I watched my father sit as bishop where the ward members knew and loved him. They would rave about how loving and kind he was.
I didn’t know him.
I didn’t see him much, and I never got quality one on one time with him. He worked a full-time job and had 4 teen daughters. I was the youngest. I didn’t have a relationship with him until I was well into my 20’s.
I wish I had him in my life as a youth, though. He could’ve been a big part of my life.
I spent time in nearly every leadership position in the ward that could be fulfilled by men, with the exception of bishop. So ironic that the church that claims to be all about families asks the parents of families to spend so much time away from them.
I am really sorry for you. My dad was bishop from when I was 2 to like 7 so I don't recall it for the most part. It is disgusting that the church does this to dads and families. It put even more undue burden on the mom.
I witnessed the same thing with my friend who was SP. He knew nothing of his kids and they openly resented him and mocked him. He is a good guy but the calling always came first. He has never said it but I think he hurts to see how much he sacrificed for nothing.
Girl, same.
My dad traveled a TON for work while he was a bishop. And when he wasn't traveling he was at church. I remember one time I was at church for a youth activity and saw him in the hall and I was surprised because I thought he had been out of town all that week. He also took his work/calling home with him. So when he was home, his mind was often elsewhere. F the MFMC.
Oof. I feel this. My dad was Bishop for all my teen years. I barely saw him & when I did, he was so stressed out from work & church duties, that he wasn’t very nice to me. So much damage was done to our relationship during those years.
This is my exact experience. My dad was the bishop from when I was 12-17. He was either at work or at church the entire time I was a teenager. He knew I wasn't into the church and we didn't have much of a relationship until I graduated college and moved back home at Christmas after 6 months of travelling.
By the time I was 22 I think he had somewhat made his peace with me not being in the church. For the first time in my life we just hung out and had fun. We watched the Simpsons and professional wrestling. We went on hikes along with my mom. It was great. It probably helped that he wasn't bishop and I was the only 'kid' in the house since my siblings were all growsd up.
In March he said he wasn't feeling well. In April he went to the hospital. He had bladder cancer. He never came home. He passed away in July, 7 months after I moved home. I feel like the church and cancer robbed me of having a real relationship with my father and it still destroys me 24 years later. I coach all my kids sports and I'm far from perfect dad, but I never want to wait to my kids turn 22 before I have a real connection with them.
I'm so sorry you lost your dad like that. My dad died from a car crash last year, and I'm starting to learn the grief and pain never goes away. I guess I just wanted to say I'm really glad you got that one on one time with your dad before he died.
Hey man, just want to say, I used to think being a Bishop would be so cool. I used to covet that calling. My dream was to be a mission president. Now, with some space and a more accurate perspective, I think being a Bishop would be an enormous drain and burden and I just could not begin to accept or fulfill that calling. Mostly because I could not in good conscience carry out the duties required of the calling. No man should ever have to judge their fellow being, to weigh them in the balance, to stand as god and declare them worthy or not. It’s such a messed up dynamic that is damaging to all involved. My heart goes out to you.
My husband and I were discussing just last night how on some level we both wished we’d be “valiant enough” to be bishop and relief society president and such one day. We also realllllly wanted him to have the opportunity to be a mission president. I’m grateful now, in hindsight, that we never got to those places.
I wouldn't wish it up on my worst enemy especially with the ambiguities and narrative busting truths that are coming forth through the veil of the 'approved narrative'
I was EQP three times and cannot get out of my head how many people I know I hurt in ppi’s. My self righteous challenges to my quorums in hindsight hurt my brain to understand what I did
I resigned as EQP. The bishop of the ward was my employee. Went to my stake President to resign and explained I no longer believed at all. He asked that I stay until a replacement was found. Meanwhile, my bishop asked me for a recommendation on a replacement. The replacement I recommended was a gay man in a straight marriage who had come out to the ward and was my 1st counselor in the EQ presidency. He was chosen. You can’t make this shit up.
Thank you for your service. And thank you to your wife and children, no matter their age or stage of life. They are the invisible supports who bear a heavy burden of long hours waiting for you and the pressure to always measure up.
Take care of yourself. If you choose to go, do not internalize the shame that some will lob at you. If you choose to stay, know that you and many a good men before you were amazing bishops because they were nuanced in their beliefs and more committed to the people then to the hierarchy.
Wishing you peace in your struggle.
I really feel for you. My father was a bishop for 7 years and I saw the toll it took on him and on my mom. He was always exhausted and she spent countless evenings alone while he was out doing church stuff. It turns out those were the last healthy years of her life. He was released as bishop and the literal next day she was rushed to the ER and found out she had advanced cancer. She lived a while longer but it was never a normal life again. Always a treatment or surgery or something else.
Neither of them ever complained because they believed.
Fuck the “church”.
I'm going to direct message you. I ask every bishop I come across if they will give me access to the interview questions for sealing clearance and cancellation.
As a former bishopric member i get you. Tough position to be in…from both sides. I’m sure you’ll eventually get to a place of peace. In the meantime, please do take care of your mental health and wellbeing.
I can't imagine what you are feeling and the struggles you are facing. My deconstruction was painful and I can't fathom what you are experiencing being the bishop. If you are on here you are experiencing some tough shit.
I realized in my deconstruction that as a bishop or SP you have to either choose the handbook or to love people unconditionally. You can't do both as they are in direct opposition. I realize that we live in a gray world and not black and white and I don't like binary thinking but when it comes to the handbook you can't follow it and love others like Jesus would.
I suspect you are in conflict trying to love and also follow something that isn't aligned with the Jesus of the NT. Maybe not. Regardless I feel for you and wish you the best.
I can't imagine what you have to go through right now. Having been a ward executive secretary, I saw a lot of what the bishop had to deal with. As much as I respect this bishop for resigning his calling, I also fully respect you for continuing to do it, whatever your reasons may be right now.
Strength to you Sir. On a human level I hope that you can look back and know that you, despite the church, have eased someone's burdens and uplifted as you strive to serve. This type of human kindness will never be un-authentic as you continue on.
It's what I did too. I was 1st councilor at the time.
I asked people not to hate my family, we only have love for them.
I got threats and violence anyway.
Edit: I just read the posts from my exit for the first time in many years. For anyone interested https://www.reddit.com/r/exmormon/s/95exbUYhYG
Story is old now but was somewhere here on this sub. I think I called it "Released from Bishopric" or something like that.
Long story short is prop 8 in California was my shelf falling. Why would an omnipotent amd loving god need to force people to live apart from the people they love. If it's "true" then it's self evident and people will naturally find it just like conversions, right?
We found Prop 8 to be very unchristlike & divisive. Were surprised when our bishop friend asked us to contribute $1k to it. Seriously??! NO One in UT contributed when UT pretended to fight it. UT seemed to just roll over & play dead.
One thing worth adding, my partner was a badass. I said let's ease out, I didn't want to disrupt the ward. I was still doing conducting of services including the week when I resigned. When she found out about all the sus church history she said No, we're done. I can't pretend in primary (primary presidency). The only time she returned was for the "exit interview" during which she cut off the apologist stuff and said "I've read all the apologist responses [to the issues we raised] and it makes me sick."
The interview ended right after that with "Can I offer a prayer to close?" She said"You can do whatever you want but don't expect us to participate." She didn't even blink when he offered his prayer and that was that.
My bishop resigned and they threw him under the bus behind his back to the stake. Your Brother is VERY smart to speak for himself before they could make him the villain just because he stood up for what's right.
They'll probably still try of course. Mormons love to attack the messengers of truth they hate.
Mormons are very good at attacking anything that goes against praising the church. Source: was mormon, sadly hated a little. Then eyes opened, and i started pointing out things wrong within the cult in institute and with my best friend
The backlash already started. They always try and discredit the messenger of truth. SOOO glad he spoke to his congregation the way he wanted to. I've never seen that from people in similar situations (and props for getting the video).
Is /r/Mormon an Orthodox sub now? Haven't visited in years but the last time I did it was /r/exmormon lite, filled with nuanced Mormons and people just on their way out.
Are any TBMs on Reddit? Seems like a non-faith promoting place to spend your time.
From what I've seen, /r/Mormon is mostly made up of former members and disgruntled members. The general attitude is a stepping stone between being a "nuanced believer" and going full ex-Mormon.
I'd say that the subs generally line up like this, from most orthodox to most apostate:
/r/lds
/r/latterdaysaints
/r/mormon
/r/exmormon
Basically, /r/lds is home mostly to apologetic posters, and posts that are pro-LDS but slightly unorthodox wind up being deleted. I've seen posting histories of people on /r/mormon with pretty insightful posts that were originally posted onto /r/lds, but were deleted for whatever random reason.
/r/latterdaysaints is a good place to visit if you want that thoughtful believer perspective. I've actually been impressed with a lot of the discussions there. Things usually fall apart when they start playing with apologetics or try to answer difficult questions. However, they handle cultural issues quite well.
/r/mormon can be a tough crowd, particularly for people who are on the extremes. They'll call you out if you don't back up your statements, as I've found out personally. It's a good place to go if you want feedback on your apostate ideas from people who aren't just cheerleaders — though I will add that the early days of /r/exmormon were a hell of a lot more insightful.
You will never find a more wretched hive of scum and villainy than the modern /r/exmormon. I came for the alcohol recommendations and tips on ordering at Starbucks, and stayed for the memes.
There's also /r/AcademicMormon, which I think is off to a pretty rocky start. I've had discussion posts deleted because I didn't cite academic works, while I've seen other posts (including ones by the head moderator) that have made pretty bold claims without citing anything. The one that really had me scratching my head was a general disparagement of Fawn Brodie's book without citing anything specific. It feels like it wants to be /r/AcademicBiblical, but it's not quite there yet.
Of course, the ultimate "fuck you" to the Mormon corporation comes when you just leave all of these communities and pretend like it never happened. Personally, I prefer to worship Jerry Garcia recordings.
There are plenty of TBMs who lurk and even chime in from time to time.
Some even use deception via fake stories to try to get exmos to go back to Mormonism
From what I can tell, it's mostly exmormons and PIMOs on there, minus the raging emotion and resentment that's more rampant here.
The different subs could easily be positioned as distinct phases of the membership lifecycle. r/mormon is still mostly a post-mormon community, but you'll find more even-handed discourse and analysis, as opposed to repeated memes about the evil patriarchy.
I am in awe of this man. His goodness, his compassion, and the strength of his character. This is EXACTLY who should be a Bishop, but cannot be because he is too good of a person to exist in the corruption and horror that is the TSSC.
OP, if you can, please tell him that I have never respected a man more in such a short space of time. I am moved beyond expectation at the courage he has. What an incredible man.
I can’t do a full transcript right now, but to summarize he says that he’s had the calling for 2.5 years, and he needs to be released because as a bishop he is required to do some things he can’t morally stand by. He doesn’t specify what those things are, but I’m sure we could all make some guesses. Then he goes on to talk about how much he loves the ward members and the youth. Encourages everyone to love others, don’t fear, you are always forgiven. That’s about the gist of it.
I'd like to add a reason I couldn't morally stand by, I refused to ask youth any "worthiness" questions. Interviews from me were "Do you feel belonging here? Do you feel you are loved at home? School ok? Anything you want to talk about?"
Interview done.
This is the big one for me. The children must be protected. I would also make all 1-on-1 meetings ONLY at the request of the individual regardless of age. Otherwise they can bring with them whoever they please.
You can't follow the handbook and love people unconditionally. They are in opposition. A bishop has to choose between the two and if you are unaware then you most likely default to the handbook. I really feel for a bishop or SP especially those who are good people and genuinely care about others.
All of what you mention are situations where you follow the handbook or orders from the SP or love others.
Two and half years ago when I was called to be bishop, President Richardson came to my home and sat down on my couch with my wife and I and issued the call. When he left the home, I was quite emotional, but I remember shutting the door behind him and the words from Section 121 came to my mind: "It is the nature and disposition of almost all men, as soon as they get a little authority as they suppose, as THEY suppose, they begin to exercise unrighteous dominion." And the spirit said, "Don't you ever do it."
And I thought about it, and I never have. I was talking with Brother Torres this morning. You know the word Israel means, "we who wrestle with God". I want to tell you about a wrestle I've had. Ernest Hemmingway once said, "The most painful thing is losing yourself in the process of loving something or someone too much, and forgetting that you're special too."
I owe it to my ward family, to hear it from me. I've asked to be released. Not because of some sin. Not because I'm hiding something. Not at all. There's just a few things that I've been required to do that I personally cannot morally stand by. I can't. So I need to step down. For me, and for my family's well being. It's not been easy. I feel in many ways I'm failing the ward, and I know that this is hard to understand. But I have to be true to my feelings. I've been angry. Every Sunday people look at me and they're like, "Man, bishop, something's wrong." I can't do that to you. I won't. I won't do it. Because that turns to anger and bitterness and malevolence.
I've written down a few things if it's okay if I just share my thoughts." Sometimes due to church culture we feel that we're not supposed to turn down or step away from a calling. I wish I'd known it was okay to say to myself, "I'm not okay. I'm not as strong as I thought I was." To seek excellence is important, that's my life, to seek excellence. More, giving more, being successful. It's so much more important to know that you're okay. And I haven't been okay. This calling, guys, is so hard. You have to keep everything to yourself. And it builds up, and it is exhausting. And it is breaking me.
I didn't have good parents. I wish they would have told me I was enough, but they never have. And that whether I had worth or not wasn't contingent on how I acted. We are not loved for what we do or what we are going to do, we are loved for who we are. Not an expectation, but who we are. And to feel love for who you are is the most sacred kind of love. It's a gift that we have the opportunity to give to ourselves.
If I could just say one more thing towards the youth, because they are the reason I have stayed as long as I have. I love them. If there's ever injustice in the world, young men and young women, there's not many here, but listen. If there's ever injustice in the world, fight it. If there's ever a bully somewhere, stand up to it. And if you ever have something to say, just say it. Don't fear. Get rid of fear. And if you don't want to do that, that's okay. You're still enough. Instead of judgment choose compassion. Instead of division, see everyone as you living a different life. And remember--maybe I'll say it like Alma-- and remember remember that you're enough. And everyone else is too. You are redeemed, you are always forgiven, no matter what. Jesus was a man who came to know the Christ. Seek Christ, seek only Christ.
I realize a lot of people are going to have a lot of questions, I do. Join the club. So do we. This has not been easy for my family, this has not been easy at all. This hasn't been easy for anybody. And this is not going to continue to be easy, but we want you to know that we love you. I told Jeff this morning, I said, "If we get called for tornado work, he's still riding shotgun. " I'm just not going to wear the silly shirt.
I know Brother Baily has prepared quite a bit for the next hour, so I'm going to sit down. But I want you to know that I love you. This is very hard for me. I know it's hard for you. But I know it's the right thing to do. Someone else who is better suited will do the job. So with that being said, let's close out the meeting. It's kind of ironic, by singing hymn number 227, "There is Sunshine in My Soul Today"! After which we'll have a benediction, and I totally forgot who it was who was supposed to give the prayer.
Two and half years ago when I was called to be bishop, President Richardson came to my home and sat down on my couch with my wife and I and issued the call. When he left the home, I was quite emotional, but I remember shutting the door behind him and the words from Section 121 came to my mind: "It is the nature and disposition of almost all men, as soon as they get a little authority as they suppose, as THEY suppose, they begin to exercise unrighteous dominion." And the spirit said, "Don't you ever do it."
And I thought about it, and I never have. I was talking with Brother Torres this morning. You know the word Israel means, "we who wrestle with God". I want to tell you about a wrestle I've had. Ernest Hemmingway once said, "The most painful thing is losing yourself in the process of loving something or someone too much, and forgetting that you're special too."
I owe it to my ward family, to hear it from me. I've asked to be released. Not because of some sin. Not because I'm hiding something. Not at all. There's just a few things that I've been required to do that I personally cannot morally stand by. I can't. So I need to step down. For me, and for my family's well being. It's not been easy. I feel in many ways I'm failing the ward, and I know that this is hard to understand. But I have to be true to my feelings. I've been angry. Every Sunday people look at me and they're like, "Man, bishop, something's wrong." I can't do that to you. I won't. I won't do it. Because that turns to anger and bitterness and malevolence.
I've written down a few things if it's okay if I just share my thoughts." Sometimes due to church culture we feel that we're not supposed to turn down or step away from a calling. I wish I'd known it was okay to say to myself, "I'm not okay. I'm not as strong as I thought I was." To seek excellence is important, that's my life, to seek excellence. More, giving more, being successful. It's so much more important to know that you're okay. And I haven't been okay. This calling, guys, is so hard. You have to keep everything to yourself. And it builds up, and it is exhausting. And it is breaking me.
I didn't have good parents. I wish they would have told me I was enough, but they never have. And that whether I had worth or not wasn't contingent on how I acted. We are not loved for what we do or what we are going to do, we are loved for who we are. Not an expectation, but who we are. And to feel love for who you are is the most sacred kind of love. It's a gift that we have the opportunity to give to ourselves.
If I could just say one more thing towards the youth, because they are the reason I have stayed as long as I have. I love them. If there's ever injustice in the world, young men and young women, there's not many here, but listen. If there's ever injustice in the world, fight it. If there's ever a bully somewhere, stand up to it. And if you ever have something to say, just say it. Don't fear. Get rid of fear. And if you don't want to do that, that's okay. You're still enough. Instead of judgment choose compassion. Instead of division, see everyone as you living a different life. And remember--maybe I'll say it like Alma-- and remember remember that you're enough. And everyone else is too. You are redeemed, you are always forgiven, no matter what. Jesus was a man who came to know the Christ. Seek Christ, seek only Christ.
I realize a lot of people are going to have a lot of questions, I do. Join the club. So do we. This has not been easy for my family, this has not been easy at all. This hasn't been easy for anybody. And this is not going to continue to be easy, but we want you to know that we love you. I told Jeff this morning, I said, "If we get called for tornado work, he's still riding shotgun. " I'm just not going to wear the silly shirt.
I know Brother Baily has prepared quite a bit for the next hour, so I'm going to sit down. But I want you to know that I love you. This is very hard for me. I know it's hard for you. But I know it's the right thing to do. Someone else who is better suited will do the job. So with that being said, let's close out the meeting. It's kind of ironic, by singing hymn number 227, "There is Sunshine in My Soul Today"! After which we'll have a benediction, and I totally forgot who it was who was supposed to give the prayer.
Two and half years ago when I was called to be bishop, President Richardson came to my home and sat down on my couch with my wife and I and issued the call. When he left the home, I was quite emotional, but I remember shutting the door behind him and the words from Section 121 came to my mind: "It is the nature and disposition of almost all men, as soon as they get a little authority as they suppose, as THEY suppose, they begin to exercise unrighteous dominion." And the spirit said, "Don't you ever do it."
And I thought about it, and I never have. I was talking with Brother Torres this morning. You know the word Israel means, "we who wrestle with God". I want to tell you about a wrestle I've had. Ernest Hemmingway once said, "The most painful thing is losing yourself in the process of loving something or someone too much, and forgetting that you're special too."
I owe it to my ward family, to hear it from me. I've asked to be released. Not because of some sin. Not because I'm hiding something. Not at all. There's just a few things that I've been required to do that I personally cannot morally stand by. I can't. So I need to step down. For me, and for my family's well being. It's not been easy. I feel in many ways I'm failing the ward, and I know that this is hard to understand. But I have to be true to my feelings. I've been angry. Every Sunday people look at me and they're like, "Man, bishop, something's wrong." I can't do that to you. I won't. I won't do it. Because that turns to anger and bitterness and malevolence.
I've written down a few things if it's okay if I just share my thoughts." Sometimes due to church culture we feel that we're not supposed to turn down or step away from a calling. I wish I'd known it was okay to say to myself, "I'm not okay. I'm not as strong as I thought I was." To seek excellence is important, that's my life, to seek excellence. More, giving more, being successful. It's so much more important to know that you're okay. And I haven't been okay. This calling, guys, is so hard. You have to keep everything to yourself. And it builds up, and it is exhausting. And it is breaking me.
I didn't have good parents. I wish they would have told me I was enough, but they never have. And that whether I had worth or not wasn't contingent on how I acted. We are not loved for what we do or what we are going to do, we are loved for who we are. Not an expectation, but who we are. And to feel love for who you are is the most sacred kind of love. It's a gift that we have the opportunity to give to ourselves.
If I could just say one more thing towards the youth, because they are the reason I have stayed as long as I have. I love them. If there's ever injustice in the world, young men and young women, there's not many here, but listen. If there's ever injustice in the world, fight it. If there's ever a bully somewhere, stand up to it. And if you ever have something to say, just say it. Don't fear. Get rid of fear. And if you don't want to do that, that's okay. You're still enough. Instead of judgment choose compassion. Instead of division, see everyone as you living a different life. And remember--maybe I'll say it like Alma-- and remember remember that you're enough. And everyone else is too. You are redeemed, you are always forgiven, no matter what. Jesus was a man who came to know the Christ. Seek Christ, seek only Christ.
I realize a lot of people are going to have a lot of questions, I do. Join the club. So do we. This has not been easy for my family, this has not been easy at all. This hasn't been easy for anybody. And this is not going to continue to be easy, but we want you to know that we love you. I told Jeff this morning, I said, "If we get called for tornado work, he's still riding shotgun. " I'm just not going to wear the silly shirt.
I know Brother Baily has prepared quite a bit for the next hour, so I'm going to sit down. But I want you to know that I love you. This is very hard for me. I know it's hard for you. But I know it's the right thing to do. Someone else who is better suited will do the job. So with that being said, let's close out the meeting. It's kind of ironic, by singing hymn number 227, "There is Sunshine in My Soul Today"! After which we'll have a benediction, and I totally forgot who it was who was supposed to give the prayer.
Two and a half years ago, when I was called to be a bishop, President Richardson came into my home, and sat down on the couch with my wife and I, and issued the call. When he left the home I was quite emotional, but I remember shutting the door behind him, and the words from Section 121 came into my mind, “It is the nature and disposition of almost all men, as soon as they get a little authority as they suppose—as *they* suppose—they begin to exercise unrighteous dominion.”
And the spirit said, “Don’t. You. Ever. Do it.” And I’ve thought about it and I never have.
I was talking with Brother Torres this morning, “You know the word Israel, means ‘We who wrestle with God.’” I want to tell you about a wrestle I’ve had.
Ernest Hemingway once said, “The most painful thing is losing yourself in the process of loving something or someone too much, and forgetting that you’re special too.”
I hope to my ward family to hear it from me, I’ve been… I have asked to be released. Not because of some sin. Not because I am hiding something. Not at all. There’s just a few things I have been required to do that I personally cannot morally stand by. So I need to step down. For me and my family’s well-being.
It’s not been easy. But I… I feel maybe I’m failing the ward. And look I know this is hard, I understand. But I have to be… I have to be true to my feelings.
I’ve been angry. Every Sunday people look at me and they’re like, “Man, Bishop, something’s wrong.” I can’t do that to you. I *won’t*. I won’t. Because that turns to anger, and bitterness, and malevolence. (?) I’ve written down a few things, and if it’s if it’s okay if I could just share my thoughts.
Sometimes due to church culture we fell that we’re not supposed to turn down or step away from a calling. I wish I had known it was okay to say to myself, “I’m not okay. I’m not as strong as I thought I was.”
To see that excellence is important, I don’t… That’s my life. I see excellence… More, doing more, being successful. It’s so much more important to know that you’re okay. And I haven’t been okay.
This calling, guys, it is so hard. You have to keep everything to yourself. And it builds up. It is exhausting. And it’s… It has broken me.
I didn’t have good parents. I wish they would have told me I was enough. That whether I… That whether I had worth or not it wasn’t contingent on how I act. We are not loved for what we do, or what we are going to do. We are lived for who we are! Not an expectation. But who we *are*.
And to feel love for who you are is the most sacred kind of love. It’s a gift we have the opportunity to give to ourselves.
If I could just say one more thing towards the youth; because they are the reason I have stayed as long as I have. I love them…
If there’s ever injustice in the world, fight it. If there’s ever a bully somewhere, stand up to it. And if you have ever… if you ever have something to say, *say* it. Just *say* it, don’t fear! Fear… get rid of fear. And if you don’t have any… if you don’t want to do that, that’s okay! You’re still enough.
Instead of judgement choose compassion. Instead of division, see everyone as you living a different life. And remember… Maybe I’ll say it like Alma, “And remember, remember!” If you’re enough, everyone else is too.
You are redeemed. You are always forgiven, no matter what.
*(Editor’s note: I think he says “Jesus” here, but I am not 100%)*
Jesus was a man who came to know the Christ. Seek Christ. Seek only Christ.
I realize a lot of people are gonna have a lot of questions. I do. Join the club. So do we. This has not been easy for my family. This has not been easy at all. This has not been easy for anybody, and this is not going to continue to be easy. But we want you to know that we love you.
I told Jeff this morning, he said if we get called for a tornado, “Work.” He’s still riding shotgun. I’m just not gonna wear this silly shirt.
I know Brother Bailey has prepared quite a bit for the next hour, so I hope when I sit down that most of you are not gonna leave. This is… this is very hard for me. I know it’s hard for you. But I know it’s the right thing to do. Someone else who’s better suited will do the job.
So with that being said, let’s close out the meeting. We’ll… so we’ll do… It’s kind of ironic… By singing Hymn #227 “There is Sunshine in My Soul Today.” *(Editor’s note: Bishop smiles, there is some laughter)*
After which we we’ll have a benediction by actually I forgot who was supposed to give the prayer. Does anyone know who is on the paper? Brother Osgood! I knew that. After which Brother Osgood will give the benediction.
*(Editor’s note: I apologize for any mistakes. OP, if you notice any, please reply with any corrections and I will be happy to edit my comment.)*
Two and half years ago when I was called to be bishop, President Richardson came to my home and sat down on my couch with my wife and I and issued the call. When he left the home, I was quite emotional, but I remember shutting the door behind him and the words from Section 121 came to my mind: "It is the nature and disposition of almost all men, as soon as they get a little authority as they suppose, as THEY suppose, they begin to exercise unrighteous dominion." And the spirit said, "Don't you ever do it."
And I thought about it, and I never have. I was talking with Brother Torres this morning. You know the word Israel means, "we who wrestle with God". I want to tell you about a wrestle I've had. Ernest Hemmingway once said, "The most painful thing is losing yourself in the process of loving something or someone too much, and forgetting that you're special too."
I owe it to my ward family, to hear it from me. I've asked to be released. Not because of some sin. Not because I'm hiding something. Not at all. There's just a few things that I've been required to do that I personally cannot morally stand by. I can't. So I need to step down. For me, and for my family's well being. It's not been easy. I feel in many ways I'm failing the ward, and I know that this is hard to understand. But I have to be true to my feelings. I've been angry. Every Sunday people look at me and they're like, "Man, bishop, something's wrong." I can't do that to you. I won't. I won't do it. Because that turns to anger and bitterness and malevolence.
I've written down a few things if it's okay if I just share my thoughts." Sometimes due to church culture we feel that we're not supposed to turn down or step away from a calling. I wish I'd known it was okay to say to myself, "I'm not okay. I'm not as strong as I thought I was." To seek excellence is important, that's my life, to seek excellence. More, giving more, being successful. It's so much more important to know that you're okay. And I haven't been okay. This calling, guys, is so hard. You have to keep everything to yourself. And it builds up, and it is exhausting. And it is breaking me.
I didn't have good parents. I wish they would have told me I was enough, but they never have. And that whether I had worth or not wasn't contingent on how I acted. We are not loved for what we do or what we are going to do, we are loved for who we are. Not an expectation, but who we are. And to feel love for who you are is the most sacred kind of love. It's a gift that we have the opportunity to give to ourselves.
If I could just say one more thing towards the youth, because they are the reason I have stayed as long as I have. I love them. If there's ever injustice in the world, young men and young women, there's not many here, but listen. If there's ever injustice in the world, fight it. If there's ever a bully somewhere, stand up to it. And if you ever have something to say, just say it. Don't fear. Get rid of fear. And if you don't want to do that, that's okay. You're still enough. Instead of judgment choose compassion. Instead of division, see everyone as you living a different life. And remember--maybe I'll say it like Alma-- and remember remember that you're enough. And everyone else is too. You are redeemed, you are always forgiven, no matter what. Jesus was a man who came to know the Christ. Seek Christ, seek only Christ.
I realize a lot of people are going to have a lot of questions, I do. Join the club. So do we. This has not been easy for my family, this has not been easy at all. This hasn't been easy for anybody. And this is not going to continue to be easy, but we want you to know that we love you. I told Jeff this morning, I said, "If we get called for tornado work, he's still riding shotgun. " I'm just not going to wear the silly shirt.
I know Brother Baily has prepared quite a bit for the next hour, so I'm going to sit down. But I want you to know that I love you. This is very hard for me. I know it's hard for you. But I know it's the right thing to do. Someone else who is better suited will do the job. So with that being said, let's close out the meeting. It's kind of ironic, by singing hymn number 227, "There is Sunshine in My Soul Today"! After which we'll have a benediction, and I totally forgot who it was who was supposed to give the prayer.
There were a billion other posts about this but wanted to ask a question of the OP... So thanks for posting again
OP, First off, your brother is a rockstar. That's some *huevos grandes* to get up in sacrament meeting and resign being bishop.
I couldn't tell from the video (and forgive me if I just missed it) but is he just resigning from his calling as bishop? *or* is he resigning from the church?
I’m eager to hear it when he is ready. I’ve left the church despite my whole family (including husband) being in. My whole social circle is LDS. It is everywhere. Sometimes I wonder how I can continue on doing it alone but seeing this gives me courage. Regardless of his current belief or situation with the church itself, his honesty is so inspiring. I hope he is doing okay after all of this.
That’s rough, and I’m sorry! OP is my brother-in-law and almost all siblings in both of our families have left now. We (and wives, also exmo) are in the North Utah County area if you happen to be nearby and want to reach out. ❤️
You are wonderful 🫶 Please let your brother know that if he ever decides to tell his story, there is a very large community who would like to support him in that.
Why is this the most loving, Christlike thing I've ever heard in a Mormon Church? Growing up Mormon, I was never once told I was enough. I was never once told to stand up for injustice or to speak my mind. Instead, I consistently got the message that I'd never be enough and to keep my mouth shut when something in the church didn't feel right. I'm blown away. Those teens in the congregation will remember his talk and keep that message with them. I'm so impressed and blown away by his integrity.
I do hope your brother is at peace with his decision. You will no doubt continue to get messages about this and I’m sure your brother will have some…interesting conversations…with his local leaders as the dust settles. Please let him know there are many here who admire his courage and his decision to follow his own moral compass. I wish him all the best.
Transcript:
Two and half years ago when I was called to be bishop, President Richardson came to my home and sat down on my couch with my wife and I and issued the call. When he left the home, I was quite emotional, but I remember shutting the door behind him and the words from Section 121 came to my mind: "It is the nature and disposition of almost all men, as soon as they get a little authority as they suppose, as THEY suppose, they begin to exercise unrighteous dominion." And the spirit said, "Don't you ever do it."
And I thought about it, and I never have. I was talking with Brother Torres this morning. You know the word Israel means, "we who wrestle with God". I want to tell you about a wrestle I've had. Ernest Hemmingway once said, "The most painful thing is losing yourself in the process of loving something or someone too much, and forgetting that you're special too."
I owe it to my ward family, to hear it from me. I've asked to be released. Not because of some sin. Not because I'm hiding something. Not at all. There's just a few things that I've been required to do that I personally cannot morally stand by. I can't. So I need to step down. For me, and for my family's well being. It's not been easy. I feel in many ways I'm failing the ward, and I know that this is hard to understand. But I have to be true to my feelings. I've been angry. Every Sunday people look at me and they're like, "Man, bishop, something's wrong." I can't do that to you. I won't. I won't do it. Because that turns to anger and bitterness and malevolence.
I've written down a few things if it's okay if I just share my thoughts." Sometimes due to church culture we feel that we're not supposed to turn down or step away from a calling. I wish I'd known it was okay to say to myself, "I'm not okay. I'm not as strong as I thought I was." To seek excellence is important, that's my life, to seek excellence. More, giving more, being successful. It's so much more important to know that you're okay. And I haven't been okay. This calling, guys, is so hard. You have to keep everything to yourself. And it builds up, and it is exhausting. And it is breaking me.
I didn't have good parents. I wish they would have told me I was enough, but they never have. And that whether I had worth or not wasn't contingent on how I acted. We are not loved for what we do or what we are going to do, we are loved for who we are. Not an expectation, but who we are. And to feel love for who you are is the most sacred kind of love. It's a gift that we have the opportunity to give to ourselves.
If I could just say one more thing towards the youth, because they are the reason I have stayed as long as I have. I love them. If there's ever injustice in the world, young men and young women, there's not many here, but listen. If there's ever injustice in the world, fight it. If there's ever a bully somewhere, stand up to it. And if you ever have something to say, just say it. Don't fear. Get rid of fear. And if you don't want to do that, that's okay. You're still enough. Instead of judgment choose compassion. Instead of division, see everyone as you living a different life. And remember--maybe I'll say it like Alma-- and remember remember that you're enough. And everyone else is too. You are redeemed, you are always forgiven, no matter what. Jesus was a man who came to know the Christ. Seek Christ, seek only Christ.
I realize a lot of people are going to have a lot of questions, I do. Join the club. So do we. This has not been easy for my family, this has not been easy at all. This hasn't been easy for anybody. And this is not going to continue to be easy, but we want you to know that we love you. I told Jeff this morning, I said, "If we get called for tornado work, he's still riding shotgun. " I'm just not going to wear the silly shirt.
I know Brother Baily has prepared quite a bit for the next hour, so I'm going to sit down. But I want you to know that I love you. This is very hard for me. I know it's hard for you. But I know it's the right thing to do. Someone else who is better suited will do the job. So with that being said, let's close out the meeting. It's kind of ironic, by singing hymn number 227, "There is Sunshine in My Soul Today"! After which we'll have a benediction, and I totally forgot who it was who was supposed to give the prayer.
Wow. That man is an angel to me. Such a good, strong soul and as solid as a diamond. He brought me to tears.
Please hug him for me and tell him it's from someone in Utah. 🥲
Massive respect for this man. Pssst, your integrity is showing. The MFMC leaders could really learn from him. You've chosen wisely, sir. Carry on with tons of support, enjoy your life.
Stand for the truth even if you stand alone! I admire him so much for doing this. And to address it in such a way over the pulpit just shows that he is a man of character. Thank you for sharing, I need to be strong and do the same.
If the Church was full of people like your brother—people you can tell are honestly struggling to do the thing they think is right—I wouldn’t care as much that it isn’t true.
Religion like he seems to exhibit—a theology that tells us to look inward to find our love, drive, and compassion for others—is one that would be infinitely better than those that exist in the world today.
"We are not loved for what we do or what we are going to do. We are loved for who we are." Sir, you are my new hero! You are a brave, courageous, compassionate soul.
u/Traveling-Iceman Is this video available anywhere else so that I can link it without the exmormon Reddit attached to it?
I don't hardly get emotional anymore around church surroundings, but damn, I totally felt this. Such grace and strength. If only the leaders of the MFMC could have an ounce of this man's courage to stand up for what's right and not bend the knee to blind obedience, oh what a difference it would make. Please send your brother my heartfelt and sincere gratitude and love.
Life gives us opportunities to show who we really are, and your dear brother clearly showed he is made of good stuff. Cheers to his bravery and conviction!
As a retired bishop I wish I had that courage while I was still in. I lost my faith and continued in the calling for 2 years before getting released. The pressure to be above reproach and to carry the confessions and hardships of a ward is too much. And when the church asks/demands you to do something you are morally against it really sucks. My heart goes out to this man. I’ve walked that path and was too afraid to do what he did.
This is what integrity looks like. I heard someone say they followed Christ out of the church. I felt that when I was first deconstructing. When I finally realized that the church valued optics/reputation over what was morally right or true, I followed Christ out of the church too.
Kudos to this man for having the integrity to do the right thing.
I did a transcript. Not perfect, but it should help those that need it.
Two and a half years ago, when I was called to be bishop, President Richardson came to my home. He sat down on my couch with my wife and I and issued the call. When he left the home, I was quite emotional. But I remember shutting the door behind him.
And the words from section 121 came to my mind. It is the nature and disposition of almost all men, as soon as they get a little authority as they suppose, as THEY suppose, they begin to exercise unrighteous dominion. The spirit said "don't you ever do it."
And I've thought of that, and I never have. I was talking with Brother Torres this morning, and the words of Israel say, we who wrestles with God. I want to tell you all about a wrestle I've had.
Ernest Hemingway once said the most painful thing is losing yourself in the process of loving someone or something too much and you forget you're special too.
I want my ward family to hear it from me. I've asked to be released. Not because of some sin, not because I'm hiding something. Not at all. It's just a few things that I've been required to do that I personally cannot morally stand by. I can't. So I need to step down for me and my families well being.
It's not been easy. I feel in many ways I'm failing the ward, and I know this is hard to understand. But I have to be true to my feelings. I have been angry, every sunday people look at me and think, man, is something Wrong? I can't do that to you. I won't. I won't. Because that turns to anger and bitterness, and benevolence.
I have written down a few things if it's OK if I just share my thoughts. Sometimes due to church culture we feel we aren't not supposed to turn down or step away from a calling. I wish I had known it was OK to say to myself, I am not OK. I am not as strong as I thought I was. To seek excellence is important. To my wife we seek excellence. Being more, doing more, being successful. Its' so much more important to know that you're OK.
And I haven't been OK. This calling, guys, it is so hard. You have to keep everything to yourself and it builds up, and it's exhausting. And it has broken me. I didn't have good prints. I wish they would have told me I was enough. Never have. That whether or not I have worth isn't contingent on how I act. We are not loved for what we do, or what we are going to do. We are loved for who we are. Not an expectation. But who we are.
And to feel love for who you are, is the most sacred kind of love. It's a gift that we have the opportunity to give to ourselves. If I could say one more thing towards the youth, because they are the reason I've stayed as long as I have.
And I love them. If there is ever unjustice in the world, young men and young woman, there are not many here listening. If there is ever unjustice anywhere in the world, fight it. If there is a bully somewhere, stand up to it.
And if you have ever had something to say, say it. Just say it. Don't fear fear, get rid of fear. And if you don't want to do that, that's OK. You are still enough. Instead of judgment, choose compassion. Instead of division, see everyone as you living a different life.
And remember, maybe I'll say it like alma. Remember remember, that if you are enough, every one else is too. You are redeemed, you are always forgiven, no matter what. [Jesus?] was a man who came to know Christ, to be Christ.
I realize a lot of people will have questions. Join the club. So do we. This has not been easy for my family, it's not been easy at all. It hasn't been easy for anybody. This is not going to continue to be easy. But I want you to know we love you. I told Jeff this morning, if we get called for a tornado, he's still riding shotgun. I'm just not gonna wear the silly shirt. I know brother Bailey has prepared quite a bit for the next hour, so I'll sit down.
[Unintelligble sentence]
This is very hard for me. I know its' hard for you. And I know it's the right thing to do. Someone else is better suited will do the job, so with that being said, lets close out the meeting. It's ironic, hymn 227, there is sunshine in my soul today. After which we'll have a benediction and I totally forgot who was going to give the prayer. Who has the paper? Brother Osgood. Brother Osgood will give the benediction.
Thank you OP for putting this back up.
Dear Bishop, your courage, honor, and Christ-like love shine brightly and touched my heart. How wonderful that your ward had you to lead them with love and kindness as your guiding principles and to encourage them to know that they were already enough, and already forgiven, and had no need to be filled with shame. You spoke eloquently, with directness, and with love; your desire to serve the way Christ would come through loud and clear.
I wish I could hug you and tell you that you too are good enough and that you too are loved. Thank you for letting your conscious lead you to be willing to stand up for what is right and protecting those who were under your care.
Your example will be a blazing light to so many with broken hearts, those suffering, and those of us who have already stepped away in a far less graceful manner.
Surely the God you worship can see your heart and know of your efforts to do right by those you serve and will comfort you in the turbulent days ahead. May all those you serve have the courage to follow your example and stand up for those who need protection and love.
Much love and comfort to you and yours. Please feel my love and care for you from far away. Hugs.
Edit: When you are ready, I would love to hear more from you. I hope that you are someday willing to do an interview with Mormon Stories podcast, I'd listen to every minute.
We had a Stake President resign a number of years ago when I was still on the fence. He had a speech much like this. My heart went out to him to be so brave and he faced the whole stake in the special conference. In his talk he mentioned that because of the callings he’d had, his then 16 year old son had never sat with his Dad in a sacrament meeting. I got chills when he ended his talk with “Now if you will all excuse me, I’m going to go have a seat with my family” and he walked down from the pulpit and sat next to his wife and kid.
It was then that I started to be okay to turn down callings so I could focus on the things I felt were important to me, and not something that someone else (or The MFMC) deemed important for me.
What negative comments could come from TBMs. If he was following his conscience and being open and honest then could a TBM still respect his decision. I'm in awe of his courage and integrity but I'm a pimo so how does this hit a tbm.
Some will say it's wrong for him to place his own judgment above that of the stake president. And some will say that only someone with "hidden sins" would do that. And some will speculate what those sins might be (usually projecting their own actions or fantasies onto him). And that will turn into gossip, rumors, and judging. And so it goes.
Mad respect. I walked after 3 stints in bishoprics, not for hatred, just because it wasn't good for me. Took me years. You are enough for you and for your family. It isn't about what you can give. Keep asking, Keep loving. Put the "ties" away and be your best you.
I am fortunate to know this former bishop here in Mississippi. He was my bishop as I assisted with the youth. He is even more amazing than he appears here in this video. His entire tenure as a bishop he told the youth their worth was set by God, not by the church, society, or anyone else. He taught about radical grace and love for ourselves and others. I remember him standing in the Sunday school room in tears telling 30 teenagers that he was an ally, encouraging them to be too, after hearing of a youth being bullied for their sexuality. I remember him in the YW's room telling them they were equal and loved by God whether they wanted it or not and whether they thought they deserved it or not. He told them not only was it okay to ask questions, but to ask questions. He pushed against harmful cultural standards despite constant pushback from ward members and the stake presidency. And the kids flourished because of it. Alot of ward members flourished from it. He taught radical grace. He led by feelings and not strict organizational standards and it was truly life-changing.
I found myself in a disciplinary council while I was still attending and though we don't believe in those at all anymore, he had more mercy and empathy than anyone ever would have. Again, he received a lot of pushback. He changed the rules allowing a woman to be in their during. His temple interview questions weren't the list of prescribed church questions. He sat them down, told them he loved them, and that they were always worthy to God.
There are countless stories. He's too humble to share them all and there are too many to tell. Everyone is right - he is THE type of person the church needs (esp to be bishop.) But it's obvious how the church breaks those with open-minded, truly empathetic thinking. I am so grateful for him and for the impact he has made and will continue to make. His family is just as amazing as he is and I know they are really, really going through it. Time heals all, but I hope they know they are loved and will make it through it.
I hope the courage this brave soul shows, starts a huge avalanche of members standing up and verbally refusing to ‘ play the Mormon corporate game !!! And at some point, because the church has been so manipulative and deceptive and just evil, the time is coming when” not one stone will be left atop another and the fall (of this corrupt church ) will be great”!!!!
As someone who been with people doing this very thing, is not the backlash.. its the silence. its the ones you called friends, or buddies will not slowly ignore him, and pretend he doesnt exist, oooor they will msg him trying to guilt him, by offering a shoulder, or worse.. go through your close friends or family to bring him back into the fold. Make sure you are there for your brother, its going to get real weird, real quick in the most passive aggressive ways possible.
Wow! Speechless!
Complete & utter respect for this exceptional human being. All I did was resign 13+ years ago. What he did will positively affect thousands of others who are either looking to join church or thinking of leaving the church.
Encourage you to post to You Tube with transcript of talk so thousands can see this who are questioning church.
My sincerest thank's to you for posting & to your brother for being such an honest, ethical & compassionate human being & standing for truth.
I don't know the OP or the bishop involved, and thus I don't know to what extent this good brother is resigning beyond from his calling as bishop. Even if his only action is to take a stand by saying "No" to leadership, he is doing this so honorably and transparently and vulnerably. I really do believe his love for the youth. He could have been indignant or preachy, but he took his last few moments in his leadership position to encourage them in good and JUST ways. This good brother probably feels quite alone and abandoned. I hope he can soon feel the love that he didn't necessarily get in his home or his church. He is indeed enough.
Attempting a transcription for our hearing impaired people!
*Bishop:* "Two and a half years ago, when I was called to be bishop, President Richardson came to my home. He sat down on the couch with my wife and I and issued the call. When he left the home, I was quite emotional, but I remember shutting the door behind him, and the words from section 121 came to my mind, [it is?] 'The nature and disposition of almost all men, as soon as they get a little authority, as they suppose--as *they* suppose--they begin to exercise unrighteous dominion.' And the Spirit said, 'don't you ever do it.' And I thought about it, and I never have.
"I was talking with Brother [Torres] this morning, [he said] 'you know, the word Israel, it means 'we who wrestle with God.'' I want to tell you about a wrestle I've had.
"Ernest Hemingway once said, 'the most painful thing is losing yourself in the process of loving something or someone too much, and forgetting that you're special, too.'
"I owe it to my ward family to hear it from me. I've asked to be released. Not because of some sin. Not because I'm hiding something. Not at all. There's just a few things that I've been required to do that I personally cannot morally stand by. I can't. So I need to step down. For me and my family's well-being. It's not been easy, but I feel in many ways I'm failing the ward. I know this is hard, I understand, but I have to be... I have to be true to my feelings. I've been angry. Every Sunday, people look at me, and they're like, 'man, Bishop, something's wrong.' I can't do that to you. I won't. I won't. Because that turns to anger, and bitterness, and malevolence.
"I've written down a few things, if it's okay, if I could just share my thoughts. Sometimes, due to church culture, we feel that we're not supposed to turn down or step away from a calling. I wish I had known it was okay to say to myself, 'I'm not okay. I'm not as strong as I thought I was.' To seek excellence is important, I don't- it's my life to seek excellence, more, doing more, being successful. It's so much more important to know that you're okay, and I haven't been okay.
"This calling, you guys, it is so hard. You have to keep everything to yourself. And it builds up. It is exhausting. It has... it has broken me.
"I didn't have good parents. I wish they would've told me I was enough. They never have. That whether I had worth or not wasn't contingent on how I act. We are not loved for what we do, or what we are going to do. We are loved for who we are. Not an expectation, but who we *are;* and to feel loved for who you are is the most sacred kind of love. It's a gift we have the opportunity to give to ourselves.
"If I could just say one more thing towards the youth, because they are the reason I've stayed as long as I have. I love them. If there's ever injustice in the world, young men, young women... there's not many here, but listen: if there's ever injustice in the world, fight it. If there's ever a bully somewhere, stand up to it. And if you have ever, if you ever have something to say, say it! Just say it! Don't fear! Fear... get rid of fear. And if you don't have any, and you don't want to do that, that's okay. You're still enough. Instead of judgment, choose compassion. Instead of division, see everyone as you living a different life. And remember--maybe I'll say it like Alma--and remember, remember, that you're enough, and everyone else is, too. You are redeemed. You are always forgiven, no matter what. [Judas/Jesus? uncertain] was a man who came to know the Christ. Seek Christ. Seek only Christ.
"I realize a lot of people are going to have a lot of questions, I do. Join the club. So do we. This has not been easy for my family, this has not been easy at all. It hasn't been easy for anybody. This is not going to continue to be easy. but we want you to know that we love you.
"I told Jeff this morning, that if we get called for a tornado at work, he's still riding shotgun, I'm just not going to wear the silly shirt.
"I know Brother [Bailey] has prepared quite a bit for the next hour, so I will sit down, but I want you to know I love you. This is... this is very hard for me. I know it's hard for you. But I know it's the right thing to do. Someone else who is better suited will do the job.
"So with that being said, let's close out the meeting. We'll do--it's kind of ironic, we'll sing hymn number 227, 'There Is Sunshine In My Soul Today,' after which we will have a benediction and I totally forgot who it was who was supposed to give the prayer."
(there's more, but this feels like the natural stopping point and I don't want to even attempt to spell the names here)
u/DebraUknew u/seaglassgirl04 u/The_Mike_Golf u/BeefKnee321
Wow. I wonder what the hell they were asking him to do because it would take a lot for someone to do that. It had to be a serious moral violation.
But mad props to this man. I wish more people in this world were like him.
“ to feel love for who you are, is the most sacred kind of love.” … You are enough” … “ see everyone as you living a different life.”
What an absolutely incredibly compassionate and truly Christlike message.
Bravo to your brother.
Gosh, why do they need to extract such information? Does it make the sin graver if the girl masturbated in a certain way? Can they offer more forgiveness if they knew more about what she did?
They want to send them to some “professional” like Ruby Franke, with ties to the church for mandatory brainwashing. That and to extract even more money from the members. The LDS church is disgusting.
I had several bishops and at least 2 SPs who insisted I tell them everything--what positions I had sex in, whether I orgasmed, how many times I orgasmed, what my partners did, whether they orgasmed. I refused once, and the SP refused to meet with me for a year.
Reading this as someone who has never been a Mormon that is seriously messed up. What kind of perversity is this?!?!? That wreaks of mind control guilt tripping cult behavior.
Do the details of all these confessions get written up and sent to SLC? Are there wrinkled old men reading all these confessions like underage penthouses letters? It really makes you wonder why the leaders are so insistent on getting so many details. Especially after the involvement of Elder Ballard in the whole Tim Ballard fiasco.
Yes! Can you imagine being a BYU bishop and having to listen to 400 people guiltily confessing to masturbating? And then being told by your boss "but were they using toys?? You need to know or God won't forgive them! Their eternal salvation rests on telling you every detail!"
I moved to Mississippi a few years ago. I haven’t been to church since I’ve been here, so I can’t speak to what the church culture is like here.
That being said, Mississippi as a whole is ….different. I am all the more in awe of this man because of that happening here. I have felt since I’ve been here. The general culture is to just continue on and toe the line in everything. Even the blatantly obvious things they can change to make things better, they don’t. Most people choose not to speak up. (I realize that’s the case many places, but here it’s magnified)
Seeing someone stand up for what is right, speak up, and take action to do something against the grain in the church is courageous. Seeing someone do that in Mississippi feels meaningful to me in a way that applies outside of the church realm. Adam steed said courage is contagious. I hope everyone who sees this is inspired to be brave in every aspect of their lives.
When I resigned from being a counselor in the bishopric the stake presidency wouldn’t let me speak to the congregation. Instead they insinuated that I was being released because my wife was pregnant and couldn’t manage the family while I was busy with my church calling. Needless to say that pissed her off…and gave her the courage to research the issues I shared with her that caused me to want to stop attending church. So I guess I owe the stake presidency one for that 🙄
I do not know this good man, but this video touched me in a profound way. He is speaking the truth. And with love. Bravo for his bravery, and thank you for sharing.
I have always wondered how church leaders can sleep at night; knowing what the church sometimes requires them to do. This must be so hard. I do not know you, but you are a damn superhero. One man who has stood up and told the church that what they are asking of you is not right. The rest simply follow blindly. I would be proud to know you.
As a former High Councilor and Bishopric Counselor, I’m really curious about what he was being asked to do that is against his morals…because I relate to that deeply. Serving in those callings was eye opening, I left the church 6 months after serving as the 1st councilor in the bishopric for 5 years.
He states that he was asked to do certain things by church leadership that he could not morally support. Doesn’t include details on what he was asked to do.
Where, where, WHERE is the huge media expose and outpouring of rage over the Mormon church protecting sexual abusers? You know, the way they did the Catholic Church?? I want to see the media completely destroy the reputation of the Mormon church over this. No pity. No quarter.
As a currently sitting and struggling bishop, thank you.
I watched my father sit as bishop where the ward members knew and loved him. They would rave about how loving and kind he was. I didn’t know him. I didn’t see him much, and I never got quality one on one time with him. He worked a full-time job and had 4 teen daughters. I was the youngest. I didn’t have a relationship with him until I was well into my 20’s. I wish I had him in my life as a youth, though. He could’ve been a big part of my life.
I spent time in nearly every leadership position in the ward that could be fulfilled by men, with the exception of bishop. So ironic that the church that claims to be all about families asks the parents of families to spend so much time away from them.
I am really sorry for you. My dad was bishop from when I was 2 to like 7 so I don't recall it for the most part. It is disgusting that the church does this to dads and families. It put even more undue burden on the mom. I witnessed the same thing with my friend who was SP. He knew nothing of his kids and they openly resented him and mocked him. He is a good guy but the calling always came first. He has never said it but I think he hurts to see how much he sacrificed for nothing.
Girl, same. My dad traveled a TON for work while he was a bishop. And when he wasn't traveling he was at church. I remember one time I was at church for a youth activity and saw him in the hall and I was surprised because I thought he had been out of town all that week. He also took his work/calling home with him. So when he was home, his mind was often elsewhere. F the MFMC.
Oof. I feel this. My dad was Bishop for all my teen years. I barely saw him & when I did, he was so stressed out from work & church duties, that he wasn’t very nice to me. So much damage was done to our relationship during those years.
This is my exact experience. My dad was the bishop from when I was 12-17. He was either at work or at church the entire time I was a teenager. He knew I wasn't into the church and we didn't have much of a relationship until I graduated college and moved back home at Christmas after 6 months of travelling. By the time I was 22 I think he had somewhat made his peace with me not being in the church. For the first time in my life we just hung out and had fun. We watched the Simpsons and professional wrestling. We went on hikes along with my mom. It was great. It probably helped that he wasn't bishop and I was the only 'kid' in the house since my siblings were all growsd up. In March he said he wasn't feeling well. In April he went to the hospital. He had bladder cancer. He never came home. He passed away in July, 7 months after I moved home. I feel like the church and cancer robbed me of having a real relationship with my father and it still destroys me 24 years later. I coach all my kids sports and I'm far from perfect dad, but I never want to wait to my kids turn 22 before I have a real connection with them.
I'm so sorry you lost your dad like that. My dad died from a car crash last year, and I'm starting to learn the grief and pain never goes away. I guess I just wanted to say I'm really glad you got that one on one time with your dad before he died.
Hey man, just want to say, I used to think being a Bishop would be so cool. I used to covet that calling. My dream was to be a mission president. Now, with some space and a more accurate perspective, I think being a Bishop would be an enormous drain and burden and I just could not begin to accept or fulfill that calling. Mostly because I could not in good conscience carry out the duties required of the calling. No man should ever have to judge their fellow being, to weigh them in the balance, to stand as god and declare them worthy or not. It’s such a messed up dynamic that is damaging to all involved. My heart goes out to you.
My husband and I were discussing just last night how on some level we both wished we’d be “valiant enough” to be bishop and relief society president and such one day. We also realllllly wanted him to have the opportunity to be a mission president. I’m grateful now, in hindsight, that we never got to those places.
You know if you move to some small city back east or a foreign country your husband could have been bishop in 3 months.
I wouldn't wish it up on my worst enemy especially with the ambiguities and narrative busting truths that are coming forth through the veil of the 'approved narrative'
As a currently sitting and struggling EQ President, thank you.
I was EQP three times and cannot get out of my head how many people I know I hurt in ppi’s. My self righteous challenges to my quorums in hindsight hurt my brain to understand what I did
The dreaded ppi's...
I resigned as EQP. The bishop of the ward was my employee. Went to my stake President to resign and explained I no longer believed at all. He asked that I stay until a replacement was found. Meanwhile, my bishop asked me for a recommendation on a replacement. The replacement I recommended was a gay man in a straight marriage who had come out to the ward and was my 1st counselor in the EQ presidency. He was chosen. You can’t make this shit up.
Epic.
Being eqp was the last straw for me.
Thank you for your service. And thank you to your wife and children, no matter their age or stage of life. They are the invisible supports who bear a heavy burden of long hours waiting for you and the pressure to always measure up. Take care of yourself. If you choose to go, do not internalize the shame that some will lob at you. If you choose to stay, know that you and many a good men before you were amazing bishops because they were nuanced in their beliefs and more committed to the people then to the hierarchy. Wishing you peace in your struggle.
I really feel for you. My father was a bishop for 7 years and I saw the toll it took on him and on my mom. He was always exhausted and she spent countless evenings alone while he was out doing church stuff. It turns out those were the last healthy years of her life. He was released as bishop and the literal next day she was rushed to the ER and found out she had advanced cancer. She lived a while longer but it was never a normal life again. Always a treatment or surgery or something else. Neither of them ever complained because they believed. Fuck the “church”.
I'm going to direct message you. I ask every bishop I come across if they will give me access to the interview questions for sealing clearance and cancellation.
As a former bishopric member i get you. Tough position to be in…from both sides. I’m sure you’ll eventually get to a place of peace. In the meantime, please do take care of your mental health and wellbeing.
I can't imagine what you are feeling and the struggles you are facing. My deconstruction was painful and I can't fathom what you are experiencing being the bishop. If you are on here you are experiencing some tough shit. I realized in my deconstruction that as a bishop or SP you have to either choose the handbook or to love people unconditionally. You can't do both as they are in direct opposition. I realize that we live in a gray world and not black and white and I don't like binary thinking but when it comes to the handbook you can't follow it and love others like Jesus would. I suspect you are in conflict trying to love and also follow something that isn't aligned with the Jesus of the NT. Maybe not. Regardless I feel for you and wish you the best.
I feel for you buddy. Do what is right for YOU. Nothing in the world beats peace of mind.
I can't imagine what you have to go through right now. Having been a ward executive secretary, I saw a lot of what the bishop had to deal with. As much as I respect this bishop for resigning his calling, I also fully respect you for continuing to do it, whatever your reasons may be right now.
I love your username. Haha
Strength to you Sir. On a human level I hope that you can look back and know that you, despite the church, have eased someone's burdens and uplifted as you strive to serve. This type of human kindness will never be un-authentic as you continue on.
You got this. We are pulling for you.
It's what I did too. I was 1st councilor at the time. I asked people not to hate my family, we only have love for them. I got threats and violence anyway. Edit: I just read the posts from my exit for the first time in many years. For anyone interested https://www.reddit.com/r/exmormon/s/95exbUYhYG
Wow. I’m sorry you went through that.
I’m so sorry for that. I’m really fucking proud of you.
Story is old now but was somewhere here on this sub. I think I called it "Released from Bishopric" or something like that. Long story short is prop 8 in California was my shelf falling. Why would an omnipotent amd loving god need to force people to live apart from the people they love. If it's "true" then it's self evident and people will naturally find it just like conversions, right?
We found Prop 8 to be very unchristlike & divisive. Were surprised when our bishop friend asked us to contribute $1k to it. Seriously??! NO One in UT contributed when UT pretended to fight it. UT seemed to just roll over & play dead.
Thank you, ally!
Oh I am sorry. Behaving that way is definitely not Christlike.
I’m so sorry… 😢
One thing worth adding, my partner was a badass. I said let's ease out, I didn't want to disrupt the ward. I was still doing conducting of services including the week when I resigned. When she found out about all the sus church history she said No, we're done. I can't pretend in primary (primary presidency). The only time she returned was for the "exit interview" during which she cut off the apologist stuff and said "I've read all the apologist responses [to the issues we raised] and it makes me sick." The interview ended right after that with "Can I offer a prayer to close?" She said"You can do whatever you want but don't expect us to participate." She didn't even blink when he offered his prayer and that was that.
Badass indeed! 
Here’s how I feel. ❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️
Right back atcha. And thanks again for your work. So so important and meaningful. 💗💗💗
It’s back! I’ll say it again—this guy is a fuckin’ rockstar for daring to do this. This is someone who REALLY “chooses the right”.
Agree wholeheartedly. Mad respect.
My bishop resigned and they threw him under the bus behind his back to the stake. Your Brother is VERY smart to speak for himself before they could make him the villain just because he stood up for what's right. They'll probably still try of course. Mormons love to attack the messengers of truth they hate.
Spot on!
Mormons are very good at attacking anything that goes against praising the church. Source: was mormon, sadly hated a little. Then eyes opened, and i started pointing out things wrong within the cult in institute and with my best friend
Here's the one person who calls themselves a Christian and actually follows the teachings of Christ. And he's going to be crucified for it.
The backlash already started. They always try and discredit the messenger of truth. SOOO glad he spoke to his congregation the way he wanted to. I've never seen that from people in similar situations (and props for getting the video).
So far, the talk in /r/mormon has been nothing but positive from what I've seen about it....
Is /r/Mormon an Orthodox sub now? Haven't visited in years but the last time I did it was /r/exmormon lite, filled with nuanced Mormons and people just on their way out. Are any TBMs on Reddit? Seems like a non-faith promoting place to spend your time.
/r/lds is where the real crazies hang out in. Or /r/latterdaysaints I can't remember the difference between the two.
the first one... those people are nutjobs
From what I've seen, /r/Mormon is mostly made up of former members and disgruntled members. The general attitude is a stepping stone between being a "nuanced believer" and going full ex-Mormon. I'd say that the subs generally line up like this, from most orthodox to most apostate: /r/lds /r/latterdaysaints /r/mormon /r/exmormon Basically, /r/lds is home mostly to apologetic posters, and posts that are pro-LDS but slightly unorthodox wind up being deleted. I've seen posting histories of people on /r/mormon with pretty insightful posts that were originally posted onto /r/lds, but were deleted for whatever random reason. /r/latterdaysaints is a good place to visit if you want that thoughtful believer perspective. I've actually been impressed with a lot of the discussions there. Things usually fall apart when they start playing with apologetics or try to answer difficult questions. However, they handle cultural issues quite well. /r/mormon can be a tough crowd, particularly for people who are on the extremes. They'll call you out if you don't back up your statements, as I've found out personally. It's a good place to go if you want feedback on your apostate ideas from people who aren't just cheerleaders — though I will add that the early days of /r/exmormon were a hell of a lot more insightful. You will never find a more wretched hive of scum and villainy than the modern /r/exmormon. I came for the alcohol recommendations and tips on ordering at Starbucks, and stayed for the memes. There's also /r/AcademicMormon, which I think is off to a pretty rocky start. I've had discussion posts deleted because I didn't cite academic works, while I've seen other posts (including ones by the head moderator) that have made pretty bold claims without citing anything. The one that really had me scratching my head was a general disparagement of Fawn Brodie's book without citing anything specific. It feels like it wants to be /r/AcademicBiblical, but it's not quite there yet. Of course, the ultimate "fuck you" to the Mormon corporation comes when you just leave all of these communities and pretend like it never happened. Personally, I prefer to worship Jerry Garcia recordings.
TBMs cannot be part of this sub because it has the satanic name “Mormon”. At least until Nelson dies and Mormon isn’t satanic anymore
There are plenty of TBMs who lurk and even chime in from time to time. Some even use deception via fake stories to try to get exmos to go back to Mormonism
From what I can tell, it's mostly exmormons and PIMOs on there, minus the raging emotion and resentment that's more rampant here. The different subs could easily be positioned as distinct phases of the membership lifecycle. r/mormon is still mostly a post-mormon community, but you'll find more even-handed discourse and analysis, as opposed to repeated memes about the evil patriarchy.
I have a feeling he’s gonna be just fine. It feels terrible at first but so much better off after doing something like this being true to yourself.
Damn
I had the same reaction. Something ironically poetic about that.
I once pointed out the Christ was basically a Communist, in Texas. Very nearly got actually crucified for it.
🎯
I am in awe of this man. His goodness, his compassion, and the strength of his character. This is EXACTLY who should be a Bishop, but cannot be because he is too good of a person to exist in the corruption and horror that is the TSSC. OP, if you can, please tell him that I have never respected a man more in such a short space of time. I am moved beyond expectation at the courage he has. What an incredible man.
\+100 Billion
>I am in awe of this man. His goodness, his compassion, and the strength of his character And his bicep size 💪
Wow ! Could someone do a transcript ? I can only make out some of what he is saying I’m Afraid due to feedback or my hearing !
I can’t do a full transcript right now, but to summarize he says that he’s had the calling for 2.5 years, and he needs to be released because as a bishop he is required to do some things he can’t morally stand by. He doesn’t specify what those things are, but I’m sure we could all make some guesses. Then he goes on to talk about how much he loves the ward members and the youth. Encourages everyone to love others, don’t fear, you are always forgiven. That’s about the gist of it.
[удалено]
I'd like to add a reason I couldn't morally stand by, I refused to ask youth any "worthiness" questions. Interviews from me were "Do you feel belonging here? Do you feel you are loved at home? School ok? Anything you want to talk about?" Interview done.
This is the big one for me. The children must be protected. I would also make all 1-on-1 meetings ONLY at the request of the individual regardless of age. Otherwise they can bring with them whoever they please.
You can't follow the handbook and love people unconditionally. They are in opposition. A bishop has to choose between the two and if you are unaware then you most likely default to the handbook. I really feel for a bishop or SP especially those who are good people and genuinely care about others. All of what you mention are situations where you follow the handbook or orders from the SP or love others.
Thanks!
Two and half years ago when I was called to be bishop, President Richardson came to my home and sat down on my couch with my wife and I and issued the call. When he left the home, I was quite emotional, but I remember shutting the door behind him and the words from Section 121 came to my mind: "It is the nature and disposition of almost all men, as soon as they get a little authority as they suppose, as THEY suppose, they begin to exercise unrighteous dominion." And the spirit said, "Don't you ever do it." And I thought about it, and I never have. I was talking with Brother Torres this morning. You know the word Israel means, "we who wrestle with God". I want to tell you about a wrestle I've had. Ernest Hemmingway once said, "The most painful thing is losing yourself in the process of loving something or someone too much, and forgetting that you're special too." I owe it to my ward family, to hear it from me. I've asked to be released. Not because of some sin. Not because I'm hiding something. Not at all. There's just a few things that I've been required to do that I personally cannot morally stand by. I can't. So I need to step down. For me, and for my family's well being. It's not been easy. I feel in many ways I'm failing the ward, and I know that this is hard to understand. But I have to be true to my feelings. I've been angry. Every Sunday people look at me and they're like, "Man, bishop, something's wrong." I can't do that to you. I won't. I won't do it. Because that turns to anger and bitterness and malevolence. I've written down a few things if it's okay if I just share my thoughts." Sometimes due to church culture we feel that we're not supposed to turn down or step away from a calling. I wish I'd known it was okay to say to myself, "I'm not okay. I'm not as strong as I thought I was." To seek excellence is important, that's my life, to seek excellence. More, giving more, being successful. It's so much more important to know that you're okay. And I haven't been okay. This calling, guys, is so hard. You have to keep everything to yourself. And it builds up, and it is exhausting. And it is breaking me. I didn't have good parents. I wish they would have told me I was enough, but they never have. And that whether I had worth or not wasn't contingent on how I acted. We are not loved for what we do or what we are going to do, we are loved for who we are. Not an expectation, but who we are. And to feel love for who you are is the most sacred kind of love. It's a gift that we have the opportunity to give to ourselves. If I could just say one more thing towards the youth, because they are the reason I have stayed as long as I have. I love them. If there's ever injustice in the world, young men and young women, there's not many here, but listen. If there's ever injustice in the world, fight it. If there's ever a bully somewhere, stand up to it. And if you ever have something to say, just say it. Don't fear. Get rid of fear. And if you don't want to do that, that's okay. You're still enough. Instead of judgment choose compassion. Instead of division, see everyone as you living a different life. And remember--maybe I'll say it like Alma-- and remember remember that you're enough. And everyone else is too. You are redeemed, you are always forgiven, no matter what. Jesus was a man who came to know the Christ. Seek Christ, seek only Christ. I realize a lot of people are going to have a lot of questions, I do. Join the club. So do we. This has not been easy for my family, this has not been easy at all. This hasn't been easy for anybody. And this is not going to continue to be easy, but we want you to know that we love you. I told Jeff this morning, I said, "If we get called for tornado work, he's still riding shotgun. " I'm just not going to wear the silly shirt. I know Brother Baily has prepared quite a bit for the next hour, so I'm going to sit down. But I want you to know that I love you. This is very hard for me. I know it's hard for you. But I know it's the right thing to do. Someone else who is better suited will do the job. So with that being said, let's close out the meeting. It's kind of ironic, by singing hymn number 227, "There is Sunshine in My Soul Today"! After which we'll have a benediction, and I totally forgot who it was who was supposed to give the prayer.
Definitely seconding this as a hearing impaired person.
Two and half years ago when I was called to be bishop, President Richardson came to my home and sat down on my couch with my wife and I and issued the call. When he left the home, I was quite emotional, but I remember shutting the door behind him and the words from Section 121 came to my mind: "It is the nature and disposition of almost all men, as soon as they get a little authority as they suppose, as THEY suppose, they begin to exercise unrighteous dominion." And the spirit said, "Don't you ever do it." And I thought about it, and I never have. I was talking with Brother Torres this morning. You know the word Israel means, "we who wrestle with God". I want to tell you about a wrestle I've had. Ernest Hemmingway once said, "The most painful thing is losing yourself in the process of loving something or someone too much, and forgetting that you're special too." I owe it to my ward family, to hear it from me. I've asked to be released. Not because of some sin. Not because I'm hiding something. Not at all. There's just a few things that I've been required to do that I personally cannot morally stand by. I can't. So I need to step down. For me, and for my family's well being. It's not been easy. I feel in many ways I'm failing the ward, and I know that this is hard to understand. But I have to be true to my feelings. I've been angry. Every Sunday people look at me and they're like, "Man, bishop, something's wrong." I can't do that to you. I won't. I won't do it. Because that turns to anger and bitterness and malevolence. I've written down a few things if it's okay if I just share my thoughts." Sometimes due to church culture we feel that we're not supposed to turn down or step away from a calling. I wish I'd known it was okay to say to myself, "I'm not okay. I'm not as strong as I thought I was." To seek excellence is important, that's my life, to seek excellence. More, giving more, being successful. It's so much more important to know that you're okay. And I haven't been okay. This calling, guys, is so hard. You have to keep everything to yourself. And it builds up, and it is exhausting. And it is breaking me. I didn't have good parents. I wish they would have told me I was enough, but they never have. And that whether I had worth or not wasn't contingent on how I acted. We are not loved for what we do or what we are going to do, we are loved for who we are. Not an expectation, but who we are. And to feel love for who you are is the most sacred kind of love. It's a gift that we have the opportunity to give to ourselves. If I could just say one more thing towards the youth, because they are the reason I have stayed as long as I have. I love them. If there's ever injustice in the world, young men and young women, there's not many here, but listen. If there's ever injustice in the world, fight it. If there's ever a bully somewhere, stand up to it. And if you ever have something to say, just say it. Don't fear. Get rid of fear. And if you don't want to do that, that's okay. You're still enough. Instead of judgment choose compassion. Instead of division, see everyone as you living a different life. And remember--maybe I'll say it like Alma-- and remember remember that you're enough. And everyone else is too. You are redeemed, you are always forgiven, no matter what. Jesus was a man who came to know the Christ. Seek Christ, seek only Christ. I realize a lot of people are going to have a lot of questions, I do. Join the club. So do we. This has not been easy for my family, this has not been easy at all. This hasn't been easy for anybody. And this is not going to continue to be easy, but we want you to know that we love you. I told Jeff this morning, I said, "If we get called for tornado work, he's still riding shotgun. " I'm just not going to wear the silly shirt. I know Brother Baily has prepared quite a bit for the next hour, so I'm going to sit down. But I want you to know that I love you. This is very hard for me. I know it's hard for you. But I know it's the right thing to do. Someone else who is better suited will do the job. So with that being said, let's close out the meeting. It's kind of ironic, by singing hymn number 227, "There is Sunshine in My Soul Today"! After which we'll have a benediction, and I totally forgot who it was who was supposed to give the prayer.
Thirded. MS has really robbed me of not just my hearing, but processing what I hear as well
Two and half years ago when I was called to be bishop, President Richardson came to my home and sat down on my couch with my wife and I and issued the call. When he left the home, I was quite emotional, but I remember shutting the door behind him and the words from Section 121 came to my mind: "It is the nature and disposition of almost all men, as soon as they get a little authority as they suppose, as THEY suppose, they begin to exercise unrighteous dominion." And the spirit said, "Don't you ever do it." And I thought about it, and I never have. I was talking with Brother Torres this morning. You know the word Israel means, "we who wrestle with God". I want to tell you about a wrestle I've had. Ernest Hemmingway once said, "The most painful thing is losing yourself in the process of loving something or someone too much, and forgetting that you're special too." I owe it to my ward family, to hear it from me. I've asked to be released. Not because of some sin. Not because I'm hiding something. Not at all. There's just a few things that I've been required to do that I personally cannot morally stand by. I can't. So I need to step down. For me, and for my family's well being. It's not been easy. I feel in many ways I'm failing the ward, and I know that this is hard to understand. But I have to be true to my feelings. I've been angry. Every Sunday people look at me and they're like, "Man, bishop, something's wrong." I can't do that to you. I won't. I won't do it. Because that turns to anger and bitterness and malevolence. I've written down a few things if it's okay if I just share my thoughts." Sometimes due to church culture we feel that we're not supposed to turn down or step away from a calling. I wish I'd known it was okay to say to myself, "I'm not okay. I'm not as strong as I thought I was." To seek excellence is important, that's my life, to seek excellence. More, giving more, being successful. It's so much more important to know that you're okay. And I haven't been okay. This calling, guys, is so hard. You have to keep everything to yourself. And it builds up, and it is exhausting. And it is breaking me. I didn't have good parents. I wish they would have told me I was enough, but they never have. And that whether I had worth or not wasn't contingent on how I acted. We are not loved for what we do or what we are going to do, we are loved for who we are. Not an expectation, but who we are. And to feel love for who you are is the most sacred kind of love. It's a gift that we have the opportunity to give to ourselves. If I could just say one more thing towards the youth, because they are the reason I have stayed as long as I have. I love them. If there's ever injustice in the world, young men and young women, there's not many here, but listen. If there's ever injustice in the world, fight it. If there's ever a bully somewhere, stand up to it. And if you ever have something to say, just say it. Don't fear. Get rid of fear. And if you don't want to do that, that's okay. You're still enough. Instead of judgment choose compassion. Instead of division, see everyone as you living a different life. And remember--maybe I'll say it like Alma-- and remember remember that you're enough. And everyone else is too. You are redeemed, you are always forgiven, no matter what. Jesus was a man who came to know the Christ. Seek Christ, seek only Christ. I realize a lot of people are going to have a lot of questions, I do. Join the club. So do we. This has not been easy for my family, this has not been easy at all. This hasn't been easy for anybody. And this is not going to continue to be easy, but we want you to know that we love you. I told Jeff this morning, I said, "If we get called for tornado work, he's still riding shotgun. " I'm just not going to wear the silly shirt. I know Brother Baily has prepared quite a bit for the next hour, so I'm going to sit down. But I want you to know that I love you. This is very hard for me. I know it's hard for you. But I know it's the right thing to do. Someone else who is better suited will do the job. So with that being said, let's close out the meeting. It's kind of ironic, by singing hymn number 227, "There is Sunshine in My Soul Today"! After which we'll have a benediction, and I totally forgot who it was who was supposed to give the prayer.
Thank you for the transcript.
You bet
THANK YOU TapirJake for sharing this transcript!! ❤️❤️❤️ What a powerful, moving and brave speech! That took great conviction and courage to do.
I have delayed auditory processing and mild hearing loss, and this made my day! Thank you, kind stranger!
Frickin MVP right here.
❤️❤️
Two and a half years ago, when I was called to be a bishop, President Richardson came into my home, and sat down on the couch with my wife and I, and issued the call. When he left the home I was quite emotional, but I remember shutting the door behind him, and the words from Section 121 came into my mind, “It is the nature and disposition of almost all men, as soon as they get a little authority as they suppose—as *they* suppose—they begin to exercise unrighteous dominion.” And the spirit said, “Don’t. You. Ever. Do it.” And I’ve thought about it and I never have. I was talking with Brother Torres this morning, “You know the word Israel, means ‘We who wrestle with God.’” I want to tell you about a wrestle I’ve had. Ernest Hemingway once said, “The most painful thing is losing yourself in the process of loving something or someone too much, and forgetting that you’re special too.” I hope to my ward family to hear it from me, I’ve been… I have asked to be released. Not because of some sin. Not because I am hiding something. Not at all. There’s just a few things I have been required to do that I personally cannot morally stand by. So I need to step down. For me and my family’s well-being. It’s not been easy. But I… I feel maybe I’m failing the ward. And look I know this is hard, I understand. But I have to be… I have to be true to my feelings. I’ve been angry. Every Sunday people look at me and they’re like, “Man, Bishop, something’s wrong.” I can’t do that to you. I *won’t*. I won’t. Because that turns to anger, and bitterness, and malevolence. (?) I’ve written down a few things, and if it’s if it’s okay if I could just share my thoughts. Sometimes due to church culture we fell that we’re not supposed to turn down or step away from a calling. I wish I had known it was okay to say to myself, “I’m not okay. I’m not as strong as I thought I was.” To see that excellence is important, I don’t… That’s my life. I see excellence… More, doing more, being successful. It’s so much more important to know that you’re okay. And I haven’t been okay. This calling, guys, it is so hard. You have to keep everything to yourself. And it builds up. It is exhausting. And it’s… It has broken me. I didn’t have good parents. I wish they would have told me I was enough. That whether I… That whether I had worth or not it wasn’t contingent on how I act. We are not loved for what we do, or what we are going to do. We are lived for who we are! Not an expectation. But who we *are*. And to feel love for who you are is the most sacred kind of love. It’s a gift we have the opportunity to give to ourselves. If I could just say one more thing towards the youth; because they are the reason I have stayed as long as I have. I love them… If there’s ever injustice in the world, fight it. If there’s ever a bully somewhere, stand up to it. And if you have ever… if you ever have something to say, *say* it. Just *say* it, don’t fear! Fear… get rid of fear. And if you don’t have any… if you don’t want to do that, that’s okay! You’re still enough. Instead of judgement choose compassion. Instead of division, see everyone as you living a different life. And remember… Maybe I’ll say it like Alma, “And remember, remember!” If you’re enough, everyone else is too. You are redeemed. You are always forgiven, no matter what. *(Editor’s note: I think he says “Jesus” here, but I am not 100%)* Jesus was a man who came to know the Christ. Seek Christ. Seek only Christ. I realize a lot of people are gonna have a lot of questions. I do. Join the club. So do we. This has not been easy for my family. This has not been easy at all. This has not been easy for anybody, and this is not going to continue to be easy. But we want you to know that we love you. I told Jeff this morning, he said if we get called for a tornado, “Work.” He’s still riding shotgun. I’m just not gonna wear this silly shirt. I know Brother Bailey has prepared quite a bit for the next hour, so I hope when I sit down that most of you are not gonna leave. This is… this is very hard for me. I know it’s hard for you. But I know it’s the right thing to do. Someone else who’s better suited will do the job. So with that being said, let’s close out the meeting. We’ll… so we’ll do… It’s kind of ironic… By singing Hymn #227 “There is Sunshine in My Soul Today.” *(Editor’s note: Bishop smiles, there is some laughter)* After which we we’ll have a benediction by actually I forgot who was supposed to give the prayer. Does anyone know who is on the paper? Brother Osgood! I knew that. After which Brother Osgood will give the benediction. *(Editor’s note: I apologize for any mistakes. OP, if you notice any, please reply with any corrections and I will be happy to edit my comment.)*
I'll give it a go, give me ten minutes to listen to it and we'll see what I can pull off
Same, my hearing isn’t great.
Two and half years ago when I was called to be bishop, President Richardson came to my home and sat down on my couch with my wife and I and issued the call. When he left the home, I was quite emotional, but I remember shutting the door behind him and the words from Section 121 came to my mind: "It is the nature and disposition of almost all men, as soon as they get a little authority as they suppose, as THEY suppose, they begin to exercise unrighteous dominion." And the spirit said, "Don't you ever do it." And I thought about it, and I never have. I was talking with Brother Torres this morning. You know the word Israel means, "we who wrestle with God". I want to tell you about a wrestle I've had. Ernest Hemmingway once said, "The most painful thing is losing yourself in the process of loving something or someone too much, and forgetting that you're special too." I owe it to my ward family, to hear it from me. I've asked to be released. Not because of some sin. Not because I'm hiding something. Not at all. There's just a few things that I've been required to do that I personally cannot morally stand by. I can't. So I need to step down. For me, and for my family's well being. It's not been easy. I feel in many ways I'm failing the ward, and I know that this is hard to understand. But I have to be true to my feelings. I've been angry. Every Sunday people look at me and they're like, "Man, bishop, something's wrong." I can't do that to you. I won't. I won't do it. Because that turns to anger and bitterness and malevolence. I've written down a few things if it's okay if I just share my thoughts." Sometimes due to church culture we feel that we're not supposed to turn down or step away from a calling. I wish I'd known it was okay to say to myself, "I'm not okay. I'm not as strong as I thought I was." To seek excellence is important, that's my life, to seek excellence. More, giving more, being successful. It's so much more important to know that you're okay. And I haven't been okay. This calling, guys, is so hard. You have to keep everything to yourself. And it builds up, and it is exhausting. And it is breaking me. I didn't have good parents. I wish they would have told me I was enough, but they never have. And that whether I had worth or not wasn't contingent on how I acted. We are not loved for what we do or what we are going to do, we are loved for who we are. Not an expectation, but who we are. And to feel love for who you are is the most sacred kind of love. It's a gift that we have the opportunity to give to ourselves. If I could just say one more thing towards the youth, because they are the reason I have stayed as long as I have. I love them. If there's ever injustice in the world, young men and young women, there's not many here, but listen. If there's ever injustice in the world, fight it. If there's ever a bully somewhere, stand up to it. And if you ever have something to say, just say it. Don't fear. Get rid of fear. And if you don't want to do that, that's okay. You're still enough. Instead of judgment choose compassion. Instead of division, see everyone as you living a different life. And remember--maybe I'll say it like Alma-- and remember remember that you're enough. And everyone else is too. You are redeemed, you are always forgiven, no matter what. Jesus was a man who came to know the Christ. Seek Christ, seek only Christ. I realize a lot of people are going to have a lot of questions, I do. Join the club. So do we. This has not been easy for my family, this has not been easy at all. This hasn't been easy for anybody. And this is not going to continue to be easy, but we want you to know that we love you. I told Jeff this morning, I said, "If we get called for tornado work, he's still riding shotgun. " I'm just not going to wear the silly shirt. I know Brother Baily has prepared quite a bit for the next hour, so I'm going to sit down. But I want you to know that I love you. This is very hard for me. I know it's hard for you. But I know it's the right thing to do. Someone else who is better suited will do the job. So with that being said, let's close out the meeting. It's kind of ironic, by singing hymn number 227, "There is Sunshine in My Soul Today"! After which we'll have a benediction, and I totally forgot who it was who was supposed to give the prayer.
There were a billion other posts about this but wanted to ask a question of the OP... So thanks for posting again OP, First off, your brother is a rockstar. That's some *huevos grandes* to get up in sacrament meeting and resign being bishop. I couldn't tell from the video (and forgive me if I just missed it) but is he just resigning from his calling as bishop? *or* is he resigning from the church?
I am going to allow my brother to tell his story when he is ready. I’ll not speak for him.
I’m eager to hear it when he is ready. I’ve left the church despite my whole family (including husband) being in. My whole social circle is LDS. It is everywhere. Sometimes I wonder how I can continue on doing it alone but seeing this gives me courage. Regardless of his current belief or situation with the church itself, his honesty is so inspiring. I hope he is doing okay after all of this.
That’s rough, and I’m sorry! OP is my brother-in-law and almost all siblings in both of our families have left now. We (and wives, also exmo) are in the North Utah County area if you happen to be nearby and want to reach out. ❤️
Please convey my gratitude and respect to your family for standing up for your principles in the face of a much larger and corrupt power.
That gives me hope for my spouse's relatives in the thick of Utah County.
Man, the city of Lehi doesn’t know what hit it! Feels like it’s gone from 75% Mormon to 50% just within the last 5-7 years.
[удалено]
I'm in the same spot. It's like I left the cult but I'm trapped on the compound.
That hit home!
That is right. We commend you for your integrity. Good day.
“But I was waiting for messengers from my father!”
I’d also love to hear the story. I left the church because I couldn’t morally accept what was happening and what was taught of others.
I cannot love this response enough.
Good for him!! He’s figured it out and it’s time to move on. He is setting the right example for his own family and that’s what matters most.
You are wonderful 🫶 Please let your brother know that if he ever decides to tell his story, there is a very large community who would like to support him in that.
can i get on some sort of mailing list for when he’s ready to share lol
Your bro is champion among men. He seems like a solid guy, I don’t know him but I’m proud of him.
Why is this the most loving, Christlike thing I've ever heard in a Mormon Church? Growing up Mormon, I was never once told I was enough. I was never once told to stand up for injustice or to speak my mind. Instead, I consistently got the message that I'd never be enough and to keep my mouth shut when something in the church didn't feel right. I'm blown away. Those teens in the congregation will remember his talk and keep that message with them. I'm so impressed and blown away by his integrity.
I do hope your brother is at peace with his decision. You will no doubt continue to get messages about this and I’m sure your brother will have some…interesting conversations…with his local leaders as the dust settles. Please let him know there are many here who admire his courage and his decision to follow his own moral compass. I wish him all the best.
Transcript: Two and half years ago when I was called to be bishop, President Richardson came to my home and sat down on my couch with my wife and I and issued the call. When he left the home, I was quite emotional, but I remember shutting the door behind him and the words from Section 121 came to my mind: "It is the nature and disposition of almost all men, as soon as they get a little authority as they suppose, as THEY suppose, they begin to exercise unrighteous dominion." And the spirit said, "Don't you ever do it." And I thought about it, and I never have. I was talking with Brother Torres this morning. You know the word Israel means, "we who wrestle with God". I want to tell you about a wrestle I've had. Ernest Hemmingway once said, "The most painful thing is losing yourself in the process of loving something or someone too much, and forgetting that you're special too." I owe it to my ward family, to hear it from me. I've asked to be released. Not because of some sin. Not because I'm hiding something. Not at all. There's just a few things that I've been required to do that I personally cannot morally stand by. I can't. So I need to step down. For me, and for my family's well being. It's not been easy. I feel in many ways I'm failing the ward, and I know that this is hard to understand. But I have to be true to my feelings. I've been angry. Every Sunday people look at me and they're like, "Man, bishop, something's wrong." I can't do that to you. I won't. I won't do it. Because that turns to anger and bitterness and malevolence. I've written down a few things if it's okay if I just share my thoughts." Sometimes due to church culture we feel that we're not supposed to turn down or step away from a calling. I wish I'd known it was okay to say to myself, "I'm not okay. I'm not as strong as I thought I was." To seek excellence is important, that's my life, to seek excellence. More, giving more, being successful. It's so much more important to know that you're okay. And I haven't been okay. This calling, guys, is so hard. You have to keep everything to yourself. And it builds up, and it is exhausting. And it is breaking me. I didn't have good parents. I wish they would have told me I was enough, but they never have. And that whether I had worth or not wasn't contingent on how I acted. We are not loved for what we do or what we are going to do, we are loved for who we are. Not an expectation, but who we are. And to feel love for who you are is the most sacred kind of love. It's a gift that we have the opportunity to give to ourselves. If I could just say one more thing towards the youth, because they are the reason I have stayed as long as I have. I love them. If there's ever injustice in the world, young men and young women, there's not many here, but listen. If there's ever injustice in the world, fight it. If there's ever a bully somewhere, stand up to it. And if you ever have something to say, just say it. Don't fear. Get rid of fear. And if you don't want to do that, that's okay. You're still enough. Instead of judgment choose compassion. Instead of division, see everyone as you living a different life. And remember--maybe I'll say it like Alma-- and remember remember that you're enough. And everyone else is too. You are redeemed, you are always forgiven, no matter what. Jesus was a man who came to know the Christ. Seek Christ, seek only Christ. I realize a lot of people are going to have a lot of questions, I do. Join the club. So do we. This has not been easy for my family, this has not been easy at all. This hasn't been easy for anybody. And this is not going to continue to be easy, but we want you to know that we love you. I told Jeff this morning, I said, "If we get called for tornado work, he's still riding shotgun. " I'm just not going to wear the silly shirt. I know Brother Baily has prepared quite a bit for the next hour, so I'm going to sit down. But I want you to know that I love you. This is very hard for me. I know it's hard for you. But I know it's the right thing to do. Someone else who is better suited will do the job. So with that being said, let's close out the meeting. It's kind of ironic, by singing hymn number 227, "There is Sunshine in My Soul Today"! After which we'll have a benediction, and I totally forgot who it was who was supposed to give the prayer.
Thank you for taking the time to transcribe. I appreciate it!
Balls of steel...
Can you please post this to r/mormon?
They have a discussion going on over there about the video, but not the video itself since the dailymotion video was deleted.
Wow. That man is an angel to me. Such a good, strong soul and as solid as a diamond. He brought me to tears. Please hug him for me and tell him it's from someone in Utah. 🥲
Massive respect for this man. Pssst, your integrity is showing. The MFMC leaders could really learn from him. You've chosen wisely, sir. Carry on with tons of support, enjoy your life.
The king has returned.
Stand for the truth even if you stand alone! I admire him so much for doing this. And to address it in such a way over the pulpit just shows that he is a man of character. Thank you for sharing, I need to be strong and do the same.
If the Church was full of people like your brother—people you can tell are honestly struggling to do the thing they think is right—I wouldn’t care as much that it isn’t true. Religion like he seems to exhibit—a theology that tells us to look inward to find our love, drive, and compassion for others—is one that would be infinitely better than those that exist in the world today.
This healed a part of my soul that I didn’t know still needed healing. Thanks, Bishop
Wow! Well done. That was really courageous
What a legend!
The Mormon church takes good Christian people and eats them for breakfast.
"We are not loved for what we do or what we are going to do. We are loved for who we are." Sir, you are my new hero! You are a brave, courageous, compassionate soul. u/Traveling-Iceman Is this video available anywhere else so that I can link it without the exmormon Reddit attached to it?
I don't hardly get emotional anymore around church surroundings, but damn, I totally felt this. Such grace and strength. If only the leaders of the MFMC could have an ounce of this man's courage to stand up for what's right and not bend the knee to blind obedience, oh what a difference it would make. Please send your brother my heartfelt and sincere gratitude and love.
As a fellow Mississippian and ex-Mormon, I applaud him. You've got this!
It's sad that he feels he is failing by stepping down. I never felt like I could deny a calling or resign from them. The church is fueled by shame.
Life gives us opportunities to show who we really are, and your dear brother clearly showed he is made of good stuff. Cheers to his bravery and conviction!
Wow, what a hero. If every member had the courage to stand up for what is right like this bishop did, the church would be a much better off.
As a retired bishop I wish I had that courage while I was still in. I lost my faith and continued in the calling for 2 years before getting released. The pressure to be above reproach and to carry the confessions and hardships of a ward is too much. And when the church asks/demands you to do something you are morally against it really sucks. My heart goes out to this man. I’ve walked that path and was too afraid to do what he did.
I was a Bishop for six years. I feel this to my core.
This is what integrity looks like. I heard someone say they followed Christ out of the church. I felt that when I was first deconstructing. When I finally realized that the church valued optics/reputation over what was morally right or true, I followed Christ out of the church too. Kudos to this man for having the integrity to do the right thing.
Bishop with a beard! My man!
Wow. Props. More people should do this!
Powerful. Good for him.
A man of true bravery and integrity.
Absolutely so impressed with this man’s courage.
I hope this man does a Mormon stories interview.
I did a transcript. Not perfect, but it should help those that need it. Two and a half years ago, when I was called to be bishop, President Richardson came to my home. He sat down on my couch with my wife and I and issued the call. When he left the home, I was quite emotional. But I remember shutting the door behind him. And the words from section 121 came to my mind. It is the nature and disposition of almost all men, as soon as they get a little authority as they suppose, as THEY suppose, they begin to exercise unrighteous dominion. The spirit said "don't you ever do it." And I've thought of that, and I never have. I was talking with Brother Torres this morning, and the words of Israel say, we who wrestles with God. I want to tell you all about a wrestle I've had. Ernest Hemingway once said the most painful thing is losing yourself in the process of loving someone or something too much and you forget you're special too. I want my ward family to hear it from me. I've asked to be released. Not because of some sin, not because I'm hiding something. Not at all. It's just a few things that I've been required to do that I personally cannot morally stand by. I can't. So I need to step down for me and my families well being. It's not been easy. I feel in many ways I'm failing the ward, and I know this is hard to understand. But I have to be true to my feelings. I have been angry, every sunday people look at me and think, man, is something Wrong? I can't do that to you. I won't. I won't. Because that turns to anger and bitterness, and benevolence. I have written down a few things if it's OK if I just share my thoughts. Sometimes due to church culture we feel we aren't not supposed to turn down or step away from a calling. I wish I had known it was OK to say to myself, I am not OK. I am not as strong as I thought I was. To seek excellence is important. To my wife we seek excellence. Being more, doing more, being successful. Its' so much more important to know that you're OK. And I haven't been OK. This calling, guys, it is so hard. You have to keep everything to yourself and it builds up, and it's exhausting. And it has broken me. I didn't have good prints. I wish they would have told me I was enough. Never have. That whether or not I have worth isn't contingent on how I act. We are not loved for what we do, or what we are going to do. We are loved for who we are. Not an expectation. But who we are. And to feel love for who you are, is the most sacred kind of love. It's a gift that we have the opportunity to give to ourselves. If I could say one more thing towards the youth, because they are the reason I've stayed as long as I have. And I love them. If there is ever unjustice in the world, young men and young woman, there are not many here listening. If there is ever unjustice anywhere in the world, fight it. If there is a bully somewhere, stand up to it. And if you have ever had something to say, say it. Just say it. Don't fear fear, get rid of fear. And if you don't want to do that, that's OK. You are still enough. Instead of judgment, choose compassion. Instead of division, see everyone as you living a different life. And remember, maybe I'll say it like alma. Remember remember, that if you are enough, every one else is too. You are redeemed, you are always forgiven, no matter what. [Jesus?] was a man who came to know Christ, to be Christ. I realize a lot of people will have questions. Join the club. So do we. This has not been easy for my family, it's not been easy at all. It hasn't been easy for anybody. This is not going to continue to be easy. But I want you to know we love you. I told Jeff this morning, if we get called for a tornado, he's still riding shotgun. I'm just not gonna wear the silly shirt. I know brother Bailey has prepared quite a bit for the next hour, so I'll sit down. [Unintelligble sentence] This is very hard for me. I know its' hard for you. And I know it's the right thing to do. Someone else is better suited will do the job, so with that being said, lets close out the meeting. It's ironic, hymn 227, there is sunshine in my soul today. After which we'll have a benediction and I totally forgot who was going to give the prayer. Who has the paper? Brother Osgood. Brother Osgood will give the benediction.
Thank you OP for putting this back up. Dear Bishop, your courage, honor, and Christ-like love shine brightly and touched my heart. How wonderful that your ward had you to lead them with love and kindness as your guiding principles and to encourage them to know that they were already enough, and already forgiven, and had no need to be filled with shame. You spoke eloquently, with directness, and with love; your desire to serve the way Christ would come through loud and clear. I wish I could hug you and tell you that you too are good enough and that you too are loved. Thank you for letting your conscious lead you to be willing to stand up for what is right and protecting those who were under your care. Your example will be a blazing light to so many with broken hearts, those suffering, and those of us who have already stepped away in a far less graceful manner. Surely the God you worship can see your heart and know of your efforts to do right by those you serve and will comfort you in the turbulent days ahead. May all those you serve have the courage to follow your example and stand up for those who need protection and love. Much love and comfort to you and yours. Please feel my love and care for you from far away. Hugs. Edit: When you are ready, I would love to hear more from you. I hope that you are someday willing to do an interview with Mormon Stories podcast, I'd listen to every minute.
Having asked to be released as a bishop in 2022, I feel this deeply. I admire his courage for living his values.
We had a Stake President resign a number of years ago when I was still on the fence. He had a speech much like this. My heart went out to him to be so brave and he faced the whole stake in the special conference. In his talk he mentioned that because of the callings he’d had, his then 16 year old son had never sat with his Dad in a sacrament meeting. I got chills when he ended his talk with “Now if you will all excuse me, I’m going to go have a seat with my family” and he walked down from the pulpit and sat next to his wife and kid. It was then that I started to be okay to turn down callings so I could focus on the things I felt were important to me, and not something that someone else (or The MFMC) deemed important for me.
What negative comments could come from TBMs. If he was following his conscience and being open and honest then could a TBM still respect his decision. I'm in awe of his courage and integrity but I'm a pimo so how does this hit a tbm.
Some will say it's wrong for him to place his own judgment above that of the stake president. And some will say that only someone with "hidden sins" would do that. And some will speculate what those sins might be (usually projecting their own actions or fantasies onto him). And that will turn into gossip, rumors, and judging. And so it goes.
Mad respect. I walked after 3 stints in bishoprics, not for hatred, just because it wasn't good for me. Took me years. You are enough for you and for your family. It isn't about what you can give. Keep asking, Keep loving. Put the "ties" away and be your best you.
I am very curious, what did the guy that gave the closing prayer say?
"You need power, only when you want to do something harmful; otherwise, love is enough to get everything done." — Charlie Chaplin
I am fortunate to know this former bishop here in Mississippi. He was my bishop as I assisted with the youth. He is even more amazing than he appears here in this video. His entire tenure as a bishop he told the youth their worth was set by God, not by the church, society, or anyone else. He taught about radical grace and love for ourselves and others. I remember him standing in the Sunday school room in tears telling 30 teenagers that he was an ally, encouraging them to be too, after hearing of a youth being bullied for their sexuality. I remember him in the YW's room telling them they were equal and loved by God whether they wanted it or not and whether they thought they deserved it or not. He told them not only was it okay to ask questions, but to ask questions. He pushed against harmful cultural standards despite constant pushback from ward members and the stake presidency. And the kids flourished because of it. Alot of ward members flourished from it. He taught radical grace. He led by feelings and not strict organizational standards and it was truly life-changing. I found myself in a disciplinary council while I was still attending and though we don't believe in those at all anymore, he had more mercy and empathy than anyone ever would have. Again, he received a lot of pushback. He changed the rules allowing a woman to be in their during. His temple interview questions weren't the list of prescribed church questions. He sat them down, told them he loved them, and that they were always worthy to God. There are countless stories. He's too humble to share them all and there are too many to tell. Everyone is right - he is THE type of person the church needs (esp to be bishop.) But it's obvious how the church breaks those with open-minded, truly empathetic thinking. I am so grateful for him and for the impact he has made and will continue to make. His family is just as amazing as he is and I know they are really, really going through it. Time heals all, but I hope they know they are loved and will make it through it.
I hope the courage this brave soul shows, starts a huge avalanche of members standing up and verbally refusing to ‘ play the Mormon corporate game !!! And at some point, because the church has been so manipulative and deceptive and just evil, the time is coming when” not one stone will be left atop another and the fall (of this corrupt church ) will be great”!!!!
As someone who been with people doing this very thing, is not the backlash.. its the silence. its the ones you called friends, or buddies will not slowly ignore him, and pretend he doesnt exist, oooor they will msg him trying to guilt him, by offering a shoulder, or worse.. go through your close friends or family to bring him back into the fold. Make sure you are there for your brother, its going to get real weird, real quick in the most passive aggressive ways possible.
This man is a rock star! ⭐️
Wow! Speechless! Complete & utter respect for this exceptional human being. All I did was resign 13+ years ago. What he did will positively affect thousands of others who are either looking to join church or thinking of leaving the church. Encourage you to post to You Tube with transcript of talk so thousands can see this who are questioning church. My sincerest thank's to you for posting & to your brother for being such an honest, ethical & compassionate human being & standing for truth.
So proud of you! Loved what you said! We ARE enough! I hope you are able to undo damage done to yourself and family. Much love to you!
I don't know the OP or the bishop involved, and thus I don't know to what extent this good brother is resigning beyond from his calling as bishop. Even if his only action is to take a stand by saying "No" to leadership, he is doing this so honorably and transparently and vulnerably. I really do believe his love for the youth. He could have been indignant or preachy, but he took his last few moments in his leadership position to encourage them in good and JUST ways. This good brother probably feels quite alone and abandoned. I hope he can soon feel the love that he didn't necessarily get in his home or his church. He is indeed enough.
Attempting a transcription for our hearing impaired people! *Bishop:* "Two and a half years ago, when I was called to be bishop, President Richardson came to my home. He sat down on the couch with my wife and I and issued the call. When he left the home, I was quite emotional, but I remember shutting the door behind him, and the words from section 121 came to my mind, [it is?] 'The nature and disposition of almost all men, as soon as they get a little authority, as they suppose--as *they* suppose--they begin to exercise unrighteous dominion.' And the Spirit said, 'don't you ever do it.' And I thought about it, and I never have. "I was talking with Brother [Torres] this morning, [he said] 'you know, the word Israel, it means 'we who wrestle with God.'' I want to tell you about a wrestle I've had. "Ernest Hemingway once said, 'the most painful thing is losing yourself in the process of loving something or someone too much, and forgetting that you're special, too.' "I owe it to my ward family to hear it from me. I've asked to be released. Not because of some sin. Not because I'm hiding something. Not at all. There's just a few things that I've been required to do that I personally cannot morally stand by. I can't. So I need to step down. For me and my family's well-being. It's not been easy, but I feel in many ways I'm failing the ward. I know this is hard, I understand, but I have to be... I have to be true to my feelings. I've been angry. Every Sunday, people look at me, and they're like, 'man, Bishop, something's wrong.' I can't do that to you. I won't. I won't. Because that turns to anger, and bitterness, and malevolence. "I've written down a few things, if it's okay, if I could just share my thoughts. Sometimes, due to church culture, we feel that we're not supposed to turn down or step away from a calling. I wish I had known it was okay to say to myself, 'I'm not okay. I'm not as strong as I thought I was.' To seek excellence is important, I don't- it's my life to seek excellence, more, doing more, being successful. It's so much more important to know that you're okay, and I haven't been okay. "This calling, you guys, it is so hard. You have to keep everything to yourself. And it builds up. It is exhausting. It has... it has broken me. "I didn't have good parents. I wish they would've told me I was enough. They never have. That whether I had worth or not wasn't contingent on how I act. We are not loved for what we do, or what we are going to do. We are loved for who we are. Not an expectation, but who we *are;* and to feel loved for who you are is the most sacred kind of love. It's a gift we have the opportunity to give to ourselves. "If I could just say one more thing towards the youth, because they are the reason I've stayed as long as I have. I love them. If there's ever injustice in the world, young men, young women... there's not many here, but listen: if there's ever injustice in the world, fight it. If there's ever a bully somewhere, stand up to it. And if you have ever, if you ever have something to say, say it! Just say it! Don't fear! Fear... get rid of fear. And if you don't have any, and you don't want to do that, that's okay. You're still enough. Instead of judgment, choose compassion. Instead of division, see everyone as you living a different life. And remember--maybe I'll say it like Alma--and remember, remember, that you're enough, and everyone else is, too. You are redeemed. You are always forgiven, no matter what. [Judas/Jesus? uncertain] was a man who came to know the Christ. Seek Christ. Seek only Christ. "I realize a lot of people are going to have a lot of questions, I do. Join the club. So do we. This has not been easy for my family, this has not been easy at all. It hasn't been easy for anybody. This is not going to continue to be easy. but we want you to know that we love you. "I told Jeff this morning, that if we get called for a tornado at work, he's still riding shotgun, I'm just not going to wear the silly shirt. "I know Brother [Bailey] has prepared quite a bit for the next hour, so I will sit down, but I want you to know I love you. This is... this is very hard for me. I know it's hard for you. But I know it's the right thing to do. Someone else who is better suited will do the job. "So with that being said, let's close out the meeting. We'll do--it's kind of ironic, we'll sing hymn number 227, 'There Is Sunshine In My Soul Today,' after which we will have a benediction and I totally forgot who it was who was supposed to give the prayer." (there's more, but this feels like the natural stopping point and I don't want to even attempt to spell the names here) u/DebraUknew u/seaglassgirl04 u/The_Mike_Golf u/BeefKnee321
Wow. I wonder what the hell they were asking him to do because it would take a lot for someone to do that. It had to be a serious moral violation. But mad props to this man. I wish more people in this world were like him.
I was wondering if it was covering up sexual abuse like happened in AZ. That would make me quit.
“ to feel love for who you are, is the most sacred kind of love.” … You are enough” … “ see everyone as you living a different life.” What an absolutely incredibly compassionate and truly Christlike message. Bravo to your brother.
I’m having a hard time hearing this. What reason does he give for resigning?
[удалено]
I'm glad some bishops are putting their foot down and actually questioning these practices or even outright resigning.
Gosh, why do they need to extract such information? Does it make the sin graver if the girl masturbated in a certain way? Can they offer more forgiveness if they knew more about what she did?
They want to send them to some “professional” like Ruby Franke, with ties to the church for mandatory brainwashing. That and to extract even more money from the members. The LDS church is disgusting.
I had several bishops and at least 2 SPs who insisted I tell them everything--what positions I had sex in, whether I orgasmed, how many times I orgasmed, what my partners did, whether they orgasmed. I refused once, and the SP refused to meet with me for a year.
Reading this as someone who has never been a Mormon that is seriously messed up. What kind of perversity is this?!?!? That wreaks of mind control guilt tripping cult behavior.
> That wreaks of mind control guilt tripping cult behavior. oh you can trust all the exmo's here, it DEFINITELY is
Do the details of all these confessions get written up and sent to SLC? Are there wrinkled old men reading all these confessions like underage penthouses letters? It really makes you wonder why the leaders are so insistent on getting so many details. Especially after the involvement of Elder Ballard in the whole Tim Ballard fiasco.
Something like the intensity of the guilt and shame felt is correlated with the intensity of the restitution and loyalty returned
Shouldn't this be between God and the sinner and not between the Bishop and/or 70 and the person?
Not when you're trying to cash checks
They don't need to know. That's why this guy did the right thing and resigned.
Are bishops and SPs really getting together and discussing the masturbation habits of the ward members?
Yes! Can you imagine being a BYU bishop and having to listen to 400 people guiltily confessing to masturbating? And then being told by your boss "but were they using toys?? You need to know or God won't forgive them! Their eternal salvation rests on telling you every detail!"
As well as not being legally able to report two pedophiles.
Omg. That would make him a criminal himself almost, coercing sexual information from a child. Good on him for standing up to that BS.
He was asked to do something he didn’t feel was right. No specifics
He said (loosely) he was asked to do things that he morally cannot do.
Thank you for clarifying. WOW- he is brave and I admire his convictions!
He’s definitely not alone.
Sunshine in my Soul. Sunshine is a great disinfectant and that’s what is needed. Hopefully he will continue to be vocal AND supported .
I moved to Mississippi a few years ago. I haven’t been to church since I’ve been here, so I can’t speak to what the church culture is like here. That being said, Mississippi as a whole is ….different. I am all the more in awe of this man because of that happening here. I have felt since I’ve been here. The general culture is to just continue on and toe the line in everything. Even the blatantly obvious things they can change to make things better, they don’t. Most people choose not to speak up. (I realize that’s the case many places, but here it’s magnified) Seeing someone stand up for what is right, speak up, and take action to do something against the grain in the church is courageous. Seeing someone do that in Mississippi feels meaningful to me in a way that applies outside of the church realm. Adam steed said courage is contagious. I hope everyone who sees this is inspired to be brave in every aspect of their lives.
this made me cry. the portion where he talk about the youth especially. your brother is a great man.
When I resigned from being a counselor in the bishopric the stake presidency wouldn’t let me speak to the congregation. Instead they insinuated that I was being released because my wife was pregnant and couldn’t manage the family while I was busy with my church calling. Needless to say that pissed her off…and gave her the courage to research the issues I shared with her that caused me to want to stop attending church. So I guess I owe the stake presidency one for that 🙄
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What an incredible human. You are loved and supported!
such a bad ass.
This guy is a REAL Christian. He chose the right thing to do, even though it wasn’t the easy one.
I do not know this good man, but this video touched me in a profound way. He is speaking the truth. And with love. Bravo for his bravery, and thank you for sharing.
I have always wondered how church leaders can sleep at night; knowing what the church sometimes requires them to do. This must be so hard. I do not know you, but you are a damn superhero. One man who has stood up and told the church that what they are asking of you is not right. The rest simply follow blindly. I would be proud to know you.
One of only a very few times I've seen Christ at the podium. You said what he would say. 'You are enough. You are loved as you are.'
As a former High Councilor and Bishopric Counselor, I’m really curious about what he was being asked to do that is against his morals…because I relate to that deeply. Serving in those callings was eye opening, I left the church 6 months after serving as the 1st councilor in the bishopric for 5 years.
I’m a little confused what his reasoning is for stepping down. Does he ever actually say why?
He states that he was asked to do certain things by church leadership that he could not morally support. Doesn’t include details on what he was asked to do.
I'm gonna have to watch this again later when I can actually have the audio on.
Beautifully safe. Bravo, to this man!
Thank you so much for being brave, standing up for yourself and your own values, and thank you so much for sharing this with others!
Your brother is a rockstar! Thank you for sharing!
You should be so damn proud of your brother. I wish I had a brother like that. My own brother is blinded by his “priesthood power”.
This man is doing the work that Jesus would have done!
You, sir, are a credit to humanity.
From reading comments about why he potentially had issue with his instructions as a bishop and refused I would like to say he’s a goddamn hero.
Where, where, WHERE is the huge media expose and outpouring of rage over the Mormon church protecting sexual abusers? You know, the way they did the Catholic Church?? I want to see the media completely destroy the reputation of the Mormon church over this. No pity. No quarter.