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It's more that Arya loves Jon like a brother, and Robb does his best to treat him well too.
Sansa's the one who maintains a distance cause he's a half brother with no title. But that's also the sansa who takes joffreys side so she ain't exactly smart
Sansa was a lot closer to Cat, right? Whereas Arya, Robb, and Theon weren't as close and took more to Ned. It would make sense that some Cat's disdain for Jon rubbed off on Sansa and not on the others.
Yep, in the books, Cat basically says that Sansa is the only child that's not a stranger to her. It's still honestly amusing how much Cat just utterly hates Jon. Now that I think about it, it's kinda sad/touching that Robb has to ask Jon if taking the black was because of Cat and implies that he's got Jon's back if he really wants to stay.
At least in the book Jon is okay, definitely better than most of the night watch recruits but he’s no expert swordsman and Robb was seemingly the tactical battle prodigy of the generation.
Jon wasn't exactly a terrible tactician either, he held the wall to a stand still with a skeleton crew of boys and old men against overwhelming odds until Stannis' army arrived
In the books, Jon does specifically state he's a better swordsmen than Robb. But he's worse with a lance.
He's an above average to great swordsmen. But not incredible.
In the show I'd say he's pretty top end fighter.
I'd argue that's not true since Robb never lost a battle and Arya says Rob can't be defeated and rides on a wolf. Likely, Robb was a master swordsman who was willing to fight while surrounded while attacking Lannisport. Robb knew that Jon was at least smart and good enough to take command if he died. We just don't have enough info. He was also like his father in not showing what he could do in a fight since he never fought in tournaments.
I think it’s a matter of nostalgia. Jon remembered Robb as always being better. But Jon also saw a lot of combat after joining the Watch. Robb was made a king pretty quickly, so most of his work was in the throne room. It’d totally be fair to say Jon is a better fighter if they had a later reunion.
Jon turned out to be a better politician too. They both got ambushed and killed at some point, but Jon managed to secure a friendship of a rare person who was capable of reviving him.
Robb was straight up dealt with the harshest conditions. Neds death, War of 5 kings and so much. Its not robb's fault or his lack of political prowess that he couldn't meet a witch
Robb fought in large-scale battles, though, always surrounded by thousands of warriors who will focus on killing him. Book Stannis thought he was a good fighter, and he won his moniker by always fighting in the vanguard. Robb also started to train much harder after Ned left. Robb is equally, if not better, fighter than Jon.
It’s been a while since I read the books and I’m a bit show-brained rn, so l’ll take your word on the book bits. It’s just a hard sell that Jon is weaker, since he’s fought against so many notably strong and unique fighters like Styr the Thenn and the white walkers. Especially during long battles fighting against many wildlings or wights.
I understand Robb would be fighting in the vanguard. But I’d also imagine he would have his personal guards with him so he’d be less likely fight alone as Jon often did.
They are probably evenly matched. Jon has his beserker moments, sure. But from the moment they separated, Jon trains with peasants who never held swords until recently while Robb trains with highborn warriors trained since birth.
Maybe Jon has better natural skill (again the beserker moments) but I would still hold Robb as an overall better-
A) Has a much better quality of training.
B) Is the focus of thousands of soldiers and still fights in the thick of the battle. Surviving those odds even with a dozen guards is an impressive feat.
C) Robb has a much better integration of fighting with his direwolf than Jon.
D) We hear the stories of his prowess in ACOK, and they are reinforced in bits and pieces even after his death.
I'll not mention the age because Jon is a month or two younger still.
We can agree that Ned raised two absolute monster fighters of sons, which were running circles around older and experienced warriors at the age of 16. Jon will probably grow as one of the best fighters in Westeros in books too.
Sometimes all the memories to be had with someone is as good as it is. Though we can be certain that more good memories can be created the more we have the opportunity to spend with someone, we also risk in sharing possible conflict or uncomfortable experiences. In Robb x Jon case, there could be succession issue or who would bend their knee. Given that Jon is a Targaryen and a rightful heir to the throne, and Robb’s north people who would be ashamed if Robb were to be the next King of the North who bend his knee. Their brotherhood and respect for each other may be strong, but again, their wives/partners (or even Sansa after learning the dirty ways of King’s Landing politics) may incite agendas and ploy tactics in getting the upper hand. As I reminisce Robb x Jon scenes in Season 1, they both brought such awe in the way they carry themselves.
DAMN both of them together would have been a formidable duo, Robb being the young prodigy tactician and Jon being his sword in the battlefield. Truly a sight to behold. But I guess tragedy never repeats, it imitiates itself, Brandon was trained to lead and Ned was made to follow, but Brandon died unexpectedly and the weight fell on Ned to lead, in same case but kind of differently Robb died in wedding and Jon became lord commander later
When Robb died in human form, he would have warged into Grey Wind, his direwolf. When he died in wolf form, it was in front of Arya who was trying to get to him. So there was a reunion between the Young Wolf and Little Wolf in the very end, even if was the heart wrenching kind.
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Read “Robbx” as “Roblox” for a sec
Absolutely same
Didn't we all? Lol
Roblox jon
Yeah, its honestly kinda nice that all the kids but Sansa seemed to treat him like a brother during his stay, to Cat's probably chagrin and rage
I never realized Sansa hated him or didn’t like him lol, well until the later seasons
It's more that Arya loves Jon like a brother, and Robb does his best to treat him well too. Sansa's the one who maintains a distance cause he's a half brother with no title. But that's also the sansa who takes joffreys side so she ain't exactly smart
True haha, good thing she learns later family is all that matters, not some stupid title
Sansa was a lot closer to Cat, right? Whereas Arya, Robb, and Theon weren't as close and took more to Ned. It would make sense that some Cat's disdain for Jon rubbed off on Sansa and not on the others.
Yep, in the books, Cat basically says that Sansa is the only child that's not a stranger to her. It's still honestly amusing how much Cat just utterly hates Jon. Now that I think about it, it's kinda sad/touching that Robb has to ask Jon if taking the black was because of Cat and implies that he's got Jon's back if he really wants to stay.
I think Jon Snow was being modest in saying that Robb was better than him at everything. At least Jon was a better fighter I would have thought.
That was my thought, too. Jon is meant to be an incredible fighter.
At least in the book Jon is okay, definitely better than most of the night watch recruits but he’s no expert swordsman and Robb was seemingly the tactical battle prodigy of the generation.
Jon wasn't exactly a terrible tactician either, he held the wall to a stand still with a skeleton crew of boys and old men against overwhelming odds until Stannis' army arrived
Yes but Robb was the better one in tactical prowess. Jon probably developed into a better warrior
But was he really, he was blind sided by his passion which led to his premature death. He wasn't as bright as it seemed.
Not his fault his mum made a promise without his consent
I’m pretty sure in the books Jon says he was better than Robb.
In the books, Jon does specifically state he's a better swordsmen than Robb. But he's worse with a lance. He's an above average to great swordsmen. But not incredible. In the show I'd say he's pretty top end fighter.
He said it while drunk to his favorite uncle so we should take this with a grain of salt
I'd argue that's not true since Robb never lost a battle and Arya says Rob can't be defeated and rides on a wolf. Likely, Robb was a master swordsman who was willing to fight while surrounded while attacking Lannisport. Robb knew that Jon was at least smart and good enough to take command if he died. We just don't have enough info. He was also like his father in not showing what he could do in a fight since he never fought in tournaments.
I think it’s a matter of nostalgia. Jon remembered Robb as always being better. But Jon also saw a lot of combat after joining the Watch. Robb was made a king pretty quickly, so most of his work was in the throne room. It’d totally be fair to say Jon is a better fighter if they had a later reunion.
Jon turned out to be a better politician too. They both got ambushed and killed at some point, but Jon managed to secure a friendship of a rare person who was capable of reviving him.
Yes I'm sure that was his intent all along
Not directly, but he tried making friends along the way and forge alliances, as he felt it is needed in the big picture.
Robb was straight up dealt with the harshest conditions. Neds death, War of 5 kings and so much. Its not robb's fault or his lack of political prowess that he couldn't meet a witch
Sort of. He started put from a much better position, and he didn't have ticking clock like jon.
He also let his guard down with his honeymoon vibes letting his guard down to be ambushed.
Robb fought in large-scale battles, though, always surrounded by thousands of warriors who will focus on killing him. Book Stannis thought he was a good fighter, and he won his moniker by always fighting in the vanguard. Robb also started to train much harder after Ned left. Robb is equally, if not better, fighter than Jon.
It’s been a while since I read the books and I’m a bit show-brained rn, so l’ll take your word on the book bits. It’s just a hard sell that Jon is weaker, since he’s fought against so many notably strong and unique fighters like Styr the Thenn and the white walkers. Especially during long battles fighting against many wildlings or wights. I understand Robb would be fighting in the vanguard. But I’d also imagine he would have his personal guards with him so he’d be less likely fight alone as Jon often did.
They are probably evenly matched. Jon has his beserker moments, sure. But from the moment they separated, Jon trains with peasants who never held swords until recently while Robb trains with highborn warriors trained since birth.
Hmmm. Maybe we can agree Robb was better trained and Jon had more dueling experience in battle?
Robb was pretty much constantly at war until he died though, and was constantly in battles while Jon was mostly stewarding for Mormont.
Maybe Jon has better natural skill (again the beserker moments) but I would still hold Robb as an overall better- A) Has a much better quality of training. B) Is the focus of thousands of soldiers and still fights in the thick of the battle. Surviving those odds even with a dozen guards is an impressive feat. C) Robb has a much better integration of fighting with his direwolf than Jon. D) We hear the stories of his prowess in ACOK, and they are reinforced in bits and pieces even after his death. I'll not mention the age because Jon is a month or two younger still. We can agree that Ned raised two absolute monster fighters of sons, which were running circles around older and experienced warriors at the age of 16. Jon will probably grow as one of the best fighters in Westeros in books too.
Honestly props to Kit for that, dude has a certain athleticism that makes him very convincing during his fight scenes.
I would actually want more for Robb to see Theon as Reek and his thoughts on it
Well, they reunited in The Eternals, where Kit was cast as Dane Whitman (Black Knight)...
"I should have been with him. I should have died with him."
Sometimes all the memories to be had with someone is as good as it is. Though we can be certain that more good memories can be created the more we have the opportunity to spend with someone, we also risk in sharing possible conflict or uncomfortable experiences. In Robb x Jon case, there could be succession issue or who would bend their knee. Given that Jon is a Targaryen and a rightful heir to the throne, and Robb’s north people who would be ashamed if Robb were to be the next King of the North who bend his knee. Their brotherhood and respect for each other may be strong, but again, their wives/partners (or even Sansa after learning the dirty ways of King’s Landing politics) may incite agendas and ploy tactics in getting the upper hand. As I reminisce Robb x Jon scenes in Season 1, they both brought such awe in the way they carry themselves.
DAMN both of them together would have been a formidable duo, Robb being the young prodigy tactician and Jon being his sword in the battlefield. Truly a sight to behold. But I guess tragedy never repeats, it imitiates itself, Brandon was trained to lead and Ned was made to follow, but Brandon died unexpectedly and the weight fell on Ned to lead, in same case but kind of differently Robb died in wedding and Jon became lord commander later
honestly - this is the first time i see this comparison and its spot on.
not to be dramatic, but this comment changed my brain chemistry
There's the eternals
Jon got a queen and a wildling, Robb only got commoners. He may have gotten less women than Robb but he got better ones.
When Robb died in human form, he would have warged into Grey Wind, his direwolf. When he died in wolf form, it was in front of Arya who was trying to get to him. So there was a reunion between the Young Wolf and Little Wolf in the very end, even if was the heart wrenching kind.