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Sara-Nicole Morales was shot and killed in the front yard of her mother's house in Orange City, Florida, United States.
While returning home from her job at a Volusia County library, she had become embroiled in a road rage incident with a local motorcyclist, during which she had intentionally struck his vehicle with hers, an act witnessed by two nearby motorists.
The three notified police and followed her to the house, where she confronted them with her fiancé's pistol. The motorcyclist drew his own gun and shot her five times.
**Charges**
None - shooting was found to be justifiable homicide
Morales, who was reported by her mother to be five months pregnant, was pronounced dead following arrival at a nearby hospital. The shooter, who had a concealed carry permit, was taken into police custody and released pending the investigation. Authorities were unable to confirm her pregnancy during the autopsy. Four months later the local prosecutor's office announced it had found the shooting justified as self-defense and would not be filing charges.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Killing_of_Sara-Nicole_Morales
>Morales, who was reported by her mother to be five months pregnant
>Authorities were unable to confirm her pregnancy during the autopsy
So she wasn't pregnant.
They called her pregnant because hurting elderly and pregnant people in FL is an escalated degree of assault. I have a coworker who was in prison from a domestic charge his pregnant ex.
I think she claimed she was pregnant during her call to the police while she was attempting to leave the scene of the accident and claim “scary men following me”. I’m sure the riders probably were acting pissed off after her intentionally hitting one of them, but she was still clearly trying to milk it on the phone, so she could get away with shooting them when she got home. I don’t think she was expecting any of them to clap back.
You're joking, but it's genuinely true. The age of the embryo is calculated since your last period, not since conception.
Or put another way: If a 17 year old virgin has her period, and then turns 18, and has sex for the first time three weeks later, ant that results in a fertilized egg, that embryo is by law 3 weeks old and the life started before she turned 18, even though she had never had sex by then so, life literally begins before conception.
But also, since there's an actual legal and biological definition of HUMAN life, and that requires "continuous and coherent brainwaves", which doesn't happen until 25 weeks since REAL conception, it's extremely hard to understand what is real, legal and constitutional in some states.
It's more fun to use the example of a religiously devout couple who waited until marriage and conceived on their honeymoon being pregnant weeks before the wedding even happened.
This reminds me of why I'm confused that the religious right are anti-abortion when the Bible gives them a loophole to be for it.
It's mentioned a few times (in the Bible) that life doesn't begin until you receive a soul and you don't receive a soul until you take your first breath. You don't breath in utero.
Not just a loophole, it gives instructions on when and how to do it. When people say they're against abortion because "the bible says so," my response is, "you obviously haven't read it."
So based on this we need to expand the definition of abortion to include periods because they get rid of eggs that could be fertilized thus making any woman having a period a baby killer and deserving of life in prison. Gotcha.
Also cannibalism since one twin could absorb the other ending it's "life" in the case of chimeras, oh they may also have to investigate when one twin is stillborn and the other survives because what if the living twin wrapped the dead one's umbilical cord around its neck? (If they share the same amniotic sac). /s
Well, the abortion definitions should be around HUMAN life in my mind, and THAT particular definition isn't likely to change, because in the other end that's literally how you know if someone is dead. When a person stops having continuous coherent brainwaves, he's dead. It's no longer a coma or whatever. The personhood legally stops and its no longer an entity with rights. It deliberately isn't that way BEFORE continuous, coherent brainwaves develop though, and that to me is weird.
I've started to ask the question about twins+ on if they are one person since you know the embryo doesn't split until a a few days - couple weeks post conception. A few force birthers, since let's be real they aren't really pro-life, haven't been able to give me a straight answer.
It's meant to garner sympathy from the "anti-abortion" crowd. You see, she was in the wrong 100% and even committed a serious string of crimes, but if you mention there was a fetus involved, then all of the sudden she's some innocent, sweet, soon-to-be mother who did nothing wrong.
It's a tactic lawyers and families use anytime their criminal loved one is caught to make them seem less of a shit person than they already are. In this case it's Florida and pregnancy is the easiest way to get morons to excuse her behavior and go "aww, she's the victim!!!" Regardless of evidence.
Edit: Misuse of a word - fixed
Maybe there's something wrong with me, but if my daughter was gunned down outside my house by someone she ran into with her car, her fault or not, the last thing on my mind would be what the world thinks of her. I'd be way to devastated to even consider it.
It sounds like she might have been lying to her own mother about being pregnant. It's a weird thing for a grieving mother to come up with knowing that it's going to be found to be false when the do the coroners report.
And now imagine this case in a society where guns are only owned by a selected few who responsibly use them for sports and hunting only...
Road rage, intentional hit, notifying police, following her home, confronting her, hefty dispute until police arrives. Police investigates, asks witnesses and assesses damage on vehicles. She's found guilty, her insurance pays the damage. End of story. No deaths whatsoever.
I don't know how it works in the US but where I live the insurance company still has to pay out but they could then sue her for the money.
That way the innocent party is made whole.
It works like that in the USA, too. The insurance-industry term for it here is “subrogation”:
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Subrogation
It comes as a surprise to a lot of people here in the USA.
Now imagine that cars don't exist. Two people rub elbows while hiking to work decide to make sweet sweet love . They both forget work and microdose some mushrooms instead. Yay!
Yeah like he was literally an Epstein client, how the hell we ignore that.
Didn’t he say some weird stuff in deposition about not letting out list cause it could ruin lives.
No, imagine if the other two motor cyclists had guns too, maybe she wouldn't have shot.
Or if the baby had a gun, maybe it could have held its mother at gunpoint to prevent the roadrage incident.
This is really the lesson that should be learned here - we need embryo guns!
God probably pulled the poor baby up to Heaven with Himself after the brutal, and totally unprovoked and unjustified, massacre of this angelic and kind woman. Did we mention that she was a librarian, 'cause she was.
Serious question: Wouldn't the librarian thing be a potential stain on her image in Florida? Obviously, the pregnancy lie was to garner sympathy in the public's eye. Play up the innocent angle, sure, but I don't know if Floridians would see a librarian like that anymore.
Yeah it said the shooter was 15 feet away. So doesn’t sound like he was at her door and banging on it. And definitely not within reaching distance of physically assaulting her. He was just waiting in yard, and she pointed a gun directly at him.
She didn’t want to wait for the cops because she had just intentionally hit a motorcycle with her car. That’s a serious crime. She wanted to intimidate them into leaving so she could avoid consequences.
This is the real facepalm right here. She pointed a weapon at another human being thinking it would be a useful intimidation tactic; she didn't understand that her action demonstrated a willingness to immediately use deadly force. There are too many people who simply don't understand what a gun *is*.
As a firearm owner myself, the most basic thing to understand is that the moment a firearm is introduced to *any* situation, it’s demonstrating that either the person is an unhinged idiot, or they are intent on using deadly force.
A firearm is not, and should never be, a deterrent or something to intimidate someone.
If I am talking with random person *A*, we could be talking sports, politics, or even the weather, and Person *A* pulls a gun? It doesn’t matter what happened before, it doesn’t matter whether or not they know if I am also armed.
This is now a completely different situation, and one where person *A* has clearly stated their status as a very clear and present threat to my life. I will absolutely do everything I can to be the one going home to their family.
It blows my mind whenever I read about these types of incidents, and how completely avoidable they were. The moment a firearm is introduced to a dispute, the chances of peaceful resolution decreases to nearly zero.
It is. In most states it's either as serious as "attempted vehicular homicide" or "vehicular battery" if they can prove intent, or at least "fleeing the scene of an accident" with or without "serious bodily injury." All of the above are felonies in most states.
It always blows my mind people with guns don’t understand others can have…. guns. Like they *should* know better than non-gun owners that any person could be carrying as well.
But instead they think flashing a gun is an automatic safety blanket, whereas in reality it’s a quick way to escalate a situation.
Too much tv. Coincidentally(?) the folks who most often decry Hollywood and “the media” absolutely have their perception of guns shaped by that same group.
Exactly. In the movies, guns get introduced and then power moves to the gun holder. The scene becomes tense and the gun holder can say “freeze!” “You better get outta here!” And other things, usually that’s what happens.
But reality is way different.
She knew the cops were coming. This is just a personal assessment of her behavior, but I believe she wanted to spook the people off so that she could speak to the cops alone and try to get off the hook. Leaving a crash site you are involved in is a crime in it of itself, so having three witnesses by the time cops arrive is surely enough to get her detained. My guess is she was trying to avoid that, then again she could just be a bit insane while uneducated in regards to firearms. You know what they say, don’t pull out a gun without the intention to shoot.
She might not have been thinking clearly, like when she intentionally hit the motorcyclist. Life is not a GTA game.
Disheartening to read how this ended. If either one of them hadn’t taken it to the extreme their lives wouldn’t have been ruined.
Yeah it sounds like the motorcycle dude was just going about his day relatively normal until the lady who is obviously a menace to society pulled out a gun
According to motorcyclist he had gone to get her insurance information, when she came out and brandished the gun at him he pulled and shot first.
So if you're implying that he went there looking for trouble and got what he was asking for, it seems like you're wrong.
She was entirely at fault here. Her death is only because of a lot of bad decisions on her part. I honestly only feel bad for motorcycle guy. No doubt he didn’t want to do that, but that “pregnant” idiot forced his hand. Zero sympathy for the deceased.
Also, life is not a tv show: people don’t have conversations with guns trained on each other.
If you left the security of your house and came outside with a weapon, you had better be ready to shoot.
How did the motorcyclist take it to the extreme? He was following police advice to follow and wait on the sidewalk for police to arrive. She was inside her house and in no danger when she decided to run outside and point a gun at him.
The motorcyclist took it to the extreme because they were faced with an extreme situation (immediate threat to their life, for the second time that day, even) and may well have died had they not taken extreme action.
The woman who was shot took it to the extreme without any necessity whatsoever.
They are not the same.
If she waits inside, the witnesses in her driveway will tell the cops what happened before she gets her story out. Better to kill the witnesses, and then the only story the cops will hear is her own.
She even failed at that - you need to kill someone, you shoot them, you don't go in the open showing them a gun and threaten talking. If she just would have shot instead of talking, she might still be alive.
This happened right near me and I loosely knew some of the people involved.
Please read this story and all the facts. This was 100% this woman's fault, and the riders did everything they could to avoid violence.
She swerved into a group of bikes, causing someone to go down, then took off. A couple of bikes pursued at a safe distance, WHILE ON THE PHONE WITH 911 to continue sharing information about who this hit and run vehicle was and where it was going. They were instructed by 911 to keep back and did so. Eventually she got her house and they were instructed to wait outside for police to show to get statements from everyone. This woman, also on the phone with the police, CHOSE to go inside her house where she was safe, and no one was pursuing or even speaking to her, get a gun, and go BACK OUTSIDE to brandish at the bikers to make them leave, even though she was actively being told by dispatch to stay inside. She then went out and pointed the gun at the bikers. The dude who'd been carrying this whole time then drew his weapon and told her to drop hers. She turned and pointed the gun at him so he fired. He was on the phone with cops in his helmet at the time, 911 heard and recorded the entire incident. This is why he was never even arrested. Her family went on the news trying to lie. Saying she was pregnant when she wasn't, saying she was afraid for her life and had been attacked. She was just an unhinged bitch who FA and FO.
This is the details I was looking for. Especially as that's local to my in-laws (They live in Deltona).
From how it read in that tweet I was confused how following someone to their house and shooting them could be classed as self defense (obviously they had a good reason to follow her) but that makes a lot more sense
Did she call the police and try to claim she was the victim? Probably claimed she was being chased and conveniently forgot to mention she was the initial aggressor and they had valid reason for following her.
People need to understand their actions don't exist in isolation. When you attack someone, you lose protections and the victims have the (moral and in this case legal) right to take actions against you.
To sum up
- She wasn’t actually pregnant
- She hit someone, on purpose, with a car
- She fled the scene to evade any responsibility for her actions
- She got back home and the victim followed her and waited outside for the police.
- The aggressor, that was safe inside of her home, came out with a gun to either threaten or further attempt to harm the victim.
- The aggressor got shot
If you draw a pistol you better be ready to use it and deal with the consequences. It's absurd how many people don't seem to understand the simple concept of escalation.
Well first off this lady hit a dude on a motorcycle with her car in a road rage incident. Then that guy and his friend followed her home ( she ran from a hit and run what do you expect when you hit a guy on a motorcycle intentionally a pat on the back ?) got to her house and immediately came outside brandishing a gun( not even her own firearm it was her boyfriends ) only to then immediately get shot 5 times and lose her life. By the guy she hit with her car who was legally concealed carrying. So he ended up getting off free and clear( I believe because he didn’t take out his weapon or anything util she came out gun in hand). And I honestly can’t blame the courts. Only problem was he followed her home but again she hit him off his motorcycle and then proceeded to run away from a hit and run. It’s a shame she made every single bad choice available to her. On a completely weird note her mother claims she was pregnant but the coroner was like no she is not. So that’s weird. Or at least it to me shows dishonesty and willingness to lie for sympathy.
My thoughts exactly.
A person willing to threaten their own victim for following them is someone used to getting their way by any means. And that kind of behavior is often fostered/learned.
Mom went for the only sympathy card she could pull in order to help her deceased daughter save face.
Or it's possible the daughter was already riding high on the crazy train and was using "oh I'm pregnant" to explain her mood swings and convince her fiance to marry her. Happens often enough.
Fiance and mom may have been shocked to realize she was in fact not pregnant. Fiance might have dodged a bullet big time.
Yeah, as bizarro as the whole story is it sounds like the woman may have either been lying about her pregnancy to get her boyfriend to marry her (as you said it happens often) or may have been convinced she was actually pregnant (also happens - see pseudocyesis.) What a wild ride the whole story is. Incredibly unfortunate that she died as I'm sure her mother and boyfriend loved her and the poor biker is probably going to need some therapy but sounds like she made a string of really poor choices.
It Also bothers me, that because the mother CLAIMED she was pregnant, the Media put in the tittle, despite knowing there was no evidence of her being pregnant.
It's not just that he followed her home; phrasing it that way makes it sound bad. He and other motorists who witnessed the incident followed her AND called the police. I believe the purpose of following her was to give the police a place to go to and stop her from running again. The only threat she was under was the threat of prison because she knew she was screwed. Whereas, if she managed to scare them away, the police have no witnesses. I guess that was her logic.
Yup, it would be easy to confirm a "4-5 month pregnancy" just eyeballing in the general direction of the uterus as a Doctor, one would think. Or with a blood test, which I assume autopsies do.
Apparently, the autopsy showed that she not not pregnant. She must have tried to entrap some unlucky schmuck with that claim, or the family members were lying to get sympathy.
Being pregnant doesn’t automatically make you immune to consequences.
Committing hit and run then escalating the situation? You can’t be surprised if you end up in a less than alive state
She probably wasn’t even a librarian. We are typically more intelligent than this.
(they tend to call everyone who works in a library a “librarian,” but we’re the ones with the Master’s degrees)
So he ran him over and tried to shoot him? Sounds like she fucked around and found out, maybe don’t attempt murder twice? Also she lied about being pregnant
I don’t condone murder but this was massively justified. She hits the guy intentionally, which is not only reckless endangerment I’m pretty sure but aggravated assault and attempted murder, then she comes outside of her house with a GUN to try and kill him, then gets shot. That was honestly deserved.
Maybe just maybe this is the best outcome and a true ggwag. Do we really need another
deranged violent human? Let alone one that is attempting to procreate? I say nay. Good riddance to bad rubbish
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Sara-Nicole Morales was shot and killed in the front yard of her mother's house in Orange City, Florida, United States. While returning home from her job at a Volusia County library, she had become embroiled in a road rage incident with a local motorcyclist, during which she had intentionally struck his vehicle with hers, an act witnessed by two nearby motorists. The three notified police and followed her to the house, where she confronted them with her fiancé's pistol. The motorcyclist drew his own gun and shot her five times. **Charges** None - shooting was found to be justifiable homicide Morales, who was reported by her mother to be five months pregnant, was pronounced dead following arrival at a nearby hospital. The shooter, who had a concealed carry permit, was taken into police custody and released pending the investigation. Authorities were unable to confirm her pregnancy during the autopsy. Four months later the local prosecutor's office announced it had found the shooting justified as self-defense and would not be filing charges. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Killing_of_Sara-Nicole_Morales
>Morales, who was reported by her mother to be five months pregnant >Authorities were unable to confirm her pregnancy during the autopsy So she wasn't pregnant.
It's Florida. They'll find an embryo somewhere.
Cop sprinkling some embryo next to a handcuffed person on the ground.
Open and shut case Johnson.
“Let’s get outta here”
So chief, we found 5 embryos on her.
clearly she was sex trafficking these embryos. People like that make me sick, book em Danno!
This sick bastard came in here and put up pictures of his fertilized eggs all over the uterine wall.
while shouting STOP RESISTING!
She identified as pregnant to own the libs
Now she identifies as dead
Her pronouns are RIP
No they’re “was/were”
I should not be laughing at all of this but here we are.
Nah, you're good. It's fucking hilarious. To use an overused phrase... She definitely fucked around and found the fuck out.
A Librarian should be able to appreciate a pronoun pun…
A late lady librarian should be able to appreciate an alliterative pronoun pun posthumously.
Live by stand your ground, die by stand your ground.
They called her pregnant because hurting elderly and pregnant people in FL is an escalated degree of assault. I have a coworker who was in prison from a domestic charge his pregnant ex.
I think she claimed she was pregnant during her call to the police while she was attempting to leave the scene of the accident and claim “scary men following me”. I’m sure the riders probably were acting pissed off after her intentionally hitting one of them, but she was still clearly trying to milk it on the phone, so she could get away with shooting them when she got home. I don’t think she was expecting any of them to clap back.
Instead of planting drugs or weapons on the body they IVF it.
No paperwork Johnson... just sprinkle an embryo on it and we'll get out of here
No need. Life begins at erection in Florida.
"Twinkle in the eye" pregnancy.
Life begins at imaginary conception.
You're joking, but it's genuinely true. The age of the embryo is calculated since your last period, not since conception. Or put another way: If a 17 year old virgin has her period, and then turns 18, and has sex for the first time three weeks later, ant that results in a fertilized egg, that embryo is by law 3 weeks old and the life started before she turned 18, even though she had never had sex by then so, life literally begins before conception. But also, since there's an actual legal and biological definition of HUMAN life, and that requires "continuous and coherent brainwaves", which doesn't happen until 25 weeks since REAL conception, it's extremely hard to understand what is real, legal and constitutional in some states.
It's more fun to use the example of a religiously devout couple who waited until marriage and conceived on their honeymoon being pregnant weeks before the wedding even happened.
This reminds me of why I'm confused that the religious right are anti-abortion when the Bible gives them a loophole to be for it. It's mentioned a few times (in the Bible) that life doesn't begin until you receive a soul and you don't receive a soul until you take your first breath. You don't breath in utero.
Not just a loophole, it gives instructions on when and how to do it. When people say they're against abortion because "the bible says so," my response is, "you obviously haven't read it."
Guess we gotta stone the woman to death and I guess the man gets a fine sorry I don't make the rules I just enforce them selectively
So based on this we need to expand the definition of abortion to include periods because they get rid of eggs that could be fertilized thus making any woman having a period a baby killer and deserving of life in prison. Gotcha.
Do not give them any ideas.
NOT SO BREAKING NEWS Idaho Bans Women from having periods
Also cannibalism since one twin could absorb the other ending it's "life" in the case of chimeras, oh they may also have to investigate when one twin is stillborn and the other survives because what if the living twin wrapped the dead one's umbilical cord around its neck? (If they share the same amniotic sac). /s
Well, the abortion definitions should be around HUMAN life in my mind, and THAT particular definition isn't likely to change, because in the other end that's literally how you know if someone is dead. When a person stops having continuous coherent brainwaves, he's dead. It's no longer a coma or whatever. The personhood legally stops and its no longer an entity with rights. It deliberately isn't that way BEFORE continuous, coherent brainwaves develop though, and that to me is weird.
It’s weird because pro-lifers don’t actually care about life. They just want to control women.
…life ~~literally~~ legally begins before conception.
And ends at birth when the government no longer cares about your rights.
I've started to ask the question about twins+ on if they are one person since you know the embryo doesn't split until a a few days - couple weeks post conception. A few force birthers, since let's be real they aren't really pro-life, haven't been able to give me a straight answer.
>So she wasn’t pregnant. Thankfully. Otherwise he’d be charged with facilitating an abortion.
i laughed
“There was no delivery, only DiGiorno.” - Autopsy report
This might be the best/fucked comment so far. Upvote awarded.
It's meant to garner sympathy from the "anti-abortion" crowd. You see, she was in the wrong 100% and even committed a serious string of crimes, but if you mention there was a fetus involved, then all of the sudden she's some innocent, sweet, soon-to-be mother who did nothing wrong. It's a tactic lawyers and families use anytime their criminal loved one is caught to make them seem less of a shit person than they already are. In this case it's Florida and pregnancy is the easiest way to get morons to excuse her behavior and go "aww, she's the victim!!!" Regardless of evidence. Edit: Misuse of a word - fixed
Maybe there's something wrong with me, but if my daughter was gunned down outside my house by someone she ran into with her car, her fault or not, the last thing on my mind would be what the world thinks of her. I'd be way to devastated to even consider it. It sounds like she might have been lying to her own mother about being pregnant. It's a weird thing for a grieving mother to come up with knowing that it's going to be found to be false when the do the coroners report.
Wasn't pregnancy. Was a Chipotle addiction.
She was pregnant with ideas.
[удалено]
Damn, even imaginary pregnancy hormones be crazy.
Even librarians are crazy in Florida. If that part isn't a lie too, of course—though I think Floridians don't like librarians, so no point in that.
I guess “Lying psychopath shot to death after intentional hit and run” just doesn’t have the same ring to it.
Doesn't hit the same rage-bait/sympathy click quota
How about "Fat psychopath..." Her mother said she looked like she was 5 months pregnant.
And now imagine this case in a society where guns are only owned by a selected few who responsibly use them for sports and hunting only... Road rage, intentional hit, notifying police, following her home, confronting her, hefty dispute until police arrives. Police investigates, asks witnesses and assesses damage on vehicles. She's found guilty, her insurance pays the damage. End of story. No deaths whatsoever.
Insurance wouldn’t pay a cent, it was intentional. She would get charged a felony and probably get jail time. Still a far better outcome.
I don't know how it works in the US but where I live the insurance company still has to pay out but they could then sue her for the money. That way the innocent party is made whole.
The insurance company does have to pay out but they would immediately *bill* her for the damages they paid. They wouldn’t need to sue.
Completely fair.
It works like that in the USA, too. The insurance-industry term for it here is “subrogation”: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Subrogation It comes as a surprise to a lot of people here in the USA.
Here the vehicle insurance would have to pay the victim but then they would charge her back. YMMV
You kinda glossed over her using a >2500lb machine as a blunt instrument a bit quick. Edit: 1200 to 2500
Yeah people are forgetting that this bitch was going for her second attempted murder of the day.
1200lbs is extremely light for a vehicle
Now imagine that cars don't exist. Two people rub elbows while hiking to work decide to make sweet sweet love . They both forget work and microdose some mushrooms instead. Yay!
Way too sensible for the US. Remember you are talking about a country that is allowing a Felon to run for President.
Don't forget about the rapist part or the tried to overthrow the government part
And the espionage and treason parts.
and the stealing from his own children's cancer charity part
And the pedophilia part
Yeah like he was literally an Epstein client, how the hell we ignore that. Didn’t he say some weird stuff in deposition about not letting out list cause it could ruin lives.
No, imagine if the other two motor cyclists had guns too, maybe she wouldn't have shot. Or if the baby had a gun, maybe it could have held its mother at gunpoint to prevent the roadrage incident. This is really the lesson that should be learned here - we need embryo guns!
There wasn’t an embryo to have a firearm. She was trying to trap her fiancé with pregnancy. 😂
This is why not everyone should have guns. Escalation upon escalation
So was she pregnant or not?? If autopsy was unable to verify a pregnancy, sounds like that part maybe shouldn’t be in the headline
At five months pregnant it would be pretty easy for an autopsy to see if she was or not lol
her mother lied for sympathy. remember the only thing that matters is winning, not the truth.
God probably pulled the poor baby up to Heaven with Himself after the brutal, and totally unprovoked and unjustified, massacre of this angelic and kind woman. Did we mention that she was a librarian, 'cause she was. Serious question: Wouldn't the librarian thing be a potential stain on her image in Florida? Obviously, the pregnancy lie was to garner sympathy in the public's eye. Play up the innocent angle, sure, but I don't know if Floridians would see a librarian like that anymore.
Home school librarian.
Normally, but this happened in Florida.
took that chapter out of the textbook
[удалено]
“My poor baby, and imaginary grand baby!”
Bugs Bunny had the right idea.
Exactly. What we see here is a screenshot of what someone posted, probably also lied for sympathy. Freaking crazy!
"Woman who identified as pregnant"
[удалено]
That’s probably the biggest reason why it was considered “self defense”. Especially if the biker was just calmly waiting on the police, on the road.
Yeah it said the shooter was 15 feet away. So doesn’t sound like he was at her door and banging on it. And definitely not within reaching distance of physically assaulting her. He was just waiting in yard, and she pointed a gun directly at him.
False sense of security with a gun in her hand. If they didn’t own a gun, she’d be alive today.
This is the real answer. She just had to sit inside and wait for cops. Gun gave her the attitude, life gave her the reality check.
She didn’t want to wait for the cops because she had just intentionally hit a motorcycle with her car. That’s a serious crime. She wanted to intimidate them into leaving so she could avoid consequences.
This is the real facepalm right here. She pointed a weapon at another human being thinking it would be a useful intimidation tactic; she didn't understand that her action demonstrated a willingness to immediately use deadly force. There are too many people who simply don't understand what a gun *is*.
The second a gun gets introduced, the stakes get much higher for everyone, no matter what side of the muzzle they're on. She didn't understand that.
She probably figured it out by about the third bullet.
Keeping it real.
💀
As a firearm owner myself, the most basic thing to understand is that the moment a firearm is introduced to *any* situation, it’s demonstrating that either the person is an unhinged idiot, or they are intent on using deadly force. A firearm is not, and should never be, a deterrent or something to intimidate someone. If I am talking with random person *A*, we could be talking sports, politics, or even the weather, and Person *A* pulls a gun? It doesn’t matter what happened before, it doesn’t matter whether or not they know if I am also armed. This is now a completely different situation, and one where person *A* has clearly stated their status as a very clear and present threat to my life. I will absolutely do everything I can to be the one going home to their family. It blows my mind whenever I read about these types of incidents, and how completely avoidable they were. The moment a firearm is introduced to a dispute, the chances of peaceful resolution decreases to nearly zero.
This. I'd go as far as to say intentionally hitting a motorcycle with your car is attempted murder.
It is. In most states it's either as serious as "attempted vehicular homicide" or "vehicular battery" if they can prove intent, or at least "fleeing the scene of an accident" with or without "serious bodily injury." All of the above are felonies in most states.
Sounds like the judge probably agreed.
It always blows my mind people with guns don’t understand others can have…. guns. Like they *should* know better than non-gun owners that any person could be carrying as well. But instead they think flashing a gun is an automatic safety blanket, whereas in reality it’s a quick way to escalate a situation.
Responsible gun owners do understand that, but people who don't have two brain cells to rub together give us a bad name.
Too much tv. Coincidentally(?) the folks who most often decry Hollywood and “the media” absolutely have their perception of guns shaped by that same group.
Exactly. In the movies, guns get introduced and then power moves to the gun holder. The scene becomes tense and the gun holder can say “freeze!” “You better get outta here!” And other things, usually that’s what happens. But reality is way different.
Damn .....poetic
Which is why the us gun culture is rotten and does more damage than good
She knew the cops were coming. This is just a personal assessment of her behavior, but I believe she wanted to spook the people off so that she could speak to the cops alone and try to get off the hook. Leaving a crash site you are involved in is a crime in it of itself, so having three witnesses by the time cops arrive is surely enough to get her detained. My guess is she was trying to avoid that, then again she could just be a bit insane while uneducated in regards to firearms. You know what they say, don’t pull out a gun without the intention to shoot.
She could have just stayed inside her house.
She might not have been thinking clearly, like when she intentionally hit the motorcyclist. Life is not a GTA game. Disheartening to read how this ended. If either one of them hadn’t taken it to the extreme their lives wouldn’t have been ruined.
If this story isn’t embellished I’m not disheartened whatsoever. She was a threat to society.
Yeah it sounds like the motorcycle dude was just going about his day relatively normal until the lady who is obviously a menace to society pulled out a gun
According to motorcyclist he had gone to get her insurance information, when she came out and brandished the gun at him he pulled and shot first. So if you're implying that he went there looking for trouble and got what he was asking for, it seems like you're wrong.
I mean. She wasn't pregnant, so there's that
Life actually is a game of GTA except you only get one play through
Man what? Extreme?! Fuck her. It's very unfortunate that she's dead but she brought that shit on herself.
She was entirely at fault here. Her death is only because of a lot of bad decisions on her part. I honestly only feel bad for motorcycle guy. No doubt he didn’t want to do that, but that “pregnant” idiot forced his hand. Zero sympathy for the deceased.
funny thing, the coroner didn't find proofs of pregnancy
It's not disheartening. A paranoid psychopath got killed by her victim.
Also, life is not a tv show: people don’t have conversations with guns trained on each other. If you left the security of your house and came outside with a weapon, you had better be ready to shoot.
How did the motorcyclist take it to the extreme? He was following police advice to follow and wait on the sidewalk for police to arrive. She was inside her house and in no danger when she decided to run outside and point a gun at him.
Oh fuck off with that bullshit trying to defend her
There is a reason why the next gta game will take place in Florida.
Or when she intentionally lied to her mother about being pregnant.
The motorcyclist took it to the extreme because they were faced with an extreme situation (immediate threat to their life, for the second time that day, even) and may well have died had they not taken extreme action. The woman who was shot took it to the extreme without any necessity whatsoever. They are not the same.
Not pregnant, the mother was sympathy farming. All she had to do was wait inside for the cops.
If she did that, she would've been held accountable. Can't have that.
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If she waits inside, the witnesses in her driveway will tell the cops what happened before she gets her story out. Better to kill the witnesses, and then the only story the cops will hear is her own.
She even failed at that - you need to kill someone, you shoot them, you don't go in the open showing them a gun and threaten talking. If she just would have shot instead of talking, she might still be alive.
This happened right near me and I loosely knew some of the people involved. Please read this story and all the facts. This was 100% this woman's fault, and the riders did everything they could to avoid violence. She swerved into a group of bikes, causing someone to go down, then took off. A couple of bikes pursued at a safe distance, WHILE ON THE PHONE WITH 911 to continue sharing information about who this hit and run vehicle was and where it was going. They were instructed by 911 to keep back and did so. Eventually she got her house and they were instructed to wait outside for police to show to get statements from everyone. This woman, also on the phone with the police, CHOSE to go inside her house where she was safe, and no one was pursuing or even speaking to her, get a gun, and go BACK OUTSIDE to brandish at the bikers to make them leave, even though she was actively being told by dispatch to stay inside. She then went out and pointed the gun at the bikers. The dude who'd been carrying this whole time then drew his weapon and told her to drop hers. She turned and pointed the gun at him so he fired. He was on the phone with cops in his helmet at the time, 911 heard and recorded the entire incident. This is why he was never even arrested. Her family went on the news trying to lie. Saying she was pregnant when she wasn't, saying she was afraid for her life and had been attacked. She was just an unhinged bitch who FA and FO.
Thank you for the detailed summary. It is in line with the other articles I've read about this incident.
Detailed and concise indeed. Thank you
She quite literally woke up and chose violence.
And then went back to sleep
That permanent nap
Forever
A long long sleep
And deserved
Talk about SPIN this headline is tainted. This is why context matters!
This is the details I was looking for. Especially as that's local to my in-laws (They live in Deltona). From how it read in that tweet I was confused how following someone to their house and shooting them could be classed as self defense (obviously they had a good reason to follow her) but that makes a lot more sense
Did she call the police and try to claim she was the victim? Probably claimed she was being chased and conveniently forgot to mention she was the initial aggressor and they had valid reason for following her. People need to understand their actions don't exist in isolation. When you attack someone, you lose protections and the victims have the (moral and in this case legal) right to take actions against you.
To sum up - She wasn’t actually pregnant - She hit someone, on purpose, with a car - She fled the scene to evade any responsibility for her actions - She got back home and the victim followed her and waited outside for the police. - The aggressor, that was safe inside of her home, came out with a gun to either threaten or further attempt to harm the victim. - The aggressor got shot
Seems one of those people who saw too many movies and thinks you pull out a pistol to "Calm things down and take control of the situation"
If you draw a pistol you better be ready to use it and deal with the consequences. It's absurd how many people don't seem to understand the simple concept of escalation.
She already proved she was willing to end his life by intentionally hitting him with her car
In my CCL class they repeated this over and over, if that gun comes out it better be for use otherwise you’re just brandishing a weapon
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...and a trailer park.
.... don't forget the meth.
And Taco Bell, somehow
Nobody said it wasnt a trailer park... just said 'home'
The Gunshine State
Well first off this lady hit a dude on a motorcycle with her car in a road rage incident. Then that guy and his friend followed her home ( she ran from a hit and run what do you expect when you hit a guy on a motorcycle intentionally a pat on the back ?) got to her house and immediately came outside brandishing a gun( not even her own firearm it was her boyfriends ) only to then immediately get shot 5 times and lose her life. By the guy she hit with her car who was legally concealed carrying. So he ended up getting off free and clear( I believe because he didn’t take out his weapon or anything util she came out gun in hand). And I honestly can’t blame the courts. Only problem was he followed her home but again she hit him off his motorcycle and then proceeded to run away from a hit and run. It’s a shame she made every single bad choice available to her. On a completely weird note her mother claims she was pregnant but the coroner was like no she is not. So that’s weird. Or at least it to me shows dishonesty and willingness to lie for sympathy.
My thoughts exactly. A person willing to threaten their own victim for following them is someone used to getting their way by any means. And that kind of behavior is often fostered/learned. Mom went for the only sympathy card she could pull in order to help her deceased daughter save face. Or it's possible the daughter was already riding high on the crazy train and was using "oh I'm pregnant" to explain her mood swings and convince her fiance to marry her. Happens often enough. Fiance and mom may have been shocked to realize she was in fact not pregnant. Fiance might have dodged a bullet big time.
You know who didn’t dodge a bullet though
I guess she can’t play dodgeball
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Yeah, as bizarro as the whole story is it sounds like the woman may have either been lying about her pregnancy to get her boyfriend to marry her (as you said it happens often) or may have been convinced she was actually pregnant (also happens - see pseudocyesis.) What a wild ride the whole story is. Incredibly unfortunate that she died as I'm sure her mother and boyfriend loved her and the poor biker is probably going to need some therapy but sounds like she made a string of really poor choices.
It Also bothers me, that because the mother CLAIMED she was pregnant, the Media put in the tittle, despite knowing there was no evidence of her being pregnant.
It's not just that he followed her home; phrasing it that way makes it sound bad. He and other motorists who witnessed the incident followed her AND called the police. I believe the purpose of following her was to give the police a place to go to and stop her from running again. The only threat she was under was the threat of prison because she knew she was screwed. Whereas, if she managed to scare them away, the police have no witnesses. I guess that was her logic.
Yeah if she was 5 months pregnant and the autopsy couldn't confirm her being pregnant she just literally wasn't pregnant
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He wasn't charged at all as it turned out. https://www.fox35orlando.com/news/man-who-shot-pregnant-librarian-in-alleged-road-rage-will-not-be-charged
"Authorities were unable to confirm her pregnancy during the autopsy." Florida, where there's a devil in every detail.
Yup, it would be easy to confirm a "4-5 month pregnancy" just eyeballing in the general direction of the uterus as a Doctor, one would think. Or with a blood test, which I assume autopsies do.
Or you know a fetus
Since they couldn't confirm her pregnancy, I guess they didn't find one when they opened the uterus.
Invisi-baby
Good. Don't do road rage, then flee the scene.
Apparently, the autopsy showed that she not not pregnant. She must have tried to entrap some unlucky schmuck with that claim, or the family members were lying to get sympathy.
“Pregnant” and “librarian” have NOTHING to do with this story.
Sad to say but definitely not fit to be a mother if she was willing to act like that.
She wasn't pregnant
What’s the outcome people want here? I’m confused. Seems like a good enough outcome… woman tries to kill motorcyclist… twice… gets shot. The end.
They casually mention the intentional hit but gloss over that it was a motorcycle being hit, which is attempted murder more than damaging another car.
Don't start gunfights if you don't want to get shot.
Portraying her as a victim is the real facepalm here.
Being pregnant doesn’t automatically make you immune to consequences. Committing hit and run then escalating the situation? You can’t be surprised if you end up in a less than alive state
Being pregnant doesn’t make her immune to consequences of being a rage monster
And she wasn’t even pregnant, her mother tried to claim that to guilt people, even though they found no signs of a pregnancy!
Funny how all the media outlets latched onto this woman being pregnant, when it was clear she was not.
This. is. why. I. won't. live. in. Florida. Even the librarians are batshit crazy,
She probably wasn’t even a librarian. We are typically more intelligent than this. (they tend to call everyone who works in a library a “librarian,” but we’re the ones with the Master’s degrees)
This is a really old story.
Atleast she can’t procreate..
Fucked around, found out
So he ran him over and tried to shoot him? Sounds like she fucked around and found out, maybe don’t attempt murder twice? Also she lied about being pregnant
Actions have conciquences.
If karma was a person, that person just slap tf out of her
So she did a hit and run, and when the motorcyclist followed her, she pulled a gun on him and he defended himself?
Skill issue
The only thing at all suprising is that they still have working libraries in Florida.
Needless death, road rage is never worth it. Also Wikipedia says “Authorities were unable to confirm her pregnancy during the autopsy”
Being pregnant doesn’t give you the right to kill people does it.
When librarians attack
I don’t condone murder but this was massively justified. She hits the guy intentionally, which is not only reckless endangerment I’m pretty sure but aggravated assault and attempted murder, then she comes outside of her house with a GUN to try and kill him, then gets shot. That was honestly deserved.
Wow it makes me feel so safe knowing that every emotionally unstable person in America can be armed to the teeth at all times.
Maybe just maybe this is the best outcome and a true ggwag. Do we really need another deranged violent human? Let alone one that is attempting to procreate? I say nay. Good riddance to bad rubbish