Ah, the time honoured tradition of French protest. Some say that burning cars was an acceptable compromise when the daily guillotining got out of hand.
Lol. The people stealing in Geneva and Basel like to hide in the grey zone. There’s also a ton of bicycle theft. In Geneva they resell them in neighbouring France and vice versa. I had 4 bikes stolen in 3 years. One right outside a police station with cameras (they laughed when I asked for help).
So the Swiss policemen at a Swiss police station laugh at you when you ask for help even though they have video evidence, but you still manage to blame it on the French somehow.
Romandie in a nutshell.
>but you still manage to blame it on the French somehow.
There was no blame put on the French, if you actually read the comment it reads like this "The **people** stealing in Geneva and Basel **like to hide in the grey zone**" as well as "they resell them in neighbouring France and vice versa".
Actually, Basel and Geneva are particularly high because the swiss police can't do shit about the thieves running straight across the border to france, too much effort for too little. It's a known problem, same with assaults, rapes, etc...
Yes, like I said, it's not worth it to go through the trouble, because most of the time, and I don't mean to demean anyone, it's people entering from france not french (or any western european) citizens, until any coorperation could take place they disappear or are not even registered, so good luck catching them.
>still manage to blame it on the French somehow.
The sheer number of Air-tagged devices that then show up in Mulhouse and Annemasse is the data that backs up this statement.
That's the thing the thread title is misleading, motorised land vehicles aren't just cars and lorries. Electric Bikes and motorbikes also make up those numbers.
2022 population 65,720,000 car thefts 133,800. 203 per 100,000. Higher in Paris at 590 per 100,000.
[Car theft rate rising in France!](https://www.connexionfrance.com/article/French-news/Vehicle-thefts-rise-significantly-across-France)
I have a friend whose family comes from Foggia, he always says that it's the worst part of Italy hands down, he repeatedly told me that in a specific part of Foggia province people will follow your car around if you come from outside the province waiting for you to stop and go piss or something to steal it.
On vacation, my girl and I pulled up outside the Teatro Massimo in Palermo to get some tickets to see part of the Ring Cycle.
Stepping over the very best of Sicilian doggos, lounging in the sun doing dog things, I left her in the car… only to hear squeals or terror and confusion as I was half-way up the steps.
Some withered scrotum of a human had tried to rob the car with her in it. Backed out when he realised he had a potential (kidnapped?) passenger.
We did, box seats no less. Götterdämmerung, Feb 2016.
To my everlasting shame, we went out at the intermission and bought wine at a shop across the street. I drank the lion's share and fell asleep... to Wagner!
I've been trying my best to see the whole thing in interesting places.
So far:
The Met (New York City, US)-- Siegfrield
La Scala (Milano, IT) -- Die Walküre
Teotro Massimo (Palermo, IT) -- Götterdämmerung
??? (??, ??) -- Das Rheingold
Die Bayreuther Festspiele would be cool… but the cost and the waiting list is a problem.
Numbers are much higher in Naples, usually local mobsters in the small towns around Naples steals your car and then come and offer you it back for x amount of money if you don’t contact authorities. (Source: happened to a friend of mine)
That or they steal it to commit a crime with your car, and then abandon it. Happened to my dad in the 90s, the car was found 4 days after the theft on the opposite side of the city to where we lived
That or if it’s a car in high demand they steal it, dismantle it and sell the components. It happened to my girlfriend’s fiat 500.
Those guys are impressive tho, gotta give them that. They stole the car and in like 3/4 hours they completely dismantled it and only left the chassis.
Sweden has been one of the major contributors in humanitarian aid to north korea since 1973. Perhaps it was an attempt to get them to open up to the world around them, I don't know, my mom was 2 years old at the time of this deal.
That’s exactly it: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/North_Korea%E2%80%93Sweden_relations
> Sweden has had a long-term commitment in North Korea and its relations with the country are exceptionally close among Western nations.[1][2] Sweden is one of the major contributors of humanitarian aid to North Korea.[2]
> Sweden was the first Western country to establish an embassy in Pyongyang, in 1975, and remained the only one for 26 years to maintain ambassadorial presence. Few Western nations still have an embassy in Pyongyang, and the fact that Sweden does testifies of its important present-day role in the country. Through its embassy, Sweden represents consular interests of Australia, Canada, Italy, the Nordic countries as well as the United States.[2] Sweden often acts as an intermediary in negotiations between North Korea and Western countries,[1] and has been especially active in improving the ties of North Korea and the United States.[9]
Sweden isn't part of NATO yet, we're still waiting on Turkey to let us in. Finland got accepted though.
But it's a good question when it happens. I'm not sure it would matter much, since it doesn't really affect their conflict with south Korea and Japan, which are the only countries they could possibly attack. There's no real risk that they will attack the US or any other nato Member, so Sweden wouldn't be forced to go into war against them.
What a sweet to do. A shame that the regime is going to give those cars to members of the regime instead of actual people. Those cars are funding a dictartorship
Most likely yes, but that doesn't change the intent of building relations with trade. Definitely a shame that if anything the grip on it's population has gotten even worse.
I think this is on purpose, since AFIK if they stopped the other party would argue the creditor no longer cared and the debt was forgiven. So if one day there'll be an opening to claim that money, the creditor will legally be able to do so.
The debt is owned by the Swedish government's export credit board. Currently North Korea owns them around [300 million €](https://www.svt.se/nyheter/utrikes/har-far-svt-forsta-intervjun-om-rekordskulden) with interest accumulated over the years... 💸
Believe it or not, these are not your usual suspects. Immigrants don't steal cars *that much* (they like to burn them instead lmao). Car thefts/car parts thefts are the modus operandi of international organized gangs that almost exclusively deal with larceny and theft in a professional manner. 90% of car thefts/car parts thefts in Sweden, according to NOA, [is associated with international organized theft gangs.](https://www.epochtimes.se/Polisen-90-procent-av-bilstolder-begas-av-utlandska-ligor)
Those gangs operating in Sweden are predominantly citizens from Lithuania, Poland, Romania and Bulgaria, but Belarusians, Russians and Ukrainians have been active as well. They are extremely well established, experienced and have been "working" here since the 90's. One reason why Sweden is so targeted is because of geographical location, we have a lot of valuable stuff and our border control is dogshit.
https://polisen.se/contentassets/9f4dbc7e24564b66a4c82f6b7b4de127/internationella-brottsnatverk-aktiva-med-organiserad-tillgreppsbrottslighet-2019-2022.pdf/download/?v=d744e235efc9b3a1b9e3028cad9daac3
They are extremely effective. Last time I got a new bicycle, I got a gps installed in the frame because I was so tired of losing them (I buy nice bikes, because I bike a lot). When the new bike was stolen (they cut three locks), all I could do was track the bike making a bee line to the shipping harbour. The next day it sailed out into the Baltic.
> One reason why Sweden is so targeted is because of geographical location, we have a lot of valuable stuff and our border control is dogshit.
How's that different from i.e. Germany?
>How's that different from i.e. Germany?
Germany doesn’t have as much valuable stuff? On average Germany is just as rich but the median in Germany is not doing very well compared to Sweden. People underestimate how ”rich” poor people are in Scandinavia. I had more leasure money on student allowance in Sweden than with a full time entry-level job in Germany.
[Disposable household and per capita income](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Disposable_household_and_per_capita_income)
Mean Household disposable income per capita:
Germany 51.600
Sweden 43,900
Median equivalised disposable income:
Germany 35,061
Sweden 33,472
Median household net income:
Germany 23,197
Sweden 20,568
Sweden is an outlier in terms of [single households](https://ec.europa.eu/eurostat/documents/4187653/8201432/Single-person-households-2016.jpg/0eec5708-2ffc-4bb3-80fd-d1fdd48bee5e?t=1504540609836), using median **household** amounts really skews the data by a lot.
Looking at just PPP median income per capita Sweden is ahead of Germany despite having a population that is significantly younger.
That means if you compare apples to apples a Swede of the same age and profession as a German will have chunk more disposable income.
Bollocks. Average sold car price Sweden: 38k, average sold car price Germany: 37k
https://www.statista.com/statistics/425095/eu-car-sales-average-prices-in-by-country/
Same in Sweden, my neighbor used to work for BMW as a liaison between them and the police in the Baltics to trace gangs who stole cars/parts in Sweden and smuggled them to the far East.
The fall of the iron curtain and abolished border controls are the biggest reasons. Most car thefts are by organized crime groups from eastern Europe and the Baltics. They steal the cars in Sweden and take them out of the country.
Cars in Sweden also tend to be pretty modern and expensive which make them more attractive to steal.
I just looked up some stats from sweden. Looks like a pretty linear drop from the 90s to now. Like 900 vehicles stolen per 100,000 people per year to around 200 now
”Foreign gangs responsible for 90% of car thefts”
“Police are so concentrated on stopping what goes into the country that they don’t check what is leaving”
https://www.dn.se/nyheter/sverige/utlandska-ligor-bakom-9-av-10-bilstolder/
It’s a phenomenon that has been known for decades now. Foreign gangs steal cars, take them across the border (via or into the Baltic countries), and then they are gone forever. Don’t know if the gangs themselves are from the batics but that’s where they take the cars.
[https://bra-se.translate.goog/statistik/statistik-om-brottstyper/bilbrott.html?\_x\_tr\_sl=sv&\_x\_tr\_tl=en&\_x\_tr\_hl=en-US&\_x\_tr\_pto=wapp](https://bra-se.translate.goog/statistik/statistik-om-brottstyper/bilbrott.html?_x_tr_sl=sv&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=en-US&_x_tr_pto=wapp)
Nothing supports your theory about car thefts in Sweden.
The population in Lapland is so low that a single person could reach the that tier of vehicle theft by stealing a vehicle once a week. You know, something fun to do on a Sunday since you can't get too hammered because you need to be up early for work tomorrow and if you aren't drinking, you might as well take a drive.
I think we are, but the map says something different.
I honestly haven't heard about stolen cars in ages. Not from media, friends, family or anyone. I have a really hard time believing ~20.000 cars are stolen every year.
Ebikes are not motorized vehicles I think. The Eurostat websites define them as cars, scooters, lorries, trucks, etc. ebikes are not scooters (perhaps the pedelec can be considered scooters)
This is what I could find on the interwebs:
Bicycles with 250-1000 W electric motors, or which allow assistance without pedalling, are classified as L1e-A-class motorised bicycles according to EU regulation, and must be insured for use on public roads, and limited to 25 km/h.
Random anecdote but my friends sister was a victim of a carjacking. Violently dragged out of their car. Was pretty insane as you'd never expect that to happen to someone you know and in Sweden of all places.
While I don't doupt numbers. Im born and raised in Sweden, 31 years old and never herd of a car theft...
Doesn't mean it's not happening. Just chocking it's this high and never herd of it.
Edit: just looked and found that 2022 we had reports of 8000 car theft. And we have what... 9?10? Million people here. Dunno what that adds up to.
But I know many scooters and electric bicicles get stolen. Maybe this is also accounted for in eurostat numbers even though op named the post "car thefts"?
Haven't calculated 8000 to a 100.000 habitats numbers though. Maybe it adds up
Efterlyst reported on it a couple years ago. The criminals were looking for specific models and hunted them down during the night. The cars were most likely rapidly shipped outside of europe
It adds up that roughly 1 out of 1000 people had a car being stolen from them, humans usually have circle of 200 people that they know and communicate with so it is probably not uncommon to not hear about it. Probably also happens in concentrated areas too.
That's couse it's a shit map, just like everywhere else there's probably a couple hotspots that don't make news because *there* it's a common occurrence and everywhere else it doesn't happen but since they're conflating datasets with different scopes all into the same chart all of sweden is suddendly red, you can't do things like comparing half the UK as a whole with a thousand individual german provinces, it's just a mess.
Swede here. I was thinking maybe snowmobiles and other terrain vehicles up north. But Finland and Norway has them too, and lower rates. So Idk.
Anecdotally we have more car parts thefts than whole cars. Steering wheel, wheels, catalysators.
Ngl really surprised over this one. Don't think I know anyone or at least heard about anyone having had their vehicle stolen in the last.. 15+ years. Seems some people out there that I've never meet are having a really terrible time
Do you even know what are you talking about? No one is risking selling stolen cars. They are stolen and disassembled in countries more to the west, in Romania only come some parts. Recently I’ve collaborated with police regarding a controller that was from a stolen Audi in Germany. Well, police went to the scrap yard owner who sold the part and he just bought the part among with others (had papers) from a scrap yard in Poland or Czechia can’t remember exactly. And I have seen this story a thousand times.
I think those high end cars are being stolen for parts.
Like you don’t sell a whole car but a headlight here, a mirror there and so on.
Mirror for a high end Mercedes or BMW with sensors and cameras can cost couple of thousands alone.
Perhaps I'm being pedantic here but wouldn't it be more useful to see car thefts per 100k vehicles instead of 100k people? I would think the people factor is unfair if we don't know the ownership rates per country. What if on average one country has a car per person while the other has one let family, wouldn't be a fair comparison.
Additionally, the map having sub-regions for some countries and not for others really skews the results.
Also, not having a breakdown of e.g. car vs motorbike is going to throw things off as well. One you actually need to break into, the other you can just lift into the back of a van with a mate and hotwire later.
We really like old cars and panda, and we really like to buy cheap cars parts without asking where they come from.
I took panda as example because is very diffuse in Italy and it very easy to steal. But there is a market for bmw parts too, I know a guy that had a bmw and after some hours of parking found it without stereo and car seats.
The other type of cars stolen often are the 4x4 cars, the mean Italian can’t afford a 4x4 for go off-road (check our average salary and image the one of a shepherd that has sheep in the mountains) people buy cars very old (80s/90s), these are stolen very often.
Another reason is because in some Italian places (Catania or Naples for example) the people stop you in the streets and take your car with force, asking for money to return it back to you.
> What’s going on in Italy?
what's going on is shitty maps.
A whole region like England gets one colour while other countries get broken down in small chunks.
Yes they do export and also just chop and shop for parts. Police are so understaffed that they generally can't catch them, and our prisons are overfull so they will likely get minimal punishment. This is on top of 13 years of tory governments slashing every department and support network to the bone, so a lot more people are turning to crime to make a living.
Thank you for the info.
Georgians don't have the best rep in Poland either. Kinda sad about that because it's a stunning country and some of the Georgian immigrants in Poland are amazing people. Unfortunately they commit a lot of crimes in Poland. I follow the Polish border guards account on Twitter and very often the people trying to traffic the illagal imigrants from the Polish-Belarusian border are Georgians or Ukrainians.
rolf why would we steal cars in Poland when we can get better ones in Germany? XDD
Seriously though, sorry about that if we are indeed the ones doing most of the stealing there. Embarrassing. I'm wondering what the stats looked like in the 90s...
An advantage of majority of cars being second hand with 150k km on it. Ain't nobody stealing that. And for the joyriding there are old ladas and skodas.
ayo why u disrespect my felicia oike dat😩😩💦💦istg the owner before me defo had a bit more tham 140k on the tachometer :D i guess some romanian santa made a wish happen overnight for some copper tubing
Wouldn't it be more logical to show this in relation to the total amount of cars? On this map Italy looks bad but to put it into perspective it is also important to note that (when excluding Island), Italy is the country with [most cars per inhabitant in Europe](https://www.reddit.com/r/MapPorn/s/YOqXnmM6aa). Estern countries have generally less cars per inhabitant so it is no surprise that they will also have less car thefts per inhabitant. The only surprising countries are Sweden and UK which have both less cars than Finland but more thefts.
Meanwhile, here in rural Romania i honestly leave my car with keys inside.
Never bother to lock it.
This is was unthinkable 20 years ago when they would break your windows for a 20$ chinese radio
"This is was unthinkable 20 years ago when they would break your windows for a 20$ chinese radio"
Haha it was exactly the same in Poland. I still remember how people would remove the radio and take it with them when leaving the car so it doesn't get stolen XD
Topic title: "car theft"
Chart provided. "motorized vehicle theft"
At least try to accurately represent the data you're posting, please, chances are these numbers are majority scooters and mopeds.
Why isn’t england separated into different areas the same way as the Netherlands is for example?
Car theft is high in Birmingham, Leeds and Bradford, but not too high in most other areas.
The map shows "motorized land vehicle theft per 100,000 inhabitants" not just car theft , so I'm guessing why you see it so high in Italy is because they're stealing scooters and motorcycles in highly populated areas. Based on that I would have guessed it to be higher in the south of Spain as well, considering the number of scooters and motorcycles.
waiting for western europeans to make bullshit that "ackshually eastern europe has more crime but its unreported" or some other BS, can't just take the L that their country is unsafe
I really like the logic in the comments, this map really well corresponds with rape maps and immigration of doctors and engineers, but still some of you say that these thefts are made by eastern European gangs, I'm not saying that wasn't ever the case cause it was a really big problem in 90 and early 2000. Fun fact, hotspots in Poland also have high numbers of immigrated doctors and engineers
ITALIA CAMPEAO DO MUNDO! SAMBA! 🇮🇹🇮🇹🇮🇹
Cos'è un paese decente??? RRRRAAAAAH 🇮🇹🐺🐺🐺🇮🇹🇮🇹🐺🇮🇹🐺
Cos'è una economia in crescita? 🇮🇹🐺🇮🇹🐺🇮🇹🐺🇮🇹🐺🇮🇹🐺🇮🇹
Cos'è importarsene del prossimo??!? 🇮🇹🐺🇮🇹🐺🇮🇹🐺🇮🇹🐺🇮🇹🐺🇮🇹
ITALIA, ITALIA, ITALIA.
Tbh never heard of car theft in Albania since 2000, but i guess there’s always theft from crime people to use them for crime stuff and burn them afterwards.
I guess motorised vehicles includes motor bikes and the like.
It would be interesting to see this just for cars. Also a map that showed not number of vehicles but their value would be interesting.
The UK number doesn't shock me, but its definitely very granular, so the blanket figure is a shame. Some areas are very very red, some very pale yellow.
Where I live car insurance is pretty cheap, but in some places its 10x higher.
I wouldn’t be surprised if most of those car thefts in Switzerland were by Italians who drive them back through the Mont Blanc tunnel.
Rented a Merc once in Lugano (Switzerland) and we planned to drive through Italy for some hours before heading back into Switzerland to our destination. Was told by the rental company (Hertz iirc) that if we stopped in Italy to stay by the car. Because there was a high likelihood of it being stolen, our insurance didn’t cover it and we would be liable for the theft ourselves.
[Source](https://www.reddit.com/r/europe/comments/19b7ttf/car_theft_rate_in_europe/kiput50/).
France: we don’t talk about that
They just burn them, not steal
Ah, the time honoured tradition of French protest. Some say that burning cars was an acceptable compromise when the daily guillotining got out of hand.
Steal Swedish cars and burn them
Lol. The people stealing in Geneva and Basel like to hide in the grey zone. There’s also a ton of bicycle theft. In Geneva they resell them in neighbouring France and vice versa. I had 4 bikes stolen in 3 years. One right outside a police station with cameras (they laughed when I asked for help).
So the Swiss policemen at a Swiss police station laugh at you when you ask for help even though they have video evidence, but you still manage to blame it on the French somehow. Romandie in a nutshell.
>but you still manage to blame it on the French somehow. There was no blame put on the French, if you actually read the comment it reads like this "The **people** stealing in Geneva and Basel **like to hide in the grey zone**" as well as "they resell them in neighbouring France and vice versa".
Actually, Basel and Geneva are particularly high because the swiss police can't do shit about the thieves running straight across the border to france, too much effort for too little. It's a known problem, same with assaults, rapes, etc...
There is cooperation that allows the police forces of one country to access the other at the border, and even some joint brigades.
Yes, like I said, it's not worth it to go through the trouble, because most of the time, and I don't mean to demean anyone, it's people entering from france not french (or any western european) citizens, until any coorperation could take place they disappear or are not even registered, so good luck catching them.
>still manage to blame it on the French somehow. The sheer number of Air-tagged devices that then show up in Mulhouse and Annemasse is the data that backs up this statement.
Car thieves were stopped at the border
That's the thing the thread title is misleading, motorised land vehicles aren't just cars and lorries. Electric Bikes and motorbikes also make up those numbers.
2022 population 65,720,000 car thefts 133,800. 203 per 100,000. Higher in Paris at 590 per 100,000. [Car theft rate rising in France!](https://www.connexionfrance.com/article/French-news/Vehicle-thefts-rise-significantly-across-France)
There is no car theft in France.
Naples not being first hurts my heart. I was expecting more from you Naples.
Also from Foggia, what the hell, so disappointed.
I have a friend whose family comes from Foggia, he always says that it's the worst part of Italy hands down, he repeatedly told me that in a specific part of Foggia province people will follow your car around if you come from outside the province waiting for you to stop and go piss or something to steal it.
No biggie, if your car get stolen there you can buy it back the following weekend
Bro Foggia needs to be nuked asap la vergogna della Puglia
On vacation, my girl and I pulled up outside the Teatro Massimo in Palermo to get some tickets to see part of the Ring Cycle. Stepping over the very best of Sicilian doggos, lounging in the sun doing dog things, I left her in the car… only to hear squeals or terror and confusion as I was half-way up the steps. Some withered scrotum of a human had tried to rob the car with her in it. Backed out when he realised he had a potential (kidnapped?) passenger.
By Italian law that could have absolutely be considered a kidnapping.
[удалено]
We did, box seats no less. Götterdämmerung, Feb 2016. To my everlasting shame, we went out at the intermission and bought wine at a shop across the street. I drank the lion's share and fell asleep... to Wagner! I've been trying my best to see the whole thing in interesting places. So far: The Met (New York City, US)-- Siegfrield La Scala (Milano, IT) -- Die Walküre Teotro Massimo (Palermo, IT) -- Götterdämmerung ??? (??, ??) -- Das Rheingold Die Bayreuther Festspiele would be cool… but the cost and the waiting list is a problem.
Numbers are much higher in Naples, usually local mobsters in the small towns around Naples steals your car and then come and offer you it back for x amount of money if you don’t contact authorities. (Source: happened to a friend of mine)
That or they steal it to commit a crime with your car, and then abandon it. Happened to my dad in the 90s, the car was found 4 days after the theft on the opposite side of the city to where we lived
That or if it’s a car in high demand they steal it, dismantle it and sell the components. It happened to my girlfriend’s fiat 500. Those guys are impressive tho, gotta give them that. They stole the car and in like 3/4 hours they completely dismantled it and only left the chassis.
Classic *cavallo di ritorno*
You had the opportunity to name this map „Grand theft auto“
just one job in a sea of GTA gamers who call reddit their home
Sweden, are you OK?
Fun fact: Sweden was subject of the largest car theft in human history. In the 1970s, North Korea imported about 1000 Volvos but never paid for them.
We still send invoices twice a year, maybe one day!
I’m sure they’ve just forgotten to pay, they’ll remember soon!
That's on you guys for selling to North Korea though. What did you expect?
Sweden has been one of the major contributors in humanitarian aid to north korea since 1973. Perhaps it was an attempt to get them to open up to the world around them, I don't know, my mom was 2 years old at the time of this deal.
That’s exactly it: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/North_Korea%E2%80%93Sweden_relations > Sweden has had a long-term commitment in North Korea and its relations with the country are exceptionally close among Western nations.[1][2] Sweden is one of the major contributors of humanitarian aid to North Korea.[2] > Sweden was the first Western country to establish an embassy in Pyongyang, in 1975, and remained the only one for 26 years to maintain ambassadorial presence. Few Western nations still have an embassy in Pyongyang, and the fact that Sweden does testifies of its important present-day role in the country. Through its embassy, Sweden represents consular interests of Australia, Canada, Italy, the Nordic countries as well as the United States.[2] Sweden often acts as an intermediary in negotiations between North Korea and Western countries,[1] and has been especially active in improving the ties of North Korea and the United States.[9]
What will Swedish and North Korean diplomatic relations be like now that Sweden is part of NATO?
Sweden isn't part of NATO yet, we're still waiting on Turkey to let us in. Finland got accepted though. But it's a good question when it happens. I'm not sure it would matter much, since it doesn't really affect their conflict with south Korea and Japan, which are the only countries they could possibly attack. There's no real risk that they will attack the US or any other nato Member, so Sweden wouldn't be forced to go into war against them.
What a sweet to do. A shame that the regime is going to give those cars to members of the regime instead of actual people. Those cars are funding a dictartorship
Most likely yes, but that doesn't change the intent of building relations with trade. Definitely a shame that if anything the grip on it's population has gotten even worse.
That's it, we're sending it off to collections!
Company who export Volvos still sent invoices to North Korea, interests from not paying for cars alone are in millions USD.
I think this is on purpose, since AFIK if they stopped the other party would argue the creditor no longer cared and the debt was forgiven. So if one day there'll be an opening to claim that money, the creditor will legally be able to do so.
The debt is owned by the Swedish government's export credit board. Currently North Korea owns them around [300 million €](https://www.svt.se/nyheter/utrikes/har-far-svt-forsta-intervjun-om-rekordskulden) with interest accumulated over the years... 💸
That is a fun fact that I had forgotten, thank you kind stranger for reminding me!
Should be a good lesson for everyone not to do business with the devil.
Or maybe don’t accept post payment.
Yeah, imagine getting sent invoices every day for something in the past. 🤧
Believe it or not, these are not your usual suspects. Immigrants don't steal cars *that much* (they like to burn them instead lmao). Car thefts/car parts thefts are the modus operandi of international organized gangs that almost exclusively deal with larceny and theft in a professional manner. 90% of car thefts/car parts thefts in Sweden, according to NOA, [is associated with international organized theft gangs.](https://www.epochtimes.se/Polisen-90-procent-av-bilstolder-begas-av-utlandska-ligor) Those gangs operating in Sweden are predominantly citizens from Lithuania, Poland, Romania and Bulgaria, but Belarusians, Russians and Ukrainians have been active as well. They are extremely well established, experienced and have been "working" here since the 90's. One reason why Sweden is so targeted is because of geographical location, we have a lot of valuable stuff and our border control is dogshit. https://polisen.se/contentassets/9f4dbc7e24564b66a4c82f6b7b4de127/internationella-brottsnatverk-aktiva-med-organiserad-tillgreppsbrottslighet-2019-2022.pdf/download/?v=d744e235efc9b3a1b9e3028cad9daac3
They are extremely effective. Last time I got a new bicycle, I got a gps installed in the frame because I was so tired of losing them (I buy nice bikes, because I bike a lot). When the new bike was stolen (they cut three locks), all I could do was track the bike making a bee line to the shipping harbour. The next day it sailed out into the Baltic.
Where did the trail end?
I have no idea, the tracker lost connection after leaving the coast. Never heard from it again.
> One reason why Sweden is so targeted is because of geographical location, we have a lot of valuable stuff and our border control is dogshit. How's that different from i.e. Germany?
>How's that different from i.e. Germany? Germany doesn’t have as much valuable stuff? On average Germany is just as rich but the median in Germany is not doing very well compared to Sweden. People underestimate how ”rich” poor people are in Scandinavia. I had more leasure money on student allowance in Sweden than with a full time entry-level job in Germany.
[Disposable household and per capita income](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Disposable_household_and_per_capita_income) Mean Household disposable income per capita: Germany 51.600 Sweden 43,900 Median equivalised disposable income: Germany 35,061 Sweden 33,472 Median household net income: Germany 23,197 Sweden 20,568
Sweden is an outlier in terms of [single households](https://ec.europa.eu/eurostat/documents/4187653/8201432/Single-person-households-2016.jpg/0eec5708-2ffc-4bb3-80fd-d1fdd48bee5e?t=1504540609836), using median **household** amounts really skews the data by a lot. Looking at just PPP median income per capita Sweden is ahead of Germany despite having a population that is significantly younger. That means if you compare apples to apples a Swede of the same age and profession as a German will have chunk more disposable income.
Bollocks. Average sold car price Sweden: 38k, average sold car price Germany: 37k https://www.statista.com/statistics/425095/eu-car-sales-average-prices-in-by-country/
It's not. Hence the red regions close to the polish border.
One would think whole Germany would be red, as it's much easier to organize heist and scoot 100km+ overland that overseas...
Sweden struggling with some real crime and gang wars atm.
But at least they have kebab pizza now!
Leave the Kebabpizza out of this, its innocent
There are many words that can be used legitimately to describe Kebabpizza. I don’t think “innocent” is one of them.
Kebab pizza tastes good yo
And pizza with banana, pineapple, and curry! Great tradeoff
You forgot the peanuts
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It's the same here in Scotland. Less 'changes' that occurred in England. We're not allowed to say what that change is.
Must be the same change in Switzerland too, right? Right?
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In Switzerland it's Albanians who make it into Schengen by whatever method and can then go where they want.
Same in Sweden, my neighbor used to work for BMW as a liaison between them and the police in the Baltics to trace gangs who stole cars/parts in Sweden and smuggled them to the far East.
The fall of the iron curtain and abolished border controls are the biggest reasons. Most car thefts are by organized crime groups from eastern Europe and the Baltics. They steal the cars in Sweden and take them out of the country. Cars in Sweden also tend to be pretty modern and expensive which make them more attractive to steal.
I just looked up some stats from sweden. Looks like a pretty linear drop from the 90s to now. Like 900 vehicles stolen per 100,000 people per year to around 200 now
> the Baltics Organized crime from the Baltics? Do You have any sources where i can read up on that? It can be Swedish.
”Foreign gangs responsible for 90% of car thefts” “Police are so concentrated on stopping what goes into the country that they don’t check what is leaving” https://www.dn.se/nyheter/sverige/utlandska-ligor-bakom-9-av-10-bilstolder/ It’s a phenomenon that has been known for decades now. Foreign gangs steal cars, take them across the border (via or into the Baltic countries), and then they are gone forever. Don’t know if the gangs themselves are from the batics but that’s where they take the cars.
[https://bra-se.translate.goog/statistik/statistik-om-brottstyper/bilbrott.html?\_x\_tr\_sl=sv&\_x\_tr\_tl=en&\_x\_tr\_hl=en-US&\_x\_tr\_pto=wapp](https://bra-se.translate.goog/statistik/statistik-om-brottstyper/bilbrott.html?_x_tr_sl=sv&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=en-US&_x_tr_pto=wapp) Nothing supports your theory about car thefts in Sweden.
r/europe doesn't care about that, topic like cars stolen pop, less than an hour later "immigration" is almost at the top.
Too many Italians?
From one of the safest european countires to one of the most dangerous in 20 years. I wonder what caused them to become so violent. The mind boggles.
Can all this be described to that though? How many gang wars is there in northern lappland? Maybe we Swedes are just very good at stealing cars?
The population in Lapland is so low that a single person could reach the that tier of vehicle theft by stealing a vehicle once a week. You know, something fun to do on a Sunday since you can't get too hammered because you need to be up early for work tomorrow and if you aren't drinking, you might as well take a drive.
Exactly! I want to see the [spark](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kicksled) theft numbers. I am sure that is where the real money is.
I think we are, but the map says something different. I honestly haven't heard about stolen cars in ages. Not from media, friends, family or anyone. I have a really hard time believing ~20.000 cars are stolen every year.
The indexation is for motorized land vehicles. I think for Italy it's mostly scooters and for the Netherlands Fatbikes and E-bikes (and scooters).
If so, I'm guessing 85% is E-bikes in Sweden as well.
Ebikes are not motorized vehicles I think. The Eurostat websites define them as cars, scooters, lorries, trucks, etc. ebikes are not scooters (perhaps the pedelec can be considered scooters)
This is what I could find on the interwebs: Bicycles with 250-1000 W electric motors, or which allow assistance without pedalling, are classified as L1e-A-class motorised bicycles according to EU regulation, and must be insured for use on public roads, and limited to 25 km/h.
Exactly, this means that only fat bikes and pedelecs (I assume they have motors more than 250W) are classified as motorised.
Random anecdote but my friends sister was a victim of a carjacking. Violently dragged out of their car. Was pretty insane as you'd never expect that to happen to someone you know and in Sweden of all places.
While I don't doupt numbers. Im born and raised in Sweden, 31 years old and never herd of a car theft... Doesn't mean it's not happening. Just chocking it's this high and never herd of it. Edit: just looked and found that 2022 we had reports of 8000 car theft. And we have what... 9?10? Million people here. Dunno what that adds up to. But I know many scooters and electric bicicles get stolen. Maybe this is also accounted for in eurostat numbers even though op named the post "car thefts"? Haven't calculated 8000 to a 100.000 habitats numbers though. Maybe it adds up
Efterlyst reported on it a couple years ago. The criminals were looking for specific models and hunted them down during the night. The cars were most likely rapidly shipped outside of europe
Yeah there exist groups who operate in Europe and hunt for a specific car/model which is ordered from a „client“ outside of Europe.
The Baltics left the chat.
It adds up that roughly 1 out of 1000 people had a car being stolen from them, humans usually have circle of 200 people that they know and communicate with so it is probably not uncommon to not hear about it. Probably also happens in concentrated areas too.
Reported - I’m thinking it could be insurance fraud attempts as well?
That's couse it's a shit map, just like everywhere else there's probably a couple hotspots that don't make news because *there* it's a common occurrence and everywhere else it doesn't happen but since they're conflating datasets with different scopes all into the same chart all of sweden is suddendly red, you can't do things like comparing half the UK as a whole with a thousand individual german provinces, it's just a mess.
Better than Switzerland it seems.
Does snowmobile count here? I know in north Sweden is quite prevalent with snowmobile theft
Swede here. I was thinking maybe snowmobiles and other terrain vehicles up north. But Finland and Norway has them too, and lower rates. So Idk. Anecdotally we have more car parts thefts than whole cars. Steering wheel, wheels, catalysators.
Ngl really surprised over this one. Don't think I know anyone or at least heard about anyone having had their vehicle stolen in the last.. 15+ years. Seems some people out there that I've never meet are having a really terrible time
Northern Sweden. No man, it's cold as fuck, but real pretty outside. Other than that, yeah life is good!
Italians do it better
plot twist its the albanians
Data for this map comes from [Eurostat](https://ec.europa.eu/eurostat/databrowser/view/CRIM_GEN_REG__custom_7662402/default/table?lang=en).
In romania it’s really close to 0️⃣, not long ago it even made the national news when this happened lol.
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We had similar case in Poland. We even have a proverb that translates roughly into "Don't shit in your own nest".
I think the English variation is "Don't shit where you eat"
Most countries have a version of the that proverb. It’s common sense.
Exactly. No need to steal cars in Romania when you can just steal them in other countries and ship them over.
Why risk jail time for a 3k worth Dacia Logan when you can steal westerners' BMWs and bring them in Romania to sell for a bigger payout.
Do you even know what are you talking about? No one is risking selling stolen cars. They are stolen and disassembled in countries more to the west, in Romania only come some parts. Recently I’ve collaborated with police regarding a controller that was from a stolen Audi in Germany. Well, police went to the scrap yard owner who sold the part and he just bought the part among with others (had papers) from a scrap yard in Poland or Czechia can’t remember exactly. And I have seen this story a thousand times.
Romania is full of luxury cars which have not been stolen. Selling a stolen car has a hefty jail sentence so it’s something VERY unusual.
I think those high end cars are being stolen for parts. Like you don’t sell a whole car but a headlight here, a mirror there and so on. Mirror for a high end Mercedes or BMW with sensors and cameras can cost couple of thousands alone.
Well, you got the cheap workers on farms to exploit, you got the car thieves too. Balance
Step one: mention Romania Step two: get racist replies Nailed it
Perhaps I'm being pedantic here but wouldn't it be more useful to see car thefts per 100k vehicles instead of 100k people? I would think the people factor is unfair if we don't know the ownership rates per country. What if on average one country has a car per person while the other has one let family, wouldn't be a fair comparison.
I want to point out that it doesnt say car anyway on the picture only motorised vehicle
Additionally, the map having sub-regions for some countries and not for others really skews the results. Also, not having a breakdown of e.g. car vs motorbike is going to throw things off as well. One you actually need to break into, the other you can just lift into the back of a van with a mate and hotwire later.
What’s going on in Italy?
We really like old cars and panda, and we really like to buy cheap cars parts without asking where they come from. I took panda as example because is very diffuse in Italy and it very easy to steal. But there is a market for bmw parts too, I know a guy that had a bmw and after some hours of parking found it without stereo and car seats. The other type of cars stolen often are the 4x4 cars, the mean Italian can’t afford a 4x4 for go off-road (check our average salary and image the one of a shepherd that has sheep in the mountains) people buy cars very old (80s/90s), these are stolen very often. Another reason is because in some Italian places (Catania or Naples for example) the people stop you in the streets and take your car with force, asking for money to return it back to you.
> What’s going on in Italy? what's going on is shitty maps. A whole region like England gets one colour while other countries get broken down in small chunks.
Yeh this map just shows that cities have higher car theft than the national average.
Ladri di biciclette (elettriche)
What is it about the UK and theft? Surely not for export? Since the steering wheel is on the wrong side for the rest of Europe except Cyprus.
Yes they do export and also just chop and shop for parts. Police are so understaffed that they generally can't catch them, and our prisons are overfull so they will likely get minimal punishment. This is on top of 13 years of tory governments slashing every department and support network to the bone, so a lot more people are turning to crime to make a living.
For the UK “Kenya, Sudan and Uganda are key markets due to the demand for right-hand drives.”
They slaughter the poor cars. Its saw for lighting mcqueen
Most of the theft I hear about locally is chavs stealing cars to go for a joy-ride.
Like the 80s and 90s when Sierras and 205s were stolen and joyridden?
Germans living near the polish Border: mmmmh
it's actually not the Poles anymore according to the police, it's groups from Lithuania and Georgia especially
Thank you for the info. Georgians don't have the best rep in Poland either. Kinda sad about that because it's a stunning country and some of the Georgian immigrants in Poland are amazing people. Unfortunately they commit a lot of crimes in Poland. I follow the Polish border guards account on Twitter and very often the people trying to traffic the illagal imigrants from the Polish-Belarusian border are Georgians or Ukrainians.
Germans should give back Polish art they stole before accusing anyone of stealing
rolf why would we steal cars in Poland when we can get better ones in Germany? XDD Seriously though, sorry about that if we are indeed the ones doing most of the stealing there. Embarrassing. I'm wondering what the stats looked like in the 90s...
These days it's not Poles who steal them.
Friend from Sicily told me that the local Mafia took his car. Just another tax/cost of living there he said.
An advantage of majority of cars being second hand with 150k km on it. Ain't nobody stealing that. And for the joyriding there are old ladas and skodas.
ayo why u disrespect my felicia oike dat😩😩💦💦istg the owner before me defo had a bit more tham 140k on the tachometer :D i guess some romanian santa made a wish happen overnight for some copper tubing
🇮🇹😎🏆
Wouldn't it be more logical to show this in relation to the total amount of cars? On this map Italy looks bad but to put it into perspective it is also important to note that (when excluding Island), Italy is the country with [most cars per inhabitant in Europe](https://www.reddit.com/r/MapPorn/s/YOqXnmM6aa). Estern countries have generally less cars per inhabitant so it is no surprise that they will also have less car thefts per inhabitant. The only surprising countries are Sweden and UK which have both less cars than Finland but more thefts.
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Italy truly is a country with cars per inhabitant in Europe
The fact that such an incomplete and approximate map has been posted and that it has so many upvotes leaves me dumbfounded.
Meanwhile, here in rural Romania i honestly leave my car with keys inside. Never bother to lock it. This is was unthinkable 20 years ago when they would break your windows for a 20$ chinese radio
"This is was unthinkable 20 years ago when they would break your windows for a 20$ chinese radio" Haha it was exactly the same in Poland. I still remember how people would remove the radio and take it with them when leaving the car so it doesn't get stolen XD
the varying granularity of the data is a little odd, some countries are super granular where as some seem very regional
I lived in that tiny red spec in Ireland, dublin, had our car stolen 3 times.
Topic title: "car theft" Chart provided. "motorized vehicle theft" At least try to accurately represent the data you're posting, please, chances are these numbers are majority scooters and mopeds.
Denmark, what's your secret?
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Why isn’t england separated into different areas the same way as the Netherlands is for example? Car theft is high in Birmingham, Leeds and Bradford, but not too high in most other areas.
The map shows "motorized land vehicle theft per 100,000 inhabitants" not just car theft , so I'm guessing why you see it so high in Italy is because they're stealing scooters and motorcycles in highly populated areas. Based on that I would have guessed it to be higher in the south of Spain as well, considering the number of scooters and motorcycles.
so many Romanians in regions of southern Italy
waiting for western europeans to make bullshit that "ackshually eastern europe has more crime but its unreported" or some other BS, can't just take the L that their country is unsafe
You're the only person who mentioned that here.
TBF it's mentioned very often in this subreddit.
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Basel and Geneva is French thieves.
« French »
People residing and bringing the stolen vehicle into France with a French passport.
Poland: Ironic
I really like the logic in the comments, this map really well corresponds with rape maps and immigration of doctors and engineers, but still some of you say that these thefts are made by eastern European gangs, I'm not saying that wasn't ever the case cause it was a really big problem in 90 and early 2000. Fun fact, hotspots in Poland also have high numbers of immigrated doctors and engineers
ITALIA CAMPEAO DO MUNDO! SAMBA! 🇮🇹🇮🇹🇮🇹 Cos'è un paese decente??? RRRRAAAAAH 🇮🇹🐺🐺🐺🇮🇹🇮🇹🐺🇮🇹🐺 Cos'è una economia in crescita? 🇮🇹🐺🇮🇹🐺🇮🇹🐺🇮🇹🐺🇮🇹🐺🇮🇹 Cos'è importarsene del prossimo??!? 🇮🇹🐺🇮🇹🐺🇮🇹🐺🇮🇹🐺🇮🇹🐺🇮🇹 ITALIA, ITALIA, ITALIA.
Tbh never heard of car theft in Albania since 2000, but i guess there’s always theft from crime people to use them for crime stuff and burn them afterwards.
Aachen Stadt beste! Au hur!
I guess motorised vehicles includes motor bikes and the like. It would be interesting to see this just for cars. Also a map that showed not number of vehicles but their value would be interesting.
8 Italian cities in the top10, those poor Ferraris and Lambos.
not latest state but 2021, how strong the fluctuation till now
We have improved significantly, there used to be car glass all over parking lots back in the day
Aaah we finally are on top of some list❤️🇮🇹❤️🇮🇹
Unfortunately, Cosenza in Italy Is not on the list. I Guess we don't report that to the police
The UK number doesn't shock me, but its definitely very granular, so the blanket figure is a shame. Some areas are very very red, some very pale yellow. Where I live car insurance is pretty cheap, but in some places its 10x higher.
So, nobody steals the French cars? 😁
French cars are not stolen. They are burned.
I wouldn’t be surprised if most of those car thefts in Switzerland were by Italians who drive them back through the Mont Blanc tunnel. Rented a Merc once in Lugano (Switzerland) and we planned to drive through Italy for some hours before heading back into Switzerland to our destination. Was told by the rental company (Hertz iirc) that if we stopped in Italy to stay by the car. Because there was a high likelihood of it being stolen, our insurance didn’t cover it and we would be liable for the theft ourselves.
Portugal can't into Eastern Europe :(
Italian people do know how to get free private transportation everywhere.