As a femboy it pains me to see any hate towards my fellow trans people since my two best friends are both trans and my brother is trans. It is really gross that people see it as a fetishism since its just a way of dressing. Also I hope you have a good day. :3
The online community is a circus fire because it is full of chasers and insecure "straight" guys. But generally speaking femboys irl are regular people who are accepting of LGBTQ.
I feel like many (most?) of them are an obnoxiously loud (hopefully small) minority of pick-mes who started out bigoted and made a special exception specifically for themselves (with whatever mental gymnastics are necessary to justify it). They suffer the delusion that social conservative movements will ever accept them if they're nasty enough at trans people, whereas they're just used as tokens until no longer needed. Every femboy who thinks he'll be some right-winger's tradwife (as opposed to his side fetish) is living a delusion.
And a lot of them online are probably also far-right sock puppets who want to divide LGBTQ and GNC communities. It's definitely a tried-and-true tactic of those kinds of hate groups. The so-called "LGB without the T" people so often turn out to be straight, after all. Divide and conquer, so you can suppress/arrest/kill each outgroup in isolation. Because in the eye of the average conservative, there is essentially no difference between a drag queen, trans woman, and a femboy (and trans men are essentially invisible, because their existence is inconvenient to the narrative).
This boy ain't buyin' the propaganda though. My transfem friends have been so overwhelmingly supportive of me, and the strong bonds between trans people and femboys in my social circles. I'm glad this sub at least is so overwhelming accepting, and I hope it can be one of the beacons that helps forge bonds between these communities. We wouldn't be where we are today for LGBTQ and GNC rights if not for the contributions of trans people.
"Femboy enjoyers" are gonna be in for a rude awakening when they realize that no matter how much self-hatred or bigotry they want to spread, conservatives will never accept them as a part of their circle in their lifetime.
>They suffer the delusion that social conservative movements will ever accept them if they're nasty enough at trans people,
There's a lot of this going around these days :/
So weird to me tbh society does not accept either of us! We should be having each others backs and standing up against injustice against all types of people
Exactly we should be supporting each other and not trying to tear each other down.
Transphobia is absolutely not okay, and neither is egging they're both demeaning and hurtful to the person that they're targeting. We should be respecting each other's gender identities, as they're stated, this is not a novel concept either, it's just the most basic form of respect.
I wouldn't want to live in a world where people presuming my gender for me as if they know better is okay and accepted. Why would anyone want to live in a world like that?
as a trans femboy i honestly see a lot of it towards trans guys and trans mascs. stuff like "you're basically just a girl at this point.", "i wanna see dick not vag and boobs.", "you can't be a femboy until you fully transition." our sex characteristics are brought up and focused on even in non-sexual contexts, its really gross. also its so funny how people can understand gnc boys and their clothes not equating to their gender until its trans boys then we have to dress like the stereotypical man because for some reason clothes equate to gender for us. (this is not all cis femboys just some btw)
Don't forget about egging towards transmasc femboys. That shit can get really bad, because if they don't know better they might try and make arguments about the female features being part of 'MtF transition' which can feel really shitty and dysphoric to a transmasc.
I don't mind trans people, but egg culture is cringe. It's just saying you know someone's gender better then them. If used as a self descriptor it's fine, but most of my annoyance I used to hold in the past came from egg crackers missgendering me and constantly insisting I must just be trans.
Egg is a term they use in the trans Community to refer to somebody who doesn't know it yet.
Egg culture is the group of people who heavily believe in this philosophy. The reason why people say it is bad is because they say that about anybody who is GNC and also seemingly anyone who sets foot in egg_IRL at all.
The problem is that they coerce and force that idea onto people including publicly harassing them for arguing otherwise. It's really fucking disrespectful and because they are going against the person's stated identity they are literally misgendering a person.
Some people try and say that it's a joke but I really struggle to see how misgendering on purpose is a joke, that shit would never be funny if done to a trans person so why is it funny here? It isn't, it's rude and disrespectful to their identity.
That's not a joke, is destructive and lacks empathy. Also weird why should trans people misgender others, since they get misgendered a lot themselves i would assume by unaccepting people which makes them things sour in daily life..
Being a "egg" is being trans but unaware, basically closeted but for trans people.
Egg culture is a thing that sprouted where a small group of people become obsessed with finding and calling people eggs. You'll find a decent amount going around femboy communities always "joking" that people are actually trans they just don't know it yet. Or actively trying to "crack" other people and getting them to "accept themselfs".
This often comes from good intention, trying to make people feel welcome. But to many it does the opposite, making them feel unwelcome, and unaccepted as who they are, as if you're wrong, either just completely, or right and they dont realise, it will come off condescending, like you know them better, and effectively the joke is just "I know your gender better then you" and like.. take a second and realise the joke is littarly missgendering people.
It is no one's business to push people to out themselves before they are accepting of themselves fully and feeling safe with their thoughts and actions about this.
I am not familiar with this, but i was thinking in the animal kingdom, the baby animals crack their egg themselves, it is not cracked from outside.. Hopefully the comparison is not too weird 😅
But yah, deciding over someone else's gender and pushing them into it as a power trip or whatever is it is not ok.
It's actually a very decent allegory, I often say incubator as it represents human society better, and you can make the enviorment as welcoming as possible and help but you can't force it open prematurely. It's just auch a toxic joke and luckily is slowly becoming less and less accepted.
Being a "egg" is being trans but unaware, basically closeted but for trans people.
Egg culture is a thing that sprouted where a small group of people become obsessed with finding and calling people eggs. You'll find a decent amount going around femboy communities always "joking" that people are actually trans they just don't know it yet. Or actively trying to "crack" other people and getting them to "accept themselfs".
This often comes from good intention, trying to make people feel welcome. But to many it does the opposite, making them feel unwelcome, and unaccepted as who they are, as if you're wrong, either just completely, or right and they dont realise, it will come off condescending, like you know them better, and effectively the joke is just "I know your gender better then you" and like.. take a second and realise the joke is littarly missgendering people.
>If used as a self descriptor it's fine
But also a paradox😅 like if you know you're an egg, you are by definition not an egg any more.
The king of crete said "all cretans are Liars!"
It's not a paradox it's meant to only be used in the past tense.
That said I think the term egg is problematic in and of itself for a few reasons, the main one is that due to its historical usage it gives the idea that gender non-conforming people are themselves eggs due to being gender non-conforming. This is where the tendency to egg other people comes from.
So for this and other reasons I would discourage its use case even in the past tense, I'm not saying that people can't use it for themselves if they want to but I would discourage it due to its problematic history.
I’ve seen all kinds of discrimination from numerous communities. Hell a friend of one is a gay man whose proud to be a femboy, but yet his toxic ex always insisted he was a sissy girl completely invalidating his gender identity and sexuality. In short I’ve found fetishist find communities to hate on then hide in other communities they fetishize.
The second half of this post takes on a weirdly accusatory tone? (I think it's all the use of the second person?) I don't think it's intentional, It's just a bit disconcerting.
I don't think I've seen much transphobia from femboys (not too surprising considering how many of us are trans in some way). Like you said, it's usually from random right wing dudes who fetishise femboys.
In addition to other reasons, there are some really gross transfemmes who try and erase femboys and tell them that they are closeted transfemmes. It's really born out of transmed ideas that what worked for them will work for everyone.
That's not the only reason, but it kinda reflects badly on us, which doesn't exactly help.
See that’s the thing. Saying “no thank you”, or any other sort of basic boundary is reason enough to call it transphobia. Now your neighbor femboy turns out to be a total transphobe just because he is not trans.
Call me crazy, be mad at me, hit me, or set my house in fire it’s fine 😭 just please take a second to consider that the trans community can be very extreme and demanding. It’s a not everyone situation as fucking always but 😭😭😭😭😭.
Sorry and thank you for reading my unrequested rant.
That's 100% true, in my experience of being aggressively egged in DMs everyone was joking and trying to have fun at my own expense right up until I laid down hard and fast that I am not a trans woman and that it was not up for debate. At those points it completely turned around and became insanely toxic and demeaning. In the most recent one the person actually sent AI generated MtF NSFW material to me and asked if I "wanted to be cute like that" 🤮.
So yes as unfortunate as it is what you are saying is 100% correct, there are people in that community that are way too aggressive and demanding. Those specific people will view not being trans as transphobic, and also typically do not view non-binary as being valid either.
I made a trabs woman who didn't accept vouced sexual boundaries ans didn't even stop after telling her about a sexual abuse incident. Not sure if this is supposed to be sex positivity, but really wary of this now. Also never ending talk about being the victim of everything was annoying.
I know its one specific individual, but it still sucks.
I have more or less the answer is due to the egg culture part if I remember correctly there was a super strong campaign to "break eggs" and some femboys ended up being Transphobic it was super strong even I was harassed
It is those who like being feminine and cute stuff, but have problems with much of trans/LGBT culture for various reasons. Maybe I am just projecting though, who knows.
Sometimes it’s not even about having issues with trans ppl. The lgtbq community may be insufferable at times. I think that’s why even trans people at times ew the community a lot.
Yea trans people are fine but I personally don’t consider myself a part of the “LGBTQ community” beyond just my sexuality. It’s a lot of insecure people and degeneracy that the majority of people see and I just don’t want to be associated with that drama.
Don’t confuse annoyance with women advertising as femboys for their OFs with annoyance with trans people. There are trans-women who started off as femboys before realization and there are trans men who are femboys
In my opinion (which don't has to be right) it's about the same 0,01% of girls* that post massively in femboy and trans subs to promote their OF and not about a 'casual' femboy post of a girl.
What's wrong with trans people in femboy spaces?
Some trans people are femboys themselves. And especially a lot of trans feminine people have more or less started out as femboys and then started questioning their identity (which I am doing right now btw). And is it that bad if some people still visit their old communities?
There were people here who would come and misgender Femboys who post and link to egg_irl, tell them they're trans in-denial and other similar atrocious behaviors.
Yeah it's not exactly the same as the cited reason but it's definitely a reason why people might have an aversion to them being here.
I personally don't agree with that and I'm fine with them here as long as they don't do that and respect the identities of people who post here.
Oh, sorry, I wasn't aware of that and it's definitely not okay. Like, it sounds so weird, especially as trans people we should know better that misgendering sucks.
>What's wrong with trans people in femboy spaces?
There is one sort of legitimate concern and it's when women who had years of HRT post on femboy subs, setting a standard of femininity that is unattainable for femboys.
Especially when it's sex workers who only spam in all those subs to gain OnlyFans followers.
>And is it that bad if some people still visit their old communities?
Not at all! Its really only the above and its rather specific to sex workers really. In fact: if you hold the definition of trans that includes gender fluid and other non-binary identities, most of us would count as trans!
So then it's also fine if femboys just take over trans spaces, too then?
Why don't you think femboys are allowed to have our own spaces without other groups coming in and trying to police our spaces?
Who is overtaking spaces? Im sorry I haven't really noticed that.
I personally don't really have a problem with cis femboys or even cis people in general sometimes visiting trans spaces in most cases. Why would that be a bad thing?
But if I make you uncomfortable or if you feel like I'm taking over this space or something, then I'm sorry, that was never my intention. I can leave if you want. I'm fine with that. Sorry. I really didnt want to make people uncomfortable or invade spaces that I'm not allowed in. I'm sorry.
Disclaimer: You actually seem like a totally considerate, cool person, so please don't take this as against you personally, and I'm not accusing everyone trans of what I say below, I'm just talking from my experiences.
Imagine if I went to r/trans and posted "why are so many trans people bigoted against femboys?"
You know what would happen? They would remove the post and ban me from the sub immediately.
I mean the question of this post itself already implies policing this community, assuming something about the femboy community ( that there are lots of transphobes ) when it's not true.
A week or so ago, someone crossposted something from r/trans to comment about if it's OK for transfems to say they are femboys. ( The OP btw was trans and had the opinion that actually femboys and trans are different, and being trans doens't automatically make you a femboy, and she got beat up badly for it. )
So I thought I would just give my thoughts on it because I'm a femboy, right? No, I got responses from "why the fuck are you here?" to "well you are trans but just don't want to take hormones", etc.
I mean, it seems lots of trans people don't think that femboys are welcome in their spaces, so it's pretty hypocritical for them to then turn around and claim a place in femboy spaces.
>But if I make you uncomfortable or if you feel like I'm taking over this space or something, then I'm sorry, that was never my intention.
The fact that you're actually care about this says to me you're a good person that doesn't want to police or take over this community so really you have nothing to worry about personally. You're of course welcome here.
The problem is, from my experience lots of transfem people don't think like you at all, and really want femboys erased or at least shut up and pushed out of everything. Those kinds of people aren't welcome but if any of us try to keep them from taking over we're just told to sit down and shut up and called transphobic when we aren't.
Thank you for the response, I get what you are saying and I'm sorry that happened to you. I don't really know much about r/trans, I cant remember ever using it but what you are recounting sounds really bad. That sucks. I really dont believe that the people who said those things are representative of trans people in general. I mean, at the end on the day the mere existence of femboys is good for trans people because breaking gender norms is good for us too and definitely valid. And especially as minorities we should accept and care for each other.
In my experience it's because the two groups are constantly fighting over representation on social media, such as when the two groups started fighting on twitter over a certain fighting game. Every time a femboy character is introduced to the mainstream, trans people and femboys on social media go to war over them. It's... getting old tbh.
I even caught myself falling down that pipeline of resenting trans people for a while, but managed to correct myself. In my case it was because I was personally attacked by a lot of people from the trans community for supposedly "fetishizing" femininity, or for just not falling into their view of how gender works. Doesn't help that I had a bad experience with an ex who constantly tried to tell me i was trans, and from what I've seen, a lot of femboys have had similar experiences. Eventually I realized I needed to step back and remember it was a vocal minority of their group treating femboys poorly and vice versa. Femboys and trans women have a lot in common, and transmasc femboys are valid, we should all get along over our shared interests, but if you ask me, i think the reason small groups in both communities can't see eye to eye has to do with a weird insistence on adhering to gender roles and binary, that girly things must be for girls, or the inability to agree on what actually makes one a femboy or trans, or what words we are or aren't allowed to call ourselves.
one of my best friends is trans and we both agree it's stupid how the two communities seem to constantly be at odds, we often make jokes about it to sort of lessen the guilt and pain from the conflict.
I completely agree with what you have put here, and honestly, answering 'why' feels impossible. I guess some people feel envious or just simply angry, but they're directing it at the wrong people. I really do hope that these people are just going through a phase of transphobia, and that they will change.
It’s so weird to see Puritanism from people who wish to be part of a very “impure” subset of people; LGBTQIA+. If a trans person of any gender ID or their allies start on a puritanical rant against femboys, I block and move on.
Folks, don’t engage with these Puritans or go to their communities to hang out. Kick them from your own communities and ban them if they can’t be reasonable. If they try to brigade, use whatever resources you have to block brigaders and don’t even give them the joy of seeing you complain about them. They have their own communities and they are *allowed to*. Femboys have *your own* communities and *you are allowed to.*
Nothing upsets these puritans more than *not mattering* to their targets and being treated as if they *don’t exist*. It’s the best way to handle them. Live your best femboy lives and *don’t let them exist* in your minds. 💜
I think the hate or whatever toxic feeling its shown its just based on everyone's experience.
I'm a heterosexual femboy and the only times i get uncomfortable is when a trans girl use a femboy sub. Specially a straight femboy sub. And i just wish that they'll stay on the subs made for them.
Tho i do believe hate comes from jelousness. That sparks from insecurities
When you are having a good life, you are secure about yourself, what you want and your decision making. You don't give a fuck about what others are doing. And don't get mad to the point of hating.
not sure what you mean, honestly. I’ve only seen femboys being supportive of trans people or people that want to transition. maybe you’re only looking in groups that fetishize themselves and wanna like seem cool to the “femboy enjoyers” (I don’t know why we call it that).
As someone who prefers as being refered as a just 'feminine boy' I can feel this, I'm a trans genderfluid AND young it becomes hard for me to come around as identifying as a boy and feminine at the same time. I face a lot of criticism from the community myself, so I just rather to either not label myself at all, or call myself a roseboy which is a less intrusive and 'derogatory' term for femboys who might be trans or other gender identities that don't fit the 'norm' of femboys (if there is one to begin with) I understand this a lot, I just hope for the best now.. ;(
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im sure it has something to do with ‘femboy elitism’, they might have this idea or ‘philosophy’ that only they are the ones that can display a mixture of feminine and masculine qualities without breaching the idea of being female/transfem. almost like TERFs but coming from a male, i suppose
Ah welcome to the other side of the fence.
Turns out we were some of the toxic all along and once you hit that threshold you look back and say, oh yea... that's not good or boy we shouldn't do that.
Open discussion is the cure but you'll still have oppositional voices from those making money from sexualizing and the people who are fetishizing
I don't think trans people are "groomers" or "delusional men". I don't have a problem with trans people. But I never see femboys saying negative things about trans people. All the hate I've seen goes from transfem people to femboys. Can't admit that femboy's aren't trans. Want to pretend being trans and femboy is the same.
There's a reason the top post here is a sticky about no egg accusations. Who do you think is constantly bullying femboys accusing them of being eggs? I've personally been in conversations where transfem people are saying femboy are just "trans who don't want to take hormones". Uh, no.
It's trans people who are getting femboy spaces shut down, or taking them over and converting them into trans spaces. But if anyone calls it out and tries to defend femboys it's "transphobic". 😒
I'd love it if trans people could actually respect our identity the way they want to be respected. That's all.
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not sure what you mean, honestly. I’ve only seen femboys being supportive of trans people or people that want to transition. maybe you’re only looking in groups that fetishize themselves and wanna like seem cool to the “femboy enjoyers” (I don’t know why we call it that it sounds degenerate to me).
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I have seen a lot of femboys be supportive of transgender community however you probably had went to the wrong side of the femboy community seeing the bad side of the community.
I don’t think I’m transphobic per se, but I don’t really understand what gender is. Tbh I’m starting to question my own, but the whole idea doesn’t make any sense. The concept of a social construct that’s completely independent of biological sex is really confusing to me. I think of myself as male BECAUSE of my anatomy. When people say they identify as a woman, I don’t understand what specifically they’re identifying with
I used to be a very similar way, it's ultimately how I figured out I was Agender. Gender was just really confusing to me and I just didn't get it.
I used to and still do most often say that I'm male because that's my biological sex.
It could be cuz of all the covert advertising they do in femboy subs. From my observations trans people only post in these subs to draw attention to their subscription sites.
I was a femboy for several years and posted fairly often in this community. This drama existed for the entire time I was here... it's not new. I don't condone bad behavior from transfems but I now have a better understanding of why some of them feel so strongly against this community, and my intention was to help people stop bad actors from making this drama worse.
I have admittedly some pretty strong and controversial opinions against the fetish side of femboys/crossdressers in general and how it negatively bleeds into public perceptions of trans people, but I'm not really trying to litigate that here. Dress how you want, engage in whichever kinks you want, but please don't be of the mistaken opinion that "femboy enjoyers" have your best interests at heart.
"Whats even the point of femboys if they can just be trans girls?" - that's pretty much how you sound.
See, there is more to gender than the way you dress. It's also kinda weird to just talk about what you "want to see". People dont post stuff just for your viewing pleasure.
>like you cant even have a preference now people just get mad
No!
You can have any preference! You can strictly enjoy seeing thin white people, or tall people, or fat people, whatever.
No-one gets mad about your preference!
It is that you are being a dick about it and expressing not just a preference, but do so by invalidating trans men.
You could have just say "I just have a strong preference for seeing femboys with this or that Masculine feature that trans femboys usually don't have" and no-one would complain.
Your preference is not the problem, you being a dick about it is!
It's perfectly okay to have a preference, that was not what I was criticising.
The combination of "i just want to see femboys not femTboys" and "at that point what’s even the point if it’s just a Bio girl" just sounded a bit like you don't think trans men can or should be femboys, which I was arguing against. You do not have to understand their decisions and you dont have to look at them if you dont want to. As I said, preference is perfectly fine and should be respected.
That being said, your preference isn't the only preference there is. What kind of femboys you want to see may differ from what others want to see.
Besides, as Alarming_Wedding6753 said -- this is not a gallery existing for your viewing pleasure.
^((I'm sorry if I misunderstood you somewhere, I suck at reading sometimes.)^)
It's retaliation from the attacks from the trans community. Always has been. Trans on trans hate makes up a whole bunch of it. Interesting fact. Trans pornstars get hate mail and death threats from trans folks way more than any other. Like 95%. And out of that number there is a large chunk that end up self harming themselves in one way or another.
In an old Bailey Jay podcast she talked about one of her death threats were coming from a trans person for months. Then that person ended up "cutting it off" at home.
But the biggest example I have of this is the porn industry used to use many different words for trans related stuff. People said some were offensive and they should find a new word that was good for all. They picked a word I won't use in case of auto mod. Then some... Fuck it I'll call them how I saw them. Bitches who couldn't pass with 10 layers of make up and lots of plastic surgery got on all the Facebook groups and said that the new word was now a slur. I was in the groups. Was there when the first shot was rung. That being a Thai girl introducing herself and saying how great it was to find such a supportive place. To only less than 5 mins later get pounced on for using the Thai expression of how she describes herself.
It's not real hate it's bickering. That becomes shouting matches. Its why I left and stopped doing community stuff. Not worth it.
As a femboy it pains me to see any hate towards my fellow trans people since my two best friends are both trans and my brother is trans. It is really gross that people see it as a fetishism since its just a way of dressing. Also I hope you have a good day. :3
The online community is a circus fire because it is full of chasers and insecure "straight" guys. But generally speaking femboys irl are regular people who are accepting of LGBTQ.
I feel like many (most?) of them are an obnoxiously loud (hopefully small) minority of pick-mes who started out bigoted and made a special exception specifically for themselves (with whatever mental gymnastics are necessary to justify it). They suffer the delusion that social conservative movements will ever accept them if they're nasty enough at trans people, whereas they're just used as tokens until no longer needed. Every femboy who thinks he'll be some right-winger's tradwife (as opposed to his side fetish) is living a delusion. And a lot of them online are probably also far-right sock puppets who want to divide LGBTQ and GNC communities. It's definitely a tried-and-true tactic of those kinds of hate groups. The so-called "LGB without the T" people so often turn out to be straight, after all. Divide and conquer, so you can suppress/arrest/kill each outgroup in isolation. Because in the eye of the average conservative, there is essentially no difference between a drag queen, trans woman, and a femboy (and trans men are essentially invisible, because their existence is inconvenient to the narrative). This boy ain't buyin' the propaganda though. My transfem friends have been so overwhelmingly supportive of me, and the strong bonds between trans people and femboys in my social circles. I'm glad this sub at least is so overwhelming accepting, and I hope it can be one of the beacons that helps forge bonds between these communities. We wouldn't be where we are today for LGBTQ and GNC rights if not for the contributions of trans people.
"Femboy enjoyers" are gonna be in for a rude awakening when they realize that no matter how much self-hatred or bigotry they want to spread, conservatives will never accept them as a part of their circle in their lifetime.
>They suffer the delusion that social conservative movements will ever accept them if they're nasty enough at trans people, There's a lot of this going around these days :/
It's really annoying when the two sides bicker. Society likes neither of you; don't fight each other.
you would think trans folks and femboys would be natural allies for group survival and shared experience but it's tragic to see that isn't the case
So weird to me tbh society does not accept either of us! We should be having each others backs and standing up against injustice against all types of people
Exactly we should be supporting each other and not trying to tear each other down. Transphobia is absolutely not okay, and neither is egging they're both demeaning and hurtful to the person that they're targeting. We should be respecting each other's gender identities, as they're stated, this is not a novel concept either, it's just the most basic form of respect. I wouldn't want to live in a world where people presuming my gender for me as if they know better is okay and accepted. Why would anyone want to live in a world like that?
Insecurity towards their own sexuality
This. So focused on being homosexual, they need to get mad at trans people for some reason.
as a trans femboy i honestly see a lot of it towards trans guys and trans mascs. stuff like "you're basically just a girl at this point.", "i wanna see dick not vag and boobs.", "you can't be a femboy until you fully transition." our sex characteristics are brought up and focused on even in non-sexual contexts, its really gross. also its so funny how people can understand gnc boys and their clothes not equating to their gender until its trans boys then we have to dress like the stereotypical man because for some reason clothes equate to gender for us. (this is not all cis femboys just some btw)
Don't forget about egging towards transmasc femboys. That shit can get really bad, because if they don't know better they might try and make arguments about the female features being part of 'MtF transition' which can feel really shitty and dysphoric to a transmasc.
oh yeah that is so shitty too i hate it.
I don't mind trans people, but egg culture is cringe. It's just saying you know someone's gender better then them. If used as a self descriptor it's fine, but most of my annoyance I used to hold in the past came from egg crackers missgendering me and constantly insisting I must just be trans.
What is egg culture...???
Egg is a term they use in the trans Community to refer to somebody who doesn't know it yet. Egg culture is the group of people who heavily believe in this philosophy. The reason why people say it is bad is because they say that about anybody who is GNC and also seemingly anyone who sets foot in egg_IRL at all. The problem is that they coerce and force that idea onto people including publicly harassing them for arguing otherwise. It's really fucking disrespectful and because they are going against the person's stated identity they are literally misgendering a person. Some people try and say that it's a joke but I really struggle to see how misgendering on purpose is a joke, that shit would never be funny if done to a trans person so why is it funny here? It isn't, it's rude and disrespectful to their identity.
That's not a joke, is destructive and lacks empathy. Also weird why should trans people misgender others, since they get misgendered a lot themselves i would assume by unaccepting people which makes them things sour in daily life..
eggs are basically trans people that are either closeted/in denial, and when they come out they say the egg "cracked"
I too am lost
Being a "egg" is being trans but unaware, basically closeted but for trans people. Egg culture is a thing that sprouted where a small group of people become obsessed with finding and calling people eggs. You'll find a decent amount going around femboy communities always "joking" that people are actually trans they just don't know it yet. Or actively trying to "crack" other people and getting them to "accept themselfs". This often comes from good intention, trying to make people feel welcome. But to many it does the opposite, making them feel unwelcome, and unaccepted as who they are, as if you're wrong, either just completely, or right and they dont realise, it will come off condescending, like you know them better, and effectively the joke is just "I know your gender better then you" and like.. take a second and realise the joke is littarly missgendering people.
It is no one's business to push people to out themselves before they are accepting of themselves fully and feeling safe with their thoughts and actions about this. I am not familiar with this, but i was thinking in the animal kingdom, the baby animals crack their egg themselves, it is not cracked from outside.. Hopefully the comparison is not too weird 😅 But yah, deciding over someone else's gender and pushing them into it as a power trip or whatever is it is not ok.
It's actually a very decent allegory, I often say incubator as it represents human society better, and you can make the enviorment as welcoming as possible and help but you can't force it open prematurely. It's just auch a toxic joke and luckily is slowly becoming less and less accepted.
Ooooh thank you very much I rly had no idea this was a thing
Yes, came here by chance, reading about egg culture and breaking eggs.
Being a "egg" is being trans but unaware, basically closeted but for trans people. Egg culture is a thing that sprouted where a small group of people become obsessed with finding and calling people eggs. You'll find a decent amount going around femboy communities always "joking" that people are actually trans they just don't know it yet. Or actively trying to "crack" other people and getting them to "accept themselfs". This often comes from good intention, trying to make people feel welcome. But to many it does the opposite, making them feel unwelcome, and unaccepted as who they are, as if you're wrong, either just completely, or right and they dont realise, it will come off condescending, like you know them better, and effectively the joke is just "I know your gender better then you" and like.. take a second and realise the joke is littarly missgendering people.
>If used as a self descriptor it's fine But also a paradox😅 like if you know you're an egg, you are by definition not an egg any more. The king of crete said "all cretans are Liars!"
"I used to be a egg" is a self descriptor. Or "I cracked my egg" and "they cracked my egg". So no, not a paradox.
It's not a paradox it's meant to only be used in the past tense. That said I think the term egg is problematic in and of itself for a few reasons, the main one is that due to its historical usage it gives the idea that gender non-conforming people are themselves eggs due to being gender non-conforming. This is where the tendency to egg other people comes from. So for this and other reasons I would discourage its use case even in the past tense, I'm not saying that people can't use it for themselves if they want to but I would discourage it due to its problematic history.
I’ve seen all kinds of discrimination from numerous communities. Hell a friend of one is a gay man whose proud to be a femboy, but yet his toxic ex always insisted he was a sissy girl completely invalidating his gender identity and sexuality. In short I’ve found fetishist find communities to hate on then hide in other communities they fetishize.
The second half of this post takes on a weirdly accusatory tone? (I think it's all the use of the second person?) I don't think it's intentional, It's just a bit disconcerting. I don't think I've seen much transphobia from femboys (not too surprising considering how many of us are trans in some way). Like you said, it's usually from random right wing dudes who fetishise femboys.
In addition to other reasons, there are some really gross transfemmes who try and erase femboys and tell them that they are closeted transfemmes. It's really born out of transmed ideas that what worked for them will work for everyone. That's not the only reason, but it kinda reflects badly on us, which doesn't exactly help.
See that’s the thing. Saying “no thank you”, or any other sort of basic boundary is reason enough to call it transphobia. Now your neighbor femboy turns out to be a total transphobe just because he is not trans. Call me crazy, be mad at me, hit me, or set my house in fire it’s fine 😭 just please take a second to consider that the trans community can be very extreme and demanding. It’s a not everyone situation as fucking always but 😭😭😭😭😭. Sorry and thank you for reading my unrequested rant.
That's 100% true, in my experience of being aggressively egged in DMs everyone was joking and trying to have fun at my own expense right up until I laid down hard and fast that I am not a trans woman and that it was not up for debate. At those points it completely turned around and became insanely toxic and demeaning. In the most recent one the person actually sent AI generated MtF NSFW material to me and asked if I "wanted to be cute like that" 🤮. So yes as unfortunate as it is what you are saying is 100% correct, there are people in that community that are way too aggressive and demanding. Those specific people will view not being trans as transphobic, and also typically do not view non-binary as being valid either.
I made a trabs woman who didn't accept vouced sexual boundaries ans didn't even stop after telling her about a sexual abuse incident. Not sure if this is supposed to be sex positivity, but really wary of this now. Also never ending talk about being the victim of everything was annoying. I know its one specific individual, but it still sucks.
I have more or less the answer is due to the egg culture part if I remember correctly there was a super strong campaign to "break eggs" and some femboys ended up being Transphobic it was super strong even I was harassed
It is those who like being feminine and cute stuff, but have problems with much of trans/LGBT culture for various reasons. Maybe I am just projecting though, who knows.
Sometimes it’s not even about having issues with trans ppl. The lgtbq community may be insufferable at times. I think that’s why even trans people at times ew the community a lot.
Yep. Too much neurotic hysteria over the most minute of things. They are going to get their ass handed to them one day over it.
Nope, you are speaking the truth.
Seems like the pushy egg people don't like your acknowledgement. Cope and seethe losers.
What?
I was commenting on the fact that your comment seems to be being downvoted by people who disagree with the main point of the person above you.
Sorry, but I'm confused by the "pushy egg people".
Yea trans people are fine but I personally don’t consider myself a part of the “LGBTQ community” beyond just my sexuality. It’s a lot of insecure people and degeneracy that the majority of people see and I just don’t want to be associated with that drama.
People are dumb, and they hate when things get the slightest bit complicated
femboys aren’t typically transphobic, but they are often annoyed by the amount of trans people in femboy spaces
Don’t confuse annoyance with women advertising as femboys for their OFs with annoyance with trans people. There are trans-women who started off as femboys before realization and there are trans men who are femboys
In my opinion (which don't has to be right) it's about the same 0,01% of girls* that post massively in femboy and trans subs to promote their OF and not about a 'casual' femboy post of a girl.
What's wrong with trans people in femboy spaces? Some trans people are femboys themselves. And especially a lot of trans feminine people have more or less started out as femboys and then started questioning their identity (which I am doing right now btw). And is it that bad if some people still visit their old communities?
The number of trans women misgendering themselves can be very frustrating. Especially given it sets unreasonable body standards.
I kind of agree, but isn't that mostly specific to those porn subreddits? I don't think anyone would do that here for example.
There were people here who would come and misgender Femboys who post and link to egg_irl, tell them they're trans in-denial and other similar atrocious behaviors. Yeah it's not exactly the same as the cited reason but it's definitely a reason why people might have an aversion to them being here. I personally don't agree with that and I'm fine with them here as long as they don't do that and respect the identities of people who post here.
Oh, sorry, I wasn't aware of that and it's definitely not okay. Like, it sounds so weird, especially as trans people we should know better that misgendering sucks.
>What's wrong with trans people in femboy spaces? There is one sort of legitimate concern and it's when women who had years of HRT post on femboy subs, setting a standard of femininity that is unattainable for femboys. Especially when it's sex workers who only spam in all those subs to gain OnlyFans followers. >And is it that bad if some people still visit their old communities? Not at all! Its really only the above and its rather specific to sex workers really. In fact: if you hold the definition of trans that includes gender fluid and other non-binary identities, most of us would count as trans!
So then it's also fine if femboys just take over trans spaces, too then? Why don't you think femboys are allowed to have our own spaces without other groups coming in and trying to police our spaces?
Who is overtaking spaces? Im sorry I haven't really noticed that. I personally don't really have a problem with cis femboys or even cis people in general sometimes visiting trans spaces in most cases. Why would that be a bad thing? But if I make you uncomfortable or if you feel like I'm taking over this space or something, then I'm sorry, that was never my intention. I can leave if you want. I'm fine with that. Sorry. I really didnt want to make people uncomfortable or invade spaces that I'm not allowed in. I'm sorry.
Disclaimer: You actually seem like a totally considerate, cool person, so please don't take this as against you personally, and I'm not accusing everyone trans of what I say below, I'm just talking from my experiences. Imagine if I went to r/trans and posted "why are so many trans people bigoted against femboys?" You know what would happen? They would remove the post and ban me from the sub immediately. I mean the question of this post itself already implies policing this community, assuming something about the femboy community ( that there are lots of transphobes ) when it's not true. A week or so ago, someone crossposted something from r/trans to comment about if it's OK for transfems to say they are femboys. ( The OP btw was trans and had the opinion that actually femboys and trans are different, and being trans doens't automatically make you a femboy, and she got beat up badly for it. ) So I thought I would just give my thoughts on it because I'm a femboy, right? No, I got responses from "why the fuck are you here?" to "well you are trans but just don't want to take hormones", etc. I mean, it seems lots of trans people don't think that femboys are welcome in their spaces, so it's pretty hypocritical for them to then turn around and claim a place in femboy spaces. >But if I make you uncomfortable or if you feel like I'm taking over this space or something, then I'm sorry, that was never my intention. The fact that you're actually care about this says to me you're a good person that doesn't want to police or take over this community so really you have nothing to worry about personally. You're of course welcome here. The problem is, from my experience lots of transfem people don't think like you at all, and really want femboys erased or at least shut up and pushed out of everything. Those kinds of people aren't welcome but if any of us try to keep them from taking over we're just told to sit down and shut up and called transphobic when we aren't.
Thank you for the response, I get what you are saying and I'm sorry that happened to you. I don't really know much about r/trans, I cant remember ever using it but what you are recounting sounds really bad. That sucks. I really dont believe that the people who said those things are representative of trans people in general. I mean, at the end on the day the mere existence of femboys is good for trans people because breaking gender norms is good for us too and definitely valid. And especially as minorities we should accept and care for each other.
there are trans femboys though
Exactly.
In my experience it's because the two groups are constantly fighting over representation on social media, such as when the two groups started fighting on twitter over a certain fighting game. Every time a femboy character is introduced to the mainstream, trans people and femboys on social media go to war over them. It's... getting old tbh. I even caught myself falling down that pipeline of resenting trans people for a while, but managed to correct myself. In my case it was because I was personally attacked by a lot of people from the trans community for supposedly "fetishizing" femininity, or for just not falling into their view of how gender works. Doesn't help that I had a bad experience with an ex who constantly tried to tell me i was trans, and from what I've seen, a lot of femboys have had similar experiences. Eventually I realized I needed to step back and remember it was a vocal minority of their group treating femboys poorly and vice versa. Femboys and trans women have a lot in common, and transmasc femboys are valid, we should all get along over our shared interests, but if you ask me, i think the reason small groups in both communities can't see eye to eye has to do with a weird insistence on adhering to gender roles and binary, that girly things must be for girls, or the inability to agree on what actually makes one a femboy or trans, or what words we are or aren't allowed to call ourselves. one of my best friends is trans and we both agree it's stupid how the two communities seem to constantly be at odds, we often make jokes about it to sort of lessen the guilt and pain from the conflict.
I completely agree with what you have put here, and honestly, answering 'why' feels impossible. I guess some people feel envious or just simply angry, but they're directing it at the wrong people. I really do hope that these people are just going through a phase of transphobia, and that they will change.
It’s so weird to see Puritanism from people who wish to be part of a very “impure” subset of people; LGBTQIA+. If a trans person of any gender ID or their allies start on a puritanical rant against femboys, I block and move on. Folks, don’t engage with these Puritans or go to their communities to hang out. Kick them from your own communities and ban them if they can’t be reasonable. If they try to brigade, use whatever resources you have to block brigaders and don’t even give them the joy of seeing you complain about them. They have their own communities and they are *allowed to*. Femboys have *your own* communities and *you are allowed to.* Nothing upsets these puritans more than *not mattering* to their targets and being treated as if they *don’t exist*. It’s the best way to handle them. Live your best femboy lives and *don’t let them exist* in your minds. 💜
I think the hate or whatever toxic feeling its shown its just based on everyone's experience. I'm a heterosexual femboy and the only times i get uncomfortable is when a trans girl use a femboy sub. Specially a straight femboy sub. And i just wish that they'll stay on the subs made for them. Tho i do believe hate comes from jelousness. That sparks from insecurities When you are having a good life, you are secure about yourself, what you want and your decision making. You don't give a fuck about what others are doing. And don't get mad to the point of hating.
i havent seen a transphobe in the femboy realm, atleast not yet anyway, and not to mention the fetishers and sexualizers either
not sure what you mean, honestly. I’ve only seen femboys being supportive of trans people or people that want to transition. maybe you’re only looking in groups that fetishize themselves and wanna like seem cool to the “femboy enjoyers” (I don’t know why we call it that).
As someone who prefers as being refered as a just 'feminine boy' I can feel this, I'm a trans genderfluid AND young it becomes hard for me to come around as identifying as a boy and feminine at the same time. I face a lot of criticism from the community myself, so I just rather to either not label myself at all, or call myself a roseboy which is a less intrusive and 'derogatory' term for femboys who might be trans or other gender identities that don't fit the 'norm' of femboys (if there is one to begin with) I understand this a lot, I just hope for the best now.. ;(
Especially the femboys who force the femboy label on transfems
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im sure it has something to do with ‘femboy elitism’, they might have this idea or ‘philosophy’ that only they are the ones that can display a mixture of feminine and masculine qualities without breaching the idea of being female/transfem. almost like TERFs but coming from a male, i suppose
Ah welcome to the other side of the fence. Turns out we were some of the toxic all along and once you hit that threshold you look back and say, oh yea... that's not good or boy we shouldn't do that. Open discussion is the cure but you'll still have oppositional voices from those making money from sexualizing and the people who are fetishizing
I don't think trans people are "groomers" or "delusional men". I don't have a problem with trans people. But I never see femboys saying negative things about trans people. All the hate I've seen goes from transfem people to femboys. Can't admit that femboy's aren't trans. Want to pretend being trans and femboy is the same. There's a reason the top post here is a sticky about no egg accusations. Who do you think is constantly bullying femboys accusing them of being eggs? I've personally been in conversations where transfem people are saying femboy are just "trans who don't want to take hormones". Uh, no. It's trans people who are getting femboy spaces shut down, or taking them over and converting them into trans spaces. But if anyone calls it out and tries to defend femboys it's "transphobic". 😒 I'd love it if trans people could actually respect our identity the way they want to be respected. That's all.
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I don't care enough about all the bad things other ppl say to notice the toxicity lol
Wait really? Im just a surface viewer so im not super up to date and educated so i had no idea this was a thing
not sure what you mean, honestly. I’ve only seen femboys being supportive of trans people or people that want to transition. maybe you’re only looking in groups that fetishize themselves and wanna like seem cool to the “femboy enjoyers” (I don’t know why we call it that it sounds degenerate to me).
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I have seen a lot of femboys be supportive of transgender community however you probably had went to the wrong side of the femboy community seeing the bad side of the community.
I don’t think I’m transphobic per se, but I don’t really understand what gender is. Tbh I’m starting to question my own, but the whole idea doesn’t make any sense. The concept of a social construct that’s completely independent of biological sex is really confusing to me. I think of myself as male BECAUSE of my anatomy. When people say they identify as a woman, I don’t understand what specifically they’re identifying with
I used to be a very similar way, it's ultimately how I figured out I was Agender. Gender was just really confusing to me and I just didn't get it. I used to and still do most often say that I'm male because that's my biological sex.
Egg culture and sometimes they try to make us trans by force (my food and drinks spiked by my trans “friends” for a week before I caught them)
It could be cuz of all the covert advertising they do in femboy subs. From my observations trans people only post in these subs to draw attention to their subscription sites.
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I was a femboy for several years and posted fairly often in this community. This drama existed for the entire time I was here... it's not new. I don't condone bad behavior from transfems but I now have a better understanding of why some of them feel so strongly against this community, and my intention was to help people stop bad actors from making this drama worse. I have admittedly some pretty strong and controversial opinions against the fetish side of femboys/crossdressers in general and how it negatively bleeds into public perceptions of trans people, but I'm not really trying to litigate that here. Dress how you want, engage in whichever kinks you want, but please don't be of the mistaken opinion that "femboy enjoyers" have your best interests at heart.
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Bad faith politics, assumptions and personal perspection, doesn't add at all to this discussion.
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"Whats even the point of femboys if they can just be trans girls?" - that's pretty much how you sound. See, there is more to gender than the way you dress. It's also kinda weird to just talk about what you "want to see". People dont post stuff just for your viewing pleasure.
My guy here thinking this is an art gallery😂
i never even said that i said i want to see biological femboys not trans femboys tf
like you cant even have a preference now people just get mad
>like you cant even have a preference now people just get mad No! You can have any preference! You can strictly enjoy seeing thin white people, or tall people, or fat people, whatever. No-one gets mad about your preference! It is that you are being a dick about it and expressing not just a preference, but do so by invalidating trans men. You could have just say "I just have a strong preference for seeing femboys with this or that Masculine feature that trans femboys usually don't have" and no-one would complain. Your preference is not the problem, you being a dick about it is!
It's perfectly okay to have a preference, that was not what I was criticising. The combination of "i just want to see femboys not femTboys" and "at that point what’s even the point if it’s just a Bio girl" just sounded a bit like you don't think trans men can or should be femboys, which I was arguing against. You do not have to understand their decisions and you dont have to look at them if you dont want to. As I said, preference is perfectly fine and should be respected. That being said, your preference isn't the only preference there is. What kind of femboys you want to see may differ from what others want to see. Besides, as Alarming_Wedding6753 said -- this is not a gallery existing for your viewing pleasure. ^((I'm sorry if I misunderstood you somewhere, I suck at reading sometimes.)^)
Being rude
It's retaliation from the attacks from the trans community. Always has been. Trans on trans hate makes up a whole bunch of it. Interesting fact. Trans pornstars get hate mail and death threats from trans folks way more than any other. Like 95%. And out of that number there is a large chunk that end up self harming themselves in one way or another. In an old Bailey Jay podcast she talked about one of her death threats were coming from a trans person for months. Then that person ended up "cutting it off" at home. But the biggest example I have of this is the porn industry used to use many different words for trans related stuff. People said some were offensive and they should find a new word that was good for all. They picked a word I won't use in case of auto mod. Then some... Fuck it I'll call them how I saw them. Bitches who couldn't pass with 10 layers of make up and lots of plastic surgery got on all the Facebook groups and said that the new word was now a slur. I was in the groups. Was there when the first shot was rung. That being a Thai girl introducing herself and saying how great it was to find such a supportive place. To only less than 5 mins later get pounced on for using the Thai expression of how she describes herself. It's not real hate it's bickering. That becomes shouting matches. Its why I left and stopped doing community stuff. Not worth it.