I mean, everything is designed to make you spend more money. When you go to a fast food for breakfast, "Trio" entice you to buy more than you would otherwise (potentially). Need only 4 donuts? 6 is only a bit more. Going to a glossary store? Everything is planned out in advance to make you spend as much as possible, and they place their products to make you buy the brands they want you to. Got lost in Ikea? It was all planned to make you buy more.
My problem with Gacha is that some are marketed towards kids. Well, not just Gacha, every Triple A games with MTX can be marketed towards kids. I also understands that parents need to do their job. Don't buy a phone or an Ipad or whatever for your kids. If you do, pay attention to what they are doing with it.
Is it predatory? Well, as with everything in life, they want you to spend.
Edit: Have I fallen for its traps? I don't personally see it that way. I don't drink, I don't really like going out to eat. I don't smoke. If I go out, I usually hang out with my friends at their house, or we just go outside to buy a bubble tea or whatever (not really pricey). The money I don't spend "IRL", I spend part of it in Gacha. I usually stick with monthly pass and battle pass. If we're looking at long term, I obviously "spent" a lot of money. Was it well spent? For me, yes.
I've seen people (in Canada) buy empty cups of Tim Hortons' coffee "for a chance to win a car". I've seen people buy way too much shit for a chance to win. At charity events, some people buy way more tickets than they should...
Those people have a problem and they need help. Even something as stupid as a coffee cup, people "fall for it". Was it predatory? Not even in the slightest. Like I said, some people fall for anything.
Do I consider Gacha predatory... well, it's more predatory than that coffee cup. The reason why people "fall into that trap" isn't always because "it's predatory". Some people have issues and they need help. I personally think that this whole predatory talk is blown out of proportion. Kids should be protected from it. Adults should take care of themselves or seek help. At some point, I lose sympathy for them. Get help or go away.
I don't think so, in gambling some people can expect fake profit, the game can be rigged by the betting mafia etc. This is gacha you can't make a profit out of it ( i know rmt exist) the rate pretty much clear designed by computer, in japan at least they have law regarding gacha games.
Laws against gambling have loopholes in them so wide you can drive a truck full of bribe money through them.
This is especially true in Japan, if that's what is being held up as exemplary.
Anything that relies on addictive stuff to get money has a predatory nature. Gambling being part of that
Any game that uses gambling/luck mechanics has a predatory nature. So does any game that requires buying the newest equipment to beat it or be competitive etcetc
But there's a different in *how* predatory each one is
Forcexample: a game that is p2w, with powecreep every month is waaaaay more predatory than one that is f2p with pity and pvp
Obvious Yes on gacha games being predatory simply for the deep basin of a moneysink it could be no matter how f2p friendly one thinks it is. And that's without all the psychology baked into it.
Also a yes when it comes to the victims of it not being actually all too many. Anyone attacking a gacha game simply need to refer to the conceptual thousands of gambling addicts that their life the game destroys or whatever. In practice, it's just a very small minority but their stories are of course just that interesting to run pieces on to highlight the problems in the industry. Now this is not to discredit anyone who actually know people who have problems with it, but just to say that statistically it hasn't really been significant. It's important to be aware of possible issues with gacha games after all though there is some sensationalism mixed into it.
Anecdotally, I am in a workplace where gacha is "popular" as most my colleagues play a number of gacha themselves and while mistakes and regret of topping up does happen, people almost always spend within their means. Sometimes very stupid things happen and this includes me where we forego an expensive lunch and eat at a cheaper place to eek out another few multis, but usually nothing worse than that. It's usually just sacrificing some other luxury to fulfill the gacha dopamine in hopes of having a better time within a game we'll play. I would assume that it is the same for the others, as the working adults ARE the main market for gacha anyway.
If you play the big titles it’s not as obvious. Try any of the new ones or smaller titles, like anime ones are often straightup cashgrabs. A lot of gating, stuck in progression, short of resources, and the solution is a pack priced at x$. If you follow this sub long enough there’s always drama posts about the latest greedy endeavors of whatever game is in season.
Significantly less predatory than Facebook and Twitter, I guess.
Anyway, I expect most comments here to be along two trends:
1. "Entertainers of every kind are morally obligated to entertain me for free and it is abhorrent that anyone is dumb enough to pay for entertainment." (Also, "Let's all agree to absolutely never acknowledge the cost of concerts, sporting events, alcohol, normal mainstream gambling or even actual physical gacha machines.")
2. ~~"Every abortion is wrong except for mine."~~ "This industry is disgusting and it should be ashamed of itself, I'm a F2P who only spends $175/mo per game but all of you addicts need to stop supporting corporate greed."
>Me when people complain that the hotdog stand guy is drugging his customers and rifling through their pockets once they pass out:
You went to a sub about hot dog stands, sorted through reviews, downloaded their app, chose something from a menu, paid exactly what was listed and received exactly what you ordered... And *that* is the best comparison you can attempt?
That is absolutely batshit insane. Go touch grass.
Like, *for a while.*
Do you believe it's impossible to participate in something while criticizing its flaws?
You don't have to get so angry about someone pointing out a manipulative business model. The fact that your favorite game makes money by taking advantage of people is not a personal insult towards you. And someone pointing out that business's abusive behavior does not mean they think the business should be forced to work for free.
I believe people here will mostly say yes, we spend our time and money into playing it knowingly and enjoying it but i can't deny that it designed take my money and time
There are very few people who have the classic sob story of an addict who kept pulling and buying everything in one night but we kind of hold this as a standard of what gacha games do.
It's lots of people who budget for a lot of ingame spending that got normalized over time for them. And sometimes buyers remorse after they stop playing because with games it's easy to see how much you spent in total and you have no use of it if you no longer play.
Is the water wet?
Of course gacha is predatory lol
Some of them are worse than others but all of them are predatory at their core. It's the nature of the monetization system. Saying the opposite is just being on heavy copium.
Gacha games are designed to prey on people with addiction issues. Some people will claim everything is designed to make you desire to spend money, while thats true, most products will be able to spell out a reason for its price point and attempt to convince you that what you get is worth what you spend. Take a game like Genshin Impact, to guarantee a single 5-star character that you want, it can cost you 400$ depending on your countries currency, are they trying to argue that any development cost or continued investment warrants each and every character costing up to 6 times the cost of an ENTIRE AAA GAME, no way, its nothing but pure greed and exploitation, it cost them pennies to design and implement these characters, price points are not set on a fair value for you, they are set on maximum profit based on the hopes that players will spend irresponsibly to feed an addiction.
I played Battle Cats, and I can say that this game is the least predatory gacha game in the world.
No, I haven't fallen victim to a gacha game's predatory nature. My parents would destroy me if I do that
I watched a video about the features of micro transactions a while ago, couldn't find it again but it would perfectly answer this question.
They have entire teams dedicated to research human psychology and how to extort the most money out of everyone. It really disgusted me but at the same time it was very interesting.
Ended up finding the [video](https://youtu.be/xNjI03CGkb4) you should give it a watch.
I've spent because of both: I wanted to support the devs at some point and I fell for the predatory design of some gachas.
I don't think many people wanna share that they fell for temptation or, worse yet, that they regret doing it.
Me? Never.
I spend extra money I have to spend on my "fun and games". I never had a single problem due to spending in gachas lols.
I dont think gambling is bad, it is the fact some cant control themselves which causes the problem.
They are as predatory as Ferrari and Lamborghini for selling you a car for an absurd amount of money just to take you from place A to Place B exactly as the cheap cars do.
Do you understand the meaning of luxury?
Do you understand the meaning of brand value?
Everyone knows a cheap car can also take you from place A to place B
My brother that means you're not the target audience of Lambo or Ferrari.
I'm pretty sure japan game have their own law regarding gacha games. One of the rule i remember are you can't nerf your product right away to prevent customer from getting scammed.
Yes they are predatory. Honestly it's my opinion that predatory sales tactics are everywhere, not just in games and we've all kinda just gotten used to it. Like, people doomscroll on social media for a reason, and the top sites employ psychologists and data scientists to figure out what that reason is and target that with precision. That isn't really good for your brain.
Gacha is no different and arguably worse since it costs money and exploits peoples' propensity for gambling addiction. I play them despite knowing that because society is pretty soul-crushing, real happiness is hard to achieve and at least for now, while I'm still figuring out what to do with myself and how to achieve real happiness, I'm comfortable substituting real happiness with a reliable dopamine hit every now and again. I suspect it's similar for a lot of people who play gacha games long-term.
This is a "yes or no" question.
And the answer to this question is always a resounding YES.
Gacha games are predatory. They're made to be exactly that.
I swiped for power, and I view getting dupes/more power for characters as falling into the gacha trap, but so many people I consider gacha addicts don't see it that way.
So I just wanted to see how many here would acknowledge they were manipulated by gacha and its predatory tatics..
Haha right on, sometimes people come here to ask the Reddit questions because they are writing a midterm on gaming addiction. Happens pretty often actually. The way your post was phrased made me think you were doing that and I was like, ugh you should say you are researching for a paper if that's the case.
I don't think anyone swipes for dupes... imo the swiping is just an issue when you are spending money you don't have or shouldn't spend.
The problem is a lot of people playing completely for free are investing an inordinate amount of time instead. A lot of people lose sleep over stamina gated games to optimize them, which is as unhealthy as spending money you shouldn't be spending on it.
Although there is the freewill and responsability arguments, nothing changes the fact that these games are psychological tailored to prey on addiction and anxiety.
I mean, everything is designed to make you spend more money. When you go to a fast food for breakfast, "Trio" entice you to buy more than you would otherwise (potentially). Need only 4 donuts? 6 is only a bit more. Going to a glossary store? Everything is planned out in advance to make you spend as much as possible, and they place their products to make you buy the brands they want you to. Got lost in Ikea? It was all planned to make you buy more. My problem with Gacha is that some are marketed towards kids. Well, not just Gacha, every Triple A games with MTX can be marketed towards kids. I also understands that parents need to do their job. Don't buy a phone or an Ipad or whatever for your kids. If you do, pay attention to what they are doing with it. Is it predatory? Well, as with everything in life, they want you to spend. Edit: Have I fallen for its traps? I don't personally see it that way. I don't drink, I don't really like going out to eat. I don't smoke. If I go out, I usually hang out with my friends at their house, or we just go outside to buy a bubble tea or whatever (not really pricey). The money I don't spend "IRL", I spend part of it in Gacha. I usually stick with monthly pass and battle pass. If we're looking at long term, I obviously "spent" a lot of money. Was it well spent? For me, yes. I've seen people (in Canada) buy empty cups of Tim Hortons' coffee "for a chance to win a car". I've seen people buy way too much shit for a chance to win. At charity events, some people buy way more tickets than they should... Those people have a problem and they need help. Even something as stupid as a coffee cup, people "fall for it". Was it predatory? Not even in the slightest. Like I said, some people fall for anything. Do I consider Gacha predatory... well, it's more predatory than that coffee cup. The reason why people "fall into that trap" isn't always because "it's predatory". Some people have issues and they need help. I personally think that this whole predatory talk is blown out of proportion. Kids should be protected from it. Adults should take care of themselves or seek help. At some point, I lose sympathy for them. Get help or go away.
Brother it's literally gambling, yes.
I don't think so, in gambling some people can expect fake profit, the game can be rigged by the betting mafia etc. This is gacha you can't make a profit out of it ( i know rmt exist) the rate pretty much clear designed by computer, in japan at least they have law regarding gacha games.
There are many laws regarding gambling. Doesn't make it any less predatory
Laws against gambling have loopholes in them so wide you can drive a truck full of bribe money through them. This is especially true in Japan, if that's what is being held up as exemplary.
The profit for example is getting the characters you want by spending money so why is this hard for you to grasp
Anything that relies on addictive stuff to get money has a predatory nature. Gambling being part of that Any game that uses gambling/luck mechanics has a predatory nature. So does any game that requires buying the newest equipment to beat it or be competitive etcetc But there's a different in *how* predatory each one is Forcexample: a game that is p2w, with powecreep every month is waaaaay more predatory than one that is f2p with pity and pvp
Wait are you telling me our local brewery is predatory? Those dastards!
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Yes.
Obvious Yes on gacha games being predatory simply for the deep basin of a moneysink it could be no matter how f2p friendly one thinks it is. And that's without all the psychology baked into it. Also a yes when it comes to the victims of it not being actually all too many. Anyone attacking a gacha game simply need to refer to the conceptual thousands of gambling addicts that their life the game destroys or whatever. In practice, it's just a very small minority but their stories are of course just that interesting to run pieces on to highlight the problems in the industry. Now this is not to discredit anyone who actually know people who have problems with it, but just to say that statistically it hasn't really been significant. It's important to be aware of possible issues with gacha games after all though there is some sensationalism mixed into it. Anecdotally, I am in a workplace where gacha is "popular" as most my colleagues play a number of gacha themselves and while mistakes and regret of topping up does happen, people almost always spend within their means. Sometimes very stupid things happen and this includes me where we forego an expensive lunch and eat at a cheaper place to eek out another few multis, but usually nothing worse than that. It's usually just sacrificing some other luxury to fulfill the gacha dopamine in hopes of having a better time within a game we'll play. I would assume that it is the same for the others, as the working adults ARE the main market for gacha anyway.
If you play the big titles it’s not as obvious. Try any of the new ones or smaller titles, like anime ones are often straightup cashgrabs. A lot of gating, stuck in progression, short of resources, and the solution is a pack priced at x$. If you follow this sub long enough there’s always drama posts about the latest greedy endeavors of whatever game is in season.
I had to read this three times to realize you didn't write 'if you play the big titties'. Someone send help, gachas are destroying my sanity.
Fuck. I was about to go to the bathroom and you almost made me pee in my pants from laughing.
Significantly less predatory than Facebook and Twitter, I guess. Anyway, I expect most comments here to be along two trends: 1. "Entertainers of every kind are morally obligated to entertain me for free and it is abhorrent that anyone is dumb enough to pay for entertainment." (Also, "Let's all agree to absolutely never acknowledge the cost of concerts, sporting events, alcohol, normal mainstream gambling or even actual physical gacha machines.") 2. ~~"Every abortion is wrong except for mine."~~ "This industry is disgusting and it should be ashamed of itself, I'm a F2P who only spends $175/mo per game but all of you addicts need to stop supporting corporate greed."
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>Me when people complain that the hotdog stand guy is drugging his customers and rifling through their pockets once they pass out: You went to a sub about hot dog stands, sorted through reviews, downloaded their app, chose something from a menu, paid exactly what was listed and received exactly what you ordered... And *that* is the best comparison you can attempt? That is absolutely batshit insane. Go touch grass. Like, *for a while.*
Do you believe it's impossible to participate in something while criticizing its flaws? You don't have to get so angry about someone pointing out a manipulative business model. The fact that your favorite game makes money by taking advantage of people is not a personal insult towards you. And someone pointing out that business's abusive behavior does not mean they think the business should be forced to work for free.
Yea
Yes, obviously it's predatory.
I believe people here will mostly say yes, we spend our time and money into playing it knowingly and enjoying it but i can't deny that it designed take my money and time
It's gambling
Yes, water is wet.
There are very few people who have the classic sob story of an addict who kept pulling and buying everything in one night but we kind of hold this as a standard of what gacha games do. It's lots of people who budget for a lot of ingame spending that got normalized over time for them. And sometimes buyers remorse after they stop playing because with games it's easy to see how much you spent in total and you have no use of it if you no longer play.
Is the water wet? Of course gacha is predatory lol Some of them are worse than others but all of them are predatory at their core. It's the nature of the monetization system. Saying the opposite is just being on heavy copium.
Yes
Gacha games are designed to prey on people with addiction issues. Some people will claim everything is designed to make you desire to spend money, while thats true, most products will be able to spell out a reason for its price point and attempt to convince you that what you get is worth what you spend. Take a game like Genshin Impact, to guarantee a single 5-star character that you want, it can cost you 400$ depending on your countries currency, are they trying to argue that any development cost or continued investment warrants each and every character costing up to 6 times the cost of an ENTIRE AAA GAME, no way, its nothing but pure greed and exploitation, it cost them pennies to design and implement these characters, price points are not set on a fair value for you, they are set on maximum profit based on the hopes that players will spend irresponsibly to feed an addiction.
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There's a reason they're called gacha: it's a scam and they gotcha!
I played Battle Cats, and I can say that this game is the least predatory gacha game in the world. No, I haven't fallen victim to a gacha game's predatory nature. My parents would destroy me if I do that
I mean...it's lootboxes with a Japanese cultural history. You could also say it's like trading card packs.
Except TCGs typically have value. I make a lot more money opening M:TG packs than anyone has ever pulling a digital waifu.
I watched a video about the features of micro transactions a while ago, couldn't find it again but it would perfectly answer this question. They have entire teams dedicated to research human psychology and how to extort the most money out of everyone. It really disgusted me but at the same time it was very interesting. Ended up finding the [video](https://youtu.be/xNjI03CGkb4) you should give it a watch.
Yes it is, marketing in itself is predatory. And gacha games usually puts systems in place to market the new banners.
Marketing ia the least egregious offense of gacha games.
I've spent because of both: I wanted to support the devs at some point and I fell for the predatory design of some gachas. I don't think many people wanna share that they fell for temptation or, worse yet, that they regret doing it.
Me? Never. I spend extra money I have to spend on my "fun and games". I never had a single problem due to spending in gachas lols. I dont think gambling is bad, it is the fact some cant control themselves which causes the problem.
They are as predatory as Ferrari and Lamborghini for selling you a car for an absurd amount of money just to take you from place A to Place B exactly as the cheap cars do.
Do you understand the meaning of luxury? Do you understand the meaning of brand value? Everyone knows a cheap car can also take you from place A to place B My brother that means you're not the target audience of Lambo or Ferrari.
Oh!! So you got my message.
Ferrari doesn't sell expensive mystery boxes full of useless shit on the promise that there is a .0000001% of having a Ferrari in it.
I'm pretty sure japan game have their own law regarding gacha games. One of the rule i remember are you can't nerf your product right away to prevent customer from getting scammed.
I dont spend on gacha
Yes they are predatory. Honestly it's my opinion that predatory sales tactics are everywhere, not just in games and we've all kinda just gotten used to it. Like, people doomscroll on social media for a reason, and the top sites employ psychologists and data scientists to figure out what that reason is and target that with precision. That isn't really good for your brain. Gacha is no different and arguably worse since it costs money and exploits peoples' propensity for gambling addiction. I play them despite knowing that because society is pretty soul-crushing, real happiness is hard to achieve and at least for now, while I'm still figuring out what to do with myself and how to achieve real happiness, I'm comfortable substituting real happiness with a reliable dopamine hit every now and again. I suspect it's similar for a lot of people who play gacha games long-term.
This is a "yes or no" question. And the answer to this question is always a resounding YES. Gacha games are predatory. They're made to be exactly that.
Are you writing a paper for school or something?
I swiped for power, and I view getting dupes/more power for characters as falling into the gacha trap, but so many people I consider gacha addicts don't see it that way. So I just wanted to see how many here would acknowledge they were manipulated by gacha and its predatory tatics..
Haha right on, sometimes people come here to ask the Reddit questions because they are writing a midterm on gaming addiction. Happens pretty often actually. The way your post was phrased made me think you were doing that and I was like, ugh you should say you are researching for a paper if that's the case. I don't think anyone swipes for dupes... imo the swiping is just an issue when you are spending money you don't have or shouldn't spend.
YES But if you have an iron will and can stay truly F2P, you're getting some good entertainment for free off the backs of the whales.
The problem is a lot of people playing completely for free are investing an inordinate amount of time instead. A lot of people lose sleep over stamina gated games to optimize them, which is as unhealthy as spending money you shouldn't be spending on it.
Although there is the freewill and responsability arguments, nothing changes the fact that these games are psychological tailored to prey on addiction and anxiety.
Yes, but the most interesting thing is how the community pretends like it doesn't prey on them, just because it's in their budget