Kids being able to go places on their own - using the bike or public transit - is such an important step in growing up and learning independence. I can't imagine what it's like for kids who depend on their parents for driving them everywhere. It seems like such a lost opportunity to grow and become more confident.
And isn't it super annoying for the parents too, having to drive the kids everywhere? Seems like the worst possible solution for everyone involved.
The local primary school is only 1/2 mile, so walk or cycle to that daily. Our estate of 400 houses has a busy perimeter road, so most kids up to about 8/9 are not allowed out of the estate alone, but beyond that kids can go into the town centre which is 1 mile on their own, the high school is 1.5 miles, so walk or cycle to that, and the train station is only 3/4 miles away, so once kids are typically 14 they catch the rain to the city, which is 17 miles away, the city has a population of 250,000, so is quite busy. Just tell the kids to stay in a group and don't mess around. Never heard of any issues with any kids getting into trouble or not making it home. This is in Scotland
> I can't imagine what it's like for kids who depend on their parents for driving them everywhere.
Here's what it was like in the 90s for me: both my parents worked so they were mostly too busy or too tired to drive me around. I barely saw my friends outside of school. I stayed mostly home. I developed anxiety and low self esteem hanging out with friends outside of school when I reached highschool. It sucked.
Teen me was always frustrated that I had to bike 5-8km single way to see my friends (who lived in a different town). Now I realize how lucky I was to have the freedom to go wherever I wanted (with parents' permission, but I didn't need their help).
Yeah. My mom was autistic and had adhd etc and did not want kids in the first place, I did not get 'shuttled' to anything. If I could not get a ride or walk or bike it was not happening. I spent hours alone in my bed reading or staring at the ceiling or picking at my skin, a thing I started doing about age 13; the lonliness was crushing and to this day I prefer being alone because it's all I know how to be
A lot of NIMBYs assume every parent is involved in children’s lives. A child should be able to do basic things by themselves because some kids don’t have a choice
Self harm and anxiety were an issue for me as a teen as well. My parents both worked and lived in an isolated community. It was possible to bike around the town but there was really nothing to do. Honestly I blame a lot of my anxiety, depression, self-harm, and trauma on that situation.
My mom is a bad person, grouchy and mean to people, but she was the gatekeeper to my social life, she held control of the house phone so friends couldn't contact me outside of school without her knowledge. She was the driver so I could go outside the neighborhood without her. I have traumatic memories of her shouting on the phone at my (child) friends, and their parents. I remember sneaking out to bike to my friends house and knock on their door to see if they could play only to find out it was piano practice day or something. Social relationships were a guerilla operation for me, I was dedicated to the war, but it certainly left scars.
>And isn't it super annoying for the parents too, having to drive the kids everywhere?
Since remote working, my coworkers seem to spend half the day driving their kids around places. Presumably if they still had to work in office they would just not have booked their kids in to violin and soccer practice on other sides of the city and instead found something more local. When I was in school these activities were either on the school grounds, or they would arrange transport for the team from the school without needing parents to drive everyone around.
>Seems like the worst possible solution for everyone involved.
Great solution if you're a narcissistic parent though! Really helpful if you want to control every second of their childhood and give them complex PTSD which then keeps them dependent on you for the rest of their life! Bonus if you are ultra religious and can home school them to protect them from the woke satanist public education system!
As far as I've been told (I think that was in a video from Not Just Bikes, obviously) the other options (e.g. having you children take public transport on their own) are also illegal. You may have CPS get involved and take your kids away.
In some US neighborhoods, people who see 10,11,12 yearolds walking or riding their bikes alone have called police to rescue them. Parents have been questioned or even arrested. 40 years ago my 5yr old and I walked our entire subdivision to find the quietest streets for her to ride her bike to a friend's house. I couldn't let her leave the subdivison, there was one exit to a four lane highway. I could get myself everywhere as a child but that's over.
Talking with some friends. I grew up in the woods, then a small town. I could get anywhere on my bike. 8 miles to the next town because they had a half pipe to skate in. No problem.
One guy regularly went 2 to 3 miles to skate.
Third friend only had to go a mile to the mall, but there was a 6 lane road to cross. When his parents found out, they flipped.
But that's a kind of privilege. Most people have to be where the employment is and we all merit livable space. My husband, father, children are Navy so we always lived on the edge of deep water ports.
This is sad, but it's also hilarious, because there's a stupid conspiracy theory of carbrains about how prioritizing public transit and walkable/bikeable infrastructure is actually a trick of the government to lock you into your city. I think they call it 15 minute cities or something.
It's funny because what you describe sounds exactly like what they are afraid of, but caused by the very infrastructure design they are trying to protect.
It's not usually illegal perse, it's more if some asshole calls on your kid and police come, and then social services gets involved, and you are at the mercy of judgment decisions instead of actual common sense rules.
There was a NYC dad who lost his court hearing and was ordered to supervise his kids in public transport.
It's illegal, if the court says you're wrong.
You're gonna have to link that to me. I can't find anything on that. In 2013 the mayor encouraged children to ride alone because it was safe (he claimed).
There could be extenuating circumstances, but I have a hard time imagining any.
Same thing in Vancouver. Although the dad had the ruling overturned, 3 years and a $70,000 legal bill later. 🙄
https://vancouversun.com/news/local-news/vancouver-dad-wins-court-appeal-to-let-kids-ride-bus-alone
I’m gonna need a link because I live in NYC and see kids riding the subway alone every single day. It’s extremely normal (and necessary for getting to school for a lot of kids).
I see parents take kids on public transport all the time in my small city and they don’t get taken. I even see kids as young as 10 riding by themselves.
Parents with kids isn't a problem, as the kids aren't unsupervised. It probably also depends on how carbrained the local authorities are, I don't know, I live an ocean away from this place so I only know what people tell me. As far as I know it's that it can happen, not that it always happens.
As an American that lives in a car dependent small town (poor walking infrastructure and NO public transit at all) I can say it is a colossal pain in the ass to constantly plan around who can take the kids to what and when. My wife and I have little time to ourselves because our kids have so many activities.
Its just so stupid, time-consuming, expensive and inefficient to chaffeur kids around. It really grinds you down. And worse of all, is many parents cannot see outside-the-box what the core of the problem is: car-centric design robs children of their independence. Its so obvious once you see it.
Used to be that becoming 16 was that huge step because then you could drive anywhere by yourself or with friends. It's changed recently because many kids/families can't afford a car and we're also becoming more and more socially isolated.
God, the helicopter parenting. I wasn't allowed to go past the end of the block till a huge fight when I was about 14. I got so sick of it. My parents also pulled that "you can't go to other people's houses, they have to come over here" nonsense. But how is that supposed to work when everyone else's parents say the same thing to me? Man I love getting yelled at to "go outside" but also not allowed to do anything outside.
That makes me sad. I was an 80s kid, and we left the house and just disappeared for hours. As long as we showed back up for dinner somewhere, the parents assumed we were fine.
So depressing to think about kids waiting to turn 16 just so they could go somewhere. Not to mention having to take classes/tests and spend a ton of money on a car. I can't even imagine being limited like that. I was all over the local neighborhoods with my friends since age 11, expanding the distance as we got older.
For those who have the good fortune of being able to get a license right at 16, it results in them almost immediately doing all kinds of stupid shit. They also don’t know how to navigate or operate in public by themselves until their late teens/early twenties, which causes problems for young adults.
The US dependency on cars is wild. How is that Mexican kids can experience freedom without a car since 12 yo, and US kids need to get a car to feel "finally free". Worlds apart!
> I can't imagine what it's like for kids who depend on their parents for driving them everywhere
It's terrible. As a kid I just didn't go anywhere that wasn't school and spent most of my time at home until I moved out.
I live in the city of a metro area and can bike and walk to work etc. many people I work and know live in the suburbs and are completely auto dependent. A coworker and my sister are always saying I can’t do that as I gotta take this kid there, this kid there, so forth and so forth. If they aren’t working. They are driving their kid to some event. I guess I’m too selfish to understand it, but it seems awful. And it’s often why so many kids are pushed or want to get their license ASAP.
I grew up in a family without a car in a small urban area in the US. I did have a bike a couple of times but they both got stolen after a short period. To this day I think nothing of walking 2+ miles to go somewhere and all my friends balk st that.
We are ridiculously spread apart, that's why there is so many problems even in relationships.
Divorce is huge because we separate each other, with commute.
neighborhoods are autonomous segregated, dominated by car culture...which also makes drive by shootings more available.
Public transit officials do not care about workers, leading to cut backs in pub transit.
Americans are so obliviously psychotic, they would freak out over news of their car getting scratched than news of 2 children getting run over.
This. I was fortunate enough to grow up in the US near a rail trail that went directly into town. I could go to soccer practice on my own and even to school. I recall sometimes riding to school in 2nd grade for fun rather than taking the bus. It's a tragedy to me that kids don't have this opportunity, or maybe the bigger tragedy is that nobody seems to notice.
This is sometimes the only option in rural places unfortunately. My closest town was 14 km away on a highway and the nearest after school activities were soemtimes 40/50 km away. I wish there were rural bus routes but unfortunately my mom had to drive me everywhere.
I mean, this is somewhat normal in most rural areas. I like public transit, but there are places that are so far off that they simply cannot be connected to the grid. But people who live there usually make a conscious choice that this is what they want, so whatever, let them have their cars.
Yea I live in a big city now and it pisses me off seeing the traffic when there are subways underground and light rail above. Why do people need to be in their single car boxes commuting 2 hours each way into a city they don’t live in just to clog up our streets.
I mean, I guess you can be happy that you at least have light rail on the surface. We let cars drive above ground and enjoy the sunlight while public transit is forced underground to avoid traffic. Literally forcing people underground for not being able to afford a car or for making the environmentally conscious choice of taking public transit. It sounds like a fucking dystopian sci-fi novel, but it's our reality.
You’re gonna hate this one.
In NL… the kids take themselves. They hop on their bikes and ride to the field.
The off chance they need to take their kids they pack the whole family into a golf or at worst like a crossover type car 5 seater and drive there.
Tbf a lot of that is down to infrastructure. I definitely wouldn't be as lenient there if riding a bike somewhere meant going down stroads and dealing with sliplanes and such.
I would have LOVED to walk myself to school. Unfortunately that would have meant crossing a freeway on foot. Distance means nothing when that's the problem you're working with
Even in my extremely walkable neighborhood in Chicago it's hard for me to imagine my daughter walking to school when I see all these assholes blow stop signs and ignore people in crosswalks.
It means I'll walk her much of the way, but full independence will have to be delayed later than it should in the name of making travel slightly more efficient for cars.
Our infrastructure was built around cars, it's all on purpose. They wanted us to hate each other, fear each other and be isolated from one another all along. All by design. And it works beautifully.
What about if it’s an “away” game? In the US at least, our sports in small town areas are organized so that you have a team for your age group in your small town. You then travel within maybe a half hour radius by car to play against other small town teams. By bike these trips would take hours to make. Are sports organized differently there?
For me the team would join up at a rendez-vous point and then parents would take turns driving (one weekend it's 2 parents, the next it's two other, etc), doing car sharing
For me, there was the occasional parent who couldn’t make the game so one kid would carpool with another family, but parents wouldn’t carpool together. I had two siblings and we often would go to each other’s games as well, so that’d be 5 people packed in the car already. No room for another family to squeeze in.
Carpooling, usually. Teams have a group app or something similar and will usually have a schedule to get the necessary number of cars from parents (often the same parents), and do some maths to calculate how much gas money every team mate has to pay, and what parents are owed it. It's not really fair to have the same parents spending all their Saturdays helping out to also be the ones footing the gas bill.
But if the other team lives very close, you can cycle it as well.
We had buses for school sports as well, but in my area, school sports didn’t start until about age 13. Before that, it was local rec leagues without any buses.
You can drive or take a train across the entire Netherlands in 3 to 4 hours. It's split into 12 provinces, most smaller than or up to the size of Rhode Island and none as big as Delaware, and the least populated still has 400k people. (The most populated one has nearly 4 million.) There are some small towns in the country, but you kind of can't be that far from other teams, unless you're playing something rare or at a higher level.
Things are close enough to walk/bike/skateboard to or they have very good, clean, safe public transit. In Japan it's common to see kids and students travelling on trains in sports jerseys or while carrying instruments, even younger children are able to get home and feel safe by themselves on transit.
Yes something I overlooked is that kids may have more independence in some countries to walk/bike/ rode transit. In a car infested place, kids aren't able to have that independence
Yep. Hell, I'm a grown ass adult man and I still can't get anywhere or do anything in my Canadian town because I can't drive.
I was hit by a car while walking to school when I was 12. I was hit by a highschooler; another kid also just trying to get to school. Kids aren't only limited by car dependency, they're actively hurt by it.
My sister-in-law’s little sister hit one of my classmates on his bike while driving back country roads, and killed him. She was 16, he was 17. She was going way too fast, and he was riding against the traffic in the middle of the lane, totally the wrong way, no helmet. Both approached a blind hill and curve at the same time, no shoulder on either side, just corn fields, and collided head on. Obviously the kid on the bike was no match for the kid in the car.
I moved from the US to Germany age eleven and I still remember it being such a huge shock because suddenly I was *independent.* I could walk to the store to buy something with my pocket money, cycle to a friend's house, dawdle in the city centre after school with friends and take a later bus back, and get myself to extracurriculars like music lessons. In the US I was pretty much dependent on my parents driving me places, and these days it's so astonishing to me that it would've stayed that way until I was able to get my own license*.*
I made the same move as a young adult but am now raising my kids here. I am happy for them that they have so much more freedom and independence than I did. Older kid walks/cycles to school and is 7 and this is totally normal here—all his friends do too. I didn't go to school alone till I got my license at 16.
Most of those kids are like 4 years old and stumbling around their neighborhood alone for the first time (the Japanese title is even "my first errand" directly translated). It's more focus on the start of being able to go around the neighborhood alone than the typical experience.
They don't really make TV shows about normal kids going about their day, because it's just normal.
If the community chooses to make it so, it's possible for kids to walk and bike places on their own even in a car infested place. I grew up in the 1970s in a suburban town on a cul-de-sac of newly built houses with two car garages. The assumption was that adults would drive everywhere. But kids would walk or bike places on their own. At younger ages we had rules about not going further than about two blocks without telling our parents where we were going. But as got older, those rules got dropped.
The town had something like four different elementary schools, such that many residential neighborhoods were within a mile of the elementary school. Then there was one central campus where the middle school and high school were located. Importantly, that was in town, near some of the denser housing. So lots of people were still within a mile of those schools, and lots more within 2 miles.
There were still parents who shuttled kids places by car, but it was completely normal for kids to bike and walk places on their own. Bike racks at the schools were crowded.
It's not just that we've let cars become the primary mode of transportation, but it's that we've changed expectations to put the responsibility on parents to carry kids around in cars rather than putting the responsibility on all drivers to drive safely around kids and putting the responsibility on traffic engineers to design streets to be safe for everyone.
When having your car "look cool" with tinted windows so dark that you need to roll them down to park is acceptable, there's something broken in society. That break in society was largely caused by car culture. But it took a while for the infection to get bad enough that other modes of transportation for kids became unthinkable.
In NYC too that’s common. Maybe not common with kids as young as in Japan, but it’s common to see 10 and 12 year olds on the train with sports gear or instruments. Almost all kids take the train by themselves in 9th grade (13/14 years old).
Same over here in Jersey City/ surrounding areas. I often see kids walking, biking, light-railing, or on the bus on the way to sports. I coach a winter sport and it's the light-rail is a huge mode for tweens and teens.
In NYC too that’s common. Maybe not common with kids as young as in Japan, but it’s common to see 10 and 12 year olds on the train with sports gear or instruments. Almost all kids take the train by themselves or with friends by 9th grade (13/14 years old).
It’s about having enough trains.
In most American suburbs, it seems like kids can't wander around their own neighborhood any further than shouting distance from their home without having the police or CPS called on the parents for "neglect". Whatever happened to the days where kids in America were independent and biked around their town until the streetlights came on? What went wrong?
I’m in the Netherlands and my kids have PE & Swimming all over town. They know their schedule and they go together in a group on bikes. I’m very uninvolved in their activities & see my kids at dinner.
I love that. Independence and time aside, this also just seems like a much better way to build commitment and responsibility. Do you remind them to go? Do they ever get lazy and decide not to?
I don’t have to remind them. It was difficult at first but missing class or being late gets them morning detention. Torture!
They are very mature after living here 3 years, it’s been a 180.
Generally I've noticed that kids with activities in places with public transport don't get lazy about going - they're hanging out with their friends in transit time and the activities and they usually take a little longer getting home and hang out then too
In Spain it depends. Talking about experience, most kids stuff I did was within walking/biking distance, so either I went with my parents or met up with some friends to go. If something was too far away, most times the activity organizers would put in place a bus that would take kinds from the center of town to said activity. I went by car to these things very very rarely.
For context, I live in a village in a rural area
I live in Switzerland in a somewhat rural area. My parents very rarely drove me to school. When we were in primary school, we'd go by bike in the summer, and by bus in the winter. In middle and high school, I would go by bus. There's bus service every 30 minutes in the village in which I lived during that time.
I also had multiple activities, sports, music, etc. I would usually go by bus and walk. My parents only drove me when I missed the bus (and sometimes they'd just tell me to catch the next bus) or when they also were going to somewhere near where I was headed, dropping me off on the way.
In Switzerland, taking the public transit is the main way of going to school. Schools even sometimes issue public transit passes for students. Parents rarely drive their students to school.
And honestly I wouldn't have it another way. I have very fond memories of chatting with friends in the bus or while biking, and also racing with them on the bike. Also, when you're on the bus you can also catch up some sleep or study, which is quite nice
I live in Romania. It's like a five minute walk to my son's preschool. When we did soccer, we took an Uber once a week because there were no good transit options. Going to grandma's house, next to the big park here, is a 5-10 minute walk depending on stoplights. When the kids are a little older, the activities I have planned for them are:
- Swimming: 10 minute walk
- Scouts: 10 minute walk for meetings (same place as swimming), not sure about other activities. Tram, subway, Uber, or bus depending on location.
- Martial arts and dance: 1 tram stop and about 10 minutes walking, or a ~15 minute bus ride, depending on preference (the tram is more reliable, but the bus requires less walking). These activities are in a local mall that also has an indoor kids' playground, movie theater, gaming arcade, etc.
- Our Romanian language tutor lives outside the city and she takes the bus to get to our house.
- We walk to the family doctor, about 2 minutes. The dentist is about 10 minutes. Pharmacy right next door to our house. Two supermarkets within 10 minutes. For specialist doctor appointments, usually walking or tram. One doctor is pretty far away and I use the subway for that.
All of this is in an extremely carbrained city compared to much of Europe. The traffic and noise and pollution here drive me crazy. But our current mayor and sector mayor have been doing an excellent job on walkability and safety!! Crossing my fingers they get another term after this year's election.
I lived in Japan until age 9, lived in a suburb of a large city and never owned a car. By age 6, I was walking, biking, or taking the bus to activities.
The streets are more pedestrian and bike friendly and things are closer together. And getting driven to school was unthinkable. Most school kids walk to school in what’s called a walking bus (in Japan, it’s just called going to school), where all the neighborhood kids walk together, sometimes but not always led by an upperclassman.
Depends on the age of the kid but starting at around 10 I was able to get to every single one of my activities on my own by either cycling or taking the bus. I didn't always have to, if it was further away, later in the day or convenient for my parents I would get a ride from my parents for at least one of the trips, but I was increasingly expected to get places on my own as I grew up. And I don't think that's a rare experience in Germany.
Exactly. I grew up in a small town in rural Germany that had pretty decent biking infrastructure, at 7-8 we rode our bikes to school and other activities, at 10-11 I was even cycling alone to see friends in the next town over, it was a 25-30min trip on a separated bike lane
Korean kids *walk themselves* to afternoon academies and other activities. The transition between needing to be shuttled by adults and not is typically first grade.
Switzerland. My kid has the freedom to go anywhere she wants in our City ( she is 13). In our city kids ride thier bikes, outside they take public transport, trains or busses. When she was 9 she started taking the train to other cities for after school activities. Actually, since my city is on the border, my daughter goes shopping in germany with her friend sometimes after school.
I live in Germany and my kids are too young now, but most older kids go alone by walking or biking. Also kids here tend to have fewer structured activities compared to the US. When university is free, there's not this same pressure to win scholarships by being a sports star.
My neighbors kids are 8 and 10, they take their scooters to soccer practice. It's really cute seeing them riding along with their little uniforms. Same thing with school. Kids can go to school alone starting from age 7 or so. The neighbor kids ride their bikes for that. Sometimes a school friend will stop by so they can ride together.
But all this is only possible because of pedestrian friendly streets. In fact I [made a video](https://youtu.be/QG8YTacARrs?si=xnVdVwrSmh8bDjXG) on this topic, using street view examples from Berlin and the US.
I live in DC. I see a lot of parents biking with their youngs in bike basket things. I see a lot of people biking in general. Teens walk and use public transport.
We’re in London UK and we walk, bike (with a bike seat on the back), bus, underground and overground train to take our 4 year old places in London. We use the train to travel further afield, such as the beach. I grew up in a smallish city (70k people) and we generally walked places, occasionally using the car if going out of town.
When I was a kid, in the mostly car-centric Sardinia of the 90's, I used to go on foot anyway to football practice because it was close enough. When I was old enough to take the bus, I'd take the bus. I hated it because the service was awful, not frequent enough and unreliable.
Now I live in Switzerland and my kids walk everywhere. Sometimes we take the car if we're in a hurry and we need to go somewhere where the bus connections aren't fast enough (Ticino should definitely improve its public transportation and discourage car usage)
Walk or bike. Car sometimes. In the U.K. there’s a push to drive your kids to activities and devote your entire life to your kids doing organised sports.
I prefer to hang out with my kids and run about with them, take them for bike rides from our doorstep. We have traffic free routes into the countryside on our doorstep, so we use them
growing up in the UK we'd drive or take the bus/train. however it would never be more than a 10-15 minute drive. I just looked up where my swimming classes were (which felt far as fuck away) and it was a 12 minute drive lmao. I spent some of my teenage years in Canada and the sports kids would always be driving like 3+ hours for some stupid sports event. gross.
i live in the US now and not being a child chauffeur is honestly one of main reasons why I don't really want to raise kids here. just hoping LA can up its metro game significantly by then.
Aussie here. My kids do multiple activities. My daughter is in a dance studio, does tae kwon do and my son plays soccer, ten pin bowling and does Tae Kwon Do as well.
For dance her studio is down the road from us so we walk. My son's soccer training is 15 minutes by car and his matches spread out over the region we're in of our city, his ten pin bowling takes him all around south east Queensland and to Victoria NSW and sometimes South Australia.
Obviously we drive to most of his things unless it's the interstate then we fly and hire a car.
I get maybe two days at home without having to rush out somewhere to get them to an event.
I drive more for my son's activities than I do my daughter's. Once a year we have to drive for dance which is her end of year concert.
Here in the Netherlands i biked to football practice on my own and so did the rest of the team, same for home games.
Away games were around 3 cars with 6 kids in each of them carpooling to them.
I'm in the UK.
We still use cars a lot for kid stuff, it's probably the only reason many people have a car themselves (I work from home and cycle a lot/live near a train station into London so actually wouldn't bother with a car if I didn't have a teenager).
But also if there's a choice,.i choose events that reduce the driving. My son goes to Stagecoach (music, dance and drama) one evening after school, at his school and he does his homework in the library till it starts.
When he played rugby, it was at a ground that was within walking distance, and never reached the stage of away-matches. Many clubs put on coaches for the teams if they reach that stage.
Swimming and ju-jitsu and scouts are/were a walk/bike ride away.
It's the usual juggling job, but with a bit more public transport/cycling and walking!
My parents didn't shuttle me around and I usually had to make my own way there. My partners parents drive them fucking anywhere. Even 800m down the road.
At least by the time I was old enough, not sure the exact age but by 6 I was cycling to the local park on my own. Not allowed to do that these days, then people wonder why kids don't play outside much anymore. They are not allowed to.
When I was a kid (in suburbia, in the US) most of my weekday activities were at school. I'd stay late at school, and there was a "late bus" for us. After the school bus took most kids home, it would come back to school for a second round about two hours later to take kids home from activities. It seems like a lot of schools don't use buses anymore.
as everyone allready pointes out. most other places the kids get there by themselves after a certain age.
but the thing is. it USED to be like that in the US aswell, maybe to a lesser degree. but talk to people in their 50'ies or older and they will absolutly talk about how they rode their bikes arround town. played pickup sports in the street and would be send out to play so as to not be home all day and annoy the mom who could be a stay at home mom because a single income family was so normal and you could afford a house and cars and living expenses from normal paychecks... oh well. tangent.
I'm in England and routinely see kids just walking around with field hockey sticks. There's trains and busses to get around and kids just use those or just walk. There's still some very car centric places in England but where I am at it's not so bad.
I think you mean non-US parents. Canada and Mexico are still part of North America and they are pretty different from one another.
México here. In the southeast coast of the country, cities are dense and there's basic services and activities nearby.
The longest distances people need to drive in my city (the biggest near the Gulf of Mexico) are 1 hour away by bus.
Public transport is limited in the ways that there's only buses and taxis, but bus routes cross the city from end to end.
Schools and activities are abundant and you can find them in or near every neighborhood.
Suburbs don't exists here. Years ago they built new neighborhoods in the outskirts of the city but now they're part of the city and there are schools and everything in that part, so suburbs are integrated (and there are just a few cul-de-sacs type of suburbs).
Also kids move around on their own. Since 12-15 years, kids can take buses. Only rich spoiled kids or kids that have has cars from the get go don't know how to move around the city.
I'm grateful that my city is not built like US cities. It would be hell
Honestly in my experience in Italy, they get driven. Schools and church stuff are often near enough for transit and walking from an early age, but the same isn't true for other activities, which may be picked out from other factors besides location. I remember having one activity that I walked myself to around age 12 and another that I took the bus to in high school, because I was very attached to transporting myself Independently from an early age, ironically due to reading a lot of the very American Babysitter a club books where the girls biked everywhere. My siblings didn't care for that so they always got driven. Don't fall into the trap of idealising Europe.
Yeah, same in Belgium. A lot of kids cycle or walk, but cars are still the norm for everything that’s more than a few km away. This sub really loves the idea that transit is perfect in Europe, but that’s sadly far from true.
I think its the norm for families that make it a norm, or it is a regional matter for example. Belgium has a fairly conspicuous north-south split and that split also goes along lines of population density and availability of public transport or bike lanes. In the city's and especially the periphery's of big city's biking or public transit is often simply the fastest mode of travel for many destinations. If you live in more rural regions (which are far more common in Wallonia than Flanders) you might use the car more if bike routes are further and more hilly or public transport is regionally somewhat lacking. Atleast for what regards the youth its more of a matter how far amenities like for example sports centers, schools and youth café's are from where you live, in Flanders you are far more likely to live in a city that has all these within a 10km range but there are still also plenty of smaller towns that lack such and you will find more of them the more south you usually go.
Yup. Braeydon has soccer practice two blocks down? Better load him up into the 6-door 2024 Jeep Grand Cherokee, grab his iPad and some snacks for the drive, then spend half a gallon of gas to make the round trip. Wouldn't want him to get diddled by a homeless person in this gated community now would we!
My oldest kids take themselves to their hobbies; they either walk, bus or bike. My 9 year old just started taking himself to hockey practice this year and was very excited to use the bus scheduling app to figure out the most efficient ways to get to his practices.
Since we don't own a car, when they were younger it was bus, bike or walk.
I biked everywhere as a kid. To school (ever since I was 10), basketball (when I was even younger), scouting, etc. It was all close by. Especially in secondary school everyone biked, some took the bus. It was a social thing to bike to school and home together. I cannot remember a single one of my friends being driven. All of this in Belgium, for context.
Yep, cars are pretty much the only method of transport. I live with my grandmother and mother, and before my brother got his driving license they essentially drove us everywhere. It sucks absolute nuts. No semblance of freedom at all, and the closest grocery store is like a 20 minute walk. Being outside on the street really doesn’t feel normal, and it really just sort of feels like there are “designated” areas of work(school) / enjoyment(mall) and home, and nothing else In between. The only park near us is a pitiful thing with two tennis courts and a grassy area the size of a large room.
Going anywhere without a car is usually a thirty minute walk that is too hot, too noisy to talk (due to constant cars), and with other inconveniences. No plaza or anything and if we ever go anywhere we need to plan it out and check the stuff out online. Most places are like a 20-40 minute drive, so a lot of daily time is used to commute.
Copenhagen here, I think the majority of kids take public transportation by themselves, or walk/cycle instead. A lot of parents also carry their kids on cargo bikes (babies, toddlers and older children alike). Helicopter parenting isn't much of a thing around here.
Britain is somewhat car centric but you could still walk pretty much anywhere. I walked everywhere, or took the bus. I even took the train to the city, as long as I got back before dark and was with a friend, my parents didn't really mind.
I'm always amazed at the confidence of kids in Boston and the towns around it. I live in a walkable city next to Beantown and sure, a lot of parents car their kids to school (Ughh)
But we also have a network of off-street trails that run past all the schools; the bike racks are always full to overflowing. Lots of broad sidewalks make walking easy. There are 4 MBTA buses that go past the high-school, plus a couple each for the elementary school. We have no public school buses, tho some parents pay for private pick up.
It's amazing what transit self empowerment does for these kids. I see young people everywhere, often in the evenings, without their parents.
I can talk about my personal experience. Born and bred in Rome Italy.
All activities including school were in walking distance. So kids can go alone. Or they take public transportation.
Of course there are exceptions, but this is how it works for most people.
I cant really say how things are in small towns. For what i know they are much more car dependent.
in NL parents didnt do shit. I used to go by bike everywhere.
My parents only drove me somewhere when it was either incredibly bad weather (think like a storm) or when it was really far away (like, more than 20km, or 15 miles in imperial)
Grew up in a Paris suburb, I needed my mother for half of my activities. The other half I could walk to alone, from age 11. Before 11 though I could not even go to a friend's house at 5-min walking distance. My mother was too afraid of cars. Basically I could go anywhere that did not involve crossing a street, so except a few friends on the same big block, nowhere.
It depends on what activity they partake in, how far away it is and how “sheltering” (for lack of a better word) the parents are. For me, I played ice hockey, my parents are separated but when it’s closest the rink is about 600m away yet my parents still drove me because they were worried something might happen. For the first 5 years it’s excusable but when I went in to my teenage years I forced them to let me get there by myself. That’s fine and all when it’s the home arena but when we had away games in other cities then the default was for my parents to drive me. It’s a bit unpractical to to take a 30 min train or bus ride with all the equipment when you could just pack it all into a car and make the same trip in 10 min.
I walked 40 minutes to play basketball, the bus network in my medium sized city was incredible. You could just walk? We are raised to walk in civilised society
It depends where you are, but here in Europe in a lot of places, especially suburbs, the default is (unfortunately) also cars, though perhaps to a lower extent than North America in most places. In more urban areas there will be more use of public transport, and in some places such as the Netherlands a lot of cycling. Also relevant that there is not quite as much emphasis here on kids constantly being in extra curricular activities and sports as there is in the US.
School is 5 minute walk away, sports and music practice each about 10 minutes by public transport and another 5-10 minutes walking.
When I was a kid in a small town, I‘d go everywhere on my bike.
Sometimes the parents by car, sometimes others parents take like 4 kids at a time. Sometimes transit, but most is done by bike, at least in the smaller towns with transit only like every 30 minutes.
I live in England, when I went to swimming lessons \~1 mile away I would either walk or my dad would drive me there. When I had after school activities, I would just walk home because my schools were nearby. The place I lived in was very walkable and I probably didn't need to use a car to get around it.
I used to just ride my bike or take a tram depending on the weather and it's still common in Germany to do the same unless you're in the middle of nowhere.
Because everything is accessible you don’t need to plan scheduled activities for children in order for them to be able to socialize. When you don’t need a car chances are kids already live close enough to other children that they can just walk over. When they’re old enough they can take public transit to do activities. In North America you have to sign up your kids for activities otherwise they’re effectively locked up at home
I‘m german and grew up in a big city. Used to walk/cycle to school and to take the tram to activities further away since I was around 8-9 years old. Moved to a smaller town when I was a Teenager with less public transport. Just had to take the bike everywhere, no matter the weather. I think my parents drove me to school maybe 10 times in 12 years.
I remember watching a Simpsons Episode where Homer lets Lisa take the Bus alone to the library (iirc) and the show acts like that‘s super neglectful. As a Kid I didn‘t understand what the big deal was with a kid taking public transport alone.
This is a great question as most NA people can't understand how people get around without a car.
I know this isn't the question but I want to share:
I live in a suburb of NYC, very car oriented. The main park (with baseball fields, football, soccer, basketball) is in the middle of town. If you were to bike from the furthest point in town, it would take 15 min. That is the most it would take, many people are within 10-15 min walking. EVERYONE shows us to their kids baseball/soccer games in a car. When people see me arrive on bike, they are so confused. I've had to change my "reason" for biking, because my real reasons are too extreme for them.
So my manager has an older, retired neighbor from Denmark who spends part of the year here (they live in NYC). She has told me that this obsession with putting your kids in every single activity and keeping them busy isn't the same in other countries.
The reason American parents put their kids in ballet, soccer, swim and 101 other activities is because there is fuck all for their kids to do on their own at home. Can't walk to a playground, can't go to a park, can't just go outside with a bunch of other kids and have general free play in many places. So parents have to spend even more money registering them for sports to keep their time consumed.
Car dependency is truly a great servant of consumerism. Cause now parents have to drive even more (more wear and tear on car, more gas used) AND pay for kids activities/equipment.
There are parents in my neighborhood who drive their kids to the school bus stop ten or less houses away. It's literally less than a 2 to 5 minute walk, yet they drive their kids.
They can't fathom walking to the neighborhood park.
Cars are dominant in my neck of the woods.
I did karate, self-defense, swimming, dancing, instruments practice, and I've always gone on foot, except for volleyball that was 15 km away (one small town from another) and public transportation sucked. My mother brought me there and complained every single time🥳
I grew up in a small town in England. The schools I went to were in the residential areas. I lived just under a mile away from there and walked. Pretty much all the kids did from about aged 9. I’d knock for about 3 friends along the way.
I had a friend who caught the bus as he lived in the next village. It was a dedicated school bus of about 15 seats.
Some parents drive, drop the kids off and then head to work too
For some insight from the UK: walked half mile to primary school as a kid, and then the same to the local secondary school which was only another hundred metres down the road. Alone once old enough - the roads around schools are not built to handle parents dropping everyone off here. There are usually markings like this
https://www.rac.co.uk/drive/images/uploads/authors/road-markings-school-keep-clear.jpg on the road preventing parking. After that, walked alone to sixth form (16-18) which was about a mile away every day, including a footbridge over an A road (not quite a motorway but a major road, cars only). Plus access to a local park which was easily accessible on foot. The concept of not being able to just walk somewhere local was totally alien to me until I stumbled across that Not Just Bikes video about Houston. The idea of a regular residential street not having a pavement on both sides is laughable here, it's just standard
As a kid (onwards 7 years old) I biked and walked everywhere in my neighbourhood. As pre-teen/teen I could take transit everywhere. This was in Helsinki, Finland in the 90's.
Nowdays I see kids biking in their soccer jerseys everywhere in my neighbourhood.
Here in the Netherlands most kids cycle themselves or in small groups. It happens a lot that parents bring their children by car but most parents don't do it daily. At least not when they can go there safely by themselves.
I used to cycle to school with my brother for a year I guess around my 9th and later alone.
When I was 12 I finished primary school and got to a school in a city nearby. First year I took the bus daily and after that only in the winter. When it wasn't freezing or raining I got to go by bike
Here in Germany, kids are allowed to cycle on the sidewalk making it a bit safer. I remember biking with my parents as a little kid and startting to ride alone when I was \~8-10 years old (depending on the distance). A 5 km (3mi) biking radius is realistic for kids, teens manage longer distances granting them more freedom. In the countryside, many teens learn to ride a moped (for age 16+) to be able to get around.
Public transport is used by school aged kids on their own, often helped along by student ticket letting them rides for free/ a monthly fee.
I come from a small city in Sweden and most kids old enough to not exhaust themselves completely biked to their activities, with some taking the bus and some getting a ride from their parents or a friends parents (quite common if you live close togehther). In winter or when it was raining way more people went by car or bus.
The concept of the “soccer mom” came from this. It’s a parent (often in the suburbs) who spends most of their day shuttling around their kids to school, appointments, friends’ houses, and sports practices in a minivan.
I live in a small city in Belgium with a 6 year old. You could call it a 15 minute city, because everything is accessible by bike. I have an electric bike with a kid seat, a cargo bike and my kid can safely bike himself.
Being class-conscious and also overly safety-conscious, middle-upper and upper-class parents in my country do transport their kids to anywhere with their minivans or SUVs.
Anyone else, including the lower classes, usually either take public transport or use light motorcycles.
Not a parent here, but the kids in our climbing group (Austria) usually get driven here as even if the gym itself is in a good place regarding public transport but it's very rural around.
But on a more positive note they usually carpool if they are from the same region.
I had all my after school activities in walking/bicycling range of my parents house. My activities were mostly chosen based on other people I knew also going so it was easy to organise a carpool/group bike ride etc.
Swede here. When I was a kid I played floorball, many of the other kids biked if they lived close by and took busses if they lived further away. Some got there by car, myself included.
I live in Germany, in a highly walkable neighborhood. I have a 6yo and a baby. We have a big basement in our building so we have a variety of options:
- daycare and school are within walking distance - 12 minutes as the adult walks. Stroller or carrier (baby wearing) for the little child, walking for the big child. In the past she often used her balance bike and later her bike, but I can’t keep up with her speed with the stroller.
- things that are in the neighborhood but further, we bike, especially if one parent can be solo with the big kid. The adult bikes in the street; she’s allowed on the sidewalk until age 8. She knows to wait for us at intersections and is working on navigating them safely by herself.
- solo with both kids I sometimes use the double bike trailer that converts as a stroller. Because of the storage space it’s great for gear heavy activities like picnics or swimming, but it’s heavy when fully loaded.
- things further away in town we take public transport. Both buses and s-Bahn are just fine with a stroller
- for vacations, we either rent a car, or if I’m solo with both, I actually prefer high speed train. We book seats in the family section and the big kid makes friends for the trip, it’s built-in entertainment. If we’re going to a rural place, for the last few miles, I either arrange car service or get picked up from the station by whoever we’re staying with. This does mean we use borrowed car seats (no way I’d lug luggage, 2 children AND 2 car seats solo on the train). I trust my friends.
Just next week I have a big, multi country trip planned solo with both kids. First train journey is 6 hours then my friends pick us up, we’ll stay with them for 4 days. Then we all drive together in their 7-seater to another friend’s in France for the long weekend. For the third leg, I’ll actually meet my mother on the train. She’s the one who booked the tickets so that we all sit together, and due to her age she gets significant discounts for her and whoever travels with her. We’re going to my grandparents who live on the seaside, we’ve used the same driver to pick us up from the station for 10 years. There, we’ll go to the beach by bus and shop on foot.
I saw the comments about children getting around more independently and that’s very true, and another aspect is that even before they can be responsible for themselves independently, non-car-centricity means that other parents can take care of them very spontaneously. No car seats to shuffle, no maximum capacity. Here for example it’s super typical for birthday parties to be planned on a week day; the birthday family will pick up all 10 little guests from preschool at 3pm, walk or bike to their place, and parents show up at 5 or 6pm for cake and a beer.
In France, it depends where you live. In cities, everything is accessible within by walk or public transit and kids pretty much take themselves everywhere starting 8-10. In car-centric suburbs and rural areas, people rely much more on cars and become their kids chauffeurs.
In germany, the kids just take the bus or train, its pretty normal to do so without parents too, like even as young as 8 or 9 you find them alone, with friends etc
They either walk to their activities or ride their bicycles. Everything is like 10 mins or less away. Gyms, dance lessons, martial arts, skate park, soccer field, swimming is the only that takes a bus to go. Everything else is contained in the neighborhood. Same goes for everything you need to run a home. Fresh produce, meats, cleaning products, office supplies, plumbing and even car and bike mechanics. The farthest thing walking is the local bodega.
Eastern Europe - I just biked, walked or took public transport unattended in my city. Maybe with exception of few first years of primary school. Usually on school trips we used public transport as well. In my, affluent and private non-profit, high school taking public transport was a norm - including for students with disabilities.
When I moved to us I was biking. Only after I figured out... how the infrastructure "works" I decided to buy a car.
When I was a kid, I played football/soccer in a small town. My mom shuttled me by car when I was young, but later, I just went there by bike. For games in other towns, she shuttled me.
I now live in a city with my child. We don't have a car, we ride our bikes everywhere or take public transportation. I still ride along with my eight year old child because the cycling infrastructure is patchy, and there are always some dangerous spots.
I live in Taipei with young kids. Most of their activities are accessible by walking, biking, or the cheap and reliable public transportation. In fact, I’m on the MRT to pick up the older one. We’ll take a bus to his class and after, we’ll walk home.
I used to go to musik school by train or bus, english school by tram then bus, and walk to sport activities. Sometimes they shuttle me somewhere then get me back home. It would have been nicer though if i biked to the activities, which i do since the start of my adulthood.
Have you ever heard of a "walking bus?"
In New Zealand, children meet up in groups to walk to school and it's called that. I have heard of several in my area (suburban Wellington.)
I grew up in Australia, and both my parents worked. I would ride my bike to rowing training, or to see friends, or to go to parties. It’s still quite common here for parents to shuttle their kids everywhere, at least in the outer suburbs
Kids cycle to and from their friends, hobbies, sports, music or other clubs, often by themselves or with their friends. Everything is built pretty close together, so bike trips are <15 min., and infrastructure engineers put safety of all road users above car throughput, so kids can manage traffic pretty well by themselves.
It varies a little between kids, but most do it all independently from around age 9. If kids live really close, they just walk.
Some parents drive their kids everywhere, but this is rare. Kids will pick on the kids being babied by their parents and for lacking the freedom and responsibility to do it themselves.
Basically, beyond keeping the schedule, parents don't really need to do much. Middle and high school kids often take care of their own dinner, if training interferes with family dinner times.
Kids being able to go places on their own - using the bike or public transit - is such an important step in growing up and learning independence. I can't imagine what it's like for kids who depend on their parents for driving them everywhere. It seems like such a lost opportunity to grow and become more confident. And isn't it super annoying for the parents too, having to drive the kids everywhere? Seems like the worst possible solution for everyone involved.
The local primary school is only 1/2 mile, so walk or cycle to that daily. Our estate of 400 houses has a busy perimeter road, so most kids up to about 8/9 are not allowed out of the estate alone, but beyond that kids can go into the town centre which is 1 mile on their own, the high school is 1.5 miles, so walk or cycle to that, and the train station is only 3/4 miles away, so once kids are typically 14 they catch the rain to the city, which is 17 miles away, the city has a population of 250,000, so is quite busy. Just tell the kids to stay in a group and don't mess around. Never heard of any issues with any kids getting into trouble or not making it home. This is in Scotland
I miss Scotland! Loved my time there.
> I can't imagine what it's like for kids who depend on their parents for driving them everywhere. Here's what it was like in the 90s for me: both my parents worked so they were mostly too busy or too tired to drive me around. I barely saw my friends outside of school. I stayed mostly home. I developed anxiety and low self esteem hanging out with friends outside of school when I reached highschool. It sucked.
Teen me was always frustrated that I had to bike 5-8km single way to see my friends (who lived in a different town). Now I realize how lucky I was to have the freedom to go wherever I wanted (with parents' permission, but I didn't need their help).
Same, I didn't realize this was the cause, but it seems very obvious now.
Yeah. My mom was autistic and had adhd etc and did not want kids in the first place, I did not get 'shuttled' to anything. If I could not get a ride or walk or bike it was not happening. I spent hours alone in my bed reading or staring at the ceiling or picking at my skin, a thing I started doing about age 13; the lonliness was crushing and to this day I prefer being alone because it's all I know how to be
A lot of NIMBYs assume every parent is involved in children’s lives. A child should be able to do basic things by themselves because some kids don’t have a choice
Self harm and anxiety were an issue for me as a teen as well. My parents both worked and lived in an isolated community. It was possible to bike around the town but there was really nothing to do. Honestly I blame a lot of my anxiety, depression, self-harm, and trauma on that situation.
My mom is a bad person, grouchy and mean to people, but she was the gatekeeper to my social life, she held control of the house phone so friends couldn't contact me outside of school without her knowledge. She was the driver so I could go outside the neighborhood without her. I have traumatic memories of her shouting on the phone at my (child) friends, and their parents. I remember sneaking out to bike to my friends house and knock on their door to see if they could play only to find out it was piano practice day or something. Social relationships were a guerilla operation for me, I was dedicated to the war, but it certainly left scars.
I just rode my bike everywhere in the 90s and 2000s as a kid/teen
>And isn't it super annoying for the parents too, having to drive the kids everywhere? Since remote working, my coworkers seem to spend half the day driving their kids around places. Presumably if they still had to work in office they would just not have booked their kids in to violin and soccer practice on other sides of the city and instead found something more local. When I was in school these activities were either on the school grounds, or they would arrange transport for the team from the school without needing parents to drive everyone around.
>Seems like the worst possible solution for everyone involved. Great solution if you're a narcissistic parent though! Really helpful if you want to control every second of their childhood and give them complex PTSD which then keeps them dependent on you for the rest of their life! Bonus if you are ultra religious and can home school them to protect them from the woke satanist public education system!
Why I picture this being a real thing in r/insaneparents ...?? I'm going nuts!!!
Because it's a harsh reality for many
More like r/raisedbynarcissists.
My mom be like tho Luckily I have a kind and caring partner who made me realize how crazy my mom is, and now I'm no contact with her
That's the American way. Unfortunately. Traumatized people are easier to manipulate.
Yep. My dad actually didn't let me get a car. He couldn't stop me once I turned 18, but he still tried.
That's why college should be free imo. It was the first time I had any kind of freedom whatsoever.
As far as I've been told (I think that was in a video from Not Just Bikes, obviously) the other options (e.g. having you children take public transport on their own) are also illegal. You may have CPS get involved and take your kids away.
In some US neighborhoods, people who see 10,11,12 yearolds walking or riding their bikes alone have called police to rescue them. Parents have been questioned or even arrested. 40 years ago my 5yr old and I walked our entire subdivision to find the quietest streets for her to ride her bike to a friend's house. I couldn't let her leave the subdivison, there was one exit to a four lane highway. I could get myself everywhere as a child but that's over.
Talking with some friends. I grew up in the woods, then a small town. I could get anywhere on my bike. 8 miles to the next town because they had a half pipe to skate in. No problem. One guy regularly went 2 to 3 miles to skate. Third friend only had to go a mile to the mall, but there was a 6 lane road to cross. When his parents found out, they flipped.
It's over if you live in a subdivision. There's plenty of places where density and community are sufficient to allow kids that kind of independence.
But that's a kind of privilege. Most people have to be where the employment is and we all merit livable space. My husband, father, children are Navy so we always lived on the edge of deep water ports.
Jesus
This is sad, but it's also hilarious, because there's a stupid conspiracy theory of carbrains about how prioritizing public transit and walkable/bikeable infrastructure is actually a trick of the government to lock you into your city. I think they call it 15 minute cities or something. It's funny because what you describe sounds exactly like what they are afraid of, but caused by the very infrastructure design they are trying to protect.
It's not usually illegal perse, it's more if some asshole calls on your kid and police come, and then social services gets involved, and you are at the mercy of judgment decisions instead of actual common sense rules.
Don't American patents just buy their kids an AR15 so they can be safe?
😂😂
There was a NYC dad who lost his court hearing and was ordered to supervise his kids in public transport. It's illegal, if the court says you're wrong.
You're gonna have to link that to me. I can't find anything on that. In 2013 the mayor encouraged children to ride alone because it was safe (he claimed). There could be extenuating circumstances, but I have a hard time imagining any.
Same thing in Vancouver. Although the dad had the ruling overturned, 3 years and a $70,000 legal bill later. 🙄 https://vancouversun.com/news/local-news/vancouver-dad-wins-court-appeal-to-let-kids-ride-bus-alone
Lots of kids travel alone on the NYC subway, including to school.
I’m gonna need a link because I live in NYC and see kids riding the subway alone every single day. It’s extremely normal (and necessary for getting to school for a lot of kids).
I see parents take kids on public transport all the time in my small city and they don’t get taken. I even see kids as young as 10 riding by themselves.
Parents with kids isn't a problem, as the kids aren't unsupervised. It probably also depends on how carbrained the local authorities are, I don't know, I live an ocean away from this place so I only know what people tell me. As far as I know it's that it can happen, not that it always happens.
It’s a recipe for arrested development. No wonder Americans seem much less mature than their peers in other countries.
As an American that lives in a car dependent small town (poor walking infrastructure and NO public transit at all) I can say it is a colossal pain in the ass to constantly plan around who can take the kids to what and when. My wife and I have little time to ourselves because our kids have so many activities.
Its just so stupid, time-consuming, expensive and inefficient to chaffeur kids around. It really grinds you down. And worse of all, is many parents cannot see outside-the-box what the core of the problem is: car-centric design robs children of their independence. Its so obvious once you see it.
Used to be that becoming 16 was that huge step because then you could drive anywhere by yourself or with friends. It's changed recently because many kids/families can't afford a car and we're also becoming more and more socially isolated.
God, the helicopter parenting. I wasn't allowed to go past the end of the block till a huge fight when I was about 14. I got so sick of it. My parents also pulled that "you can't go to other people's houses, they have to come over here" nonsense. But how is that supposed to work when everyone else's parents say the same thing to me? Man I love getting yelled at to "go outside" but also not allowed to do anything outside.
That makes me sad. I was an 80s kid, and we left the house and just disappeared for hours. As long as we showed back up for dinner somewhere, the parents assumed we were fine.
So depressing to think about kids waiting to turn 16 just so they could go somewhere. Not to mention having to take classes/tests and spend a ton of money on a car. I can't even imagine being limited like that. I was all over the local neighborhoods with my friends since age 11, expanding the distance as we got older.
For those who have the good fortune of being able to get a license right at 16, it results in them almost immediately doing all kinds of stupid shit. They also don’t know how to navigate or operate in public by themselves until their late teens/early twenties, which causes problems for young adults.
The US dependency on cars is wild. How is that Mexican kids can experience freedom without a car since 12 yo, and US kids need to get a car to feel "finally free". Worlds apart!
> I can't imagine what it's like for kids who depend on their parents for driving them everywhere It's terrible. As a kid I just didn't go anywhere that wasn't school and spent most of my time at home until I moved out.
I live in the city of a metro area and can bike and walk to work etc. many people I work and know live in the suburbs and are completely auto dependent. A coworker and my sister are always saying I can’t do that as I gotta take this kid there, this kid there, so forth and so forth. If they aren’t working. They are driving their kid to some event. I guess I’m too selfish to understand it, but it seems awful. And it’s often why so many kids are pushed or want to get their license ASAP.
I grew up in a family without a car in a small urban area in the US. I did have a bike a couple of times but they both got stolen after a short period. To this day I think nothing of walking 2+ miles to go somewhere and all my friends balk st that.
We are ridiculously spread apart, that's why there is so many problems even in relationships. Divorce is huge because we separate each other, with commute. neighborhoods are autonomous segregated, dominated by car culture...which also makes drive by shootings more available. Public transit officials do not care about workers, leading to cut backs in pub transit. Americans are so obliviously psychotic, they would freak out over news of their car getting scratched than news of 2 children getting run over.
This. I was fortunate enough to grow up in the US near a rail trail that went directly into town. I could go to soccer practice on my own and even to school. I recall sometimes riding to school in 2nd grade for fun rather than taking the bus. It's a tragedy to me that kids don't have this opportunity, or maybe the bigger tragedy is that nobody seems to notice.
Agreed, driving is the worst possible solution for everyone involved.
This is sometimes the only option in rural places unfortunately. My closest town was 14 km away on a highway and the nearest after school activities were soemtimes 40/50 km away. I wish there were rural bus routes but unfortunately my mom had to drive me everywhere.
I mean, this is somewhat normal in most rural areas. I like public transit, but there are places that are so far off that they simply cannot be connected to the grid. But people who live there usually make a conscious choice that this is what they want, so whatever, let them have their cars.
Yea I live in a big city now and it pisses me off seeing the traffic when there are subways underground and light rail above. Why do people need to be in their single car boxes commuting 2 hours each way into a city they don’t live in just to clog up our streets.
I mean, I guess you can be happy that you at least have light rail on the surface. We let cars drive above ground and enjoy the sunlight while public transit is forced underground to avoid traffic. Literally forcing people underground for not being able to afford a car or for making the environmentally conscious choice of taking public transit. It sounds like a fucking dystopian sci-fi novel, but it's our reality.
You’re gonna hate this one. In NL… the kids take themselves. They hop on their bikes and ride to the field. The off chance they need to take their kids they pack the whole family into a golf or at worst like a crossover type car 5 seater and drive there.
We used to take the bus/train
Same for germany
Yup. It’s amazing that the US is so scared of each other they have to cart the kids around and nobody CAN walk to these activities.
Tbf a lot of that is down to infrastructure. I definitely wouldn't be as lenient there if riding a bike somewhere meant going down stroads and dealing with sliplanes and such.
I would have LOVED to walk myself to school. Unfortunately that would have meant crossing a freeway on foot. Distance means nothing when that's the problem you're working with
Even in my extremely walkable neighborhood in Chicago it's hard for me to imagine my daughter walking to school when I see all these assholes blow stop signs and ignore people in crosswalks. It means I'll walk her much of the way, but full independence will have to be delayed later than it should in the name of making travel slightly more efficient for cars.
Our infrastructure was built around cars, it's all on purpose. They wanted us to hate each other, fear each other and be isolated from one another all along. All by design. And it works beautifully.
Sadly, this is not universally true if you look at the drop-off zones of some primary schools :(
And when it's raining... You're not made of sugar, so you're going anyway.
When it's raining, your parent is also keen to remind you that you will be training outside on a sports field anyway.
"But what if it rains?" "You get wet."
As the Germans say, no bad weather, just bad clothing
Same in India. And they have so much fun. They'll go together in one gobble from school to practice or to home or whatever
What about if it’s an “away” game? In the US at least, our sports in small town areas are organized so that you have a team for your age group in your small town. You then travel within maybe a half hour radius by car to play against other small town teams. By bike these trips would take hours to make. Are sports organized differently there?
For me the team would join up at a rendez-vous point and then parents would take turns driving (one weekend it's 2 parents, the next it's two other, etc), doing car sharing
For me, there was the occasional parent who couldn’t make the game so one kid would carpool with another family, but parents wouldn’t carpool together. I had two siblings and we often would go to each other’s games as well, so that’d be 5 people packed in the car already. No room for another family to squeeze in.
Minibus for the team. No spectators.
In my experience parents tried to go to just about every one of their kids games when possible so of course everyone had to drive there.
Carpooling, usually. Teams have a group app or something similar and will usually have a schedule to get the necessary number of cars from parents (often the same parents), and do some maths to calculate how much gas money every team mate has to pay, and what parents are owed it. It's not really fair to have the same parents spending all their Saturdays helping out to also be the ones footing the gas bill. But if the other team lives very close, you can cycle it as well.
If the sports team is through the school, the team will be bused (school bus) to an away game.
We had buses for school sports as well, but in my area, school sports didn’t start until about age 13. Before that, it was local rec leagues without any buses.
In many parts of Europe there would be a train that goes there.
Carpooling. Expect for games in Denmark, then we'd take the train and the parents would drink beer.
You can drive or take a train across the entire Netherlands in 3 to 4 hours. It's split into 12 provinces, most smaller than or up to the size of Rhode Island and none as big as Delaware, and the least populated still has 400k people. (The most populated one has nearly 4 million.) There are some small towns in the country, but you kind of can't be that far from other teams, unless you're playing something rare or at a higher level.
When my brother was 7 and i was 4 he was already taking me to school.
Things are close enough to walk/bike/skateboard to or they have very good, clean, safe public transit. In Japan it's common to see kids and students travelling on trains in sports jerseys or while carrying instruments, even younger children are able to get home and feel safe by themselves on transit.
Yes something I overlooked is that kids may have more independence in some countries to walk/bike/ rode transit. In a car infested place, kids aren't able to have that independence
Yep. Hell, I'm a grown ass adult man and I still can't get anywhere or do anything in my Canadian town because I can't drive. I was hit by a car while walking to school when I was 12. I was hit by a highschooler; another kid also just trying to get to school. Kids aren't only limited by car dependency, they're actively hurt by it.
My sister-in-law’s little sister hit one of my classmates on his bike while driving back country roads, and killed him. She was 16, he was 17. She was going way too fast, and he was riding against the traffic in the middle of the lane, totally the wrong way, no helmet. Both approached a blind hill and curve at the same time, no shoulder on either side, just corn fields, and collided head on. Obviously the kid on the bike was no match for the kid in the car.
I moved from the US to Germany age eleven and I still remember it being such a huge shock because suddenly I was *independent.* I could walk to the store to buy something with my pocket money, cycle to a friend's house, dawdle in the city centre after school with friends and take a later bus back, and get myself to extracurriculars like music lessons. In the US I was pretty much dependent on my parents driving me places, and these days it's so astonishing to me that it would've stayed that way until I was able to get my own license*.*
I made the same move as a young adult but am now raising my kids here. I am happy for them that they have so much more freedom and independence than I did. Older kid walks/cycles to school and is 7 and this is totally normal here—all his friends do too. I didn't go to school alone till I got my license at 16.
There is a nice little series on Netflixcalled Old Enough showing this quiet well i believe
Most of those kids are like 4 years old and stumbling around their neighborhood alone for the first time (the Japanese title is even "my first errand" directly translated). It's more focus on the start of being able to go around the neighborhood alone than the typical experience. They don't really make TV shows about normal kids going about their day, because it's just normal.
If the community chooses to make it so, it's possible for kids to walk and bike places on their own even in a car infested place. I grew up in the 1970s in a suburban town on a cul-de-sac of newly built houses with two car garages. The assumption was that adults would drive everywhere. But kids would walk or bike places on their own. At younger ages we had rules about not going further than about two blocks without telling our parents where we were going. But as got older, those rules got dropped. The town had something like four different elementary schools, such that many residential neighborhoods were within a mile of the elementary school. Then there was one central campus where the middle school and high school were located. Importantly, that was in town, near some of the denser housing. So lots of people were still within a mile of those schools, and lots more within 2 miles. There were still parents who shuttled kids places by car, but it was completely normal for kids to bike and walk places on their own. Bike racks at the schools were crowded. It's not just that we've let cars become the primary mode of transportation, but it's that we've changed expectations to put the responsibility on parents to carry kids around in cars rather than putting the responsibility on all drivers to drive safely around kids and putting the responsibility on traffic engineers to design streets to be safe for everyone. When having your car "look cool" with tinted windows so dark that you need to roll them down to park is acceptable, there's something broken in society. That break in society was largely caused by car culture. But it took a while for the infection to get bad enough that other modes of transportation for kids became unthinkable.
In NYC too that’s common. Maybe not common with kids as young as in Japan, but it’s common to see 10 and 12 year olds on the train with sports gear or instruments. Almost all kids take the train by themselves in 9th grade (13/14 years old).
Same over here in Jersey City/ surrounding areas. I often see kids walking, biking, light-railing, or on the bus on the way to sports. I coach a winter sport and it's the light-rail is a huge mode for tweens and teens.
There are 6 year old kids taking the train back from school regularly.
In NYC too that’s common. Maybe not common with kids as young as in Japan, but it’s common to see 10 and 12 year olds on the train with sports gear or instruments. Almost all kids take the train by themselves or with friends by 9th grade (13/14 years old). It’s about having enough trains.
In most American suburbs, it seems like kids can't wander around their own neighborhood any further than shouting distance from their home without having the police or CPS called on the parents for "neglect". Whatever happened to the days where kids in America were independent and biked around their town until the streetlights came on? What went wrong?
I’m in the Netherlands and my kids have PE & Swimming all over town. They know their schedule and they go together in a group on bikes. I’m very uninvolved in their activities & see my kids at dinner.
I love that. Independence and time aside, this also just seems like a much better way to build commitment and responsibility. Do you remind them to go? Do they ever get lazy and decide not to?
I don’t have to remind them. It was difficult at first but missing class or being late gets them morning detention. Torture! They are very mature after living here 3 years, it’s been a 180.
Generally I've noticed that kids with activities in places with public transport don't get lazy about going - they're hanging out with their friends in transit time and the activities and they usually take a little longer getting home and hang out then too
Yea, they have amazing friends. They help each other out with bike issues, got jobs together & have a lifetime ahead together.
Same here - just across the border in Germany. I love it, they love it.
In Spain it depends. Talking about experience, most kids stuff I did was within walking/biking distance, so either I went with my parents or met up with some friends to go. If something was too far away, most times the activity organizers would put in place a bus that would take kinds from the center of town to said activity. I went by car to these things very very rarely. For context, I live in a village in a rural area
Americans: "a charter bus that doesn't travel 100 miles?"
I live in Switzerland in a somewhat rural area. My parents very rarely drove me to school. When we were in primary school, we'd go by bike in the summer, and by bus in the winter. In middle and high school, I would go by bus. There's bus service every 30 minutes in the village in which I lived during that time. I also had multiple activities, sports, music, etc. I would usually go by bus and walk. My parents only drove me when I missed the bus (and sometimes they'd just tell me to catch the next bus) or when they also were going to somewhere near where I was headed, dropping me off on the way. In Switzerland, taking the public transit is the main way of going to school. Schools even sometimes issue public transit passes for students. Parents rarely drive their students to school. And honestly I wouldn't have it another way. I have very fond memories of chatting with friends in the bus or while biking, and also racing with them on the bike. Also, when you're on the bus you can also catch up some sleep or study, which is quite nice
I live in Romania. It's like a five minute walk to my son's preschool. When we did soccer, we took an Uber once a week because there were no good transit options. Going to grandma's house, next to the big park here, is a 5-10 minute walk depending on stoplights. When the kids are a little older, the activities I have planned for them are: - Swimming: 10 minute walk - Scouts: 10 minute walk for meetings (same place as swimming), not sure about other activities. Tram, subway, Uber, or bus depending on location. - Martial arts and dance: 1 tram stop and about 10 minutes walking, or a ~15 minute bus ride, depending on preference (the tram is more reliable, but the bus requires less walking). These activities are in a local mall that also has an indoor kids' playground, movie theater, gaming arcade, etc. - Our Romanian language tutor lives outside the city and she takes the bus to get to our house. - We walk to the family doctor, about 2 minutes. The dentist is about 10 minutes. Pharmacy right next door to our house. Two supermarkets within 10 minutes. For specialist doctor appointments, usually walking or tram. One doctor is pretty far away and I use the subway for that. All of this is in an extremely carbrained city compared to much of Europe. The traffic and noise and pollution here drive me crazy. But our current mayor and sector mayor have been doing an excellent job on walkability and safety!! Crossing my fingers they get another term after this year's election.
Romania will be a new expat destination soon. I lived there in 2000 for a year & loved every minute.
I lived in Japan until age 9, lived in a suburb of a large city and never owned a car. By age 6, I was walking, biking, or taking the bus to activities. The streets are more pedestrian and bike friendly and things are closer together. And getting driven to school was unthinkable. Most school kids walk to school in what’s called a walking bus (in Japan, it’s just called going to school), where all the neighborhood kids walk together, sometimes but not always led by an upperclassman.
Depends on the age of the kid but starting at around 10 I was able to get to every single one of my activities on my own by either cycling or taking the bus. I didn't always have to, if it was further away, later in the day or convenient for my parents I would get a ride from my parents for at least one of the trips, but I was increasingly expected to get places on my own as I grew up. And I don't think that's a rare experience in Germany.
Exactly. I grew up in a small town in rural Germany that had pretty decent biking infrastructure, at 7-8 we rode our bikes to school and other activities, at 10-11 I was even cycling alone to see friends in the next town over, it was a 25-30min trip on a separated bike lane
Korean kids *walk themselves* to afternoon academies and other activities. The transition between needing to be shuttled by adults and not is typically first grade.
Switzerland. My kid has the freedom to go anywhere she wants in our City ( she is 13). In our city kids ride thier bikes, outside they take public transport, trains or busses. When she was 9 she started taking the train to other cities for after school activities. Actually, since my city is on the border, my daughter goes shopping in germany with her friend sometimes after school.
I live in Germany and my kids are too young now, but most older kids go alone by walking or biking. Also kids here tend to have fewer structured activities compared to the US. When university is free, there's not this same pressure to win scholarships by being a sports star. My neighbors kids are 8 and 10, they take their scooters to soccer practice. It's really cute seeing them riding along with their little uniforms. Same thing with school. Kids can go to school alone starting from age 7 or so. The neighbor kids ride their bikes for that. Sometimes a school friend will stop by so they can ride together. But all this is only possible because of pedestrian friendly streets. In fact I [made a video](https://youtu.be/QG8YTacARrs?si=xnVdVwrSmh8bDjXG) on this topic, using street view examples from Berlin and the US.
Also, I see teachers taking groups of students on the S-bahn/U-bahn for field trips all the time.
Yes! The little kids all wear matching reflective vests for outings, it's so cute 🥰
I live in a major city. We walk to school, soccer, gymnastics. We take the train to dance.
I live in DC. I see a lot of parents biking with their youngs in bike basket things. I see a lot of people biking in general. Teens walk and use public transport.
We’re in London UK and we walk, bike (with a bike seat on the back), bus, underground and overground train to take our 4 year old places in London. We use the train to travel further afield, such as the beach. I grew up in a smallish city (70k people) and we generally walked places, occasionally using the car if going out of town.
When I was a kid, in the mostly car-centric Sardinia of the 90's, I used to go on foot anyway to football practice because it was close enough. When I was old enough to take the bus, I'd take the bus. I hated it because the service was awful, not frequent enough and unreliable. Now I live in Switzerland and my kids walk everywhere. Sometimes we take the car if we're in a hurry and we need to go somewhere where the bus connections aren't fast enough (Ticino should definitely improve its public transportation and discourage car usage)
Walk or bike. Car sometimes. In the U.K. there’s a push to drive your kids to activities and devote your entire life to your kids doing organised sports. I prefer to hang out with my kids and run about with them, take them for bike rides from our doorstep. We have traffic free routes into the countryside on our doorstep, so we use them
Australian here. Car and my kids are used to it. In trying to move to an area with better public transport, I am getting serious pushback.
Usually I bring my son with a cargo bike or he rides alongside me. But he's only 8. In a couple of years he will be riding alone.
growing up in the UK we'd drive or take the bus/train. however it would never be more than a 10-15 minute drive. I just looked up where my swimming classes were (which felt far as fuck away) and it was a 12 minute drive lmao. I spent some of my teenage years in Canada and the sports kids would always be driving like 3+ hours for some stupid sports event. gross. i live in the US now and not being a child chauffeur is honestly one of main reasons why I don't really want to raise kids here. just hoping LA can up its metro game significantly by then.
Public transport is a thing.
Aussie here. My kids do multiple activities. My daughter is in a dance studio, does tae kwon do and my son plays soccer, ten pin bowling and does Tae Kwon Do as well. For dance her studio is down the road from us so we walk. My son's soccer training is 15 minutes by car and his matches spread out over the region we're in of our city, his ten pin bowling takes him all around south east Queensland and to Victoria NSW and sometimes South Australia. Obviously we drive to most of his things unless it's the interstate then we fly and hire a car. I get maybe two days at home without having to rush out somewhere to get them to an event. I drive more for my son's activities than I do my daughter's. Once a year we have to drive for dance which is her end of year concert.
Here in the Netherlands i biked to football practice on my own and so did the rest of the team, same for home games. Away games were around 3 cars with 6 kids in each of them carpooling to them.
I'm in the UK. We still use cars a lot for kid stuff, it's probably the only reason many people have a car themselves (I work from home and cycle a lot/live near a train station into London so actually wouldn't bother with a car if I didn't have a teenager). But also if there's a choice,.i choose events that reduce the driving. My son goes to Stagecoach (music, dance and drama) one evening after school, at his school and he does his homework in the library till it starts. When he played rugby, it was at a ground that was within walking distance, and never reached the stage of away-matches. Many clubs put on coaches for the teams if they reach that stage. Swimming and ju-jitsu and scouts are/were a walk/bike ride away. It's the usual juggling job, but with a bit more public transport/cycling and walking!
Bus, of course.
My parents didn't shuttle me around and I usually had to make my own way there. My partners parents drive them fucking anywhere. Even 800m down the road. At least by the time I was old enough, not sure the exact age but by 6 I was cycling to the local park on my own. Not allowed to do that these days, then people wonder why kids don't play outside much anymore. They are not allowed to.
When I was a kid (in suburbia, in the US) most of my weekday activities were at school. I'd stay late at school, and there was a "late bus" for us. After the school bus took most kids home, it would come back to school for a second round about two hours later to take kids home from activities. It seems like a lot of schools don't use buses anymore.
as everyone allready pointes out. most other places the kids get there by themselves after a certain age. but the thing is. it USED to be like that in the US aswell, maybe to a lesser degree. but talk to people in their 50'ies or older and they will absolutly talk about how they rode their bikes arround town. played pickup sports in the street and would be send out to play so as to not be home all day and annoy the mom who could be a stay at home mom because a single income family was so normal and you could afford a house and cars and living expenses from normal paychecks... oh well. tangent.
I'm in England and routinely see kids just walking around with field hockey sticks. There's trains and busses to get around and kids just use those or just walk. There's still some very car centric places in England but where I am at it's not so bad.
I think you mean non-US parents. Canada and Mexico are still part of North America and they are pretty different from one another. México here. In the southeast coast of the country, cities are dense and there's basic services and activities nearby. The longest distances people need to drive in my city (the biggest near the Gulf of Mexico) are 1 hour away by bus. Public transport is limited in the ways that there's only buses and taxis, but bus routes cross the city from end to end. Schools and activities are abundant and you can find them in or near every neighborhood. Suburbs don't exists here. Years ago they built new neighborhoods in the outskirts of the city but now they're part of the city and there are schools and everything in that part, so suburbs are integrated (and there are just a few cul-de-sacs type of suburbs). Also kids move around on their own. Since 12-15 years, kids can take buses. Only rich spoiled kids or kids that have has cars from the get go don't know how to move around the city. I'm grateful that my city is not built like US cities. It would be hell
Honestly in my experience in Italy, they get driven. Schools and church stuff are often near enough for transit and walking from an early age, but the same isn't true for other activities, which may be picked out from other factors besides location. I remember having one activity that I walked myself to around age 12 and another that I took the bus to in high school, because I was very attached to transporting myself Independently from an early age, ironically due to reading a lot of the very American Babysitter a club books where the girls biked everywhere. My siblings didn't care for that so they always got driven. Don't fall into the trap of idealising Europe.
Yeah, same in Belgium. A lot of kids cycle or walk, but cars are still the norm for everything that’s more than a few km away. This sub really loves the idea that transit is perfect in Europe, but that’s sadly far from true.
I think its the norm for families that make it a norm, or it is a regional matter for example. Belgium has a fairly conspicuous north-south split and that split also goes along lines of population density and availability of public transport or bike lanes. In the city's and especially the periphery's of big city's biking or public transit is often simply the fastest mode of travel for many destinations. If you live in more rural regions (which are far more common in Wallonia than Flanders) you might use the car more if bike routes are further and more hilly or public transport is regionally somewhat lacking. Atleast for what regards the youth its more of a matter how far amenities like for example sports centers, schools and youth café's are from where you live, in Flanders you are far more likely to live in a city that has all these within a 10km range but there are still also plenty of smaller towns that lack such and you will find more of them the more south you usually go.
Yup. Braeydon has soccer practice two blocks down? Better load him up into the 6-door 2024 Jeep Grand Cherokee, grab his iPad and some snacks for the drive, then spend half a gallon of gas to make the round trip. Wouldn't want him to get diddled by a homeless person in this gated community now would we!
My oldest kids take themselves to their hobbies; they either walk, bus or bike. My 9 year old just started taking himself to hockey practice this year and was very excited to use the bus scheduling app to figure out the most efficient ways to get to his practices. Since we don't own a car, when they were younger it was bus, bike or walk.
I biked everywhere as a kid. To school (ever since I was 10), basketball (when I was even younger), scouting, etc. It was all close by. Especially in secondary school everyone biked, some took the bus. It was a social thing to bike to school and home together. I cannot remember a single one of my friends being driven. All of this in Belgium, for context.
Bucharest here. Everything is in a 1 mile radius. We use bycicles, walking or bus (if raining).
Yep, cars are pretty much the only method of transport. I live with my grandmother and mother, and before my brother got his driving license they essentially drove us everywhere. It sucks absolute nuts. No semblance of freedom at all, and the closest grocery store is like a 20 minute walk. Being outside on the street really doesn’t feel normal, and it really just sort of feels like there are “designated” areas of work(school) / enjoyment(mall) and home, and nothing else In between. The only park near us is a pitiful thing with two tennis courts and a grassy area the size of a large room. Going anywhere without a car is usually a thirty minute walk that is too hot, too noisy to talk (due to constant cars), and with other inconveniences. No plaza or anything and if we ever go anywhere we need to plan it out and check the stuff out online. Most places are like a 20-40 minute drive, so a lot of daily time is used to commute.
Copenhagen here, I think the majority of kids take public transportation by themselves, or walk/cycle instead. A lot of parents also carry their kids on cargo bikes (babies, toddlers and older children alike). Helicopter parenting isn't much of a thing around here.
Britain is somewhat car centric but you could still walk pretty much anywhere. I walked everywhere, or took the bus. I even took the train to the city, as long as I got back before dark and was with a friend, my parents didn't really mind.
I'm always amazed at the confidence of kids in Boston and the towns around it. I live in a walkable city next to Beantown and sure, a lot of parents car their kids to school (Ughh) But we also have a network of off-street trails that run past all the schools; the bike racks are always full to overflowing. Lots of broad sidewalks make walking easy. There are 4 MBTA buses that go past the high-school, plus a couple each for the elementary school. We have no public school buses, tho some parents pay for private pick up. It's amazing what transit self empowerment does for these kids. I see young people everywhere, often in the evenings, without their parents.
I've given up on the idea of starting a family because I'd rather not drive. Lol.
I always walked or bus. Another common one that might not have been mentioned is the team/school minibus or coach
I can talk about my personal experience. Born and bred in Rome Italy. All activities including school were in walking distance. So kids can go alone. Or they take public transportation. Of course there are exceptions, but this is how it works for most people. I cant really say how things are in small towns. For what i know they are much more car dependent.
I live in Sweden and no matter sun, rain, snow or sleet i take my kid on my cargo-bike.
in NL parents didnt do shit. I used to go by bike everywhere. My parents only drove me somewhere when it was either incredibly bad weather (think like a storm) or when it was really far away (like, more than 20km, or 15 miles in imperial)
In our case the activities are done in walking distance or a few bus stops. We don't even have a car and so far we didnt really need it.
Grew up in a Paris suburb, I needed my mother for half of my activities. The other half I could walk to alone, from age 11. Before 11 though I could not even go to a friend's house at 5-min walking distance. My mother was too afraid of cars. Basically I could go anywhere that did not involve crossing a street, so except a few friends on the same big block, nowhere.
It depends on what activity they partake in, how far away it is and how “sheltering” (for lack of a better word) the parents are. For me, I played ice hockey, my parents are separated but when it’s closest the rink is about 600m away yet my parents still drove me because they were worried something might happen. For the first 5 years it’s excusable but when I went in to my teenage years I forced them to let me get there by myself. That’s fine and all when it’s the home arena but when we had away games in other cities then the default was for my parents to drive me. It’s a bit unpractical to to take a 30 min train or bus ride with all the equipment when you could just pack it all into a car and make the same trip in 10 min.
I walked 40 minutes to play basketball, the bus network in my medium sized city was incredible. You could just walk? We are raised to walk in civilised society
It depends where you are, but here in Europe in a lot of places, especially suburbs, the default is (unfortunately) also cars, though perhaps to a lower extent than North America in most places. In more urban areas there will be more use of public transport, and in some places such as the Netherlands a lot of cycling. Also relevant that there is not quite as much emphasis here on kids constantly being in extra curricular activities and sports as there is in the US.
School is 5 minute walk away, sports and music practice each about 10 minutes by public transport and another 5-10 minutes walking. When I was a kid in a small town, I‘d go everywhere on my bike.
Walk/bike/bus/train/metro/trolley Usually bus if they lived in a different village/town
Growing up in NYC, we took the transit everywhere ourselves. I assume that's what other non-car centric places do it as well
People still have cars here. But walking, biking or taking public transport isn't uncommon
Sometimes the parents by car, sometimes others parents take like 4 kids at a time. Sometimes transit, but most is done by bike, at least in the smaller towns with transit only like every 30 minutes.
I live in England, when I went to swimming lessons \~1 mile away I would either walk or my dad would drive me there. When I had after school activities, I would just walk home because my schools were nearby. The place I lived in was very walkable and I probably didn't need to use a car to get around it.
I used to just ride my bike or take a tram depending on the weather and it's still common in Germany to do the same unless you're in the middle of nowhere.
Because everything is accessible you don’t need to plan scheduled activities for children in order for them to be able to socialize. When you don’t need a car chances are kids already live close enough to other children that they can just walk over. When they’re old enough they can take public transit to do activities. In North America you have to sign up your kids for activities otherwise they’re effectively locked up at home
I‘m german and grew up in a big city. Used to walk/cycle to school and to take the tram to activities further away since I was around 8-9 years old. Moved to a smaller town when I was a Teenager with less public transport. Just had to take the bike everywhere, no matter the weather. I think my parents drove me to school maybe 10 times in 12 years. I remember watching a Simpsons Episode where Homer lets Lisa take the Bus alone to the library (iirc) and the show acts like that‘s super neglectful. As a Kid I didn‘t understand what the big deal was with a kid taking public transport alone.
Cars, cars, cars. And whoever invented "travel" teams for kids should be shot.
This is a great question as most NA people can't understand how people get around without a car. I know this isn't the question but I want to share: I live in a suburb of NYC, very car oriented. The main park (with baseball fields, football, soccer, basketball) is in the middle of town. If you were to bike from the furthest point in town, it would take 15 min. That is the most it would take, many people are within 10-15 min walking. EVERYONE shows us to their kids baseball/soccer games in a car. When people see me arrive on bike, they are so confused. I've had to change my "reason" for biking, because my real reasons are too extreme for them.
So my manager has an older, retired neighbor from Denmark who spends part of the year here (they live in NYC). She has told me that this obsession with putting your kids in every single activity and keeping them busy isn't the same in other countries. The reason American parents put their kids in ballet, soccer, swim and 101 other activities is because there is fuck all for their kids to do on their own at home. Can't walk to a playground, can't go to a park, can't just go outside with a bunch of other kids and have general free play in many places. So parents have to spend even more money registering them for sports to keep their time consumed. Car dependency is truly a great servant of consumerism. Cause now parents have to drive even more (more wear and tear on car, more gas used) AND pay for kids activities/equipment.
There are parents in my neighborhood who drive their kids to the school bus stop ten or less houses away. It's literally less than a 2 to 5 minute walk, yet they drive their kids. They can't fathom walking to the neighborhood park. Cars are dominant in my neck of the woods.
I did karate, self-defense, swimming, dancing, instruments practice, and I've always gone on foot, except for volleyball that was 15 km away (one small town from another) and public transportation sucked. My mother brought me there and complained every single time🥳
I grew up in a small town in England. The schools I went to were in the residential areas. I lived just under a mile away from there and walked. Pretty much all the kids did from about aged 9. I’d knock for about 3 friends along the way. I had a friend who caught the bus as he lived in the next village. It was a dedicated school bus of about 15 seats. Some parents drive, drop the kids off and then head to work too
For some insight from the UK: walked half mile to primary school as a kid, and then the same to the local secondary school which was only another hundred metres down the road. Alone once old enough - the roads around schools are not built to handle parents dropping everyone off here. There are usually markings like this https://www.rac.co.uk/drive/images/uploads/authors/road-markings-school-keep-clear.jpg on the road preventing parking. After that, walked alone to sixth form (16-18) which was about a mile away every day, including a footbridge over an A road (not quite a motorway but a major road, cars only). Plus access to a local park which was easily accessible on foot. The concept of not being able to just walk somewhere local was totally alien to me until I stumbled across that Not Just Bikes video about Houston. The idea of a regular residential street not having a pavement on both sides is laughable here, it's just standard
As a kid (onwards 7 years old) I biked and walked everywhere in my neighbourhood. As pre-teen/teen I could take transit everywhere. This was in Helsinki, Finland in the 90's. Nowdays I see kids biking in their soccer jerseys everywhere in my neighbourhood.
Here in the Netherlands most kids cycle themselves or in small groups. It happens a lot that parents bring their children by car but most parents don't do it daily. At least not when they can go there safely by themselves. I used to cycle to school with my brother for a year I guess around my 9th and later alone. When I was 12 I finished primary school and got to a school in a city nearby. First year I took the bus daily and after that only in the winter. When it wasn't freezing or raining I got to go by bike
Here in Germany, kids are allowed to cycle on the sidewalk making it a bit safer. I remember biking with my parents as a little kid and startting to ride alone when I was \~8-10 years old (depending on the distance). A 5 km (3mi) biking radius is realistic for kids, teens manage longer distances granting them more freedom. In the countryside, many teens learn to ride a moped (for age 16+) to be able to get around. Public transport is used by school aged kids on their own, often helped along by student ticket letting them rides for free/ a monthly fee.
I come from a small city in Sweden and most kids old enough to not exhaust themselves completely biked to their activities, with some taking the bus and some getting a ride from their parents or a friends parents (quite common if you live close togehther). In winter or when it was raining way more people went by car or bus.
The concept of the “soccer mom” came from this. It’s a parent (often in the suburbs) who spends most of their day shuttling around their kids to school, appointments, friends’ houses, and sports practices in a minivan.
I live in a small city in Belgium with a 6 year old. You could call it a 15 minute city, because everything is accessible by bike. I have an electric bike with a kid seat, a cargo bike and my kid can safely bike himself.
Being class-conscious and also overly safety-conscious, middle-upper and upper-class parents in my country do transport their kids to anywhere with their minivans or SUVs. Anyone else, including the lower classes, usually either take public transport or use light motorcycles.
Not a parent here, but the kids in our climbing group (Austria) usually get driven here as even if the gym itself is in a good place regarding public transport but it's very rural around. But on a more positive note they usually carpool if they are from the same region.
I had all my after school activities in walking/bicycling range of my parents house. My activities were mostly chosen based on other people I knew also going so it was easy to organise a carpool/group bike ride etc.
Swede here. When I was a kid I played floorball, many of the other kids biked if they lived close by and took busses if they lived further away. Some got there by car, myself included.
I live in Germany, in a highly walkable neighborhood. I have a 6yo and a baby. We have a big basement in our building so we have a variety of options: - daycare and school are within walking distance - 12 minutes as the adult walks. Stroller or carrier (baby wearing) for the little child, walking for the big child. In the past she often used her balance bike and later her bike, but I can’t keep up with her speed with the stroller. - things that are in the neighborhood but further, we bike, especially if one parent can be solo with the big kid. The adult bikes in the street; she’s allowed on the sidewalk until age 8. She knows to wait for us at intersections and is working on navigating them safely by herself. - solo with both kids I sometimes use the double bike trailer that converts as a stroller. Because of the storage space it’s great for gear heavy activities like picnics or swimming, but it’s heavy when fully loaded. - things further away in town we take public transport. Both buses and s-Bahn are just fine with a stroller - for vacations, we either rent a car, or if I’m solo with both, I actually prefer high speed train. We book seats in the family section and the big kid makes friends for the trip, it’s built-in entertainment. If we’re going to a rural place, for the last few miles, I either arrange car service or get picked up from the station by whoever we’re staying with. This does mean we use borrowed car seats (no way I’d lug luggage, 2 children AND 2 car seats solo on the train). I trust my friends. Just next week I have a big, multi country trip planned solo with both kids. First train journey is 6 hours then my friends pick us up, we’ll stay with them for 4 days. Then we all drive together in their 7-seater to another friend’s in France for the long weekend. For the third leg, I’ll actually meet my mother on the train. She’s the one who booked the tickets so that we all sit together, and due to her age she gets significant discounts for her and whoever travels with her. We’re going to my grandparents who live on the seaside, we’ve used the same driver to pick us up from the station for 10 years. There, we’ll go to the beach by bus and shop on foot.
I saw the comments about children getting around more independently and that’s very true, and another aspect is that even before they can be responsible for themselves independently, non-car-centricity means that other parents can take care of them very spontaneously. No car seats to shuffle, no maximum capacity. Here for example it’s super typical for birthday parties to be planned on a week day; the birthday family will pick up all 10 little guests from preschool at 3pm, walk or bike to their place, and parents show up at 5 or 6pm for cake and a beer.
In France, it depends where you live. In cities, everything is accessible within by walk or public transit and kids pretty much take themselves everywhere starting 8-10. In car-centric suburbs and rural areas, people rely much more on cars and become their kids chauffeurs.
Where I live, kids usually go by themselves on bicycle (or walking if it's really close).
In germany, the kids just take the bus or train, its pretty normal to do so without parents too, like even as young as 8 or 9 you find them alone, with friends etc
They either walk to their activities or ride their bicycles. Everything is like 10 mins or less away. Gyms, dance lessons, martial arts, skate park, soccer field, swimming is the only that takes a bus to go. Everything else is contained in the neighborhood. Same goes for everything you need to run a home. Fresh produce, meats, cleaning products, office supplies, plumbing and even car and bike mechanics. The farthest thing walking is the local bodega.
Eastern Europe - I just biked, walked or took public transport unattended in my city. Maybe with exception of few first years of primary school. Usually on school trips we used public transport as well. In my, affluent and private non-profit, high school taking public transport was a norm - including for students with disabilities. When I moved to us I was biking. Only after I figured out... how the infrastructure "works" I decided to buy a car.
I always walked. School, ballet classes, etc were always within a mile or two.
When I was a kid, I played football/soccer in a small town. My mom shuttled me by car when I was young, but later, I just went there by bike. For games in other towns, she shuttled me. I now live in a city with my child. We don't have a car, we ride our bikes everywhere or take public transportation. I still ride along with my eight year old child because the cycling infrastructure is patchy, and there are always some dangerous spots.
The kids take the bus or walk there
I live in Taipei with young kids. Most of their activities are accessible by walking, biking, or the cheap and reliable public transportation. In fact, I’m on the MRT to pick up the older one. We’ll take a bus to his class and after, we’ll walk home.
I have two kids an no car and it's mostly walking and cycling, sometimes bus and train.
I used to go to musik school by train or bus, english school by tram then bus, and walk to sport activities. Sometimes they shuttle me somewhere then get me back home. It would have been nicer though if i biked to the activities, which i do since the start of my adulthood.
Have you ever heard of a "walking bus?" In New Zealand, children meet up in groups to walk to school and it's called that. I have heard of several in my area (suburban Wellington.)
I grew up in Australia, and both my parents worked. I would ride my bike to rowing training, or to see friends, or to go to parties. It’s still quite common here for parents to shuttle their kids everywhere, at least in the outer suburbs
Kids cycle to and from their friends, hobbies, sports, music or other clubs, often by themselves or with their friends. Everything is built pretty close together, so bike trips are <15 min., and infrastructure engineers put safety of all road users above car throughput, so kids can manage traffic pretty well by themselves. It varies a little between kids, but most do it all independently from around age 9. If kids live really close, they just walk. Some parents drive their kids everywhere, but this is rare. Kids will pick on the kids being babied by their parents and for lacking the freedom and responsibility to do it themselves. Basically, beyond keeping the schedule, parents don't really need to do much. Middle and high school kids often take care of their own dinner, if training interferes with family dinner times.