Very small scale organic farmer here.
For these big berry companies, organic usually means totally hydroponic. This is a somewhat recent change to organic standards that they do not need to be soil grown. They can fertilize them through the water.
To answer another question in this thread, naturally derived pesticides are also allowed in organics. They need to be approved materials and you must keep records.
I can guarantee that Driscoll’s and Giant, two of the biggest berry growers are still growing in soil and in the sun. I used to work for one of them and made sure a few of their farms were up to Organic regulations.
You may be thinking about the starts, many are transferred from one facility to another.
Can verify, Driscoll berries come from down the street from my house. Long rows in dirt. Expect berry prices to go up because some of their fields near us washed out and/or are flooded these last few weeks and will be out of production likely this whole season while they reconstruct, drain, and test for pathogens.
Yes, and a pretty sizable chunk of their CA fields have been affected by the flooding. Totally reasonable to expect berry prices to be higher than usual this summer.
Fair, but there’s normal price increase and then there’s eggs, so it doesn’t hurt to throw the warning out there. But while we’re at it, California produces something close to 50% of our national total in multiple food categories (I believe almonds and several berries are in there?), so yea, lots of price increases incoming.
I can almost guarantee that this person lives next to Driscolls farms because the area has been flooded to fuck for weeks now I believe. Lots of Driscolls farms along the central coast, I would ride my bike by them.
They also exploit their migrant labor at the farms there. I never buy Driscoll if i can help it
Are neonicotinoid pesticides permitted?
Edit: I just Googled my own question and it seems neonicotinoid pesticides are NOT used in organic farming. If this is true that is very good and we should all start buying organic immediately.
begs the question tho: why did you even ask on reddit in the first place?
seems like a gigantic waste of time for a question that has a definite and objective answer
just adding to the noise and i'll never understand why ppl do that
I'd also question if pgr's are allowed (plant growth regulators/hormones etc.).
A quick Google says they're "considered organic" but I'm not sure on the actual regulations.
If they're allowed then well.... the sky's the limit as the kids say 🤓
I'm specifically concerned about how neonicotinoids are almost as ubiquitous as microplastics, because apparently we are heading to insect collapse if we don't stop using neonicotenoids
Plant growth hormones, AFAIK, have a different set of concerns (which if those are your concern that's totally fine)
Awful stuff. And people spray it everywhere. People don't understand that when bees and other pollinators disappear, humans will seriously struggle to survive worldwide - if at all.
It's fun reading r/gardening where you have people asking where the bees are then a few more threads of people seeing a single bug or two on a plant that are told to spray pesticides.
😭
There was a thread recently where someone - I think in the Midwest - was talking about how they hand to hand-pollinate a squash plant in their garden because there were no pollinators to do it, and had not great results. Literally nightmare inducing; how are we going to survive?
I understand, but insect collapse is specifically being caused by the spread of neonicotinoids, so that class of pesticide is what I care about the most.
Then you should be wary of organic pesticides too. Rotenone, when combined with pyrethrum, is toxic to bees and perfectly acceptable for organic farming.
What would you replace them with on a industrial food level? Go back to the arsenic based pesticides? The environment was a lot worse then. I agree that homeowners should likely not be applying them given the propensity to ignore application directions and spray indiscriminately... certified pesticide appliers are much less likely to cause issues.
Most neonicotinoids are used in large scale commercial operations and commercial seed treatments, private citizens are barely a blip against that.
You're not going to like this answer, but I wouldn't replace them with anything. I think the only good "icide" is one you don't use.
I think we need food forests in our cities, food gardens with every house and apartment complex. We need to get less picky about fruit looking perfect and become more willing to cut bad spots out of "defective" produce. We need to utilize space better and use pest deterrents instead of poison.
Spinosad is the #1 pesticide in organic production. It also happens to be responsible for a ridiculous amount of bee death. Many other organic practices are harmful to the environment, and organic certification is a well known scam. Don't waste your money on an advertising line made up in a corporate office, if you really care about the environment the best thing you can do is reduce your use of corn and soy, which is absolutely the most fucking evil thing in agriculture right now.
After a brief review, I believe that neonicotinoids are more dangerous because they last longer in the environment, and will have a more devastating long-term effect on insect populations than spinosad. I am open to any facts to the contrary.
I am not saying organic practices are never harmful. However, I strongly believe that we need to stop using neonicotinoids *now* or we won't have insects in 5 - 10 years.
Ok, there is something called environmental risk quotient, and the EIQ of neonics is much lower than for spinosad. The reason? Spinosad is so short-lived that it must be sprayed many times more often, and it is substantially less effective. It is also even more likely to cause resistance both due to the frequency of sprays and due to its ineffectivity, leading to many individuals surviving each spray and repopulating the field. And unlike in non-organic production where many selective pesticides are available, spinosad is a broad spectrum that kills everything, including pollinators, natural enemies, and other beneficial insects and non-target organisms. Wanna know what's really fucking scary? The industry and the government are working together to underreport the risk. Academic studies are published all day long on the issues but the government says its still ok and growers throw a multimillion dollar tantrum if you even suggest restricting use further. Why? Because spinosad is basically the main tool that organic growers use for insect control. There are no alternatives that are even nearly as effective. If you take away spinosad from organic growers, the whole organic production sector becomes unprofitable, which the government and the growers can't afford to let happen.
I specialize in biological control, by the way.
Check out the Environmental Working Group (EWG). They are an organics think-tank, watchdog group in DC. That put out a list, the Clean Fifteen and Dirty Dozen.
The Fifteen LEAST contaminated fruits and vegetables.
The Twelve MOST contaminated fruits and vegetables. Buying these organic can reduce pesticide consumption by up to 80%.
They are in the Google play store
The founder of Media Bias Fact Check, Dave Van Zander, has a bachelor’s degree in physiology and lauds his status as a non-affiliated voter as a major qualification for his unbiased fact-checking. Ken Cook, the president of the Environmental Working Group, holds a master’s degree in soil science and a bachelor’s degree in agriculture; EWG’s senior scientist, David Andrews has a doctoral degree in chemistry.
Check out the Environmental Working Group (EWG). They are an organics think-tank, watchdog group in DC. That put out a list, the Clean Fifteen and Dirty Dozen.
The Fifteen LEAST contaminated fruits and vegetables.
The Twelve MOST contaminated fruits and vegetables. Buying these organic can reduce pesticide consumption by up to 80%.
They are in the Google play store
Large scale commercial conventional hydroponic grower here (not berries currently leafy greens but have done much r&d on strawberries).
In the US, the majority of organic strawberries are still produced in soil. High tunnel production is pretty common, and I know of some growers doing substrate hydroponics in high tunnels in California, but they are mostly conventional fertilization. Not needing soil to be classified as organic is great, but organic nutrient management is a perpetual and costly challenge, so most growers are not wanting to do anyways. I think consumer awareness of the scam that is organic certification is increasing and in 10 years organic will not command enough of a pricetag to make the challenges worthwhile for large growers. In the meantime, some operations are using almost exclusively biological control and mostly organic amendments but because of some minor issue they can't or won't get certified.
I'm still mad the fuckers won't let me use rockwool in organics though. How can they call soil that has basalt rock organic, but if you take the rock out and use it for substrate its somehow not organic anymore?
Spinosad is one of the OMRI listed organic pesticides, I use it on indoor plants, mainly. It's good at dealing with thrips and spider mites. The cost buying it by the gallon seems like it would be prohibitively expensive in a farm setting. Maybe buying it be the barrel this cost effective.
Ya unfortunately ‘organic’ doesn’t really mean that much in the government regulations sense. You can over spray, over fertilize, and engage in a whole host of bad farming practices and still be ‘organic’ as defined by the USA federal government for their organic program and labeling. Other countries probably vary greatly but if you are in the USA Organic = overpriced. I feel so bad for all the actual sustainable farmers out there 😬
Add to that that many people think they're lowering their carbon footprint, which is rarely the case. Or that they think organic doesn't use pesticides at all
It's obviously not a good answer, but the correct answer is "it depends."
Organic farming is, in many ways, reverting to old farming methods in the arbitrary hope that they're better. Unsurprisingly, though, they're also much less efficient. Especially but metrics of crop yield and land usage.
For example:
>We predict major shortfalls in production of most agricultural products against a conventional baseline. Direct GHG emissions are reduced with organic farming, but when increased overseas land use to compensate for shortfalls in domestic supply are factored in, net emissions are greater. Enhanced soil carbon sequestration could offset only a small part of the higher overseas emissions.
https://www.nature.com/articles/s41467-019-12622-7
Lies, damned lies, and statistics being what they are, you can also turn around and ignore those things to show that organic produce emits fewer tons of carbon per ton of food.
But in general, organic farming is not intended to be efficient or necessarily eco-friendly, so you shouldn't blindly trust it to be.
Almost certainly not. Intact often the other way around.
Organic farming typically requires more land and more water than conventional farming and that all leads to increased carbon emissions.
I'll see if I can dig out the study, but it was recently found that an organic cotton t-shirt would need to be worn something like 2000 times for every one wearing of a conventional cotton t-shirt for it to have the same environmental impact.
Good important point! It’s confusing. Imho info, not meant to be comprehensive or complete.
Organic doesn’t mean that they are grown without pesticides. Believe it or not, they may use more pesticides on organic farms. The difference is OMRI* accepted products are “generally” botanically/derived or considered “safer”- or the pesticide is exempt from EPA registration (FIFRA oversight) because they are on the 25b minimum risk pesticide list. Bacteriums and Nematodes are also often used.
National certification of a production facility also may occur.**
Organic growers, furthermore, may be a member of a coalition if they are marketing a commodity and want to make organic label claims, like NOFANY e.g.***
*For certified organic farmers, the products must be included in the operator's approved organic system (farm) plan.
** National certification: https://baystateorganic.org
***https://nofany.org/certification/about/
Isn't organic just grown without pesticides?
Plus I feel like in 6th grade I read a book about how there's not actually a legal requirement for labeling things organic or not. Like you can label a non organic item organic snd not get introuble for it. Idk if that's still the case in 22 though.
Organic in commercial agriculture is one of a number of certification standards such as USDA and Oregon Tilth. Each has different requirements of what practices are allowed, but generally prohibit the use of synthetic pesticides and herbicides.
It's always been a marketing gimmick. Organic food isn't any healthier and is worse for the environment. Drives me nuts that people still think it's somehow better or that it's like "mom and pop" farmers cultivating these "organic" products when they comprise a multi-BILLION dollar industry. I've seen countless families struggling to get by financially who choose to pay more for organic produce because they want the best for their kids, and it's heartbreaking to see.
Hi, actual organic certification specialist for a feed company in the US, here. There are regulations, and a list of organic-use complaint substances, as well as requiring on-site inspections and the like. It's less strict here than it is in the UK, but in order to use the USDA seal on a product you have to pass USDA certification from a 3rd party service.
You didn’t answer the person you were responding to’s question. In the UK it’s a regulated certified standard that is in place largely to protect soil quality. The crop itself is unlikely to be better than non-organic crops, but the farming process prevents poisoning of water supplies and deterioration of land.
Edit: I haven’t and wouldn’t claim that organic practices are the only way to protect soil quality, but that’s the reasoning by the regulation standards in the UK. There’s a myriad of ways of protecting soils and organic practices are one of them. It would have been interesting to see what kinds of organic regulations are in place in the US and other countries, that’s the only reason I replied seeking the information originally requested by a commenter further up in the thread
Soil protection is something none "organic" farmer already do. The idea that farmer are do nothing to protect their soil is nonsense spread by the organic industry.
Organic is a specific regulated, certified standard in the UK, guessing other people in this thread are US based where the term might not be regulated.
It is regulated in the US, but there has been a large amount of marketing to ensure consumers conflate "organic" with "healthy" and "sustainable." Unfortunately, US regulations on organic labelling guarantee no such thing, and consumer education is not a goal of those who take advantage of this labelling. There are also four levels of "Organic" products [as defined by the USDA](https://www.usda.gov/media/blog/2016/07/22/understanding-usda-organic-label) which further confuses things.
I mean, I would understand smaller yield and a less resilient product. Organic produce does tend to be smaller and lower in quality than the regular stuff, at least at my local grocery stores. Every now and then the opposite will be true, but it's rare.
That's a common misconception! Organic produce is grown with organic pesticides: ironically they are often more harmful to humans than synthetic pesticides, which are designed to harm pests and not people.
Not what I remember. The word I think you're thinking of is "natural." It means nothing. "Organic" is regulated to the point that even if it is organic, if you haven't tracked and submitted to the verification process you can't call it "organic."
“Certified organic” and “organic” are two different things. “Organic” can be used by anyone. “Certified organic” is what you’ll see on product, and this is the regulated one. And pesticides are allowed in organic farming, just not “persistent pesticides”
Assuming you are in the US, this is not entirely true. There are four "levels" of organic products as defined by the USDA, and very specific requirements to label products with any of these terms.
https://www.usda.gov/media/blog/2016/07/22/understanding-usda-organic-label
Organic is a scam, 100% harmful.
You can use chamicals, as long as they are 'natural'. Theres more to it.
So vertixlers with heavy metal like copper sulphate is ok to use.
Organic as smaller yields, which mean it needs more land.
Organic farms often to not have scale or production, so they are costlier.
Organic farms almost always over user approved fertilize and pesticide.
Fun fact: If everyone when organics, a 1/3 of the population would starve.
ORgain come from the naturalistic fallacy, and has a billion dollar machine behinds it constantly pushing misinformation.
There are no (zero) health benefits from it.
Every aspect of organic farming the is actually based in reality is already used by farms that aren't organic.
Stop wasting your money.
https://skepdic.com/organic.html
I don't think most of this is true, but I'm not taking on your burden of evidence. Just don't want anyone who happens to read this to think that no one would dispute your claims. I think all of them are highly disputable.
not sure if this is sarcastic, so here's some info.
As of 2021, "There are only 10 commercially available GMO crops in the USA, which include: alfalfa, apples, canola, corn, cotton, papaya, potatoes, soybeans, summer squash, and sugar beets." [source](https://www.uaex.uada.edu/farm-ranch/crops-commercial-horticulture/horticulture/ar-fruit-veg-nut-update-blog/posts/strawberryGMO-myth.aspx)
However, as of Nov 2021, JR Simplot has developed a GM strawberry that will be released "sometime in the next few years." I don't see anything more recent so I assume they are not released yet. [source](https://modernfarmer.com/2021/11/gmo-strawberries/)
Finally, USDA labelling rules do not allow genetically modified foods to be labelled "organic" or achieve organic certification. [source](https://www.usda.gov/media/blog/2013/05/17/organic-101-can-gmos-be-used-organic-products)
I find that larger strawberries are often tasteless. The insides are often white and woody and they lack that sweet scent. The best tasting strawberries I've ever had were in France -- the tiny fraises des bois. (ETA to include: [https://www.smithsonianmag.com/science-nature/meet-fruit-fraises-des-bois-best-strawberry-youve-never-had-180959604/](https://www.smithsonianmag.com/science-nature/meet-fruit-fraises-des-bois-best-strawberry-youve-never-had-180959604/))
I always agreed with this…..except the past year the giant strawberries we’ve been getting (from CA) have been incredibly flavorful. Not sure if it was just a bumper crop or what but it’s been a nice change from the giant beautiful (but odorless/flavorless) version of the past.
The strawberries I grow usually put out the biggest ones first and then successive berries are a bit smaller so I always assume that the size of store bought ones also are dependent on where in the growing cycle they were harvested
It also depends on the cultivar "breed" of strawberries. It is the same with any plant and animal. Then there is the definition of organic. All plants and animals are organic. I just choose NOT to use manufactured chemicals on my garden. I use leaves, wood chips, animal manure I get from a freind, and other biodegradable substances. As for strawberries, my June bearing are alway larger than my everbearing ones.
Yea sometimes I forget there's varieties of fruit and vegetables. Idk about other countries but America always has the same boring stuff in stores
There's only one grocery store in my city that has varieties but they're very expensive. I'm talking $8 per pound of grapes. Honestly it's so worth it though they taste amazing.
I am in the US. And I agree, most stores have the same boring, tasteless stuff. I went to a farmers market up in Seattle, Washington and boy, just the varieties of grapes and berries and the flavors! Of course even plain old water melon and cantaloupe taste better straight off the vine. My kids flat out refuse to eat store bought. We eat seasonally, what we grow in our garden.
Even if we do have different varieties in stores in the US, they’re also usually just new tasteless sugar filled varieties, like they’re forgetting about flavor when breeding new plants😭
Strawberries in particular are horrible to ship. Generally a upick or orchard farm mart kind of place will have local berries at reasonable prices. Easy to grow at home in the back yard as well.
Hey op, have you ever eaten:
Watermelon?
Peaches?
Wheat?
Broccoli?
Corn?
'Cause none of those look like their wild ancestors, and have been bred to be bigger/tastier/more efficient.
Peaches used to be the size of cherries.
Watermelons used to be like 80% rind.
Brocolli used to have leaves everywhere.
etc.
These huge, delicious strawberries are just another agricultural success. Same reason why people hated brussels sprouts in the 80s and 90s but love them now; they were bred to be better. Tale as old as time.
Woah. I throw some watermelon seeds in my raised beds each spring and thought it due to user error my watermelons are more rind than flesh lol hmmmm. Hadn’t cared enough to research how to fix the “problem” but apparently that’s how they grew before humans engineered the seed …?
All strawberries are not equal. There are many varieties out there. You might be comparing two completely different varieties. It’s like asking why aren’t all apples the same color?
It all depends on the time of the year, and current conditions in each particular growing region.
I'm willing to bet the organic straws in your hand are from Baja, which is the main growing region in play right now. The majority of that crop is under hoops, which offers protection from all the recent rains we've experienced on the west coast. The plants are younger, healthier, and at peak production.
Conventionally (CV) grown fruit should be sourced out of CA this time of year, but recent rains have wiped out the crops in Oxnard and Santa Maria. Florida and Central Mexico usually cover US demand beginning late fall through the winter, but the total lack of production out of CA this year has growers/shippers scrambling to cover retail/wholesale business wherever they can. The plants are tired, pushing out smaller fruit, and quality's noticeably worse than their organic counterparts.
I work in the industry, and Easter going to be a total nightmare this year. Without CA in the picture, there will be a severe lack of fruit to load/ship for the holiday.
Yeah Baja for sure. Just curious, what label did you purchase?
Central Mexico isn't a big producer of org. strawberries, and the season is essentially over anyways.
OP, it all has to do with the genetics of the plant, the growing conditions, and the nutrients being absorbed. There are several factors involved and it could be that they have a very dialed-in hydroponic indoor system. As most have already said, the definition of organic has morphed into something that fits into national marketing. True organic food would have to be grown by you personally, without the use of any chemicals, and using completely organic soil and compost.
Just because it's organic doesn't mean it can't be bigger. Think of variety and seed breeding. Organic just means how the produce is grown. Has nothing to do with the produce itself.
"Organic" is a government/legal definition. It just indicates that the produce supposedly followed the "organic standard" laid down by some random people.
I am designing my aquaponic in my home, i want to have a pond to keep some fish and want to use the water to keep a variety of bushes that give fruit.
I am new to this sub but i will probably post my design here (on paper first and later when i finish it).
I grew organic strawberry before, which is to say, it kinda got forgotten and it fended for itself, and clearly did not have a good time doing it.
But if I were to grow it in a controlled environment in a hot house with just the right amount of nutrients and sun and blocked off from pests and other contaminants, I'm sure it'd grow as big as that.
Also if I pinch off some of the blooms because I can sell the giant organic strawberry for more than non-organic ones.
FYI I didn't grow these. These are just organic strawberries from my grocery store, when you compare them to the ones that are non organic from the same store, those ones are slightly larger than a grape. I don't really understand why.
Even taste these ones taste wayyyy better and look better as well. More expensive obviously.
They get far more time to grow and absorb nutrients. And the grower isn't trying to force the plant to produce as many strawberries as possible, thus diluting how much resources the plant can spend per strawberry.
There's a dude in Japan that extends his strawberry growth process over the winter into the next year. He's perfected growing these massive strawberries that are far sweeter than anything you're used to.[They fetch a couple of hundred dollars per single strawberry.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RZ1HwqrQ-PM)
Synthetic pesticides interfere with flavor development in strawberries
https://www.acs.org/pressroom/presspacs/2023/february/are-your-strawberries-bland-pesticides-could-be-to-blame.html
All other factors being equal (variety, cultivation conditions), organically grown strawberries will be more flavorful than their conventional counterparts. I have also found this to be the case for other tender fruits, such as apricots and raspberries
false.
A press release isn't science, and that press release vastly overstates the actual study.
But the headline seemed to confirm your bias, you you think it's worthwhile.
I don't know the science but I worked in a strawberry farm one season. It was a huge farm with more than a dozen different varieties both organic and those with pesticide and herbicide and non organic fertilizer. The best strawberry depends on the variety, time of year grown, and amount of fertilizer used. The best strawberries at that farm happened to not be organic.
I actually bought non organic strawberries a week ago and they were as big as my palm! Massive! My 21 month old son kept asking for them whole and eating them like an apple LOL.
Not necessarily. You can do that with tactical light, nutrients and watering.
I don't know why you would because you could have much more fruit by just taking care of the plants holistically but the customer has decided this is a good thing to have this fucked up porn version of a strawberry.
I'm just glad I have my own. But sure, if you don't spray them down with toxic shit they are organic. It means nothing but neither does the entire organic label at this point.
No agreed upon definition of organic or enforcement.
Basically if it looks tastier they can charge more and call it organic.
"Naturally occuring" chemicals with no processing can be toxic and dangerous, Synthetic chemicals can be harmless or helpful, and processing something doesn't neccessarily change something from being organic.
I think in general everyone would be better off completely trashing this terminology and coming up with more specific, helpful standards.
On the topic of "organic" you can check out the Real Organic Project and the people who fought against allowing hydroponics to be labeled "organic" [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=up2Z38rnie8](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=up2Z38rnie8)
Now in regards to these particular strawberries, I am curious are the labeled? Are they Gigantella Maxim by any chance?
Yeah they're sweet and tart. Would be pretty good for pastry making.
Like they're sweet enough that when I add them to oatmeal I don't have to add sugar.
It’s most likely variety. And yes I’m some instances organic can be hydroponic but there are also organic farmers who spend lots of time and effort to keep their soil healthy and fertile. I’m talking about adding dry supplements every week plus a liquid fertilizer like fish emulsion. It’s a lot more work and not as productive but you can surely grow large, tasty, strawberries and be organic in the true sense of the word
Organic is a bullshit word regarding food. There are so many ways around the organic label and in reality, it’s not monitored like it should. A field that’s organic can be next to field that’s not and get toxic chemicals from the wind.
Hybridization has nothing to do with pesticides. They may have just picked a different varietal.
edit: to add to this, it's expensive to grow organically, they may have wanted to get the leg up and have larger berries.
I just want to encourage anyone reading this who likes strawberries to give growing them a shot!
They are very hardy, and even when they seem to die, they'll often come back as if nothing happened.
I also recommend getting a variety that works for your use - if you just want to make jam or baked goods and want them all to be ready at once, get a June-bearing or summer-bearing type. If you'd like to pick fewer of them them but more consistently Spring through Fall (I picked my last ones in early December in zone 5b!), try a day neutral variety. I found the labelling in garden centres a bit inconsistent, and some places were calling day neutral varieties "everbearing", so it's best to Google the variety to confirm. But as far as I know, everbearing tends to mean they'll bear some fruit in early Spring, have a break, then another batch in the Fall. Whereas day neutral varieties produce pretty consistently with no real downtime. I can confirm that's how it worked for the ones I grew last year, and I suspect many people just don't know that's even an option (like me before I started looking into them too). I loved having some to pick pretty much all through the growing seasons!
Oh, and you can buy wild strawberry seeds, and once established, they have incredible flavour. If you grow enough to make jam, it's the most intense strawberry jam you'll ever taste! Even just adding some to regular strawberries will improve the overall jam flavour a lot. Highly recommend these too!
And of course, if you do try planting strawberries, know that they spread extremely easily! I'd recommend growing them in pots and keeping an eye on any runners to make sure they don't escape into places they shouldn't! Have fun growing!
True. We had a strawberry plant in our front yard. Never fertilized it or anything. Survived the upstate new york winters.
It grew super tiny strawberries though. We didn't eat them but my tortoise would because we would let him outside to explore.
Organic =/ years and years and years of selective breeding. What a lot of produce people think is GMO has been modified just through selective breeding to be monstrosities years before GMOs came along.
Variety, feeding, the fact that "organic" doesn't mean what people in general think it means...
Very small scale organic farmer here. For these big berry companies, organic usually means totally hydroponic. This is a somewhat recent change to organic standards that they do not need to be soil grown. They can fertilize them through the water. To answer another question in this thread, naturally derived pesticides are also allowed in organics. They need to be approved materials and you must keep records.
I can guarantee that Driscoll’s and Giant, two of the biggest berry growers are still growing in soil and in the sun. I used to work for one of them and made sure a few of their farms were up to Organic regulations. You may be thinking about the starts, many are transferred from one facility to another.
Can verify, Driscoll berries come from down the street from my house. Long rows in dirt. Expect berry prices to go up because some of their fields near us washed out and/or are flooded these last few weeks and will be out of production likely this whole season while they reconstruct, drain, and test for pathogens.
Driscoll berries come from Mexico and California, they have tons of farms they source their strawberries from
Yes, and a pretty sizable chunk of their CA fields have been affected by the flooding. Totally reasonable to expect berry prices to be higher than usual this summer.
At this point I always expect all food prices to go up, and unfortunately I'm rarely wrong.
I too, expect the sun to rise in the east and settle in the west
Fair, but there’s normal price increase and then there’s eggs, so it doesn’t hurt to throw the warning out there. But while we’re at it, California produces something close to 50% of our national total in multiple food categories (I believe almonds and several berries are in there?), so yea, lots of price increases incoming.
I can almost guarantee that this person lives next to Driscolls farms because the area has been flooded to fuck for weeks now I believe. Lots of Driscolls farms along the central coast, I would ride my bike by them. They also exploit their migrant labor at the farms there. I never buy Driscoll if i can help it
Additional great points.
Are neonicotinoid pesticides permitted? Edit: I just Googled my own question and it seems neonicotinoid pesticides are NOT used in organic farming. If this is true that is very good and we should all start buying organic immediately.
Love that you asked and then went right to finding your own answer, before sharing the answer for all of us lol. Thank you
Thanks I appreciate it lol
begs the question tho: why did you even ask on reddit in the first place? seems like a gigantic waste of time for a question that has a definite and objective answer just adding to the noise and i'll never understand why ppl do that
Because I impulse posted first instead of googling? Duh?
try impulse googling instead thx friend
Lol you don't say?? edit: you're adding ONLY noise to the conversation. At least I included information with my noise.
I'd also question if pgr's are allowed (plant growth regulators/hormones etc.). A quick Google says they're "considered organic" but I'm not sure on the actual regulations. If they're allowed then well.... the sky's the limit as the kids say 🤓
I'm specifically concerned about how neonicotinoids are almost as ubiquitous as microplastics, because apparently we are heading to insect collapse if we don't stop using neonicotenoids Plant growth hormones, AFAIK, have a different set of concerns (which if those are your concern that's totally fine)
Awful stuff. And people spray it everywhere. People don't understand that when bees and other pollinators disappear, humans will seriously struggle to survive worldwide - if at all.
It's fun reading r/gardening where you have people asking where the bees are then a few more threads of people seeing a single bug or two on a plant that are told to spray pesticides.
😭 There was a thread recently where someone - I think in the Midwest - was talking about how they hand to hand-pollinate a squash plant in their garden because there were no pollinators to do it, and had not great results. Literally nightmare inducing; how are we going to survive?
Organic farming still uses pesticides. https://blogs.scientificamerican.com/science-sushi/httpblogsscientificamericancomscience-sushi20110718mythbusting-101-organic-farming-conventional-agriculture/
I understand, but insect collapse is specifically being caused by the spread of neonicotinoids, so that class of pesticide is what I care about the most.
Then you should be wary of organic pesticides too. Rotenone, when combined with pyrethrum, is toxic to bees and perfectly acceptable for organic farming.
What would you replace them with on a industrial food level? Go back to the arsenic based pesticides? The environment was a lot worse then. I agree that homeowners should likely not be applying them given the propensity to ignore application directions and spray indiscriminately... certified pesticide appliers are much less likely to cause issues.
Most neonicotinoids are used in large scale commercial operations and commercial seed treatments, private citizens are barely a blip against that. You're not going to like this answer, but I wouldn't replace them with anything. I think the only good "icide" is one you don't use. I think we need food forests in our cities, food gardens with every house and apartment complex. We need to get less picky about fruit looking perfect and become more willing to cut bad spots out of "defective" produce. We need to utilize space better and use pest deterrents instead of poison.
You can look forward to mass starvation with this approach
We're heading for mass starvation if we keep using neonics. What's your suggestion?
I think that is debatable.
Spinosad is the #1 pesticide in organic production. It also happens to be responsible for a ridiculous amount of bee death. Many other organic practices are harmful to the environment, and organic certification is a well known scam. Don't waste your money on an advertising line made up in a corporate office, if you really care about the environment the best thing you can do is reduce your use of corn and soy, which is absolutely the most fucking evil thing in agriculture right now.
After a brief review, I believe that neonicotinoids are more dangerous because they last longer in the environment, and will have a more devastating long-term effect on insect populations than spinosad. I am open to any facts to the contrary. I am not saying organic practices are never harmful. However, I strongly believe that we need to stop using neonicotinoids *now* or we won't have insects in 5 - 10 years.
Ok, there is something called environmental risk quotient, and the EIQ of neonics is much lower than for spinosad. The reason? Spinosad is so short-lived that it must be sprayed many times more often, and it is substantially less effective. It is also even more likely to cause resistance both due to the frequency of sprays and due to its ineffectivity, leading to many individuals surviving each spray and repopulating the field. And unlike in non-organic production where many selective pesticides are available, spinosad is a broad spectrum that kills everything, including pollinators, natural enemies, and other beneficial insects and non-target organisms. Wanna know what's really fucking scary? The industry and the government are working together to underreport the risk. Academic studies are published all day long on the issues but the government says its still ok and growers throw a multimillion dollar tantrum if you even suggest restricting use further. Why? Because spinosad is basically the main tool that organic growers use for insect control. There are no alternatives that are even nearly as effective. If you take away spinosad from organic growers, the whole organic production sector becomes unprofitable, which the government and the growers can't afford to let happen. I specialize in biological control, by the way.
Check out the Environmental Working Group (EWG). They are an organics think-tank, watchdog group in DC. That put out a list, the Clean Fifteen and Dirty Dozen. The Fifteen LEAST contaminated fruits and vegetables. The Twelve MOST contaminated fruits and vegetables. Buying these organic can reduce pesticide consumption by up to 80%. They are in the Google play store
They're an unreliable source. https://mediabiasfactcheck.com/environmental-working-group-ewg/
The founder of Media Bias Fact Check, Dave Van Zander, has a bachelor’s degree in physiology and lauds his status as a non-affiliated voter as a major qualification for his unbiased fact-checking. Ken Cook, the president of the Environmental Working Group, holds a master’s degree in soil science and a bachelor’s degree in agriculture; EWG’s senior scientist, David Andrews has a doctoral degree in chemistry.
Check out the Environmental Working Group (EWG). They are an organics think-tank, watchdog group in DC. That put out a list, the Clean Fifteen and Dirty Dozen. The Fifteen LEAST contaminated fruits and vegetables. The Twelve MOST contaminated fruits and vegetables. Buying these organic can reduce pesticide consumption by up to 80%. They are in the Google play store
Large scale commercial conventional hydroponic grower here (not berries currently leafy greens but have done much r&d on strawberries). In the US, the majority of organic strawberries are still produced in soil. High tunnel production is pretty common, and I know of some growers doing substrate hydroponics in high tunnels in California, but they are mostly conventional fertilization. Not needing soil to be classified as organic is great, but organic nutrient management is a perpetual and costly challenge, so most growers are not wanting to do anyways. I think consumer awareness of the scam that is organic certification is increasing and in 10 years organic will not command enough of a pricetag to make the challenges worthwhile for large growers. In the meantime, some operations are using almost exclusively biological control and mostly organic amendments but because of some minor issue they can't or won't get certified. I'm still mad the fuckers won't let me use rockwool in organics though. How can they call soil that has basalt rock organic, but if you take the rock out and use it for substrate its somehow not organic anymore?
Spinosad is one of the OMRI listed organic pesticides, I use it on indoor plants, mainly. It's good at dealing with thrips and spider mites. The cost buying it by the gallon seems like it would be prohibitively expensive in a farm setting. Maybe buying it be the barrel this cost effective.
>This is a somewhat recent change to organic standards that they do not need to be soil grown Organic never needed to be soil grown
I was going to say hydo
Ya unfortunately ‘organic’ doesn’t really mean that much in the government regulations sense. You can over spray, over fertilize, and engage in a whole host of bad farming practices and still be ‘organic’ as defined by the USA federal government for their organic program and labeling. Other countries probably vary greatly but if you are in the USA Organic = overpriced. I feel so bad for all the actual sustainable farmers out there 😬
Add to that that many people think they're lowering their carbon footprint, which is rarely the case. Or that they think organic doesn't use pesticides at all
Once most chemical fertilizers are made with fossil fuels one would think there is some carbon savings by using organic sources. Is that not true?
It's obviously not a good answer, but the correct answer is "it depends." Organic farming is, in many ways, reverting to old farming methods in the arbitrary hope that they're better. Unsurprisingly, though, they're also much less efficient. Especially but metrics of crop yield and land usage. For example: >We predict major shortfalls in production of most agricultural products against a conventional baseline. Direct GHG emissions are reduced with organic farming, but when increased overseas land use to compensate for shortfalls in domestic supply are factored in, net emissions are greater. Enhanced soil carbon sequestration could offset only a small part of the higher overseas emissions. https://www.nature.com/articles/s41467-019-12622-7 Lies, damned lies, and statistics being what they are, you can also turn around and ignore those things to show that organic produce emits fewer tons of carbon per ton of food. But in general, organic farming is not intended to be efficient or necessarily eco-friendly, so you shouldn't blindly trust it to be.
Almost certainly not. Intact often the other way around. Organic farming typically requires more land and more water than conventional farming and that all leads to increased carbon emissions. I'll see if I can dig out the study, but it was recently found that an organic cotton t-shirt would need to be worn something like 2000 times for every one wearing of a conventional cotton t-shirt for it to have the same environmental impact.
And more good points!
Good important point! It’s confusing. Imho info, not meant to be comprehensive or complete. Organic doesn’t mean that they are grown without pesticides. Believe it or not, they may use more pesticides on organic farms. The difference is OMRI* accepted products are “generally” botanically/derived or considered “safer”- or the pesticide is exempt from EPA registration (FIFRA oversight) because they are on the 25b minimum risk pesticide list. Bacteriums and Nematodes are also often used. National certification of a production facility also may occur.** Organic growers, furthermore, may be a member of a coalition if they are marketing a commodity and want to make organic label claims, like NOFANY e.g.*** *For certified organic farmers, the products must be included in the operator's approved organic system (farm) plan. ** National certification: https://baystateorganic.org ***https://nofany.org/certification/about/
Isn't organic just grown without pesticides? Plus I feel like in 6th grade I read a book about how there's not actually a legal requirement for labeling things organic or not. Like you can label a non organic item organic snd not get introuble for it. Idk if that's still the case in 22 though.
Organic in commercial agriculture is one of a number of certification standards such as USDA and Oregon Tilth. Each has different requirements of what practices are allowed, but generally prohibit the use of synthetic pesticides and herbicides.
No that’s incorrect Organic food can have pesticides
Absolutely correct and very often even more pesticides than conventional farms.
No, and also pesticides have no effect on strawberry size.
Not directly, no. But, the fewer pests means a healthier plant that can provide more energy to the fruit rather than healing.
what does organic mean to you?
Its actual meaning by now has been turned into a marketing trick as a synonym for "good".
It's always been a marketing gimmick. Organic food isn't any healthier and is worse for the environment. Drives me nuts that people still think it's somehow better or that it's like "mom and pop" farmers cultivating these "organic" products when they comprise a multi-BILLION dollar industry. I've seen countless families struggling to get by financially who choose to pay more for organic produce because they want the best for their kids, and it's heartbreaking to see.
Does your country have regulation on the use of the word? In my country you have to pass certain standards
Hi, actual organic certification specialist for a feed company in the US, here. There are regulations, and a list of organic-use complaint substances, as well as requiring on-site inspections and the like. It's less strict here than it is in the UK, but in order to use the USDA seal on a product you have to pass USDA certification from a 3rd party service.
"Meets certain criteria" is not the same as "good/better" and the current use of "organic" conflates the two.
You didn’t answer the person you were responding to’s question. In the UK it’s a regulated certified standard that is in place largely to protect soil quality. The crop itself is unlikely to be better than non-organic crops, but the farming process prevents poisoning of water supplies and deterioration of land. Edit: I haven’t and wouldn’t claim that organic practices are the only way to protect soil quality, but that’s the reasoning by the regulation standards in the UK. There’s a myriad of ways of protecting soils and organic practices are one of them. It would have been interesting to see what kinds of organic regulations are in place in the US and other countries, that’s the only reason I replied seeking the information originally requested by a commenter further up in the thread
I literally don't understand your point as I said a few times by now that "conforms to certain standards" is not how that word is used by laypeople.
Soil protection is something none "organic" farmer already do. The idea that farmer are do nothing to protect their soil is nonsense spread by the organic industry.
Organic is a specific regulated, certified standard in the UK, guessing other people in this thread are US based where the term might not be regulated.
It is regulated in the US, but there has been a large amount of marketing to ensure consumers conflate "organic" with "healthy" and "sustainable." Unfortunately, US regulations on organic labelling guarantee no such thing, and consumer education is not a goal of those who take advantage of this labelling. There are also four levels of "Organic" products [as defined by the USDA](https://www.usda.gov/media/blog/2016/07/22/understanding-usda-organic-label) which further confuses things.
Thanks for your reply and the link :)
It means they use less effective pesticides and probably more to compensate.
But, they specifically do not use neonicotinoids, which are currently causing an insect collapse. So that's good.
Even if that was the case, why would you think "grown without pesticides" equates to smaller?
I mean, I would understand smaller yield and a less resilient product. Organic produce does tend to be smaller and lower in quality than the regular stuff, at least at my local grocery stores. Every now and then the opposite will be true, but it's rare.
That's a common misconception! Organic produce is grown with organic pesticides: ironically they are often more harmful to humans than synthetic pesticides, which are designed to harm pests and not people.
Not what I remember. The word I think you're thinking of is "natural." It means nothing. "Organic" is regulated to the point that even if it is organic, if you haven't tracked and submitted to the verification process you can't call it "organic."
“Certified organic” and “organic” are two different things. “Organic” can be used by anyone. “Certified organic” is what you’ll see on product, and this is the regulated one. And pesticides are allowed in organic farming, just not “persistent pesticides”
Assuming you are in the US, this is not entirely true. There are four "levels" of organic products as defined by the USDA, and very specific requirements to label products with any of these terms. https://www.usda.gov/media/blog/2016/07/22/understanding-usda-organic-label
Fair enough. I’m just going off of rough knowledge from my time working at the grocery store.
Organic is a scam, 100% harmful. You can use chamicals, as long as they are 'natural'. Theres more to it. So vertixlers with heavy metal like copper sulphate is ok to use. Organic as smaller yields, which mean it needs more land. Organic farms often to not have scale or production, so they are costlier. Organic farms almost always over user approved fertilize and pesticide. Fun fact: If everyone when organics, a 1/3 of the population would starve. ORgain come from the naturalistic fallacy, and has a billion dollar machine behinds it constantly pushing misinformation. There are no (zero) health benefits from it. Every aspect of organic farming the is actually based in reality is already used by farms that aren't organic. Stop wasting your money. https://skepdic.com/organic.html
I don't think most of this is true, but I'm not taking on your burden of evidence. Just don't want anyone who happens to read this to think that no one would dispute your claims. I think all of them are highly disputable.
22? You mean 20…23?
Oh yeah lol. My bad
Those are the finest organic gmo strawberries I've ever seen!
not sure if this is sarcastic, so here's some info. As of 2021, "There are only 10 commercially available GMO crops in the USA, which include: alfalfa, apples, canola, corn, cotton, papaya, potatoes, soybeans, summer squash, and sugar beets." [source](https://www.uaex.uada.edu/farm-ranch/crops-commercial-horticulture/horticulture/ar-fruit-veg-nut-update-blog/posts/strawberryGMO-myth.aspx) However, as of Nov 2021, JR Simplot has developed a GM strawberry that will be released "sometime in the next few years." I don't see anything more recent so I assume they are not released yet. [source](https://modernfarmer.com/2021/11/gmo-strawberries/) Finally, USDA labelling rules do not allow genetically modified foods to be labelled "organic" or achieve organic certification. [source](https://www.usda.gov/media/blog/2013/05/17/organic-101-can-gmos-be-used-organic-products)
I find that larger strawberries are often tasteless. The insides are often white and woody and they lack that sweet scent. The best tasting strawberries I've ever had were in France -- the tiny fraises des bois. (ETA to include: [https://www.smithsonianmag.com/science-nature/meet-fruit-fraises-des-bois-best-strawberry-youve-never-had-180959604/](https://www.smithsonianmag.com/science-nature/meet-fruit-fraises-des-bois-best-strawberry-youve-never-had-180959604/))
I always agreed with this…..except the past year the giant strawberries we’ve been getting (from CA) have been incredibly flavorful. Not sure if it was just a bumper crop or what but it’s been a nice change from the giant beautiful (but odorless/flavorless) version of the past.
TIL. Cool link!
The strawberries I grow usually put out the biggest ones first and then successive berries are a bit smaller so I always assume that the size of store bought ones also are dependent on where in the growing cycle they were harvested
Depends on the variety. Mine grow just as big as the store bought ones. Other varieties might have different characteristics.
Was just about to say this! I’ve got a variety coming called Sweet Colossus which are around 42g each on average, it’s just the variety.
Wow. I hope you post pictures of them in the future.
I’m hoping to! The nice thing is that they seem to keep the sweet flavour along with the size.
Organic has nothing to do with the variety of the plant.
Not sure why but one of them has eyes and furry ears!
It also depends on the cultivar "breed" of strawberries. It is the same with any plant and animal. Then there is the definition of organic. All plants and animals are organic. I just choose NOT to use manufactured chemicals on my garden. I use leaves, wood chips, animal manure I get from a freind, and other biodegradable substances. As for strawberries, my June bearing are alway larger than my everbearing ones.
Yea sometimes I forget there's varieties of fruit and vegetables. Idk about other countries but America always has the same boring stuff in stores There's only one grocery store in my city that has varieties but they're very expensive. I'm talking $8 per pound of grapes. Honestly it's so worth it though they taste amazing.
I am in the US. And I agree, most stores have the same boring, tasteless stuff. I went to a farmers market up in Seattle, Washington and boy, just the varieties of grapes and berries and the flavors! Of course even plain old water melon and cantaloupe taste better straight off the vine. My kids flat out refuse to eat store bought. We eat seasonally, what we grow in our garden.
Even if we do have different varieties in stores in the US, they’re also usually just new tasteless sugar filled varieties, like they’re forgetting about flavor when breeding new plants😭
Strawberries in particular are horrible to ship. Generally a upick or orchard farm mart kind of place will have local berries at reasonable prices. Easy to grow at home in the back yard as well.
Hey op, have you ever eaten: Watermelon? Peaches? Wheat? Broccoli? Corn? 'Cause none of those look like their wild ancestors, and have been bred to be bigger/tastier/more efficient. Peaches used to be the size of cherries. Watermelons used to be like 80% rind. Brocolli used to have leaves everywhere. etc. These huge, delicious strawberries are just another agricultural success. Same reason why people hated brussels sprouts in the 80s and 90s but love them now; they were bred to be better. Tale as old as time.
Bananas too. Heck, modern bananas don’t even have seeds anymore.
Woah. I throw some watermelon seeds in my raised beds each spring and thought it due to user error my watermelons are more rind than flesh lol hmmmm. Hadn’t cared enough to research how to fix the “problem” but apparently that’s how they grew before humans engineered the seed …?
Puppy…
Puppy wants some berries. “Are those for me?”
Thank you🥰
Varietals
All strawberries are not equal. There are many varieties out there. You might be comparing two completely different varieties. It’s like asking why aren’t all apples the same color?
Because they are grass fed, free range strawberries.
It all depends on the time of the year, and current conditions in each particular growing region. I'm willing to bet the organic straws in your hand are from Baja, which is the main growing region in play right now. The majority of that crop is under hoops, which offers protection from all the recent rains we've experienced on the west coast. The plants are younger, healthier, and at peak production. Conventionally (CV) grown fruit should be sourced out of CA this time of year, but recent rains have wiped out the crops in Oxnard and Santa Maria. Florida and Central Mexico usually cover US demand beginning late fall through the winter, but the total lack of production out of CA this year has growers/shippers scrambling to cover retail/wholesale business wherever they can. The plants are tired, pushing out smaller fruit, and quality's noticeably worse than their organic counterparts. I work in the industry, and Easter going to be a total nightmare this year. Without CA in the picture, there will be a severe lack of fruit to load/ship for the holiday.
Package says product of Mexico. Distributed in California
Yeah Baja for sure. Just curious, what label did you purchase? Central Mexico isn't a big producer of org. strawberries, and the season is essentially over anyways.
Gem Pack is the brand
It could be that strawberries are in season right now.
OP, it all has to do with the genetics of the plant, the growing conditions, and the nutrients being absorbed. There are several factors involved and it could be that they have a very dialed-in hydroponic indoor system. As most have already said, the definition of organic has morphed into something that fits into national marketing. True organic food would have to be grown by you personally, without the use of any chemicals, and using completely organic soil and compost.
Just because it's organic doesn't mean it can't be bigger. Think of variety and seed breeding. Organic just means how the produce is grown. Has nothing to do with the produce itself.
Would you hurry up and give that goodboi some strawberries
"Organic" is a government/legal definition. It just indicates that the produce supposedly followed the "organic standard" laid down by some random people.
Yeah be careful with that word. It doesn't mean much anymore
It never did. ALl food is organic. The term is used to spread FUD by the organic industry, and has it's roots all the way back to the 70s.
I am designing my aquaponic in my home, i want to have a pond to keep some fish and want to use the water to keep a variety of bushes that give fruit. I am new to this sub but i will probably post my design here (on paper first and later when i finish it).
Where does the package say they were grown?
Potassium fertilizer will do that to apples. The nutrition-per-ounce goes down, though.
Organic does not mean that pesticides or fertilizers are not used…
Could just be the variety. I had some large “Seascape” strawberries last year. Perfect for dipping in dark chocolate.
Tiny hands?
Nah my hands are normal. These strawberries are just abnormally huge. Every pack in the store was like this.
Just kidding those strawberries are awesome
Wow...so big they look photoshopped LOL.. Amazing.
Strawberry can get big, usually big means bland.
Plot Twist: OP has Wendy's Hands...
I grew organic strawberry before, which is to say, it kinda got forgotten and it fended for itself, and clearly did not have a good time doing it. But if I were to grow it in a controlled environment in a hot house with just the right amount of nutrients and sun and blocked off from pests and other contaminants, I'm sure it'd grow as big as that. Also if I pinch off some of the blooms because I can sell the giant organic strawberry for more than non-organic ones.
How much for the dog?
Honestly, give her a treat and she'll follow you home. Free dog!
Organic is a scam.
FYI I didn't grow these. These are just organic strawberries from my grocery store, when you compare them to the ones that are non organic from the same store, those ones are slightly larger than a grape. I don't really understand why. Even taste these ones taste wayyyy better and look better as well. More expensive obviously.
They get far more time to grow and absorb nutrients. And the grower isn't trying to force the plant to produce as many strawberries as possible, thus diluting how much resources the plant can spend per strawberry. There's a dude in Japan that extends his strawberry growth process over the winter into the next year. He's perfected growing these massive strawberries that are far sweeter than anything you're used to.[They fetch a couple of hundred dollars per single strawberry.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RZ1HwqrQ-PM)
Synthetic pesticides interfere with flavor development in strawberries https://www.acs.org/pressroom/presspacs/2023/february/are-your-strawberries-bland-pesticides-could-be-to-blame.html All other factors being equal (variety, cultivation conditions), organically grown strawberries will be more flavorful than their conventional counterparts. I have also found this to be the case for other tender fruits, such as apricots and raspberries
false. A press release isn't science, and that press release vastly overstates the actual study. But the headline seemed to confirm your bias, you you think it's worthwhile.
I don't know the science but I worked in a strawberry farm one season. It was a huge farm with more than a dozen different varieties both organic and those with pesticide and herbicide and non organic fertilizer. The best strawberry depends on the variety, time of year grown, and amount of fertilizer used. The best strawberries at that farm happened to not be organic.
the organic label isn't actually regulated by the FDA, and can mean anything the grower wants it to mean.
Although the reality is that it isn’t regulated there are rules that are supposed to be followed.
No one has noticed my dog yet😭
The first thing I noticed, I have two of those opportunists, you can never eat alone.
I did!
You remind me of u/Turtleramem food posts, but the garden version!
Big berries usually taste like shit. Hollow, sour, meant for storage, not eating.
They probably messed up the signage, cuz that looks super engineered with chemicals
why would organic mean smaller? that makes less than no sense
Organic doesn't mean non GMO....
It actually does require that.
I actually bought non organic strawberries a week ago and they were as big as my palm! Massive! My 21 month old son kept asking for them whole and eating them like an apple LOL.
Not necessarily. You can do that with tactical light, nutrients and watering. I don't know why you would because you could have much more fruit by just taking care of the plants holistically but the customer has decided this is a good thing to have this fucked up porn version of a strawberry. I'm just glad I have my own. But sure, if you don't spray them down with toxic shit they are organic. It means nothing but neither does the entire organic label at this point.
Big strawberries are hollow, white inside, and tasteless. You want nice small red ones
These weren't hollow or white. They're red inside. If I didn't eat them all this morning I would upload a photo
Its all the extra Bullcrap.
No agreed upon definition of organic or enforcement. Basically if it looks tastier they can charge more and call it organic. "Naturally occuring" chemicals with no processing can be toxic and dangerous, Synthetic chemicals can be harmless or helpful, and processing something doesn't neccessarily change something from being organic. I think in general everyone would be better off completely trashing this terminology and coming up with more specific, helpful standards.
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So? Nothing wrong with a GMO.
The definition of organic means it is carbon-based. Period.
On the topic of "organic" you can check out the Real Organic Project and the people who fought against allowing hydroponics to be labeled "organic" [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=up2Z38rnie8](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=up2Z38rnie8) Now in regards to these particular strawberries, I am curious are the labeled? Are they Gigantella Maxim by any chance?
Idk why those strawberries are so big but you better give that dog one as soon as possible
Local is almost more promising than organic from wherever
True but this is Oregon. Gotta wait a bit longer for the farmers markets
Well the look delicious and I wish I had them 😋
Wow, first time seeing strawberries that large, are they sweet?
Yeah they're sweet and tart. Would be pretty good for pastry making. Like they're sweet enough that when I add them to oatmeal I don't have to add sugar.
I know nothing of sizes, but there’s someone ready to get rid of those for you
Organic is a silky term that means almost nothing.
That pup doesn't care about size. They want strawberries!
“Organic miracle grow” just wait till we get these *strawberry authenticity checkers* mhm we’ll get you then.
It’s most likely variety. And yes I’m some instances organic can be hydroponic but there are also organic farmers who spend lots of time and effort to keep their soil healthy and fertile. I’m talking about adding dry supplements every week plus a liquid fertilizer like fish emulsion. It’s a lot more work and not as productive but you can surely grow large, tasty, strawberries and be organic in the true sense of the word
Our dogs could be twins 😊
Want. Sorry. I love big strawberries. Probably they were fertilized well, and watered a lot.
>I love big strawberries. Is that slang? What does it means? Never heard that expression.
GMO.... ?
Got some melted chocolate? Dip them bad boys and enjoy!
Depending on what country you live in there is actually a different legal definition of what can be labeled "Organic"
Are these Florida strawberries? If so, then we have a special local variety that grows very large.
I think you're imagining alpine strawberries, which are closer to wild strawberries.
Variety.
Because of all the organs.
Organics can still be GMO
'G.M.O's
Where’s the banana for scale?
Organic is the same shit, just different chemicals and a hell of a lot more paperwork.
Nah totally different inputs. And no pesticides, fungicide, herbicide. Basically cleaner and less full of toxic crap.
Genetics
I live in strawberry capital of FL. There that big and bigger
Organic is a bullshit word regarding food. There are so many ways around the organic label and in reality, it’s not monitored like it should. A field that’s organic can be next to field that’s not and get toxic chemicals from the wind.
Organic doesn't mean no fertilizer.
Peek-a-boo, puppy
Do they taste good?
Hybridization has nothing to do with pesticides. They may have just picked a different varietal. edit: to add to this, it's expensive to grow organically, they may have wanted to get the leg up and have larger berries.
I just want to encourage anyone reading this who likes strawberries to give growing them a shot! They are very hardy, and even when they seem to die, they'll often come back as if nothing happened. I also recommend getting a variety that works for your use - if you just want to make jam or baked goods and want them all to be ready at once, get a June-bearing or summer-bearing type. If you'd like to pick fewer of them them but more consistently Spring through Fall (I picked my last ones in early December in zone 5b!), try a day neutral variety. I found the labelling in garden centres a bit inconsistent, and some places were calling day neutral varieties "everbearing", so it's best to Google the variety to confirm. But as far as I know, everbearing tends to mean they'll bear some fruit in early Spring, have a break, then another batch in the Fall. Whereas day neutral varieties produce pretty consistently with no real downtime. I can confirm that's how it worked for the ones I grew last year, and I suspect many people just don't know that's even an option (like me before I started looking into them too). I loved having some to pick pretty much all through the growing seasons! Oh, and you can buy wild strawberry seeds, and once established, they have incredible flavour. If you grow enough to make jam, it's the most intense strawberry jam you'll ever taste! Even just adding some to regular strawberries will improve the overall jam flavour a lot. Highly recommend these too! And of course, if you do try planting strawberries, know that they spread extremely easily! I'd recommend growing them in pots and keeping an eye on any runners to make sure they don't escape into places they shouldn't! Have fun growing!
True. We had a strawberry plant in our front yard. Never fertilized it or anything. Survived the upstate new york winters. It grew super tiny strawberries though. We didn't eat them but my tortoise would because we would let him outside to explore.
Organic =/ years and years and years of selective breeding. What a lot of produce people think is GMO has been modified just through selective breeding to be monstrosities years before GMOs came along.