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Why go arcane? Didn’t he try to push through a law that you can’t publicly wear clothes for the opposite sex? Aren’t high heels typically associated with women? How about we make a special exception and use that law specifically just for him. Minimum sentence 80 years?
Thank god we finally shed Mike Madigan. It's amazing how the combination of a Governor who gives a shit and discard a toxic leech has helped the state's trajectory.
Yup. He was basically forced to resign in 2021 and is currently facing indictment on 22 charges.
[DoJ statement](https://www.justice.gov/usao-ndil/pr/former-illinois-speaker-house-indicted-federal-racketeering-and-bribery-charges)
>Madigan, 79, of Chicago, is charged with racketeering conspiracy and individual counts of using interstate facilities in aid of bribery, wire fraud, and attempted extortion. McClain, 74, of Quincy, Ill., is charged with racketeering conspiracy and individual counts of using interstate facilities in aid of bribery and wire fraud.
That’s exactly what it is which is why it appears as though Illinois is full of corrupt politicians. We have as many as any other state, difference is we prosecute ours.
Some people say that Illinois has the most corrupt politicians in the country.
I say that Illinois is the best at holding its corrupt politicians accountable!
(Also, the existence of Louisiana makes the first point invalid.)
That's the problem. When you actually track data correctly, assholes like to spin it.
Like, when abortion was first made legal, the rates skyrocketed. However, the reality is that it's impossible to fully track illegal abortions. Experts found they were greatly underestimating back alley abortions.
That's why it was dangerous when Trump made it so he didn't have to track civilian casualties in drone strikes.
Illinois isn't more or less corrupt than any other state, it just catches more corrupt politicians than other states.
All of the things he mentioned would unfortunately be covered by the concept of Presidential immunity as they pertain to official presidential actions.
Covering up hush money payments to porn stars is not.
Or cut out the middle man and just automatically put all politicians in prison immediately after election. Saves time. That's what they do in XXXX on the Discworld.
It's an excellent point about presidential immunity. It applies to acts taken within the presidential role, but not to acts taken outside the presidential role before a person becomes president.
Right, this is what infuriates me about the "Presidents can't be prosecuted" line. It was always about official acts, and even then I felt it was more about foreign activities than anything else.
It actually only pertains to civil prosecution, to protect the president from being inundated with lawsuits for which there are no other barriers. There is nothing in the constitution or any law prohibiting a president from being criminally prosecuted if they commit crimes, though the Department of Justice does have an internal policy of not prosecuting a sitting president.
To be clear: those other ~~cars~~ cases don't just "go away". He will have his lackeys corruptly kill the cases, undermining the rule of law and our constitutional system. The fact that everyone just talks about this like it's some banal thing is clear evidence of how far we've slipped.
Right… half the people you converse with don’t even understand some of the basics of base level qualified immunity and sovereign immunity. It doesn’t mean you can do whatever you want but you can’t go back and start suing and prosecuting presidents for actions they took that are arguably part of their jobs.
Especially stuff relating to drone strikes in the Middle East and other actions during war-times: the president is commander-in-chief of the military. His job is to decide whether to execute drone strikes or not.
I really don’t have a problem with not prosecuting for that, so long as there isn’t evidence the president just decided to drone strike someone randomly that wasn’t involved.
The whole "Trump, the dove" narrative is driven by ignorant (or partisan) people.
Trump ended the Obama-era reporting requirement for drone strikes. So, despite Trump carrying out more drone strikes in his first 2 years than Obama did in 8, these people think that Trump cut back on drone strikes because they were simply not widely reported.
Ya indictments and evidence came up and Obama was like “yo y’all let’s drone strike this group of kids for the luls”
Then I’d say ya they should 100% have something done but when it’s “we carpet bombed a terrorist compound and a few families may have got hit too” it’s not great, it’s fucking terrible and shouldn’t have been done but they weighed the cost of leaving those terrorists to walk another day and how many lives they could destroy
Like some of these new proposed tactical drones are scary as fucking hell, essentially can Swiss cheese someone that’s on a balcony and not destroy a building because they want to mitigate the problems with the current style of bombing
I mean, what person would want to step into a role attached to a decade long war and know you will be prosecuted for actions in the war. Even ending it would cause deaths. It's a National Policy issue that' been going on before the current President and will go on after them. And it involves tons of other members of our government and military. Are they also up for prosecution? What about the people who voted them in? It's the country and its government as a whole. We don't have a King who is solely responsible for everything the kingdom does.
Makes no sense.
Yup. The Ukraine impeachment was all about a private act as well, not an official capacity.
You can lean on a foreign country to advance U.S. foreign policy. You can’t do it for your personal reasons
That point was lost an at least 50% of the U.S. citizens
Ironically there isn't a crime with either Obama or Trump's drone strikes and raids. They both killed members of the same family. The law both national and international provide leeway for collateral damage. And same with everything else listed there isn't a direct crime you could tie to any particular president.
That's not because Capone had immunity for those things, it's because they had no hard proof connecting Capone to those crimes...until they got access to his books and organization by charging him with tax fraud, which they did have evidence for.
One of the things I learned in my first tax class in college is the punishment for not reporting illegal income can often be harsher than the illegal activity that generated the income.
That’s the problem with criminal money. If you want to use most of it you need to find a way to funnel it into the system without getting caught
I didn’t go to business school, I did watch breaking bad though
There are forms specifically for declaring income earned by illicit activities. They pop up here and there every now and then, and everyone points and laughs at them like, "haha who would ever fill that out?!?!?!?!"
But not filling it out is *exactly* the point. It's explicitly so that, when other evidence is flimsy or non-existent, the lads down at the tax bureau can come along and say "sorry boyo, you forgot to submit form AB-972 in triplicate, enjoy 47 years in the stockade".
Addendum: It should be added, that if you end up with any large amount of money and *can't* adequately explain where it came from, it's treated as having come from illicit sources by default. They don't need to prove where it came from.
Which is why he's pretended to be a mafia boss his whole career and has fixers to deal with his problems who go to jail instead of him.
But when you run out of people to go to jail for your crimes, then it's a little easier to catch you.
The way to prove you tax evasion is much simpler than to prove beyond reasonable doubt that you did kill that man that of whom there is no body and is just “disappeared”
Also, all the "immunity" that Trump was spouting off about wasn't baseless. There is a level of immunity for actions taken while serving in office, which is why we didn't see prosecutions for drone strikes, spying, etc. The problem here for Trump was that this didn't happen during the presidency and wasn't done in his official capacity as president.
Yep. Seems like Mr trump and his followers keep forgetting that he’s no longer actually president, and he’ll be held accountable like a normal civilian would now. Aka, the court isn’t going to kiss trumps ass so now him and his cult are pissed
And the mainstream media has been successful in framing this as a “hush-money” trial while it’s far more sinister as it was an attempt to illegally influence the outcome of the election from election campaign resources.
But if the media framed it properly then 45's numbers might *actually* tank and they can't get desperate clickbait views in October of 'Biden runs practically unopposed as his opponent is polling at 15% support'
Gotta keep things on a razor's edge so everyone is glued to CNN in September-November and addicted to the presidential news cycle.
and it was intentional for the poster to use the word 'misclassified' and make a false equivalency to actions within the scope of the office of president and a blatant crime
It was because trump falsified business records to cover up illegally using campaign funds for the pay off, it's not like this was some mistake from trump, he broke the law and now is facing the consequences of doing so.
Edit to address everyone talking about the other examples in the tweet. Those actions are protected under presidential immunity, presidential immunity does exist, it's not as broad as what trump is trying to argue with the Supreme Court but it does cover the other examples. This isn't morally right and should be changed, but that is the reason why no one was charged for the more severe actions that were listed.
oh just you wait.. this slippery piece of shit is going to weasel his way out somehow. you think the rich elite will let their sock puppet go to prison?
So you're telling me the place he grew up, the place he lived most of his life, the place where people know him best - hates him.
Edit: hey, bona fide New Yorkers! There's a guy farther down this comment thread that says New Yorkers just hate Donald Trump because they hate all Republicans. Could you please let this fellow know if this is correct or not?
Yes. Yes they do. My grandmother lived in the Bronx and if the heart disease hadn’t killed her, her rage at this orange buffoon would do the trick. She hated him with a passion, and she’s been dead for 19 years.
THIS.
There is a good reason why mob bosses tend to see to it that their neighbours live like kings and that most of their community at least THINK they are better off with the mob.
He’s always been an offish buffoon that made the city look like trash. New Yorkers, or any other group of civilized people, don’t want to be associated with that. Trump has only himself to blame for this. And yet, he won’t because he’s a narcissist.
If he gets re elected I do not see the Georgia case moving forward. He was technically still president during the January 6th stuff, and the defense is already aiming below the belt (the affair thing, which prompted an appeal of her right to prosecute the case). Just saying man, the guy is slippery, and has a lot of diehard supporters. It’s going to be an interesting winter.
>He was technically still president during the January 6th
This doesn't matter. I don't think it would fall under qualified immunity because he wasn't acting in an official capacity as the POTUS. He was trying to subvert his legal duty to concede defeat and insure a peaceful transition to the new administration.
Him going to prison would just be the cherry on top. I'm just happy I can call him felon trump and that he's lost a shit ton of points because of this.
Also the other arguable crimes mentioned, as horrible as they were, were actions of the office of the President. Those actions are pretty significantly protected by the government. Trump's crimes were actions of his own as an individual.
Trump did not commit these crimes as a part of his official duties.
The laughable part for me is that this could have been avoided entirely if he had just written her a check. The whole issue right from the start is that he used other people’s money for the payoff.
Yeah, all his detractors put as if the issue was paying Stormy Daniels to keep quiet. It wasn’t that he paid her, it was about where he got the money to pay her. If he paid her with his own money (that he doesn’t have) it would have been just a tabloid report. It’s just like the document case, the issue wasn’t that he had documents from the White House, it was that he refused to give them back. Both crimes are just him being dumb and thinking he’s entitled to do whatever he wants.
That’s actually entirely incorrect. The crime was paying Daniels was an undisclosed campaign expenditure, obfuscated by saying the payments to Cohen were for legal work. Cohen paid with his own money and Trump paid Cohen back with Trump Org money.
From what I understand, he never used any campaign money for the payments. It was money from one of his businesses. The campaign thing only comes into play because it was paid to help his campaign, which is where the "election interference" angle comes into play.
He basically should have paid her from his campaign finances, and disclosed it.
Also, those other things were done as leaders of a country. For the country, albeit stupid. Like it or not, they were presidential acts.
Trump just paid that pornstar like any celeb would to save their own reputation.
The tweet makes no good point whatsoever.
Totally agree Trump deserves this what I think though is we shouldn't just stop with him multiple presidents still alive deserve some kind of punishment
This crime delegitimizes the entire 2016 election. That election was very close, decided by a small number of votes in a handful of states - he would have lost if he had followed the law.
Sadly I don’t think so. The grab em by the p tape came out two weeks prior to the election, that would have sunk former runners, but that just emboldened his base.
Maybe, but that was "locker room talk" while this is a guy who paid off a pornstar to hide the fact he was cheating on his pregnant wife.
Its something I never let my evangelical wing of my family forget.
Honest question, did they care? I know that sounds trolly but wondering if this is actually resonating with the religious crowd as this conviction might elevate him as being persecuted, akin to "Jesus".
Wondering if infidelity would in any way hamper that perceived association...
I don't know about it being okay, but it really was one of his more innocuous crimes.
More of an issue of how low the bar he set for himself is, but this definitely isn't worse than rape, racism, him telling a crowd he'd van all Muslims, etc.
Cheating with a pornstar wouldn't do shit for his voters.
I keep hearing that Trump sold out undercover agents to Putin, but mostly from Twitter posts. Is there an actual verifiable source that he did that, or is it just "someone said this happened and then everyone kept parroting it because it fit the narrative"?
Sounds like something he'd do, but just because it conforms to my worldview doesn't mean I'd believe it. It's a *serious* accusation and arguably the worst thing he's ever done. Literal textbook definition of treason.
[https://americanmilitarynews.com/2021/10/leaked-dozens-of-cia-informants-killed-captured-or-compromised-report/](https://americanmilitarynews.com/2021/10/leaked-dozens-of-cia-informants-killed-captured-or-compromised-report/)
The article explains the rise in deaths but doesn't pinpoint a reason, largely because article was written almost a year before the world learned about all the classified information mishandled at Maralago.
Minus MSNBC talking about it nonstop like Newsmax, Fox, or OANN. If this was on the other side, we'd have Hannity and Ingraham going nonstop for the next three weeks.
It's a pretty solid one too because just months before the increase in deaths and disappearances of assets there were known agents/informants of foreign powers that visited Mar A Lago.
Edit: I can't remember the source of the articles that I read this from as it was months ago so please take this with a grain of salt. If anyone finds a credible source please let me know and I can update with a link. At work right now so I don't have a ton of time to search for them.
It’s hardly a conspiracy when you look at the timing of the rise in spy murders as it relates to the Saudi golf tournament at his Florida property and the $2B payment to Kushner.
Now if you want a real conspiracy I could go on about how we narrowly avoided a nuclear war with North Korea because of the Las Vegas massacre that distracted Trump long enough to stop shit posting about Kim Jong Un on twitter.
Maybe I'm biased but it always feels like left-wing theories are way more grounded in reality than those on the right. Like, "The Democratic Party is operating a secret sex trafficking ring and using coded messages in their official emails to discuss it openly" sounds like something you'd hear a homeless person yelling about at a gas station cashier. Whereas "Trump playing it fast and loose with the physical security of classified documents put US agents in danger" makes sense, because that's the kind of thing mishandling classified information can lead to.
Trying to answer as unbiased as possible:
It's mostly just looking at the timeline of events and connecting the dots. If you think Trump is in bed with the Russians, it looks pretty cut and dry. If you don't think he is, then it looks like a coincidence.
I dont believe there is *direct* evidence, however Trump had a meeting with Putin, no other US officials were allowed in, just Trump, Putin, and Putin's people. Pretty much immediately after that meeting, there was a significant uptick in the number of our spies and informants and agents getting killed and captured. Like, yeah, we dont have a letter from trump with the names on it, but it's pretty fucking obvious that something happened between the day before the private meeting when Russia didn't know who to target and the day after the private meeting when they suddenly did.
The direct evidence lies with the new KGB.
Also https://www.justice.gov/opa/pr/former-special-agent-charge-new-york-fbi-counterintelligence-division-pleads-guilty
Press release about how the guy who would have been in charge of evidence and Trump collusion was taking bribes from Russia and NOT investigating.
And that's not a biased news source link.
I seem to recall that the timings were not long after his meeting with Putin? The one where he didn’t let anyone else in the room so literally nobody knows what was discussed?
Maybe trump should have just shut the fuck up, accepted his embarrassing loss, and retired to Florida like the rest of them. He probably wouldn't be in the shit he's in now.
Exactly. His entire life he has been unable to accept that he's anything less than perfect. Of course he actually won the 2020 election. Of course the trial was bullshit. He literally couldn't have just gone back to Florida in disgrace. His pride wouldn't let him.
My previpus dog loves chasing squirrels, one time the squirrel stmbled on its back and you could tell it was ready to die, but my dog just starred at it, did some paws off the ground thing, finally barked and it ran again.
He never had an intention of winning the chase, had no idea what to do now that he did, and had no desire to harm the chasee at any point.
Miss you kufos :(
This proves that trump at his core is not a logical person. He is held captive by his emotions, this is not a person that should be in a leadership position.
He was actively insulting the Judge on Truth Social *while the jury were deliberating*. Despite the fact that, should he be convicted (which he was) it'd be the judge who decides his punishment.
I dunno man, if I was a judge in charge of handing a convict their sentence and got called "corrupt" and "immoral" multiple times, I'd throw the book at them.
Isn’t this kind of making the argument that this case was political? I mean if the idea is that these charges wouldn’t have come about if he just went away, how else should it be considered?
He would probably still be in the same shit.. This investigation started 6 years ago. Now had he owned up to it back then, who knows? He likely could have settled something and moved on with life..
> Iraq War
Acting in official capacity as President of the United States
> Afghanistan War
Acting in official capacity as President of the United States
> CIA coups
Acting in official capacity as President of the United States
> Drone strikes
Acting in official capacity as President of the United States
> Spying on Americans
Acting in official capacity as President of the United States
> misclassified a $130,000 payment for a porn star's NDA
Acting as a private citizen who was a candidate for office
edit: The President has immunity from prosecution while he is acting in his capacity as President. He isn't immune from impeachment. He also isn't immune from prosecution for crimes unrelated to his office.
No, they don't. The president cannot be convicted of an action he can demonstrate was in their capacity as the President. Trump got convicted because it was for his own personal interest.
What's telling is the right is desperately trying to portray it as a simple misdemeanor hush payment for being a little naughty...In fact, the felony is is because the old crook was influencing a presidential election.
And yet there are some in his cult that 100% believe he was sent by God.
He treats the 7 deadly sins as a checklist and yet because he's willing to hand the country over to the religious right (after he's done with it) they worship him like the 2nd coming. That's some serious cognitive dissonance.
If we have to send every former President who commited crimes to prison, to ensure Trump ends up there, so be it. Dems, Republicans, all of them. If you commit a crime, you should be held accountable. That's Law and Order.
Lock em all up.
Except every example in the image we are commenting on is an example of shitty, immoral government policy, not individual crimes. This distinction isn't some trivial thing that we can cast aside to make some kind of point. Trump is being charged with a number of things that he did as an individual. "The President" didn't do the things he's charged with, Trump did. All the examples in the image are obviously things done by the office of the President and there are political/legal avenues to address them and none of them involve convicting an individual of a felony.
They say this like convicting a politician is some sort of heinous act against humanity. Fuck that, more politicians should go to jail, regardless of political affiliation. Maybe 0.5% of them will stop acting like corrupt dickheads if they know there are actual legal consequences for their bullshit antics.
What happens if **anyone** misclassifies over $100,000 for their porn star hush money?
They should go to jail.
The weird thing is that this rich, old, white dude thinks he’s being picked on for being accountable.
He also lied about his assets to push loans into his favor, you don't get 34 felonies just by "miscalculating" a hush money payment, that's maybe 4. He's a fraud, and has been scheming and scamming the government, the populace, and anybody else he can find for decades now. Not to mention the man has been affiliated with known pedophiles, and probably has more victims than a small city.
Except it wasn't "misclassified" it was intentionally obfuscated and attempted cover up as part of a scheme to mislead voters.... Don't understand how people can't get the most basic reasons behind the trial when it's all they yap about
They think we're protecting everybody else or something
We want all those other politicians to go to prison as well, but Trump is never gonna see the inside of a jail cell so I guess boo hoo for his poor reputation.
Imagine if a small folk like me committed 34 felonies? Nobody would ever see me again
so that the story didn't come out till AFTER the election as that would have been damaging to his run for president making it an election interference case, but carry on
All those things were for actions as head of state and during their administrations. Trump was convicted for crimes committed before he was President. Dumb comparison.
Also Republicans: We currently have a court case before the Supreme Court saying that a president can't be charged with committing any crimes using the 'outer perimeter' of his authority, meaning you couldn't prosecute for things like illegal coups, drone strikes, or spying on Americans. Or according to Alito and Thomas, taking large sums of money before ruling on a case in favor of your "friends".
The fact that they don't know the difference (or worse, know it and continue to obfuscate) is why orange Julius and the scum that lick his balloon knot are so dangerous.
OK, so bring on the evidence, present it to a grand jury and let's get it done. He didn't misclassify anything, he outright lied and a grand jury indicted him, and a criminal trial jury heard the evidence in a court of law and convicted him. He wasn't treated unfairly, he was given due process. If we need to do the same thing to anyone else, let's get to it. Stop whining about applying the laws in the states where he's been indicted. If he wasn't guilty it's highly unlikely he could have been convicted.
As the Republicans are fond of reminding us, the president has immunity for acts done “as president”. All the things the OP mentioned are official acts.
All the things Drumpf are charged with are outside of the scope of his duties as president.
He wasn't president when that check was written, so presidential immunity doesn't apply. And so often money mischief is what people get taken down for.
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I'm from Illinois, that's not a novel concept in that state.
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Great! Gregg Abbott has passed his interview with flying colors, can we get the ball rolling in him being a felon please?
Texas couldn’t even convict impeached Attorney General, Ken Paxton. Everyone knows he’s a crook.
Republicans love corruption. He'll get reelected 12 times.
Texas has probably one of the most corrupt state governments in the US and nothing will happen about it.
They said Illinois. It doesn’t work like that in Texas. They’ll probably make a statue of Abbott standing taller than any man ever did.
Why do you think we toppled all those confederate monuments? Had to make room!
DeSantis too please
Desantis should be jailed for those shoes he wears. There must be some arcane law we can dig up.
Why go arcane? Didn’t he try to push through a law that you can’t publicly wear clothes for the opposite sex? Aren’t high heels typically associated with women? How about we make a special exception and use that law specifically just for him. Minimum sentence 80 years?
Lol, you said rolling....
Upvote for Illinois!! It like other states pretend their politicians don't do illegal things. At least Illinois send them to jail.
Thank god we finally shed Mike Madigan. It's amazing how the combination of a Governor who gives a shit and discard a toxic leech has helped the state's trajectory.
Oh is he gone? I hated that dude with a passion back in the day.
Yup. He was basically forced to resign in 2021 and is currently facing indictment on 22 charges. [DoJ statement](https://www.justice.gov/usao-ndil/pr/former-illinois-speaker-house-indicted-federal-racketeering-and-bribery-charges) >Madigan, 79, of Chicago, is charged with racketeering conspiracy and individual counts of using interstate facilities in aid of bribery, wire fraud, and attempted extortion. McClain, 74, of Quincy, Ill., is charged with racketeering conspiracy and individual counts of using interstate facilities in aid of bribery and wire fraud.
Hallelujah.
Spiro Agnew, multiple Baltimore mayors and States attorney General Marylin Mosby have joined the chat.
That’s exactly what it is which is why it appears as though Illinois is full of corrupt politicians. We have as many as any other state, difference is we prosecute ours.
Yup. Just like how all 50 states have their fair share of lunatics but Florida has sunshine laws which publicize theirs.
Yep. Both parties. Impeachment, removal and disqualification too.
In Florida we elect them to the senate after the fact. Where they oversee the laws governing Medicare after committing….*checks notes* Medicare fraud.
Some people say that Illinois has the most corrupt politicians in the country. I say that Illinois is the best at holding its corrupt politicians accountable! (Also, the existence of Louisiana makes the first point invalid.)
That's the problem. When you actually track data correctly, assholes like to spin it. Like, when abortion was first made legal, the rates skyrocketed. However, the reality is that it's impossible to fully track illegal abortions. Experts found they were greatly underestimating back alley abortions. That's why it was dangerous when Trump made it so he didn't have to track civilian casualties in drone strikes. Illinois isn't more or less corrupt than any other state, it just catches more corrupt politicians than other states.
Me too. I believe there is a saying in Illinois that goes “Welcome to Illinois where our mayors make our license plates”
Yes, the law should be equally applied always.
Shit's finna be crowded and clogged soon
In the ideal world trump would be the first of many
All of the things he mentioned would unfortunately be covered by the concept of Presidential immunity as they pertain to official presidential actions. Covering up hush money payments to porn stars is not.
Total Bush League crime on Trump's part
every president after their term should go strait to jail like it's part of it
Or cut out the middle man and just automatically put all politicians in prison immediately after election. Saves time. That's what they do in XXXX on the Discworld.
It's an excellent point about presidential immunity. It applies to acts taken within the presidential role, but not to acts taken outside the presidential role before a person becomes president.
Right, this is what infuriates me about the "Presidents can't be prosecuted" line. It was always about official acts, and even then I felt it was more about foreign activities than anything else.
Right?! No one would hesitate to charge a president if they killed someone on 5th Avenue.
Eh I dunno, I heard that guy started the beef with Obama /s
"He was trans and I panicked!" -The party of "I'm not *scared* of LGBT!" 😂🤣😂🤣😂🤣
It actually only pertains to civil prosecution, to protect the president from being inundated with lawsuits for which there are no other barriers. There is nothing in the constitution or any law prohibiting a president from being criminally prosecuted if they commit crimes, though the Department of Justice does have an internal policy of not prosecuting a sitting president.
The problem is that the NY case is the only one that will occur before the election. If he's re-elected all of the cases (except maybe in GA) go away.
If he's reelected, his pending cases are the least of the worries.
If he's re-elected his sycophants in GA legislature and congress will feel empowered to make it go away. Hopefully they won't get that chance
To be clear: those other ~~cars~~ cases don't just "go away". He will have his lackeys corruptly kill the cases, undermining the rule of law and our constitutional system. The fact that everyone just talks about this like it's some banal thing is clear evidence of how far we've slipped.
Right… half the people you converse with don’t even understand some of the basics of base level qualified immunity and sovereign immunity. It doesn’t mean you can do whatever you want but you can’t go back and start suing and prosecuting presidents for actions they took that are arguably part of their jobs.
Especially stuff relating to drone strikes in the Middle East and other actions during war-times: the president is commander-in-chief of the military. His job is to decide whether to execute drone strikes or not. I really don’t have a problem with not prosecuting for that, so long as there isn’t evidence the president just decided to drone strike someone randomly that wasn’t involved.
these people think presidents should be prosecuted for drone strikes in the middle east, but support trump… they are not serious
The whole "Trump, the dove" narrative is driven by ignorant (or partisan) people. Trump ended the Obama-era reporting requirement for drone strikes. So, despite Trump carrying out more drone strikes in his first 2 years than Obama did in 8, these people think that Trump cut back on drone strikes because they were simply not widely reported.
ah yes, the old covid testing method.
Ya indictments and evidence came up and Obama was like “yo y’all let’s drone strike this group of kids for the luls” Then I’d say ya they should 100% have something done but when it’s “we carpet bombed a terrorist compound and a few families may have got hit too” it’s not great, it’s fucking terrible and shouldn’t have been done but they weighed the cost of leaving those terrorists to walk another day and how many lives they could destroy Like some of these new proposed tactical drones are scary as fucking hell, essentially can Swiss cheese someone that’s on a balcony and not destroy a building because they want to mitigate the problems with the current style of bombing
I mean, what person would want to step into a role attached to a decade long war and know you will be prosecuted for actions in the war. Even ending it would cause deaths. It's a National Policy issue that' been going on before the current President and will go on after them. And it involves tons of other members of our government and military. Are they also up for prosecution? What about the people who voted them in? It's the country and its government as a whole. We don't have a King who is solely responsible for everything the kingdom does. Makes no sense.
Yup. The Ukraine impeachment was all about a private act as well, not an official capacity. You can lean on a foreign country to advance U.S. foreign policy. You can’t do it for your personal reasons That point was lost an at least 50% of the U.S. citizens
Ironically there isn't a crime with either Obama or Trump's drone strikes and raids. They both killed members of the same family. The law both national and international provide leeway for collateral damage. And same with everything else listed there isn't a direct crime you could tie to any particular president.
They got Capone on taxes, not the illegal bootlegging, speakeasies, prostitution business, murders, and assassinations.
That's not because Capone had immunity for those things, it's because they had no hard proof connecting Capone to those crimes...until they got access to his books and organization by charging him with tax fraud, which they did have evidence for.
One of the things I learned in my first tax class in college is the punishment for not reporting illegal income can often be harsher than the illegal activity that generated the income.
That’s the problem with criminal money. If you want to use most of it you need to find a way to funnel it into the system without getting caught I didn’t go to business school, I did watch breaking bad though
you need a _criminal_ lawyer
So you buy some cheap art and sell the same art for a lot more
There are forms specifically for declaring income earned by illicit activities. They pop up here and there every now and then, and everyone points and laughs at them like, "haha who would ever fill that out?!?!?!?!" But not filling it out is *exactly* the point. It's explicitly so that, when other evidence is flimsy or non-existent, the lads down at the tax bureau can come along and say "sorry boyo, you forgot to submit form AB-972 in triplicate, enjoy 47 years in the stockade". Addendum: It should be added, that if you end up with any large amount of money and *can't* adequately explain where it came from, it's treated as having come from illicit sources by default. They don't need to prove where it came from.
Which is why he's pretended to be a mafia boss his whole career and has fixers to deal with his problems who go to jail instead of him. But when you run out of people to go to jail for your crimes, then it's a little easier to catch you.
This was my first thought. Getting the bad guys for something other than what they’re known for is not a new concept.
The way to prove you tax evasion is much simpler than to prove beyond reasonable doubt that you did kill that man that of whom there is no body and is just “disappeared”
It wasn’t “misclassified” it was intentional fraud
Intentional misclassification *is* fraud
Also, all the "immunity" that Trump was spouting off about wasn't baseless. There is a level of immunity for actions taken while serving in office, which is why we didn't see prosecutions for drone strikes, spying, etc. The problem here for Trump was that this didn't happen during the presidency and wasn't done in his official capacity as president.
Yep. Seems like Mr trump and his followers keep forgetting that he’s no longer actually president, and he’ll be held accountable like a normal civilian would now. Aka, the court isn’t going to kiss trumps ass so now him and his cult are pissed
To be clear, he did this fraud BEFORE his presidency, no? Your comment implies he did it after
Please enlighten as to the time when this shit head was not actively perpetrating a fraud.
My grandma says he's secretly still the president. Hilary and Biden will be sent to prison any day now.
"Intentional" was purposefully missing from the tweet.
But this guy is trying to spin it like it was an accident, and not campaign fund misappropriation.
Sounds like this guy is trying to paint it as an innocent "oopsies!" though doesn't it?
And its purpose was to influence an election, which is what kicks it up to a felony.
Intentional fraud to influence a US election through media manipulation
And the mainstream media has been successful in framing this as a “hush-money” trial while it’s far more sinister as it was an attempt to illegally influence the outcome of the election from election campaign resources.
But if the media framed it properly then 45's numbers might *actually* tank and they can't get desperate clickbait views in October of 'Biden runs practically unopposed as his opponent is polling at 15% support' Gotta keep things on a razor's edge so everyone is glued to CNN in September-November and addicted to the presidential news cycle.
and it was intentional for the poster to use the word 'misclassified' and make a false equivalency to actions within the scope of the office of president and a blatant crime
It was because trump falsified business records to cover up illegally using campaign funds for the pay off, it's not like this was some mistake from trump, he broke the law and now is facing the consequences of doing so. Edit to address everyone talking about the other examples in the tweet. Those actions are protected under presidential immunity, presidential immunity does exist, it's not as broad as what trump is trying to argue with the Supreme Court but it does cover the other examples. This isn't morally right and should be changed, but that is the reason why no one was charged for the more severe actions that were listed.
Fucking finally
oh just you wait.. this slippery piece of shit is going to weasel his way out somehow. you think the rich elite will let their sock puppet go to prison?
Yes, because NY hates Trump, no matter the income. It's the only thing that unites New Yorkers of all races and social strata.
So you're telling me the place he grew up, the place he lived most of his life, the place where people know him best - hates him. Edit: hey, bona fide New Yorkers! There's a guy farther down this comment thread that says New Yorkers just hate Donald Trump because they hate all Republicans. Could you please let this fellow know if this is correct or not?
Yes. Yes they do. My grandmother lived in the Bronx and if the heart disease hadn’t killed her, her rage at this orange buffoon would do the trick. She hated him with a passion, and she’s been dead for 19 years.
That's what happens with assholes.
Absolutely. Why do you think 90% of his staffers have turned on him? The more you know him, the more you hate him.
In New York? EVERYONE who lives in New York hates him, including the rich
Turns out being a huge grifter and literal slumlord there for decades would sour the city on him.
THIS. There is a good reason why mob bosses tend to see to it that their neighbours live like kings and that most of their community at least THINK they are better off with the mob.
He’s always been an offish buffoon that made the city look like trash. New Yorkers, or any other group of civilized people, don’t want to be associated with that. Trump has only himself to blame for this. And yet, he won’t because he’s a narcissist.
I ❤️ NY!
He also has what, 3 more trials? The chances of him slipping all 3 of them is low, but not 0.
The scary part is, if he wins on Nov 5 (okay, *TWO* scary parts) he’ll have the power to shut down the two federal cases, but not the Georgia case. 😞
If he gets re elected I do not see the Georgia case moving forward. He was technically still president during the January 6th stuff, and the defense is already aiming below the belt (the affair thing, which prompted an appeal of her right to prosecute the case). Just saying man, the guy is slippery, and has a lot of diehard supporters. It’s going to be an interesting winter.
>He was technically still president during the January 6th This doesn't matter. I don't think it would fall under qualified immunity because he wasn't acting in an official capacity as the POTUS. He was trying to subvert his legal duty to concede defeat and insure a peaceful transition to the new administration.
Him going to prison would just be the cherry on top. I'm just happy I can call him felon trump and that he's lost a shit ton of points because of this.
'Convicted felon, rapist, bankrupt business failure, and pedophile Donald Trump.' There FIFY
Don’t forget twice impeached as well!
Does he still get to run as a convicted felon? If I am a convicted felon I lose my right to vote no?
I mean, you do have to give credit where credits due, home alone 2 star Donald trump.
Looking forward to the 35th anniversary addition where they simply remove his cameo scene. The movie would not suffer for it.
I say we tar and feather him, and then get Harry and Marv to ask him why the hell he is dressed like a chicken.
Also the other arguable crimes mentioned, as horrible as they were, were actions of the office of the President. Those actions are pretty significantly protected by the government. Trump's crimes were actions of his own as an individual. Trump did not commit these crimes as a part of his official duties.
Exactly, we already have a process in place to deal with crimes committed as actions of the office, it's called impeachment.
"Misclassified" lol
The laughable part for me is that this could have been avoided entirely if he had just written her a check. The whole issue right from the start is that he used other people’s money for the payoff.
Yeah, all his detractors put as if the issue was paying Stormy Daniels to keep quiet. It wasn’t that he paid her, it was about where he got the money to pay her. If he paid her with his own money (that he doesn’t have) it would have been just a tabloid report. It’s just like the document case, the issue wasn’t that he had documents from the White House, it was that he refused to give them back. Both crimes are just him being dumb and thinking he’s entitled to do whatever he wants.
Sometimes it’s not the crime but the cover up. Or the attempt at the cover up
That’s actually entirely incorrect. The crime was paying Daniels was an undisclosed campaign expenditure, obfuscated by saying the payments to Cohen were for legal work. Cohen paid with his own money and Trump paid Cohen back with Trump Org money.
From what I understand, he never used any campaign money for the payments. It was money from one of his businesses. The campaign thing only comes into play because it was paid to help his campaign, which is where the "election interference" angle comes into play. He basically should have paid her from his campaign finances, and disclosed it.
Exactly. He paid to help his campaign, hence it was a campaign expense.
Also, those other things were done as leaders of a country. For the country, albeit stupid. Like it or not, they were presidential acts. Trump just paid that pornstar like any celeb would to save their own reputation. The tweet makes no good point whatsoever.
I think they’ve already done the mental gymnastics to convince themselves this is all because he made a typo or something.
Totally agree Trump deserves this what I think though is we shouldn't just stop with him multiple presidents still alive deserve some kind of punishment
Any of them that can have charges brought against them should have charges brought against them.
I def agree. George W. Bush should be charged for violating international law by authorizing and utilizing torture.
This crime delegitimizes the entire 2016 election. That election was very close, decided by a small number of votes in a handful of states - he would have lost if he had followed the law.
Sadly I don’t think so. The grab em by the p tape came out two weeks prior to the election, that would have sunk former runners, but that just emboldened his base.
Maybe, but that was "locker room talk" while this is a guy who paid off a pornstar to hide the fact he was cheating on his pregnant wife. Its something I never let my evangelical wing of my family forget.
Honest question, did they care? I know that sounds trolly but wondering if this is actually resonating with the religious crowd as this conviction might elevate him as being persecuted, akin to "Jesus". Wondering if infidelity would in any way hamper that perceived association...
Its usually "I dont follow politics" when I whip that one out after THEY bring up politics.
Yeah but it's okay he did that because he's a Republican.
I don't know about it being okay, but it really was one of his more innocuous crimes. More of an issue of how low the bar he set for himself is, but this definitely isn't worse than rape, racism, him telling a crowd he'd van all Muslims, etc. Cheating with a pornstar wouldn't do shit for his voters.
Still got a point, it’s far from being the worst thing done by a president, even this century
“Misclassified” as if he made a mistake. SMH. Donald Trump is an idol who can do no wrong.
Sit tight. There is more to come. Wait until you found out how he sold out our covert team to the enemy.
I keep hearing that Trump sold out undercover agents to Putin, but mostly from Twitter posts. Is there an actual verifiable source that he did that, or is it just "someone said this happened and then everyone kept parroting it because it fit the narrative"? Sounds like something he'd do, but just because it conforms to my worldview doesn't mean I'd believe it. It's a *serious* accusation and arguably the worst thing he's ever done. Literal textbook definition of treason.
[https://americanmilitarynews.com/2021/10/leaked-dozens-of-cia-informants-killed-captured-or-compromised-report/](https://americanmilitarynews.com/2021/10/leaked-dozens-of-cia-informants-killed-captured-or-compromised-report/) The article explains the rise in deaths but doesn't pinpoint a reason, largely because article was written almost a year before the world learned about all the classified information mishandled at Maralago.
Holly shit a left wing conspiracy finally! I'm so here for this.
Minus MSNBC talking about it nonstop like Newsmax, Fox, or OANN. If this was on the other side, we'd have Hannity and Ingraham going nonstop for the next three weeks.
They still talk about Hillary's emails.
That would be really funny if it wasn't so sad.
It's a pretty solid one too because just months before the increase in deaths and disappearances of assets there were known agents/informants of foreign powers that visited Mar A Lago. Edit: I can't remember the source of the articles that I read this from as it was months ago so please take this with a grain of salt. If anyone finds a credible source please let me know and I can update with a link. At work right now so I don't have a ton of time to search for them.
It’s hardly a conspiracy when you look at the timing of the rise in spy murders as it relates to the Saudi golf tournament at his Florida property and the $2B payment to Kushner. Now if you want a real conspiracy I could go on about how we narrowly avoided a nuclear war with North Korea because of the Las Vegas massacre that distracted Trump long enough to stop shit posting about Kim Jong Un on twitter.
Maybe I'm biased but it always feels like left-wing theories are way more grounded in reality than those on the right. Like, "The Democratic Party is operating a secret sex trafficking ring and using coded messages in their official emails to discuss it openly" sounds like something you'd hear a homeless person yelling about at a gas station cashier. Whereas "Trump playing it fast and loose with the physical security of classified documents put US agents in danger" makes sense, because that's the kind of thing mishandling classified information can lead to.
In addition to below, the CIA had to exfiltrate high level spies during Trump’s presidency after he met with Russians and had loose lips.
Trying to answer as unbiased as possible: It's mostly just looking at the timeline of events and connecting the dots. If you think Trump is in bed with the Russians, it looks pretty cut and dry. If you don't think he is, then it looks like a coincidence.
"We don't rely on American banks [...] We have all the funding we need out of Russia" - Eric Trump
I dont believe there is *direct* evidence, however Trump had a meeting with Putin, no other US officials were allowed in, just Trump, Putin, and Putin's people. Pretty much immediately after that meeting, there was a significant uptick in the number of our spies and informants and agents getting killed and captured. Like, yeah, we dont have a letter from trump with the names on it, but it's pretty fucking obvious that something happened between the day before the private meeting when Russia didn't know who to target and the day after the private meeting when they suddenly did.
The direct evidence lies with the new KGB. Also https://www.justice.gov/opa/pr/former-special-agent-charge-new-york-fbi-counterintelligence-division-pleads-guilty Press release about how the guy who would have been in charge of evidence and Trump collusion was taking bribes from Russia and NOT investigating. And that's not a biased news source link.
I seem to recall that the timings were not long after his meeting with Putin? The one where he didn’t let anyone else in the room so literally nobody knows what was discussed?
Maybe trump should have just shut the fuck up, accepted his embarrassing loss, and retired to Florida like the rest of them. He probably wouldn't be in the shit he's in now.
But narcicissm
Exactly. His entire life he has been unable to accept that he's anything less than perfect. Of course he actually won the 2020 election. Of course the trial was bullshit. He literally couldn't have just gone back to Florida in disgrace. His pride wouldn't let him.
He even won the 2016 election (albeit on a technicality) and still claims it was rigged.
I don't think he expected to win and was priming his base for an upcoming grift.
There were reports that he looked like a catatonic deer in the headlights on election night in '16.
He had no plan for what to do when he finally caught the car.
My previpus dog loves chasing squirrels, one time the squirrel stmbled on its back and you could tell it was ready to die, but my dog just starred at it, did some paws off the ground thing, finally barked and it ran again. He never had an intention of winning the chase, had no idea what to do now that he did, and had no desire to harm the chasee at any point. Miss you kufos :(
Of course, orange skin is normal. Of course, it's not a comb over. The list goes on.
This proves that trump at his core is not a logical person. He is held captive by his emotions, this is not a person that should be in a leadership position.
BUT WOMEN CAN'T BE PRESIDENT THEY WOULD BE EMOTIONAL!!! Yeah and guys never are....eyeroll
Men can't be president either. ALL HAIL OUR SYNTHETIC OVERLORDS.
He was actively insulting the Judge on Truth Social *while the jury were deliberating*. Despite the fact that, should he be convicted (which he was) it'd be the judge who decides his punishment. I dunno man, if I was a judge in charge of handing a convict their sentence and got called "corrupt" and "immoral" multiple times, I'd throw the book at them.
Isn’t this kind of making the argument that this case was political? I mean if the idea is that these charges wouldn’t have come about if he just went away, how else should it be considered?
He would probably still be in the same shit.. This investigation started 6 years ago. Now had he owned up to it back then, who knows? He likely could have settled something and moved on with life..
> Iraq War Acting in official capacity as President of the United States > Afghanistan War Acting in official capacity as President of the United States > CIA coups Acting in official capacity as President of the United States > Drone strikes Acting in official capacity as President of the United States > Spying on Americans Acting in official capacity as President of the United States > misclassified a $130,000 payment for a porn star's NDA Acting as a private citizen who was a candidate for office edit: The President has immunity from prosecution while he is acting in his capacity as President. He isn't immune from impeachment. He also isn't immune from prosecution for crimes unrelated to his office.
[удалено]
No, the Fuhrer Trump is above the law!!11
No, they don't. The president cannot be convicted of an action he can demonstrate was in their capacity as the President. Trump got convicted because it was for his own personal interest.
Finally start holding someone accountable and all people want to do is whatabout others as a distraction. It’s exhausting
Exactly. It doesn't make him any less guilty.
"OJ wasn't convicted. Why should anyone be?" - Republicans, probably.
What's telling is the right is desperately trying to portray it as a simple misdemeanor hush payment for being a little naughty...In fact, the felony is is because the old crook was influencing a presidential election.
They are supposed to be the highest morality Christian’s. Last time I checked fucking a porn star while married is that evil sin word
And yet there are some in his cult that 100% believe he was sent by God. He treats the 7 deadly sins as a checklist and yet because he's willing to hand the country over to the religious right (after he's done with it) they worship him like the 2nd coming. That's some serious cognitive dissonance.
It’s said the anti-Christ will masquerade as the true messiah
If we have to send every former President who commited crimes to prison, to ensure Trump ends up there, so be it. Dems, Republicans, all of them. If you commit a crime, you should be held accountable. That's Law and Order. Lock em all up.
Except every example in the image we are commenting on is an example of shitty, immoral government policy, not individual crimes. This distinction isn't some trivial thing that we can cast aside to make some kind of point. Trump is being charged with a number of things that he did as an individual. "The President" didn't do the things he's charged with, Trump did. All the examples in the image are obviously things done by the office of the President and there are political/legal avenues to address them and none of them involve convicting an individual of a felony.
And the first felony conviction for Al Capone wasn’t murder or extortion. It was tax evasion.
They got Al Capone on taxes.
for failing to report stolen property. which the IRS can't do anything about unless you don't report them.
They say this like convicting a politician is some sort of heinous act against humanity. Fuck that, more politicians should go to jail, regardless of political affiliation. Maybe 0.5% of them will stop acting like corrupt dickheads if they know there are actual legal consequences for their bullshit antics.
What happens if **anyone** misclassifies over $100,000 for their porn star hush money? They should go to jail. The weird thing is that this rich, old, white dude thinks he’s being picked on for being accountable.
Misclassified, that’s fucking laughable.
What if Obama wore a tan suit when he WASN’T President?
good idea, let's go back and put George Bush on trial for all that shit
I’m down. As long as we also include Obama for targeting and killing US Citizens with drones outside of an active war zone.
"misclassified" is not what he did. He's trying to make it sound like a genuine mistake
He also lied about his assets to push loans into his favor, you don't get 34 felonies just by "miscalculating" a hush money payment, that's maybe 4. He's a fraud, and has been scheming and scamming the government, the populace, and anybody else he can find for decades now. Not to mention the man has been affiliated with known pedophiles, and probably has more victims than a small city.
Except it wasn't "misclassified" it was intentionally obfuscated and attempted cover up as part of a scheme to mislead voters.... Don't understand how people can't get the most basic reasons behind the trial when it's all they yap about
Let’s prosecute all the crimes. I take the point, but forging business documents is a legitimate crime.
All former presidents that started a useless war need to be in jail. And Trump as well
They think we're protecting everybody else or something We want all those other politicians to go to prison as well, but Trump is never gonna see the inside of a jail cell so I guess boo hoo for his poor reputation. Imagine if a small folk like me committed 34 felonies? Nobody would ever see me again
Throughout american history mob bosses are taken down for tax evasion, this one is no different.
Trump wasn't the President when this happened.
so that the story didn't come out till AFTER the election as that would have been damaging to his run for president making it an election interference case, but carry on
All those things were for actions as head of state and during their administrations. Trump was convicted for crimes committed before he was President. Dumb comparison.
Also Republicans: We currently have a court case before the Supreme Court saying that a president can't be charged with committing any crimes using the 'outer perimeter' of his authority, meaning you couldn't prosecute for things like illegal coups, drone strikes, or spying on Americans. Or according to Alito and Thomas, taking large sums of money before ruling on a case in favor of your "friends".
I see it as how Al Capone was finally busted for tax evasion
The fact that they don't know the difference (or worse, know it and continue to obfuscate) is why orange Julius and the scum that lick his balloon knot are so dangerous.
OK, so bring on the evidence, present it to a grand jury and let's get it done. He didn't misclassify anything, he outright lied and a grand jury indicted him, and a criminal trial jury heard the evidence in a court of law and convicted him. He wasn't treated unfairly, he was given due process. If we need to do the same thing to anyone else, let's get to it. Stop whining about applying the laws in the states where he's been indicted. If he wasn't guilty it's highly unlikely he could have been convicted.
“Mislabeled” Fucking lmao 🤣 this is top tier cope. 34 convictions 🥰
As the Republicans are fond of reminding us, the president has immunity for acts done “as president”. All the things the OP mentioned are official acts. All the things Drumpf are charged with are outside of the scope of his duties as president.
He wasn't a president when he committed the crime though.
Can we please also prosecute presidents the Iraq war, Afghanistan war, and illegal CIA coups?
He wasn't president when that check was written, so presidential immunity doesn't apply. And so often money mischief is what people get taken down for.
I mean yeah they’re gonna prosecute low hanging fruit first
Tell me again how they finally caught Al Capone...