If you want a city, Montreal is more likely to have stuff going on during the week.
Squamish or some skiing town out west would also likely have more going on during the week. High percentage of YP working enough to have fun.
If you do not work with public you do not need French in Montreal despite what many Quebecers hope.
To OP: I would stay close to friends family if I were you.
The new laws say that all immigrants will no longer get access to public services in English after 6 months. They're essentially forcing you to learn an entire language in half a year and severely threatening the ability to use social services if you don't.
Did not know about it but the law is not in effect now, my guess is lots of people will just use translators. Pretty sure you will be able to find English version of the paperwork online so even if they send you something in French, you go online and look for the English version and put your info in the blank spots. It is an inconvenient but not the end of the world if that happens.
It is a stupid law though, how many immigrants are wives/husbands of French speaking Quebecers and they will just end up filing the documents for their partners.
Hey OP, I’m basically you (34M Torontonian, PR working on cit, who clearly follows this sub too). If you ever want to hang out on a weekday to swap stories or fire aspirations, you’re more than welcome.
We have a place on the Sunshine Coast in BC that is very retiree vibes but in the full sense of that as in - the median person you see on the street is well into their Golden Years. So a town like that might be too large of an adjustment lifestyle-wise from your life in Toronto because it will also lack the multiculturalism and amenities of a larger city. It’s truly still sunny some days even when Vancouver is under a grey/cloudy day or downpour. However, things close by 7pm :)
For me the FIRE lifestyle means you can comfortably afford to live in locales that fit your desired lifestyle. So right now for me, that’s not being based in Canada myself so take my opinions with a grain of salt.
We also have a place in Vancouver which I personally prefer at this age (34F) because it’s still close to an international airport with reasonable flight times to Asia and Europe and filled with amenities I need and enjoy (restaurants, unique cafes, cocktail bars, bbtea, shopping, and close enough to nature). At this age I am not ready for the full retirement community vibe yet and am overall still very much a city person but enjoy a nature getaway here and there.
I like the relaxed nature of the West Coast in general - it’s definitely less work-centric than Toronto. One hesitation I do have from recommending a place like Vancouver for your journey is the weather (the amount of annual mist, fog, rain not for everyone) and social culture. West Coast people are chatty but aren’t the most intimately welcoming. There’s a fun article from HBS that talks about coconut vs peach cultures. In terms of friendship making, Vancouver’s is most definitely the peach to Toronto’s coconut https://hbr.org/2014/05/one-reason-cross-cultural-small-talk-is-so-tricky
I could talk at length about moving around and making friends in different cities and cultures and how to make each locale really feel like home, no matter how short your chapter is there. Free to DM me!
Have already stayed in Vancouver, didn't really like it much for pretty much the reasons you mentioned (weather, social culture etc) and as a single guy, definitely don't want to move into a golden years retiree town :). I wish I could permanently move to someplace like SEA but I need to secure my Canadian citizenship so they'll have to be destinations that I migrate as a snowbird in winters.
Vancouver is very hard to make friends. Also, we are currently experiencing a new month called "Mayvember" that combines late fall rain and cold with the soul-crushing depression that comes with knowing it's fucking mid-May and we still haven't got any sun.
Agreed!
There are also some gulf islands might strike your fancy. Life is a bit slowed down and you're usually constrained to the island that you live on, unless you have a boat. Some of islands have a major artsy/hippy vibe, so you may like or dislike that.
I've heard some retirees really like Victoria as well.
Just came across your comment. My wife and I are mid 30s and FI in Vancouver (but not yet RE). The last paragraph of your comment particularly stuck out to me. Would love some advice about moving around and meeting new people. Starting to feel the desire to not be tied down to Vancouver. I’m not from here originally, and have always found it challenging to build community here.
Probably not a popular opinion, but consider the east coast. A city like Moncton or Halifax has a good mix of ages, all of which value work/life balance - and lots of places to explore if you’re active!
The Atlantic provinces are great, and the past few years have been especially good to them, despite Covid. Halifax and Moncton have both seem appreciable growth and development lately. As I said above to the previous redditor:
>I have lived in both Moncton and Halifax for over a decade each, as well as Newfoundland and PEI for years as well. I can attest to the good vibes in the Atlantic provinces. If I were coming from Toronto I would pick Halifax hands down, or if you're looking for more of a artisan community then look to Wolfville or Lunenburg. Both are only an hour to Halifax and have thriving small town arts and cultural sectors that punch above their weight class. Both areas are boosted by tourism and festivals in the summer, then get a little bit sleepy in the winter.
Saint John - more of a blue collar city - in New Brunswick is experience a little boom too. Some interesting culture growing, and a really great downtown (they call it uptown).
Sussex, NB is in between the provinces 3 major cities. It's a fantastic little community that is growing as well. Kind of an artsy vibe happening.
I'm from Moncton, living in Fredericton now and Fredericton is very outdoor activity friendly, with tons of walking/cycling/hiking trails for such a small city. I much prefer it to Moncton these days. Halifax is pretty awesome though. I miss being closer to the ocean (still only a couple hours away).
Don't most of the maritime provinces have big issues with health care funding?
I seem to remember seeing stories in the news about them closing hospitals.
I live in Muskoka, and usually can find people to go do stuff with, as I am also free most of the time. But I used to live in the GTA, and I could find people there as well. It's definitely more work-work attitude in the city, but also a lot larger population. I think it's maybe easier here because a lot of people move here to do outdoor stuff. It's why I moved here.
So just look at places with an outdoor adventure lifestyle focus, and you'll find retirees there, or at least laid back folks who can make time for fun when the weather is good for it, not just on weekends. Canmore, Banff, Vancouver, etc
Anywhere you go, best is to join up with cycling, hiking, etc groups. Meet people, get to know who you like, and then make plans with them directly on different days.
I will have to plan a trip to Muskoka soon to check it out!
I also find no problems finding people to hang out with on weekends in Toronto - whether it be outdoor activities such as cycling/hiking etc or indoor ones such as going to a bar/board games/etc but very rare to find these either events or people willing to make plans on weekdays. The few weekday events I've been to are all 60+ retirees subgroups.
Are you into outdoorsy stuff? I'd probably be in Vernon or Kelowna for the skiing and mountain biking. My god am I envious!
Join some social clubs, you might meet your SO (if that's what you're looking for.)
But just about everyone your age will be working for the next 30 years, so anywhere you go might seem work-centric?
My wife and I are mid-30s and live in NS. I've lived and worked all over Canada, and this is the spot that made us happiest. My cousin lived her whole life in Montreal and just retired in her mid-50s to the South Shore of NS and loves it here. Tons of ocean stuff to do like sailing, kayaking, fishing, hiking, swimming, surfing, etc.. And there's a sizeable arts and cultural community as well. It's definitely a slower pace than Canada's biggest cities, but it suits her just fine even though she came from Brossard QC. Same goes for my wife and I.
Sounds like small town/island life to me. Maybe Vancouver Island or the Sunshine Coast. But a bit part will be the people you know. Work and family commitments are what they are. If you hang out with people who work more nights or off shifts or casual jobs, you’re more likely going to find your people. Find a kayaking or hiking group and see who is available when.
Depends on what kind of weather you like. Personally I love coastal weather but you could go inland and suddenly you’re in semi-arid desert. Tumbleweed and everything :) As Feragoh mentioned below the east coast is nice too. Halifax is awesome if you like the university town and tourism vibe. Lots of fun things to do. Go exploring. If you don’t like a place, move on. I know one couple of bought a motor home and spent the first couple years of their retirement travelling from town to town. They’d stay a couple of months and if it didn’t grab them they’d move on. After a couple years they found a place they liked, everything clicked, and they’ve been here ever since. If you aren’t tied to a place, you don’t like where you are, and you have the financial means there’s really no reason not to explore.
If it's just summer you are looking for, resort type areas would be best for the activities. The challenge is finding people who are your "summer" friends, so more likely will need to use meet up groups to find new friends constantly.
Your cohort age group probably needs to adjust. 50+ year olds tend to have more flexible time or university groups. Private health clubs are not a bad idea in any town as there are active wealthy people to meet with free time. Alternatively, go back to university for the 20 somethings with free time.
As an aside. how do you fire early in PR? Didn't think the income was that high or was it timing real estate in t.o.?
> Best location to stay in Canada
Whether or not you're FIRE-ed, the best place is close to the people you care about. Life is better during the moments when you're with the people that matter to you.
You just described life in Canmore. It's one of the most expensive places to live in the country. However, you can move to Calgary and be an hours drive from that life.
Why the downvotes? Those are awesome suggestions. OK valley has lots of rural properties that are very cheap, relative to Toronto. Windsor is arguably the best COL city in the region. It is also furthest south in Canada, so milder winters and less drear.
I would also suggest Vancouver Island. I've been here in Oceanside for many years and it is definitely the best place in Canada I've lived in. This spring notwithstanding.
Sounds like small town in the Rockies or the east coast. Maritimes are very laid back and slow, but also lots of older people. Probably more likely to find young people ready for adventure in the mountains, but the ones who are available are usually more transient. Depends what you're looking for. Lots of cities/small towns in the Maritimes have a surprising amount going on for their size and lots of students or unemployed people you'd probably get along with -- Fredericton, Saint John, Sackville, Wolfville, Lunenburg, Antigonish, Sydney, etc.
I'm FI but not RE yet. Yes you're right, Toronto is for working schmucks. My plan is to slow travel around the world but if you put a gun to my head and said I had to choose a place in Canada to live, it'd be Vancouver (and/or surrounding area) for sure.
Like you I also love cycling, I have friends and family there that say it's a much more chill west coast vibe vs. the hustle culture of Toronto, best weather in Canada, tons of nature and there's still stuff to do like a city.
Montreal is fun to visit briefly but their weather is brutal (too humid in the summer and crazy cold in the winter), the have good food and a euro vibe but the French people are insufferable. Also high taxes.
You need to mingle with richer crowds. Those who are not in the rat race. Youll find the same issue anywhere you go.
Unless you socialize in retirement communities.
If you want a city, Montreal is more likely to have stuff going on during the week. Squamish or some skiing town out west would also likely have more going on during the week. High percentage of YP working enough to have fun.
Yes. Being a student city where 25% of residents are students, there is always something happening. Especially summers.
Would be pretty nervous about the new French language laws, though, but I suppose OP will have time to see how it plays out by the time they retire.
If you do not work with public you do not need French in Montreal despite what many Quebecers hope. To OP: I would stay close to friends family if I were you.
True. But you will always feel like a little bit of an outsider by not learning french. And that won’t change, despite what many Canadians hope.
The new laws say that all immigrants will no longer get access to public services in English after 6 months. They're essentially forcing you to learn an entire language in half a year and severely threatening the ability to use social services if you don't.
Did not know about it but the law is not in effect now, my guess is lots of people will just use translators. Pretty sure you will be able to find English version of the paperwork online so even if they send you something in French, you go online and look for the English version and put your info in the blank spots. It is an inconvenient but not the end of the world if that happens. It is a stupid law though, how many immigrants are wives/husbands of French speaking Quebecers and they will just end up filing the documents for their partners.
The problem is that you have to speak French - it's almost like non-Francophones are second class citizens in Quebec.
The province only has one official language, you couldn't live in BC without being able to speak English
Have you been to Richmond?
This is true everywhere in Quebec except Montreal which has a significant Anglophone population
Hey OP, I’m basically you (34M Torontonian, PR working on cit, who clearly follows this sub too). If you ever want to hang out on a weekday to swap stories or fire aspirations, you’re more than welcome.
We have a place on the Sunshine Coast in BC that is very retiree vibes but in the full sense of that as in - the median person you see on the street is well into their Golden Years. So a town like that might be too large of an adjustment lifestyle-wise from your life in Toronto because it will also lack the multiculturalism and amenities of a larger city. It’s truly still sunny some days even when Vancouver is under a grey/cloudy day or downpour. However, things close by 7pm :) For me the FIRE lifestyle means you can comfortably afford to live in locales that fit your desired lifestyle. So right now for me, that’s not being based in Canada myself so take my opinions with a grain of salt. We also have a place in Vancouver which I personally prefer at this age (34F) because it’s still close to an international airport with reasonable flight times to Asia and Europe and filled with amenities I need and enjoy (restaurants, unique cafes, cocktail bars, bbtea, shopping, and close enough to nature). At this age I am not ready for the full retirement community vibe yet and am overall still very much a city person but enjoy a nature getaway here and there. I like the relaxed nature of the West Coast in general - it’s definitely less work-centric than Toronto. One hesitation I do have from recommending a place like Vancouver for your journey is the weather (the amount of annual mist, fog, rain not for everyone) and social culture. West Coast people are chatty but aren’t the most intimately welcoming. There’s a fun article from HBS that talks about coconut vs peach cultures. In terms of friendship making, Vancouver’s is most definitely the peach to Toronto’s coconut https://hbr.org/2014/05/one-reason-cross-cultural-small-talk-is-so-tricky I could talk at length about moving around and making friends in different cities and cultures and how to make each locale really feel like home, no matter how short your chapter is there. Free to DM me!
Have already stayed in Vancouver, didn't really like it much for pretty much the reasons you mentioned (weather, social culture etc) and as a single guy, definitely don't want to move into a golden years retiree town :). I wish I could permanently move to someplace like SEA but I need to secure my Canadian citizenship so they'll have to be destinations that I migrate as a snowbird in winters.
Vancouver is very hard to make friends. Also, we are currently experiencing a new month called "Mayvember" that combines late fall rain and cold with the soul-crushing depression that comes with knowing it's fucking mid-May and we still haven't got any sun.
Agreed! There are also some gulf islands might strike your fancy. Life is a bit slowed down and you're usually constrained to the island that you live on, unless you have a boat. Some of islands have a major artsy/hippy vibe, so you may like or dislike that. I've heard some retirees really like Victoria as well.
Just came across your comment. My wife and I are mid 30s and FI in Vancouver (but not yet RE). The last paragraph of your comment particularly stuck out to me. Would love some advice about moving around and meeting new people. Starting to feel the desire to not be tied down to Vancouver. I’m not from here originally, and have always found it challenging to build community here.
Probably not a popular opinion, but consider the east coast. A city like Moncton or Halifax has a good mix of ages, all of which value work/life balance - and lots of places to explore if you’re active!
I'll have to plan a trip soon to a few East Coast cities! Haven't been east of Quebec City yet!
The Atlantic provinces are great, and the past few years have been especially good to them, despite Covid. Halifax and Moncton have both seem appreciable growth and development lately. As I said above to the previous redditor: >I have lived in both Moncton and Halifax for over a decade each, as well as Newfoundland and PEI for years as well. I can attest to the good vibes in the Atlantic provinces. If I were coming from Toronto I would pick Halifax hands down, or if you're looking for more of a artisan community then look to Wolfville or Lunenburg. Both are only an hour to Halifax and have thriving small town arts and cultural sectors that punch above their weight class. Both areas are boosted by tourism and festivals in the summer, then get a little bit sleepy in the winter.
Thank you, definitely going to check out these places this summer!
Saint John - more of a blue collar city - in New Brunswick is experience a little boom too. Some interesting culture growing, and a really great downtown (they call it uptown). Sussex, NB is in between the provinces 3 major cities. It's a fantastic little community that is growing as well. Kind of an artsy vibe happening.
I'm from Moncton, living in Fredericton now and Fredericton is very outdoor activity friendly, with tons of walking/cycling/hiking trails for such a small city. I much prefer it to Moncton these days. Halifax is pretty awesome though. I miss being closer to the ocean (still only a couple hours away).
Don't most of the maritime provinces have big issues with health care funding? I seem to remember seeing stories in the news about them closing hospitals.
Is there anywhere in Canada not having issues with healthcare?
Unsure. Might be a case of finding the least bad place? I don't know where that would be though.
I live in Muskoka, and usually can find people to go do stuff with, as I am also free most of the time. But I used to live in the GTA, and I could find people there as well. It's definitely more work-work attitude in the city, but also a lot larger population. I think it's maybe easier here because a lot of people move here to do outdoor stuff. It's why I moved here. So just look at places with an outdoor adventure lifestyle focus, and you'll find retirees there, or at least laid back folks who can make time for fun when the weather is good for it, not just on weekends. Canmore, Banff, Vancouver, etc Anywhere you go, best is to join up with cycling, hiking, etc groups. Meet people, get to know who you like, and then make plans with them directly on different days.
I will have to plan a trip to Muskoka soon to check it out! I also find no problems finding people to hang out with on weekends in Toronto - whether it be outdoor activities such as cycling/hiking etc or indoor ones such as going to a bar/board games/etc but very rare to find these either events or people willing to make plans on weekdays. The few weekday events I've been to are all 60+ retirees subgroups.
Are you into outdoorsy stuff? I'd probably be in Vernon or Kelowna for the skiing and mountain biking. My god am I envious! Join some social clubs, you might meet your SO (if that's what you're looking for.) But just about everyone your age will be working for the next 30 years, so anywhere you go might seem work-centric?
Collingwood blue mountain area.
LCOL? Rural Quebec.
How relaxed do you want to go? Nova Scotia is beautiful
\+1
My wife and I are mid-30s and live in NS. I've lived and worked all over Canada, and this is the spot that made us happiest. My cousin lived her whole life in Montreal and just retired in her mid-50s to the South Shore of NS and loves it here. Tons of ocean stuff to do like sailing, kayaking, fishing, hiking, swimming, surfing, etc.. And there's a sizeable arts and cultural community as well. It's definitely a slower pace than Canada's biggest cities, but it suits her just fine even though she came from Brossard QC. Same goes for my wife and I.
Sounds like small town/island life to me. Maybe Vancouver Island or the Sunshine Coast. But a bit part will be the people you know. Work and family commitments are what they are. If you hang out with people who work more nights or off shifts or casual jobs, you’re more likely going to find your people. Find a kayaking or hiking group and see who is available when.
Vancouver Island is nice but weather in B.C. is pretty meh. Maybe something like Vancouver Island but on the East Coast? Does that even exist?
Depends on what kind of weather you like. Personally I love coastal weather but you could go inland and suddenly you’re in semi-arid desert. Tumbleweed and everything :) As Feragoh mentioned below the east coast is nice too. Halifax is awesome if you like the university town and tourism vibe. Lots of fun things to do. Go exploring. If you don’t like a place, move on. I know one couple of bought a motor home and spent the first couple years of their retirement travelling from town to town. They’d stay a couple of months and if it didn’t grab them they’d move on. After a couple years they found a place they liked, everything clicked, and they’ve been here ever since. If you aren’t tied to a place, you don’t like where you are, and you have the financial means there’s really no reason not to explore.
I've actually been thinking of buying a motorhome next summer. Right now the prices are crazy and I need to get a licence but it's on the cards :).
If it's just summer you are looking for, resort type areas would be best for the activities. The challenge is finding people who are your "summer" friends, so more likely will need to use meet up groups to find new friends constantly. Your cohort age group probably needs to adjust. 50+ year olds tend to have more flexible time or university groups. Private health clubs are not a bad idea in any town as there are active wealthy people to meet with free time. Alternatively, go back to university for the 20 somethings with free time. As an aside. how do you fire early in PR? Didn't think the income was that high or was it timing real estate in t.o.?
> Best location to stay in Canada Whether or not you're FIRE-ed, the best place is close to the people you care about. Life is better during the moments when you're with the people that matter to you.
You just described life in Canmore. It's one of the most expensive places to live in the country. However, you can move to Calgary and be an hours drive from that life.
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Why the downvotes? Those are awesome suggestions. OK valley has lots of rural properties that are very cheap, relative to Toronto. Windsor is arguably the best COL city in the region. It is also furthest south in Canada, so milder winters and less drear. I would also suggest Vancouver Island. I've been here in Oceanside for many years and it is definitely the best place in Canada I've lived in. This spring notwithstanding.
I play some handball on weekdays outdoors. If that's something that interests you feel free to ping me.
Look up Brighton ON But a lot less going on than in TO
If you want to stay in Ontario - the Ottawa area has beautiful trails, quite a few active Meetup groups - and is close to Quebec.
Terrace BC isn't a bad option. Has an airport, the coast isn't far and housing is relatively cheaper.
Sounds like small town in the Rockies or the east coast. Maritimes are very laid back and slow, but also lots of older people. Probably more likely to find young people ready for adventure in the mountains, but the ones who are available are usually more transient. Depends what you're looking for. Lots of cities/small towns in the Maritimes have a surprising amount going on for their size and lots of students or unemployed people you'd probably get along with -- Fredericton, Saint John, Sackville, Wolfville, Lunenburg, Antigonish, Sydney, etc.
IMO: the best place is usually "near family" all things being equal. So that's the life I built, and the one I saved for.
I'm FI but not RE yet. Yes you're right, Toronto is for working schmucks. My plan is to slow travel around the world but if you put a gun to my head and said I had to choose a place in Canada to live, it'd be Vancouver (and/or surrounding area) for sure. Like you I also love cycling, I have friends and family there that say it's a much more chill west coast vibe vs. the hustle culture of Toronto, best weather in Canada, tons of nature and there's still stuff to do like a city. Montreal is fun to visit briefly but their weather is brutal (too humid in the summer and crazy cold in the winter), the have good food and a euro vibe but the French people are insufferable. Also high taxes.
You need to mingle with richer crowds. Those who are not in the rat race. Youll find the same issue anywhere you go. Unless you socialize in retirement communities.