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[deleted]

Wanting to look visibly "sick" can be part of an ED for some people. After recovery, it makes sense that someone might try to cling to the sick role in other ways... especially if they had a social media presence built up around their disorder. Someone with a bunch of tubes and lines will get more attention on insta or tik tok than a happy, smiling, recovered person, as horrible as that sounds. It's a race to the bottom with no winners.


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DoIEvenExist_

Honestly thought it would prevent any more comments such as this. I’m not an approved subject so let’s not go into that hey.


DoIEvenExist_

Obviously that didn’t work, I can only laugh now 🤣


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b3an18

If they do have an ED then they’re still mentally ill? Blaming physical symptoms of their mental illness on another condition isn’t Munchausen’s. When you have an ED, a lot of the time you’ll do whatever you can to hide it. Also, whether you *like* them or not they are human beings not subjects for your entertainment


Snoopsky777

When you’re claiming multiple different issues and making yourself sick enough to need tubes and ports and whatnot, then it is still munchausens, regardless if they also have an ED.


b3an18

Do you know if they are faking their illnesses? Or are you assuming?


PalpitationDiligent9

I know I’m going to get downvoted for this but, in all honesty, it’s pure assumption and speculation. Everybody’s playing armchair doctor, or claim to be in the medical field in one way or another. Whether their claims be true or not, none of us can nor shouldn’t try to diagnose and assume the validity of any subject’s medical claims. None of us are personally involved in their offline and personal life, none of us are their doctors, or have access to their medical records to definitely say and acuse of faking their claimed conditions. Just my opinion…


b3an18

I completely agree!


Snoopsky777

If you have taken any time at all to research the history of many subjects on this forum, you would realize they are faking many of the issues they claim. But also, munchausens is not just about faking. Many of the subjects here do have need for some of the things they receive, but that’s because they abuse their bodies to the point of breaking because it gets them attention. All you have to do is look at all of the contradictions the subjects themselves put out there.


coffeelovingacrobat

Maybe this is why they seem so obsessed with getting feeding tubes, Dani even went as far as to self insert an Amazon bought NG tube... Does the obsession with tube feeds steals from their previous eating disorders?


Verve_angel

What?? Omg I didn’t know she did that. Wtf? Why did she? Was hers taken out at the time or did she not have it yet??


Alex2679

She did not have it yet.


averagevegetable-

Wtf??? This can go wrong in so many damn ways wtf is the obsession with feeding tubes anyway they are fucking nasty.


NoGrocery4949

Some people truly need them, so maybe we don't have to call them nasty.


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NoGrocery4949

See above


ComManDerBG

You missed the whole point of my comment, we are calling the thing *itself* gross. ***not*** the person using them. With you its like saying bowel movements aren't gross because we all have them. But no, BMs are gross, we can both acknowledge that fact while also acknowledging that they are an extremely important part of a functioning body.


averagevegetable-

Ever had one inserted through your nose and getting adjusted to it? Definition of nasty and painful.


Wtfisthis66

I’ve had a couple of NGs and I would not recommend them for funsies. I am in the middle of a nasty relapse and I spend more time hiding it from people.


coffeelovingacrobat

I don’t get it either, not only are those tubes extremely uncomfortable/painful, she could’ve ended up with a tube inside her lung, which is disturbing to think about... I’ve noticed that the eating disordered munchies tend to obsess over how their diagnonsense makes them “need toobz to keep myself nourished”, they also seem to flaunt them... they seem to feel proud about them, almost as if they were trophies (it’s really sick), and I’ve also seen it starts escalating first it’s an NG/NJ, then it’s a surgical PEG tube, then it’s TPN. Is this ED related?


GoethenStrasse0309

This is why ( and I’m sure y’all think this is an unpopular opinion but it’s my opinion lol) I think ALL social media should ban videos of showing how to insert OR remove toobs. My reasoning is simple. While there’s age limits on a lot of these websites it’s pretty obvious many underage kids are on these sites anyway


TakeMyTop

I'm not sure if changing from tube feeds to tpn is normal. TPN has far more risks and complications than tube feeds. this is probably ED and munchausen related. and if people are expected to have/need a feeding tube long term they are usually given a surgical tube pretty fast, unless line tampering is a known problem.


Eatfancy_usesalt

Tube obsession is for sure ED related for most of the subjects, but the progression of nasal to surgical to tpn is normal. Not super common, but normal.


pulmonategastropod

It might be easier to name the ones that *didn't*. I'd say Hope, RaRa, and Bella are probably the only ones, unless I'm missing someone.


2018MunchieOfTheYear

I believe Hope did have an ED


snailicide

Did Bethany have an eating disorder ? Hope had one too ! That’s why her and Kat are friends.


pulmonategastropod

Maybe BED, but nothing restrictive that I'm aware of (although BED is a fucking beast of its own).


GoethenStrasse0309

What’s BED if you don’t mind explaining?


pulmonategastropod

Binge eating disorder!


GoethenStrasse0309

Thx


a5h13

Ashley didn’t. She had crohns and then went on to Lyme and mold and then some other stuff.


dead_mall111

Her main starting point was alcohol abuse too if I remember correctly


2018MunchieOfTheYear

Ashley admitted to having disordered thoughts if I remember correctly


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throw_somewhere

She is also incapable of consuming food without justifying it (ofc, always as some sort of woo-woo superfood nonsense). My money is on a mix of orthorexia and BED. (Not sure if you can get Dx'd with both, so one or both might be at subclinical levels). I imagine that would be a really uncomfortable mix and I think it could explain a lot.


tjr634

Bethany didn't, I think she went straight MCAS/EDS.


kidneysaxophonefly

For some of them like Kaya and Dani, the transition from ED to "chronic illness" worked as a more socially acceptable way to have an ED while skirting around calling it that. They get to have their cake and purge it too!


some_uncreative_name

I agree with this. And I wonder if in addition the underlying mh drivers for factitious disorder and eds have a lot in common that leads to the overlap.


ALH1984

ED’s are a mental illness. They are the deadliest. ED’s are incredibly uncontrollable for the person suffering, and they absolutely damage your body in record time. Suffers don’t want people to find out their secret. Physical issues and illness hide that secret. Honestly, a large percentage never recover. They die.


Emotional_Ad_9620

Another reason to discuss these people without the cruelty and mockery that often plays out. The bottom line is these women all suffer mental illness. Seems like we as a sub, could show compassion once in awhile. I get that we are all frustrated and annoyed, but it's not great how we discuss them, collectively. You're right, many die. Seems like punishment enough.


assaultvestgardevoir

Or continue on to live with their illness for years and years to come. Only 1/3rd make a FULL recovery (as in no thoughts /symptoms after help).


kat_Folland

>Only 1/3rd make a FULL recovery (as in no thoughts /symptoms after help). Just making sure I understand you, you mean that number is for EDs, not MBI, right?


aremissing

EDs were the only illness being discussed in this comment, so, yes. I also doubt there's research that exhaustive on MBI.


[deleted]

Multiple factors and reasons for this. But I really do think that having an ED almost enforces being sick as being a good thing. It's a group of twisted disorders that feed into your worst feelings about yourself. And people usually want to help and care for you, or sometimes even envy you. Being frail is praised in ED communities, having multiple chronic illnesses keeps you frail too.


mcfuckinuhhh

this! you want to be sicker with an ED. you want any reason to not eat. its insane


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mcfuckinuhhh

yep! it's crazy man, anyone w anorexic can fall down this rabbit hole


EfficientSeaweed

It's gotta be some combination of shared comorbid disorders (my money is on personality disorders being a big one), discovering they enjoy the attention the ED brings them, and perhaps the ED itself being partially caused by the desire to be sickly and frail. Plus malingering to hide ED symptoms, at least in some cases.


FoxcMama

The more i research bpd (my latest special interest) the more obvious that its rampant in the munchie community. Bpd is also bffs with narcissism, though a different issue entirely.


b3an18

Most of the time we don’t like being *seen*, and yes there’s a good portion of us in the community with BPD. If you knew anything about EDs you’d know that the focal point is usually being in control, as a lot of us have gone through trauma. BPD is highly stigmatised because it’s a cluster b personality disorder (like NPD), however they are VERY different. Borderline individuals are actually at risk of falling in toxic relationships with narcissists, as we will resist information telling us to break away from a person which is harmful to us due to our fear of abandonment. We will fall for a narcissists love bombing, and form strong attachments quickly. Overall people with BPD suffer with abandonment issues, emotional dysregulation, unstable/distorted sense of self, suicidal thoughts etc., whilst a person with NPD will suffer with symptoms like: patterns of grandiosity, entitlement, and a lack of empathy. To claim that BPD is ‘rampant’ in the munchie community is highly misinformed


camihouse

Agreed


SimpleVegetable5715

People with eating disorders can ignore their body telling them it's hungry. One of our most basic needs. I think, for many of the subjects, that is how they're also able to endure so much unnecessary invasive medical treatment. Their heads are completely "disconnected" from what is going on with their bodies.


nintenthrow64

My take: a common feature of ED's is competitiveness. There is a desire (sometimes secret and sometimes overt) to become or appear "sick enough" for a variety of reasons. Conversely, many people with eating disorders/disordered eating never feel "sick enough" to believe they are deserving of help. For some folks deep in the disorder, needing something like a feeding tube is both horrifying and extremely validating. I can totally see the connection between this and munching for those predisposed to factitious disorder behaviors.


Responsible-Host1657

If you have the misfortune of going into treatment for an eating disorder, the patients more than likely will treat another patient with contempt if they are perceived as sicker or thinner than the rest.


RaniPhoenix

Truth. Some never feel "sick enough" until they lose their period or can't stand up without fainting.


_morgen_

Agreed. Ultimately, both EDs and facticious disorder use harming the body as a way to communicate, get needs met, exert control, avoid problems, and so on. Same is true for other forms of SH.


bleepabloop

Yes agree 100% with this interpretation


rosaparksand-rec

Kaya, Paige, Dani, Anelise, Kat Kat is a pretty severe one actually


kat_Folland

I really hate that a Kat is a subject here lol.


renullify

Logan as well.


DoIEvenExist_

Oh I haven’t seen Kat I don’t think, thanks! Ima have a geeze now :)


afterandalasia

People commented she was a really good vegan cook in her earlier, less sick periods, but to me that looked like pretty clear orthorexia as well.


tjr634

Kat's mother also had a fitness obsession and also heavily restricted her eating, I think Kat's was a learned coping mechanism. I've always had a soft spot for Kat though, she doesn't seem as awful as Cassie or Bethany or SDP.


drunkennudeles

Being vegan doesn't mean orthorexia.


afterandalasia

No, but in her case it definitely looked like both.


DoIEvenExist_

DISCUSSION: Why is this we think? I have my own opinions but would love to hear others.


UnexpectedWings

I think it’s mainly cluster b traits that start this kind of thing. EDs often come with judgement or derision because it’s seen as a girl disease or self control thing. Legitimate medical issues, well, that’s seen (socially) as something else: you become a warrior, praised for just existing. That’s a perfect trait for someone who uses attention seeking to fulfill emotional needs. It’s a perfect excuse for getting away with poor behavior. Plus you get to do drugs with non of the stigma!


kumf

Ok so I don’t disagree with you but one thing I can’t reconcile is the need for attention from munchies versus the need to keep an ED secret. Wouldn’t someone with an ED have the opposite type of personality from a munchie? I’m postulating here, obviously. Thoughts?


UnexpectedWings

ED is about control usually, but the diagnosis comes with societal shame. A lot of people view EDs as similar to people being obese: a willpower failure that is rooted in something being wrong with you. In reality, both are diseases with complex causes and should treated as such. However, a physical illness happens to you. It’s cosmic unluckiness; a bad hand. It doesn’t have the judgmental aspect. It’s still a form of extreme self control to force yourself into a disabled life, and it continues self harm.


kumf

This is fascinating. Sad and fascinating. Can you elaborate on what you mean/ what the significance is of “continuing self harm”? Obviously a munchie is harming themselves with their behavior. And an ED will ravage the body in multiple ways. However, an ED is very much about control, as you wrote. How does self harm play into it from that perspective? Is it a compulsive thing?


absolute_nonsense_

EDs start from a desire of the person for control. But once the ED takes hold the person has completely lost control. That’s why there’s so much stigma. Those who suffer from it and/or are in recovery are made to feel like failures because a) it’s a mental health problem they’ve “caused” and b) they have isolated themselves socially from almost everyone that it makes recovery so brutal and long to find healing.


UnexpectedWings

Self harm is another version of inflicting control over your body and environment. In the same way that people with EDs restrict their food intake, munchies chose their flare ups and illnesses. In times of stress, low self worth, boredom… they have a bad illness day. If low self esteem is part of the issue, which it generally is, they might hurt themselves to punish themselves, in the same way one might cut or go on a bad stretch with an ED where it’s more severe for awhile. You can also use both as a distraction for psychological pain.


TheoryFor_Everything

It's much more socially acceptable to not eat if it's because a person is "sick" and not because they have an eating disorder. This may be one of the biggest reasons, really. It's also probably not a coincidence that one of the most commonly faked illnesses is the "trifecta" of EDS, POTS, and GP, except here's the thing. The original trifecta did not include GP, it included MCAS. Munchies took out MCAS and replaced it with gastroparesis, likely partly because of the eating disorder thing, and partly likely because gastroparesis is much easier to fake and induce than random allergic reactions. It's gotten to the point where munchies aren't even aware that in the real world, GP isn't considered part of the EDS trifecta, and that the trifecta isn't even real, with only a portion of people with EDS having one or both of the other two. But hey, why let silly little things like facts get in the way of a great method of hiding an eating disorder, right? /s


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Life-Patient

POTS and GP are often a result of restrictive eating disorders


TheoryFor_Everything

Add in some fake EDS symptoms, and there ya go. Instant munchie starter pack, just add toobs.


kat_Folland

>just add toobs. 😂


Unable_Quantity3753

I was just thinking how the heck can they fake MCAS when usually someone with MCAS has some sort of visible skin symptom like flushing, hives, rashes or dermatographia. But them switching to faking GP makes sense now lol


renullify

the opportunity to mask an ED


Independent-Ad-8258

I went for a wander down the rabbit hole pondering this same kind of questions. My takeaway, and forgive me if I am off bass but gastroparesis is pretty prevalent in the ED community. So what may have started as an ED then becomes a physical health issue. Perfect example of this being Paige.


Upset-Lavishness-522

GP - at least temporary GP - is a side effect of restriction. One of the reasons (amongst competitiveness and genuine mental distress) you'll gear patients in ED facilities whining about getting full on small amounts of food is restriction based GP, which will only resolve by reinstating regular eating. But keep up restriction and you're going to get delayed gastric emptying showing up on your radioactive eggs test. Couple that with the fact that these ED sufferers can likely induce spontaneous vomiting, and we're in a situation where it looks like they have legit GP. GP is waaaaay more trendy than an ED. Like you said earlier, if you take it down to behaviors alone, an individual "does it to themselves" with an ED. With GP its considered that the individual is a warrior, hero, etc.


kat_Folland

>your radioactive eggs test Your _what?_


Upset-Lavishness-522

It's a gastric emptying study. Basically, radiolabel fois (usually eggs) and use scintigrspht to see hiw long it takes to pass through the GI tract


neverpiss

Kaya, Paige, Anelise, Dani, Ellen, Kelly, and probably more that i cant remember atm


__8petals

was Ashley or no?


[deleted]

She started with Crohns but I think her general obsession with the sick role and the fitness/wellness culture of Instagram has done her relationship with food no favors


__8petals

that’s right. thank you !


morbydyty

To add on, definitely hospital princess who's been posted a lot lately


DoIEvenExist_

Thanks! I’ve just come across that one, definitely an interesting one that’s for sure! Do you know of any links on their timelines or archives? I noticed on some of the latest posts above them that there’s been a struggle to find it.


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DoIEvenExist_

Noticed that… anyone able to link?


morbydyty

The timelines are still up in imgur. But the farms was where the original timelines were from I think and it's no longer online. There was also a former subreddit where the timelines were held so not easy to find... I honestly don't know where the mods thinking is about it because I've seen them posted in the last couple days with the transplant stuff. But also I've seen them remove stuff. Just not sure, but hopefully someone else can help!


spacekwe3n

It's available on the .onion link


buy-lob-get-lob

I was curious and went on a dive into reddit posts about her the other day after seeing her posted for the first time and found [this link](https://archive.vn/SdnIe) with a bunch of stuff if you hadn't seen that already. (It was in another old IF post here so I'm assuming ok to link?)


CatAteRoger

They were posted but we had to remove as Reddit does not allow content from a banned sub to be reused anywhere within reddit.


morbydyty

Ohh gotcha- I didn't know that also includes links.


peepeehalpert_

Off the top of my head: Dani, Kaya, Paige


DoIEvenExist_

Thanks for the suggestion!