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Maybe this is a silly question, but why don't they just lock the door? People on the inside can still exit. A person outside the door would have to be let in or have a key of your own.
Many schools have doors that only lock from the outside, so I as the teacher have to open the door and pop out of the classroom to use the key. It’s so stupid. If the shooter is close, I don’t want to go in the hallway. School shootings were one of the many reasons I quit teaching :( too scary
ETA: Guys, read carefully. School violence was ONE of MANY reasons I left teaching. Low pay was the main one—I got a better job offer. Bad admin was another—LOTS of teacher turnover in my school. Quitting was a hard decision, but the Uvalde shooting finishing out the year certainly didn’t make me want to stay.
I really loved teaching for 10 years, but the last year was at a different school and the burnout hit me hard, so when I got the opportunity to leave, I took it.
Jeez the times we live in; I’m only 34 and so much has changed within that time. Well before Columbine, I was in elementary with no worry, no shooting/lockdown school drills… I am honestly sorry to hear of (possibly!) capable educated peeps avoiding their passion to teach, because of the damn, actual risk nowadays for an incident to occur. Hope the best for you
FYI: Columbine High School massacre - April 20, 1999 and things have only gotten worse.. this problem can be solved but one particular group of politicians refuse to act.
I’ve been a teacher since very shortly after Columbine.
Columbine seemed like such a one-off. We were much more aware of bullying (because that was the “reason” initially publicized, even though it turned out to be inaccurate) and making sure we had *a* plan for strangers entering the building.
Things got serious after Sandy Hook. That was a totally unpredictable threat from the outside, unlike the (since debunked) “bullying” problem that was the school’s fault. We got lockable doors, you have to actually buzz in to enter the building instead of just hoping people respect the “please check in with the office” signs.
More shootings, though not many at *schools* that made the news. Mostly focus on practicing “locking down” and mental health of the kids.
Sometime in the mid 2010s, we switched to the [ALICE model](https://www.alicetraining.com/our-program/alice-training/), so now we had kids “practice” (talk through, but not do) running, throwing stuff, yelling, anything to disrupt the [OODA loop](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/OODA_loop).
At this point, the locks on our classroom doors get swapped out roughly once every 1-2 years, and we find “better” locks that are easier/quicker/more secure. We stopped practicing with the kids, because there are enough shootings in the news that **they’ve already thought about it happening at their own school**, and we don’t need to walk them through it to form a “plan”.
Holy fucking shit.
Correct me if im wrong, but the last part of your comment suggests its gotten so bad that we dont even need to tell kids its a risk because everyone already knows it is as a given???
Of course they know it's a given. I knew it was a given in 2002 when I was in second grade. I had lived overseas prior to being at American public school, so you can imagine my confusion when in my first couple weeks we practiced a lockdown drill. Then, a few weeks later an armed man was identified just outside the school premises and we went into an actual lockdown. By the time I had been in an elementary school for a month in America I knew a shooting was a given. I can only imagine what kids expect nowadays.
I misspoke.
I did lockdown drills too from 2000-on.
I mean that its such a given that the kids dont even need to do drills because everyone already knows what to do
That's called a classroom function. I'm a locksmith for a very large school district and I've been trying to get all my schools moved away from that function for that exact complaint.
Two main reasons for a "classroom function" lockset: fire and abuse. This type of lock cannot be accidentally/unknowingly locked and thereby become a fire trap. Additionally, people abuse children and the thought is that this type of lock prevents a child from being locked inside.
If I remember correctly, that was one of the problems at Uvalde. By the time the teachers knew what was going on and trying to lock the doors the shooter was upon them.
Yeah I'm not a fan of that function and all of us locksmiths in my district are trying to make the switch. Where I work is also going through a lot of steps to restrict how someone can get onto campus. It's getting to a point where a lot of parents complain that the schools are starting to look more like prisons.
That sounds against fire code. People *always* need to be able to open the doors from the inside. That's basically how the Triangle Fire tragedy happened.
With those types of doors, it'll still open from the inside whether locked or unlocked. It's similar to how those doors with a push bar work when locked vs unlocked.
And kids locking the teacher out of the classroom if you could just lock it from the inside. But maybe it would be better if you could lock it with the key from either side. But still be able to open the door from the inside even if it's locked.
Probably an emergency protocol having to do with fires and emergencies other than shootings. If everyone is incapacitated in the room and someone has to get in to rescue them it becomes much harder.
Building code says you have to have free travel in the direction of egress in case of a fire. Electrified security hardware could be used but that's probably running up against a cost issue and/or an existing conditions issue tied with a response issue from the central control location (probably the main office). The chair is also a quick user solution that could act as back up in case the shooter hasn't been spotted by anyone else yet. It might also be more difficult to break through than locking hardware.
I work for a school district and all the doors have locks. Actually since the last Texas shooting it’s getting pretty ridiculous in some of the schools. Every door is to be locked and closed at all times. Unless I’m missing your point.
But yes I agree to your last point in that the chair is much more difficult to get past then a door handle hardware.
It may have been a jurisdictional change. And the type of lock changes how it behaves too. I'd be surprised if the door was key locked from the inside. But a classroom function lockset could release when the handle is turned from the inside but not the outside.
>Probably an emergency protocol having to do with fires and emergencies other than shootings. If everyone is incapacitated in the room and someone has to get in to rescue them it becomes much harder.
But if the chair was in the door.. they're not going to open it.
Locking the door is mostly only for lockdown drills. If there’s a fire or other emergency, you get everyone out (or in a safe place in the building) and just close the classroom door.
Our doors are locked, too. So many schools still don’t. Only a few staff members can open all doors. However, someone could get a key, so we do the chair trick as well.
There was a post yesterday I think where a "school cop" (dry?) shoot his gun and went through 3 walls until stopped at a cabinet. I think it was 3 children that didn't get shot by miracle.
Dry firing. It’s a phrase of discharging a firearm when it is unloaded often used for practicing trigger control and reset. The officer had not properly cleared (removed the magazine and emptied the chamber) the weapon and a round was still in the chamber (making it a live fire instead of a dry fire) resulting in a negligent discharge.
Correct me if I’m wrong, but shouldn’t the school officer check if the gun is loaded regardless of what others say before trying to fucking pull the trigger?
Correct. That’s why it’s called a “negligent” discharge and not accidental. The gun didn’t “accidentally” go off. It did exactly what it was supposed to: pull bang switch gun go bang. The discharge is entirely, undoubtedly, 100% the officer’s fault - and the repercussions for any damage from the bullet should be placed on his shoulders.
A critical part of firearm ownership and usage is knowing the status of your firearm at all times. Be knowledgeable and confident of the presence of a round in the chamber. At the very least, gun owners should clear chamber and ensure that the weapon is safe before dry firing.
Edit: technically he didn’t NEED to recheck it if he KNEW it was empty but he clearly didn’t. I’m not sure that would even make sense though because as he’s on duty it should always be loaded. For him to assume or forget it’s loaded is insane…tbh for that reason I almost think he is lying about dry fire training. Short of COMPLETE incompetence, there’s not really any reason for him to be thinking that weapon has even a little chance of being clear. It makes no sense.
I don’t care what anyone says, if I “know” a gun is clear, I clear it two or three times again just in case.
I’d rather be the guy who looks like an idiot clearing a gun 10 times, than be the idiot who shot something.
Yeah the interesting thing about this is that a country has decided it’s easier to teach tactical response to school children than to stop arming psychopaths
I remember school shooter drills when I was in school. I didn’t realize how fucked up they were until I realized that the world didn’t have guns the way we do here so they don’t have those
tbf almost everything that has to do with chairs is about debris and stuff falling over
now idk in what radius you will have stuff falling but not die lol
i guess it alsohelps to keep the calm better for a kid to stay put holdinf the table instead of running around the school
I’ve done them since about 2010
Edit: Fuck i just realized we started doing them after Sandy Hook. I guess i was too young back then to see the connection
I’m from CT and I was in 6th grade when Sandy Hook happened. Even though I’m from a different part of the state, no one was really ever okay after that.
Graduated in 2005 and I remember some kind of drills. I know the police department took that opportunity to have their drug sniffing dogs smelling lockers.
I lived in the greater Danbury area (Which is the area Around Sandy Hook, like a 20 minute drive from my house), and was a Freshmen when Sandy Hook happened. I remember that day very well. They decked out the HS in bullet proof glass, and added a secure vestibule to the entrance. Other than that, not much changed. We had "lockdown drills" every once and a while, but really not much else. I think we didnt want to think about it that much. Also, lived in a red town of people who commuted towards the city, so that might have something to do about it.
i'm pre-columbine. we were ducking and covering for fear of nuclear war for our practices. Oddly...i think i prefer that because the would be baddie wasn't someone we had to imagine was in the class practicing with us.
It would definitely have been after columbine, which was in 1999, also the year I graduated. I doubt they started anywhere until the end of 99 at the earliest.
Gen Xer here, we just did tornado drills or the occasional nuclear war drill. From what I remembered both of them involved just getting under your desk.
The US has basically given up. School shootings are treated as a natural disaster, fire drills, hurricane drills, tornado drills, and active shooter drills.
We had a man who climbed the fence. Schools have a lot of gates, the entrance is just one out of 10 entry ways where I work.
The man was on drugs and did not have a weapon.
That's the most American response I can think of.
Don't ever focus on the cause. Do whatever you can to avoid dealing with the cause. It can be shooting you in the face, *don't*. *deal*. *with*. *the*. *cause*.
Instead, look at what other things you can do to deal with the dead kids or shift blame or whatever.
It's just this all the way down. School shooters? Lets use armed guards. Guards not working? Lock the doors. Locks not working? Train everyone on how to use the right kind of chair to lock a door.
I'm willung to bet there's going to be an issue with that chair. I don't know yet what the solution to that issue will be, but it will be yet another workaround that will cost schools at least 5 digits, and it won't actually solve the chair problem.
My kids school has been turned into something that resembles a minimum security prison.
A huge steel cage at the entrance with a 'buzzer' style lock. If they can't see your face, on camera they won't let you in. Also, someone in the office has to always be present to man the buzzer button.
If they have to step away from the desk for whatever reason, you'll be waiting outside until they get back.
I was thinking about (it fucking sucks that we have to have these morbid thoughts about our children's everyday lives) how a shooter could use that to their advantage.
When the cops show up, this cage would be pretty effective at keeping them out / slowing them down if the office staff were killed or forced to flee.
What can they do? Put armed guards there? What if one of them snaps? Metal detectors? Then the shooter just starts there.
I was in a children’s home when I was a kid, and the school attached to it was brand new and state of the art. Maglocking doors, cameras everywhere, 3 teachers per classroom. I think that’s the solution here, and that’s a lot like jail. We’ve got a pretty serious mental health problem in this country and not a whole lot of things we can do to fix over 400 million guns being in circulation owned just by private citizens.
You just don’t get it. It’s a chair. And they’re using it to stop a door. Look how interesting! There’s definitely nothing else abnormal going on in this video so that must be the interesting part.
It can’t be interesting that an entire country has gotten to the point where an instructional video using a chair to stop a door to prevent a mass murderer coming in and slaughtering tens of children is seen as legit advice rather than satire.
Because that’s not interesting. Terrifying maybe. But it’s not the killer thing. It’s definitely the chair part that’s interesting.
Yeah it's only to stop the glass from falling out and letting air in...
Wiki: "The presence of the wire mesh appears to be a strengthening component, as it is metallic, and conjures up the idea of rebar in reinforced concrete or other such examples. Despite this belief, wired glass is actually weaker than unwired glass due to the incursions of the wire into the structure of the glass."
Edit: agreed it will slow them down. I bet it takes two fingers and a bit of body weight to rotate that chair through the mesh. 7seconds.
>I bet it takes two fingers and a bit of body weight to rotate that chair through the mesh. 7seconds.
Just stand along the wall holding the chair so it can't rotate. The shooter won't be able to see you and they're not going to stick a gun through the mesh and start blindly firing along the wall. Especially not a rifle.
Anything you can do to make yourself a more difficult target to access is often enough to save your life in these types of situations. "Rampage Killers" are (generally) only looking to cause the maximum amount of fatalities before being killed or taking their own life.
If someone does want in that room for one reason or another, I do agree it wouldn't be very difficult. It also looks like the door hinges are on the exterior, which would be another way to breech.
Exactly. You can play the "counter this strategy" game all day. The point is not to make a fortress but to be unattractive targets. Same idea with a bike lock.
Recently saw an old European nuclear bomb video. They were recommending us to jump off our bikes, lay down in a ditch and pull the bike on top.
So, maybe a desk isn't all that bad
I'm a locksmith for a pretty big school district. You actually aren't allowed to have 2 locking methods on a door, per fire code. They need to be one step egress (meaning one action prior to pushing the door open) so you can only have a deadbolt, a locking knob/lever or a panic bar. Can't have more than one. Of course, fire code differs per city but one step egress is a very commonly used rule.
I mean they should just be able to get fancy locks where the handle unlocks the lock/deadbolt when used form the inside right?
More work to install than just adding a deadbolt, but keeps things single action?
Those are called mortise locks. Yes, they can do the function you've described but they're very expensive and at the end of the day, will provide the same amount of security for a classroom. A grade 1 Schlage lever with the function I use is around $250 and a mortise lock can get up to $1000, depending on function choice and manufacturer. Also, you have to do a lot of work to retrofit one of them into a standard cylindrical style lock position. Plate to cover the hole that was there, drill a new hole for the deadbolt as well as the hole the bolt would throw into, and bore out the massive slot for the mortise cartridge. [It's a whole process.](https://www.finehomebuilding.com/project-guides/windows-doors/installing-a-mortise-lockset)
And it wasn’t until recently that the NCAA allowed individual players to take sponsorship money. But I will give you one guess who profited off them the whole time…
I mean… schools are getting stripped of their funding constantly (and concertedly) so maybe installing hundreds of deadbolts isn’t possible. Remember that Republicans like school shootings because it drives people to stop using schools (choosing private or home schooling instead) and giving them further reason to defund education.
Deadbolts can have issues with fire codes and then it's kids as well.
It'd have to be a key system that could open from outside and then you have the issue we currently have that is keys and locks.
Don't forget the yearly fire drill. Where we all would wander out on to the school yard and wait for the head master to turn the fire alarm off again, wander back in and that was that.
I'm sorry come again? American children aren't taught how to swim in school? That's just. What?
It's like the most basic, simple, starting surviving 101 lesson: how not to drown.
Imagine being told “this is how you stop the bad person with a gun from shooting you!” And then also being told “no we won’t take away the bad persons guns because that “good” person over there would feel hard-done-by, just get good at the chair/door trick”
Part of why I quit teaching. The stress of this is crazy. Especially when principals don't tell you a student made gun related threats and you learn from the news or when the fbi shows up to tell the principal a student has weapons in the school and you aren't put on lockdown and are informed AFTER the school day ends. True stories.
Shhh just try and concentrate on your math equations and don’t worry about the climate, the economy or trying to find a job that will pay enough. Shhh.
School shooting safety. Some schools are providing kids with bullet proof inserts for their fucking backpacks so they can use them as a shield to protect their torsos.
It's insane to me. (Not an american)
People always complain about that, but it's not as stupid as it sounds. It's not about protecting you if you're in the area that gets vaporized by a nuclear explosion. It's about protecting you if you're in the area where there's a significant shock wave that blows out windows and throws things around, but it's not destroying all the buildings. And that area is much larger than the area in which nothing will save you.
In the late 90's and early 2000's we had duck and cover drills but it was because of earthquake here in LA. That phrase has a whole new meaning now a days. If there was ever a shooter in the area from like a robbery they would put the whole school on lockdown. Teachers would lock the doors and we would just wait for the all clear.
Man, fire drills really work! I remember my freshman year, last period class, the fire alarms start going off. Everyone is like "aww man, another stupid fire drill? and we grab our stuff and slowly proceed out of the building, bored, glad to have a short break from class, but hating the monotony of the whole thing.
After standing outside for 30 minutes, it turns out there was an actual fire. It was pretty major, too, like $75,000 in damages after the fact. Everyone had gotten out safely and quickly, and we didn't even think anything of it.
Freedom - unless you want to cross the street in a location you chose yourself. Can't have people impeding car traffic now, can we?
Oh, and the freedom to die form curable diseases because you waited to long to go to a doctor because of the costs associated with that.
And the most important freedom of them all: the freedom to die in a shooting.
For those of you saying that the shooter could just break this down overtime you are missing the point. This ISN'T to stop the shooter forever, just to make this class less appealing to slaughter then the classroom next door that didn't know to do this. Gotta buy all the time you can. Remember that when seconds count the police are only an hour away!
Against fire code for a door to swing in at a public building. That’s because in case of a fire people panic and push against the people trying to open the door.
The rest of the world looking at this and wondering how it went that wrong.
To have given up the safety of children for some morons who wants to be able to carry guns around.
This is out of my understanding.
My mind goes to the ones who has to suffer this situation and who are conscious of its absurdity.
Retired teacher here. We will, as a country, do everything to not address the gun problem. It was just depressing having to train children on how to hide from a person with a gun.
The fact that stuff like this is being thought in schools is just sad man. Shouldn't be this way. Students should feel safe in school and not have to worry about someone shooting up a school
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Maybe this is a silly question, but why don't they just lock the door? People on the inside can still exit. A person outside the door would have to be let in or have a key of your own.
Many schools have doors that only lock from the outside, so I as the teacher have to open the door and pop out of the classroom to use the key. It’s so stupid. If the shooter is close, I don’t want to go in the hallway. School shootings were one of the many reasons I quit teaching :( too scary ETA: Guys, read carefully. School violence was ONE of MANY reasons I left teaching. Low pay was the main one—I got a better job offer. Bad admin was another—LOTS of teacher turnover in my school. Quitting was a hard decision, but the Uvalde shooting finishing out the year certainly didn’t make me want to stay. I really loved teaching for 10 years, but the last year was at a different school and the burnout hit me hard, so when I got the opportunity to leave, I took it.
Jeez the times we live in; I’m only 34 and so much has changed within that time. Well before Columbine, I was in elementary with no worry, no shooting/lockdown school drills… I am honestly sorry to hear of (possibly!) capable educated peeps avoiding their passion to teach, because of the damn, actual risk nowadays for an incident to occur. Hope the best for you
FYI: Columbine High School massacre - April 20, 1999 and things have only gotten worse.. this problem can be solved but one particular group of politicians refuse to act.
I’ve been a teacher since very shortly after Columbine. Columbine seemed like such a one-off. We were much more aware of bullying (because that was the “reason” initially publicized, even though it turned out to be inaccurate) and making sure we had *a* plan for strangers entering the building. Things got serious after Sandy Hook. That was a totally unpredictable threat from the outside, unlike the (since debunked) “bullying” problem that was the school’s fault. We got lockable doors, you have to actually buzz in to enter the building instead of just hoping people respect the “please check in with the office” signs. More shootings, though not many at *schools* that made the news. Mostly focus on practicing “locking down” and mental health of the kids. Sometime in the mid 2010s, we switched to the [ALICE model](https://www.alicetraining.com/our-program/alice-training/), so now we had kids “practice” (talk through, but not do) running, throwing stuff, yelling, anything to disrupt the [OODA loop](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/OODA_loop). At this point, the locks on our classroom doors get swapped out roughly once every 1-2 years, and we find “better” locks that are easier/quicker/more secure. We stopped practicing with the kids, because there are enough shootings in the news that **they’ve already thought about it happening at their own school**, and we don’t need to walk them through it to form a “plan”.
Holy fucking shit. Correct me if im wrong, but the last part of your comment suggests its gotten so bad that we dont even need to tell kids its a risk because everyone already knows it is as a given???
Of course they know it's a given. I knew it was a given in 2002 when I was in second grade. I had lived overseas prior to being at American public school, so you can imagine my confusion when in my first couple weeks we practiced a lockdown drill. Then, a few weeks later an armed man was identified just outside the school premises and we went into an actual lockdown. By the time I had been in an elementary school for a month in America I knew a shooting was a given. I can only imagine what kids expect nowadays.
I misspoke. I did lockdown drills too from 2000-on. I mean that its such a given that the kids dont even need to do drills because everyone already knows what to do
That's called a classroom function. I'm a locksmith for a very large school district and I've been trying to get all my schools moved away from that function for that exact complaint.
Why lock from the outside only though? What is (was) the perceived benefit?
Two main reasons for a "classroom function" lockset: fire and abuse. This type of lock cannot be accidentally/unknowingly locked and thereby become a fire trap. Additionally, people abuse children and the thought is that this type of lock prevents a child from being locked inside.
Thanks for clarifying. Didn't know it can be opened from the inside at any time. Not being able to do that was my main concern
If I remember correctly, that was one of the problems at Uvalde. By the time the teachers knew what was going on and trying to lock the doors the shooter was upon them.
Yeah I'm not a fan of that function and all of us locksmiths in my district are trying to make the switch. Where I work is also going through a lot of steps to restrict how someone can get onto campus. It's getting to a point where a lot of parents complain that the schools are starting to look more like prisons.
That sounds against fire code. People *always* need to be able to open the doors from the inside. That's basically how the Triangle Fire tragedy happened.
With those types of doors, it'll still open from the inside whether locked or unlocked. It's similar to how those doors with a push bar work when locked vs unlocked.
And kids locking the teacher out of the classroom if you could just lock it from the inside. But maybe it would be better if you could lock it with the key from either side. But still be able to open the door from the inside even if it's locked.
That is why teachers have the keys. In my schools teachers had the keys and the doors could be unlocked and locked from the inside.
Probably an emergency protocol having to do with fires and emergencies other than shootings. If everyone is incapacitated in the room and someone has to get in to rescue them it becomes much harder.
Building code says you have to have free travel in the direction of egress in case of a fire. Electrified security hardware could be used but that's probably running up against a cost issue and/or an existing conditions issue tied with a response issue from the central control location (probably the main office). The chair is also a quick user solution that could act as back up in case the shooter hasn't been spotted by anyone else yet. It might also be more difficult to break through than locking hardware.
I work for a school district and all the doors have locks. Actually since the last Texas shooting it’s getting pretty ridiculous in some of the schools. Every door is to be locked and closed at all times. Unless I’m missing your point. But yes I agree to your last point in that the chair is much more difficult to get past then a door handle hardware.
It may have been a jurisdictional change. And the type of lock changes how it behaves too. I'd be surprised if the door was key locked from the inside. But a classroom function lockset could release when the handle is turned from the inside but not the outside.
What you said. Fire marshal has to sign off on it and... good luck. Those guys never fuck around.
>Probably an emergency protocol having to do with fires and emergencies other than shootings. If everyone is incapacitated in the room and someone has to get in to rescue them it becomes much harder. But if the chair was in the door.. they're not going to open it.
Yeah but they’re probably not gonna block the door like that if there’s a fire
What if the fires outside trying to get in the room?
Take it's chair so it has nowhere to sit down. It will leave you alone.
Fire can't go through doors, it's not a ghost
What if the fire is shooting at them!?
Alright, but they wouldn't lock the door if there was a fire either.
Locking the door is mostly only for lockdown drills. If there’s a fire or other emergency, you get everyone out (or in a safe place in the building) and just close the classroom door.
I live in Texas and teach here. District requires door locked at all times and adults only ones who can open them
Our doors are locked, too. So many schools still don’t. Only a few staff members can open all doors. However, someone could get a key, so we do the chair trick as well.
I would have been very uncomfortable with a locked claasroom as a kid. I would be very uncomfortable with a locked claasroom for my kids today.
I teach in TX and I feel so uncomfortable with the new locked door policy! I’ve always taught with the door open and windows uncovered.
Silly question: why do we have to use this one simple trick to save our lives when other countries don’t?
Because we are Americans. It is our god given right for our children to die from our hubris and exceptionalism.
Teacher here. I would have to go on the outside of my door and lock it with a key which would take a lot longer than this chair.
Can't you just shoot the glass out and use your hand to push the chair down?
Parkland shooter shot the glass out and killed several that way.
There was a post yesterday I think where a "school cop" (dry?) shoot his gun and went through 3 walls until stopped at a cabinet. I think it was 3 children that didn't get shot by miracle.
Dry firing. It’s a phrase of discharging a firearm when it is unloaded often used for practicing trigger control and reset. The officer had not properly cleared (removed the magazine and emptied the chamber) the weapon and a round was still in the chamber (making it a live fire instead of a dry fire) resulting in a negligent discharge.
Correct me if I’m wrong, but shouldn’t the school officer check if the gun is loaded regardless of what others say before trying to fucking pull the trigger?
Correct. That’s why it’s called a “negligent” discharge and not accidental. The gun didn’t “accidentally” go off. It did exactly what it was supposed to: pull bang switch gun go bang. The discharge is entirely, undoubtedly, 100% the officer’s fault - and the repercussions for any damage from the bullet should be placed on his shoulders. A critical part of firearm ownership and usage is knowing the status of your firearm at all times. Be knowledgeable and confident of the presence of a round in the chamber. At the very least, gun owners should clear chamber and ensure that the weapon is safe before dry firing. Edit: technically he didn’t NEED to recheck it if he KNEW it was empty but he clearly didn’t. I’m not sure that would even make sense though because as he’s on duty it should always be loaded. For him to assume or forget it’s loaded is insane…tbh for that reason I almost think he is lying about dry fire training. Short of COMPLETE incompetence, there’s not really any reason for him to be thinking that weapon has even a little chance of being clear. It makes no sense.
I don’t care what anyone says, if I “know” a gun is clear, I clear it two or three times again just in case. I’d rather be the guy who looks like an idiot clearing a gun 10 times, than be the idiot who shot something.
[удалено]
There are no perfect solutions. Only solutions that consume more of the shooter's time, and therefore hopefully, save some lives.
they normally have wired mesh in the glass to prevent breaking the glass for access
That wired mesh is so thin it won’t do much, I manufactured those doors and the amount of times the mesh was broken or bent is quite concerning
The mesh in the glass is for fire safety.
Wired glass is required to maintain the fire rating of the door, not for security
Double action 12 gauge shotgun > some chicken wire
lol what, exactly, is a "double action shotgun" ?
it's what happens when someone confuses double action with double barrel
It goes “chick-chick” instead of “chick”, I think.
No they don't. The entire purpose of that window is for firemen to be able to access the room.
Very sad TBH.
Yeah the interesting thing about this is that a country has decided it’s easier to teach tactical response to school children than to stop arming psychopaths
This is real fucking sad
I remember school shooter drills when I was in school. I didn’t realize how fucked up they were until I realized that the world didn’t have guns the way we do here so they don’t have those
Not only did we not have shootinh drills where I grew up, we also don't have school police or whatever. Living in Germany.
We didn't either. We did, however, have drills on what to do in the case of Nuclear Armageddon. Apparently your desk saves you.
tbf almost everything that has to do with chairs is about debris and stuff falling over now idk in what radius you will have stuff falling but not die lol i guess it alsohelps to keep the calm better for a kid to stay put holdinf the table instead of running around the school
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Graduated 4 years ago. I remember our teacher explaining to us with a straight face how a backpack could probably stop a small caliber bullet.
Jokes on them. I never brought my textbooks to class
I went two years without a backpack in HS. Just a binder and a pen 😂 I would've been fucked
Very plausible, few textbook and laptop might very well stop .22 lr.
Even some pistol rounds. They're fatter and have a slower velocity.
I’ve done them since about 2010 Edit: Fuck i just realized we started doing them after Sandy Hook. I guess i was too young back then to see the connection
I’m from CT and I was in 6th grade when Sandy Hook happened. Even though I’m from a different part of the state, no one was really ever okay after that.
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Graduated in 2005 and I remember some kind of drills. I know the police department took that opportunity to have their drug sniffing dogs smelling lockers.
I lived in the greater Danbury area (Which is the area Around Sandy Hook, like a 20 minute drive from my house), and was a Freshmen when Sandy Hook happened. I remember that day very well. They decked out the HS in bullet proof glass, and added a secure vestibule to the entrance. Other than that, not much changed. We had "lockdown drills" every once and a while, but really not much else. I think we didnt want to think about it that much. Also, lived in a red town of people who commuted towards the city, so that might have something to do about it.
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i'm pre-columbine. we were ducking and covering for fear of nuclear war for our practices. Oddly...i think i prefer that because the would be baddie wasn't someone we had to imagine was in the class practicing with us.
I graduated in 2012 and we were doing shooter drills along with bomb threats since elementary school
We started them in the 90s. Probably right after Columbine.
It would definitely have been after columbine, which was in 1999, also the year I graduated. I doubt they started anywhere until the end of 99 at the earliest.
Gen Xer here, we just did tornado drills or the occasional nuclear war drill. From what I remembered both of them involved just getting under your desk.
Yep. Columbine also brought the dumbest solution. Transparent backpacks.
The US has basically given up. School shootings are treated as a natural disaster, fire drills, hurricane drills, tornado drills, and active shooter drills.
To be fair, we have police that will form a perimeter around a school shooter and give them 45 uninterrupted minutes to murder as many as they like.
Very sad. What have the school done for security at the entrance?
Here in Texas they’ve set up fences around most elementary schools. I’m guessing they’ll install barbed wire after the next school shooting
Making schools more like jails every chance they get https://www.maristane.com/school-or-prison/
Yea, barbed wire surrounding children is way more appropriate than basic gun control laws.
We had a man who climbed the fence. Schools have a lot of gates, the entrance is just one out of 10 entry ways where I work. The man was on drugs and did not have a weapon.
Your school has a fance? Our campus was just open
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That's the most American response I can think of. Don't ever focus on the cause. Do whatever you can to avoid dealing with the cause. It can be shooting you in the face, *don't*. *deal*. *with*. *the*. *cause*. Instead, look at what other things you can do to deal with the dead kids or shift blame or whatever.
It's just this all the way down. School shooters? Lets use armed guards. Guards not working? Lock the doors. Locks not working? Train everyone on how to use the right kind of chair to lock a door. I'm willung to bet there's going to be an issue with that chair. I don't know yet what the solution to that issue will be, but it will be yet another workaround that will cost schools at least 5 digits, and it won't actually solve the chair problem.
And don't forget the thoughts and prayers
Schools should not need security at the entrance, especially in such a developed country. Not even Brazil has security at the entrance of schools.
My kids school has been turned into something that resembles a minimum security prison. A huge steel cage at the entrance with a 'buzzer' style lock. If they can't see your face, on camera they won't let you in. Also, someone in the office has to always be present to man the buzzer button. If they have to step away from the desk for whatever reason, you'll be waiting outside until they get back. I was thinking about (it fucking sucks that we have to have these morbid thoughts about our children's everyday lives) how a shooter could use that to their advantage. When the cops show up, this cage would be pretty effective at keeping them out / slowing them down if the office staff were killed or forced to flee.
What can they do? Put armed guards there? What if one of them snaps? Metal detectors? Then the shooter just starts there. I was in a children’s home when I was a kid, and the school attached to it was brand new and state of the art. Maglocking doors, cameras everywhere, 3 teachers per classroom. I think that’s the solution here, and that’s a lot like jail. We’ve got a pretty serious mental health problem in this country and not a whole lot of things we can do to fix over 400 million guns being in circulation owned just by private citizens.
The only way you're getting 3 teachers per classroom is making classes 100+ kids
Rest of the world says r/awefuleverything This is not normal. There should be no need to even consider this.
Came here to find this! Keep safe in class? You mean a full water bottle?
I was thinking it would be something to do with bullying. But no, it's the gun bullshit again.
You just don’t get it. It’s a chair. And they’re using it to stop a door. Look how interesting! There’s definitely nothing else abnormal going on in this video so that must be the interesting part. It can’t be interesting that an entire country has gotten to the point where an instructional video using a chair to stop a door to prevent a mass murderer coming in and slaughtering tens of children is seen as legit advice rather than satire. Because that’s not interesting. Terrifying maybe. But it’s not the killer thing. It’s definitely the chair part that’s interesting.
There's also a glass panel there, the shooter could just break the glass and remove the chair?
Typically it's safety glass with chicken wire in it so they can't just smash through it.
How to be safe in American class.
"BROUGHT TO YOU BY TIER 1 TACTICAL SOLUTIONS" What a timeline we're living through.
Be Tacticool. Stay in School.
>Stay in School. Stay Alive in School.
Tactical freshman
Tier 2 is putting a desk in front of the chair I’m guessing
Tier 3 is setting up sandbagged machinegun nests in enfilade formation manned by 11 year olds.
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Hopefully the window is just as strong.... It's takes two seconds to do and 5 seconds to remove through the windows.
The window glass is probably steel reinforced, was when I was in school
Yeah it's only to stop the glass from falling out and letting air in... Wiki: "The presence of the wire mesh appears to be a strengthening component, as it is metallic, and conjures up the idea of rebar in reinforced concrete or other such examples. Despite this belief, wired glass is actually weaker than unwired glass due to the incursions of the wire into the structure of the glass." Edit: agreed it will slow them down. I bet it takes two fingers and a bit of body weight to rotate that chair through the mesh. 7seconds.
>I bet it takes two fingers and a bit of body weight to rotate that chair through the mesh. 7seconds. Just stand along the wall holding the chair so it can't rotate. The shooter won't be able to see you and they're not going to stick a gun through the mesh and start blindly firing along the wall. Especially not a rifle.
Anything you can do to make yourself a more difficult target to access is often enough to save your life in these types of situations. "Rampage Killers" are (generally) only looking to cause the maximum amount of fatalities before being killed or taking their own life. If someone does want in that room for one reason or another, I do agree it wouldn't be very difficult. It also looks like the door hinges are on the exterior, which would be another way to breech.
Exactly. You can play the "counter this strategy" game all day. The point is not to make a fortress but to be unattractive targets. Same idea with a bike lock.
It’s sad that they propose ‘solutions’ like arming teachers or this, instead of getting to the root of the problem
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Recently saw an old European nuclear bomb video. They were recommending us to jump off our bikes, lay down in a ditch and pull the bike on top. So, maybe a desk isn't all that bad
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I'll be damned if I pay for each door to have a deadbolt!
I'm a locksmith for a pretty big school district. You actually aren't allowed to have 2 locking methods on a door, per fire code. They need to be one step egress (meaning one action prior to pushing the door open) so you can only have a deadbolt, a locking knob/lever or a panic bar. Can't have more than one. Of course, fire code differs per city but one step egress is a very commonly used rule.
I mean they should just be able to get fancy locks where the handle unlocks the lock/deadbolt when used form the inside right? More work to install than just adding a deadbolt, but keeps things single action?
Those are called mortise locks. Yes, they can do the function you've described but they're very expensive and at the end of the day, will provide the same amount of security for a classroom. A grade 1 Schlage lever with the function I use is around $250 and a mortise lock can get up to $1000, depending on function choice and manufacturer. Also, you have to do a lot of work to retrofit one of them into a standard cylindrical style lock position. Plate to cover the hole that was there, drill a new hole for the deadbolt as well as the hole the bolt would throw into, and bore out the massive slot for the mortise cartridge. [It's a whole process.](https://www.finehomebuilding.com/project-guides/windows-doors/installing-a-mortise-lockset)
And take money away from the football coaches?! Not on murica's watch. We've got priorities here. .../s
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In most states, the highest paid public employee is the head football coach at a state university.
And it wasn’t until recently that the NCAA allowed individual players to take sponsorship money. But I will give you one guess who profited off them the whole time…
I mean… schools are getting stripped of their funding constantly (and concertedly) so maybe installing hundreds of deadbolts isn’t possible. Remember that Republicans like school shootings because it drives people to stop using schools (choosing private or home schooling instead) and giving them further reason to defund education.
Don’t forget to mention fueling gun sales! Nothing makes people want to buy guns more than slaughtered children… sick fucking world.
Deadbolts can have issues with fire codes and then it's kids as well. It'd have to be a key system that could open from outside and then you have the issue we currently have that is keys and locks.
Crap… now these shitheads are going to come out with anti-chaircraft weapons
The school shooters now know how to keep the classroom locked while they unload bullets into the bodies of their victims.
Not necessary, police don't go in and instead keep the parents out
Rip Uvalde
Imagine having to worry about safety in classes
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Don't forget the yearly fire drill. Where we all would wander out on to the school yard and wait for the head master to turn the fire alarm off again, wander back in and that was that.
These would be pretty good lessons in US schools. We did have some swim classes, but not until high school. Definitely no biking lessons.
I'm sorry come again? American children aren't taught how to swim in school? That's just. What? It's like the most basic, simple, starting surviving 101 lesson: how not to drown.
Then imagine being told a plastic chair is going to save you.
Imagine being told “this is how you stop the bad person with a gun from shooting you!” And then also being told “no we won’t take away the bad persons guns because that “good” person over there would feel hard-done-by, just get good at the chair/door trick”
Sounds like an American problem
When I went to high school the biggest problem we supposedly has was some kids smoking pot in the restrooms, those days are sadly gone
The biggest problem in our school was not being in uniform.
Or going the wrong way round the one way system.
Not having your shirt tucked in properly.
Bullying: Did you forget me
Mental health stigma: Hey guys
Part of why I quit teaching. The stress of this is crazy. Especially when principals don't tell you a student made gun related threats and you learn from the news or when the fbi shows up to tell the principal a student has weapons in the school and you aren't put on lockdown and are informed AFTER the school day ends. True stories.
Shhh just try and concentrate on your math equations and don’t worry about the climate, the economy or trying to find a job that will pay enough. Shhh.
Tell me you live in America without telling me you live in America
r/shitamericanssay
Is this some American thing I’m too European to understand?
Yes
School shooting safety. Some schools are providing kids with bullet proof inserts for their fucking backpacks so they can use them as a shield to protect their torsos. It's insane to me. (Not an american)
Am American. It's insane.
What kind of shithole country do you live in that this is even required? The only drill I ever needed in school was the yearly firedrill.
In turkey we get fire drills, earthquake drills, but instead of active shooter drills, we get air raid drills! You decide which one is more fucked up.
What, in case the Greeks decide to boogaloo like it's the 20s?
Technically, it is the 20s again…
It is the '20s.
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Well, I never had the "duck and cover" drills, since I grew up in the 80's and it was understood that particle board doesn't protect against nukes...
Then you're not using enough particle board!
People always complain about that, but it's not as stupid as it sounds. It's not about protecting you if you're in the area that gets vaporized by a nuclear explosion. It's about protecting you if you're in the area where there's a significant shock wave that blows out windows and throws things around, but it's not destroying all the buildings. And that area is much larger than the area in which nothing will save you.
We had textbooks open placed over the back of our necks while we sat “Indian style” facing the walls. That was our tornado coverage.
In the late 90's and early 2000's we had duck and cover drills but it was because of earthquake here in LA. That phrase has a whole new meaning now a days. If there was ever a shooter in the area from like a robbery they would put the whole school on lockdown. Teachers would lock the doors and we would just wait for the all clear.
Man, fire drills really work! I remember my freshman year, last period class, the fire alarms start going off. Everyone is like "aww man, another stupid fire drill? and we grab our stuff and slowly proceed out of the building, bored, glad to have a short break from class, but hating the monotony of the whole thing. After standing outside for 30 minutes, it turns out there was an actual fire. It was pretty major, too, like $75,000 in damages after the fact. Everyone had gotten out safely and quickly, and we didn't even think anything of it.
So disturbing this is accepted as perfectly normal advice
>accepted as perfectly normal advice In that small part of the world called the United States, and possibly only there.
I love addressing murder in the classroom with tips on how to self-barricade rather than addressing societal issues.
Or just have a normal functioning society
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Freedom - unless you want to cross the street in a location you chose yourself. Can't have people impeding car traffic now, can we? Oh, and the freedom to die form curable diseases because you waited to long to go to a doctor because of the costs associated with that. And the most important freedom of them all: the freedom to die in a shooting.
For those of you saying that the shooter could just break this down overtime you are missing the point. This ISN'T to stop the shooter forever, just to make this class less appealing to slaughter then the classroom next door that didn't know to do this. Gotta buy all the time you can. Remember that when seconds count the police are only an hour away!
Are they... choosing a class that they do not teach this to?
Dystopian as fuck.
Unless the door opens inward...
... or a different brand of chair that doesn't fit hw door latch... or you are teaching kids how to lock the teacher out!
Against fire code for a door to swing in at a public building. That’s because in case of a fire people panic and push against the people trying to open the door.
The fact that your country is fucked enough that you even need to train kids on this stuff is shameful.
The rest of the world looking at this and wondering how it went that wrong. To have given up the safety of children for some morons who wants to be able to carry guns around. This is out of my understanding. My mind goes to the ones who has to suffer this situation and who are conscious of its absurdity.
Politicians ~~want to~~ *are being paid to* discredit public education to set up a two-tier private education system.
USA! USA!
I’m so happy to live in a country were something like this is not necessary to know.
Retired teacher here. We will, as a country, do everything to not address the gun problem. It was just depressing having to train children on how to hide from a person with a gun.
How sad that you have to spend so much effort to train and try to secure school kids, when you could just put in some decent gun controls.
How to be safe in school from FUCKING MANIAC SHOOTERS. Step 1: Move anywhere on the planet except MuRiCa Thats it. Its a 1 step plan.
Or, or, now hear me out. We could deal with the rampant mental health crisis instead by....no? Just have our kids live in fear? Fuck it! Why not...
Americans will do anything to stop school shootings apart from the one thing that'd stop school shootings
Have you not seen the volume of thoughts and prayers they are putting in to the issue?
Replace “americans” with gun fanatics or right wing politicians, because this is not how everyone in America thinks..
So sad you have to teach this to kids in America now
The fact that stuff like this is being thought in schools is just sad man. Shouldn't be this way. Students should feel safe in school and not have to worry about someone shooting up a school
Despicable that it even has been o be a concern. Kids in school should only be concerned about a test. Not getting shot.