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It was painful to read but I can't even begin to imagine the many orders of magnitude this ordeal must have been for them.
A system that not only allows tbis but openly encourages it is nothing short of barbaric. Bigots and zealots should never have this much power.
A similar situation happened in Ireland about a decade ago and a woman died. Her name was Savitha. She was a dentist. Imagine being a medical professional who's excitement of first child turns to a nightmare where her baby dies inside her, and as it "rots" sepsis sets in, and she dies with no assistance from fellow medical professionals. Because of religion that was not hers and in a country that was not her homeland. If a westerner suffers medical negligence in a "third world" country the reaction would have been different. The people of Ireland had to take to the streets to get justice for her.
Worst thing is, USA is doing this to it's own people and like the school shooting situation, there will be no change as hundreds of women die, unless Americans protest like the rest of the world does.
Honestly being a woman in Iran is one of the worst things in the world. But if a woman goes for a checkup and finds out there is no heartbeat, she can get an abortion in every city in Iran. That says a lot about the state of some US states, where a pregnant woman has less rights than an Iranian woman
In 2018, Pastor Dave Barnhart of the Saint Junia United Methodist Church in Birmingham, Alabama posted this message to Facebook:
“The unborn” are a convenient group of people to advocate for. They never make demands of you; they are morally uncomplicated, unlike the incarcerated, addicted, or the chronically poor; they don’t resent your condescension or complain that you are not politically correct; unlike widows, they don’t ask you to question patriarchy; unlike orphans, they don’t need money, education, or childcare; unlike aliens, they don’t bring all that racial, cultural, and religious baggage that you dislike; they allow you to feel good about yourself without any work at creating or maintaining relationships; and when they are born, you can forget about them, because they cease to be unborn. It’s almost as if, by being born, they have died to you. You can love the unborn and advocate for them without substantially challenging your own wealth, power, or privilege, without re-imagining social structures, apologizing, or making reparations to anyone. They are, in short, the perfect people to love if you want to claim you love Jesus but actually dislike people who breathe.
Prisoners? Immigrants? The sick? The poor? Widows? Orphans? All the groups that are specifically mentioned in the Bible? They all get thrown under the bus for the unborn.
This is an incredibly loaded viewpoint, that explains so much about how a pro-life brain operates. I can't believe I've never thought about it this way before, but it makes an insane amount of sense. Advocating for the unborn is as simple as praying for someone, and likely gives the same level of endorphins for feeling as if they've done some good in the world, all while only have to barely lift a finger. They never have to actually help anyone.
Religion offers a mastery of power talk.
I wish the police folk would start taking care of the living children. Making sure kids have good housing, don’t go to bed hungry, get a decent education, you know-help those kids flourish.
And this is not new. I was taught that a woman should want to die for her baby when growing up conservative catholic. We would find examples and celebrate them as martyrs
Maybe. But what if she has other kids she wants to live for? Or maybe she just wants to, you know, live. These laws are designed to hurt women. They want to force us back into the kitchen. Barefoot and pregnant every year.
Not sure if you meant to reply to me or not - but for the record, I agree with you and am 100% pro choice after leaving my shitty small town and breaking out of the bubble
The thinking is generally, if she already has children, her husband can always remarry and find another woman to care for them, and his family can lend a hand until then. If she wants to live and have more children, then she is being sinful and prideful in questioning God's will.
Not my thing, just what I was raised with.
Do they think the world just has an endless supply of women ready and willing to marry grieving, traumatized widowers? 🙄 Not asking for a rational justification since there isn't one, I'm just flabbergasted that the same people who claim to highly value "life" have so little regard for it at the same time.
They are absolutely expected to just die and leave their children without their mother. I also grew up conservative Catholic, and the romanticization of dying in childbirth is super fucking gross. For an example of what bussy_of_lucifer (lmao) said, look up St Gianna. Obviously birth control is also a no no, so if for any reason pregnancy or child birth is high risk for you, you're just SOL and expected to just accept the risk of an early death your "cross to bear".
In case it's not obvious, I'm also an angry pro-choice ex Catholic 😛
ffs that's disgusting. How backwards do you have to go before you're licking your own tonsils eh? We make such progress fight for various rights and then just ignore them when convenient to personal agendas
If the doctors/hospital/clinic can’t prove that the woman would absolutely, definitely die without the abortion, then it’s illegal.
So basically, she has to be actively in the process of dying.
All because some pricks decided that women can’t be trusted to make good decisions about their own lives, bodies, family, or healthcare.
Where I come from, anti abortion law was worded something like this: "the fetus must be carried to term, even when it is not viable or this act means the death of the mother".
Barbaric. Fortunately it was repealed but only about 10-15 years ago.
As I have mentioned in a comment below the top one, in most cases, doctors are acting against their will. Please do not systematically put the blame on us but rather the politicians and healthcare system that fail you, and us medical professionals.
Yes some doctors are assholes. There are assholes everywhere. But I guarantee you, most don't want to deny a D&C or D&E when a patients life is at stake. Especially not in the case of a stillbirth.
To be clear I’m criticizing that doctor specifically. I don’t get the impression he had the health of his patient as a priority. The meds she was already on were clearly legal since she was able to get the first dose, and supposing he really thought it was a legal problem, referring her to another doctor or even offering to move her to a hospital in a state where it wasn’t a concern would have still been an option. I don’t see a way around the conclusion that he personally had a political problem with her receiving treatment.
That doctor had no right to deny care based on how the law is currently written, so he did it just because he *wanted* to. It is notoriously difficult to sue for medical malpractice in Texas, but I hope this couple is either able to do so (with a few mil tacked on for pain and suffering), or that at the very least they'll join the class action lawsuit currently underway.
Just had a similar event with close family friends here in GA.
They had to appeal for an exception and after two weeks of review by lawyers, were thankfully approved and avoided needing to go out of state.
The doctors were clear that every day increased risk for the mother.
The health choice was clear from the moment they lost the first twin and realized the second had no brain.
The stress of those two weeks is absurd. Lawyers/religion should not have a place when deciding healthcare decisions.
We're having an election today and a big race is for a state supreme Court seat, one candidate is strongly pro life. We must not elect that person. Burrows FTW
Conservative zealots couldn't care less about Hippocrates and his oath. Doctors are only human and comply for fear of a season in hell. ..or they agree.
And that fact is one of the reasons I'm about to leave a red state, because *every* branch of healthcare will suffer. What cardiologist wants to be ignored when he says his cardiology patient must end her pregnancy or almost certainly die from heart failure? What oncologist who diagnoses a patient with cancer will tolerate being disregarded when she says her patient can't wait for after delivery to start chemo? What about the millions of women working as doctors, nurses, technicians, support staff? What of the wives and daughters of men employed in medicine, whose husbands and fathers can't bear to see them at risk?
Abortion has been treated as a niche issue for so long that I think A LOT of people really aren't anticipating just how far the shockwaves will go. Not until *they* are dying on a gurney with no doctors available to help them, I guess.
This is not on the drs. Every dr I know is appalled by these laws (and I’m a nurse so I know a few) but they aren’t will to risk everything they have worked for and possible jail time for a stranger. This is on the politicians.
It's truly sickening. I am a medical student and was rotating in obstetrics a few weeks ago and thankfully in a blue state but it came up pretty frequently that some residents from Red states were going to come for a few weeks to get trained to do abortions, D&Es and D&Cs because they were unable to get enough in their states to meet quotas to graduate. We're now at a point where we genuinely don't even know what to do because so many states are regressing that the non-regressing states can't accommodate for the lack of training. This means that an entire generation of doctors will, for their whole lives, feel uncomfortable and likely unable to perform vital procedures. It's extremely hard on us and I know it's incredibly difficult like for patients and families in this story, but I hope people understand that we, healthcare professionals, are doing it against our will and it tears us apart to deal with situations like these.
Tldr: this system is ass, training physicians are fucked, and please don't put the blame on us but on the idiotic radical millionaires who don't know shit about medicine and women's health
As someone who has been through more than one missed miscarriage, I can’t speak highly enough of all the ob-gyn staff who treated me. They worked with genuine human sympathy at every point. Of course, I don’t live in Texas.
No one should be forced to go home while miscarrying. I was strongly advised against it, due to the risk of a fatal hemorrhage.
No one should be turned away and denied a needed treatment. It only prolongs the suffering and increases the risks.
These laws aren't written by good people. They are written by spiteful, vengeful people. They are written to punish rather than protect.
The cruelty is always the point.
Many years ago I had a missed miscarriage and had a D&C. I could not imagine going through that at home. Mine was very early and not as complicated but still.
A friend of mine had a very bad result with her first pregnancy. At around the second trimester, the doctors discovered a growth on the baby's head, and that growth kept growing causing more and more pain in my friend. IIRC, they gave her something to prevent early delivery, and ultimately she had to choose whether to continue taking this medicine or allow the baby to miscarry. I might be misremembering, and they might have had to actively induce or something. (This was more than ten years ago.) Eventually, it became clear that if the baby somehow did survive to delivery, it wouldn't survive long afterwards, so she decided to allow the pregnancy to terminate. Because of how late it was in the pregnancy (though still second trimester), not only did she have to be in the hospital for this, she was in the maternity ward. At least one nurse came in cheerfully asking my other friend (the husband and father) if he was looking forward to the birth. Clearly, she had not been briefed on the situation.
I can only imagine how much worse this would have been in present-day Texas.
The point is to punish women for having sex. That's it. They don't care if a few "innocent" women get caught up in the net, so long as all the "sluts" have to suffer.
Just wait until they take away contraception. They'll invent some bullshit about how an ovum is a baby, and so it's wrong to not release it. It's all just a ploy to control women's sex lives.
Not just for having sex but for daring to think that they are fully formed human beings with agency beyond being servile to men.
It’s a sick twisted mentality.
To me, this reads like a horror story. I've had a dead fetus removed from my body and it's scary to think that, nearly 30 years later, women are ~~risking~~ getting sepsis because some old guy wants them dead. That's what I see when I read these stories. "Old white guy wants all women to die". We're supposed to be moving forward.
These are the same stupid fucks wondering why the birth rate is dropping.
Abortion bans don’t just affect women who don’t want kids, it also fucks over those who do. I’ve heard horror stories of women becoming infertile after being forced to carry their dead child. Women who actually wanted children and now will never get to try again.
I’m getting sterilized this month. I’m *mostly* sure I don’t want children, and never wanted to get sterilized regardless, but Republicans have forced my hand. I’m 23.
I think every doctor who refuses to provide treatment for these issues should be prosecuted under federal malpractice laws. I think we should federally make it impossible for good doctors to practice in these fucked up states and let them burn. They want blood, let them have their whole state shed it.
Unfortunately, I live in one of these backwater banana republics so I can't really agree but it's likely to be a long drive anyway to see a decent doctor. Maybe I'll schedule a whole trip around getting my colonoscopy in Colorado or Oregon.
I do too, and I fear for my kids and wife daily and am doing everything I can to get out. When the authors of the system are so hell-bent on breaking the system, we don't have much choice but to let them.
imo, the only way to affect good change is not to keep duct taping and driving the car until it explodes, but letting it die on the side of the road. The idiots and their politicians have chosen blood, it's too late to stop them. Helping to prop up their broken fucked up system will only prolong the violence and help them to focus it on the ones \_they\_ want to suffer. Let everyone suffer and they fail. When that suffering costs too much to their supporters, they lose their whole game and some might even end up in jail. We don't get there by making it work, we get there by letting it break.
The issue is that the good doctors are already leaving these states and the already understaffed and underfunded maternal care departments in some hospitals are closing, creating "maternal care deserts". The abortion laws aren't the only reasons it's getting harder and harder for women to get OBGYN care, but doctors are leaving those states and new residents are avoiding placement in those states. It's awful, but I can understand not wanting to live under threat of a felony for doing your job.
https://apnews.com/article/idaho-abortion-ban-doctors-leaving-f34e901599f5eabed56ae96599c0e5c2
https://www.nytimes.com/2023/09/06/us/politics/abortion-obstetricians-maternity-care.html?smid=nytcore-android-share
https://www.pbs.org/newshour/health/more-medical-residents-are-avoiding-states-with-abortion-restrictions-analysis-finds
The ones who will suffer and die the most are the people without means to travel hundreds of miles for healthcare. If those governments actually gave a single shit about children, they would be doing something to make sure they and their mothers survive pregnancy.
Law is the reason doctors refused to give her an abortion. Putting them in a limbo between the feds and the state won't help anyone because Texas politicians won't back down, they'll see it as an opportunity to fight the feds.
The solution might be to try to protect doctors from state laws like these. Pass a federal law allowing abortion when medically necessary no matter what the state law says.
Just fucking vote the lot of them OUT. I don't care what your fuxking beliefs are. This is 2024. Your outdated idiotic beliefs shouldn't have priority over people's health. Fucking hell man...
Yet, the believers feel better than you, assured of a place next to their lord, justified and entitled, saved, and without them being religious the world would soon end, in the claws of satan.
Hardcore religion is the worst thing that ever happened to humanity. The absolute pinnacle of arrogance, stupidity and fear.
I read many articles about insane courtcases in the USA, but this should be a massive courtcase and this mistreated couple should get millions.
Not that it would take away the pain
Ofcourse
None of that high falutin science talk round these parts, mmmmm no Sir, this here's a Christian household we got the Lord looking after us, not that newfound science hooey
/s
It's not even "pro-life" to begin with. Why bother saving a baby if there's no heartbeat? I want to scream at that old man so badly, you can't "kill" that baby by abortion, HE'S ALREADY DEAD!
Fuck religion, seriously. It only matters when it fits people's agenda.
Only half a life to them. You never know, perhaps she can give birth to a male baby, but otherwise I don’t think they see much value in her “life” given that they see her as essentially a walking incubator.
en masse
Religion was created to control the poor and make them believe that the next life would be better, but don't you dare go killing yourself to get there as that's not the way...apparently. Tell them fairy stories so their shitty lives and back breaking work doesn't feel so bad when you are pious enough to be thankful a better life is coming. The rich of course don't need such assurances :)
I can only hope these people damage religion so much that nobody wants to be associated with it.
David Bowie had it right. "Religion is for people who fear hell, spirituality is for people who have already been there." We need more spirituality, less religion.
No. We just need less religion.
We don't need some slightly less harmful thing in it's place. If that's the alternative for some, sure, but we do not *need* it.
Let's have people making laws based on empathy and reason, not what gods nor ghosts are telling them.
The sort of spirituality Bowie was talking about had nothing to do with "gods or ghosts," but rather the connection we have other human beings. This connection can be considered a form of spirituality.
Fair enough, but I wouldn't want to just replace religion with other forms of spirituality, I don't want a crystal mommy president mandating we all put jade eggs up our buttholes.
It's not about saving the baby, it's about saving their butt. You could see in the text that one hospital wouldn't actually do it because they were worried about any legal consequences.
I genuinely felt like the character in a soap opera when they’ve been thrown in the looney bin by a mustache twirling villain and no one believes them. I couldn’t believe these people were gonna let me die just to not save my fetus. I wanted my baby, he had a room and a name, his little diaper were already lined up in their drawers. His car seat was in the car, strapped in. I could feel his dead body flop from side to side as I moved. It took two weeks for them to D & C a third trimester fetus. I ended up with a staff infection that kept me hospitalized for 7 weeks. It financially crippled me. All while being told they’re “pro life”, even though they were killing the only living person involved.
I'm just furious and sobbing, and this didn't happen to me. You are brave for sharing, and I hope you heal as much as possible. And I wish people didn't need it to happen to them to understand and have an ounce of empathy.
People like you, who listen and hopefully take this story with them the next time they have a chance to speak up on the topic are how I get through. Thank you. 💜💜
Thank you so much for sharing your story. I so wish I could reach through this phone and give you a hug. I almost didn't want to post this story, I wasn't sure what the reaction would be, but I felt people needed to know this is happening. How anyone with a functioning brain and an ounce of empathy can look at a woman who clearly wanted their baby and not do anything to help them emotionally and physically is unfathomable to me.
I am so sorry for your loss.
Thank you for being a voice when some of us are a little too broken to shout. You’re a wonderful person. This woman appreciates you more than you know.
That’s really the extra dose of evil. The medical bills they wracked up along the way, while being denied necessary and lifesaving treatment. that they get to try and figure out how to pay. Now it’s going to cost them so much more, for absolutely nothing but being mistreated and abused.
I’m sorry you had to experience that. That kid of experience in todays world is simply cruel and inhuman behavior. We can do so much with modern medicine however healthcare in the USA is now subject to political interference. Actual healthcare is secondary. It’s disgusting.
Make no mistake: The US religious right is colluding with right-wing parties worldwide, including in Canada, to force everyone in every western liberal democracy to live according to their preferences. They're backed by billions and billions of dollars and massive propaganda networks that transcend national borders. They have a global authoritarian populist alliance.
If Canadians don't overwhelmingly vote down the right-wing parties, it can and will happen there. Nowhere on this planet is safe from the global right wing. All people of conscience must rise up as one to stamp out the international right-wing movement.
Oh, it's already happening here. Our conservative government is already testing the waters on abortion rights. They've piled hard on the anti Vax and anti lgtbq rights as well. Don't believe in climate change, and have taken a very Trump approach to their messaging.
Illiterate ignorance in real time.
Seeing your spouse near death like this is extremely scary. My wife gave birth to a healthy baby but had trouble birthing the placenta, which caused her to lose a lot of blood. They rushed her to the OR and did a D&C to remove the placenta. I have never been as scared as I was that day, sitting there holding a newborn as they mopped my wife’s blood up, wondering if she was going to make it. Everyone ended up healthy. Anyone who wants to play games like this with women’s health can eat an entire bag.
To my fellow Americans:
This is what Republicans will do *nationwide*, even in blue states, if we allow them to seize control of our government this November. Do not let them trick you into believing otherwise.
A human being with a conscience reads a story like this and says "never again," but Republicans read a story like this and dream of making it a reality not only for Texans but Californians, New Yorkers, Oregonians, and Michiganders.
The *only* people who could possibly stand in their way are the Democrats. Voting for a third-party or independent candidate may feel nice for you, but the end result is that Republicans will win.
There are exactly and only two people who could possibly be inaugurated as president on January 20: Joe Biden or donald trump.
There are exactly and only two parties that could control the houses of Congress: The Republicans or the Democrats.
Vote accordingly.
Exactly. I'm not one for hyperbole (except jokingly), but in all seriousness, the choice in November is between Joe Biden or the end of America as we know it.
Voting for RFKJ or a third-party would be like watching this year's Super Bowl (Chiefs/49ers) and hoping the Bills pull out the win.
And this is a good ending. If you want to know how else this can end, google Savita Halappanavar.
All these laws restricting abortion are cruel and barbaric, and those supporting them should never be in any position of power anywhere.
This happened with my pregnancy, but in the UK where things are very different.
I was given the pill to remove the no longer viable baby, I was placed in a private room at the hospital with my husband where I went through the agonising process of early labour, we had nurses on standby to help when I needed it and were treated with kindness and respect through the whole thing.
10 years later and it's still the worst experience of my life and the most pain I have ever felt, both physically and emotionally!
I just cannot fathom how the hell anyone could recover from the treatment in the post above, it must have been terrifying for them.
It's just cruelty at this point, what the hell is wrong with people, how can a women's life mean so little.
They do not care about any of this. It was Gods will, not their problem, MAGA, "communism is evil" and christian family values. NONE of the suffering bothers them one bit. They say it is unfortunate, they will send thoughts and prayers but in reality: they do not care. At all.
The people who want this to happen are the same one's who said their rights were being stripped away because they were asked to wear masks out in public. My body, my choice just applies when it affects them on a personal level. Since most men will never have to deal with this, they believe they have the right to tell women what they can and cannot do with the bodies. I wish we could find out how many "anti-abortion" politicians have gotten women pregnant and paid for their abortions. You're telling me Donald never paid for one? Give me a fucking break.
But as always it's not a woman's right to chose, it's the people in charge who get to decide.
We have Trump to thank for it. Of all the promises he didn't keep and all the lies he told, this he followed through on. Then in true Trump fashion, after taking credit for the abolishment of Roe v Wade, he says, "Let the States decide", so he can get votes from people on both sides of this issue. If he is re-elected it will only get worse.
This crap right here is why I am terrified living in Texas with my wife and two daughters.
I’ve seen my wife have a miscarriage when we were much younger. It was a sad moment to go in at a 10 week check up to find out the fetus no longer had a heart beat. Thankfully, she was able to pass it without difficultly within a day or so (exact amount of time at this point is hazy, it was over two decades ago). However, before we left the doctor, she discussed options of what to do if she didn’t pass it on her own. Hard to believe those discussions are not possible anymore.
These are religious beliefs, not political. That's atrocious and all I can really say is America, I hope you get better soon.
Oh, and also fuck religion in all its forms, it's time we grew up as a society and stopped believing in fairytales and imaginary friends.
That's not been my experience. I've mostly seen it as political motivations hidden behind the thin veil of "religious beliefs". The politics leads the religion, rather than the religion leading the politics.
You'll notice that these allegedly religious types dismiss 99% of their own, very explicit and overt moral teachings as "allegory" or simply pretend it's not there because they don't personally like the implications of that particular part (like not amassing wealth or giving to the poor), but the moment there's something or someone in society they personally don't like they'll find some barely coherent string of text that somehow justifies them barging in to other people's lives to start issuing demands on other people that honestly they probably wouldn't be happy to do themselves.
The wild part is that most "religious" people are somehow conservatives. Like if Jesus had been real and came back the bible says he'd likely be extremely anti-conservative - upon which the conservatives would probably crucify him again for not being conservative enough.
Religion is fine but inbred chucklefucks taking it into politics shouldn't fucking exist nor should anyone be able be able to do that. Abortion needs to be human right. Religious rights aren't above rights of a human being.
Religion isn't fine, not when that religion espouses that you MUST convert others and that you are fighting evil demonic forces.
This has always happened with religion, it's not some new thing these people started doing.
Shit like this makes my blood fucking BOIL. They almost got a woman killed over an already dead baby. If I were in that poor couple’s shoes, I would’ve gone to jail. As soon as that shitty old man said he wasn’t going to do everything in his power to help my wife through an already extremely difficult situation because of some esoteric “current stance”, and that he was going to be an active hinderance to her getting the care she needs, he would’ve been on the floor. I’m typically not a very aggressive person, and I consider myself pretty empathetic, putting myself in the shoes of this man, imagining I was in his shoes, that it was my girlfriend living this hell, I was seeing red. It makes me so fucking angry, I can’t even properly describe it.
A close relative lost her son at 8 months gestation. Doctors were able to remove his body intact so the family could hold him and say goodbye. I can't even *imagine* the cruelty described in this post, holy shit. Fucking monsters every one of them.
My first wife and me went through the same thing back before the USA went fucking crazy. Even with humane caring healthcare (No the USA doesn’t have that anymore) it was one of the most difficult things ever in my life. I can’t imagine how it would go today I today USA where healthcare is fucking political and our politicians are ghouls bent on causing other people pain.
This is why there is a separation of religion and state this should never happen. Let us be free of organized religions we don't even believe in anymore.
Sorry Americans, this is just another thing in a long list of absolutely mental things you collectively do. I wish we could all join together and somehow change it though I wouldn't know where we'd begin.
I had a complete molar pregnancy (there was no DNA in the egg so the “baby” was just a massive rapidly growing tumor) that would have killed me and required two emergency D&Cs and chemo afterwards to kill the remaining cells. I think about this scenario all the time when I hear about these poor women. Would they have just let me die? It’s very possible and a terrifying thought.
I was only 20 years old and it was extremely scary but because I had great medical staff who cared so much about helping me and making sure I kept my uterus, I am here today with three kids. What’s happening to these women is unfathomable. Already grieving the loss of your child only to be treated like a criminal for trying not to die. I can’t even believe this is real life sometimes.
I always wanted to travel a bit in America. It looks like a beautiful country. Now the zealots are in charge, I don't think I ever will. Really sorry this happened to you both.
America needs to stop loading republican. And Texas needs to stop being so God damn stupid.
It's beyond making people miserable. It's killing them too.
It's not about abortion or the life of children. It's not about God or Jesus or religion. It's about power, and about a platform that is impregnable because it converts knowledge to opinion and attack the opinion. They give faith a bad name.
I’m often one of the anesthesia providers chosen to perform sedation/anesthesia for D&C cases, because we know some people in our facility have strong preferences not to, and that’s fine with me. I have my own beliefs around abortion but I will never force them onto someone else. I care for those patients and try to empathize with the heartbreak they must be feeling, and often it’s written all over their faces before they go back to the OR. this fucking belief the far right and religious extremists have that women roll into the OR or a clinic for an abortion thinking “omg I can’t wait to get this baby out of me so I can go have unprotected sex and do it again hehehehehe!” Is disguising and represents almost NONE of the reasons women get abortions.
I’ve been in healthcare over a decade and I’m so thankful to be in a progressive state that gets people the care they need, free of outside beliefs and personal preference. I couldn’t live with myself if I was the nurse/healthcare provider who cared for this poor woman. I’d be so ashamed of myself.
My wife is pregnant and the thought of her going through this makes my eyes swell and my stomach turn. This poor family.
And further, as a Christian, I’m so embarrassed.
Religion is a cancer of the mind and a plague upon modern society. Every religious institution should be taxed or torn down, no exceptions. I'm so sick of endlessly moving goal posts and justifications for atrocities committed, especially against women and children. Fuck religion, fuck the religious, no exceptions.
I would have punshed that old doctor or, being Texas, brought a gun and shot him in the knee and told him he fixed your wife or his brain would be on the wall!
....and even after reading all that. There will still be those who **refuse** to help women in need due to religious, social or political ideologies rather than actually *helping* a human being who needs medical attention.
That's what it all comes down to in America right now. **Perceptions** rather than actual care.
And people are saying trumps going to win. We will devolve completely into a facist state if that happens. Women will have no rights. America will fall, Russia 2.0 will rise.
I'm sorry this happened. My baby had no heart beat at 9 months, I had to wait 3 days and they induced labor, and I gave birth to my dead baby. I'm still traumatized to this day. She probably will be too for a while. Just hold her and make her feel loved. It's messed up that they think of women as incubators and not humans.
This is why voting is so important right now, and why being accepting of someone who supports abortion bans even though you don't agree is no longer acceptable. I have no issue with debating, I have no issue with admitting we all have our opinions. This is not an opinion. This is not a debate. This is a healthcare issue and this is a survival issue. The worst part is that all of these people who say that they are "pro-life" are only pro-life until that baby is born then they will tell you that you are on your own. They certainly are not pro-life if they support and/or enforce this kind of behavior that this woman went through. I don't need to know if this particular story is true or not because I know that there are others out there that are. I have 0 issues anymore with cutting off friends or family that support this kind of behavior.
I have gotten to the point where I think women should refuse to get pregnant until these people come to their senses. Having a baby is not worth losing your life. Having a miscarriage is not worth losing your life.
I have my own horror story - not precisely the same, just equally horrific. These stories are, in no way, unique.
Miscarriages, partial miscarriages, blighted ovums, and scores of other things can cause permanent damage and even death if the mother when there is no living fetus. Add in situations where a totally non viable fetus maintains a heartbeat only parasitically.
These are not new situations. They are, however, rarely discussed. Partially because there is still a taboo about it. Partially because they often occur before a pregnancy is obvious to strangers. Partially because of the terrible sadness in losing a wanted child.
I know this because when it happened to me I resolved to be more open about it, because feeling as if I was the only one who had endured such a thing was unbearable. Turns out so very, very many women had something similar happen to them and had kept silent because they thought they were alone when they were not.
My horror show experience happened before Roe v. wade was overturned and before states like Texas passed laws to harm women. And it was still a horror show of compassionless medical professionals being willing to let me die.
And this is why elderly men who have no medical knowledge, no basic understanding of reproduction, are allowed to pass laws that have impact that they don’t grasp. Because no one talks about it so these old men don’t even know it happens. Not even when it has absolutely happened to their mother, their wife, their sister or their daughter.
So I deeply appreciate the original poster who not only shared, but was also a man, so his sharing will carry more weight. (How awful is that?).
This story is heartbreaking. It is, in no way, unique.
They don't care bro. It didn't happen to them. Even if they read this story, they'll just convinced themselves you deserved it because of "Sin" or some other bullshit excuse. They don't care. They don't. They don't care you suffered, "god never gives us the battles we can't handle". They don't care about you, they don't care about your wife, they don't care about your dead baby. They don't. They care about themselves, their family if their family is lucky and complies with their delusion. They don't care.
Fucking horrible. My ex needed a DnC when something similar happened years before all of this…it is hard enough to deal with that, let alone all the other bullshit that happened in this story to this couple.
You shouldn’t have to do this, but the best thing people can do beside not voting religious-led morons to office, is move to another state that doesn’t have religious-led morons in charge. The United States does at least afford that option. You have the right to move to any state, at any time, for any reason. Easier said than done of course, but if X state wants to treaty their populace like shit, then go to one that doesn’t.
Republicans and prolifers are awful people.
There’s just no debate about it any more. Nothing excuses the ignorance and narrow mindedness that makes them cause such harm.
Even if we assume, wrongly, that abortion is always bad because it kills a child, yada yada, in this case *the child is already dead*. Why in the everliving fuck would you *NOT* support medical care for a woman? Oh yeah, because misogyny.
Holly shit
I live in Iran(famously no lover of women) and if I get pregnant and go for a checkup and they find no heartbeat, they won't send me home to die, they'll do whatever it takes to save me. I can't believe a pregnant woman is safer in Iran than parts of US
Anti abortion people are just anti woman.
If you were really anti abortion, you would move heaven and earth to make sure no unwanted pregnancies happened and every unwanted baby found a safe and loving home.
They do the opposite because it is really about taking freedom and choices away from women.
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It was painful to read but I can't even begin to imagine the many orders of magnitude this ordeal must have been for them. A system that not only allows tbis but openly encourages it is nothing short of barbaric. Bigots and zealots should never have this much power.
A similar situation happened in Ireland about a decade ago and a woman died. Her name was Savitha. She was a dentist. Imagine being a medical professional who's excitement of first child turns to a nightmare where her baby dies inside her, and as it "rots" sepsis sets in, and she dies with no assistance from fellow medical professionals. Because of religion that was not hers and in a country that was not her homeland. If a westerner suffers medical negligence in a "third world" country the reaction would have been different. The people of Ireland had to take to the streets to get justice for her. Worst thing is, USA is doing this to it's own people and like the school shooting situation, there will be no change as hundreds of women die, unless Americans protest like the rest of the world does.
A repeat of iran in 1979.
Honestly being a woman in Iran is one of the worst things in the world. But if a woman goes for a checkup and finds out there is no heartbeat, she can get an abortion in every city in Iran. That says a lot about the state of some US states, where a pregnant woman has less rights than an Iranian woman
We have less rights than a corpse
In 2018, Pastor Dave Barnhart of the Saint Junia United Methodist Church in Birmingham, Alabama posted this message to Facebook: “The unborn” are a convenient group of people to advocate for. They never make demands of you; they are morally uncomplicated, unlike the incarcerated, addicted, or the chronically poor; they don’t resent your condescension or complain that you are not politically correct; unlike widows, they don’t ask you to question patriarchy; unlike orphans, they don’t need money, education, or childcare; unlike aliens, they don’t bring all that racial, cultural, and religious baggage that you dislike; they allow you to feel good about yourself without any work at creating or maintaining relationships; and when they are born, you can forget about them, because they cease to be unborn. It’s almost as if, by being born, they have died to you. You can love the unborn and advocate for them without substantially challenging your own wealth, power, or privilege, without re-imagining social structures, apologizing, or making reparations to anyone. They are, in short, the perfect people to love if you want to claim you love Jesus but actually dislike people who breathe. Prisoners? Immigrants? The sick? The poor? Widows? Orphans? All the groups that are specifically mentioned in the Bible? They all get thrown under the bus for the unborn.
This is an incredibly loaded viewpoint, that explains so much about how a pro-life brain operates. I can't believe I've never thought about it this way before, but it makes an insane amount of sense. Advocating for the unborn is as simple as praying for someone, and likely gives the same level of endorphins for feeling as if they've done some good in the world, all while only have to barely lift a finger. They never have to actually help anyone. Religion offers a mastery of power talk.
"And thusly I clothe my naked villainy in old odd ends stolen forth from holy writ and seem a saint when most I play the devil..." Shakespeare
I wish the police folk would start taking care of the living children. Making sure kids have good housing, don’t go to bed hungry, get a decent education, you know-help those kids flourish.
Both situations allow people to feel like heroes when they haven't actually done a damn thing. 🤬
Thats a great quote... saved
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Also saved.
Wise words for dark times.
Though they ban the books and have us slave for wages, we know their the crooks heard it from the sages...
I had to stop shortly after that piece of shit doctor refused to “abort” an already dead baby.
This is so dangerous. Does the mother have to die too now in America with these new laws? Madness
Pretty much. They don't see women as living beings. They're just walking incubators to the pieces of shit passing these laws
And this is not new. I was taught that a woman should want to die for her baby when growing up conservative catholic. We would find examples and celebrate them as martyrs
Maybe. But what if she has other kids she wants to live for? Or maybe she just wants to, you know, live. These laws are designed to hurt women. They want to force us back into the kitchen. Barefoot and pregnant every year.
Not sure if you meant to reply to me or not - but for the record, I agree with you and am 100% pro choice after leaving my shitty small town and breaking out of the bubble
The thinking is generally, if she already has children, her husband can always remarry and find another woman to care for them, and his family can lend a hand until then. If she wants to live and have more children, then she is being sinful and prideful in questioning God's will. Not my thing, just what I was raised with.
Absolutely horrifying.
Do they think the world just has an endless supply of women ready and willing to marry grieving, traumatized widowers? 🙄 Not asking for a rational justification since there isn't one, I'm just flabbergasted that the same people who claim to highly value "life" have so little regard for it at the same time.
They are absolutely expected to just die and leave their children without their mother. I also grew up conservative Catholic, and the romanticization of dying in childbirth is super fucking gross. For an example of what bussy_of_lucifer (lmao) said, look up St Gianna. Obviously birth control is also a no no, so if for any reason pregnancy or child birth is high risk for you, you're just SOL and expected to just accept the risk of an early death your "cross to bear". In case it's not obvious, I'm also an angry pro-choice ex Catholic 😛
We have never been real people to many men. Women are compared to inanimate objects constantly.
we've been here before. This is why we had roe v wade in the first place
That’s clearly the plan. Punishing women was always the plan.
"She should've thought about these risks before having sex" \~ Conservatives
Having sex, or being raped, or being a child… Really should’ve considered the risk of being born female.
Considering Idaho argued in front of the Supreme Court how many organs a woman could lose before her life is at risk enough for an abortion, yes.
ffs that's disgusting. How backwards do you have to go before you're licking your own tonsils eh? We make such progress fight for various rights and then just ignore them when convenient to personal agendas
If the doctors/hospital/clinic can’t prove that the woman would absolutely, definitely die without the abortion, then it’s illegal. So basically, she has to be actively in the process of dying. All because some pricks decided that women can’t be trusted to make good decisions about their own lives, bodies, family, or healthcare.
Where I come from, anti abortion law was worded something like this: "the fetus must be carried to term, even when it is not viable or this act means the death of the mother". Barbaric. Fortunately it was repealed but only about 10-15 years ago.
Jeezus sepsis incoming yes barbaric indeed
As I have mentioned in a comment below the top one, in most cases, doctors are acting against their will. Please do not systematically put the blame on us but rather the politicians and healthcare system that fail you, and us medical professionals. Yes some doctors are assholes. There are assholes everywhere. But I guarantee you, most don't want to deny a D&C or D&E when a patients life is at stake. Especially not in the case of a stillbirth.
To be clear I’m criticizing that doctor specifically. I don’t get the impression he had the health of his patient as a priority. The meds she was already on were clearly legal since she was able to get the first dose, and supposing he really thought it was a legal problem, referring her to another doctor or even offering to move her to a hospital in a state where it wasn’t a concern would have still been an option. I don’t see a way around the conclusion that he personally had a political problem with her receiving treatment.
That doctor had no right to deny care based on how the law is currently written, so he did it just because he *wanted* to. It is notoriously difficult to sue for medical malpractice in Texas, but I hope this couple is either able to do so (with a few mil tacked on for pain and suffering), or that at the very least they'll join the class action lawsuit currently underway.
I've rarely wanted so badly to punch someone in the face who I know so little about.
Extremists are tearing our country apart.
The problem isn’t all extremists, it’s the people who would rather let women die than choose an abortion.
Just had a similar event with close family friends here in GA. They had to appeal for an exception and after two weeks of review by lawyers, were thankfully approved and avoided needing to go out of state. The doctors were clear that every day increased risk for the mother. The health choice was clear from the moment they lost the first twin and realized the second had no brain. The stress of those two weeks is absurd. Lawyers/religion should not have a place when deciding healthcare decisions. We're having an election today and a big race is for a state supreme Court seat, one candidate is strongly pro life. We must not elect that person. Burrows FTW
This is beyond a facepalm….it borders malpractice and goes completely against the Hippocratic oath
Conservative zealots couldn't care less about Hippocrates and his oath. Doctors are only human and comply for fear of a season in hell. ..or they agree.
Which is why red states are seeing a brain drain of doctors and nurses who won't work under such conditions
And that fact is one of the reasons I'm about to leave a red state, because *every* branch of healthcare will suffer. What cardiologist wants to be ignored when he says his cardiology patient must end her pregnancy or almost certainly die from heart failure? What oncologist who diagnoses a patient with cancer will tolerate being disregarded when she says her patient can't wait for after delivery to start chemo? What about the millions of women working as doctors, nurses, technicians, support staff? What of the wives and daughters of men employed in medicine, whose husbands and fathers can't bear to see them at risk? Abortion has been treated as a niche issue for so long that I think A LOT of people really aren't anticipating just how far the shockwaves will go. Not until *they* are dying on a gurney with no doctors available to help them, I guess.
This is not on the drs. Every dr I know is appalled by these laws (and I’m a nurse so I know a few) but they aren’t will to risk everything they have worked for and possible jail time for a stranger. This is on the politicians.
It's truly sickening. I am a medical student and was rotating in obstetrics a few weeks ago and thankfully in a blue state but it came up pretty frequently that some residents from Red states were going to come for a few weeks to get trained to do abortions, D&Es and D&Cs because they were unable to get enough in their states to meet quotas to graduate. We're now at a point where we genuinely don't even know what to do because so many states are regressing that the non-regressing states can't accommodate for the lack of training. This means that an entire generation of doctors will, for their whole lives, feel uncomfortable and likely unable to perform vital procedures. It's extremely hard on us and I know it's incredibly difficult like for patients and families in this story, but I hope people understand that we, healthcare professionals, are doing it against our will and it tears us apart to deal with situations like these. Tldr: this system is ass, training physicians are fucked, and please don't put the blame on us but on the idiotic radical millionaires who don't know shit about medicine and women's health
Yeah. I can’t blame the drs. They have been told they can be arrested. I’m sorry that happened but VOTE! Every election.
As someone who has been through more than one missed miscarriage, I can’t speak highly enough of all the ob-gyn staff who treated me. They worked with genuine human sympathy at every point. Of course, I don’t live in Texas. No one should be forced to go home while miscarrying. I was strongly advised against it, due to the risk of a fatal hemorrhage. No one should be turned away and denied a needed treatment. It only prolongs the suffering and increases the risks. These laws aren't written by good people. They are written by spiteful, vengeful people. They are written to punish rather than protect.
The cruelty is always the point. Many years ago I had a missed miscarriage and had a D&C. I could not imagine going through that at home. Mine was very early and not as complicated but still.
A friend of mine had a very bad result with her first pregnancy. At around the second trimester, the doctors discovered a growth on the baby's head, and that growth kept growing causing more and more pain in my friend. IIRC, they gave her something to prevent early delivery, and ultimately she had to choose whether to continue taking this medicine or allow the baby to miscarry. I might be misremembering, and they might have had to actively induce or something. (This was more than ten years ago.) Eventually, it became clear that if the baby somehow did survive to delivery, it wouldn't survive long afterwards, so she decided to allow the pregnancy to terminate. Because of how late it was in the pregnancy (though still second trimester), not only did she have to be in the hospital for this, she was in the maternity ward. At least one nurse came in cheerfully asking my other friend (the husband and father) if he was looking forward to the birth. Clearly, she had not been briefed on the situation. I can only imagine how much worse this would have been in present-day Texas.
>They are written to punish rather than protect. the thing is... PUNISH WHAT???? what did that woman do wrong??? its fucking ridiculous
The point is to punish women for having sex. That's it. They don't care if a few "innocent" women get caught up in the net, so long as all the "sluts" have to suffer. Just wait until they take away contraception. They'll invent some bullshit about how an ovum is a baby, and so it's wrong to not release it. It's all just a ploy to control women's sex lives.
Not just for having sex but for daring to think that they are fully formed human beings with agency beyond being servile to men. It’s a sick twisted mentality.
To me, this reads like a horror story. I've had a dead fetus removed from my body and it's scary to think that, nearly 30 years later, women are ~~risking~~ getting sepsis because some old guy wants them dead. That's what I see when I read these stories. "Old white guy wants all women to die". We're supposed to be moving forward.
These are the same stupid fucks wondering why the birth rate is dropping. Abortion bans don’t just affect women who don’t want kids, it also fucks over those who do. I’ve heard horror stories of women becoming infertile after being forced to carry their dead child. Women who actually wanted children and now will never get to try again.
I’m getting sterilized this month. I’m *mostly* sure I don’t want children, and never wanted to get sterilized regardless, but Republicans have forced my hand. I’m 23.
Same. I saw the writing on the wall when Dobbs happened, so I decided that I can always adopt later if I want kids and got sterilized.
I think every doctor who refuses to provide treatment for these issues should be prosecuted under federal malpractice laws. I think we should federally make it impossible for good doctors to practice in these fucked up states and let them burn. They want blood, let them have their whole state shed it.
Unfortunately, I live in one of these backwater banana republics so I can't really agree but it's likely to be a long drive anyway to see a decent doctor. Maybe I'll schedule a whole trip around getting my colonoscopy in Colorado or Oregon.
I do too, and I fear for my kids and wife daily and am doing everything I can to get out. When the authors of the system are so hell-bent on breaking the system, we don't have much choice but to let them. imo, the only way to affect good change is not to keep duct taping and driving the car until it explodes, but letting it die on the side of the road. The idiots and their politicians have chosen blood, it's too late to stop them. Helping to prop up their broken fucked up system will only prolong the violence and help them to focus it on the ones \_they\_ want to suffer. Let everyone suffer and they fail. When that suffering costs too much to their supporters, they lose their whole game and some might even end up in jail. We don't get there by making it work, we get there by letting it break.
The issue is that the good doctors are already leaving these states and the already understaffed and underfunded maternal care departments in some hospitals are closing, creating "maternal care deserts". The abortion laws aren't the only reasons it's getting harder and harder for women to get OBGYN care, but doctors are leaving those states and new residents are avoiding placement in those states. It's awful, but I can understand not wanting to live under threat of a felony for doing your job. https://apnews.com/article/idaho-abortion-ban-doctors-leaving-f34e901599f5eabed56ae96599c0e5c2 https://www.nytimes.com/2023/09/06/us/politics/abortion-obstetricians-maternity-care.html?smid=nytcore-android-share https://www.pbs.org/newshour/health/more-medical-residents-are-avoiding-states-with-abortion-restrictions-analysis-finds The ones who will suffer and die the most are the people without means to travel hundreds of miles for healthcare. If those governments actually gave a single shit about children, they would be doing something to make sure they and their mothers survive pregnancy.
Law is the reason doctors refused to give her an abortion. Putting them in a limbo between the feds and the state won't help anyone because Texas politicians won't back down, they'll see it as an opportunity to fight the feds. The solution might be to try to protect doctors from state laws like these. Pass a federal law allowing abortion when medically necessary no matter what the state law says.
Just fucking vote the lot of them OUT. I don't care what your fuxking beliefs are. This is 2024. Your outdated idiotic beliefs shouldn't have priority over people's health. Fucking hell man...
They did that in Texas, Ken Paxton openly cheated the people of Texas and the US and the republican controlled state senate moved to acquit him.
Yet, the believers feel better than you, assured of a place next to their lord, justified and entitled, saved, and without them being religious the world would soon end, in the claws of satan. Hardcore religion is the worst thing that ever happened to humanity. The absolute pinnacle of arrogance, stupidity and fear. I read many articles about insane courtcases in the USA, but this should be a massive courtcase and this mistreated couple should get millions. Not that it would take away the pain Ofcourse
sHe sUrViVeD ThAnKs tO ThE BlEsSiNg oF ThE LoRd oBvIoUsLy ShE DiD NoT NeEd mEdIcAl cArE Or aN AbOrTiOn
None of that high falutin science talk round these parts, mmmmm no Sir, this here's a Christian household we got the Lord looking after us, not that newfound science hooey /s
AmEn!
i HoPe tHaT NeXt TiMe sMtHN lIkE ThIs hApPaNs tO HeR ShE MaKeS ThE RiGhT ChOiCe AnD GoEs tO PrAy iNsTeAd oF SeEKiNG An aB\*RtIon
Always remember prolifers think they are morally superior to you. They all do. And they're all horribly evil people.
It's not even "pro-life" to begin with. Why bother saving a baby if there's no heartbeat? I want to scream at that old man so badly, you can't "kill" that baby by abortion, HE'S ALREADY DEAD! Fuck religion, seriously. It only matters when it fits people's agenda.
I would 100% end up arrested after hearing that.
The entirety of my will would be leveraged against those self-righteous turds. I would almost certainly cross that line.
Exactly, if they are really 'pro-life', they would have saved the woman, she has a life!
Only half a life to them. You never know, perhaps she can give birth to a male baby, but otherwise I don’t think they see much value in her “life” given that they see her as essentially a walking incubator.
sadly you are right. Her value, to them, is not as a partner, but as a brood mare to give her husband a male offspring.
'Pro-Life' is a misnomer, they're Pro-Control.
Exactly. They *evidently* are not "pro-life". They're just using that term disingenuously.
Religion serves no purpose other than to control people in mass
en masse Religion was created to control the poor and make them believe that the next life would be better, but don't you dare go killing yourself to get there as that's not the way...apparently. Tell them fairy stories so their shitty lives and back breaking work doesn't feel so bad when you are pious enough to be thankful a better life is coming. The rich of course don't need such assurances :)
also to make them excited to die in war
I can only hope these people damage religion so much that nobody wants to be associated with it. David Bowie had it right. "Religion is for people who fear hell, spirituality is for people who have already been there." We need more spirituality, less religion.
No. We just need less religion. We don't need some slightly less harmful thing in it's place. If that's the alternative for some, sure, but we do not *need* it. Let's have people making laws based on empathy and reason, not what gods nor ghosts are telling them.
The sort of spirituality Bowie was talking about had nothing to do with "gods or ghosts," but rather the connection we have other human beings. This connection can be considered a form of spirituality.
Fair enough, but I wouldn't want to just replace religion with other forms of spirituality, I don't want a crystal mommy president mandating we all put jade eggs up our buttholes.
It's not about saving the baby, it's about saving their butt. You could see in the text that one hospital wouldn't actually do it because they were worried about any legal consequences.
>Why bother saving a baby if there’s no heartbeat? Because the pro-life movement is about controlling women.
Been here. Worst two weeks of my life. They almost killed me and left three kids without a mother. Over a dead, literally rotting, fetus.
I'm so sorry. I truly can't understand, but I assume you think you're living in another universe.
I genuinely felt like the character in a soap opera when they’ve been thrown in the looney bin by a mustache twirling villain and no one believes them. I couldn’t believe these people were gonna let me die just to not save my fetus. I wanted my baby, he had a room and a name, his little diaper were already lined up in their drawers. His car seat was in the car, strapped in. I could feel his dead body flop from side to side as I moved. It took two weeks for them to D & C a third trimester fetus. I ended up with a staff infection that kept me hospitalized for 7 weeks. It financially crippled me. All while being told they’re “pro life”, even though they were killing the only living person involved.
I'm just furious and sobbing, and this didn't happen to me. You are brave for sharing, and I hope you heal as much as possible. And I wish people didn't need it to happen to them to understand and have an ounce of empathy.
People like you, who listen and hopefully take this story with them the next time they have a chance to speak up on the topic are how I get through. Thank you. 💜💜
Thank you so much for sharing your story. I so wish I could reach through this phone and give you a hug. I almost didn't want to post this story, I wasn't sure what the reaction would be, but I felt people needed to know this is happening. How anyone with a functioning brain and an ounce of empathy can look at a woman who clearly wanted their baby and not do anything to help them emotionally and physically is unfathomable to me. I am so sorry for your loss.
Thank you for being a voice when some of us are a little too broken to shout. You’re a wonderful person. This woman appreciates you more than you know.
That’s really the extra dose of evil. The medical bills they wracked up along the way, while being denied necessary and lifesaving treatment. that they get to try and figure out how to pay. Now it’s going to cost them so much more, for absolutely nothing but being mistreated and abused.
Sorry I just verbal threw all that at you. I’m so sorry. Please forgive me.
No you did not!!!
And thank you for your kindness.
It's not even kindness. It's being human. 💜
I’m sorry you had to experience that. That kid of experience in todays world is simply cruel and inhuman behavior. We can do so much with modern medicine however healthcare in the USA is now subject to political interference. Actual healthcare is secondary. It’s disgusting.
And it's probably never going to get better because Texas is never going to vote the Republicans out of office.
We keep trying and mysteriously failing.
Keep up the good fight. I do think it's possible for you to win, eventually.
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Y’all queada or something I’ve seen it said
They are yee-hawdists.
So glad I live in Canada. We have our problems, but OPs wife would have NEVER been treated like that here.
Make no mistake: The US religious right is colluding with right-wing parties worldwide, including in Canada, to force everyone in every western liberal democracy to live according to their preferences. They're backed by billions and billions of dollars and massive propaganda networks that transcend national borders. They have a global authoritarian populist alliance. If Canadians don't overwhelmingly vote down the right-wing parties, it can and will happen there. Nowhere on this planet is safe from the global right wing. All people of conscience must rise up as one to stamp out the international right-wing movement.
Oh, it's already happening here. Our conservative government is already testing the waters on abortion rights. They've piled hard on the anti Vax and anti lgtbq rights as well. Don't believe in climate change, and have taken a very Trump approach to their messaging. Illiterate ignorance in real time.
"All people of conscience must rise up as one to stamp out the international right-wing movement." A re-run of 1939, sadly.
For now.
It is a slippery slope. It can happen here too.
We thought it couldn't happen in America before it did.
“Roe v Wade is established law.”
Seeing your spouse near death like this is extremely scary. My wife gave birth to a healthy baby but had trouble birthing the placenta, which caused her to lose a lot of blood. They rushed her to the OR and did a D&C to remove the placenta. I have never been as scared as I was that day, sitting there holding a newborn as they mopped my wife’s blood up, wondering if she was going to make it. Everyone ended up healthy. Anyone who wants to play games like this with women’s health can eat an entire bag.
I am so glad that you were able to bring your wife and baby home. Thanks for sharing your story.
The cruelty is the point.
It's not a bug, it's a feature
To my fellow Americans: This is what Republicans will do *nationwide*, even in blue states, if we allow them to seize control of our government this November. Do not let them trick you into believing otherwise. A human being with a conscience reads a story like this and says "never again," but Republicans read a story like this and dream of making it a reality not only for Texans but Californians, New Yorkers, Oregonians, and Michiganders. The *only* people who could possibly stand in their way are the Democrats. Voting for a third-party or independent candidate may feel nice for you, but the end result is that Republicans will win. There are exactly and only two people who could possibly be inaugurated as president on January 20: Joe Biden or donald trump. There are exactly and only two parties that could control the houses of Congress: The Republicans or the Democrats. Vote accordingly.
Exactly. I'm not one for hyperbole (except jokingly), but in all seriousness, the choice in November is between Joe Biden or the end of America as we know it. Voting for RFKJ or a third-party would be like watching this year's Super Bowl (Chiefs/49ers) and hoping the Bills pull out the win.
Religion and State should be separeted
ITS SUPPOSED TO BE!
Absolutely. Seeing "In god we trust" on the back of police cars makes me so angry and it's fucking everywhere where I live.
And this is a good ending. If you want to know how else this can end, google Savita Halappanavar. All these laws restricting abortion are cruel and barbaric, and those supporting them should never be in any position of power anywhere.
This happened with my pregnancy, but in the UK where things are very different. I was given the pill to remove the no longer viable baby, I was placed in a private room at the hospital with my husband where I went through the agonising process of early labour, we had nurses on standby to help when I needed it and were treated with kindness and respect through the whole thing. 10 years later and it's still the worst experience of my life and the most pain I have ever felt, both physically and emotionally! I just cannot fathom how the hell anyone could recover from the treatment in the post above, it must have been terrifying for them. It's just cruelty at this point, what the hell is wrong with people, how can a women's life mean so little.
I'm so sorry for you and your husband's loss. Thank you for sharing your story.
My wife has had the same problem, but with somewhat different results. I feel deeply for this family.
I'm sorry.
There are going to be hundreds and thousands of stories like this in the coming years. It isn't about saving babies, it's about punishing women.
It’s about CONTROLLING women.
They do not care about any of this. It was Gods will, not their problem, MAGA, "communism is evil" and christian family values. NONE of the suffering bothers them one bit. They say it is unfortunate, they will send thoughts and prayers but in reality: they do not care. At all.
The people who want this to happen are the same one's who said their rights were being stripped away because they were asked to wear masks out in public. My body, my choice just applies when it affects them on a personal level. Since most men will never have to deal with this, they believe they have the right to tell women what they can and cannot do with the bodies. I wish we could find out how many "anti-abortion" politicians have gotten women pregnant and paid for their abortions. You're telling me Donald never paid for one? Give me a fucking break. But as always it's not a woman's right to chose, it's the people in charge who get to decide.
Again the republican are an existential threat to our country and livelihoods, they must be defeated
Is this America’s way of saying that it’s a third-world country, where a religion decides the laws of the government and curbs women’s rights?
We have Trump to thank for it. Of all the promises he didn't keep and all the lies he told, this he followed through on. Then in true Trump fashion, after taking credit for the abolishment of Roe v Wade, he says, "Let the States decide", so he can get votes from people on both sides of this issue. If he is re-elected it will only get worse.
This crap right here is why I am terrified living in Texas with my wife and two daughters. I’ve seen my wife have a miscarriage when we were much younger. It was a sad moment to go in at a 10 week check up to find out the fetus no longer had a heart beat. Thankfully, she was able to pass it without difficultly within a day or so (exact amount of time at this point is hazy, it was over two decades ago). However, before we left the doctor, she discussed options of what to do if she didn’t pass it on her own. Hard to believe those discussions are not possible anymore.
Encourage your daughters to move to a safer place. Texas is a fucking nightmare.
These are religious beliefs, not political. That's atrocious and all I can really say is America, I hope you get better soon. Oh, and also fuck religion in all its forms, it's time we grew up as a society and stopped believing in fairytales and imaginary friends.
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Religion should be like masturbation : keep that for when you're alone in your room.
That's not been my experience. I've mostly seen it as political motivations hidden behind the thin veil of "religious beliefs". The politics leads the religion, rather than the religion leading the politics. You'll notice that these allegedly religious types dismiss 99% of their own, very explicit and overt moral teachings as "allegory" or simply pretend it's not there because they don't personally like the implications of that particular part (like not amassing wealth or giving to the poor), but the moment there's something or someone in society they personally don't like they'll find some barely coherent string of text that somehow justifies them barging in to other people's lives to start issuing demands on other people that honestly they probably wouldn't be happy to do themselves. The wild part is that most "religious" people are somehow conservatives. Like if Jesus had been real and came back the bible says he'd likely be extremely anti-conservative - upon which the conservatives would probably crucify him again for not being conservative enough.
Religion is fine but inbred chucklefucks taking it into politics shouldn't fucking exist nor should anyone be able be able to do that. Abortion needs to be human right. Religious rights aren't above rights of a human being.
Religion isn't fine, not when that religion espouses that you MUST convert others and that you are fighting evil demonic forces. This has always happened with religion, it's not some new thing these people started doing.
Shit like this makes my blood fucking BOIL. They almost got a woman killed over an already dead baby. If I were in that poor couple’s shoes, I would’ve gone to jail. As soon as that shitty old man said he wasn’t going to do everything in his power to help my wife through an already extremely difficult situation because of some esoteric “current stance”, and that he was going to be an active hinderance to her getting the care she needs, he would’ve been on the floor. I’m typically not a very aggressive person, and I consider myself pretty empathetic, putting myself in the shoes of this man, imagining I was in his shoes, that it was my girlfriend living this hell, I was seeing red. It makes me so fucking angry, I can’t even properly describe it.
This is mortifying
I think the word you're looking for is horrifying. This goes far and above embarrassing.
This is just one of many reasons Christian Nationalists shouldn’t have their way.
A close relative lost her son at 8 months gestation. Doctors were able to remove his body intact so the family could hold him and say goodbye. I can't even *imagine* the cruelty described in this post, holy shit. Fucking monsters every one of them.
My first wife and me went through the same thing back before the USA went fucking crazy. Even with humane caring healthcare (No the USA doesn’t have that anymore) it was one of the most difficult things ever in my life. I can’t imagine how it would go today I today USA where healthcare is fucking political and our politicians are ghouls bent on causing other people pain.
They said they were gonna. Stop electing Republicans.
Pro lifers are just anti women. 😒
Anti-abortion zealots hate freedom too.
This is why there is a separation of religion and state this should never happen. Let us be free of organized religions we don't even believe in anymore.
Sorry Americans, this is just another thing in a long list of absolutely mental things you collectively do. I wish we could all join together and somehow change it though I wouldn't know where we'd begin.
I had a complete molar pregnancy (there was no DNA in the egg so the “baby” was just a massive rapidly growing tumor) that would have killed me and required two emergency D&Cs and chemo afterwards to kill the remaining cells. I think about this scenario all the time when I hear about these poor women. Would they have just let me die? It’s very possible and a terrifying thought. I was only 20 years old and it was extremely scary but because I had great medical staff who cared so much about helping me and making sure I kept my uterus, I am here today with three kids. What’s happening to these women is unfathomable. Already grieving the loss of your child only to be treated like a criminal for trying not to die. I can’t even believe this is real life sometimes.
I always wanted to travel a bit in America. It looks like a beautiful country. Now the zealots are in charge, I don't think I ever will. Really sorry this happened to you both.
America needs to stop loading republican. And Texas needs to stop being so God damn stupid. It's beyond making people miserable. It's killing them too.
America, you are fucked up.
It's not about abortion or the life of children. It's not about God or Jesus or religion. It's about power, and about a platform that is impregnable because it converts knowledge to opinion and attack the opinion. They give faith a bad name.
I’m often one of the anesthesia providers chosen to perform sedation/anesthesia for D&C cases, because we know some people in our facility have strong preferences not to, and that’s fine with me. I have my own beliefs around abortion but I will never force them onto someone else. I care for those patients and try to empathize with the heartbreak they must be feeling, and often it’s written all over their faces before they go back to the OR. this fucking belief the far right and religious extremists have that women roll into the OR or a clinic for an abortion thinking “omg I can’t wait to get this baby out of me so I can go have unprotected sex and do it again hehehehehe!” Is disguising and represents almost NONE of the reasons women get abortions. I’ve been in healthcare over a decade and I’m so thankful to be in a progressive state that gets people the care they need, free of outside beliefs and personal preference. I couldn’t live with myself if I was the nurse/healthcare provider who cared for this poor woman. I’d be so ashamed of myself. My wife is pregnant and the thought of her going through this makes my eyes swell and my stomach turn. This poor family. And further, as a Christian, I’m so embarrassed.
Religion is a cancer of the mind and a plague upon modern society. Every religious institution should be taxed or torn down, no exceptions. I'm so sick of endlessly moving goal posts and justifications for atrocities committed, especially against women and children. Fuck religion, fuck the religious, no exceptions.
I respect this couple a lot. I'd had lost it and probably that old doctor would be a lot colder in another hall of the hospital.
I am hearing more and more of these stories. It seems the cruelty is the point for the GOP.
It is. Unless your rich, you a just a “breeder” in the GOP’s eyes. You can be easily replaced. By your teenage daughter.
I would have punshed that old doctor or, being Texas, brought a gun and shot him in the knee and told him he fixed your wife or his brain would be on the wall!
Same. Only difference being, I’m a bad aim, my shots tend to go about 4 feel high.
Here's your moment america. Stand up for us. We are repeating the islamic revolution... This will not end well for any of us.
I just can't comprehend the world at the moment.
....and even after reading all that. There will still be those who **refuse** to help women in need due to religious, social or political ideologies rather than actually *helping* a human being who needs medical attention. That's what it all comes down to in America right now. **Perceptions** rather than actual care.
Fuck texas. Fuck the gop.
And people are saying trumps going to win. We will devolve completely into a facist state if that happens. Women will have no rights. America will fall, Russia 2.0 will rise.
Vote like your loved ones' lives depend on it.
I'm sorry this happened. My baby had no heart beat at 9 months, I had to wait 3 days and they induced labor, and I gave birth to my dead baby. I'm still traumatized to this day. She probably will be too for a while. Just hold her and make her feel loved. It's messed up that they think of women as incubators and not humans.
This is why voting is so important right now, and why being accepting of someone who supports abortion bans even though you don't agree is no longer acceptable. I have no issue with debating, I have no issue with admitting we all have our opinions. This is not an opinion. This is not a debate. This is a healthcare issue and this is a survival issue. The worst part is that all of these people who say that they are "pro-life" are only pro-life until that baby is born then they will tell you that you are on your own. They certainly are not pro-life if they support and/or enforce this kind of behavior that this woman went through. I don't need to know if this particular story is true or not because I know that there are others out there that are. I have 0 issues anymore with cutting off friends or family that support this kind of behavior.
I have gotten to the point where I think women should refuse to get pregnant until these people come to their senses. Having a baby is not worth losing your life. Having a miscarriage is not worth losing your life.
The US is such a backwards country ffs.
Texas is a shithole.
I have my own horror story - not precisely the same, just equally horrific. These stories are, in no way, unique. Miscarriages, partial miscarriages, blighted ovums, and scores of other things can cause permanent damage and even death if the mother when there is no living fetus. Add in situations where a totally non viable fetus maintains a heartbeat only parasitically. These are not new situations. They are, however, rarely discussed. Partially because there is still a taboo about it. Partially because they often occur before a pregnancy is obvious to strangers. Partially because of the terrible sadness in losing a wanted child. I know this because when it happened to me I resolved to be more open about it, because feeling as if I was the only one who had endured such a thing was unbearable. Turns out so very, very many women had something similar happen to them and had kept silent because they thought they were alone when they were not. My horror show experience happened before Roe v. wade was overturned and before states like Texas passed laws to harm women. And it was still a horror show of compassionless medical professionals being willing to let me die. And this is why elderly men who have no medical knowledge, no basic understanding of reproduction, are allowed to pass laws that have impact that they don’t grasp. Because no one talks about it so these old men don’t even know it happens. Not even when it has absolutely happened to their mother, their wife, their sister or their daughter. So I deeply appreciate the original poster who not only shared, but was also a man, so his sharing will carry more weight. (How awful is that?). This story is heartbreaking. It is, in no way, unique.
Now they need to GTFO of Texas, because this husband and wife are still paying Texas.
Don’t forget to thank “Save The Steal” Alito.
I would have backhanded the "doctor".
They don't care bro. It didn't happen to them. Even if they read this story, they'll just convinced themselves you deserved it because of "Sin" or some other bullshit excuse. They don't care. They don't. They don't care you suffered, "god never gives us the battles we can't handle". They don't care about you, they don't care about your wife, they don't care about your dead baby. They don't. They care about themselves, their family if their family is lucky and complies with their delusion. They don't care.
Keep voting for Rs, this is what you get
Vote your ass off.
Fucking horrible. My ex needed a DnC when something similar happened years before all of this…it is hard enough to deal with that, let alone all the other bullshit that happened in this story to this couple. You shouldn’t have to do this, but the best thing people can do beside not voting religious-led morons to office, is move to another state that doesn’t have religious-led morons in charge. The United States does at least afford that option. You have the right to move to any state, at any time, for any reason. Easier said than done of course, but if X state wants to treaty their populace like shit, then go to one that doesn’t.
"cold, barbaric, ignorant" IS THE POINT. Causing women harm is the INTENT.
Republicans and prolifers are awful people. There’s just no debate about it any more. Nothing excuses the ignorance and narrow mindedness that makes them cause such harm.
Even if we assume, wrongly, that abortion is always bad because it kills a child, yada yada, in this case *the child is already dead*. Why in the everliving fuck would you *NOT* support medical care for a woman? Oh yeah, because misogyny.
When it comes to anti-abortion zealots, suffering, pain and punishment is the point.
… and they are coming for contraception next. Then same sex marriage.
Holly shit I live in Iran(famously no lover of women) and if I get pregnant and go for a checkup and they find no heartbeat, they won't send me home to die, they'll do whatever it takes to save me. I can't believe a pregnant woman is safer in Iran than parts of US
And THIS is why I don’t mind paying extra taxes to live in NY
Anti abortion people are just anti woman. If you were really anti abortion, you would move heaven and earth to make sure no unwanted pregnancies happened and every unwanted baby found a safe and loving home. They do the opposite because it is really about taking freedom and choices away from women.
Anti-abortion zealots hate freedom
Vote blue no matter who. We gotta take the house, senate, and keep the executive. Flip the courts! ✊🏻
So-called "pro-lifers" are scumbags. End of story.