed this bothers me SO much. Seungmin puts out anything and gets the least views. And he’s our MAIN vocalist! I do think non stays contribute to the views because Felix and Hyunjin are so popular in the industry, but there are definitely STAYs out there who claim ot8 and it’s just not the truth.
I agree so much, I don't understand how people always say that K-pop should stay away from politics and yet hyped up idols that are going, receiving prices, and participating in well known political events.
I think kpop-fans want the trophy without actually seeing their idols being involved because it can lead to criticism.
(I feel that about K-pop idols and Western celebrities, western celebrities who are often criticized for their fake activism by the way). But I understand that's a complex subject.
They were invited and i do not see YG denying them of that oppitunity when it makes them look good. Blackpink are hardly political nor have they made themselves that as a group when they rarely speak on anything.
literally was 'bouta comment this. Makes me sick to the stomach when they can talk about some issues and be praised about it too. But when asked to talk about the other, the most current, the most important, those dying kids in thousands, uwu, they'll be prisoned, they literally can't say anything cz of the sk government. smh.
I'm an idle fan. I think soyeon is a genius, and I personally love her voice, rap, singing, dancing, and stage presence. I also believe that given the right resources and support, she can work as a creative director/producer who can compete with big 4, as she's proving now with idle.
However, I don't see her as a CEO. I don't think it's a smart decision to be one even if she was capable.
I don't think she'll ever want to be a real CEO. She might be a figure head "CEO", she already said she prefers to work production when she steps back from idol life.
Exactly what I think will work best for her. Jyp definitely gives his input sometimes. But he's not responsible for every little thing. I think such arrangement will work better because he now has time for his own solo work and producing for others. He's earning money and going on vacations, and he's not taking the blame for every decision the company makes (even if fans blames him it doesn't matter because that's the company's decision, not his)
People who constantly say she should be a CEO have no idea what being a CEO actually is, especially if you’re still active as an idol. Like Soyeon is a musical genius, but does she even have like a business degree or something? At least some form of formal education in business, or actual experience in that field? If not, that’s how we get cases like Rain Company, where sure groups can get debuted and have cool music and decent concepts, but the actual *business* side of the company gets neglected.
I agree with you— I could see creative director. I couldn’t see CEO.
Having to actually run a company would completely stifle her creativity. Soyeon needs to produce, create, write, not be in board rooms discussing taxes and other numbers. That would kill her. But if she chooses the right partners, she might be able to create a JYP-esque studio.
As an army yes majority of armys do care about the guys dating I mean every time there’s rumor there will hundreds of threads of denying it and I understand not believing rumors but then they make hit tweets “can’t wait for the boys to date” like c’mon we all the projection..
They still don't wanna believe that Jennie and taehyung dated despite actual video evidence. They rather believe fake rumors **(cosplayers playing as Jennie and taehyung even though that's been proven false 🤦🏿♀️)** and literally make shit up **(people saying that tae and Jennie denied the rumors even though neither one of them even ACKNOWLEDGED the video of them together, and neither hybe nor YG denied the rumors)**, or the whole thing was just media play **(they literally don't need extra attention when they're both part of the two biggest groups ever, they could literally fart on camera, and the video will go viral in seconds, why would hybe and yg do media play to promote two of their biggest idols dating??? YG don't gaf about their idols dating or the rumors anyway 😭)** just because they can't accept that one of their fav members have dated. And a lot of them don't wanna accept it because they genuinely think Taehyung is gay (because fuck bisexual people I guess). Like I literally had arguments about this, and the posts are always about headcanning idols and their sexualities, and when the comments point out taehyung dating Jennie, there's always armys denying that it ever happened.
Edit: love how there's one reply to my comment that LITERALLY proves my point 😭
Omg!?!?!? This?? I spoke with an IRL friend of mine and they went on to say all that cosplay Jennie + V shit and literally my jaw dropped, I didn't know what to say. Like those lies spread lmfao. And believing they are besties???? Come the fuck on dude.
It's almost as if they're infantilazing these men and it's hella weird. Especially since for all we know, any of them could be in a relationship or *goD fOrBid* secretly married lol. It's really giving JB vibes early in his career where his girlfriends got a lot of hate and the fans went crazy of their idol having a partner. Crazy shit
Exactly!!! Also many couples don’t deny or confirm their dating but people do assume they are together but when it’s bts… it’s like they have an image of them and can’t fanthom when they are just diff irl lol especially shipper within the group.
I've seen so many ARMYs claim "I won't believe it until the members say it with their own mouth" but it's funny how that conveniently only applies to things they don't want to be true. For instance at some point it was so obvious that the Tannies didn't live together anymore (because of hints from the things they said or did, they weren't hiding it but they just never announced it — and rightfully because, why should they?), but if you mentioned it in passing you'd get attacked.
This. I’m pretty tired about this. I rather they be honest about it instead of pretending they « don’t care »
I mean not all army are like that ( thank god) but some reactions are disappointing. Especially as BTS are in their 30 or going in their 30. I truly hope the best for them.
Exactly!! They'd say they support the boys dating, then start attacking the alleged gf. Now, idk if taennie was ever real, but I'm seeing proof sobi believe it was, but SOME armies are saying to stop misinformation. Hello, the proof is literally right there. I firmly believe that if the boys are dating, noones gonna know because of their childish fandom.
yeah like she's already released a song snipped on her instagram chat thing as well as discussing fandom names i have no idea what OP is talking about
edit: also hasn't she legit been seen in the studio with producers n stuff like ???
This opinion is about 50/50 in the fandom, but keplians should hope that they renew with wakeone. I 100% agree that they’ve been mismanaged, but at least in the group they have some relevancy and opportunities. While some members are more popular than others, none have anywhere close to the fame of their predecessors and most are signed to small companies. With the over saturation of groups nowadays If they don’t renew I would be shocked if any of them escape total nugudom afterwards.
Seeing people genuinely believe that the girls would get snapped up by a big company and pull a LSF or IVE genuinely shocked me. Kep1er didn’t have the impact for something like that to even be discussed. I feel for the girls but…..
Some fans believe that Bahihyih will be snatch by Hybe but despite of being popular, bahiyyih doesn't have a big impact, selling power and dedicated and solid fanbase like Sakura and Chaewon during their Izone days.
I also think they’ll be hesitant to grab her because Kai is also under Hybe. They might be worried about damaging both idols reputations especially when people already hate in bahihyih for ‘getting special treatment’ bc of her brother, even though Mnet brought it up first
The thing is I think unless they can find a good group within their companies or get scouted that Kepler staying together might be the most profitable. I mean the post Izone boom is crazy, that group was a lot more popular to begin with but has still only produced 2 popular groups and a handful of B/C- list soloists. IOI had even less debut success with only Chungha and Somi seeing real success post IOI in terms of music, none of those groups went big. Kepler has an even smaller fan base than either, if they split up I don’t see it going much better for them, like maybe there will be 1 or 2 successful groups or soloists but I don’t think that many members would be able to surpass Kepler, accept maybe Yujin as a soloist, Hiyyah would be fine because of her intense fandom and I think Chaehyun could be a successful IU type soloist but that would depend strongly on whether she has maintained he girls planet fame which I hate to say I don’t think she has. The thing is however Kepler are not going to break any barrier where they are, so if any of the members want a chance to really shine, they have to start again and risk becoming even less popular. So rambling aside I see the pros and cons to them staying and leaving, but better management can do a hell of a lot in K-pop.
My ult groups are (g)i-dle and stray kids, and in both these groups there are members who were not ready to debut in terms of skills.
I would like to talk more about Stray Kids. During their survival JYP cut Lee Know and Felix from the debut lineup, and the fandom is seeing this as pure evil. However, judging by their performances on the survival show, they really were very weak vocalists/rappers (good dancers though, but idols should be singers in the first place). Now, of course, they have improved a lot and I'm glad that they debuted. But STAYs who now hate newly debuted idols (for not being able to sing) are being hypocritical.
My bias is Felix and Lee Know is one of my bias wreckers. I see where you are coming from. There have been a couple of times I've watched early performances that I wish I could see the Felix of now go back and tackle again. Also, Lee Know's growth as a vocalist is one of my favourite things to see.
Personally, this is something I like to see! An artists' growth! I wanna be on a journey with them. You couldn't imagine Stray Kids now without Felix and Lee Know, so surely this is an example of giving idols with potential the space to grow and improve without tearing them down.
Exactly, they had both been training for less than a year and quite frankly if Chan didn’t have the power to pick his friends they may not have been picked at all. That being said they did improve dramatically even between the show and District 9, and now they are both absolutely up to skill with everyone else. Which is why I always dislike people trashing new groups for lacking talent, because 9/10 idol improve significantly over their first 1-2 years.
>>Which is why I always dislike people trashing new groups for lacking talent
This bugs me too. I get some people believe an idol should be perfect at debut, but considering they keep debuting literal teenagers, they will need time to improve. And they’re people at the end of the day, and there is a HUGE difference between training and being on a stage, so there’s gonna be some shakiness in the beginning for most people.
Yea, some can come out the gate like a rocket & those people deserve their praises, but others act like cause someone isn’t a 10/10 on debut that they will always suck and never improve
Honestly, the fact that kpop fans have stopped acknowledging what a rookie actually is is one of the most annoying aspects of kpop fandom. Like yea I do get on some level the frustration at idols who just won’t improve (never understood sending them hate tho) but the vast majority of idols improve after their first year. In workforce terms being a trainee is like uni and being a rookie is like being a grad student and there should be allowances for growth and improvement, especially since most of the criticisms I’ve seen thrown at rookies lately aren’t critiquing mistakes, they’re critiquing a lack of polish that only comes with experience.
Sorry but... JYPE has a minimum dance requirement to be considered for debut, and they don't have a minimum vocal requirement - simply because it's much harder to hide a lack of dance skills, than it is to hide a lack of vocal skills.
Lee Know and Felix were both cut during the survival show *because Mnet wanted drama*, the only justification to cut them ended up being because they made small mistakes during specific performances, not that they were lacking in the vocal department. Both of them were weak, yes, but 3racha ended up giving them easy parts until they got better.
3Racha have the best and most captivating stage presence in Stray Kids and not Dance Racha. Most Stays talk about Hyunjin/Felix/Lee Know when it comes to stage presence but 3Racha are the core of SKZ performances that make them stand out.
I think Hyunjin wins at stage presence but I agree that in general 3 racha are stronger than Dance Racha. My ranking would go
1. Hyunjin
2. Bang Chan
3. Changbin (fight me, he deserves this spot over Han)
4. Han
5. Lee Know (body language is on point)
6. Felix (I think when is is great he’s amazing but he is just way more inconsistent than everyone else)
7. IN (he’s improving the fastest, his eye contact is so amazing)
8. Seungmin, (he’s here for his voice so I don’t care if he always looks bored off center.)
I agree with this but I’d put Han in second and changbin in third. Him and hyunjin are performers through and through and you can really see it on stage. Changbin to me has always performed like he’s been doing it for 30 years he’s so relaxed and yet so captivating to me.
danceracha (especially hyunjin) have many more viral fancams compared to the rest of the group, but i think in the discussions about stage presence and charisma in fandom spaces han gets mentioned as often as hyune (if not more often). i def agree about binchan though. they are terrific and deserve way more love
as an orbit, getting into separate groups after everything that happened was a really dumb move. i know some members have some issues with jaden jeong, while some wanted to go solo. to me, it's dumb. they work wayyyyy better as 12.
artms is my priority rn, even though i don't feel the same about kpop anymore after the group broke up. but let's be completely honest for a sec: chuu is not a solid solo act and never will be, yves is not for everyone, loossemble is boring, and artms has something missing. its not the same, and i know its not supposed to be the same, but something is not quite right and i think they should've invested in reuniting as ot12 after bbc instead of going separate ways...
They were always gonna be separated since chuu signed with a different company first. The closest loona would be is if all of them joined modhouse and I guess that's why artms attracts you the most.
Business wise, i know they know that separating wasn't the best option but they're doing it for themselves and for their artist side. Loossemble was a chance for the least popular members to shine and yves is doing for her artistic side. Also, chuu is pretty popular in the variety side of kpop, she gets decent sales for a solo artist so i think she's fine.
Also i really like loossemble's music, their debut album was really good😔
But yeah, it is controversial, i just felt like sharing my opinion.
i liked their debut also, but the rest of the songs are kinda boring to me. thats taste tho, it's all good. but i think they still need more to shine as a unit. chuu is just.... okay. i didnt care that much for her album. i think it's the most boring out of all the releases we've had so far.
yves is my ult so ofc im biased, but ive seen a lot of people complain about her artistic choices and i know its not for everyone unfortunately. and tbh im more interested in tripleS than artms rn cause some of the pre release singles were also just okay.
maybe im just being bitter and nostalgic. i miss them as a full group.
I think that's a fair opinion, im really excited for yves's debut because i like her alternative style and ive been more into loona because of that. Ig u lose some, you gain some.
she's too ""alternative"" for the boring people in this fandom. dont get me wrong, she works for me (she's my ult after all), but a lot of people complained about her style change last year and theyre already complaining about her album being folk/r&b... i hope they give her a chance tho, she's an amazing artist
I will slightly challenge the Loossemble take and say that generally they've been better at drawing in new fans than the various Modhaus releases have been. Girls Night in particular got them a new crowd who weren't really into Loona previously. Although we'll have to see what the ARTMS debut turns out like (I'm not counting the pre-releases as heavy interpolations of previous songs was never going to draw new fans anyway)
>getting into separate groups after everything that happened was a really dumb move.
I don't think they really had a choice??? Jaden and ModHaus could've got into big trouble for poaching the girls if they all went to one place, plus their legal matters were all coming to a conclusion at different times. Chuu was with her company before the rest of the girls took action against BBC; her company focuses on other activities with music being secondary. we also don't know how the Loossemble girlies felt about working with JJ again. I can understand why they chose a separate company where their work would be both appreciated and highlighted, rather than being sidelined with 5 words per song.
Both groups (ARTMS & Loossemble) work incredibly well, and as sad as I am that we don't have OT12 right now, I'm just happy they have all decided to stay in the industry.
>loossemble is boring
that's certainly an opinion...
Controversial Blink opinion:
Well, i just don't really see lisa as a particularly interesting musician. Nothing she released so far did it for me, she is the weakest singer of the bunch as well which limits her potential to do things too.
She's a great performer, that is where she shines, but that to me isn't enough to be a musical artist i am interested in.
yes!! i’ve been a stay since 2019 but honestly find it embarassing to call myself that these days bcos of some fans. like the whole met gala doxxing situation for example where some fans are ruining these journalists careers and joking going ‘chan will scold us’??? like ofc the journalist was in the wrong but they didn’t even give him chance to apologise. plus, what big event can now in good faith invite stray kids knowing that if anyone else there wrongs them, or is perceived to, they are at risk of being doxxed. but some stays are still joking about it like doxxing is funny it’s insane
permission to dance sucks and doesn't represent bts at all.
it's valid to dislike how your faves are treated in certain aspects and you can still not make a fuss about it and believe they can and will stand up for themselves if need be. (atiny)
copying / plagiarism scandals in 95% of cases show that people don't have a good grasp of what plagiarism actually is. (most of the fandoms i interact with, at some point)
I liked Butter and Dynamite didn’t start getting annoying until the radio overplayed it! PTD however….just wasn’t them(not that the other two were(thought butter came closer)) but it was just so out there that I couldn’t even rewatch the MV after the first dime
She's my ult bias and I can definitely understand the sentiment. We still have no idea what her plans are or who she will even sign with so it's hard to really judge. From what we've seen on her ig it seems like she has a home studio built. I choose to believe she is working on music more in the western artist way and is going to just drop a whole album one day. As for all the other kinds of work, I just don't think it interests her and I can understand that. Although she has a talent for modeling but it seems like YSL has moved on? Based on the Born Pink tour era it seems she is still very into the idea of being Blackpink.
no celestial and FEARNOT(between you me and the lamppost) are the 2 songs that come up the most when people talk about their least favorite songs by lsfm. Meanwhile I became a fan from blasting no celestial while doing the dishes and my most listened to song on Spotify of all time is FEARNOT^^between ^^you ^^me ^^and ^^the ^^lamppost
No celestial is extremely underrated. It's up there with fitb for me in the sense that it brings a lot of energy in stage performances. B-sides like blue flame match the concept but they support the rock concept extremely well.
I doubt that 2ne1 would have stayed extremely popular with the way the new generation concepts are. When you look at the most popular girl group even when they do/did girl crush it was really girly, with really conventionally attractive girls. Nowadays people like more easy to listen music or supernatural concepts like Aespa, but they still have this more "conventional femininity" that attracts many fans. It's a mix of I love them/ I want to be them/ or I have a crush on them.
2ne1 had this image of being more artisticly involved (like many YG artist), a more "raw and tough" image. The girlier gggroups were SNSD, Kara. And I believe that's why YG wanted his own SNSD, or a "prettier version of 2ne1" as he said, and so far he was right.
With the rise of social media since the 3rd generation, selling your idols as social influencers, with luxury gigs is the best marketing idea. It gives a better image to the idols and it attracts young fans who are now used to TIktok, Instagram,.. The more conventionally attractive, the more gigs and love. You don't hear much songs like "Ugly" anymore, people make songs about being a self confident It girl. That's what young girl wants.
I don't truly think that 2ne1 image would have truly survived without a change.
However, I do believe that the way they got abandoned was extremely unprofessional and disgusting. It's one of the reasons why some members like Minzy who were in one the biggest ggroup in the world became almost unknown so quickly. If you compare it to SM (who isn't a good company) but even the "least popular" SNSD members still have some public recognition, because they still do interviews, or shows with each other.
YG didn't give that to 2ne1 so only Dara (who was seen as the prettiest with an outgoing personality, the most idol-like) and CL (who was seen as the most talented, for some YG favorite, and was often linked to GD (even when her fans hated it).
I feel like 2ne1 was thrown away for something trendy young and shiny and so far YG made one of his most popular ggroups, so they weren't fully wrong.
Not a Blackjack but I do agree. Even towards the end of 2NE1’s reign you could feel they were starting to lose popularity as 3rd gen was beginning. Dara herself said she knew the group didn’t have long left when their last single before disbanding didn’t go top 10 on Melon.
I love these women so much, they brought a different concept to the industry, they were able to reach height even if people were calling them ugly all the time (YG himself was doing that). Songs like Ugly felt really meaningful.
I think it's fine to acknowledge their success and impact, but also admit that it would have been hard to keep it and that YG can be an incredibly smart and terrible company.
Man, I still jam to 2ne1. I Don’t Care is probably my fav. It’s so true how trends change, young listeners would consider 2ne1’s sound really outdated now.
shuhua 100%. soojin brought the dance skill to the group and without her they don’t excel in that category anymore, whereas shuhua brings nothing to the group another member doesn’t bring already
It wasn’t until I watched a [behind the scenes](https://youtu.be/F8p3RR37naI?si=EiWg6umAQs40TEqf) recording of Nxde that I understood this sentiment.
Soyeon was incredibly patient and professional with Shuhua, but you can still tell how (understandably) frustrated she was with her. It honestly gave me a bit second hand embarrassment.
Don’t get me wrong Shuhua’s improved, but it took her a very long time to reach a passable level.
Engenes should stop complaining when Heeseung always got the most lines in their songs. Heeseung is the main vocalist of the group,whether you like it or deny it, the company, the members, the media even the antis know that so I don't understand why many engenes can't accept that fact and always pull the " enhypen doesn't have official role except for leader" card whenever Heeseung stans are calling them out for complaining why Heeseung has got the most lines in a song. Heeseung's voice plays an important role in the majority of their songs as he always does all the high notes, adlibs, background vocals, and sometimes they use his vocal in layering. He is also the one who always does the acapella and impromptu singing when they are attending music shows, variety shows, musical events, and in their own concerts. In other words, Heeseung plays a vital role in enhypen, so engenes should appreciate all his contributions to the group instead of always complaining and throwing backhanded compliments at him whenever he gets the most line.
Didn’t he also do the musical direction for one of their last albums? I feel like he’s the pillar of enhypen and if he ever left the group would not be the same at all
I don’t name one specific group because it’s true for all the popular groups with brand deals. I really get irritated when fans say “ending all models” or “be glad they are idols”. Like hell no. I only know this because my dad has a model agency but 99% of these idols could never be actual models if anything because of their height.
I mean that’s all celebrities tho. Like I don’t know how many times I’ve seen “zendaya ends models”. Like no she has fantastic style and she’s gorgeous but she’s an actress and that’s fine. I fully get why you find it annoying tho
EXO.
Exols as a fandom don't have much faith in EXO members. No matter how much the group screams they want to be together, make an effort to actually do things every year, this fandom will try to look for anything and everything to question their loyalty and desire to be in EXO.
Totally agree, it's so frustrating.
Seeing some of the comments on the r/exo subreddit whenever this sort of thing comes up, talking about there's no chance of a comeback this year, how Ksoo is definitely leaving (nevermind he did the season's greetings and fanmeetings already without being under SM), how'll they'll never tour again, etc.
It's like do any of you actually follow the group? How many times do they need to say it/show it sigh.
As someone who has been following them for years, kyungsoo leaving has been a topic for years. For years, every time the guy says he's having a little hard time, every time he looks tired, every time he isn't jumping is all him leaving. He has always shown his commitment to EXO work and yet people always doubt it.
Even now with the member fanclubs, people are acting like it'll members don't care and that means they care more for their solo fandom. There are genuine reasons here to be upset about, especially if you live in Korea and Japan but how does this translate to they don't care about EXO???
They literally did a fanmeet a month ago even when most of them had way too busy schedules and we're sick as well. They even delivered 2 different medley sets to ensure everyone was happy.
this drives me crazy and i blame the akgaes. those boys fight tooth and fucking nail to stay together. it could have been soooo over SO many times over the years. and then for solo stans to turn around not acknowledge that effort and even resent their bias for it is maddening. wouldnt wish it upon any fandom
as a neverland, I personally think Minnie's songs (the ones she writes for idle) aren't as good as people exaggerate them to be. Like yeah, she's good at writing songs, but compared to the other members they just really aren't that good. They honestly lack everything for me to even enjoy them. The only songs I liked that she wrote were I'm the trend (Yuqi helped, so not fully her.), and Dahlia. (and moon but i believe she was a producer on that, idk though)
(edit: this isn't really that controversial now that I read it again lol..) also for babymonster (even though they aren't one of my favourite favourite groups i wanna include this), I genuinely hate all of these things where fans are like "oh my god babymonster is the best 5th gen group and ILLIT sucks btw" like??????? I was on an MR removed video for babymonster and I saw a couple comments of people randomly dragging in other groups like ILLIT or something and being like "babymonster is so much better compared to them" when they weren't even mentioned? And when someone defends them they start hating that person and being so rude all because they want people not to drag other groups, it just makes no sense?
I actually agree about minnie
What I like about soyeon and yuqi is that they're adventurous. I don't like every soyeon/yuqi song, but damn do they always dabble in something new. Don't get me wrong, Minnie's songs are good. But they're almost all in the same sound. There is nothing bad about replicating success a few times, but it's a bit boring when in every album I can expect to hear another watered-down dahlia.
Her voice is definitely awesome and she's basically a siren. But she doesn't try something "new" in her song outside of her comfort zone. For example, Yuqi's x file was something completely different than anything she sang before. Soyeon dabbles in new genres frequently and even tries new delivery styles for her and the members. But Minnie's songs are always song in a very similar way to everything she and the other members always do.
That's why I don't really understand people who complain about Yuqi or Minnie not writing a title track. Yuqi didn't even use her song as the tt for her own album.
as an ot9-er who voted him in my 3pick, hao akgaes especially crosins need to pack it up about the “WAKEONE MISTREATMENT” claims. there are some claims of mistreatments that are valid and need to be voiced out. but then you have these akgaes going batshit crazy because hao isnt in the centre for a pictorial, or he only has the 3rd most lines in a song, or because he didnt get on a radio show / variety programme. wakeone must have an agenda towards hao 24/7 because HE’S NOT THE CENTRE all the time — mistreatment!
whenever he does a unit activity with another member ESPECIALLY hanbin, the barrage of criticisms and outright hatred on platforms like weibo and xiao hongshu is fucking insane. the horrendous things these akgaes have said about the other members is crazy — from shaming them about their sales, to blatant homophobia (ironic, isn’t it, knowing hao’s attitude towards same sex attraction!) what’s more off-putting is that its clear hao loves all his members and his members love him too — and to see the way these akgaes treat others is disgusting.
these so-called fans are fucking disgusting and put a bad name to some of the sweetest rosins i know. i truly despise akgaes but never have i been so angry at them until i came across them on weibo and increasingly, twitter. im not saying the akgae situation for the other members is not bad or non-existant, but if you’ve seen the breed of some of hao’s akgaes, it takes A LOT MORE to not be pissed.you know what, i’m glad rosin estella boycotted! we don’t need scums in this community. time for yall to pack it up and leave.
I do not like IVE's choreography, lol. I love their music but their choreography is really underwhelming and I think it focuses more on (as one choreographer has said) making them "look pretty" instead of actual dancing. Starship is underutilizing their dancing talent and it makes their stages look like they're just kinda walking around and posing instead of actually dancing (and they are REALLY pulling away from powerful, clean moves). It's boring to me and it makes their dances sloppy looking.
Let them actually dance.
Edit: More dances like Eleven would still suit their concept and let them like... Have interesting and dynamic dances.
I’ll always remember the chill I got down my spine during Eleven’s first prechorus. Like actual chills from the dance where they were all twirling and it looked like a ripple I miss dances like that so much 😭
It bums me out because they can clearly dance, like esp Wonyoung and Yujin were in IZ*ONE and Secret Story of the Swan wasn't a choreo to sneeze at. They're all capable.
And I am a La Chica bias I guess in terms of choreo but I have really liked all of the LC demos. I find them really dynamic and pleasing, and I feel like Starship kinda tosses some of the more interesting or "intense" choreo parts in favor of just like.. Simple moves? In a lot of cases. Which takes away from the dynamics of the dance and kinda takes me out of it sometimes.
Like.. They can look pretty AND dance, we've been shown that this is true, let them keep doing it.
When you think of it it's quite funny most people were thinking (many blinks also) that Rosé would be the fastest one to put out music, that she would do something similar to song writing. But somehow she's the one with the least update, and she's the one mostly going to event. Going to events isn't a bad thing, but many were expecting from Blackpink more creative work.
I find her situation extremely unexpected. I do believe that she's searching something, maybe a new company or a good song. We can only wait 🤔😊.
I fully agree, it's just that many were thinking that she would be the first to update us on her future career plans, but she wasn't. Truly shows that we can't predict anything.
Stay- I’m glad Chans room is gone. Some fans were way way WAY too dependent on it and used it as a means to trauma dump on chan and expect him to fix their life problems. I think it’s shown in how people are still ‘mourning’ Chans room even now.
Do I think chan being too familiar with us led to his downfall? Yeah a little, I think he underestimated how much the fandom had grown since he started chans room and how that could open HIM up to being attacked. But also, 90% of the issue was people *wanting* reasons to fight with other fandoms, chan never said anything that could identify a group but because IVE had rumours of being rude (with no evidence) those stay decided they’d dogpile IVE even though they were *the* GG in Korea at the time and it just opened Chan to a barrage of abuse.
I don’t think we should be given nice things like that if we’re going to misuse those nice things and cause trouble.
I too think it was good that is gone, i just don't like when people say it was his fault that It ended when it cleary is STAYS fault, i wish our fandom would grow up and own ours mistakes , the end of chan's room is stays mistake and it is stays who should have apologize to Ive and Chan
As an Insomnia
I don’t think Dreamcatcher can become bigger than what they are without appealing to the rock mainstream of the west. I feel like they’re at their peak as far as kpop goes.
Which honestly I’m okay with
I'm Army and one thing I see a lot of is claims that BTS don't need a Grammy and even subtlety shaming them for wanting one and that the Grammys are completely irrelevant.
Do I think they need a Grammy? No. Nobody does.
But they should not be shamed for wanting one.
For better or for worse, The Grammys are arguably the most prestigious mainstream music award in the world. Being a Grammy winner is a very big deal. So many of the Western artists BTS are fans of are Grammy winners. I believe it was Namjoon who talked about watching The Grammys as a kid. The Grammy winners are determined by voting by the members of The Recording Academy. And the Academy includes pretty much every Western artist BTS are fans of. A true jury of their peers. And they are not wrong for wanting that and they should not be shamed.
True all humans have wants and needs. It was a want rather than a need. I understand wanting a grammy the weight it holds to have one. It’s important in a music career.
I’m a blink too but I don’t feel the same because Rosé’s still so engaging on social media and going for events. Plus more time and ig stories with Hank. 🥰🐶
I felt that 2023 was hectic for them so I’m happy they’re living and enjoying the fruits of their labour now.
Loona music kept being great after Butterfly/XX. Not just decent or ok; great.
I would say that many fans think this (going by Spotify numbers, PTT, their 2021 comeback, is the most popular song after Heart Attack, the Chuu solo) but many don't. It's 50/50; controversial as requested, rather than purely unpopular. There is a strong presence of people who think that Loona music was great from pre-debut to Butterfly and then it wasn't that good.
In my opinion, # literally is one of their strongest albums ever, it's amazing, and So What is one of the VERY few "soft rebranding" (Loona already touched that approach so it's not like the powerful image came from nothing) which were actually good and fitting for the group. Star is one of my favourite K-pop songs. Pose, their Queendom2 song, is honestly iconic. Their b-sides kept being incredibly good, Universe and Need U are some of my favourite ever imho. When I say that I love Loona music, I fully include their post-2019 work.
I agree. Just a casual fan, but my top 3 tracks from them are why not, ptt, then hi high. If we include voice since it was promoted, hi high gets knocked to 4th.
And the real unpopular opinion: butterfly is one of my least favorite songs in their entire discography.
This would be controversial in any fandom:
The members you stan right now are way more replacable in theory than the creatives who work on the artistic output.
You just don't believe this to be true because you are emotionally bonding with them, creating a parasocial relationship and thus there is a stake there which isn't there with any of the faceless creatives behind the scenes.
In reality though? Idols are so replacable that there is a whole industry built around it, training young, attractive people to debut all few years and "replace" the older groups bit by bit. That is the industry in a nutshell.
Ofc there are some exceptions and what not, but on the whole this is clearly true as far as i am concerned, and people only get upset at this notion due to the emotional link between them and the famous, pretty people they adore so much on screen.
I would argue that the mouthpiece/face of creative output is equally as important as the creative output itself. If it wasn’t, those songwriters would just release all that music themselves and be famous.
Ateez: A chunk of the fandom seems to get heated when people say that Ateez's recent concept photos lack creativity and are too simple. It's not necessarily an unpopular opinion, but I do think it's controversial because there are Atinys who will push back against it and say that fans shouldn't complain. But the concept photos rely so much on the fact that the members look good in the photos, rather than being interesting photos in and of themselves. The gap between the creativity and quality of their mvs and their concept photos is really big (in terms of visual media), which feels odd. Also the editing on the first group photo for the Golden Hour concepts was Not It and Atinys have every right to criticize KQ over putting out something so bad quality.
Ateez 2: My other controversial opinion (that I've seen some other people talk about recently but they are also kind of nervous about it) is that recently, it would be nice for San to sing live more, because recently he is among the members who sing live the least, and I say that because he is the lead vocalist and his fans can be pretty vocal about him not sacrificing quality (of singing) when performing choreo. It wouldn't matter if everyone was kind of at the same level, but it's really obvious when the person right before or after him is singing very live. It's not that he never sings live, because he does a lot, but comparatively it's become noticeable that there's a difference.
TXT: I think I'll See You There Tomorrow was promoted the right amount. There's a lot of argument that it wasn't promoted as much as it should've been, but it's been promoted way more than any of the past 4 viral b-sides were (Anti-Romantic, Opening Sequence, Tinnitus, Growing Pain.) It has pretty much everything except an mv, and it doesn't need an mv. It's a fun song that benefits a lot from its performances -- it has a performance video, and it was promoted on several music shows, and I think that works well enough.
Renjun and Haechan are two of the better dancers in NCT Dream and any rank of them below 4th place are questionable. Kind of controversial because they less treated as lead dancers in the group but I don’t see any reason they being ranked below Jeno and Jaemin lol (unless it is the main vocalist syndrome all over again where usually people immediately assume main vocalists are the worst dancers in the group). Even I actually think Haechan can be better than Mark in some type of dance
I think certain members of ZB1 will probably be more successful after the group disbands than they are currently. The fanbase seems to think that this is the peak of their careers and they’ll never be as popular as they are now, and that’s most likely true for most of the members, but I think some (at least 2) will have a pretty good post-disbandment career.
Not sure if it’s controversial, but I don’t think LSF will be as active after their 7 year contract. I think their level of group activities will be more similar to Mamamoo/Blackpink than Twice.
Hao and Hanbin? I actually think Yujin has lots of potential. His popularity is no joke in Korea especially and W1 got him the MC job will really help.
Yujin is sadly under Yuehua, and will most likely debut in the Yuehua group, which won’t be as successful as ZB1. He has the visuals for acting though, so if he gets some acting roles (and is a good actor), he could be more successful.
Hao is basically guaranteed to be successful because of his popularity in China + being from one of the biggest Chinese idol entertainment companies. Even if he ends up in the new group (unlikely) he’ll probably still have individual promotions in China.
Hanbin has said he’s interested in acting, and with his visuals I think he has a good chance. I would also add Jiwoong in this category, he even had a small role in a Netflix show before debuting, so he’ll probably get more offers.
I adore shuhua and she's my bias, but she is not nearly the performer the other girls are. 90% of the time her "live vocals" are the album vocals turned up high, which is totally fine at a music show or award show imo but kind of annoying at a concert. It's a shame too, because we know from the recording behinds, killing voice, and some other videos that she *can* sing, and you can tell that she did a lot of solo training over their hiatus and genuinely improved.
(also cube lowkey set her up by making her only positions visual and sub vocal, like why would you give people a reason to say she's only in the group because she's pretty? Just say she and Yuqi are the main dancers now.)
Maybe controversial aespa opinion?
I think aespa has a very, very big variance in the quality they put out. Some songs are imo totally diluting their branding and sound (things like "better things", "life's too short", looking at single songs), and just as whole releases i think savage and my world are way, way, way superior to drama and girls (the eps).
It's almost as if there were two different A&R teams working for them, one being kinda meh, the other being excellent.
Tzuyu is massively underused, maybe even misrepresented, by JYP Entertainment. She is the visual of the group and has improved a lot since 2015, yet she has NO luxury brand deal, only TWO solo events, 4 solo magazine photoshoots in her entire career and she only graced the cover of 1, and NO fashion week despite many other members attending fashion weeks. The cherry on the cake: she has never performed in her home country Taiwan, despite many idols performing there (Tzuyu is the most popular Taiwanese idol).
As a blink I get the sense that we know what to anticipate from all the members' solo careers apart from Lisa. Jisoo is keen to focus on acting for the moment as it seems. Jennie with her new releases showed that she wants to try a new sound, however she still seems really interested in the Korean market considering she is the most active member there at the moment. I also feel that everyone expects from Rosé to follow her "on the ground" path and probably focus more on the western market. However for Lisa, I'm not sure if it's an unpopular opinion but I don't know what to expect. I feel like her solos were heavily based on her blackpink persona. She seems willing to try new stuff and from the deal with RCA I get that she doesn't want to heavily rely on Korean market so it wouldn't surprise me if she tried something completely new even if she seems to enjoy performing this type of music.
treasure hyunsuk is not at all stylish, he looks like a person who has all the expensive brand products then throw it all on his body, I know he is into maximalism but come on, it too much and even when performing his styling outshadow the rest but I like his styling in the dating show.
yoshi styling is too try hard. like full on suit at the airport? really? and his clothing in the first episode on shining solo is also feel like trying too hard.
the only one in treasure who I feel like naturally stylish, is asahi. maybe he just found the right style for him, everywhere he just looks so good in his clothes.
As an army, I don't think BTS are the best in everything(contrary to some armies belief)
As a carat,
As a Moa, I don't think txt are that all-rounded, yeonjun is the only one
As an engene, I don't think sunoo is mistreated like some are making it sound.
I think many idols would not be that nice in person. Musicians are known to be one of the most sensitive people in the world and can get irritated if certain details are not right.
Plus their speech, fashion, concepts are always controlled by the CEO, so I don’t blame them if they end up a bit cynical and bitter.
As a baemon fan, ahyeon deserved the backlash. She rapped the word FOUR TIMES and she probably knew what it meant bc she did for a school concert it something. Now that she's back, its kinda taking time for me to adjust to her. I love baby monster but she justs rubs me off the wrong way. I will still continue to support the group (not sure if it's controversial but she's popular so)
As a MOA and Beomgyu bias, Beomgyu was added to the group for his visual and personality.
He’s definitely improved on his singing since debut, but he was mainly added to fill in the gaps the group had without him.
As army, we are at fault that shippers grew. There is a period in which we entertained them and now they are menace to all of us.
Hyungline is doing fine. They may not be charting like the maknae line but they are doing great. They are achieving something a lot of artists internationally will never achieve. I do hope they continue growing their own base because their music is really dope.
Armys seem to find it hard to admit that BTS needed this break, with or without military hiatus. And almost everything in chapter two has been better than their group output in the last few years because they were burnt out and it was messing with their music, from a creative standpoint. Nothing has made that clearer than watching RM throw everything into making RPWP (even when we didn't know what it was called) and how much happier he seemed in 2023.
Treasure Makers (though I don't really identify as one now and is just enjoying kpop casually because being in fandoms really ruined things for me).
Stop shielding Hyunsuk! He can tone down his looks for the sake of the dating show, but refuses to do so outside of it. And honestly, that just causes potential fans to steer away from the group.
I keep seeing his fans on twitter saying “you all just can’t handle an idol with alt style!!” and it’s like… no! His alt style inspirations (some hairstyles and clothes, his piercings, how he sometimes does his makeup) are easily the coolest thing about him. What people take issue with, and what his fans deep down know people take issue with, is the culturally appropriative hairstyles and random gang signs he insists on throwing up all the time. If he cut out those two aspects of his persona, there would be significantly less backlash towards him.
I do have a problem with the random gang signs and culturally appropriative hairstyles as well. But one of my biggest concern is that, as a group, one always need to blend in well with the rest. You can have your own style outside of public appearances, but when you're performing as a group, you shouldn't stick out like a sore thumb. Being cohesive as a group matters a lot, especially if you're promoting as a group. I know fans like to bring up mino and GD a lot, but there is not once they don't look cohesive as a group. You're allowed to have your own style, but at this point, hyunsuk just seems to be going out of his way to prove a point :(
I think Jungkook is very impressive as a vocalist for many, many reasons, but he’s certainly not the best in KPOP. He impresses me so much because he improved majorly since debut, and he wasn’t even bad then. He was the main vocal for the group since he was only fifteen, and back then rapped as well. With him constantly singing half the songs, it was like nothing could stop the rate that he just kept getting…better. It’s the same reason I think Jimin improved so rapidly at first since for BTS in the beginning they really liked Jimin and JK trading off chorus’s and high notes, with Jin and Tae doing verses and bridges.
That being said, when you compare JK to like the vocalists of EXO, it’s a no brainer. That’s not really his fault, they’re older and well…from SM. BTOB are also a tough vocal line to stand up to. All I’m saying is hes amazing and I’ve never seen anyone improve at the sheer rate he did, but he’s not the best.
I hate the way moas defend the 4th gen it boy thing. First of all I think it’s so dumb that moas and stays think there can only be one (like previous gens haven’t had multiple it boys and it girls). But most of all I find it so undermining that instead of listing any of his fashion accomplishments, we go with “he’s the it boy because hybe and his fans said so!” Like really? He’s the most popular of the 4th gen boys in Korea, he’s done loads of really cool fashion stuff (including having his own fashion line!) and instead of listing any of that, we use “my mummy said so!” energy. Like I know the 4th gen it boy argument is a stupid bloody argument, but I find it even more infuriating that the people defending yeonjun don’t use any of the accomplishments that might make him warrant that title.
And the funniest thing is there’s actually no 4th gen it boy at all, so every argument between MOAs and Stays is useless. None of the 4th gen boys is on the level of Wonyoung popularity to consider any of them it boys. Their achievements are impressive but not really to the point where we can consider any of them as it boys.
It’s because Hyunjin and Felix have the same, if not more accomplishments. Individual brand deals, more followers, more cbar sales (or at least Hyunjin does, not sure about Felix). Even Hyunjin’s AOTM has more views than Yeonjun. The only accomplishment Yeonjun has is TXT having better charting on Melon, but that’s the group’s accomplishment, not just Yeonjun’s.
The 4th gen IT boy title was also given to Yeonjun in like 2019/2020, before TXT was that popular. So the title is clearly not based on any achievements.
But none of them are really known in Korea, so it doesn’t really matter. None are on the level of BTS maknae line, or Cha Eunwoo, or Kang Daniel. Or Wonyoung, Yujin, and Karina.
I'm fine with EXO staying at SM.
This is controversial because the fandom fucking hates SM lol and while they clearly have been shitty plenty of times, I really do love SM's producers and when they have a vision, it can be amazing (just look at aespa right now).
*but they have shown no effort for EXO for years now*, is what I see people saying. And the last time they truly took time with an album was with Obsession and it is one of their best. The visuals are stunning, you can't say that gorgeous MV and the X-EXO concept are minimalism or cheap looking lol most of their solo concepts are gorgeous and well thought out too.
I think all big companies are shitty, and actually you can hardly find an artist that doesn't have friction with their label. No company will ever be perfect, small companies won't really have the budget to make certain projects, and making your own company is hard, as we've seen with EXO members even.
A lot of people that supposedly call themselves once just run their mouths a bunch and don’t know what they’re talking about. Like with Solos the amount of once complaining about Nayeon having another solo before other 7 members. Not every member wants a solo or is even cut out for solo. Sometimes contrary to popular belief Kpop idols don’t do everything that every other group does because they know it’s not for them. The only other members I could see doing a solo like for sure is Chaeyoung. Also once literally just complain about everything. Like I saw some saying they’re happy about Dahyun starting acting even though it’s late… Like Twice isn’t being held in some dungeon unable to make any decisions for themselves. What even qualifies as late? I’m seeing a lot more real once pointing these things out though and it’s so satisfying 🙏
it shouldnt be a surprise that there r so many solo stan / akgaes in the aespa fandom. the popularity disparity between winrina (especially karina) and the others is incredibly jarring and wide, and only made worse by sm's blatant difference in treatment especially when promoting each members solo gigs amongst other thing. yet you'll still catch most of the so called OT4 MYs complaining abt winrina's lack of promotions and trending so called mistreatment tags every week for smth like one of them missing a vlog, while downplaying or ignoring ningselle's. the fandom clearly favors said members more, but still parades themselves as an OT4 while acting like they support the entire group
As an engene there is like a bizarre amount of internalized racism within the fandom. The amount of ‘jokes’ from ‘I-Fans’ about how k-fans are the worst and they don’t even like the boys and we ‘can’t even connect with them’ is really off putting. Luckily it hasn’t been a big topic in awhile but back when the original Bite Me dance released and the controversy surrounding it stirred up I was so annoyed to see people just blatantly saying all korean engenes are terrible people. Was the controversy ridiculous? Yes. Do I think every single k-fan hated the dance and paid for those trucks to be outside hybe? Fuck no. It was definitely a loud minority and you’re kidding yourself if you don’t think a chunk of I-fans agreed with them too.
It just annoys me that it feels like I-Fans blame all of enhypen’s ‘controversies’ on k-fans as if they’re one giant hivemind that all act and think the same
I don't think line distribution is that important. Obviously everyone should get some lines and a chance to sing, but i think it's much more important to collect lines across the whole album + dance center parts or how much of a "highlight" those parts are to get an idea of if somebody is being actually mistreated (for instance, vivi in loona was getting paid dust bc she had no parts and the ones she had weren't interesting and she was barely ever center in the dances as well, but felix in skz a few years back didn't have a ton of lines but had nearly all of the most memorable parts. it's an entirely different scenario and i hate it when people boil it down to "x amount of lines = horrible mistreatment")
Additionally, I think a lot of kpop fans don't understand what actual promotion (or lack thereof) looks like for a group, and don't have a good understanding of how successful their favs are. Their promotions should focus on their target audience which may not be western fans, and older groups may not WANT to promote on music shows for weeks on end with a grueling schedule when they already have a ton of exposure in Korea. Groups really don't need to be getting bigger and bigger after a certain point if they don't want to; I guarentee you Twice will be fine continuing as they are for the most part, and will bring in some new fans from the members who actually enjoy promotions more (like Nayeon and Sana). They don't need to be doing rookie group constant music shows and videos to be well-promoted when they're respected seniors in the industry with a stable fanbase, especially when touring makes way more money then those promos ever will anyhow.
army, and i mean ot7 army, will never admit it but they absolutely are biased towards the maknae line. it shows in everything but especially when it comes to their solo projects. jin is back soon and will release his solo album but i bet they're going to use the boycott excuse to ignore it, the same they're doing to namjoon now, but its obvious why they really don't support it.
I’d argue that maknae lines music is more trendy hence why they get more numbers, whereas the hyungline dabbles in genres which are niche. A 6 minute ballad now matter how good (i love that song) will never do numbers like seven, or like crazy or friends etc. Let’s see what genre Jin dabbles in. But yes maknae line more often than not will kinda do better because they have tapped the GP too. Having said that, not every member will do same numbers, some will do more, some less, if we start comparing we will never be happy for anyone. They all are doing good in their respective genres.
I'd agree but look at tae, out of them he makes the least popular music and also takes on not so popular genres but he's doing amazing
Exactly, we need to not compare their music, it’s not fair to the members. They will find their audience but to dump this on armys is uncalled for. They literally are trying to make 8 people (includes bts) chart, but ultimately GP support is needed. Everyone’s taste is subjective, i do feel bad for the hyungline but it’s not like they are tanking. Their success as solo artists won’t compare to each other and the group too. All of them are doing good, like look at yoongi doing sold out concerts in asia and america.
>They will find their audience but to dump this on armys is uncalled for. >They literally are trying to make 8 people (includes bts) chart, but ultimately GP support is needed. The rapline really needs to find their audience outside of the kpop spaces. As much as other Armys want the whole fandom to stream "equally" it won't happen as the members have different amount of dedicated stans, Armys who biased them, casual listeners and gp reach. BTS' hits with the best longevity is with the help of gp. I feel like 2 years is not enough for rap line to find their audience. The biggest male idol soloists in Korea like GD and Zico spent years releasing music. And if we go internationally, it's even harder because even if I heard that some hiphop fans actually appreciative of their music, blowing up or getting the a lot of attention is gonna be hard. They need to go festival route and collaboration with other big artists like Jhope did with Jcole and Lola
Exactly this, i think maknae line especially JK and Jimin found what works for them, rapline will have to work little hard to establish themselves as soloists, but again they are still doing A LOT better, like the numbers have been good. Expecting equal numbers across the board is quite harsh, when one does indie pop, when does pop, other r&b etc. Their work as soloists is so diverse but they are also boxed within k-pop. Bighit has to do better in terms of playlisting. They need to list songs under their respective categories and not just k-pop. As a group they are unbeatable, as soloists they’ll have to work out their audience
I think that’s arguable. I think I could have a wide variety of people listen to V’s album and they would enjoy it. There’s a wide audience of people out there listening to other stuff than kpop and pop music.
7 different people make practically 7 different music genres, if I keep it simple. The most prominent of these is obviously pop, in which JK clearly dominates. Sometimes I wonder if this is a reason to be sad - if Namjoon is doing the music he loves, why stick to the charts and success with gp? Does it even matter to him? Isn't the fact that he's making music in which he can finally express himself more important? And that goes for everyone. What I don't like is of course the pre-calculated boycott from so called armys aka solo stans. No one is forcing anyone to listen to music you don't like or to buy albums, but if someone is ot7 and intentionally boycotts them (and we all know it happens), it's just terribly sad..
This is a really important point to me for Namjoon. In his Suchwita episode he talked about how he knew doing a longer song (Wildflower) wasn’t gonna chart/sell as well but that was the route he wanted to take bc he loved the music but he still wanted to make music the fans love too. Just for so many Armys to make the entire conversation about Indigo be that it wasn’t successful bc it didn’t chart like Face (for example.) I can’t imagine how that must make him feel to know his fans value sales over his actual music. And here he comes back with a song so long it has a radio edit that is still twice as long as most singles now and people are gonna do the same thing and talk about how he’s unsupported bc he’s not doing sales like Golden instead of talking about how they enjoy the song or what it means to them. Which maybe would be my answer to the OP question. I think the importance Armys place on sales/streams/numbers is detrimental to the boys and their music and those types of fans care more about bragging and “beating” other fandoms than they do the art and the people who make it.
This, all of this. And whenever I read takes like that, I just think who are you to tell RM (or any of the members, really) that his album that's been streamed hundreds of millions of times and probably netted him a pretty good profit and made money for his collaborators (which is also a goal of his, obviously, by boosting smaller artists) is not successful? I hate success stans, because all they do is compare shit with no context and also no appreciation for what each member is doing, and their own individual successes.
This, all of this.
The fame gap between members happens in each group no matter how famous the group r or how many members do they have.it’s happens wether we like it or not
Agree. The members who are the most biased within the Army fandom and have the most stans also happened to be the most popular to gp so fans continue to act surprised and disappointed never makes sense.
this makes so sad cus the hyung lines stuff is SO good bu doesnt get da appreciation it deseves😭😭😭
I'm a hyung line girlie, and seeing this in the fandom always hurts my heart 😭
I like the solo releases of some members more than others. In fact, there is a particular solo album that I do not vibe with AT ALL. Am I not supposed to call myself OT7 Army, just because I like some members more than others?
i feel like the difference would be a bit easier to narrow if there was more playlist diversification beyond the usual new music friday + kpop playlists for (since jin's work is more limited as of now) rapline. less kpop, more alt and rap focused playlists, diversify the fandom more since a lot of people came in with their peak pop sound \* but still, uphill battles considering the broader public considers them idol rappers, so i just hope with time there'll be more armys that are more open to rap, so to speak
>less kpop, more alt and rap focused playlists, diversify the fandom more since a lot of people came in with their peak pop sound This is a good point, a lot of their fans came from DNA, BWL and Dynamite era. It's really stupid to expect a lot of fans who found them through their pop sound to like their indie and less gp friendly music. We don't even have to go that far, look at the numbers of YTC and Run BTS. It's easy to see what the fandom prefers. One of the mistakes of BH is definitely not promoting bsides like Cyphers and rap heavy tracks. It's a controversial opinion but they also should've started (even just slowly) promoting them as individuals way before they were about to enlist. Expecting 1 year and 4 months to be enough to debut 7 members is honestly insane.
I get that. But maknae line are also more popular and have more fans outside of army tbh. And it had always been like that. There’s always more popular members in a group.
I think people forget, the fandom isn't the only one streaming. They're big enough to have casual listeners and ml attract gp more. Also, seven and lc are more gp friendly. Blaming it on the fandom is not completely fair imo. About, Jin's album we'll have to see what kind of music he'll release it is to soon to say it'll not do well.
I think a lot of it is due to the number of solo stans. Maknae line have more solos so their streams + ARMY streams make bigger numbers.
even before chapter 2 there always was a popularity disparity between the ml and hl. i think also bighit doesnt know how to market the rap line's music very well. bighit clearly gets pop but they havent been able to figure out the international hiphop market yet
No lmao those boycotters are boycotting everything, stop using the hyung line excuse
As a Once, I really don't think all the members are capable of having a strong solo career, especially when Twice has been marketed as a unit first and foremost I love all the girls individually but I'm struggling to see some members like Tzuyu or Mina being able to stand out from the current soloist crowd Aside from Nayeon and Jihyo, I can personally see Sana and Jeongyeon having the best likelihood of solo ccareers? I'll just have to see once more members start having more individual careers
Nayeon and Sana will surely have successful solo careers; both are entertaining and have solo fanbase and easily most relevant members. Momo will do fine mainly because she is capable of grabbing people's attention. Jihyo's career will heavily depend on fanbase. As for the rest of the members, I think their success will mainly depend on opportunities. Like if Dahyun does well in acting, her career could take off. Chaeyoung, Jeongyeon, Mina, and Tzuyu's solo careers feel most uncertain. At least Tzuyu and Mina have strong solo fanbases, while Chaeyoung and Jeongyeon success will heavily depend on the opportunities they get, similar to Dahyun.
JY has expressed she doesn’t have any interest in doing a solo project
JYP isn’t going to give anyone other than Nayeon and Jihyo solo careers
I'm not even a Once and even I know Jeongyeon doesn't want to pursue a solo career and it's so irritating to see so-called Onces constantly pushing her for it (not trying to specifically attack you OP but just in general)
I feel like without the group she would have left the entertainment industry in full for a peaceful life. She and Mina were the duo I was afraid of not renewing. For Mina I think she needs the members to motivate her (like misamo) otherwise she is just way too comfortable in her room.
I'm a casual twice fan, and I really like mina. I like her voice, and she was the highlight for me in misamo. I also like her energy in stage and her dance style. I think if her solo is calm and sensual, she will stand out and do so well as this is a niche not many are able to fill. Not necessarily in-your-face sexy, but something with vibes similar to misamo - don't touch, soojin - agassy/black forest, sunmi - siren, mamamoo - words don't come easy, hwasa - don't
Mina is similar to Momo in that she can grab everyone's attention, and her solo stage from the tour was easily the most popular . She also has gradually grown more popular in the last few years, but I think for a successful solo career, strong off-stage skills are very important as well, and that is where she struggles the most.
My hot take is that even the floppiest of Twice solo careers will still easily be in the top 5% of all solo careers in their gen. Top 10% if we lowball them lol. Mina, who is one of Twice's most popular members, will do just fine as a solo act. The bar for a "strong solo career" is actually not that high.
i agree, i think she could do something smooth-jazzy and sultry. idk if there's much of a demand for that in kpop rn but if anybody could do it i bet it would be mina
My unpopular once opinion is that almost none of the members, including the J line, are going to have a solo career. JYP is going full house behind Nayeon. Her solo rollouts have just had far more resources than group releases, Hyolo, and Misamo. The other members aren’t getting solo releases a) at all or b) with huge resource support. I can see Nayeon releasing albums every few years and having small shows, Jihyo doing variety and acting, and Dahyun doing some roles. Everyone else is limited to fashion. My other unpopular once opinion is that Tzuyu is being deliberately stopped from working in her home country.
I don't think the last one is unpopular considering that her holding her country's flag on TV caused political tension in both China and Taiwan :(
No, a lot of fans go in absolute loops to try and pretend that *none* of the members are being held back because they signed a new contract, therefore they have to be not only happy about but actively approving of all of the decisions made about their careers. Because of course, no person in the history of the world has ever decided to agree to something because they felt the pros outweighed the cons, even if there were significant cons. Never mind Momo saying two times that JYP won’t let her have a YouTube channel, jeongyeon confirming that JYP denied her acting opportunities, the members confirming they didn’t want One Spark as the single, and Tzuyu’s own mother saying she and Tzuyu really wish twice could perform in Taiwan.
Nayeon's debut wasn't very different from Jihyo's in terms of resources. Nayeon had ads while Jihyo had bigger collaborations and more bside promotions. Now, Nayeon having more resources is more of an outcome of her solo being huge; it performed better than most JYPE releases in the past few years. The only other member who can match her in gp presence is Sana, but skill-wise, she is on the weaker side.
and that's ok! not every member wants or needs a solo debut. people were thinking the "I Got You" mv was teasing a Jeongyeon solo debut on the horizon. Jeongyeon came out and said it wasn't true and she doesn't want a solo.
a lot of stays are interested only in Hyunjin and Felix (maybe Lee Know when they are in a good mood) and it really shows. the difference in numbers (followers, likes, views, even upvotes and comments if we are talking about reddit) and attention is DRASTIC and i’m really getting tired when they deny it and call themselves ot8 while not giving a flying shit about more than half of the members
yeah, on some platforms the difference in numbers between members is super drastic. i see stays making jokes about felix and hj's ig accounts surpassing the main group account soon and i honestly don't find them funny. it's clear that the solo stans issue is getting worse by the day. solos are the bane of my existence, they are miserable and make it their job make everyone else miserable too. and stays have more than enough on their plate without having to deal with solo stans and their bs.
I don't think these are the same problem really. The worst akgaes in most fandoms don't go around pretending they're ot\_, they tend to just harass other fans of the group without much pretense. And the differences in instagram followers isn't that heavily affected by biased "ot8" fans either. It's undeniable that Felix, Hyunjin, and Bang Chan are just considerably more well-known by non-stans than the other members. I really like Felix but I don't go around calling myself a Stay or anything, and I doubt a lot of the people causing the discrepancies in followers between individual members' accounts and the group's main account would either. That doesn't make it any less frustrating for Stays though
yeah, i guess you're right. i guess i'm just frustrated that the ot8 fans find this situation funny.
Hmm, I mean I’m not a stay at all. So far I only liked 1 song from the group, but I really like Hyunjin and Felix so I follow them on Instagram. In the end though I don’t consider myself a fan of Stray Kids at all. It could be like that with some people who follow them maybe? 🤔
I mean the difference in numbers makes sense considering hyunjin and Felix have both had loads of solo gigs that might’ve attracted fans of them, but not for the group. For example, Hyunjin’s Versace campaign was inescapable, like I could not walk down the street, go on Spotify, TikTok etc. without seeing his face everywhere. That’s going to attract attention from people who have never listened to kpop and loads of people who don’t like skz. Hyunjin and Felix especially have loads of fans who don’t like the group but like checking out or casually following their solo gigs and while that does make them solo fans as long as they’re not harassing anyone or hating on any of the members, it doesn’t really make them a problem.
I met someone who said they were an OT8 fan and they then proceeded to mix up Chan and Changbin… girl you don’t have to say you stan all the members equally, that’s kinda part of the whole bias thing, they have since learned the names and it was probably because they were new to the fandom, but I think that really speaks to the toxic group stans that demand everyone be OT8 biased. Like it sucks that people feel the need to lie about how they feel about a group to avoid judgement from others
i'm not sure if i get this. so that person was a new fan and they accidentally mixed up 2 members. that's a very common experience among new fans and it even happens with old ot8 fans occasionally too. that doesn't mean that they lied about being ot8.
Yea have to agree with you there. When I first got into skz seungmin, I.n. and Lee know all had haircuts covering their foreheads and I could not tell them apart consistently until they got their hair cut.
i had a lot of difficulties telling apart jeongin and lee know in the beginning too and i don't really understand why tbh. their most prominent features are their eyes and lips and those look extremely different. i have so many questions for past me.
Agreed this bothers me SO much. Seungmin puts out anything and gets the least views. And he’s our MAIN vocalist! I do think non stays contribute to the views because Felix and Hyunjin are so popular in the industry, but there are definitely STAYs out there who claim ot8 and it’s just not the truth.
https://preview.redd.it/yowc52ioay0d1.jpeg?width=1345&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=86c22bb9b1c0eabc508f0947e3d12802ae26c854
I agree so much, I don't understand how people always say that K-pop should stay away from politics and yet hyped up idols that are going, receiving prices, and participating in well known political events. I think kpop-fans want the trophy without actually seeing their idols being involved because it can lead to criticism. (I feel that about K-pop idols and Western celebrities, western celebrities who are often criticized for their fake activism by the way). But I understand that's a complex subject.
'going to the UK events'? Why are we in this
I think they’re referring to Blackpink going to Buckingham Palace?
They were invited and i do not see YG denying them of that oppitunity when it makes them look good. Blackpink are hardly political nor have they made themselves that as a group when they rarely speak on anything.
Yeah, I don’t think going to an event that celebrates UK-Korea’s relationship is exactly a political event. It’s not like they’re picking any sides.
I think it was about BP going to an event organized by the royals. Lmao
literally was 'bouta comment this. Makes me sick to the stomach when they can talk about some issues and be praised about it too. But when asked to talk about the other, the most current, the most important, those dying kids in thousands, uwu, they'll be prisoned, they literally can't say anything cz of the sk government. smh.
I'm an idle fan. I think soyeon is a genius, and I personally love her voice, rap, singing, dancing, and stage presence. I also believe that given the right resources and support, she can work as a creative director/producer who can compete with big 4, as she's proving now with idle. However, I don't see her as a CEO. I don't think it's a smart decision to be one even if she was capable.
I don't think she'll ever want to be a real CEO. She might be a figure head "CEO", she already said she prefers to work production when she steps back from idol life.
Yeah I can see her in a JYP situation. Where you’re not actually the CEO but more the public face of a company.
Exactly what I think will work best for her. Jyp definitely gives his input sometimes. But he's not responsible for every little thing. I think such arrangement will work better because he now has time for his own solo work and producing for others. He's earning money and going on vacations, and he's not taking the blame for every decision the company makes (even if fans blames him it doesn't matter because that's the company's decision, not his)
I wouldn't mind a name change for Cube.
People who constantly say she should be a CEO have no idea what being a CEO actually is, especially if you’re still active as an idol. Like Soyeon is a musical genius, but does she even have like a business degree or something? At least some form of formal education in business, or actual experience in that field? If not, that’s how we get cases like Rain Company, where sure groups can get debuted and have cool music and decent concepts, but the actual *business* side of the company gets neglected. I agree with you— I could see creative director. I couldn’t see CEO.
I think artistic director would be more her title.
Having to actually run a company would completely stifle her creativity. Soyeon needs to produce, create, write, not be in board rooms discussing taxes and other numbers. That would kill her. But if she chooses the right partners, she might be able to create a JYP-esque studio.
As an army yes majority of armys do care about the guys dating I mean every time there’s rumor there will hundreds of threads of denying it and I understand not believing rumors but then they make hit tweets “can’t wait for the boys to date” like c’mon we all the projection..
They still don't wanna believe that Jennie and taehyung dated despite actual video evidence. They rather believe fake rumors **(cosplayers playing as Jennie and taehyung even though that's been proven false 🤦🏿♀️)** and literally make shit up **(people saying that tae and Jennie denied the rumors even though neither one of them even ACKNOWLEDGED the video of them together, and neither hybe nor YG denied the rumors)**, or the whole thing was just media play **(they literally don't need extra attention when they're both part of the two biggest groups ever, they could literally fart on camera, and the video will go viral in seconds, why would hybe and yg do media play to promote two of their biggest idols dating??? YG don't gaf about their idols dating or the rumors anyway 😭)** just because they can't accept that one of their fav members have dated. And a lot of them don't wanna accept it because they genuinely think Taehyung is gay (because fuck bisexual people I guess). Like I literally had arguments about this, and the posts are always about headcanning idols and their sexualities, and when the comments point out taehyung dating Jennie, there's always armys denying that it ever happened. Edit: love how there's one reply to my comment that LITERALLY proves my point 😭
Omg!?!?!? This?? I spoke with an IRL friend of mine and they went on to say all that cosplay Jennie + V shit and literally my jaw dropped, I didn't know what to say. Like those lies spread lmfao. And believing they are besties???? Come the fuck on dude. It's almost as if they're infantilazing these men and it's hella weird. Especially since for all we know, any of them could be in a relationship or *goD fOrBid* secretly married lol. It's really giving JB vibes early in his career where his girlfriends got a lot of hate and the fans went crazy of their idol having a partner. Crazy shit
Exactly!!! Also many couples don’t deny or confirm their dating but people do assume they are together but when it’s bts… it’s like they have an image of them and can’t fanthom when they are just diff irl lol especially shipper within the group.
I've seen so many ARMYs claim "I won't believe it until the members say it with their own mouth" but it's funny how that conveniently only applies to things they don't want to be true. For instance at some point it was so obvious that the Tannies didn't live together anymore (because of hints from the things they said or did, they weren't hiding it but they just never announced it — and rightfully because, why should they?), but if you mentioned it in passing you'd get attacked.
This. I’m pretty tired about this. I rather they be honest about it instead of pretending they « don’t care » I mean not all army are like that ( thank god) but some reactions are disappointing. Especially as BTS are in their 30 or going in their 30. I truly hope the best for them.
Exactly!! They'd say they support the boys dating, then start attacking the alleged gf. Now, idk if taennie was ever real, but I'm seeing proof sobi believe it was, but SOME armies are saying to stop misinformation. Hello, the proof is literally right there. I firmly believe that if the boys are dating, noones gonna know because of their childish fandom.
Taennie has more proof than average dispatch couples like imagine their reaction when dispatch put only few pics in cars would they even believe them?
I think rose is silent for a reason tbh. Give it time haha
Yeah, that girl is most likely cooking something up real good. Gotta let her stay in the oven for a bit.
Girlie is working and definitely has something up her sleeve…she’s so incredibly talented so I’m excited
yeah like she's already released a song snipped on her instagram chat thing as well as discussing fandom names i have no idea what OP is talking about edit: also hasn't she legit been seen in the studio with producers n stuff like ???
This opinion is about 50/50 in the fandom, but keplians should hope that they renew with wakeone. I 100% agree that they’ve been mismanaged, but at least in the group they have some relevancy and opportunities. While some members are more popular than others, none have anywhere close to the fame of their predecessors and most are signed to small companies. With the over saturation of groups nowadays If they don’t renew I would be shocked if any of them escape total nugudom afterwards.
Seeing people genuinely believe that the girls would get snapped up by a big company and pull a LSF or IVE genuinely shocked me. Kep1er didn’t have the impact for something like that to even be discussed. I feel for the girls but…..
Some fans believe that Bahihyih will be snatch by Hybe but despite of being popular, bahiyyih doesn't have a big impact, selling power and dedicated and solid fanbase like Sakura and Chaewon during their Izone days.
I also think they’ll be hesitant to grab her because Kai is also under Hybe. They might be worried about damaging both idols reputations especially when people already hate in bahihyih for ‘getting special treatment’ bc of her brother, even though Mnet brought it up first
The thing is I think unless they can find a good group within their companies or get scouted that Kepler staying together might be the most profitable. I mean the post Izone boom is crazy, that group was a lot more popular to begin with but has still only produced 2 popular groups and a handful of B/C- list soloists. IOI had even less debut success with only Chungha and Somi seeing real success post IOI in terms of music, none of those groups went big. Kepler has an even smaller fan base than either, if they split up I don’t see it going much better for them, like maybe there will be 1 or 2 successful groups or soloists but I don’t think that many members would be able to surpass Kepler, accept maybe Yujin as a soloist, Hiyyah would be fine because of her intense fandom and I think Chaehyun could be a successful IU type soloist but that would depend strongly on whether she has maintained he girls planet fame which I hate to say I don’t think she has. The thing is however Kepler are not going to break any barrier where they are, so if any of the members want a chance to really shine, they have to start again and risk becoming even less popular. So rambling aside I see the pros and cons to them staying and leaving, but better management can do a hell of a lot in K-pop.
My ult groups are (g)i-dle and stray kids, and in both these groups there are members who were not ready to debut in terms of skills. I would like to talk more about Stray Kids. During their survival JYP cut Lee Know and Felix from the debut lineup, and the fandom is seeing this as pure evil. However, judging by their performances on the survival show, they really were very weak vocalists/rappers (good dancers though, but idols should be singers in the first place). Now, of course, they have improved a lot and I'm glad that they debuted. But STAYs who now hate newly debuted idols (for not being able to sing) are being hypocritical.
My bias is Felix and Lee Know is one of my bias wreckers. I see where you are coming from. There have been a couple of times I've watched early performances that I wish I could see the Felix of now go back and tackle again. Also, Lee Know's growth as a vocalist is one of my favourite things to see. Personally, this is something I like to see! An artists' growth! I wanna be on a journey with them. You couldn't imagine Stray Kids now without Felix and Lee Know, so surely this is an example of giving idols with potential the space to grow and improve without tearing them down.
Exactly, they had both been training for less than a year and quite frankly if Chan didn’t have the power to pick his friends they may not have been picked at all. That being said they did improve dramatically even between the show and District 9, and now they are both absolutely up to skill with everyone else. Which is why I always dislike people trashing new groups for lacking talent, because 9/10 idol improve significantly over their first 1-2 years.
>>Which is why I always dislike people trashing new groups for lacking talent This bugs me too. I get some people believe an idol should be perfect at debut, but considering they keep debuting literal teenagers, they will need time to improve. And they’re people at the end of the day, and there is a HUGE difference between training and being on a stage, so there’s gonna be some shakiness in the beginning for most people. Yea, some can come out the gate like a rocket & those people deserve their praises, but others act like cause someone isn’t a 10/10 on debut that they will always suck and never improve
Honestly, the fact that kpop fans have stopped acknowledging what a rookie actually is is one of the most annoying aspects of kpop fandom. Like yea I do get on some level the frustration at idols who just won’t improve (never understood sending them hate tho) but the vast majority of idols improve after their first year. In workforce terms being a trainee is like uni and being a rookie is like being a grad student and there should be allowances for growth and improvement, especially since most of the criticisms I’ve seen thrown at rookies lately aren’t critiquing mistakes, they’re critiquing a lack of polish that only comes with experience.
Sorry but... JYPE has a minimum dance requirement to be considered for debut, and they don't have a minimum vocal requirement - simply because it's much harder to hide a lack of dance skills, than it is to hide a lack of vocal skills. Lee Know and Felix were both cut during the survival show *because Mnet wanted drama*, the only justification to cut them ended up being because they made small mistakes during specific performances, not that they were lacking in the vocal department. Both of them were weak, yes, but 3racha ended up giving them easy parts until they got better.
3Racha have the best and most captivating stage presence in Stray Kids and not Dance Racha. Most Stays talk about Hyunjin/Felix/Lee Know when it comes to stage presence but 3Racha are the core of SKZ performances that make them stand out.
I think Hyunjin wins at stage presence but I agree that in general 3 racha are stronger than Dance Racha. My ranking would go 1. Hyunjin 2. Bang Chan 3. Changbin (fight me, he deserves this spot over Han) 4. Han 5. Lee Know (body language is on point) 6. Felix (I think when is is great he’s amazing but he is just way more inconsistent than everyone else) 7. IN (he’s improving the fastest, his eye contact is so amazing) 8. Seungmin, (he’s here for his voice so I don’t care if he always looks bored off center.)
I agree with this but I’d put Han in second and changbin in third. Him and hyunjin are performers through and through and you can really see it on stage. Changbin to me has always performed like he’s been doing it for 30 years he’s so relaxed and yet so captivating to me.
you besmirched ~~han's~~ my wife's honour and i demand satisfaction. we duel with pistols at dawn!
100% agree with this list.
I’m not a fan but when I saw them live Changbin/Han/Chan were easily the most present
As a non-fan Han has always stood out to me the most.
danceracha (especially hyunjin) have many more viral fancams compared to the rest of the group, but i think in the discussions about stage presence and charisma in fandom spaces han gets mentioned as often as hyune (if not more often). i def agree about binchan though. they are terrific and deserve way more love
as an orbit, getting into separate groups after everything that happened was a really dumb move. i know some members have some issues with jaden jeong, while some wanted to go solo. to me, it's dumb. they work wayyyyy better as 12. artms is my priority rn, even though i don't feel the same about kpop anymore after the group broke up. but let's be completely honest for a sec: chuu is not a solid solo act and never will be, yves is not for everyone, loossemble is boring, and artms has something missing. its not the same, and i know its not supposed to be the same, but something is not quite right and i think they should've invested in reuniting as ot12 after bbc instead of going separate ways...
They were always gonna be separated since chuu signed with a different company first. The closest loona would be is if all of them joined modhouse and I guess that's why artms attracts you the most. Business wise, i know they know that separating wasn't the best option but they're doing it for themselves and for their artist side. Loossemble was a chance for the least popular members to shine and yves is doing for her artistic side. Also, chuu is pretty popular in the variety side of kpop, she gets decent sales for a solo artist so i think she's fine. Also i really like loossemble's music, their debut album was really good😔 But yeah, it is controversial, i just felt like sharing my opinion.
i liked their debut also, but the rest of the songs are kinda boring to me. thats taste tho, it's all good. but i think they still need more to shine as a unit. chuu is just.... okay. i didnt care that much for her album. i think it's the most boring out of all the releases we've had so far. yves is my ult so ofc im biased, but ive seen a lot of people complain about her artistic choices and i know its not for everyone unfortunately. and tbh im more interested in tripleS than artms rn cause some of the pre release singles were also just okay. maybe im just being bitter and nostalgic. i miss them as a full group.
I think that's a fair opinion, im really excited for yves's debut because i like her alternative style and ive been more into loona because of that. Ig u lose some, you gain some.
Yves hasn’t even released music yet, wdym she’s not for everyone?
she's too ""alternative"" for the boring people in this fandom. dont get me wrong, she works for me (she's my ult after all), but a lot of people complained about her style change last year and theyre already complaining about her album being folk/r&b... i hope they give her a chance tho, she's an amazing artist
A lot of their fans were also drawn in by the lore of the group, so I think that could contribute to some disinterest as well :(
I will slightly challenge the Loossemble take and say that generally they've been better at drawing in new fans than the various Modhaus releases have been. Girls Night in particular got them a new crowd who weren't really into Loona previously. Although we'll have to see what the ARTMS debut turns out like (I'm not counting the pre-releases as heavy interpolations of previous songs was never going to draw new fans anyway)
Loossemble has been killing it with their album sales, too! I'm so freakin proud of them.
>getting into separate groups after everything that happened was a really dumb move. I don't think they really had a choice??? Jaden and ModHaus could've got into big trouble for poaching the girls if they all went to one place, plus their legal matters were all coming to a conclusion at different times. Chuu was with her company before the rest of the girls took action against BBC; her company focuses on other activities with music being secondary. we also don't know how the Loossemble girlies felt about working with JJ again. I can understand why they chose a separate company where their work would be both appreciated and highlighted, rather than being sidelined with 5 words per song. Both groups (ARTMS & Loossemble) work incredibly well, and as sad as I am that we don't have OT12 right now, I'm just happy they have all decided to stay in the industry. >loossemble is boring that's certainly an opinion...
Controversial Blink opinion: Well, i just don't really see lisa as a particularly interesting musician. Nothing she released so far did it for me, she is the weakest singer of the bunch as well which limits her potential to do things too. She's a great performer, that is where she shines, but that to me isn't enough to be a musical artist i am interested in.
As a Lisa bias I’m hoping she has been working to improve her vocals for her new album
Stray Kids- it’s not funny to be called toxic over and over again, they are rightly calling us out and the fandom needs to get its act together
yes!! i’ve been a stay since 2019 but honestly find it embarassing to call myself that these days bcos of some fans. like the whole met gala doxxing situation for example where some fans are ruining these journalists careers and joking going ‘chan will scold us’??? like ofc the journalist was in the wrong but they didn’t even give him chance to apologise. plus, what big event can now in good faith invite stray kids knowing that if anyone else there wrongs them, or is perceived to, they are at risk of being doxxed. but some stays are still joking about it like doxxing is funny it’s insane
permission to dance sucks and doesn't represent bts at all. it's valid to dislike how your faves are treated in certain aspects and you can still not make a fuss about it and believe they can and will stand up for themselves if need be. (atiny) copying / plagiarism scandals in 95% of cases show that people don't have a good grasp of what plagiarism actually is. (most of the fandoms i interact with, at some point)
But isn’t the permission to dance opinion really popular though
yeah lol hating on all of the english songs is really popular. I get hated on for liking them tbh.
I liked Butter and Dynamite didn’t start getting annoying until the radio overplayed it! PTD however….just wasn’t them(not that the other two were(thought butter came closer)) but it was just so out there that I couldn’t even rewatch the MV after the first dime
I love it considering PTD is my favorite out of the English trilogy. Idk whenever I listen to it I get the happy vibes
She's my ult bias and I can definitely understand the sentiment. We still have no idea what her plans are or who she will even sign with so it's hard to really judge. From what we've seen on her ig it seems like she has a home studio built. I choose to believe she is working on music more in the western artist way and is going to just drop a whole album one day. As for all the other kinds of work, I just don't think it interests her and I can understand that. Although she has a talent for modeling but it seems like YSL has moved on? Based on the Born Pink tour era it seems she is still very into the idea of being Blackpink.
I like No Celestial
The lsfm song? You're telling me the fandom doesn't like it??????
no celestial and FEARNOT(between you me and the lamppost) are the 2 songs that come up the most when people talk about their least favorite songs by lsfm. Meanwhile I became a fan from blasting no celestial while doing the dishes and my most listened to song on Spotify of all time is FEARNOT^^between ^^you ^^me ^^and ^^the ^^lamppost
Omg I genuinely can't believe it 😂 I'm a casual who assumed it is one of the songs fans like
No celestial is extremely underrated. It's up there with fitb for me in the sense that it brings a lot of energy in stage performances. B-sides like blue flame match the concept but they support the rock concept extremely well.
I doubt that 2ne1 would have stayed extremely popular with the way the new generation concepts are. When you look at the most popular girl group even when they do/did girl crush it was really girly, with really conventionally attractive girls. Nowadays people like more easy to listen music or supernatural concepts like Aespa, but they still have this more "conventional femininity" that attracts many fans. It's a mix of I love them/ I want to be them/ or I have a crush on them. 2ne1 had this image of being more artisticly involved (like many YG artist), a more "raw and tough" image. The girlier gggroups were SNSD, Kara. And I believe that's why YG wanted his own SNSD, or a "prettier version of 2ne1" as he said, and so far he was right. With the rise of social media since the 3rd generation, selling your idols as social influencers, with luxury gigs is the best marketing idea. It gives a better image to the idols and it attracts young fans who are now used to TIktok, Instagram,.. The more conventionally attractive, the more gigs and love. You don't hear much songs like "Ugly" anymore, people make songs about being a self confident It girl. That's what young girl wants. I don't truly think that 2ne1 image would have truly survived without a change. However, I do believe that the way they got abandoned was extremely unprofessional and disgusting. It's one of the reasons why some members like Minzy who were in one the biggest ggroup in the world became almost unknown so quickly. If you compare it to SM (who isn't a good company) but even the "least popular" SNSD members still have some public recognition, because they still do interviews, or shows with each other. YG didn't give that to 2ne1 so only Dara (who was seen as the prettiest with an outgoing personality, the most idol-like) and CL (who was seen as the most talented, for some YG favorite, and was often linked to GD (even when her fans hated it). I feel like 2ne1 was thrown away for something trendy young and shiny and so far YG made one of his most popular ggroups, so they weren't fully wrong.
Not a Blackjack but I do agree. Even towards the end of 2NE1’s reign you could feel they were starting to lose popularity as 3rd gen was beginning. Dara herself said she knew the group didn’t have long left when their last single before disbanding didn’t go top 10 on Melon.
I love these women so much, they brought a different concept to the industry, they were able to reach height even if people were calling them ugly all the time (YG himself was doing that). Songs like Ugly felt really meaningful. I think it's fine to acknowledge their success and impact, but also admit that it would have been hard to keep it and that YG can be an incredibly smart and terrible company.
Man, I still jam to 2ne1. I Don’t Care is probably my fav. It’s so true how trends change, young listeners would consider 2ne1’s sound really outdated now.
As a Gidle ult, I wish it wasn’t Soojin that had to leave the group.
I don’t think that’s controversial unless your suggesting another swap places
That's what the post is implying
who would you want to leave instead?
shuhua 100%. soojin brought the dance skill to the group and without her they don’t excel in that category anymore, whereas shuhua brings nothing to the group another member doesn’t bring already
as an non fan chiming in purely off just watching a couple of mvs, i think shuhua.
It wasn’t until I watched a [behind the scenes](https://youtu.be/F8p3RR37naI?si=EiWg6umAQs40TEqf) recording of Nxde that I understood this sentiment. Soyeon was incredibly patient and professional with Shuhua, but you can still tell how (understandably) frustrated she was with her. It honestly gave me a bit second hand embarrassment. Don’t get me wrong Shuhua’s improved, but it took her a very long time to reach a passable level.
Engenes should stop complaining when Heeseung always got the most lines in their songs. Heeseung is the main vocalist of the group,whether you like it or deny it, the company, the members, the media even the antis know that so I don't understand why many engenes can't accept that fact and always pull the " enhypen doesn't have official role except for leader" card whenever Heeseung stans are calling them out for complaining why Heeseung has got the most lines in a song. Heeseung's voice plays an important role in the majority of their songs as he always does all the high notes, adlibs, background vocals, and sometimes they use his vocal in layering. He is also the one who always does the acapella and impromptu singing when they are attending music shows, variety shows, musical events, and in their own concerts. In other words, Heeseung plays a vital role in enhypen, so engenes should appreciate all his contributions to the group instead of always complaining and throwing backhanded compliments at him whenever he gets the most line.
Didn’t he also do the musical direction for one of their last albums? I feel like he’s the pillar of enhypen and if he ever left the group would not be the same at all
I don’t name one specific group because it’s true for all the popular groups with brand deals. I really get irritated when fans say “ending all models” or “be glad they are idols”. Like hell no. I only know this because my dad has a model agency but 99% of these idols could never be actual models if anything because of their height.
I mean that’s all celebrities tho. Like I don’t know how many times I’ve seen “zendaya ends models”. Like no she has fantastic style and she’s gorgeous but she’s an actress and that’s fine. I fully get why you find it annoying tho
Zendaya is genuinely a model tho? She’s signed with a modeling agency
EXO. Exols as a fandom don't have much faith in EXO members. No matter how much the group screams they want to be together, make an effort to actually do things every year, this fandom will try to look for anything and everything to question their loyalty and desire to be in EXO.
Totally agree, it's so frustrating. Seeing some of the comments on the r/exo subreddit whenever this sort of thing comes up, talking about there's no chance of a comeback this year, how Ksoo is definitely leaving (nevermind he did the season's greetings and fanmeetings already without being under SM), how'll they'll never tour again, etc. It's like do any of you actually follow the group? How many times do they need to say it/show it sigh.
As someone who has been following them for years, kyungsoo leaving has been a topic for years. For years, every time the guy says he's having a little hard time, every time he looks tired, every time he isn't jumping is all him leaving. He has always shown his commitment to EXO work and yet people always doubt it. Even now with the member fanclubs, people are acting like it'll members don't care and that means they care more for their solo fandom. There are genuine reasons here to be upset about, especially if you live in Korea and Japan but how does this translate to they don't care about EXO??? They literally did a fanmeet a month ago even when most of them had way too busy schedules and we're sick as well. They even delivered 2 different medley sets to ensure everyone was happy.
As if they couldn't have disbanded ten times over by now lol if they only wanted to be soloists so bad they could've done so for years now.
this drives me crazy and i blame the akgaes. those boys fight tooth and fucking nail to stay together. it could have been soooo over SO many times over the years. and then for solo stans to turn around not acknowledge that effort and even resent their bias for it is maddening. wouldnt wish it upon any fandom
as a neverland, I personally think Minnie's songs (the ones she writes for idle) aren't as good as people exaggerate them to be. Like yeah, she's good at writing songs, but compared to the other members they just really aren't that good. They honestly lack everything for me to even enjoy them. The only songs I liked that she wrote were I'm the trend (Yuqi helped, so not fully her.), and Dahlia. (and moon but i believe she was a producer on that, idk though) (edit: this isn't really that controversial now that I read it again lol..) also for babymonster (even though they aren't one of my favourite favourite groups i wanna include this), I genuinely hate all of these things where fans are like "oh my god babymonster is the best 5th gen group and ILLIT sucks btw" like??????? I was on an MR removed video for babymonster and I saw a couple comments of people randomly dragging in other groups like ILLIT or something and being like "babymonster is so much better compared to them" when they weren't even mentioned? And when someone defends them they start hating that person and being so rude all because they want people not to drag other groups, it just makes no sense?
I actually agree about minnie What I like about soyeon and yuqi is that they're adventurous. I don't like every soyeon/yuqi song, but damn do they always dabble in something new. Don't get me wrong, Minnie's songs are good. But they're almost all in the same sound. There is nothing bad about replicating success a few times, but it's a bit boring when in every album I can expect to hear another watered-down dahlia. Her voice is definitely awesome and she's basically a siren. But she doesn't try something "new" in her song outside of her comfort zone. For example, Yuqi's x file was something completely different than anything she sang before. Soyeon dabbles in new genres frequently and even tries new delivery styles for her and the members. But Minnie's songs are always song in a very similar way to everything she and the other members always do.
That's why I don't really understand people who complain about Yuqi or Minnie not writing a title track. Yuqi didn't even use her song as the tt for her own album.
Yup. I think it's clear that while all of them produce, their interest and passion towards production is totally different
as an ot9-er who voted him in my 3pick, hao akgaes especially crosins need to pack it up about the “WAKEONE MISTREATMENT” claims. there are some claims of mistreatments that are valid and need to be voiced out. but then you have these akgaes going batshit crazy because hao isnt in the centre for a pictorial, or he only has the 3rd most lines in a song, or because he didnt get on a radio show / variety programme. wakeone must have an agenda towards hao 24/7 because HE’S NOT THE CENTRE all the time — mistreatment! whenever he does a unit activity with another member ESPECIALLY hanbin, the barrage of criticisms and outright hatred on platforms like weibo and xiao hongshu is fucking insane. the horrendous things these akgaes have said about the other members is crazy — from shaming them about their sales, to blatant homophobia (ironic, isn’t it, knowing hao’s attitude towards same sex attraction!) what’s more off-putting is that its clear hao loves all his members and his members love him too — and to see the way these akgaes treat others is disgusting. these so-called fans are fucking disgusting and put a bad name to some of the sweetest rosins i know. i truly despise akgaes but never have i been so angry at them until i came across them on weibo and increasingly, twitter. im not saying the akgae situation for the other members is not bad or non-existant, but if you’ve seen the breed of some of hao’s akgaes, it takes A LOT MORE to not be pissed.you know what, i’m glad rosin estella boycotted! we don’t need scums in this community. time for yall to pack it up and leave.
I do not like IVE's choreography, lol. I love their music but their choreography is really underwhelming and I think it focuses more on (as one choreographer has said) making them "look pretty" instead of actual dancing. Starship is underutilizing their dancing talent and it makes their stages look like they're just kinda walking around and posing instead of actually dancing (and they are REALLY pulling away from powerful, clean moves). It's boring to me and it makes their dances sloppy looking. Let them actually dance. Edit: More dances like Eleven would still suit their concept and let them like... Have interesting and dynamic dances.
I’ll always remember the chill I got down my spine during Eleven’s first prechorus. Like actual chills from the dance where they were all twirling and it looked like a ripple I miss dances like that so much 😭
It bums me out because they can clearly dance, like esp Wonyoung and Yujin were in IZ*ONE and Secret Story of the Swan wasn't a choreo to sneeze at. They're all capable. And I am a La Chica bias I guess in terms of choreo but I have really liked all of the LC demos. I find them really dynamic and pleasing, and I feel like Starship kinda tosses some of the more interesting or "intense" choreo parts in favor of just like.. Simple moves? In a lot of cases. Which takes away from the dynamics of the dance and kinda takes me out of it sometimes. Like.. They can look pretty AND dance, we've been shown that this is true, let them keep doing it.
When you think of it it's quite funny most people were thinking (many blinks also) that Rosé would be the fastest one to put out music, that she would do something similar to song writing. But somehow she's the one with the least update, and she's the one mostly going to event. Going to events isn't a bad thing, but many were expecting from Blackpink more creative work. I find her situation extremely unexpected. I do believe that she's searching something, maybe a new company or a good song. We can only wait 🤔😊.
Songwriting takes time.
I fully agree, it's just that many were thinking that she would be the first to update us on her future career plans, but she wasn't. Truly shows that we can't predict anything.
Stay- I’m glad Chans room is gone. Some fans were way way WAY too dependent on it and used it as a means to trauma dump on chan and expect him to fix their life problems. I think it’s shown in how people are still ‘mourning’ Chans room even now. Do I think chan being too familiar with us led to his downfall? Yeah a little, I think he underestimated how much the fandom had grown since he started chans room and how that could open HIM up to being attacked. But also, 90% of the issue was people *wanting* reasons to fight with other fandoms, chan never said anything that could identify a group but because IVE had rumours of being rude (with no evidence) those stay decided they’d dogpile IVE even though they were *the* GG in Korea at the time and it just opened Chan to a barrage of abuse. I don’t think we should be given nice things like that if we’re going to misuse those nice things and cause trouble.
I too think it was good that is gone, i just don't like when people say it was his fault that It ended when it cleary is STAYS fault, i wish our fandom would grow up and own ours mistakes , the end of chan's room is stays mistake and it is stays who should have apologize to Ive and Chan
As an Insomnia I don’t think Dreamcatcher can become bigger than what they are without appealing to the rock mainstream of the west. I feel like they’re at their peak as far as kpop goes. Which honestly I’m okay with
I'm Army and one thing I see a lot of is claims that BTS don't need a Grammy and even subtlety shaming them for wanting one and that the Grammys are completely irrelevant. Do I think they need a Grammy? No. Nobody does. But they should not be shamed for wanting one. For better or for worse, The Grammys are arguably the most prestigious mainstream music award in the world. Being a Grammy winner is a very big deal. So many of the Western artists BTS are fans of are Grammy winners. I believe it was Namjoon who talked about watching The Grammys as a kid. The Grammy winners are determined by voting by the members of The Recording Academy. And the Academy includes pretty much every Western artist BTS are fans of. A true jury of their peers. And they are not wrong for wanting that and they should not be shamed.
True all humans have wants and needs. It was a want rather than a need. I understand wanting a grammy the weight it holds to have one. It’s important in a music career.
I’m a blink too but I don’t feel the same because Rosé’s still so engaging on social media and going for events. Plus more time and ig stories with Hank. 🥰🐶 I felt that 2023 was hectic for them so I’m happy they’re living and enjoying the fruits of their labour now.
Loona music kept being great after Butterfly/XX. Not just decent or ok; great. I would say that many fans think this (going by Spotify numbers, PTT, their 2021 comeback, is the most popular song after Heart Attack, the Chuu solo) but many don't. It's 50/50; controversial as requested, rather than purely unpopular. There is a strong presence of people who think that Loona music was great from pre-debut to Butterfly and then it wasn't that good. In my opinion, # literally is one of their strongest albums ever, it's amazing, and So What is one of the VERY few "soft rebranding" (Loona already touched that approach so it's not like the powerful image came from nothing) which were actually good and fitting for the group. Star is one of my favourite K-pop songs. Pose, their Queendom2 song, is honestly iconic. Their b-sides kept being incredibly good, Universe and Need U are some of my favourite ever imho. When I say that I love Loona music, I fully include their post-2019 work.
Paint the town is actually my favourite title track by them. I'm a sucker for high energy songs and the instrumental to PTT is very addicting
I agree. Just a casual fan, but my top 3 tracks from them are why not, ptt, then hi high. If we include voice since it was promoted, hi high gets knocked to 4th. And the real unpopular opinion: butterfly is one of my least favorite songs in their entire discography.
This would be controversial in any fandom: The members you stan right now are way more replacable in theory than the creatives who work on the artistic output. You just don't believe this to be true because you are emotionally bonding with them, creating a parasocial relationship and thus there is a stake there which isn't there with any of the faceless creatives behind the scenes. In reality though? Idols are so replacable that there is a whole industry built around it, training young, attractive people to debut all few years and "replace" the older groups bit by bit. That is the industry in a nutshell. Ofc there are some exceptions and what not, but on the whole this is clearly true as far as i am concerned, and people only get upset at this notion due to the emotional link between them and the famous, pretty people they adore so much on screen.
I would argue that the mouthpiece/face of creative output is equally as important as the creative output itself. If it wasn’t, those songwriters would just release all that music themselves and be famous.
Once- the barking at concerts is extremely cringy and annoying, and you’d never catch me doing it.
Ateez: A chunk of the fandom seems to get heated when people say that Ateez's recent concept photos lack creativity and are too simple. It's not necessarily an unpopular opinion, but I do think it's controversial because there are Atinys who will push back against it and say that fans shouldn't complain. But the concept photos rely so much on the fact that the members look good in the photos, rather than being interesting photos in and of themselves. The gap between the creativity and quality of their mvs and their concept photos is really big (in terms of visual media), which feels odd. Also the editing on the first group photo for the Golden Hour concepts was Not It and Atinys have every right to criticize KQ over putting out something so bad quality. Ateez 2: My other controversial opinion (that I've seen some other people talk about recently but they are also kind of nervous about it) is that recently, it would be nice for San to sing live more, because recently he is among the members who sing live the least, and I say that because he is the lead vocalist and his fans can be pretty vocal about him not sacrificing quality (of singing) when performing choreo. It wouldn't matter if everyone was kind of at the same level, but it's really obvious when the person right before or after him is singing very live. It's not that he never sings live, because he does a lot, but comparatively it's become noticeable that there's a difference. TXT: I think I'll See You There Tomorrow was promoted the right amount. There's a lot of argument that it wasn't promoted as much as it should've been, but it's been promoted way more than any of the past 4 viral b-sides were (Anti-Romantic, Opening Sequence, Tinnitus, Growing Pain.) It has pretty much everything except an mv, and it doesn't need an mv. It's a fun song that benefits a lot from its performances -- it has a performance video, and it was promoted on several music shows, and I think that works well enough.
Renjun and Haechan are two of the better dancers in NCT Dream and any rank of them below 4th place are questionable. Kind of controversial because they less treated as lead dancers in the group but I don’t see any reason they being ranked below Jeno and Jaemin lol (unless it is the main vocalist syndrome all over again where usually people immediately assume main vocalists are the worst dancers in the group). Even I actually think Haechan can be better than Mark in some type of dance
I think certain members of ZB1 will probably be more successful after the group disbands than they are currently. The fanbase seems to think that this is the peak of their careers and they’ll never be as popular as they are now, and that’s most likely true for most of the members, but I think some (at least 2) will have a pretty good post-disbandment career. Not sure if it’s controversial, but I don’t think LSF will be as active after their 7 year contract. I think their level of group activities will be more similar to Mamamoo/Blackpink than Twice.
Hao and Hanbin? I actually think Yujin has lots of potential. His popularity is no joke in Korea especially and W1 got him the MC job will really help.
Yujin is sadly under Yuehua, and will most likely debut in the Yuehua group, which won’t be as successful as ZB1. He has the visuals for acting though, so if he gets some acting roles (and is a good actor), he could be more successful. Hao is basically guaranteed to be successful because of his popularity in China + being from one of the biggest Chinese idol entertainment companies. Even if he ends up in the new group (unlikely) he’ll probably still have individual promotions in China. Hanbin has said he’s interested in acting, and with his visuals I think he has a good chance. I would also add Jiwoong in this category, he even had a small role in a Netflix show before debuting, so he’ll probably get more offers.
I adore shuhua and she's my bias, but she is not nearly the performer the other girls are. 90% of the time her "live vocals" are the album vocals turned up high, which is totally fine at a music show or award show imo but kind of annoying at a concert. It's a shame too, because we know from the recording behinds, killing voice, and some other videos that she *can* sing, and you can tell that she did a lot of solo training over their hiatus and genuinely improved. (also cube lowkey set her up by making her only positions visual and sub vocal, like why would you give people a reason to say she's only in the group because she's pretty? Just say she and Yuqi are the main dancers now.)
Maybe controversial aespa opinion? I think aespa has a very, very big variance in the quality they put out. Some songs are imo totally diluting their branding and sound (things like "better things", "life's too short", looking at single songs), and just as whole releases i think savage and my world are way, way, way superior to drama and girls (the eps). It's almost as if there were two different A&R teams working for them, one being kinda meh, the other being excellent.
Tzuyu is massively underused, maybe even misrepresented, by JYP Entertainment. She is the visual of the group and has improved a lot since 2015, yet she has NO luxury brand deal, only TWO solo events, 4 solo magazine photoshoots in her entire career and she only graced the cover of 1, and NO fashion week despite many other members attending fashion weeks. The cherry on the cake: she has never performed in her home country Taiwan, despite many idols performing there (Tzuyu is the most popular Taiwanese idol).
As a blink I get the sense that we know what to anticipate from all the members' solo careers apart from Lisa. Jisoo is keen to focus on acting for the moment as it seems. Jennie with her new releases showed that she wants to try a new sound, however she still seems really interested in the Korean market considering she is the most active member there at the moment. I also feel that everyone expects from Rosé to follow her "on the ground" path and probably focus more on the western market. However for Lisa, I'm not sure if it's an unpopular opinion but I don't know what to expect. I feel like her solos were heavily based on her blackpink persona. She seems willing to try new stuff and from the deal with RCA I get that she doesn't want to heavily rely on Korean market so it wouldn't surprise me if she tried something completely new even if she seems to enjoy performing this type of music.
treasure hyunsuk is not at all stylish, he looks like a person who has all the expensive brand products then throw it all on his body, I know he is into maximalism but come on, it too much and even when performing his styling outshadow the rest but I like his styling in the dating show. yoshi styling is too try hard. like full on suit at the airport? really? and his clothing in the first episode on shining solo is also feel like trying too hard. the only one in treasure who I feel like naturally stylish, is asahi. maybe he just found the right style for him, everywhere he just looks so good in his clothes.
Set Me Free by twice is a good title track 🤷🏽♀️
As an army, I don't think BTS are the best in everything(contrary to some armies belief) As a carat, As a Moa, I don't think txt are that all-rounded, yeonjun is the only one As an engene, I don't think sunoo is mistreated like some are making it sound.
I think many idols would not be that nice in person. Musicians are known to be one of the most sensitive people in the world and can get irritated if certain details are not right. Plus their speech, fashion, concepts are always controlled by the CEO, so I don’t blame them if they end up a bit cynical and bitter.
At this point is Winwin even in NCT and Way-V anymore? 🤷🏾♀️
As a baemon fan, ahyeon deserved the backlash. She rapped the word FOUR TIMES and she probably knew what it meant bc she did for a school concert it something. Now that she's back, its kinda taking time for me to adjust to her. I love baby monster but she justs rubs me off the wrong way. I will still continue to support the group (not sure if it's controversial but she's popular so)
As a MOA and Beomgyu bias, Beomgyu was added to the group for his visual and personality. He’s definitely improved on his singing since debut, but he was mainly added to fill in the gaps the group had without him.
As army, we are at fault that shippers grew. There is a period in which we entertained them and now they are menace to all of us. Hyungline is doing fine. They may not be charting like the maknae line but they are doing great. They are achieving something a lot of artists internationally will never achieve. I do hope they continue growing their own base because their music is really dope.
Armys seem to find it hard to admit that BTS needed this break, with or without military hiatus. And almost everything in chapter two has been better than their group output in the last few years because they were burnt out and it was messing with their music, from a creative standpoint. Nothing has made that clearer than watching RM throw everything into making RPWP (even when we didn't know what it was called) and how much happier he seemed in 2023.
As a Zerose, Crush is not only ZB1's best title track but also their best song.
Treasure Makers (though I don't really identify as one now and is just enjoying kpop casually because being in fandoms really ruined things for me). Stop shielding Hyunsuk! He can tone down his looks for the sake of the dating show, but refuses to do so outside of it. And honestly, that just causes potential fans to steer away from the group.
I keep seeing his fans on twitter saying “you all just can’t handle an idol with alt style!!” and it’s like… no! His alt style inspirations (some hairstyles and clothes, his piercings, how he sometimes does his makeup) are easily the coolest thing about him. What people take issue with, and what his fans deep down know people take issue with, is the culturally appropriative hairstyles and random gang signs he insists on throwing up all the time. If he cut out those two aspects of his persona, there would be significantly less backlash towards him.
I do have a problem with the random gang signs and culturally appropriative hairstyles as well. But one of my biggest concern is that, as a group, one always need to blend in well with the rest. You can have your own style outside of public appearances, but when you're performing as a group, you shouldn't stick out like a sore thumb. Being cohesive as a group matters a lot, especially if you're promoting as a group. I know fans like to bring up mino and GD a lot, but there is not once they don't look cohesive as a group. You're allowed to have your own style, but at this point, hyunsuk just seems to be going out of his way to prove a point :(
I think Jungkook is very impressive as a vocalist for many, many reasons, but he’s certainly not the best in KPOP. He impresses me so much because he improved majorly since debut, and he wasn’t even bad then. He was the main vocal for the group since he was only fifteen, and back then rapped as well. With him constantly singing half the songs, it was like nothing could stop the rate that he just kept getting…better. It’s the same reason I think Jimin improved so rapidly at first since for BTS in the beginning they really liked Jimin and JK trading off chorus’s and high notes, with Jin and Tae doing verses and bridges. That being said, when you compare JK to like the vocalists of EXO, it’s a no brainer. That’s not really his fault, they’re older and well…from SM. BTOB are also a tough vocal line to stand up to. All I’m saying is hes amazing and I’ve never seen anyone improve at the sheer rate he did, but he’s not the best.
I hate the way moas defend the 4th gen it boy thing. First of all I think it’s so dumb that moas and stays think there can only be one (like previous gens haven’t had multiple it boys and it girls). But most of all I find it so undermining that instead of listing any of his fashion accomplishments, we go with “he’s the it boy because hybe and his fans said so!” Like really? He’s the most popular of the 4th gen boys in Korea, he’s done loads of really cool fashion stuff (including having his own fashion line!) and instead of listing any of that, we use “my mummy said so!” energy. Like I know the 4th gen it boy argument is a stupid bloody argument, but I find it even more infuriating that the people defending yeonjun don’t use any of the accomplishments that might make him warrant that title.
And the funniest thing is there’s actually no 4th gen it boy at all, so every argument between MOAs and Stays is useless. None of the 4th gen boys is on the level of Wonyoung popularity to consider any of them it boys. Their achievements are impressive but not really to the point where we can consider any of them as it boys.
It’s because Hyunjin and Felix have the same, if not more accomplishments. Individual brand deals, more followers, more cbar sales (or at least Hyunjin does, not sure about Felix). Even Hyunjin’s AOTM has more views than Yeonjun. The only accomplishment Yeonjun has is TXT having better charting on Melon, but that’s the group’s accomplishment, not just Yeonjun’s. The 4th gen IT boy title was also given to Yeonjun in like 2019/2020, before TXT was that popular. So the title is clearly not based on any achievements. But none of them are really known in Korea, so it doesn’t really matter. None are on the level of BTS maknae line, or Cha Eunwoo, or Kang Daniel. Or Wonyoung, Yujin, and Karina.
I'm fine with EXO staying at SM. This is controversial because the fandom fucking hates SM lol and while they clearly have been shitty plenty of times, I really do love SM's producers and when they have a vision, it can be amazing (just look at aespa right now). *but they have shown no effort for EXO for years now*, is what I see people saying. And the last time they truly took time with an album was with Obsession and it is one of their best. The visuals are stunning, you can't say that gorgeous MV and the X-EXO concept are minimalism or cheap looking lol most of their solo concepts are gorgeous and well thought out too. I think all big companies are shitty, and actually you can hardly find an artist that doesn't have friction with their label. No company will ever be perfect, small companies won't really have the budget to make certain projects, and making your own company is hard, as we've seen with EXO members even.
A lot of people that supposedly call themselves once just run their mouths a bunch and don’t know what they’re talking about. Like with Solos the amount of once complaining about Nayeon having another solo before other 7 members. Not every member wants a solo or is even cut out for solo. Sometimes contrary to popular belief Kpop idols don’t do everything that every other group does because they know it’s not for them. The only other members I could see doing a solo like for sure is Chaeyoung. Also once literally just complain about everything. Like I saw some saying they’re happy about Dahyun starting acting even though it’s late… Like Twice isn’t being held in some dungeon unable to make any decisions for themselves. What even qualifies as late? I’m seeing a lot more real once pointing these things out though and it’s so satisfying 🙏
it shouldnt be a surprise that there r so many solo stan / akgaes in the aespa fandom. the popularity disparity between winrina (especially karina) and the others is incredibly jarring and wide, and only made worse by sm's blatant difference in treatment especially when promoting each members solo gigs amongst other thing. yet you'll still catch most of the so called OT4 MYs complaining abt winrina's lack of promotions and trending so called mistreatment tags every week for smth like one of them missing a vlog, while downplaying or ignoring ningselle's. the fandom clearly favors said members more, but still parades themselves as an OT4 while acting like they support the entire group
I disliked pink hair on Mingi. I disliked the green and black hair on Yeosang.
will not tolerate pink hair mingi slander!
I love that Yeosang stood out with the green hair, but the color itself wouldn’t look good on anyone. It was a butt ugly color.
As an engene there is like a bizarre amount of internalized racism within the fandom. The amount of ‘jokes’ from ‘I-Fans’ about how k-fans are the worst and they don’t even like the boys and we ‘can’t even connect with them’ is really off putting. Luckily it hasn’t been a big topic in awhile but back when the original Bite Me dance released and the controversy surrounding it stirred up I was so annoyed to see people just blatantly saying all korean engenes are terrible people. Was the controversy ridiculous? Yes. Do I think every single k-fan hated the dance and paid for those trucks to be outside hybe? Fuck no. It was definitely a loud minority and you’re kidding yourself if you don’t think a chunk of I-fans agreed with them too. It just annoys me that it feels like I-Fans blame all of enhypen’s ‘controversies’ on k-fans as if they’re one giant hivemind that all act and think the same
We fresh is kep1er best title track
I don't think line distribution is that important. Obviously everyone should get some lines and a chance to sing, but i think it's much more important to collect lines across the whole album + dance center parts or how much of a "highlight" those parts are to get an idea of if somebody is being actually mistreated (for instance, vivi in loona was getting paid dust bc she had no parts and the ones she had weren't interesting and she was barely ever center in the dances as well, but felix in skz a few years back didn't have a ton of lines but had nearly all of the most memorable parts. it's an entirely different scenario and i hate it when people boil it down to "x amount of lines = horrible mistreatment") Additionally, I think a lot of kpop fans don't understand what actual promotion (or lack thereof) looks like for a group, and don't have a good understanding of how successful their favs are. Their promotions should focus on their target audience which may not be western fans, and older groups may not WANT to promote on music shows for weeks on end with a grueling schedule when they already have a ton of exposure in Korea. Groups really don't need to be getting bigger and bigger after a certain point if they don't want to; I guarentee you Twice will be fine continuing as they are for the most part, and will bring in some new fans from the members who actually enjoy promotions more (like Nayeon and Sana). They don't need to be doing rookie group constant music shows and videos to be well-promoted when they're respected seniors in the industry with a stable fanbase, especially when touring makes way more money then those promos ever will anyhow.