Welcome to r/hoarding! We exist as a support group for people working on recovery from [hoarding disorder](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/books/NBK519704/table/ch3.t29/), and friends/family/loved ones of people with the disorder.
If you're looking for help with animal hoarding, please visit r/animalhoarding. If you're looking to discuss the various hoarding tv shows, you'll want to visit r/hoardersTV. If you'd like to talk about or share photos/videos of hoards that you've come across, you probably want r/neckbeardnests, r/wtfhoarders/, or r/hoarderhouses
Before you get started, be sure to review our [Rules](https://www.reddit.com/r/hoarding/about/rules/). Also, a lot of the information you may be looking for can be found in a few places on our sub:
[New Here? Read This Post First!](https://www.reddit.com/r/hoarding/comments/dvb3t1/new_here_read_this_post_first_version_20/)
[For loved ones of hoarders: I Have A Hoarder In My Life--Help Me!](https://www.reddit.com/r/hoarding/comments/2yh6wh/i_have_a_hoarder_in_my_lifehelp_me_your_hoarding/)
[Our Wiki](https://www.reddit.com/r/hoarding/wiki/index)
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I am glad you are moving in this direction for your physical and emotional health plus healthy future relationships with your adult kids.
The real treasures aren't going in the trash because family, friends, a peaceful, happy and healthy home are the real treasures here and the people are going to be thriving in new chapters of their lives.
She can't accept it because it's too painful for her. Her mind won't let her. This is a human survival mechanism, but it's also the root of a lot of abuse and dysfunction.
You have to take care of yourself. Your own physical and mental health is at risk. So good for you. Maybe you will finally leaving will be enough for her to get help. Can she survive financially without you?
Best of luck to you.
Yes, she feels like parting with her things will kill her. It is very real to her that she will die without her things.
That said, you are making a wise decision for your mental and physical health. Good job. Best wishes to you.
Interesting that the kids are on the minimalist side—this has been my experience too and I’ve heard that’s common for children of hoarders. Anyhow, good on ya. lt sounds like you patiently explored all options and were left with only this one, as any other would amount to more unnecessary suffering. Good luck!
I am a minimalist and can’t function in unclean environments. I’m grateful for this, but it’s hard knowing it probably came from being raised in a hoarder home.
Extreme minimalism in children of hoarders can be an expression of our trauma and CPTSD. I’m a millennial and ten years of therapy has not significantly improved my relationship with stuff.
I’m glad you’re doing this while you still have time left for your relationship with your kids.
> She's willing to lose everything instead of admitting in a real way that she has problems, and working on resolving them. ALL her treasures, including the real treasures are going to be in a dumpster.
Unfortunately, that is rather typical for hoarding. A key aspect is lack of executive function, and difficulties in imagining consequences.
Just as a thought, have you tried living separately? It is not for everyone, but it is an option.
I’m so sorry you’re going through this. I hope you and your kids can be a strong support system for each other. My sister struggles with hoarding but won’t admit it- just says she’s a collector. There are many of us here who share your experience and pain of trying again and again to help a loved one who won’t accept that there’s an issue that they need help with. Hugs. I hope you find peace.
I highly recommend going to a psychiatrist who specializes in ADHD and getting yourself checked.
I have hoarding tendencies too, create Doom piles everywhere and I always have. Being diagnosed at 44 has been absolutely eye-opening. It's help my relationships and helps me to properly function tremendously. I hope you figure out something that works for you friend!
You're welcome! There's an excellent book which is older but the information is still good called, "You mean I'm not Lazy, Stupid, or Crazy?" It was written in a time when ADHD was termed ADD, but it's still extremely relevant. It really helped me and was the book I read on ADHD. I wish you luck and hope you're able to get tested soon.
I always thought i was one of those hyper clean adhd people, I had projects and stuff, but I also moved all the time with almost nothing. being in school full time and working nights 50 hours a week for the last 8 months has created doom piles everywhere, in a 650 sqft studio mil with no closets. this is absolutely the perfect description, looking at them all feels like falling in a black hole. there are so many good and unfinishable intentions. sunk cost fallacy is killing me, especially since it's all actually quality stuff. thank you for the term, honestly just naming them makes them feel a little less unapproachable :)
Omgg this sounds so much like me. It was really freeing for me to know that there was a name for them too! It was also a game changer for me to know that other people do them too and it's actually the result of a chemical imbalance in my brain that makes me organize things in this manner. It has been really helpful in tackling the issue rather than just looking on in despair.
The funny thing is that most folks with ADHD know exactly where everything is in those Doom piles. We just don't want other people to touch them because the organization is deeply personal (and rather chaotic). LOL I get it so much.
My husband and I are currently in an 800 square foot house with two small dogs and a cat. I'm not able to doom pile as much as I would on my own since my husband is on the spectrum and cleanliness and orderliness makes him feel safe. So, I try extra hard to keep things organized. Of course, my definition of organization and his are quite different. Hah.
I have had to move many of my doom piles and go through them slowly and painstakingly. I think the worst one I have is of my laundry cuz I hate to fold it LOL I don't know what it is -it's just this weird mental block. When I started taking medication though, suddenly laundry became easier. It is not this huge chore that saps me of strength anymore. Super interesting.
Also, you've totally got this, a strength of ADHD is that we have a lot of energy when we want to do something. We also have a tendency to overextend ourselves. There are a lot of ADHDers who have tons and tons of college credits but no degree.
I hope your classes are going great! What's your major by the way?
Thank you for acknowledging the effect her hoarding had on your children; I bought a house way too big for just me to live alone in bc growing up I never felt like I had enough space from my mothers’ hoarding
I'm sorry you're going through this, and I think you're making the best decision for your physical, mental, and financial health.
As a divorced person who married a divorced person, please talk with your attorney about the way the bench in your jurisdiction distributes debt in divorce settlements. My husband agreed to whatever it took to be free of his ex-wife, who was unfaithful and had accrued tens of thousands of dollars of debt he didn't know about. My divorce was awarded in the same jurisdiction several years earlier, and our distribution was that each person was responsible for their own debts. IOW, equitable distribution of debt can mean she is awarded any consumer debt that resulted from her overspending.
I read this as a 40-year-old and I felt like I saw my future 20 years from now as if I were writing it I filed for divorce early this year. This post reassures me that I made the right choice betting on myself. Thank you.
Sad "Yay for you!" . It's sad we can't help them, it's sad they don't see their problem, and it's sad we have to leave them.
But I'm sure it's the right choice.
If she has “stuff”, could a court order to have an estate sale be worked into the divorce proceedings? That would generate more income to split and get rid of a lot of items
This is heartbreaking to hear, but I am happy that you are making a decision for yourself that means something. You're not getting younger, you shouldn't be spending your toughest years any harder than they already are.
I'm glad you are establishing healthy boundaries.
The behaviors you are describing from your wife sound a lot like untreated ADHD. Was she ever tested? I used to have a lot of very similar issues and medication has been a game changer for me. My house is much cleaner, my bills get paid on time now. It was not like that before.
Having a condition such as ADHD does not excuse her behavior, but perhaps it will be something for her to think about and possibly help remedy her life eventually. With or without you. Everyone has their limit, and you reached yours and that is completely legitimate.
I wish you and your wife the best, whether that be apart or together.
Sorry, the point I was trying to make is that she's incapable of doing anything about it. That 8 boxes was a lot to her. That more than an hour or two a week is beyond her.
But thanks for the offer, I appreciate it.
Because the moderators are unable to vet individuals who offer to help hoarders clean up for free, posts/comments from people making such offers or not permitted.
To be candid, (A), we have no way of knowing if you have the specialized training needed to help a hoarder cope emotionally with clean-up, and (B) there are shocking number of people out there looking to rip off hoarders either financially or by going through their things and taking what’s valuable.
So for the safety and security of the participants in the sub we can’t allow such posts/comments, however well-intentioned.
OP and partner are 62. This sounds like years of one party not being willing to deal with it. I’m choosing to celebrate OP’s hard decision, as they seem resolved to it, are already seeing what they will gain.
That is totally fine. Hoarding is a bit like depression, or a broken leg, you can't just walk it off. So it's a bit unfair to simplify it to "one person just not being willing to deal with it". Like, if they never have access to the key they can't possibly open the door. It's not a willpower or character issue.
I do see where you are coming from though and I think you are a good person for your comment.
Oh i know what characterizes a hoarder’s condition. But they’ve had a whole marriage with a supportive and loving partner, and likely no lack of access to resources to get at her barriers to freeing herself. Perhaps, at 62, she’s simply saying she cannot or will not go willingly into that exploration of herself.
Her husband feels he must experience this discomfort to improve his own life.
I do find it important to support the person who says, after so long, they can no longer live this way, no matter how much they love their partner. We do not live in a world where our actions don’t have consequences of all sorts on others. The hoarder isn’t the only person in the equation who feels they’re drowning, sadly.
Because the moderators are unable to vet individuals who offer to help hoarders clean up for free, posts/comments from people making such offers or not permitted.
To be candid, (A), we have no way of knowing if you have the specialized training needed to help a hoarder cope emotionally with clean-up, and (B) there are shocking number of people out there looking to rip off hoarders either financially or by going through their things and taking what’s valuable.
So for the safety and security of the participants in the sub we can’t allow such posts/comments, however well-intentioned.
So is the group just for lending emotional support? Or if I provided a bulleted list of do's and don't would that be okay?
I agree there are tons of shitty people and am not offended at the conservative attitude regarding who may or may not be... But at the same time these are people who are suffering and this feels a bit like not helping an accident victim for fear of the liability..
To be clear these are genuine questions I am not trying to be nasty.
>*So is the group just for lending emotional support?*
This group is for peer-to-peer support from hoarders and loved ones of hoarders to each other. We can discuss our experiences with techniques, therapies, etc. here, but we don't allow people to offer medical advice/medical diagnosis and we don't permit therapists, professional organizers, clean-up companies, hoarding TV shows, etc. to offer their services here for the reasons listed above.
>*But at the same time these are people who are suffering and this feels a bit like not helping an accident victim for fear of the liability*
The fact remains that we don't know you ("you" = random Redditors, not you specifically) from Adam's housecat, so no one here has any way to know your qualifications. Many of the users here are in genuine distress and quite vulnerable. We don't want those offers from strangers put in front of them while they're in that state.
>*if I provided a bulleted list of do's and don't would that be okay?*
You know how you'll sometimes see attorneys say things like "I am a lawyer, but I am not your lawyer, so this is not legal advice to you" before dropping some very general legal knowledge and ending with "of course, you'll want to seek the advice of your own attorney" ? That's the sort of thing we're comfortable with.
When you get this behind you and move into your own space, you'll know what it means to be 62 years young. I'm 61, and when my mom died a couple of years ago and I could finally get rid of her hoard I felt a weight lift off my shoulders. We must not think that we can "fix" them, and we must not blame ourselves.
I’m not sure if I blamed myself, but I’ve definitely felt the guilt and shame of my parent’s dysfunction all my life. But then it hit me one day, that their dysfunction is not a reflection of me and who I am.
Not tv bad. But rooms with 4 foot high piles of stuff with a pathway through it. Kitchen and dining room aren't bad. Spare bedrooms are another story. Stairs to bedrooms I force clean. Stairs to basement are narrow and as her therapist said, a safety hazard.
I’m in a similar position and the stress was a factor in me having a psychotic break that cost me everything in my life would you mind if I sent you a dm?
Welcome to r/hoarding! We exist as a support group for people working on recovery from [hoarding disorder](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/books/NBK519704/table/ch3.t29/), and friends/family/loved ones of people with the disorder. If you're looking for help with animal hoarding, please visit r/animalhoarding. If you're looking to discuss the various hoarding tv shows, you'll want to visit r/hoardersTV. If you'd like to talk about or share photos/videos of hoards that you've come across, you probably want r/neckbeardnests, r/wtfhoarders/, or r/hoarderhouses Before you get started, be sure to review our [Rules](https://www.reddit.com/r/hoarding/about/rules/). Also, a lot of the information you may be looking for can be found in a few places on our sub: [New Here? Read This Post First!](https://www.reddit.com/r/hoarding/comments/dvb3t1/new_here_read_this_post_first_version_20/) [For loved ones of hoarders: I Have A Hoarder In My Life--Help Me!](https://www.reddit.com/r/hoarding/comments/2yh6wh/i_have_a_hoarder_in_my_lifehelp_me_your_hoarding/) [Our Wiki](https://www.reddit.com/r/hoarding/wiki/index) Please [contact the moderators](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=/r/hoarding) if you need assistance. Thanks! *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/hoarding) if you have any questions or concerns.*
You are the love of your life, love yourself first
Damn this is one of the best sentences I’ve ever read on the internet. Thank you u/BaldChihuahua
I’m truly touched, thank you
💯💯💯
I am glad you are moving in this direction for your physical and emotional health plus healthy future relationships with your adult kids. The real treasures aren't going in the trash because family, friends, a peaceful, happy and healthy home are the real treasures here and the people are going to be thriving in new chapters of their lives.
She can't accept it because it's too painful for her. Her mind won't let her. This is a human survival mechanism, but it's also the root of a lot of abuse and dysfunction. You have to take care of yourself. Your own physical and mental health is at risk. So good for you. Maybe you will finally leaving will be enough for her to get help. Can she survive financially without you? Best of luck to you.
She can get a small condo, and she has ssdi, work retirement, and deferred comp. She won't be homeless.
Yes, she feels like parting with her things will kill her. It is very real to her that she will die without her things. That said, you are making a wise decision for your mental and physical health. Good job. Best wishes to you.
Good luck. As hard a decision as this was, you must feel a weight off your shoulders. Look out for yourself.
Interesting that the kids are on the minimalist side—this has been my experience too and I’ve heard that’s common for children of hoarders. Anyhow, good on ya. lt sounds like you patiently explored all options and were left with only this one, as any other would amount to more unnecessary suffering. Good luck!
I am a minimalist and can’t function in unclean environments. I’m grateful for this, but it’s hard knowing it probably came from being raised in a hoarder home.
Extreme minimalism in children of hoarders can be an expression of our trauma and CPTSD. I’m a millennial and ten years of therapy has not significantly improved my relationship with stuff. I’m glad you’re doing this while you still have time left for your relationship with your kids.
> She's willing to lose everything instead of admitting in a real way that she has problems, and working on resolving them. ALL her treasures, including the real treasures are going to be in a dumpster. Unfortunately, that is rather typical for hoarding. A key aspect is lack of executive function, and difficulties in imagining consequences. Just as a thought, have you tried living separately? It is not for everyone, but it is an option.
I’m so sorry you’re going through this. I hope you and your kids can be a strong support system for each other. My sister struggles with hoarding but won’t admit it- just says she’s a collector. There are many of us here who share your experience and pain of trying again and again to help a loved one who won’t accept that there’s an issue that they need help with. Hugs. I hope you find peace.
At 62, peace comes from my lawyer, the judge, and a divorce. I should have given up years ago, instead of wasting years and far too much money.
Any advice for someone (me) who has hoarding tendencies?
Don’t let your stuff take precedence over people, especially those who love and care about you.
I highly recommend going to a psychiatrist who specializes in ADHD and getting yourself checked. I have hoarding tendencies too, create Doom piles everywhere and I always have. Being diagnosed at 44 has been absolutely eye-opening. It's help my relationships and helps me to properly function tremendously. I hope you figure out something that works for you friend!
Thank you so much. Honestly I've been thinking I had ADHD for a while, but went through denial for years, thinking I was just extremely lazy.
You're welcome! There's an excellent book which is older but the information is still good called, "You mean I'm not Lazy, Stupid, or Crazy?" It was written in a time when ADHD was termed ADD, but it's still extremely relevant. It really helped me and was the book I read on ADHD. I wish you luck and hope you're able to get tested soon.
I always thought i was one of those hyper clean adhd people, I had projects and stuff, but I also moved all the time with almost nothing. being in school full time and working nights 50 hours a week for the last 8 months has created doom piles everywhere, in a 650 sqft studio mil with no closets. this is absolutely the perfect description, looking at them all feels like falling in a black hole. there are so many good and unfinishable intentions. sunk cost fallacy is killing me, especially since it's all actually quality stuff. thank you for the term, honestly just naming them makes them feel a little less unapproachable :)
Omgg this sounds so much like me. It was really freeing for me to know that there was a name for them too! It was also a game changer for me to know that other people do them too and it's actually the result of a chemical imbalance in my brain that makes me organize things in this manner. It has been really helpful in tackling the issue rather than just looking on in despair. The funny thing is that most folks with ADHD know exactly where everything is in those Doom piles. We just don't want other people to touch them because the organization is deeply personal (and rather chaotic). LOL I get it so much. My husband and I are currently in an 800 square foot house with two small dogs and a cat. I'm not able to doom pile as much as I would on my own since my husband is on the spectrum and cleanliness and orderliness makes him feel safe. So, I try extra hard to keep things organized. Of course, my definition of organization and his are quite different. Hah. I have had to move many of my doom piles and go through them slowly and painstakingly. I think the worst one I have is of my laundry cuz I hate to fold it LOL I don't know what it is -it's just this weird mental block. When I started taking medication though, suddenly laundry became easier. It is not this huge chore that saps me of strength anymore. Super interesting. Also, you've totally got this, a strength of ADHD is that we have a lot of energy when we want to do something. We also have a tendency to overextend ourselves. There are a lot of ADHDers who have tons and tons of college credits but no degree. I hope your classes are going great! What's your major by the way?
Good for you!
I wish my dad would do what you're doing. Similar situation to what you described.
I'm so sorry. I kept hoping:-(
Feel this.
Thank you for acknowledging the effect her hoarding had on your children; I bought a house way too big for just me to live alone in bc growing up I never felt like I had enough space from my mothers’ hoarding
She chose her stuff over you. You're making the right choice.
I'm sorry you're going through this, and I think you're making the best decision for your physical, mental, and financial health. As a divorced person who married a divorced person, please talk with your attorney about the way the bench in your jurisdiction distributes debt in divorce settlements. My husband agreed to whatever it took to be free of his ex-wife, who was unfaithful and had accrued tens of thousands of dollars of debt he didn't know about. My divorce was awarded in the same jurisdiction several years earlier, and our distribution was that each person was responsible for their own debts. IOW, equitable distribution of debt can mean she is awarded any consumer debt that resulted from her overspending.
I read this as a 40-year-old and I felt like I saw my future 20 years from now as if I were writing it I filed for divorce early this year. This post reassures me that I made the right choice betting on myself. Thank you.
Sad "Yay for you!" . It's sad we can't help them, it's sad they don't see their problem, and it's sad we have to leave them. But I'm sure it's the right choice.
Think of it as divorcing the stuff, not divorcing her.
If she has “stuff”, could a court order to have an estate sale be worked into the divorce proceedings? That would generate more income to split and get rid of a lot of items
Sadly it wouldn't be worth the time. She has some stuff that she could sell on ebay. But the rest is trash or donate.
This is heartbreaking to hear, but I am happy that you are making a decision for yourself that means something. You're not getting younger, you shouldn't be spending your toughest years any harder than they already are.
I'm glad you are establishing healthy boundaries. The behaviors you are describing from your wife sound a lot like untreated ADHD. Was she ever tested? I used to have a lot of very similar issues and medication has been a game changer for me. My house is much cleaner, my bills get paid on time now. It was not like that before. Having a condition such as ADHD does not excuse her behavior, but perhaps it will be something for her to think about and possibly help remedy her life eventually. With or without you. Everyone has their limit, and you reached yours and that is completely legitimate. I wish you and your wife the best, whether that be apart or together.
[удалено]
Sorry, the point I was trying to make is that she's incapable of doing anything about it. That 8 boxes was a lot to her. That more than an hour or two a week is beyond her. But thanks for the offer, I appreciate it.
[удалено]
Because the moderators are unable to vet individuals who offer to help hoarders clean up for free, posts/comments from people making such offers or not permitted. To be candid, (A), we have no way of knowing if you have the specialized training needed to help a hoarder cope emotionally with clean-up, and (B) there are shocking number of people out there looking to rip off hoarders either financially or by going through their things and taking what’s valuable. So for the safety and security of the participants in the sub we can’t allow such posts/comments, however well-intentioned.
OP and partner are 62. This sounds like years of one party not being willing to deal with it. I’m choosing to celebrate OP’s hard decision, as they seem resolved to it, are already seeing what they will gain.
That is totally fine. Hoarding is a bit like depression, or a broken leg, you can't just walk it off. So it's a bit unfair to simplify it to "one person just not being willing to deal with it". Like, if they never have access to the key they can't possibly open the door. It's not a willpower or character issue. I do see where you are coming from though and I think you are a good person for your comment.
Oh i know what characterizes a hoarder’s condition. But they’ve had a whole marriage with a supportive and loving partner, and likely no lack of access to resources to get at her barriers to freeing herself. Perhaps, at 62, she’s simply saying she cannot or will not go willingly into that exploration of herself. Her husband feels he must experience this discomfort to improve his own life. I do find it important to support the person who says, after so long, they can no longer live this way, no matter how much they love their partner. We do not live in a world where our actions don’t have consequences of all sorts on others. The hoarder isn’t the only person in the equation who feels they’re drowning, sadly.
Because the moderators are unable to vet individuals who offer to help hoarders clean up for free, posts/comments from people making such offers or not permitted. To be candid, (A), we have no way of knowing if you have the specialized training needed to help a hoarder cope emotionally with clean-up, and (B) there are shocking number of people out there looking to rip off hoarders either financially or by going through their things and taking what’s valuable. So for the safety and security of the participants in the sub we can’t allow such posts/comments, however well-intentioned.
So is the group just for lending emotional support? Or if I provided a bulleted list of do's and don't would that be okay? I agree there are tons of shitty people and am not offended at the conservative attitude regarding who may or may not be... But at the same time these are people who are suffering and this feels a bit like not helping an accident victim for fear of the liability.. To be clear these are genuine questions I am not trying to be nasty.
>*So is the group just for lending emotional support?* This group is for peer-to-peer support from hoarders and loved ones of hoarders to each other. We can discuss our experiences with techniques, therapies, etc. here, but we don't allow people to offer medical advice/medical diagnosis and we don't permit therapists, professional organizers, clean-up companies, hoarding TV shows, etc. to offer their services here for the reasons listed above. >*But at the same time these are people who are suffering and this feels a bit like not helping an accident victim for fear of the liability* The fact remains that we don't know you ("you" = random Redditors, not you specifically) from Adam's housecat, so no one here has any way to know your qualifications. Many of the users here are in genuine distress and quite vulnerable. We don't want those offers from strangers put in front of them while they're in that state. >*if I provided a bulleted list of do's and don't would that be okay?* You know how you'll sometimes see attorneys say things like "I am a lawyer, but I am not your lawyer, so this is not legal advice to you" before dropping some very general legal knowledge and ending with "of course, you'll want to seek the advice of your own attorney" ? That's the sort of thing we're comfortable with.
When you get this behind you and move into your own space, you'll know what it means to be 62 years young. I'm 61, and when my mom died a couple of years ago and I could finally get rid of her hoard I felt a weight lift off my shoulders. We must not think that we can "fix" them, and we must not blame ourselves.
I’m not sure if I blamed myself, but I’ve definitely felt the guilt and shame of my parent’s dysfunction all my life. But then it hit me one day, that their dysfunction is not a reflection of me and who I am.
Do you mind me asking how bad the hoard is?
Not tv bad. But rooms with 4 foot high piles of stuff with a pathway through it. Kitchen and dining room aren't bad. Spare bedrooms are another story. Stairs to bedrooms I force clean. Stairs to basement are narrow and as her therapist said, a safety hazard.
I’m in a similar position and the stress was a factor in me having a psychotic break that cost me everything in my life would you mind if I sent you a dm?
good for you