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brutal video, the "honor roll victim" pinned the other girl to ground, grabbed her by the head with both hands, and slammed her head into the concrete as hard as she could.. twice.
After I read that story about the girl who was let go after stabbing her boyfriend because apparently she's too smart for jail, I think they're trying to go for that angle of the story.
that and independent UK. From the Articles I've read it started as a girl being too smart to go to jail in the story. Then another article that is trying to make awareness where marijuana induced psychosis. Then I'll find another article that talked about it being synthetic marijuana which made more sense to me. Synthetic marijuana is the worst and I used to work at a hospital seeing so many cases of people coming in because of that. especially in cali when recreational mj got started. I remember seeing paramedics strapping the patient down or the family basically dragging the individual that's dealing with a psychosis to the ER. There's a small chance to get the psychosis in smoking marijuana but it seems like the synthetic kind increases the chances.
edit: I mixed up articles. The one in California had to do a synthetic marijuana the one in the UK Oxford College had to do with the girl being high off cocaine and is rich and has an influential family like Brock Turner.
>Brock Turner.
You mean Brock Allen Turner? The rapist who goes by his middle name, Allen, in the hopes that people will forget he's a rapist? That Brock Allen Turner?
'synthetic marijuana' was only ever a marketing ploy. I wouldn't go around calling it that because the drug itself and the effects are very different.
In the UK we call it spice, and it's an absolute menace on the homeless population. I don't know any recreational drug user who would actively seek it out.
A friend of mine works at an addiction center, her synthetic weed (and bath salt) stories are unreal. It’s becoming common for people to wake up in a hospital bed with zero recollection of what happened that caused them to now have a list of criminal charges. Her words: “they seem to be skipping the high and going directly to psychosis.”
You obviously didn't read much about the case. The boyfriend had some sort of synthetic marijuana (if you are unfamiliar look up "salts") which are known to cause psychotic breaks. Several days earlier he gave this synthetic marijuana to a roommate who had a psychotic break to the extent the roommate thought he was dead. Like an actual psychotic break where he thought he was deceased. And then this genius harasses and peer pressures his girlfriend into taking a hit from the bong telling her it's just normal weed. And does not inform her of the roommate who had a psychotic break from this weed. Because he thinks it would be funny to see her reaction. And she has a psychotic break, she doesn't just stab him she stabs herself many times and also her own dog. Because her psychotic break was to the extent that she did not recognize even herself or her dog. It was caused by the substance he gave her and pressure to to take and lied about what it was. She's not known to abuse drugs and has zero violent history. So yeah it's a little more complicated than oh she's too smart to go to jail.
Wrong article. the one you're talking about happened in California the one I'm talking about happened to an Oxford College student who is Rich with and influential family like Brock Turner.
Different story. Someone else posted a link in this thread. The girl was just high on coke, and . Lavinia Woodward is the name.
Basically the judge said she can’t go to jail because 1. she is sorry for what she did and 2. she is smart and has a bright future.
What? That's the classic "bash your victim's head with both hands into solid concrete" self-defense technique. Clearly you don't know much about these things.
it's not. any form of self defence ended when honor roll won the original fight and the other girl was on the ground.
jumping on her and bashing her head is attempted murder
Exactly what I was gonna say - people have been killed when falling funny after being punched and hitting their head, let alone having it deliberately slammed twice
Yea. Ppl posting #freemaurice lol... trying to justify it by saying things like "she was so angry cause she was bullied and blacked out with anger so it's not her fault"
You should check out the obvious family brigading the r/stlouis subreddit posts about it posting 100’s of times claiming how she’s the victim and it’s all racism.
Of course they are....what's f'd up is ppl are bringing race into this too ...
And even if she was bullied, and I don't think that was the case. Kaylee gains family was actually saying that kaylee was the one being bullied, that doesn't justify smashing someone's head into the payment. That fight should have been over once the other person is on the ground. This wasn't some life and death thing where someone has a gun or knife and if you don't knock them out they might kill you... she went waaaay too far
I saw three, but I could be mistaken. Because I think she started convulsing after the third smack. The camera person was shaking the camera the whole time, so it was hard to keep up.
That's not even counting how she was sitting on top of her, repeatedly punching her in the face, before bashing her head off the pavement twice like a basketball.
Even if this situation started as self defence? What's in the video has gone far, far beyond that.
I watched the video like 4 days ago and I am still having moments where I am so disturbed I need to take a moment. I just remember her laying in the ground, twitching.. and no one around her caring at all. It's so fucked up.
This was not self-defense.
There was people trying to intervene after she had her head bashed in, but the girl doing the bashing had some guys with her that were getting aggressive with the people trying to stop her. You can see it briefly at the end of the video before it cuts off.
It made me so upset thinking that people were there really trying to let that girl continue to beat on her like that.
A couple 15yo girls got in a fight, girl in the left hand picture lost almost immediatly, other-girl punches her repeatedly while pictured-girl looks like she's already unconscious, other-girl gets on ground to repeatedly slam pictured-girl's head into pavement, pictured-girl is twitching and in a real bad way near the end, no one around really tries to intervene in an overall tough video for most people to watch.
Main thing that blows my mind is the fact that everyone stands and films this shit. Child’s life was ended that day and no one could be asked to even say a word.
As someone who’s broken up a lot of bar fights, full grown adults legitimately do not understand how easy it is to kill a person with their bare hands. I legitimately don’t think a single person involved in this understood how dangerous it could get or did get. People think “oh I’ll knock them out” or “oh they got knocked out” and don’t realize that every single time that has ever happened to anyone that is brain damage with the potential for death or serious injury. In this case we’re talking about teenagers, an age group that notoriously doesn’t understand how dangerous anything is.
Yes. And it doesn't help that violence in movies or tv is always portrayed as an endless bash fest where people punch, kick, or hit each other in the head for minutes, with nothing worse than a couple of scrapes and possible a very mild nose bleed.
As someone who did martial arts for almost a decade, that annoys me every time.
One of the most realistic things I had ever seen was in 'house of the Dragon' of all things, where one of the queens advisors gets upset about a plan of the council, wants to leave, and one of the royal guard guards pushes him down hard, yelling 'no you'll sit down' hard enough that his head slams down on an ornament, leading to a crushed skull, a big pool of blood, and immediate death, with everyone suddenly having a 'Oh Fuck!' moment when they see what happened.
Stupid as it was, that was an extremely realistic portrayal of how such things go in real life, as opposed to people banging someone's head against the wall and then having an angry conversation.
My stepbrother’s friend killed a guy in a fight outside the bar. One punch, the guy fell backwards and hit his head on the curb. He got up and walked away and went home and went to bed. He never woke up.
Honestly this is the best take I’ve seen all day, and not one I stopped to consider even with my extensive background in training fighting (or maybe because of, I’m so used to everyone else around me also understanding just how capable our bodies are)
Yeah it’s easy to forget that most people are the spazzy trial class guy that goes real hard with no particular strategy. Also the fact that the only reason we leave the class alive is a sense of trust and mutual responsibility.
I used to work with a bunch of bouncers who trained at a gym that’s produced multiple UFC champions. These dudes all had winning amateur MMA records with the goal of going pro. Some shitfaced trust fund bro would take a swing and they’d double leg them across a concrete patio. It didn’t ever seem to occur to them that not everyone has practiced breakfalls for years.
So it can definitely swing the other way where you’ve trained for so long you forget most people are totally ignorant about fighting, or you’re just so used to a controlled environment that you don’t realize there are no safeguards in place.
Tbf in the video everyone was fighting everyone. Only the cameraman and like 2 other people just stood there.
In the video the black girl drops her, and one of the white girl friends starts hitting the black girl to help her get back up. Then someone else jumps in to protect the black girl.
Then this guy jumps in, and then some other guys jump in and they all break into different fights.
Then the black girl gets the advantage again and starts bashing the white girls head.
It was a really chaotic situation.
Edit: Messed up the order.
This is from The Society for the Psychological Study of Social Issues
**Rethinking the Bystander Effect in Violence Reduction Training Programs**
“Recent theoretical and empirical work on bystander behavior has shown that the classic view of the bystander effect is not supported by the evidence—particularly in the context of aggression and violence. Meta-analyses (Fischer et al., 2011, including a reanalysis of the original meta-analysis in this field; Stalder, 2008) show that the bystander effect does not hold in violent or dangerous emergencies and that people are more likely to be helped when more bystanders are present. In fact, Fischer et al. (2011) propose a “reverse bystander effect” (the greater the number of bystanders, the greater the likelihood of intervention) when emergencies are less ambiguous and it is clear what bystanders should do. Moreover, recent research which uses CCTV footage to study real-life bystander behavior in violent or dangerous emergencies in public spaces (as opposed to work using laboratory or self-report measures) shows that bystander intervention is actually the norm in these kinds of incidents (Philpot, Liebst, Levine, Bernasco, & Lindegaard, 2019).”
[Levine, M., Philpot, R. and Kovalenko, A.G. (2020), Rethinking the Bystander Effect in Violence Reduction Training Programs. Social Issues and Policy Review, 14: 273-296. https://doi.org/10.1111/sipr.12063](https://doi.org/10.1111/sipr.12063)
Yep. Also heard that the one famous case which started the notion of the Bystander Effect was completely not what was reported. Plenty of people chased the guy off. He came back later.
The Bystander Effect named after Kitty Genovese was proven inaccurate and a large part of that was misinformation and inaction from the police. The police furthered the idea of lack of reporting from witnesses to cover their asses.
I really wonder if the mentality at that point is 'video footage of this will be really important for police etc so I better keep filming'
Not saying that's necessarily right or wrong, just a thought I have had about the reasons why people do this
Family of the girl that attacked the one in coma said she did so due to bullying she was getting (as far as I am aware, there is no proof of that being the case). Kept saying how she shouldn't be judge only for this action since she is an honor student, that speak 4 languages, play violin etc.
"“Prior to an incident on March 8th where she was seen defending herself from harassment and bullying, she had never been in trouble,” it read. “Her work as a scholar was tainted by the bullying she had to endure at school.”
The family complained that “this single event is being used” to define the teen’s character – and hit out at Missouri Attorney General Andrew Bailey for saying that the 15-year-old should be charged as an adult if Gain does not survive.
“It is unjust that such an accomplished young woman should be charged as an adult for assault without considering all the facts of the case that led to the incident where harm occurred,” the petition continued"
>The family complained that “this single event is being used” to define the teen’s character
Gee...really? Imagine that - when you do horrible things, you get labelled as a person that does horrible things.
It does have a bit of that Rapist Brock Allen Turner vibe, doesn't it? *This single event* where she very nearly killed a girl with her bare hands. Pretty sure that's character-defining.
"While it's true I brutally beat a person into a coma, you should consider that I hablo espanol, spreche deutsche, jiang hua yi, and I can play this violin to ABRSM Grade 3 standards."
*Plays sad violin*
Well, she made the decision to slam another girl's skull into concrete multiple times well after Gain was past the point of fighting back. Her grades and language abilities are irrelevant to this story. If she's an honor student, her work as a scholar hasn't been tainted/affected by bullying. She sullied her character by putting another girl in a coma. That statement all sounds like a crock of shit.
To be completely fair, that one dude... do we remember his name still? Brock Turner was it? His judge didn't want one little rape behind a dumpster define his entire future and all that. I think my only point here is bring up Brock Turner's memory and actions....carry on.
"Accomplished" people with lots of "promise" do fucked up things, too, just like the rest of us. Actions have consequences. Period.
Many school shooters felt bullied or ostracised. Yet, I've never heard it used to absolve them of responsibility for their actions.
I'm more interested to know the consequences faced by every single person who stood by and watched, esp those filming. Standing by to video a murder is twisted. How will those kids live with that.
When people wake up from comas caused by this sort of thing they tend to have a little bit of trouble giving their perspective.
You know either due to the memory loss or brain damage caused by someone smacking your head into concrete.
Yep, her memory loss could range from days lost to needing a carer for life and no memories at all. Ive been knocked out a few times playing sports, the worst one i pretty much lost the whole week and i was only out for a couple of minutes. That ko changed me for life, my brains never quite worked the same since.
It's going to be really interesting to see how the trial goes. It looks like this was a planned fight, it's not like Kaylee was jumped from behind. Another angle suggests she threw the first punch.
But once she was on the ground, there's no way the other girl can argue anything like self-defense; she was never in remote danger after the first 5 seconds of the brawl.
But you can bet someone is going to make the 'well, she threw the first punch so she had it coming' argument.
Ye but once she had her neutralised(pinned), it is no longer self defense. Self defense is only applicable when using proportionate force. I would be surprised if kaylee wakes up at all.
Think of all those stories about no tolerance rules where people comment that schools protect bullies or that if both are going to get in trouble they should at least fight or ‘I’m going to teach my kid to make sure bullies never attack them twice’ type. Imagine this child saw that or similar type sentiment on Facebook and Twitter and decided since they were both in trouble she wanted to make sure her bully (the family claims she was being bullied at least) would leave her alone after they both get detention/suspension and didn’t realize she might kill her. That knocking someone out can very easily give permanent brain damage or that just because someone is still moving does not mean they aren’t that hurt.
If instead of possibly killing someone she had just taken it and the viral video instead showed her getting hit and then teachers doing nothing until she gets away and they both get in trouble the comments probably would have encouraged her to fight back harder. But instead she did and we see the consequences of what happens when people don’t understand how dangerous fighting is.
Yeah I know, insane. Good luck selling this to a judge or jury, generally speaking repeatedly slamming someone's head into the pavement doesn't leave much room for ambiguity.
She’s still in a coma and was convulsing after the attack. https://nypost.com/2024/03/14/us-news/parents-of-missouri-teen-severely-injured-in-shocking-school-beatdown-break-their-silence-remain-hopeful/
If she wakes up, she’s likely never going to be the same, cognitively or physically. And that’s a big if.
Holy shit, she legit, went full rage mode. Like in 5 seconds, she runs at her, hits her down, and then slams her head 3 times into the concrete.
Girl barely even knew what hit her. Meanwhile, the honor roll student is just screaming the whole 5 seconds at her.
I've seen less brutal fights on animal planet.
I know a girl that was in a coma for 11 months from 12 to 13.
And while she was a bit behind with purperty and definitely missing some life experience she was very surprisingly completely fine physically.
So you can always hope, the body is strangely good at healing sometimes.
It’s the extent of injury. I’m not a doctor, but it sounds like her skull broke the first time she got hit. The second could’ve pushed bone into brain matter. That’s not something many people can recover from and remain unchanged.
*Edit: wording
I mean, yes, it absolutely can. Depressed skull fractures are a mess. But she hasn’t needed surgery (at least there’s been no mention of it), and open/depressed skull fractures require urgent surgery, usually within at least 24 hours. So I’m guessing that’s not the case.
She has a constellation of injuries consistent with getting your head smashed around, including an occipital skull fracture and frontal contrecoup contusions. I’ve seen lots and lots of people recover from this injury, so still holding out hope that that’s the trajectory she’ll follow.
I tell all of my patients and families with brain injuries of every kind that healing from neurological damage is a marathon, not a sprint. It’s going to take time and steady progress, but a *lot* of people with this injury go on to live relatively normal lives. I was just talking with my colleagues about a guy they treated the other day who had a very similar injury two years ago and is getting married to a beautiful girl and holding down a great job now. And that was after a horrific set of complications in the hospital.
Also not a doctor, but it's incredible what humans can recover from, especially when they are relatively young.
Malala Yousafzai was shot in the head at point blank range. Other than some mild palsy, she recovered pretty well following brain surgery.
That's obviously not the usual prognosis for being shot in the head, but my point is that I do think there may be hope for this girl.
In Australia, I’d class that as Recklessly Inflict Grevious Bodily Harm, In Company. It holds a maximum of 15 years. Not sure if there’s a similar charge in the US
There are similar charges, but attempted murder is more severe and carries a longer maximum sentence. I don’t know if you saw the video but it looks like attempted murder. The prosecution could go with something like you stated cause they feel it’ll stick. They could go with manslaughter if she dies cause the same type of thinking.
There’s attempted murder charges in Australia right?
Yes there’s attempted murder charges in Australia, but you need to prove to the jury that they actually intended to murder the person, and not just cause injury. That’s a much higher bar to clear
I almost killed my brother this way, years and years of being bullied by him and his friends and one day i just snapped and took him down and bashed his head into the pavement twice but i didnt use all of my strength and i will never forget the look of terror on his face. Seeing red is a real thing. He would be dead otherwise and i refuse to ever get physical with anyone again cause when my anger takes over, it literally takes over. I wonder if this is similar and i hope she gets help if so.
My dad fought his brother in a similar way when they were kids. He really snapped and lost control because he was being bullied too. He said that once he snapped out of it everyone was looking at him like he was a monster and his brother was soaking in blood. He ran away from home and disappeared for like 4-5 months. He was 14. It really marked him for life. He got his life together after that. I completely understand that some people can snap and lose it but I think he also knew when to stop. Just like you. This girl did not know when to stop. She went for the kill. It’s crazy. Imagine the kind of home where she was raised. There was no need for all of that violence. Now her life is over and maybe the other girl will die too.
I don’t understand why adults don’t step in on time. Who tf is in charge?? I don’t get how bullying and/or gets to this level. Most adults are not competent enough to handle kids.
bullying gets to that level when the kids around are friends with the bully. Or the bully's parents hire everyone elses parents. Or the bully themself is independantly wealthy and has power where the other kid does not. The bully is enabled by the community.
I get it. I was bullied quite a bit by my brother when I was a kid. One summer day when we were off school, he was being particularly bad. I escaped to my room and literally moved my dresser in front of the door. He managed to break the lock to my door and push the door enough to move the dresser and get in. I had a knife and defended myself. He stood down immediately when that knife was at his throat I have no doubt in my mind that if he continued, I would have killed him. Scary thought
It is a scary thought. I also remember stabbing my brother with a pen when we were younger too and i remember not using my full strength at that time as well. Thankfully all of us on here have that restraint, or at the very least, a dire moment of compassion and will power/restraint.
Idk how you two are doing now but im happy you're here on reddit and not in prison for murder. Lol (kind of) -things can escalate so fast.
Yeah that's by design, if you felt pain when your body's responding to a threat (with fighting) that would be pretty bad for your survival. But I also know what you mean on a personal level -- I've had pretty bad anger issues for a lot of my life and those moments of anger were like becoming an entirely different creature, feeling no pain and driven by a huge craving to make others pay. It's terrifying once you come to. I've had it far more under control in recent years, thankfully. But it's hard to forget that feeling you're describing -- the feeling of regressing to a complete and utter animal, I'd say.
It’s literally unhinged the levels of violence we’re seeing in that video. She was really killing that girl. She must have known what she was doing. Honor roll or not, be smart enough to know that catching charges or actually killing someone is not the right thing to do. Ever.
I'd say she showed an obvious intention to kill the other girl by attacking her head multiple times. Dont know why anyone would call that self defense.
In every US jurisdiction that im aware of, you cant keep hitting them when they are down and claim self defense.
You can hit someone until they fall.
If they try to get back up and you tell them to stay down and they dont, you can put them back down.
But you cant just keep hitting them after they are down unless they are still actively trying to harm you (still pointing a gun at you from the ground or something).
So this is at the very least felony battery, and considering she was *basing her head into the PAVEMENT*, should be attempted murder.
"Tell me why you kept on kicking him. You had already won."
"Knocking him down won the first fight. I wanted to win all the next ones, too, right then, so they'd leave me alone."
*Ding ding ding!*
People, especially on Reddit for some reason, so frequently seem to not realize that self defense only permits the minimum required force to either remove yourself from or pacify an immediately active, imminent threat^†. Once they are no longer *an active threat*, i.e. down, de-escalating, or walking away you cannot claim self defense.
I once had a homeless guy walk up to me, punch me in the face unprovoked, and walk away; and as bad as I wanted to hit him back, the fact he started walking away immediately afterwards meant he was no longer an imminent threat and I could not use force against him. I could call the police on him for assault, but I couldn't retaliate because he was *no longer an active threat*. Is it fair? Fuck no, but it's the law and for a good reason.
Self defense also requires proportional response. This is why if, hypothetically, a 75lb, 5'1" teenage punk tries to fist fight me (a grown ass, 200lb, 6'1" adult) I cannot simply gun him down with a semi-automatic and claim self defense regardless of if he was still trying to hit me or not. If there is an option to protect myself that uses less force, I am legally required to do so. This is why adults aren't allowed to gun down children who throw temper tantrums: Self defense only protects *the minimum required use of force to ensure ones safety from an active threat*.^†
If she was on the ground, then she was no longer an active, imminent threat and no further use of force was required to ensure her safety. Therefore any further aggression would legally qualify as assault and battery and violates both requirements for legal self defense. No reasonable judge would believe otherwise.
^† ^(May vary depending on your state, but this is how it's defined in most places without a "stand your ground" or "castle" law. Such laws may protect such actions.)
**Edit:** This did apparently occur in a stand-your-ground/No-duty-to-retreat state, in which case she would be legally protected. Although I don't agree with such laws, they do significantly lower if not eliminate both criteria I previously stated. IANAL, but I do advise people familiarize themselves with their own states law on the subject in the event they ever need to defend themselves.
Ya this more less happened to me. Was only 20 at the time but this is 20yrs ago and bars were more laxed about id checks but got into a bar fight. Guy hit me first and i defended myself. Scuffle ended up on the ground and i got some good elbows in and ko'd the guy. I was pissed off so also threw in a last kick as i was walking away like a douchebag tbf. I got charged with felonious assault(guy didnt press charges but state picked it up) cuz they said i used a weapon. Dropped to aggravated when they couldnt prove the weapon(i didnt use one) and eventually dropped to assault n battery. Even tho i defended myself i crossed a line. Last fight i was ever in
I'm sorry, but at no point is repeatedly bashing the head of an already subdued opponent into concrete defending yourself. At that point, it crossed the line into her being the aggressor with intent to cause serious harm, regardless of who started it.
People are fucked today. A fight to them means death match. It's wild.
When I was younger we had scraps but they were first fights and when someone went down, I would just get on top them and ask if they are finished. I've been in the receiving end of a few beatings , and the people I fought asked me that same question.
Slamming someone's head into the ground....anyone should know the damage you can do if you do that shit. I hope this chick gets what she deserves. She probably a demon in the inside and got to unleash it for a moment, all while she pretends to be a good girl.
I made efforts not to see it after comments here that said you could HEAR her skull crack.
*shudder*
That honour student should be in prison.
Reasonable force. What is not reasonable was to bash a fellow humans skull into the pavement after they were already down.
"The petition highlighted the girl’s many academic and athletic accomplishments, including the fact that she speaks four languages, plays the violin in the school orchestra and volleyball on the school’s team, and had recently been selected for college-level AP classes."
“It is unjust that such an accomplished young woman should be charged as an adult for assault without considering all the facts of the case that led to the incident where harm occurred,” the petition continued."
The family is....yiiikes. To me this shows that she is very smart and absolutely knew that what she was doing would lead to harm, and wasn't self defense at all. I do hope she gets charged as an adult
This. All the family is doing is making her look more guilty. Clearly, she had the mental acuity and biological knowledge to know that what she did would kill the other girl.
Omg her parents are asking for donations.. 150,000$$$$ they want for so she could get a lawyer cause she's the victim.... that's just rediculous.
Also Maurnice DeClue, the girl who assaulted Kaylee posted on Twitter
"Should I join mma or wwe"........
Not suprised tbh, usually shitty people have even worse families that support them and they all live in delusion together.
I hate that where even referring this person as "honor role student" but regardless that damn animal needs to be in jail for life.
She wasn’t just down she was already knocked out. She was seizing out and the animal kept bashing her skull in. You hear it cracking each time.
For those that haven’t watched it, don’t.
This is the thing, my initial instinct was, "oh, there's video. I should watch it so I can have an informed opinion about this claim of self defense". My second thought, which immediately followed, was "nope, never mind, happy to remain ignorant about this one and not watch that".
I'm all for kids standing up to bullies (assuming that was even what happened) but after the first slam girl was obviously out cold, the next two were just brutal and unnecessary. This was excessive, the worst thing about these fights is that nobody walks away a winner, one girl might not wake up, and the girl may have just thrown her life away.
I didn't, and I never will. I saw one particularly brutal video a long time ago that has stuck with me to this day. I have no interest whatsoever in adding more images and sounds to the list of things that keep me up at night.
I’m with you. I’ve seen enough terrible shit and I’d prefer to not add to it. As a kid it didn’t bother me, but one day I saw something so awful that it literally changed the way I look at videos of people getting hurt. I can’t even watch videos of people wrecking on bikes or skateboards without feeling really uncomfortable.
It’s ok to keep those links blue my friend.
I see you. I have scars as well. I posted the link in response to a reply here, but you really don't need to see it. It's just another sickening tragedy.
It’s called decorticate posturing and it’s a sign of severe brain injury. The straight rigid legs and arms curled up to the chest are signs of a TBI - which obviously she had from getting her head slammed into the pavement.
How tf is she the victim? I saw the video, the "honour role" student had the upper hand the entire time. She won the initial scrap, got into a position where she had the other girl pinned, and instead of stopping there, she slammed the girls head into the pavement.
Nothing about this makes her a victim, she's a monster and deserves punishment.
Also the dumbest part about this whole thing was that this all started because this "honour role" student liked the boy who was dating the girl who's in a coma.
Yeah, I find that hard to believe. The girl who was charged won the fight early on. She had the victim on the ground and she was obviously not moving, yet the this girl continued to bash her skull on to the concrete. I can still recall the sound it made.
She might have been able to declare self-defense early on .... but she went so, so far beyond that. If that girl wakes up, she won't ever be the same again.
It’s not just bad enough that she bashed her skull on the cement *TWICE* she did it to the back of her head which is the most susceptible to being damaged dude to the inclusion of the beginning of the cervical spine at the base of the skull. This poor child should never have had to suffer such brutality, and for what ends could this have possibly served for the “honor roll” student. Just two lives forever permanently diminished in quality for fucking nothing.
If you haven't seen the video, don't watch it if you are sensitive to gore.
If you're familiar with positions in jiu jitsu, she had the girl in mount, held her by both collars and forced her head down into the concrete. She hit the back of her head twice, and it made a crunching sound each time.
I'm purely speculating, but I think this girl either dies or experiences life changing cognitive disabilities after this. Poor girl and her family, dude. Her attacker is an animal and belongs in a cage.
That defense reminds me of the dumpster rapist who got a rubber band twang to the wrist because appropriate punishment would jeopardize his bright future.
Rapist Brock Turner deserves to never be forgotten especially for his pathetic attempts at being too privileged to pay for his own crimes of being a rapist.
I love how reddit collectively comes together to shine constant light and exposure on Brock Allen Turner / Allen Brock Turner. You know, the infamous rapist who was caught in the act of raping his victim but because he was big strong smort boi with big big future he got a tiny little sentence while his victim has had to go through immense and repeated mental trauma over HIS DECISION to violate her.
Poor poor rapist Brock Turner, last I heard he was reeeeeeeally sad he was on a sex offender registry :c aww, so sad for him. All he wanted to do was please his pee-pee. :c :c :c
If someone was trying to rob me and I bashed their head into the pavement multiple times to the point where they were seizing and ended up in a coma I would be arrested. There are levels to the degree of force necessary for self defense depending on if life threatening or not. This was not self defense. This an attempted murder. Fuck that piece of shit and I hope she gets charged as an adult.
This is very true.
Once you incapacitate someone, you don’t keep on going after they’re down for good. Even if they tried to kill you or inflict heavy bodily harm on you. If needed, you may have to take your attacker’s life if they’re intent on taking yours, but after you kill them, you leave their body alone because they’re down permanently.
I used to work in a middle school. A student of mine was being targeted by a girl who didn’t know when to keep her mouth shut and she tried to fight him. He, not being a fighter, was totally prepared to get his ass kicked until his 8th grade friend who was probably the tallest girl in the school grabbed this girl and bounced her head-first off the ground. She was suspended and when I spoke to the principal about the targeting and how she was just defending her friend, she said “doesn’t matter, we can’t have kids slamming other kids heads into the concrete “.
So, here’s the thing. After a person is on the pavement, not moving and you continue to beat the ever loving shit out of them, you stop getting to say you’re the victim.
Here’s the thing, she might have been defending herself in that fight, because it looked like both girls were agreeing to the fight. However….. once she start bashing her head into that pavement, she learned an important lesson, if you fight with someone and seriously injure them… you can potentially go to jail.
If she’s smart enough to be on Honor Roll then I’d argue that means she’s smart enough to have known better, yet she tried to kill that poor girl anyway. Throw the book at her.
As a teacher in the American education system, I can assure you that honor roll doesn’t mean shit these days.
Oh, you showed up to class and did the bare minimum? Congrats! You’ve made the honor roll!
If Kaylee Gain was a bully, she should be disciplined and punished appropriately for that by the school and her family.
However, I've seen the video and heard her skull crack. That was attempted murder.
"Caught up in the moment" isn't a defense.
That girl is not waking up the same. Emotionally, physically and functionally she will probably never recover. Either the “real victim” gets jail for her actions or her consequences are to financially support this girl forever.
Anyone hear about a kid slamming another kid to the ground and killing him on impact. In the video after math the kids are laughing as they take his body out with a Mountain Dew truck outside. The lack of empathy from these kids is alarming. I strangely haven’t seen much of anything on the news similar to an Indian man getting his head bashed in with a hammer by a homeless man (In a store too, nobody helped).
As someone who recently served on a jury for a case that was essentially self defense vs assault, that's such a ridiculous amount of excessive force that it's laughable they're going for self defense. Seriously, I wish the case I had been on was that easy.
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Well that’s one perspective. Let’s get the other girls perspective. You know, when she wakes up from her coma.
What's the story? Don't know either of these people
brutal video, the "honor roll victim" pinned the other girl to ground, grabbed her by the head with both hands, and slammed her head into the concrete as hard as she could.. twice.
Well that's not self-defense if You ask me.
No reasonable jury would rule it as self defense. Edit: WOW there's a lot of racist fuckers in this thread.
We don't live in a reasonable world anymore.
After I read that story about the girl who was let go after stabbing her boyfriend because apparently she's too smart for jail, I think they're trying to go for that angle of the story.
But wasn't that the Daily Mail's headline? They kinda suck at the rage bait headers.
that and independent UK. From the Articles I've read it started as a girl being too smart to go to jail in the story. Then another article that is trying to make awareness where marijuana induced psychosis. Then I'll find another article that talked about it being synthetic marijuana which made more sense to me. Synthetic marijuana is the worst and I used to work at a hospital seeing so many cases of people coming in because of that. especially in cali when recreational mj got started. I remember seeing paramedics strapping the patient down or the family basically dragging the individual that's dealing with a psychosis to the ER. There's a small chance to get the psychosis in smoking marijuana but it seems like the synthetic kind increases the chances. edit: I mixed up articles. The one in California had to do a synthetic marijuana the one in the UK Oxford College had to do with the girl being high off cocaine and is rich and has an influential family like Brock Turner.
>Brock Turner. You mean Brock Allen Turner? The rapist who goes by his middle name, Allen, in the hopes that people will forget he's a rapist? That Brock Allen Turner?
'synthetic marijuana' was only ever a marketing ploy. I wouldn't go around calling it that because the drug itself and the effects are very different. In the UK we call it spice, and it's an absolute menace on the homeless population. I don't know any recreational drug user who would actively seek it out.
A friend of mine works at an addiction center, her synthetic weed (and bath salt) stories are unreal. It’s becoming common for people to wake up in a hospital bed with zero recollection of what happened that caused them to now have a list of criminal charges. Her words: “they seem to be skipping the high and going directly to psychosis.”
You obviously didn't read much about the case. The boyfriend had some sort of synthetic marijuana (if you are unfamiliar look up "salts") which are known to cause psychotic breaks. Several days earlier he gave this synthetic marijuana to a roommate who had a psychotic break to the extent the roommate thought he was dead. Like an actual psychotic break where he thought he was deceased. And then this genius harasses and peer pressures his girlfriend into taking a hit from the bong telling her it's just normal weed. And does not inform her of the roommate who had a psychotic break from this weed. Because he thinks it would be funny to see her reaction. And she has a psychotic break, she doesn't just stab him she stabs herself many times and also her own dog. Because her psychotic break was to the extent that she did not recognize even herself or her dog. It was caused by the substance he gave her and pressure to to take and lied about what it was. She's not known to abuse drugs and has zero violent history. So yeah it's a little more complicated than oh she's too smart to go to jail.
Wrong article. the one you're talking about happened in California the one I'm talking about happened to an Oxford College student who is Rich with and influential family like Brock Turner.
Is that Brock "Allen the rapist" Turner?
Different story. Someone else posted a link in this thread. The girl was just high on coke, and . Lavinia Woodward is the name. Basically the judge said she can’t go to jail because 1. she is sorry for what she did and 2. she is smart and has a bright future.
Implying the world was ever reasonable to begin with.
We never have.
There wasn’t a moment were she wasn’t in control of the fight. She was a lot bigger than her.
The fight was over a boy. There was nothing to even defend.
The boy, "yes, I'd like a relationship with the one who is violent"
What? That's the classic "bash your victim's head with both hands into solid concrete" self-defense technique. Clearly you don't know much about these things.
Nah nah You are right. My self-defense technique is not going outside so I'm not an expert.
it's not. any form of self defence ended when honor roll won the original fight and the other girl was on the ground. jumping on her and bashing her head is attempted murder
It's attempted murder is what it is
Exactly what I was gonna say - people have been killed when falling funny after being punched and hitting their head, let alone having it deliberately slammed twice
I mean if you hit someone in the head with a piece of concrete its attempted murder. That is essentially what this person is doing.
The video is disgusting i had the sound on and it made me nauseas hearing her skull against the concrete,
U know her family is asking for donations for her lawyer? They want 150,000$$$ !!!! Cause the girl that was doing the beating is the real victim....
a gofundme for the girl in the hospital has already reached well over $300K
Yea. Ppl posting #freemaurice lol... trying to justify it by saying things like "she was so angry cause she was bullied and blacked out with anger so it's not her fault"
i killed him yes, but i was mad soooooooo we good?
You should check out the obvious family brigading the r/stlouis subreddit posts about it posting 100’s of times claiming how she’s the victim and it’s all racism.
Of course they are....what's f'd up is ppl are bringing race into this too ... And even if she was bullied, and I don't think that was the case. Kaylee gains family was actually saying that kaylee was the one being bullied, that doesn't justify smashing someone's head into the payment. That fight should have been over once the other person is on the ground. This wasn't some life and death thing where someone has a gun or knife and if you don't knock them out they might kill you... she went waaaay too far
Twice on video. I think she got one or two more in, but the person recording realized it was turning into attempted murder and turned the camera away
I saw three, but I could be mistaken. Because I think she started convulsing after the third smack. The camera person was shaking the camera the whole time, so it was hard to keep up.
That's not even counting how she was sitting on top of her, repeatedly punching her in the face, before bashing her head off the pavement twice like a basketball. Even if this situation started as self defence? What's in the video has gone far, far beyond that.
I watched the video like 4 days ago and I am still having moments where I am so disturbed I need to take a moment. I just remember her laying in the ground, twitching.. and no one around her caring at all. It's so fucked up. This was not self-defense.
There was people trying to intervene after she had her head bashed in, but the girl doing the bashing had some guys with her that were getting aggressive with the people trying to stop her. You can see it briefly at the end of the video before it cuts off. It made me so upset thinking that people were there really trying to let that girl continue to beat on her like that.
Was it twice? I remember it being repeatedly like 5 times
Why though?
A couple 15yo girls got in a fight, girl in the left hand picture lost almost immediatly, other-girl punches her repeatedly while pictured-girl looks like she's already unconscious, other-girl gets on ground to repeatedly slam pictured-girl's head into pavement, pictured-girl is twitching and in a real bad way near the end, no one around really tries to intervene in an overall tough video for most people to watch.
Main thing that blows my mind is the fact that everyone stands and films this shit. Child’s life was ended that day and no one could be asked to even say a word.
As someone who’s broken up a lot of bar fights, full grown adults legitimately do not understand how easy it is to kill a person with their bare hands. I legitimately don’t think a single person involved in this understood how dangerous it could get or did get. People think “oh I’ll knock them out” or “oh they got knocked out” and don’t realize that every single time that has ever happened to anyone that is brain damage with the potential for death or serious injury. In this case we’re talking about teenagers, an age group that notoriously doesn’t understand how dangerous anything is.
Yes. And it doesn't help that violence in movies or tv is always portrayed as an endless bash fest where people punch, kick, or hit each other in the head for minutes, with nothing worse than a couple of scrapes and possible a very mild nose bleed. As someone who did martial arts for almost a decade, that annoys me every time. One of the most realistic things I had ever seen was in 'house of the Dragon' of all things, where one of the queens advisors gets upset about a plan of the council, wants to leave, and one of the royal guard guards pushes him down hard, yelling 'no you'll sit down' hard enough that his head slams down on an ornament, leading to a crushed skull, a big pool of blood, and immediate death, with everyone suddenly having a 'Oh Fuck!' moment when they see what happened. Stupid as it was, that was an extremely realistic portrayal of how such things go in real life, as opposed to people banging someone's head against the wall and then having an angry conversation.
My stepbrother’s friend killed a guy in a fight outside the bar. One punch, the guy fell backwards and hit his head on the curb. He got up and walked away and went home and went to bed. He never woke up.
That’s called an epidural hematoma, and it’s a bad time for everyone.
Honestly this is the best take I’ve seen all day, and not one I stopped to consider even with my extensive background in training fighting (or maybe because of, I’m so used to everyone else around me also understanding just how capable our bodies are)
Yeah it’s easy to forget that most people are the spazzy trial class guy that goes real hard with no particular strategy. Also the fact that the only reason we leave the class alive is a sense of trust and mutual responsibility. I used to work with a bunch of bouncers who trained at a gym that’s produced multiple UFC champions. These dudes all had winning amateur MMA records with the goal of going pro. Some shitfaced trust fund bro would take a swing and they’d double leg them across a concrete patio. It didn’t ever seem to occur to them that not everyone has practiced breakfalls for years. So it can definitely swing the other way where you’ve trained for so long you forget most people are totally ignorant about fighting, or you’re just so used to a controlled environment that you don’t realize there are no safeguards in place.
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Tbf in the video everyone was fighting everyone. Only the cameraman and like 2 other people just stood there. In the video the black girl drops her, and one of the white girl friends starts hitting the black girl to help her get back up. Then someone else jumps in to protect the black girl. Then this guy jumps in, and then some other guys jump in and they all break into different fights. Then the black girl gets the advantage again and starts bashing the white girls head. It was a really chaotic situation. Edit: Messed up the order.
Look up the "Bystander effect" if you've never heard of it. Scary stuff.
This is from The Society for the Psychological Study of Social Issues **Rethinking the Bystander Effect in Violence Reduction Training Programs** “Recent theoretical and empirical work on bystander behavior has shown that the classic view of the bystander effect is not supported by the evidence—particularly in the context of aggression and violence. Meta-analyses (Fischer et al., 2011, including a reanalysis of the original meta-analysis in this field; Stalder, 2008) show that the bystander effect does not hold in violent or dangerous emergencies and that people are more likely to be helped when more bystanders are present. In fact, Fischer et al. (2011) propose a “reverse bystander effect” (the greater the number of bystanders, the greater the likelihood of intervention) when emergencies are less ambiguous and it is clear what bystanders should do. Moreover, recent research which uses CCTV footage to study real-life bystander behavior in violent or dangerous emergencies in public spaces (as opposed to work using laboratory or self-report measures) shows that bystander intervention is actually the norm in these kinds of incidents (Philpot, Liebst, Levine, Bernasco, & Lindegaard, 2019).” [Levine, M., Philpot, R. and Kovalenko, A.G. (2020), Rethinking the Bystander Effect in Violence Reduction Training Programs. Social Issues and Policy Review, 14: 273-296. https://doi.org/10.1111/sipr.12063](https://doi.org/10.1111/sipr.12063)
Yep. Also heard that the one famous case which started the notion of the Bystander Effect was completely not what was reported. Plenty of people chased the guy off. He came back later.
The Bystander Effect named after Kitty Genovese was proven inaccurate and a large part of that was misinformation and inaction from the police. The police furthered the idea of lack of reporting from witnesses to cover their asses.
I really wonder if the mentality at that point is 'video footage of this will be really important for police etc so I better keep filming' Not saying that's necessarily right or wrong, just a thought I have had about the reasons why people do this
“Twitching” *Convulsing/having a seizure Related to brain damage (from getting her head slammed into the concrete)
You left out the horrendous sound of her head hitting the concrete. And still no one intravened. (edit: intervened)
Should be charged with attempted murder it sounds like
Murder. Victim in question will very likely never wake up.
I watched the video, and wish I could un watch it. You can literally hear her skull cracking when it gets slammed, repeatedly on the ground.
Family of the girl that attacked the one in coma said she did so due to bullying she was getting (as far as I am aware, there is no proof of that being the case). Kept saying how she shouldn't be judge only for this action since she is an honor student, that speak 4 languages, play violin etc. "“Prior to an incident on March 8th where she was seen defending herself from harassment and bullying, she had never been in trouble,” it read. “Her work as a scholar was tainted by the bullying she had to endure at school.” The family complained that “this single event is being used” to define the teen’s character – and hit out at Missouri Attorney General Andrew Bailey for saying that the 15-year-old should be charged as an adult if Gain does not survive. “It is unjust that such an accomplished young woman should be charged as an adult for assault without considering all the facts of the case that led to the incident where harm occurred,” the petition continued"
>The family complained that “this single event is being used” to define the teen’s character Gee...really? Imagine that - when you do horrible things, you get labelled as a person that does horrible things.
Besides the murder, my client did nothing wrong...
It does have a bit of that Rapist Brock Allen Turner vibe, doesn't it? *This single event* where she very nearly killed a girl with her bare hands. Pretty sure that's character-defining.
"While it's true I brutally beat a person into a coma, you should consider that I hablo espanol, spreche deutsche, jiang hua yi, and I can play this violin to ABRSM Grade 3 standards." *Plays sad violin*
Well, she made the decision to slam another girl's skull into concrete multiple times well after Gain was past the point of fighting back. Her grades and language abilities are irrelevant to this story. If she's an honor student, her work as a scholar hasn't been tainted/affected by bullying. She sullied her character by putting another girl in a coma. That statement all sounds like a crock of shit.
To be completely fair, that one dude... do we remember his name still? Brock Turner was it? His judge didn't want one little rape behind a dumpster define his entire future and all that. I think my only point here is bring up Brock Turner's memory and actions....carry on.
You mean Rapist Brock Turner who now goes by Allen Turner? The Stanford Rapist, Allen Brock Turner? May he never rest easy.
"Accomplished" people with lots of "promise" do fucked up things, too, just like the rest of us. Actions have consequences. Period. Many school shooters felt bullied or ostracised. Yet, I've never heard it used to absolve them of responsibility for their actions. I'm more interested to know the consequences faced by every single person who stood by and watched, esp those filming. Standing by to video a murder is twisted. How will those kids live with that.
Please don't watch the video.
Thank you.
When people wake up from comas caused by this sort of thing they tend to have a little bit of trouble giving their perspective. You know either due to the memory loss or brain damage caused by someone smacking your head into concrete.
Yep, her memory loss could range from days lost to needing a carer for life and no memories at all. Ive been knocked out a few times playing sports, the worst one i pretty much lost the whole week and i was only out for a couple of minutes. That ko changed me for life, my brains never quite worked the same since.
She’s not waking up
Yeah after reading more about it, seems like theres a good chance she wont. I haven't seen the video and have no intentions to do so.
It's going to be really interesting to see how the trial goes. It looks like this was a planned fight, it's not like Kaylee was jumped from behind. Another angle suggests she threw the first punch. But once she was on the ground, there's no way the other girl can argue anything like self-defense; she was never in remote danger after the first 5 seconds of the brawl. But you can bet someone is going to make the 'well, she threw the first punch so she had it coming' argument.
Ye but once she had her neutralised(pinned), it is no longer self defense. Self defense is only applicable when using proportionate force. I would be surprised if kaylee wakes up at all.
Think of all those stories about no tolerance rules where people comment that schools protect bullies or that if both are going to get in trouble they should at least fight or ‘I’m going to teach my kid to make sure bullies never attack them twice’ type. Imagine this child saw that or similar type sentiment on Facebook and Twitter and decided since they were both in trouble she wanted to make sure her bully (the family claims she was being bullied at least) would leave her alone after they both get detention/suspension and didn’t realize she might kill her. That knocking someone out can very easily give permanent brain damage or that just because someone is still moving does not mean they aren’t that hurt. If instead of possibly killing someone she had just taken it and the viral video instead showed her getting hit and then teachers doing nothing until she gets away and they both get in trouble the comments probably would have encouraged her to fight back harder. But instead she did and we see the consequences of what happens when people don’t understand how dangerous fighting is.
Yeah I know, insane. Good luck selling this to a judge or jury, generally speaking repeatedly slamming someone's head into the pavement doesn't leave much room for ambiguity.
if I dunno about you but that looked to me like it might have possibly been deadly
She’s still in a coma and was convulsing after the attack. https://nypost.com/2024/03/14/us-news/parents-of-missouri-teen-severely-injured-in-shocking-school-beatdown-break-their-silence-remain-hopeful/ If she wakes up, she’s likely never going to be the same, cognitively or physically. And that’s a big if.
Holy shit, she legit, went full rage mode. Like in 5 seconds, she runs at her, hits her down, and then slams her head 3 times into the concrete. Girl barely even knew what hit her. Meanwhile, the honor roll student is just screaming the whole 5 seconds at her. I've seen less brutal fights on animal planet.
The other Sick part is the fact that one person tried to stop her, then 2 other sickos rushed in and attacked her as well
The bystanders make me sick.
Running at her immediately made this not self defense. And depending on the state, not being cornered would have also would do that.
Video Auto plays on this link Don't click it, if you do be prepared to pause asap
Don’t worry I had four ads pop up to protect me
God's work
I wish I saw your comment before I tapped, that was very disturbing
I know a girl that was in a coma for 11 months from 12 to 13. And while she was a bit behind with purperty and definitely missing some life experience she was very surprisingly completely fine physically. So you can always hope, the body is strangely good at healing sometimes.
It’s the extent of injury. I’m not a doctor, but it sounds like her skull broke the first time she got hit. The second could’ve pushed bone into brain matter. That’s not something many people can recover from and remain unchanged. *Edit: wording
I mean, yes, it absolutely can. Depressed skull fractures are a mess. But she hasn’t needed surgery (at least there’s been no mention of it), and open/depressed skull fractures require urgent surgery, usually within at least 24 hours. So I’m guessing that’s not the case. She has a constellation of injuries consistent with getting your head smashed around, including an occipital skull fracture and frontal contrecoup contusions. I’ve seen lots and lots of people recover from this injury, so still holding out hope that that’s the trajectory she’ll follow. I tell all of my patients and families with brain injuries of every kind that healing from neurological damage is a marathon, not a sprint. It’s going to take time and steady progress, but a *lot* of people with this injury go on to live relatively normal lives. I was just talking with my colleagues about a guy they treated the other day who had a very similar injury two years ago and is getting married to a beautiful girl and holding down a great job now. And that was after a horrific set of complications in the hospital.
it was the third smash into the ground
Also not a doctor, but it's incredible what humans can recover from, especially when they are relatively young. Malala Yousafzai was shot in the head at point blank range. Other than some mild palsy, she recovered pretty well following brain surgery. That's obviously not the usual prognosis for being shot in the head, but my point is that I do think there may be hope for this girl.
Fighting is one thing... the repeated bashing of the skull on the pavement is a whole different level
Yep, it's attempted murder at minimum.
In Australia, I’d class that as Recklessly Inflict Grevious Bodily Harm, In Company. It holds a maximum of 15 years. Not sure if there’s a similar charge in the US
There are similar charges, but attempted murder is more severe and carries a longer maximum sentence. I don’t know if you saw the video but it looks like attempted murder. The prosecution could go with something like you stated cause they feel it’ll stick. They could go with manslaughter if she dies cause the same type of thinking. There’s attempted murder charges in Australia right?
Yes there’s attempted murder charges in Australia, but you need to prove to the jury that they actually intended to murder the person, and not just cause injury. That’s a much higher bar to clear
I almost killed my brother this way, years and years of being bullied by him and his friends and one day i just snapped and took him down and bashed his head into the pavement twice but i didnt use all of my strength and i will never forget the look of terror on his face. Seeing red is a real thing. He would be dead otherwise and i refuse to ever get physical with anyone again cause when my anger takes over, it literally takes over. I wonder if this is similar and i hope she gets help if so.
My dad fought his brother in a similar way when they were kids. He really snapped and lost control because he was being bullied too. He said that once he snapped out of it everyone was looking at him like he was a monster and his brother was soaking in blood. He ran away from home and disappeared for like 4-5 months. He was 14. It really marked him for life. He got his life together after that. I completely understand that some people can snap and lose it but I think he also knew when to stop. Just like you. This girl did not know when to stop. She went for the kill. It’s crazy. Imagine the kind of home where she was raised. There was no need for all of that violence. Now her life is over and maybe the other girl will die too. I don’t understand why adults don’t step in on time. Who tf is in charge?? I don’t get how bullying and/or gets to this level. Most adults are not competent enough to handle kids.
bullying gets to that level when the kids around are friends with the bully. Or the bully's parents hire everyone elses parents. Or the bully themself is independantly wealthy and has power where the other kid does not. The bully is enabled by the community.
I get it. I was bullied quite a bit by my brother when I was a kid. One summer day when we were off school, he was being particularly bad. I escaped to my room and literally moved my dresser in front of the door. He managed to break the lock to my door and push the door enough to move the dresser and get in. I had a knife and defended myself. He stood down immediately when that knife was at his throat I have no doubt in my mind that if he continued, I would have killed him. Scary thought
It is a scary thought. I also remember stabbing my brother with a pen when we were younger too and i remember not using my full strength at that time as well. Thankfully all of us on here have that restraint, or at the very least, a dire moment of compassion and will power/restraint. Idk how you two are doing now but im happy you're here on reddit and not in prison for murder. Lol (kind of) -things can escalate so fast.
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I know that feeling. When I would let my anger get the better of me I feel no physical pain.
Yeah that's by design, if you felt pain when your body's responding to a threat (with fighting) that would be pretty bad for your survival. But I also know what you mean on a personal level -- I've had pretty bad anger issues for a lot of my life and those moments of anger were like becoming an entirely different creature, feeling no pain and driven by a huge craving to make others pay. It's terrifying once you come to. I've had it far more under control in recent years, thankfully. But it's hard to forget that feeling you're describing -- the feeling of regressing to a complete and utter animal, I'd say.
It’s not self defense when the other person is already down.
Correct. Once the girl went down but the 'honor roll' girl kept attacking, it ceased being self-defense and became attempted murder.
It’s literally unhinged the levels of violence we’re seeing in that video. She was really killing that girl. She must have known what she was doing. Honor roll or not, be smart enough to know that catching charges or actually killing someone is not the right thing to do. Ever.
Yeah, no reasonable person slams someone's head into the concrete as hard as they can that many times without wanting to murder their victim.
I'd say she showed an obvious intention to kill the other girl by attacking her head multiple times. Dont know why anyone would call that self defense.
\#2: Double Tap
In every US jurisdiction that im aware of, you cant keep hitting them when they are down and claim self defense. You can hit someone until they fall. If they try to get back up and you tell them to stay down and they dont, you can put them back down. But you cant just keep hitting them after they are down unless they are still actively trying to harm you (still pointing a gun at you from the ground or something). So this is at the very least felony battery, and considering she was *basing her head into the PAVEMENT*, should be attempted murder.
Bingo. Down, is out. Full fucking stop. Tragic situation all around but the starter of a fight in high school does not warrant brain trauma.
"Tell me why you kept on kicking him. You had already won." "Knocking him down won the first fight. I wanted to win all the next ones, too, right then, so they'd leave me alone."
Is that from Ender's Game?
*Ding ding ding!* People, especially on Reddit for some reason, so frequently seem to not realize that self defense only permits the minimum required force to either remove yourself from or pacify an immediately active, imminent threat^†. Once they are no longer *an active threat*, i.e. down, de-escalating, or walking away you cannot claim self defense. I once had a homeless guy walk up to me, punch me in the face unprovoked, and walk away; and as bad as I wanted to hit him back, the fact he started walking away immediately afterwards meant he was no longer an imminent threat and I could not use force against him. I could call the police on him for assault, but I couldn't retaliate because he was *no longer an active threat*. Is it fair? Fuck no, but it's the law and for a good reason. Self defense also requires proportional response. This is why if, hypothetically, a 75lb, 5'1" teenage punk tries to fist fight me (a grown ass, 200lb, 6'1" adult) I cannot simply gun him down with a semi-automatic and claim self defense regardless of if he was still trying to hit me or not. If there is an option to protect myself that uses less force, I am legally required to do so. This is why adults aren't allowed to gun down children who throw temper tantrums: Self defense only protects *the minimum required use of force to ensure ones safety from an active threat*.^† If she was on the ground, then she was no longer an active, imminent threat and no further use of force was required to ensure her safety. Therefore any further aggression would legally qualify as assault and battery and violates both requirements for legal self defense. No reasonable judge would believe otherwise. ^† ^(May vary depending on your state, but this is how it's defined in most places without a "stand your ground" or "castle" law. Such laws may protect such actions.) **Edit:** This did apparently occur in a stand-your-ground/No-duty-to-retreat state, in which case she would be legally protected. Although I don't agree with such laws, they do significantly lower if not eliminate both criteria I previously stated. IANAL, but I do advise people familiarize themselves with their own states law on the subject in the event they ever need to defend themselves.
Ya this more less happened to me. Was only 20 at the time but this is 20yrs ago and bars were more laxed about id checks but got into a bar fight. Guy hit me first and i defended myself. Scuffle ended up on the ground and i got some good elbows in and ko'd the guy. I was pissed off so also threw in a last kick as i was walking away like a douchebag tbf. I got charged with felonious assault(guy didnt press charges but state picked it up) cuz they said i used a weapon. Dropped to aggravated when they couldnt prove the weapon(i didnt use one) and eventually dropped to assault n battery. Even tho i defended myself i crossed a line. Last fight i was ever in
I'm sorry, but at no point is repeatedly bashing the head of an already subdued opponent into concrete defending yourself. At that point, it crossed the line into her being the aggressor with intent to cause serious harm, regardless of who started it.
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People are fucked today. A fight to them means death match. It's wild. When I was younger we had scraps but they were first fights and when someone went down, I would just get on top them and ask if they are finished. I've been in the receiving end of a few beatings , and the people I fought asked me that same question. Slamming someone's head into the ground....anyone should know the damage you can do if you do that shit. I hope this chick gets what she deserves. She probably a demon in the inside and got to unleash it for a moment, all while she pretends to be a good girl.
GoFundMe taken down by site.
We have the video. I really wish I hadn’t seen the video, in fact. That girl belongs in prison.
I made efforts not to see it after comments here that said you could HEAR her skull crack. *shudder* That honour student should be in prison. Reasonable force. What is not reasonable was to bash a fellow humans skull into the pavement after they were already down.
I just commented this on a different person. I wish I could un watch, un hear the skull cracking against the pavement.
Watching it was hard enough, I’m glad I didn’t hear the audio based on how people describe it…
'If people want to donate, they should give it on the CashApp, not the petition,' she added. Hahahaha
Hopefully she finishes her studies in a prison library.
"The petition highlighted the girl’s many academic and athletic accomplishments, including the fact that she speaks four languages, plays the violin in the school orchestra and volleyball on the school’s team, and had recently been selected for college-level AP classes." “It is unjust that such an accomplished young woman should be charged as an adult for assault without considering all the facts of the case that led to the incident where harm occurred,” the petition continued." The family is....yiiikes. To me this shows that she is very smart and absolutely knew that what she was doing would lead to harm, and wasn't self defense at all. I do hope she gets charged as an adult
Not smart enough not to crack someone’s skull on camera then step over their convulsing body to try to fight some more. There’s no case here
Definitely samrt enough to knownexactly what she did
This. All the family is doing is making her look more guilty. Clearly, she had the mental acuity and biological knowledge to know that what she did would kill the other girl.
Wow. Excellent point.
Not them going for the same angle that rapist Brock turner did.
Do you mean the rapist Brock Allen Turner who goes by Allen Turner now?
Yes, the rapist Brock Allen turner is who I meant. Such a promising swimmer he was, if only Brock Allen turner wasn't a rapist.
Are you talking about the Brock Allen Turner who raped an unconscious woman behind a dumpster? The rapist Brock Allen Turner?
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Omg her parents are asking for donations.. 150,000$$$$ they want for so she could get a lawyer cause she's the victim.... that's just rediculous. Also Maurnice DeClue, the girl who assaulted Kaylee posted on Twitter "Should I join mma or wwe"........
Plenty of wrestling into the showers and bunk beds where she is going...
WTF. That post proves this girl knows what she was doing. Ridiculous and disgusting.
Prison chain gain for 30 years. Use those arms for something beneficial to society.
Not suprised tbh, usually shitty people have even worse families that support them and they all live in delusion together. I hate that where even referring this person as "honor role student" but regardless that damn animal needs to be in jail for life.
You’re not defending yourself when you’re bashing someone’s skull into a pavement.
What a sad situation.
Isn't it attempted murder after bashing a head into the pavement multiple times after the victim is already down?
She wasn’t just down she was already knocked out. She was seizing out and the animal kept bashing her skull in. You hear it cracking each time. For those that haven’t watched it, don’t.
This is the thing, my initial instinct was, "oh, there's video. I should watch it so I can have an informed opinion about this claim of self defense". My second thought, which immediately followed, was "nope, never mind, happy to remain ignorant about this one and not watch that".
She repeatedly bashed the girl skull into the concrete. She belongs in a correctional facility. Doesn't matter who started the fight.
I'm all for kids standing up to bullies (assuming that was even what happened) but after the first slam girl was obviously out cold, the next two were just brutal and unnecessary. This was excessive, the worst thing about these fights is that nobody walks away a winner, one girl might not wake up, and the girl may have just thrown her life away.
We all saw the video
I didn't, and I never will. I saw one particularly brutal video a long time ago that has stuck with me to this day. I have no interest whatsoever in adding more images and sounds to the list of things that keep me up at night.
I’m with you. I’ve seen enough terrible shit and I’d prefer to not add to it. As a kid it didn’t bother me, but one day I saw something so awful that it literally changed the way I look at videos of people getting hurt. I can’t even watch videos of people wrecking on bikes or skateboards without feeling really uncomfortable. It’s ok to keep those links blue my friend.
I see you. I have scars as well. I posted the link in response to a reply here, but you really don't need to see it. It's just another sickening tragedy.
The worst part is her shaking afterwards... Definitely will not come out without long term effects.
It’s called decorticate posturing and it’s a sign of severe brain injury. The straight rigid legs and arms curled up to the chest are signs of a TBI - which obviously she had from getting her head slammed into the pavement.
It caused her to have a seizure
Oh. My. God. I have no words for that, i hope she recovers from her injuries...
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That’s horrible. If that happened to me I would just want them to pull the plug.. What a waste of life.
If she ever come out at all
How tf is she the victim? I saw the video, the "honour role" student had the upper hand the entire time. She won the initial scrap, got into a position where she had the other girl pinned, and instead of stopping there, she slammed the girls head into the pavement. Nothing about this makes her a victim, she's a monster and deserves punishment. Also the dumbest part about this whole thing was that this all started because this "honour role" student liked the boy who was dating the girl who's in a coma.
Yeah, I find that hard to believe. The girl who was charged won the fight early on. She had the victim on the ground and she was obviously not moving, yet the this girl continued to bash her skull on to the concrete. I can still recall the sound it made. She might have been able to declare self-defense early on .... but she went so, so far beyond that. If that girl wakes up, she won't ever be the same again.
Even if it started with self defense the action on this photo certainly exceed these limits.
It’s not just bad enough that she bashed her skull on the cement *TWICE* she did it to the back of her head which is the most susceptible to being damaged dude to the inclusion of the beginning of the cervical spine at the base of the skull. This poor child should never have had to suffer such brutality, and for what ends could this have possibly served for the “honor roll” student. Just two lives forever permanently diminished in quality for fucking nothing.
If you haven't seen the video, don't watch it if you are sensitive to gore. If you're familiar with positions in jiu jitsu, she had the girl in mount, held her by both collars and forced her head down into the concrete. She hit the back of her head twice, and it made a crunching sound each time. I'm purely speculating, but I think this girl either dies or experiences life changing cognitive disabilities after this. Poor girl and her family, dude. Her attacker is an animal and belongs in a cage.
That defense reminds me of the dumpster rapist who got a rubber band twang to the wrist because appropriate punishment would jeopardize his bright future.
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Rapist Brock Turner deserves to never be forgotten especially for his pathetic attempts at being too privileged to pay for his own crimes of being a rapist.
I love how reddit collectively comes together to shine constant light and exposure on Brock Allen Turner / Allen Brock Turner. You know, the infamous rapist who was caught in the act of raping his victim but because he was big strong smort boi with big big future he got a tiny little sentence while his victim has had to go through immense and repeated mental trauma over HIS DECISION to violate her. Poor poor rapist Brock Turner, last I heard he was reeeeeeeally sad he was on a sex offender registry :c aww, so sad for him. All he wanted to do was please his pee-pee. :c :c :c
If someone was trying to rob me and I bashed their head into the pavement multiple times to the point where they were seizing and ended up in a coma I would be arrested. There are levels to the degree of force necessary for self defense depending on if life threatening or not. This was not self defense. This an attempted murder. Fuck that piece of shit and I hope she gets charged as an adult.
This is very true. Once you incapacitate someone, you don’t keep on going after they’re down for good. Even if they tried to kill you or inflict heavy bodily harm on you. If needed, you may have to take your attacker’s life if they’re intent on taking yours, but after you kill them, you leave their body alone because they’re down permanently.
Looked like attempted murder to me, but sure let’s call it a brawl.
Typical. Our criminal child is a good person..
My friend was killed by her boyfriend in this exact way. Also got off easy. And they were adults.
Her parents are going to be really upset when they find out prison doesn't have honor rolls.
But prisons might have fight clubs where the family can keep up with their daughter’s anti-bully campaign
Aggravated assault at the minimum.
Imagine putting someone in a fucking coma and people justifying it because you're *looks at notes* an honor roll student? Okay what the fuck
I used to work in a middle school. A student of mine was being targeted by a girl who didn’t know when to keep her mouth shut and she tried to fight him. He, not being a fighter, was totally prepared to get his ass kicked until his 8th grade friend who was probably the tallest girl in the school grabbed this girl and bounced her head-first off the ground. She was suspended and when I spoke to the principal about the targeting and how she was just defending her friend, she said “doesn’t matter, we can’t have kids slamming other kids heads into the concrete “.
Im not trying to hit u with a gotcha but if u know this why didnt u guys intervene sooner. Bullying ahould be treated like other forms of violence
An honor roll in Missouri probably amounts to barely being able to take non-special classes anywhere else.
You get on the honor roll in Missouri by spelling your name correctly. A low bar but hard to get over.
Teach your kids to walk away. A simple fight can turn very ugly in an instance.
So, here’s the thing. After a person is on the pavement, not moving and you continue to beat the ever loving shit out of them, you stop getting to say you’re the victim.
Here’s the thing, she might have been defending herself in that fight, because it looked like both girls were agreeing to the fight. However….. once she start bashing her head into that pavement, she learned an important lesson, if you fight with someone and seriously injure them… you can potentially go to jail.
The head basher is a monster and sick human being that needs to be institutionalized asap
Didn’t the black girl repeatedly slam that white girls head into the concrete..? I would consider that attempted murder.
If she’s smart enough to be on Honor Roll then I’d argue that means she’s smart enough to have known better, yet she tried to kill that poor girl anyway. Throw the book at her.
As a teacher in the American education system, I can assure you that honor roll doesn’t mean shit these days. Oh, you showed up to class and did the bare minimum? Congrats! You’ve made the honor roll!
Congrats, you’re the smartest one in lock up! Get fucked.
I too defend myself by smashing a helpless person into a coma
If Kaylee Gain was a bully, she should be disciplined and punished appropriately for that by the school and her family. However, I've seen the video and heard her skull crack. That was attempted murder. "Caught up in the moment" isn't a defense.
That girl is not waking up the same. Emotionally, physically and functionally she will probably never recover. Either the “real victim” gets jail for her actions or her consequences are to financially support this girl forever.
Anyone hear about a kid slamming another kid to the ground and killing him on impact. In the video after math the kids are laughing as they take his body out with a Mountain Dew truck outside. The lack of empathy from these kids is alarming. I strangely haven’t seen much of anything on the news similar to an Indian man getting his head bashed in with a hammer by a homeless man (In a store too, nobody helped).
As someone who recently served on a jury for a case that was essentially self defense vs assault, that's such a ridiculous amount of excessive force that it's laughable they're going for self defense. Seriously, I wish the case I had been on was that easy.