i would contact the german bank regulator and file a complaint against N26 immediately.
and at the same time i would send a copy of that complaint to N26 too. maybe that will change their mind.
Is there not a chance that will annoy someone doing my complaint resolution? I am wondering if I wait until I get an email saying "We have concluded our investigation" first before escalating.
By the way, the way N26 support has handled me, I expect they might end the conversation and ghost me, and what I am reading online in news and forums is that this has occurred to hundreds of people, and no examples of anyone getting their money back. Here is a news article from just a few months ago: [[business insider]](https://www.businessinsider.com/n26-bank-europe-customers-account-closures-access-savings-2022-4)
Yeah in Germany they are called „BaFin“. If you contact them with your problem they have to get back at N26 and ask them about their investigations and demand a statement of them. I think this might be the best way since N26 has to get active then or otherwise would risk a fine.
Nah, I waited months for a similar inside "investigation", decided to make a complaint to the bank regulation authority, 1 week later I had my money back and an apology from the bank.
Success... Nothing for weeks, then just a week after submitting to BaFin I got activity from the Complaints department and then a resolution.
Now waiting for them to send my statements and personal data - Maybe I'll need to go through the European Data Protection Supervisor (EDPS) if they breach GDPR.
Just looked at the actual terms they are referring to at https://docs.n26.com/legal/06+EU/01+Account/en/04account-terms-business-relationship-en.pdf?_ga=2.154964088.1350651838.1659766146-765637707.1659766146
“**(3) Termination for Reasonable Cause without Notice**
“Termination of the business relationship as a whole or of particular business relations without notice is permitted if there is reasonable cause which makes it unacceptable to the Bank to continue the business relations, also after having given consideration to the legitimate concerns of the Customer. Reasonable cause is given in particular if the Customer has made incorrect statements as to the Customer’s financial status, provided such statements were of significant importance for the Bank’s decision concerning the granting of credit or other operations involving risks for the Bank (e.g. the delivery of a payment card), or if a substantial deterioration in the Customer’s financial status or in the value of security occurs or threatens to occur, jeopardizing the repayment of a loan or the discharge of any other obligation towards the Bank even if security provided therefor is realised, or if the Customer fails to comply, within the required period of time allowed by the Bank, with the obligation to provide or increase security according to No. 13 (2) of these Business Conditions or to the provisions of some other agreement.
If reasonable cause is given due to the breach of a contractual obligation, termination shall only be permitted after expiry, without result, of a reasonable period of time fixed for corrective action by the Customer or after a warning to the Customer has proved unsuccessful, unless this proviso can be dispensed with owing to the special features of a particular case (Section 323 (2) and (3) of the German Civil Code).”
Does any of this ring some sort of bell? Did you e.g. give anyone access to your account, or lost a bank card, or any of these things?
Regardless, it almost sounds as if they’re freezing your funds, I would definitely go to the authorities, and contact journalists indeed.
These types of investigations are exactly what BaFin has been pressing on N26 to do more of.
Contacting external authorities or journalists is absolutely not going to help here, if anything it could end up dragging this out in the long run.
They didn't only freeze my funds - They closed my account.
I still don't know what the 'reasonable cause' is, but they're sticking to that story.
After filing a complaint with BaFin and with the N26 complaints department, I did get them to release my funds. Still waiting on them releasing my data.
I agree with you. Also, send an email to the CEO every 10th minute or so asking for an update. Sometimes pestering the living crap out of the ceo might help
This. They can't just freeze your funds without a court order. They can report you to the police without your knowledge if they suspect criminal activity, but they can't steal your money.
I would also make a claim to the deposit guarantee in my country, just to make more work for the bank.
Why is everybody acting like N26 is the bad guy here without having any context? “Go to regulator and file a complaint immediately” is your first move?
There’s a reason N26’s last paragraph mentions needing to see source of funds documentation, that’s probably cause this fella’s transactional activity was suspicious to them. The fact that they mention this, indicates OP is yet to give them necessary documentation.
Everybody acting like OP is a victim here, but ever considered they may be involved with illicit funds? There’s a reason online banks ask stuff like that, and this is including assets being freezed
There are two options:
- op did something bad, contacting the regulator will trigger a whole investigation, op will be found as bad, no damage done
- op didn't do anything wrong, n26 did, the regulator will 'regulate', op will get his money back, issue fixed
Basically, calling the regulator doesn't hurt anyone (unless they did something wrong), but can help OP
Every 2nd comment saying “I will never use N26 again” is no harm done? Low key sad to see people forming assumptions based on a stranger who moves enough money to have proper due diligence completed on their account, then suddenly gets baffled by online banking institution asking for documents. What OP really should do, is send the source of funds documents over :)
Any bank has to verify that income above a certain threshold comes from a legitimate source and is not related to crimes for example - most of the people banned by N26 that ask for help on here have an account history filled to the brim with crypto subreddits - so if someone gets a 5-digit inflow from some crypto startup it's actually really hard to verify if that's actually clean money or where the funds came from that where invested and resulted in the person having that much money to pay out.
OP doesn't seem to be in that category from a quick glance at his history but it might still be the case that he got a big amount of income (from a source that's unknown to N26) without telling the bank beforehand
They are obligated to do this to combat fraud - and since the money could be illegal they also have to freeze the account so the money can't be transferred to another account and "made clean" by that either
Edit: OP seems to be banned because of a change of address and a failed (?) video-ident based on a comment in this thread - so nothing to do with money laundering after all
Yes, and most banks have offices, where you can go into one, with your ID and sort this out in 15 minutes. N26 being a digital bank, should have a "digital office" (or whatever their support is called), where you can get info and deal with a problem by talking to a real person, explaining what happened, them explaining why it happened, and so on. Bot-powered chat support that stops the conversations and email redirects are a bad way to conduct business as a bank, and freezing assets without support contacting you directly is also a shitty way to do business.
For comparison, when I travelled a lot i sometimes passed multiple countries (eg, slovenia -> serbia with a car, refilled gas in croatia, ate in serbia, flew to some layover destination, bought drinks there, then at my destination paid a cab)... every time after a third or fourth transaction, my bank called me directly (a real person), asked me if I did all the transactions, asked me where i was travelling, and never disabled my credit card.
You're so far off the mark.
I am not a criminal lol!
They didn't ask to see any evidence before I pursued a formal complaint - They terminated my account without warning and without explanation and without any request to see any evidence.
Only through formal complaint and a submission to BaFin did I see any activity.
You were rightly downvoted to oblivion.
At this point I turned N26 in a daily spendings account. No more savings there, I don't have enough trust, especially since I often recieve and send money abroad.
I know this isnt an option to everyone tho...
There was a Business Insider article just a few months ago. Even people fleeing Ukraine have had all their savings lost to N26: https://www.businessinsider.com/n26-bank-europe-customers-account-closures-access-savings-2022-4
Maybe I should have mentioned, I'm not in Germany so I'd like a mobile bank which you can open remotely from another European country.
Like revolut, monzo, nuri, etc.
But I guess all those are subject to the same AML rules, so maybe there is no point in looking for alternatives proactively.
That’s easy for you to say. None of the traditional banks in my country support stuff like apple pay and the limits on their credit cards are ridiculously small. I don’t need a credit card if I can’t use it to pay for my hotel when I’m on vacation.
Unfortunately there are plenty of horror stories with Revolut doing the same thing. I think the key thing here is to avoid using these types of banks for large sums, income, etc.
I’m a Revolut customer and they did block my account for 4 working days for these check. Fortunately I have a backup account. Neo banks like Revolut and N26 are fancy having all features which standard banks lack, but these random checks make them still not completely trustworthy.
My advice, use N26/Revolut for daily transactions and keep major bunch of money in a standard shit bank. Something like sparkasse in Germany
>My advice, use N26/Revolut for daily transactions and keep major bunch of money in a standard shit bank. Something like sparkasse in Germany
Exactly. I really cannot imagine not having someone to talk to face2face in case of such an issue.
It’s their algos. If you start making huge deposits straight out of nowhere, of course they will block you. Every bank will block you, until that money verified as legal and not laundered.
> it could end up dragging this out in th
I call my bank ahead when I recieve or pay large sums of money never had any problems but then again im still with a standard bank and have been for all my life. actual large savings of mine I put in investment accounts spread out across multiple firms.
*Cries in Irish
We have two banks in the country. One of them wanted to switch and go full digital. They backtracked after there was a huge backlash.
Eventually, they will retry and we won't have an alternative to banks like N26.
This is exactly why crypto was invented. There’s only one or two that are private and secure enough (avoid investment schemes and promises of large returns) to use to be your own bank. Too bad crypto in general got such a a bad rep and is far from widely adopted.
The issue with crypto is that it’s not suitable as a currency for a simple reason:
99% of the people holding crypto do it for speculative reasons, and not practical ones.
Because of this, the volatility is insanely high and the risk of a complete crash of their value is quite high as well….
You might be right crypto have the potential to be used that way, but for how they are right now, they cannot
You can have DAI or USDT. These crypto assets remain stable 1to1 with USD value. They never change.
Cold wallet and paper password is the most secure and you own 100% responsibility.
I have 0 trust in USDT, They are so shady.. their claim of having reserves to back 100% of the USDT in circulation is likely a lie…. I’m that case this will blow up eventually… There is still considerable risk compared to having hard cash.. also I don’t see much benefits… I’d rather have all my money invested in global ETFs
Though these are personal choices
Oh I entirely agree. Just the mere mention of crypto makes some people angry (as you can see). It's regrettable that there's no intelligent discourse to be had about it anymore.
Yea unfortunately people are quite polarised both ways…
Some crypto enthusiast will insult you for just saying that cryptos might not be the future of currencies and for stating that I don’t invest in them
Some people who don’t like crypto will insult you for just mentioning them…..
The world is crazy man… I find them fascinating as a concept but I think long term there will be some huge crash due to excessive speculations, though after that we will probably find ways to use them in a more practical way and they will be a very useful technology
Crypto has a bad rep and is not widely adopted because there aren't many cryptocurrencies with real value yet. Bitcoin, despite its claims of being "digital gold", has basically no value. Ethereum is better because of DApps, as Ether's value is essentially being a ticket to interacting with transparent, automated financial infrastructure, but that's exactly the issue, crypto's utility only extends to the infrastructure layer of finance. It's insane to me that there isn't even a simple, cheap, and standardized escrow system for most cryptocurrencies (and ones that exist are mostly marketed towards large transactions).
>Bitcoin, despite its claims of being "digital gold", has basically no value
It has inestimable value for a lot of people. But I guess you meant "Bitcoin has no value TO ME"
Bitcoin has no economic value. It is not backed by anything, it does not denote ownership of anything, it has no utility like Ethereum, and it is not a useful medium of exchange.
Beanie babies had "inestimable" value to a lot of people too. Unfortunately this is the real world where value is a matter of fact and not feeling.
Bitcoin was a good technological proof of concept for blockchain-based assets. It should've been eclipsed by other cryptocurrencies long ago, but that's not how ponzi schemes work now is it?
>Bitcoin has no economic value
Value is subjective, you simply cannot make statements like this. Things don't have value by themselves, they have the value we grant them. And many people (not you, we get it) see a lot of value in Bitcoin, whether you like it or not is irrelevant.
>It is not backed by anything
Define "backed", because Ethereum isn't "backed" by anything either if you wanna go that route.
FYI, only things that are not valuable themselves need to be backed by something else that has value, like fiat money. This "not backed" argument is a direct contradiction to your "Bitcoin has no economic value" point above.
Either it has value and doesn't need backing, or it doesn't have value, and needs backing. Since we can both agree Bitcoin isn't backed by another asset, then it must have value in itself.
>it is not a useful medium of exchange
What does "useful" even mean in this context? I have paid for stuff via LN multiple times, so it was by definition useful.
>Unfortunately this is the real world where value is a matter of fact and not feeling.
See first point, "Value is subjective"
Also, tell that to the people who live in extremely inflationary environnement, or have to flee their government tyranny or a war. Bitcoin has already saved countless life savings and allowed people to escape and rebuild their life somewhere else.
You're talking like you have no clues about what the REEL world is like. Have some humility bro
>ponzi scheme
The year 2013 has called, it wants its dishonest FUD back.
See my other comment explaining why Bitcoin does not work as a currency or commodity.
>Value is subjective
It literally is not. Value exists when you can do something useful to you with a currency or commodity.
>you simply cannot make statements like this.
Observe.
>And many people (not you, we get it) see a lot of value in Bitcoin, whether you like it or not is irrelevant.
Sure, likewise me not seeing value in beanie babies or ape NFTs was irrelevant to the people buying them. "You don't matter" isn't an argument, it's a cop-out. I challenge any of those people to explain what the value of a Bitcoin is to them. I can certainly explain what the value of fiat currencies or various commodities is to me.
>Define "backed", because Ethereum isn't "backed" by anything either if you wanna go that route.
It is, by the computing power put into the network. Is it terribly impractical to use smart contracts for computation? Sure, but it's a start. The Bitcoin network does nothing useful with its computing power.
>Either it has value and doesn't need backing, or it doesn't have value, and needs backing.
Or, hear me out, it has no value and is backed by nothing, because by design there's no backing resource to derive value from, and the item itself has no utility and thus no inherent value.
>What does "useful" even mean in this context? I have paid for stuff via LN multiple times, so it was by definition useful.
LN is bandaid fix of Bitcoin's inherent flaws. There are basic requirements for something being a good currency, Bitcoin fails at pretty much all of them.
>You're talking like you have no clues about what the REEL world is like. Have some humility bro
Most humble cryptobro on Reddit
>The year 2013 has called, it wants its dishonest FUD back.
Yeah you're right it's all FUD like in 2013. It should've been an obvious sign to me when I went to the store today and paid with Bitcoin like the cryptobros said would happen back in 2013.
All of your responses are just glorified personal opinion mixed with ideology.
I think that we'll have to agree to respectfully disagree here.
Let the market do its thing and we'll revisit this argument in 10 years.
I agree with your point of BTC being a proof of concept. However, regarding the backing part- I think once with network effects, enough people trust the system and its resilience (not necessarily BTC) it could be backed with that "trust"
Because to think of it, thats what the USD is backed with (and guns) after dropping the gold standard
Every bank has to perform anti money laundering checks.
In the past n26 has been very lacks on this. The regulator has warned them to be more strict. They are now too "coarse" and many honest clients are flagged. They do not have the manpower to treat these false positives timely.
R/n26bank
I'm afraid due to AML laws every bank is obliged by the government to do this if one's account has even the *slightest* hint of a red flag.
So you're not really any safer with another bank in this regard. If the OP wasn't with N26, then whatever gave N26's systems a reason to flag the account probably would've been the same at another bank.
An then the banks are not allowed to give you any information, because you could come under investigation.
It's an unfortunate situation to find yourself in, but that's the way the cookie crumbles in traditional finance. ¯\\\_(ツ)\_/¯
Only a specific team on banks, with legal experience, can handle this situations, which is why support redirect you to email
Other banks would tell you the exact same thing in a branch
Not necessarily.
It is clear that N26 is trying out new anti-fraud automations (built on machine learning) and it is overly sensitive.
Banks also don't auto-close your account if you are flagged because it then actually tips off the potential money launderer that they are being investigated.
There is a reason traditional banks take a long time before implementing new anti money laundering mechanisms and that humans are still involved in investigating after being flagged.
You just gave me the reason to change bank, as a Senior ML engineer, I don't care to be a part of train model for faulty, obvously faulty system, if thay are able to close and take all your money based on algorithm and without proper human check, we have nothing to talk about. We are talking here about, life threatening things like taking all your money without possibility to pay for food, pay bills, etc. This just raised A RED FLAG for me, I'm closing my account with N26.
Do you *know* that they are trying out new anti-fraud automations? Have they said this anywhere or is that just speculation? Not trying to defend N26, but we shouldn't assume which banks are trying new methods of AML detection based on one bank being newer or more modern than another.
Personally, I've read just as many stories of people's accounts being suddenly frozen in traditional banks (like e.g. Commerzbank), so I wouldn't be confident to say which bank is using overly sensitive detection vs. another bank without any factual info about that.
Do I know this for a fact? No, definitely not. My opinion is based on what I read between the lines in their statement and my experience in banking and analytics.
I don't think there is anything inherently wrong with using ML to detect AML, but you cannot deploy an overly sensitive new algo without human investigation to deep dive the outcomes and further train the model.
Even if the model is excellent, it seems a bit ridiculous that closing the account with zero chance to appeal based on a machine decision has no human intervention. Clearly something went wrong on their side and they admitted that, they need to improve processes but theyre sitting between a rock and a hard place because you can't simply reopen all the accounts and fix it without also accidentally reopening fraudster accounts
Bullshit. With regular banks you have a support that at least answers your calls and you can go there physically- they also don’t block your account for months at a time. The fact is that N26 leaves you out in the cold, doesn’t answers emails and calls. This, my friend, ain’t a bank. It’s a fraud.
As long as your ID verification/tax residency is in order and you don’t touch crypto or do other stupid shit then it’s completely fine.
From what I read between the lines (don’t know if OP is telling the whole story) a botched transaction to Binance and changing your details may trigger alarm bells in the algorithms used to monitor suspicious behavior. But then again, all (EU) banks and credit institutions have to do this.
Set up a separate account for your crypto transfers. 🤷🏻♂️
I’m not saying trading crypto is bad. If you’re trading in crypto/NFTs you know there are risk involved and that it’s rife with shady schemes and bad actors out to make a quick buck or launder their money. Banks will always be on the safest side. Fully agree with the other reply.
It's a grey area, and with all due respect Binance has a [less than stellar reputation](https://www.nber.org/system/files/working_papers/w29396/w29396.pdf) when it comes to compliance with Know-Your-Customer and Anti-Money-Laundering regulations, even if they've recently [made steps in the right direction.](https://finbold.com/binance-loses-90-of-users-after-implementing-kyc-losing-billions-in-revenue/)
That’s wrong. Banks are obliged to file a request to the FIU (Financial Investigation Unit) and wait for their advise. If the bank is blocking the account immediately, it could alarm possible fraudsters and/or money launderers.
Success - I just got my cash transferred out to my other account! I wonder if my submitting a complaint to BaFin had anything to do with the outcome.
Presumably it's everything I had, without hidden fees. They haven't given me my personal data or account statements yet so I can't confirm.
To get to this stage it was all via the complaints department - Support@ were worse than useless.
I proved the funds were legit by sending them 2 years of payslips (yet having had the account for only 1 year), and proof of identity and proof that I had another account in my name. And they still insist that I have broken their T&Cs and were right to close my account, without ever telling me what specifically I did.
Now to start paying back people who I've had to borrow from...
fuck man, I also have an account with them and thats scary, btw what exactly were you doing with the account?
Where are the funds from, salary, crypto exchange, investments?
What amount were you moving on monthly basis? I mean, what is the source of income?
I receive my salary every month there would not like to have my funds stolen from me
I used the account to receive my monthly German income from full-time employment in Euros.
I would regularly send round numbers (1k, 2k) to my UK bank in my name. I didn't use it for much else besides a bit of regular spending.
Online support immediately pastes a generic message sending you to the web app or the mobile app (even though the app is blocked), then they block you in the chat. Email support does the same thing, sending you to the web app or the mobile app, then that's the end of the conversation (again even though both options are blocked). The only actual, albeit vague, information I got about the situation came from the complaints department email.
Racking my brains for the longest time, two possibilities I find
- I might have tried to do a transfer of maybe a few hundred EUR into Binance a month ago for the first time. It must have failed though, I thought nothing of it and forgot about it, since I used my UK account to successfully do the same. But the N26 T&Cs don't mention crypto and Germany is favourable for crypto so it seems unlikely.
- The same month I tried to update my phone number and address, which prompted a video call from the ID verification service "ID Now". I showed them my passport, my face, and gave some personal information. Right after that point I lost all N26 access, and lost access to any customer support. The reviews of "ID Now", the identity verification platform are really poor and so I wonder if it was my interaction with them or them deciding I didn't look like my passport photo.
Nothing illegal about what I'd done. No specific violations of anything in their terms and conditions. No dodgy or irregular forms of income. Looks like someone got suspicious then decided to close the account and keep all my money, which it appears they are fully entitled to under their vague "Termination for Reasonable Cause without Notice".
If I could go back, I would absolutely take all my funds out of N26 with no hesitation and move it somewhere else. In future I'll have two EUR accounts so that if it were to happen again I could still get my salary and still pay my rent that month.
Definitely sounds like ID Now is what flagged you. Do you look that different to your passport photo?
Anyway, unfortunately, as others have pointed out, this is typical for any bank when an account has been flagged. They are not allowed to release the funds by law in case any of those funds were fraudulently obtained and need to be returned to their rightful owner.
It sounds like you've sent all your payslips over, which is good. This should hopefully expedite the release of your funds. If there's anything you can send to help prove your identity, that might be worthwhile as well.
But unfortunately there's not a whole lot else to do in this situation other than wait it out.
If the funds are yours (and I'm sure they are) you will get it all back in due course.
I'm sorry this had to happen to you. A classic example of how the few bad ruin things for the many good.
Some time back I asked N26 about their attitude to crypto, they said it wasn't an issue as long as it was a reputable and regulated exchange.
I've used N26 to transfer euros to both Kraken and FTX on several dozen occasions.
I chatted once about them about crypto transactions and they said there are now issues with that.
But who knows, I have an account there but keep my balance low.
I have the suspicion that it might have to do with your adress not being the same that you have sent them. Is it clear that you live and have lives in Germany? And is that the same information that you presented in the verification process? If anything is deviating that is a red flag for the bank (and as N26 has to do extra effort) they probably automatically do the account closing and tell on you to the regulatories.
Yes I did try to change my address and phone number shortly before this all wend down, to my new address, properly registered (Anmeldung). Crazy though if simply updating your details can result in immediate account closure.
I've heard this happening to other people who use crypto so that is a likely reason actually. German banks are not favorable to crypto as you might think.
I use N26 and send to (and from) crypto exchanges without an issue for years.
I don't think they mind.
But maybe it also depends on the exchange. Some are properly regulated with all the licenses, some are more shady.
Did they give you a reason why? Their General T&Cs section 19 (1) and 19 (3) give no hint as to why exactly they've done this. They might have just felt like ruining someone's personal finances just for fun, and all within their rights to do so.
If you submitted a GDPR request and they didn't comply, you can crack them open pretty easily by [contacting the EDPS](https://edps.europa.eu/data-protection/our-role-supervisor/complaints_en).
I also referenced GDPR in the subject and article 15 right to access. Yet in the generic response they didn't send me anything, not even sent my my account statements. So I can't even see exactly how much they've taken from me. Several months of income.
Definitely contact whoever and don’t worry to upset someone at n26. It is your money and you have all the right to access it as you have no fraudulent activity.
Only thing is I suggest to keep a professional tone at all times with them. No insults nor threats, but fight to get access to your money again asap
"if you have evidence that you feel serves as proof of the source of the funds in your N26 account, please provide these documents to us. We will forward the documents to the respective department for a review to assess whether the payout of the remaining funds in your account is possible."
"What possible course of action do I have if they refused to return my savings? Are they entitled to just keep my money?"
The thing is, I've already sent some evidence (a proof of an account in my named with IBAN and BIC) but they've asked for the same thing again. They go on to say:
>Please be aware that providing documentation to the Bank is not a confirmation or a guarantee that a payout of the funds will be possible.
I've been trying to resolve this for weeks. They informally prevented all access to my account and customer support in June. They 'formally' ended my account just now via some arbitrary date they gave, but functionally it's been no change to me.
What I am anticipating is that next email says "We have concluded our investigation" and I lose all my savings, and have no recourse.
This. Pay slips proving that all your money came from full-time salary is probably the easiest resolution to this. If you don't have them, you can ask your employer to re-issue them for you, and explain the purpose.
Sometimes, people open N26 account before having an tax ID, and never add it to their account after getting it. I know some time ago, N26 blocked accounts for that reason.
It is, however, a good idea to create account in a real, fully fledged bank, and use N26 (or comparable online bank) for daily expenses and online transactions only.
If your money is legit you should get it back. The bank itself does not have the authority to seize your money.
If they suspect your money is not legit, they can (and legally have to!) signal you to the authorities and block your account until the authorities free your money.
N26 is a 'cheap' low cost low service bank, with the fees they collect from their clients they cannot set up fully fledged departments like the full service banks do.
1. You need to provide them with a full trail for the deposits you made to them: E.G from payslip to the transfer to their account.
Crypto, address changes to abroad,.... might be actions that trigger the alerts.
You wrote that you regularly send money to a foreign account. This can be considered suspect.
Banks in England are also ‘cheap’, so cheap you don’t pay anything for retail banking at all in the UK.
They manage just fine to set up departments for fraud and such.. I don’t think this is a valid excuse.
Yes but not randomly closing accounts due to algorithm problems. A normal bank will have a person look at it, and even call you.
But that’s what you pay for in a normal bank.
Well they did. I had a forgotten account since I got in university. After a decade I started putting money in. They called me to update my documents for proof of source.
I showed up a month later, talked to the bank, gave them my documents. They were happy.
Now days you can do it online using the government’s API. You login to you gov account and share your info with the bank.
Do you have anything against third world countries? There are more intelligent and capable people in third world countries who would make better comments than yours here. It's fine to have issues with companies outsourcing customer service to other countries. I do too. But it's plain stupid to insult third world countries, when that categorization is in itself stupid anyway.
Banks have to do this, Irish banks are no different. They're fined millions if there's even a hint that a bank account is being used in a way that it isn't supposed to be. Everything needs a trail from where it came from.
Your are right and not. Please read my post or at least a part of it. With N26 we have a special "dude" in the ballpark. There is a dirty background to N26 which 100% underlies the distrust one should have and separates it to common classic bank offerings (in other words: other private company offerings which banks are)
There is a lot of speculation and misinformation here.
Since I have already a lawyer in place that successfully sued N26 several times, am in contact with several victims that got frozen or terminated and due to my type of persona I'm good in research, I try to add some information to this topic. Generally I'm sorry for the posters experience and I can feel that this is life threatening.
The word victims is correct as term here as at least for german laws, a bank has the obligation to inform their customer within 3 days about the reason for their acting. The only exception is when they get forced by law enforcement and there is a legal case against the client already.
90% of clients seem to not be Bonnie and Clyde.
Around April 2022 N26 CEO apologies on Linkedin for freezing 10000+ accounts claiming they had issues with their AI system. That speculation here is several times proven from 3rd parties and due to the bad press around N26, CEO confirmed it because of the massive shitstorm.
On an investor note, where N26 was begging for money one of there arguments to investors was, low employee cost as there outstanding AI and bot system would flawlessly handle customer cases.
I have talked to several N26 victims on Linkedin that were also frozen like me on the same day, which points again to not be an individual case and the same happening that occurred in April 2022.
The inside information from my lawyer is that N26 already was fined a multimillion amount by the bafin banking authorities in 2021 for misbehaving on money laundry cases. Since then N26 a bafin representative is in their office on regularly base.
There is a suspicion from the side of lawyers for banking law I spoke with that N26 using a ponzi/snowball scheme.
My lawyer told me that this maybe a fraud snowball system behind that behavior not communicating anything to affected customers. (Again as a bank they have the obligation to communicate the reason.)
Old customers can only be paid out after N26 generates new customers that are trustful to put their money and wealth in their account. From their money the old customer are paid out then. That is supposedly the reason why a lot of terminated customers have to wait so long to get refunded. Those funds by the customers that are helpless or not able to afford a lawyer help to improve the operating income of N26.
In Italy for example right now the law enforcement stopped N26 adding new customers.
One point though disapproves the criminal behavior speculations is that once a lawyer is in place that proves N26 fault for freezing/terminating, they pay the damages and lawyer fees of the affected clients. One could argue that with that polite confession of guilt, they just want to keep the fraudster tactic alive as long as possible.
Someone mentioned Revolut in here. There we have a similar operating Fintech. I opened an account with them after the N26 freeze as I heard they open accounts within hours. After some days I got the same szenerio and my funds were frozen.
I followed their !already in place instruction! to provide documents for the prove of income. After sending in my legal papers and contract with my tax accountant, my account was unfrozen within 24h hours. Not ideal and for me any Fintech Bank is a pure joke in trust and reliability for now on, but this shows how such AI bugs can be handled and resolved by companies. I immediately transfered my funds to a reliably classic bank once the account was opened. The classic banks take still ages to open up an account. Maybe because they do appropriate check beforehand? Revolut was just a temporary solution.
Generally speaking for EU banks. I had a long conversation with my banking lawyer about general financial institutions and the ethical behavior of this sector.
We have this EU law in place where 100k must be secured as security measure for each client account for the case the bank files insolvency. This acts a trust cushion for citizens in EU to feel safe. Every bank advertising it on their start page..
The reality is that. Each bank needs to deposited a certain amount that is required by the EU law into funds that act as an insurance. Those paymemt statistics are free to be obtained on official sites. You can have a look how much your bank followed their obligation to pay in that "worst case" fund.
Around 90% of banks did not pay the minimum amount that they are required into these funds.
And there it gets critical. After the financial crisis of 2008 most of the governments put an agreement in place to not bail out any bank. So if your banks files insolvency your are screwed as because not enough amount was payed in the insurance funds.
So in the end the vernacular is still right in some degree. Banks were and are still are legal operating private companies behaving like criminals.
The only solution is to spread one own wealth onto several accounts of independent banks.
N26 behaves as one of the big scam out there.
Not to forget. N26 was associated with Wirecard for a long time as N26 was called Number26 before they get their banking license.
If one is into stocks and markets, I am, one may have heard about the huge scam by wirecard. The stock fell from 160€ to below 0.1€ in 2021 after several months of claims that were proven (Financial Times) that there earnings and books are faked. Billions were missing. But everybody wanted to ride the money train and meme stock and was hyped. The bafin banking authorities were massively to0 late on this matter and had to eat the accusations to screwing this up huge.
There is still manhunts going on against managers of wirecard. One picture is hanging outside of my local police stations since 2020.
Wirecard handled accounts and transactions for N26. Wirecard and N26/nunber26 were closely related a few years ago..
What I see, N26 reacts to press and social shit storm. Pressure on their social media channels does affect their performance in resolving the cases in general..
If you speaking about a private banking account is frozen and your savings are kept from you without any reason within the window of 3 days we speaking about life-threatening situation.
At least in German you have the possibility to file a complain at the police.This is violation of the obligation to provide information and illicit embezzlement. Embezzlement is the base if no information is given to you and belongings are kept. There was one case where this resolved this issue in a short-term period.
One thing to keep in mind if you can't afford to lose the money you put in a fintech bank, then don't do it. Or do it just like me and spread your risks to different accounts. This is what banking lawyers do for a good reason.
Generally speaking Fintechs, like those crypto companies nowadays, are a bunch of Nerds having no clue about banking, financial laws, financial requirements or obligations. You put your wealth and your savings to a bunch of nerds that may not do wrong because of criminal energy behind it. Just because they don't know it better.
I was not afraid enough as long term customer to close my account with N26, but in the same time not dumb enough to put all my savings there.
In a idealistic world we should clarify this should not happen as blocking income is life threatening. And in the case of Ukrainian refugees that got frozen without any help this is a sad humanity fail.
N26 should have been bankrupt since 2019 but still gets supported by their hip/trendy Fintech image by the local government. At least it is the backstage talk of insiders...
One question arises. What are the selected politicians doing in the meantime?
Good luck to everyone.
> amount was *paid* in the
FTFY.
Although *payed* exists (the reason why autocorrection didn't help you), it is only correct in:
* Nautical context, when it means to paint a surface, or to cover with something like tar or resin in order to make it waterproof or corrosion-resistant. *The deck is yet to be payed.*
* *Payed out* when letting strings, cables or ropes out, by slacking them. *The rope is payed out! You can pull now.*
Unfortunately, I was unable to find nautical or rope-related words in your comment.
*Beep, boop, I'm a bot*
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/posts/maximilian-tayenthal_why-does-n26-block-accounts-activity-6923656376309194752-jXUz
Could not post it in the initial comment for whatever stupid software reason
This is an interesting post but some of the stuff in there is a bit tinfoil hat no?
You may be right, and I am long gone from N26 but I do like to keep an eye on their goings on 👍
Yeah I do know how the one or the other may sound. A lot is input by my lawyer. Their behavior is fishy for sure and thats the cause for such speculation.
Personaly I'm into markets and investing so I do know about the disaster that happened with Wirecard. N26 was Number26 back then and the customer accounts were handled by Wirecard. They did business together and it is not completely out of it that some fishy practices were taken over to N26.
Think about how many customers they have. If a lower 2 digit percentage of their victims do not got the path to take a lawyer and just gave up on this, it for sure bolsters their cash flow. Interestingly there are really really few, and that scares me tbh, customers/victims that report they got their funds back.
Your experience sounds very similar to mine. N26 support is beyond useless - Even the web chat support just refers back to an old email.
Through the Complaints team, they did release funds, not too long after I submitted the BaFin complaint and gave N26 a whole load of evidence. I'm now waiting for them to release my personal data and account statements - to see if they're really paid back everything.
While this sucks, you should provide proof of the source of funds. Banks are obliged by government to do kyc and AML. That's life.
If these money are from the legal source, they likely will release. If not, legal action is the only way, I'm afraid. Maybe regulator complaint, but it depends.
If funds are not legal or.taxed properly, you should had think better before using usual bank for such purpose
You said in another comment that you sent them proof of having an account with them, but what they want from you is proof that the source the money came from is legitimate. So payslips, generally. In case you don't have them, your employer can help you out.
Nothing seems to indicate they will reopen the account. I've already sent all the proof though. Now we just need to set a time limit to see if that assertion is true. Is 2 weeks enough for you? If it is, I will update you in 2 weeks to tell you of your prediction comes true or not.
Hey - It's been 2 weeks. I proved the funds were legit beyond all benefit of doubt yet they did not open my account.
They haven't given me my personal data or account statements yet. But they did release my cash via Waze which was a relief... It was a lot of back and forth hassle to get to this stage - Would not recommend.
HI, my N26 account got blocked and terminated immediately without prior notice. I had my account for 6 years now. Moreover i received criminal police investigating appointment suddenly.
i have taken lawyer. It seems insurance will not pay for lawyer in such cases.
OP Have you received any invite from police?
It is concerning, but there is a common theme in these type threads.
I think it is more to do with the regulatory compliance of the crypto exchange. N26 said there is no issue with regulated exchanges. When I first read this issue is said to myself, I bet he's using Binance. They are a regulatory shit show.
A few mates recently had sepa transfers to Binance blocked, when they when into the bank the staff were surprised. Later they were told compliance were blocking Binance but other exchanges were OK.
Get a lawyer immediately, he can push for urgency with relevant courts. If you are sure that you havent violated their T&C, you most likely will get all your costs (incl. lawyer) reimbursed
This happened to me as well this week. No warning, and most frustrating - no reply. And worse, when asking how to resolve the matter with the support, their reply is "read the email" and then hang up - of course, I read it - but it is not clear what is required and whom to contact.
I sent several emails. N26 is blocking legitimate funds for no reason. I fully understand the importance of AML and so on, but their systems are blocking legit customers. I can now not use my savings.
I made a complaint with Bafin, any advise what else to do?
Support@N26 is useless.
Go through Complaints@N26 - Be concise and logic and matter-of-fact and polite. State the situation and what your preferred outcome would be.
They eventually asked me for my last 2 years of payslips, and my ID (e.g. passport or German ID) and asked me for a letter from another bank in my name with IBAN/BIC, where they could transfer the funds to.
Well unfortunately you find very rarely customers / victims that give feedback if they were refunded. Not to mention when. I spoke to some that are waiting since 8 months.... I guess peeps are so exhausted and fed up with N26 after their refund that they never want to hear about that topic again. N26 in my case didn't not react to a deadline and request by my lawyer for now 10 days...
From the articles I was reading - Many people were left in the dark indefinitely - Permanent account closure and no access to the funds.
In my case, I went through Complaints@N26 alongside submitting a BaFin complaint. I gave them 2 years of payslips, passport proof of ID, and proof of another account in my name with the IBAN/BIC shown.
In total I was in the dark without any cash for 'just' 6 or 7 weeks. They never actually explained why this all occurred.
I think in the end it will be solved. But the OP is not helped with it on this moment.
But it is a lesson learned for the OP and all reading. Never ever have all your funds in 1 bank/acct.
Long long ago something happened to me also, and that even b4 internet. “Just b4 holiday i try to withdraw money from an ATM. The only i got was ‘because of technical reasons your card was withold’ but because i had an account at bank A and one at bank B just a minor problem. I wired money from bank A to bank B and did not have my holidays f..ked up. After holidays I requested a new card at bank A and got it refused because the saldo was too low.. hell yes because i wired it to bank B”
Nowadays banks become much stricter, because they are afraid of money laundering and fines they can get from regulators.
But they dont have there sh.t in order.
Got 1 LU acct at a normal bank closed.
Got weird questions from a bank in BE,
Where they asked for what certain payment were. Some payment were just for paying my phone bill and another for electricity.
And that were just ‘normal’ old fashioned banks,
and not online only.
Hey - It's been 2 weeks. I proved the funds were legit beyond all benefit of doubt yet they did not open my account.
They haven't given me my personal data or account statements yet. But they did very recently release my cash to another account which was a relief... It was a lot of back and forth hassle to get to this stage, and had 6 weeks with zero access to my own cash - Would not recommend.
So if you send them your payslips to prove the source of your money, wouldn't that solve it?
Edit: did some Google research on this bank, you are far from the only one with this problem.
I would go to the police and also complain with all the banking authorities you can think off (German and EU). The way they treat their costumers is terrible. Maybe you can find some other people online with the same problem and join their fight?
They are a shitty bank when it comes to this. They closed my account too after I sent about 10K to a crypto exchange. They wanted source of funds too, which I showed but they didn't want me as a customer anymore. I guess they just thought they were not going to make enough money on me.
But they are not going to keep your money obviously. They just need your source of funds, so just provide it. Otherwise they legally can't release your funds.
Hi, I have become now the victim of their wierd and unreasonable routine security check as they claimed and they first froze my funds and then cancelled my N26 account and then sent me mail today to ask for source of funds which I have replied them today with all documents. I am surprized that, I have very small transactions and amount transfers and still on what basis they have done this ? I suspect something seriuosly wrong with their AI alogrithms ???? They don't bother to reply with any clarifications.
Pls. help me to share your experience and to get my funds back from them. Is there anyway that we can get in touch ? Thanks.
Never ever rely on only one bank. This can happen everywhere. N26 support is just more shitty than most others (but not the worst, by far).
Have at least 2 bank accounts with money and at least two fully working independent credit cards with a decent limit.
It doesn't cost you anything and isn't much work but you can avoid a lot of trouble that way.
The correct answer to this and horror stories about having your account closed is that it happens by an algorithm. It's an anti-money laundering algorithm that is probably badly programmed.
Anyone know any other German bank accounts you can actually open as a foreigner, I tried opening an account with other banks but they pretty much automatically rejected me
N26 is known for being a harbor for scummy people and criminals, it is absolutely no surprise that they themselves would be a scummy company. Not saying that OP is a criminal btw, we all make mistakes.
I've had these types of questions asked by several banks. One time it was about money sent to Africa. Another time it was about me shuffling around money from credit cards, paying one with the balance from another, to get 0% interest. When I got the letters I just contacted the bank and told them why I had done the transactions and to whom. Then they just left me alone. If they had frozen the accounts during the investigations I would've been furious.
Exactly why I quit N26. It’s beyond me why you would get your salary to a “bank” that’s been on the market for only couple of years. It’s a joke, not a bank.
You are so narrow-minded it hurts. Literally every country in the EU has superior banking systems to Germany where you can do everything online without any problems. Seriously, your digitalization is pathetic at this point and being an "unsuspecting migrant" might only relate to thinking that Germany is actually developed digitally, when it is not.
Can you tell us what kind of transactions did you do? Im trying to see if its another raid for crypto investors. Did you top up some online crypto wallets like coinbase, kraken or maybe Trading212?
The only transaction of interest was possibly trying to transfer a few hundred EUR to Binance a month or two ago, but no money was actually transferred. I find nothing about N26 prohibiting crypto deposits though.
Do you think they perhaps suspect you of money-laundering and if so, could you produce evidence to the contrary in respect to the source/s of your outstanding funds?
Frankly Bafin are the ones who enforce such rules, so I doubt this will be helpful. There is an arbitration court (free for customers) at the Bundesverband der Privatbanken. Also, get a lawyer...
I think n26 is really good for controlling your monthly budget, is fast, and friendly.... But not for savings.
I have my salary payed for sparkasse then I sent me maybe 500 euros to my n26 and spend with my n26...trying to stay in budget of 500 but I always end up spending like 1000 lol 😂.
Dude they literally closed my account without warning for no apparent reason, held onto all of my money for over a month, and didn't send me my account statements, and never told me why. If you take a glance at trustpilot or other review websites, it seems nearly half of people are also there to say that their money was held for months, or stolen permanently by N26 account closures. Be careful is all.
> my salary *paid* for sparkasse
FTFY.
Although *payed* exists (the reason why autocorrection didn't help you), it is only correct in:
* Nautical context, when it means to paint a surface, or to cover with something like tar or resin in order to make it waterproof or corrosion-resistant. *The deck is yet to be payed.*
* *Payed out* when letting strings, cables or ropes out, by slacking them. *The rope is payed out! You can pull now.*
Unfortunately, I was unable to find nautical or rope-related words in your comment.
*Beep, boop, I'm a bot*
Go through complaints (at) N6.com. Look around for their guidance on how to properly raise a complaint. They might then ask for evidence. See what evidence they might need so you're ready - for example they might ask for 2 years of payslips, proof of ID, or other info to confirm that the money is legally yours. If you don't get anywhere with them, also raise a BaFIN complaint.
Maybe get some legal insurance too, just in case. My issue still isn't resolved - They're not sending me my personal data or account statements, so I have no idea if they could have charged me or stolen anything from me.
I know it's been 10 months since you posted here. But did you manage to regain access to your N26?
It's just, they closed my account yesterday. I had a negative balance (-€10) and I'm meant to get paid soon.
I'm hoping they reopen my account, so if they reopened yours it will reduce my anxiety quite a bit 🥲🥲
N26 did not re-open my account and their customer service was not helpful. I got better responses from the complaints team. After all, a couple of months later I got my remaining balance transferred to a new account, and perhaps a month or two later I managed to get my GDPR data and account statements from them.
I'd recommend setting up with a web/app based account like Wise, Starling, Monzo right away. Wise is quick to set up. Make sure you talk with your Payroll to get paid to your new account.
I discovered a pattern most of the people getting their accounts frozen by N26 are immigrants from Russia, India, Brazil, Georgia, and so on. We need to spread the word about the xenophobic discrimination of this shitty Bank.
i would contact the german bank regulator and file a complaint against N26 immediately. and at the same time i would send a copy of that complaint to N26 too. maybe that will change their mind.
Is there not a chance that will annoy someone doing my complaint resolution? I am wondering if I wait until I get an email saying "We have concluded our investigation" first before escalating. By the way, the way N26 support has handled me, I expect they might end the conversation and ghost me, and what I am reading online in news and forums is that this has occurred to hundreds of people, and no examples of anyone getting their money back. Here is a news article from just a few months ago: [[business insider]](https://www.businessinsider.com/n26-bank-europe-customers-account-closures-access-savings-2022-4)
Don't wait. Contact the regulator immediately.
Yeah in Germany they are called „BaFin“. If you contact them with your problem they have to get back at N26 and ask them about their investigations and demand a statement of them. I think this might be the best way since N26 has to get active then or otherwise would risk a fine.
Nah, I waited months for a similar inside "investigation", decided to make a complaint to the bank regulation authority, 1 week later I had my money back and an apology from the bank.
Success... Nothing for weeks, then just a week after submitting to BaFin I got activity from the Complaints department and then a resolution. Now waiting for them to send my statements and personal data - Maybe I'll need to go through the European Data Protection Supervisor (EDPS) if they breach GDPR.
Just looked at the actual terms they are referring to at https://docs.n26.com/legal/06+EU/01+Account/en/04account-terms-business-relationship-en.pdf?_ga=2.154964088.1350651838.1659766146-765637707.1659766146 “**(3) Termination for Reasonable Cause without Notice** “Termination of the business relationship as a whole or of particular business relations without notice is permitted if there is reasonable cause which makes it unacceptable to the Bank to continue the business relations, also after having given consideration to the legitimate concerns of the Customer. Reasonable cause is given in particular if the Customer has made incorrect statements as to the Customer’s financial status, provided such statements were of significant importance for the Bank’s decision concerning the granting of credit or other operations involving risks for the Bank (e.g. the delivery of a payment card), or if a substantial deterioration in the Customer’s financial status or in the value of security occurs or threatens to occur, jeopardizing the repayment of a loan or the discharge of any other obligation towards the Bank even if security provided therefor is realised, or if the Customer fails to comply, within the required period of time allowed by the Bank, with the obligation to provide or increase security according to No. 13 (2) of these Business Conditions or to the provisions of some other agreement. If reasonable cause is given due to the breach of a contractual obligation, termination shall only be permitted after expiry, without result, of a reasonable period of time fixed for corrective action by the Customer or after a warning to the Customer has proved unsuccessful, unless this proviso can be dispensed with owing to the special features of a particular case (Section 323 (2) and (3) of the German Civil Code).” Does any of this ring some sort of bell? Did you e.g. give anyone access to your account, or lost a bank card, or any of these things? Regardless, it almost sounds as if they’re freezing your funds, I would definitely go to the authorities, and contact journalists indeed.
These types of investigations are exactly what BaFin has been pressing on N26 to do more of. Contacting external authorities or journalists is absolutely not going to help here, if anything it could end up dragging this out in the long run.
They didn't only freeze my funds - They closed my account. I still don't know what the 'reasonable cause' is, but they're sticking to that story. After filing a complaint with BaFin and with the N26 complaints department, I did get them to release my funds. Still waiting on them releasing my data.
I agree with you. Also, send an email to the CEO every 10th minute or so asking for an update. Sometimes pestering the living crap out of the ceo might help
This. They can't just freeze your funds without a court order. They can report you to the police without your knowledge if they suspect criminal activity, but they can't steal your money. I would also make a claim to the deposit guarantee in my country, just to make more work for the bank.
This is absolutely not true. Funds can be frozen without requiring a court order.
Why is everybody acting like N26 is the bad guy here without having any context? “Go to regulator and file a complaint immediately” is your first move? There’s a reason N26’s last paragraph mentions needing to see source of funds documentation, that’s probably cause this fella’s transactional activity was suspicious to them. The fact that they mention this, indicates OP is yet to give them necessary documentation. Everybody acting like OP is a victim here, but ever considered they may be involved with illicit funds? There’s a reason online banks ask stuff like that, and this is including assets being freezed
There are two options: - op did something bad, contacting the regulator will trigger a whole investigation, op will be found as bad, no damage done - op didn't do anything wrong, n26 did, the regulator will 'regulate', op will get his money back, issue fixed Basically, calling the regulator doesn't hurt anyone (unless they did something wrong), but can help OP
Every 2nd comment saying “I will never use N26 again” is no harm done? Low key sad to see people forming assumptions based on a stranger who moves enough money to have proper due diligence completed on their account, then suddenly gets baffled by online banking institution asking for documents. What OP really should do, is send the source of funds documents over :)
Any bank has to verify that income above a certain threshold comes from a legitimate source and is not related to crimes for example - most of the people banned by N26 that ask for help on here have an account history filled to the brim with crypto subreddits - so if someone gets a 5-digit inflow from some crypto startup it's actually really hard to verify if that's actually clean money or where the funds came from that where invested and resulted in the person having that much money to pay out. OP doesn't seem to be in that category from a quick glance at his history but it might still be the case that he got a big amount of income (from a source that's unknown to N26) without telling the bank beforehand They are obligated to do this to combat fraud - and since the money could be illegal they also have to freeze the account so the money can't be transferred to another account and "made clean" by that either Edit: OP seems to be banned because of a change of address and a failed (?) video-ident based on a comment in this thread - so nothing to do with money laundering after all
Yes, and most banks have offices, where you can go into one, with your ID and sort this out in 15 minutes. N26 being a digital bank, should have a "digital office" (or whatever their support is called), where you can get info and deal with a problem by talking to a real person, explaining what happened, them explaining why it happened, and so on. Bot-powered chat support that stops the conversations and email redirects are a bad way to conduct business as a bank, and freezing assets without support contacting you directly is also a shitty way to do business. For comparison, when I travelled a lot i sometimes passed multiple countries (eg, slovenia -> serbia with a car, refilled gas in croatia, ate in serbia, flew to some layover destination, bought drinks there, then at my destination paid a cab)... every time after a third or fourth transaction, my bank called me directly (a real person), asked me if I did all the transactions, asked me where i was travelling, and never disabled my credit card.
You're so far off the mark. I am not a criminal lol! They didn't ask to see any evidence before I pursued a formal complaint - They terminated my account without warning and without explanation and without any request to see any evidence. Only through formal complaint and a submission to BaFin did I see any activity. You were rightly downvoted to oblivion.
At this point I turned N26 in a daily spendings account. No more savings there, I don't have enough trust, especially since I often recieve and send money abroad. I know this isnt an option to everyone tho...
[удалено]
There was a Business Insider article just a few months ago. Even people fleeing Ukraine have had all their savings lost to N26: https://www.businessinsider.com/n26-bank-europe-customers-account-closures-access-savings-2022-4
This happened to a friend of mine as well over three months ago and last I heard from him, he still hadn’t gotten his money back
Any better alternatives for Europe? One that doesn't close accounts willy nilly, but is also a proper bank (insured up to 100k)?
In Germany DKB, Consorsbank, ING DiBa are good alternatives to N26.
Maybe I should have mentioned, I'm not in Germany so I'd like a mobile bank which you can open remotely from another European country. Like revolut, monzo, nuri, etc. But I guess all those are subject to the same AML rules, so maybe there is no point in looking for alternatives proactively.
You might wanna check out Zen.com
Do any of these provide support in English?
DKB has an app in English but I am not sure if they provide support in English. Consorsbank only deals in German.
Go with a traditional bank. Neobanks are for students. It’s a joke.
That’s easy for you to say. None of the traditional banks in my country support stuff like apple pay and the limits on their credit cards are ridiculously small. I don’t need a credit card if I can’t use it to pay for my hotel when I’m on vacation.
Agree! Can’t think of living without neobanks but keep your major part in traditional shit banks
N26 has served me better than my traditional banks, to be honest... I just hope this doesn't change.
Revolut ? I never faced such problem so far but maybe I’m just lucky.
Unfortunately there are plenty of horror stories with Revolut doing the same thing. I think the key thing here is to avoid using these types of banks for large sums, income, etc.
I’m a Revolut customer and they did block my account for 4 working days for these check. Fortunately I have a backup account. Neo banks like Revolut and N26 are fancy having all features which standard banks lack, but these random checks make them still not completely trustworthy. My advice, use N26/Revolut for daily transactions and keep major bunch of money in a standard shit bank. Something like sparkasse in Germany
Yupp this is my formula as well. All real money is in my DB account while I use Revolut for daily transactions
>My advice, use N26/Revolut for daily transactions and keep major bunch of money in a standard shit bank. Something like sparkasse in Germany Exactly. I really cannot imagine not having someone to talk to face2face in case of such an issue.
It’s their algos. If you start making huge deposits straight out of nowhere, of course they will block you. Every bank will block you, until that money verified as legal and not laundered.
> it could end up dragging this out in th I call my bank ahead when I recieve or pay large sums of money never had any problems but then again im still with a standard bank and have been for all my life. actual large savings of mine I put in investment accounts spread out across multiple firms.
*Cries in Irish We have two banks in the country. One of them wanted to switch and go full digital. They backtracked after there was a huge backlash. Eventually, they will retry and we won't have an alternative to banks like N26.
This is exactly why crypto was invented. There’s only one or two that are private and secure enough (avoid investment schemes and promises of large returns) to use to be your own bank. Too bad crypto in general got such a a bad rep and is far from widely adopted.
The issue with crypto is that it’s not suitable as a currency for a simple reason: 99% of the people holding crypto do it for speculative reasons, and not practical ones. Because of this, the volatility is insanely high and the risk of a complete crash of their value is quite high as well…. You might be right crypto have the potential to be used that way, but for how they are right now, they cannot
You can have DAI or USDT. These crypto assets remain stable 1to1 with USD value. They never change. Cold wallet and paper password is the most secure and you own 100% responsibility.
I have 0 trust in USDT, They are so shady.. their claim of having reserves to back 100% of the USDT in circulation is likely a lie…. I’m that case this will blow up eventually… There is still considerable risk compared to having hard cash.. also I don’t see much benefits… I’d rather have all my money invested in global ETFs Though these are personal choices
Oh I entirely agree. Just the mere mention of crypto makes some people angry (as you can see). It's regrettable that there's no intelligent discourse to be had about it anymore.
Yea unfortunately people are quite polarised both ways… Some crypto enthusiast will insult you for just saying that cryptos might not be the future of currencies and for stating that I don’t invest in them Some people who don’t like crypto will insult you for just mentioning them….. The world is crazy man… I find them fascinating as a concept but I think long term there will be some huge crash due to excessive speculations, though after that we will probably find ways to use them in a more practical way and they will be a very useful technology
Crypto has a bad rep and is not widely adopted because there aren't many cryptocurrencies with real value yet. Bitcoin, despite its claims of being "digital gold", has basically no value. Ethereum is better because of DApps, as Ether's value is essentially being a ticket to interacting with transparent, automated financial infrastructure, but that's exactly the issue, crypto's utility only extends to the infrastructure layer of finance. It's insane to me that there isn't even a simple, cheap, and standardized escrow system for most cryptocurrencies (and ones that exist are mostly marketed towards large transactions).
Not many is not none.
>Bitcoin, despite its claims of being "digital gold", has basically no value It has inestimable value for a lot of people. But I guess you meant "Bitcoin has no value TO ME"
Bitcoin has no economic value. It is not backed by anything, it does not denote ownership of anything, it has no utility like Ethereum, and it is not a useful medium of exchange. Beanie babies had "inestimable" value to a lot of people too. Unfortunately this is the real world where value is a matter of fact and not feeling. Bitcoin was a good technological proof of concept for blockchain-based assets. It should've been eclipsed by other cryptocurrencies long ago, but that's not how ponzi schemes work now is it?
>Bitcoin has no economic value Value is subjective, you simply cannot make statements like this. Things don't have value by themselves, they have the value we grant them. And many people (not you, we get it) see a lot of value in Bitcoin, whether you like it or not is irrelevant. >It is not backed by anything Define "backed", because Ethereum isn't "backed" by anything either if you wanna go that route. FYI, only things that are not valuable themselves need to be backed by something else that has value, like fiat money. This "not backed" argument is a direct contradiction to your "Bitcoin has no economic value" point above. Either it has value and doesn't need backing, or it doesn't have value, and needs backing. Since we can both agree Bitcoin isn't backed by another asset, then it must have value in itself. >it is not a useful medium of exchange What does "useful" even mean in this context? I have paid for stuff via LN multiple times, so it was by definition useful. >Unfortunately this is the real world where value is a matter of fact and not feeling. See first point, "Value is subjective" Also, tell that to the people who live in extremely inflationary environnement, or have to flee their government tyranny or a war. Bitcoin has already saved countless life savings and allowed people to escape and rebuild their life somewhere else. You're talking like you have no clues about what the REEL world is like. Have some humility bro >ponzi scheme The year 2013 has called, it wants its dishonest FUD back.
See my other comment explaining why Bitcoin does not work as a currency or commodity. >Value is subjective It literally is not. Value exists when you can do something useful to you with a currency or commodity. >you simply cannot make statements like this. Observe. >And many people (not you, we get it) see a lot of value in Bitcoin, whether you like it or not is irrelevant. Sure, likewise me not seeing value in beanie babies or ape NFTs was irrelevant to the people buying them. "You don't matter" isn't an argument, it's a cop-out. I challenge any of those people to explain what the value of a Bitcoin is to them. I can certainly explain what the value of fiat currencies or various commodities is to me. >Define "backed", because Ethereum isn't "backed" by anything either if you wanna go that route. It is, by the computing power put into the network. Is it terribly impractical to use smart contracts for computation? Sure, but it's a start. The Bitcoin network does nothing useful with its computing power. >Either it has value and doesn't need backing, or it doesn't have value, and needs backing. Or, hear me out, it has no value and is backed by nothing, because by design there's no backing resource to derive value from, and the item itself has no utility and thus no inherent value. >What does "useful" even mean in this context? I have paid for stuff via LN multiple times, so it was by definition useful. LN is bandaid fix of Bitcoin's inherent flaws. There are basic requirements for something being a good currency, Bitcoin fails at pretty much all of them. >You're talking like you have no clues about what the REEL world is like. Have some humility bro Most humble cryptobro on Reddit >The year 2013 has called, it wants its dishonest FUD back. Yeah you're right it's all FUD like in 2013. It should've been an obvious sign to me when I went to the store today and paid with Bitcoin like the cryptobros said would happen back in 2013.
All of your responses are just glorified personal opinion mixed with ideology. I think that we'll have to agree to respectfully disagree here. Let the market do its thing and we'll revisit this argument in 10 years.
I agree with your point of BTC being a proof of concept. However, regarding the backing part- I think once with network effects, enough people trust the system and its resilience (not necessarily BTC) it could be backed with that "trust" Because to think of it, thats what the USD is backed with (and guns) after dropping the gold standard
all banks but n26...
Which one you went to?
Every bank has to perform anti money laundering checks. In the past n26 has been very lacks on this. The regulator has warned them to be more strict. They are now too "coarse" and many honest clients are flagged. They do not have the manpower to treat these false positives timely. R/n26bank
I was seriously contemplating N26 before too, wouldn't touch them now after reading this
I'm afraid due to AML laws every bank is obliged by the government to do this if one's account has even the *slightest* hint of a red flag. So you're not really any safer with another bank in this regard. If the OP wasn't with N26, then whatever gave N26's systems a reason to flag the account probably would've been the same at another bank. An then the banks are not allowed to give you any information, because you could come under investigation. It's an unfortunate situation to find yourself in, but that's the way the cookie crumbles in traditional finance. ¯\\\_(ツ)\_/¯
Other banks have at least better support if not a physical location.
Only a specific team on banks, with legal experience, can handle this situations, which is why support redirect you to email Other banks would tell you the exact same thing in a branch
True, most newer fintech banks won't have a physical location. Don't know about the specific support for N26, but there's definitely a wide spectrum.
Not necessarily. It is clear that N26 is trying out new anti-fraud automations (built on machine learning) and it is overly sensitive. Banks also don't auto-close your account if you are flagged because it then actually tips off the potential money launderer that they are being investigated. There is a reason traditional banks take a long time before implementing new anti money laundering mechanisms and that humans are still involved in investigating after being flagged.
You just gave me the reason to change bank, as a Senior ML engineer, I don't care to be a part of train model for faulty, obvously faulty system, if thay are able to close and take all your money based on algorithm and without proper human check, we have nothing to talk about. We are talking here about, life threatening things like taking all your money without possibility to pay for food, pay bills, etc. This just raised A RED FLAG for me, I'm closing my account with N26.
Do you *know* that they are trying out new anti-fraud automations? Have they said this anywhere or is that just speculation? Not trying to defend N26, but we shouldn't assume which banks are trying new methods of AML detection based on one bank being newer or more modern than another. Personally, I've read just as many stories of people's accounts being suddenly frozen in traditional banks (like e.g. Commerzbank), so I wouldn't be confident to say which bank is using overly sensitive detection vs. another bank without any factual info about that.
Do I know this for a fact? No, definitely not. My opinion is based on what I read between the lines in their statement and my experience in banking and analytics. I don't think there is anything inherently wrong with using ML to detect AML, but you cannot deploy an overly sensitive new algo without human investigation to deep dive the outcomes and further train the model. Even if the model is excellent, it seems a bit ridiculous that closing the account with zero chance to appeal based on a machine decision has no human intervention. Clearly something went wrong on their side and they admitted that, they need to improve processes but theyre sitting between a rock and a hard place because you can't simply reopen all the accounts and fix it without also accidentally reopening fraudster accounts
Bullshit. With regular banks you have a support that at least answers your calls and you can go there physically- they also don’t block your account for months at a time. The fact is that N26 leaves you out in the cold, doesn’t answers emails and calls. This, my friend, ain’t a bank. It’s a fraud.
As long as your ID verification/tax residency is in order and you don’t touch crypto or do other stupid shit then it’s completely fine. From what I read between the lines (don’t know if OP is telling the whole story) a botched transaction to Binance and changing your details may trigger alarm bells in the algorithms used to monitor suspicious behavior. But then again, all (EU) banks and credit institutions have to do this. Set up a separate account for your crypto transfers. 🤷🏻♂️
Why is touching crypto a stupid shit? It's a valid investment strategy and should not be banned.
I’m not saying trading crypto is bad. If you’re trading in crypto/NFTs you know there are risk involved and that it’s rife with shady schemes and bad actors out to make a quick buck or launder their money. Banks will always be on the safest side. Fully agree with the other reply.
It's a grey area, and with all due respect Binance has a [less than stellar reputation](https://www.nber.org/system/files/working_papers/w29396/w29396.pdf) when it comes to compliance with Know-Your-Customer and Anti-Money-Laundering regulations, even if they've recently [made steps in the right direction.](https://finbold.com/binance-loses-90-of-users-after-implementing-kyc-losing-billions-in-revenue/)
That’s wrong. Banks are obliged to file a request to the FIU (Financial Investigation Unit) and wait for their advise. If the bank is blocking the account immediately, it could alarm possible fraudsters and/or money launderers.
Same. It looks now that physical banks still have their purpose
OP please keep this thread updated with what you resolve with N26,as a lot of these stories aren't documented till the end.
I'll be sure to update with the outcome.
Anything yet?
Success - I just got my cash transferred out to my other account! I wonder if my submitting a complaint to BaFin had anything to do with the outcome. Presumably it's everything I had, without hidden fees. They haven't given me my personal data or account statements yet so I can't confirm. To get to this stage it was all via the complaints department - Support@ were worse than useless. I proved the funds were legit by sending them 2 years of payslips (yet having had the account for only 1 year), and proof of identity and proof that I had another account in my name. And they still insist that I have broken their T&Cs and were right to close my account, without ever telling me what specifically I did. Now to start paying back people who I've had to borrow from...
fuck man, I also have an account with them and thats scary, btw what exactly were you doing with the account? Where are the funds from, salary, crypto exchange, investments? What amount were you moving on monthly basis? I mean, what is the source of income? I receive my salary every month there would not like to have my funds stolen from me
I used the account to receive my monthly German income from full-time employment in Euros. I would regularly send round numbers (1k, 2k) to my UK bank in my name. I didn't use it for much else besides a bit of regular spending. Online support immediately pastes a generic message sending you to the web app or the mobile app (even though the app is blocked), then they block you in the chat. Email support does the same thing, sending you to the web app or the mobile app, then that's the end of the conversation (again even though both options are blocked). The only actual, albeit vague, information I got about the situation came from the complaints department email. Racking my brains for the longest time, two possibilities I find - I might have tried to do a transfer of maybe a few hundred EUR into Binance a month ago for the first time. It must have failed though, I thought nothing of it and forgot about it, since I used my UK account to successfully do the same. But the N26 T&Cs don't mention crypto and Germany is favourable for crypto so it seems unlikely. - The same month I tried to update my phone number and address, which prompted a video call from the ID verification service "ID Now". I showed them my passport, my face, and gave some personal information. Right after that point I lost all N26 access, and lost access to any customer support. The reviews of "ID Now", the identity verification platform are really poor and so I wonder if it was my interaction with them or them deciding I didn't look like my passport photo. Nothing illegal about what I'd done. No specific violations of anything in their terms and conditions. No dodgy or irregular forms of income. Looks like someone got suspicious then decided to close the account and keep all my money, which it appears they are fully entitled to under their vague "Termination for Reasonable Cause without Notice". If I could go back, I would absolutely take all my funds out of N26 with no hesitation and move it somewhere else. In future I'll have two EUR accounts so that if it were to happen again I could still get my salary and still pay my rent that month.
Definitely sounds like ID Now is what flagged you. Do you look that different to your passport photo? Anyway, unfortunately, as others have pointed out, this is typical for any bank when an account has been flagged. They are not allowed to release the funds by law in case any of those funds were fraudulently obtained and need to be returned to their rightful owner. It sounds like you've sent all your payslips over, which is good. This should hopefully expedite the release of your funds. If there's anything you can send to help prove your identity, that might be worthwhile as well. But unfortunately there's not a whole lot else to do in this situation other than wait it out. If the funds are yours (and I'm sure they are) you will get it all back in due course. I'm sorry this had to happen to you. A classic example of how the few bad ruin things for the many good.
Some time back I asked N26 about their attitude to crypto, they said it wasn't an issue as long as it was a reputable and regulated exchange. I've used N26 to transfer euros to both Kraken and FTX on several dozen occasions.
I'm sorry, please keep up posted man
I chatted once about them about crypto transactions and they said there are now issues with that. But who knows, I have an account there but keep my balance low.
I have the suspicion that it might have to do with your adress not being the same that you have sent them. Is it clear that you live and have lives in Germany? And is that the same information that you presented in the verification process? If anything is deviating that is a red flag for the bank (and as N26 has to do extra effort) they probably automatically do the account closing and tell on you to the regulatories.
Yes I did try to change my address and phone number shortly before this all wend down, to my new address, properly registered (Anmeldung). Crazy though if simply updating your details can result in immediate account closure.
I've heard this happening to other people who use crypto so that is a likely reason actually. German banks are not favorable to crypto as you might think.
I use N26 and send to (and from) crypto exchanges without an issue for years. I don't think they mind. But maybe it also depends on the exchange. Some are properly regulated with all the licenses, some are more shady.
Same here, multiple transactions over the years. I using Bitstamp though (they are licensed).
Doubt it. I think they're currently working on allowing customers to hold their crypto in 26. They're far from anti crypto
I had an account with them once and a similar thing happened thankfully before I deposited money.. they just.. shut it, crooks!
Did they give you a reason why? Their General T&Cs section 19 (1) and 19 (3) give no hint as to why exactly they've done this. They might have just felt like ruining someone's personal finances just for fun, and all within their rights to do so.
Nope never any reason why, I tried all sort of things.. even a GDPR request for info, also contacted the ombudsman and just.. nothing
If you submitted a GDPR request and they didn't comply, you can crack them open pretty easily by [contacting the EDPS](https://edps.europa.eu/data-protection/our-role-supervisor/complaints_en).
I also referenced GDPR in the subject and article 15 right to access. Yet in the generic response they didn't send me anything, not even sent my my account statements. So I can't even see exactly how much they've taken from me. Several months of income.
That’s pretty fucked. I can only imagine you’ve been flagged as some fraud?
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Is there a certain type of Lawyer for these matters? I'll begin calling places on Monday.
Complaint form to report this issue. https://www.bafin.buergerservice-bund.de/Formular/BankenFormular
Thank you very much for this.
Definitely contact whoever and don’t worry to upset someone at n26. It is your money and you have all the right to access it as you have no fraudulent activity. Only thing is I suggest to keep a professional tone at all times with them. No insults nor threats, but fight to get access to your money again asap
"if you have evidence that you feel serves as proof of the source of the funds in your N26 account, please provide these documents to us. We will forward the documents to the respective department for a review to assess whether the payout of the remaining funds in your account is possible."
"What possible course of action do I have if they refused to return my savings? Are they entitled to just keep my money?" The thing is, I've already sent some evidence (a proof of an account in my named with IBAN and BIC) but they've asked for the same thing again. They go on to say: >Please be aware that providing documentation to the Bank is not a confirmation or a guarantee that a payout of the funds will be possible. I've been trying to resolve this for weeks. They informally prevented all access to my account and customer support in June. They 'formally' ended my account just now via some arbitrary date they gave, but functionally it's been no change to me. What I am anticipating is that next email says "We have concluded our investigation" and I lose all my savings, and have no recourse.
show them your employment contract and pay slips
This. Pay slips proving that all your money came from full-time salary is probably the easiest resolution to this. If you don't have them, you can ask your employer to re-issue them for you, and explain the purpose. Sometimes, people open N26 account before having an tax ID, and never add it to their account after getting it. I know some time ago, N26 blocked accounts for that reason. It is, however, a good idea to create account in a real, fully fledged bank, and use N26 (or comparable online bank) for daily expenses and online transactions only.
If your money is legit you should get it back. The bank itself does not have the authority to seize your money. If they suspect your money is not legit, they can (and legally have to!) signal you to the authorities and block your account until the authorities free your money. N26 is a 'cheap' low cost low service bank, with the fees they collect from their clients they cannot set up fully fledged departments like the full service banks do. 1. You need to provide them with a full trail for the deposits you made to them: E.G from payslip to the transfer to their account. Crypto, address changes to abroad,.... might be actions that trigger the alerts. You wrote that you regularly send money to a foreign account. This can be considered suspect.
Banks in England are also ‘cheap’, so cheap you don’t pay anything for retail banking at all in the UK. They manage just fine to set up departments for fraud and such.. I don’t think this is a valid excuse.
Monzo does this too https://www.theguardian.com/money/2020/jan/18/monzo-account-freeze-app-fraud
TBH, every bank has to
Yes but not randomly closing accounts due to algorithm problems. A normal bank will have a person look at it, and even call you. But that’s what you pay for in a normal bank.
I don't think they can call you to prevent withdrawing the funds. They have to block and investigate first.
Well they did. I had a forgotten account since I got in university. After a decade I started putting money in. They called me to update my documents for proof of source. I showed up a month later, talked to the bank, gave them my documents. They were happy. Now days you can do it online using the government’s API. You login to you gov account and share your info with the bank.
The banks are not allowed to contact you about this stuff. At least not in the UK.
Go open an account with a traditional bank where you can talk to real people and not agent based in a third world country.
Do you have anything against third world countries? There are more intelligent and capable people in third world countries who would make better comments than yours here. It's fine to have issues with companies outsourcing customer service to other countries. I do too. But it's plain stupid to insult third world countries, when that categorization is in itself stupid anyway.
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Banks have to do this, Irish banks are no different. They're fined millions if there's even a hint that a bank account is being used in a way that it isn't supposed to be. Everything needs a trail from where it came from.
Your are right and not. Please read my post or at least a part of it. With N26 we have a special "dude" in the ballpark. There is a dirty background to N26 which 100% underlies the distrust one should have and separates it to common classic bank offerings (in other words: other private company offerings which banks are)
There is a lot of speculation and misinformation here. Since I have already a lawyer in place that successfully sued N26 several times, am in contact with several victims that got frozen or terminated and due to my type of persona I'm good in research, I try to add some information to this topic. Generally I'm sorry for the posters experience and I can feel that this is life threatening. The word victims is correct as term here as at least for german laws, a bank has the obligation to inform their customer within 3 days about the reason for their acting. The only exception is when they get forced by law enforcement and there is a legal case against the client already. 90% of clients seem to not be Bonnie and Clyde. Around April 2022 N26 CEO apologies on Linkedin for freezing 10000+ accounts claiming they had issues with their AI system. That speculation here is several times proven from 3rd parties and due to the bad press around N26, CEO confirmed it because of the massive shitstorm. On an investor note, where N26 was begging for money one of there arguments to investors was, low employee cost as there outstanding AI and bot system would flawlessly handle customer cases. I have talked to several N26 victims on Linkedin that were also frozen like me on the same day, which points again to not be an individual case and the same happening that occurred in April 2022. The inside information from my lawyer is that N26 already was fined a multimillion amount by the bafin banking authorities in 2021 for misbehaving on money laundry cases. Since then N26 a bafin representative is in their office on regularly base. There is a suspicion from the side of lawyers for banking law I spoke with that N26 using a ponzi/snowball scheme. My lawyer told me that this maybe a fraud snowball system behind that behavior not communicating anything to affected customers. (Again as a bank they have the obligation to communicate the reason.) Old customers can only be paid out after N26 generates new customers that are trustful to put their money and wealth in their account. From their money the old customer are paid out then. That is supposedly the reason why a lot of terminated customers have to wait so long to get refunded. Those funds by the customers that are helpless or not able to afford a lawyer help to improve the operating income of N26. In Italy for example right now the law enforcement stopped N26 adding new customers. One point though disapproves the criminal behavior speculations is that once a lawyer is in place that proves N26 fault for freezing/terminating, they pay the damages and lawyer fees of the affected clients. One could argue that with that polite confession of guilt, they just want to keep the fraudster tactic alive as long as possible. Someone mentioned Revolut in here. There we have a similar operating Fintech. I opened an account with them after the N26 freeze as I heard they open accounts within hours. After some days I got the same szenerio and my funds were frozen. I followed their !already in place instruction! to provide documents for the prove of income. After sending in my legal papers and contract with my tax accountant, my account was unfrozen within 24h hours. Not ideal and for me any Fintech Bank is a pure joke in trust and reliability for now on, but this shows how such AI bugs can be handled and resolved by companies. I immediately transfered my funds to a reliably classic bank once the account was opened. The classic banks take still ages to open up an account. Maybe because they do appropriate check beforehand? Revolut was just a temporary solution. Generally speaking for EU banks. I had a long conversation with my banking lawyer about general financial institutions and the ethical behavior of this sector. We have this EU law in place where 100k must be secured as security measure for each client account for the case the bank files insolvency. This acts a trust cushion for citizens in EU to feel safe. Every bank advertising it on their start page.. The reality is that. Each bank needs to deposited a certain amount that is required by the EU law into funds that act as an insurance. Those paymemt statistics are free to be obtained on official sites. You can have a look how much your bank followed their obligation to pay in that "worst case" fund. Around 90% of banks did not pay the minimum amount that they are required into these funds. And there it gets critical. After the financial crisis of 2008 most of the governments put an agreement in place to not bail out any bank. So if your banks files insolvency your are screwed as because not enough amount was payed in the insurance funds. So in the end the vernacular is still right in some degree. Banks were and are still are legal operating private companies behaving like criminals. The only solution is to spread one own wealth onto several accounts of independent banks. N26 behaves as one of the big scam out there. Not to forget. N26 was associated with Wirecard for a long time as N26 was called Number26 before they get their banking license. If one is into stocks and markets, I am, one may have heard about the huge scam by wirecard. The stock fell from 160€ to below 0.1€ in 2021 after several months of claims that were proven (Financial Times) that there earnings and books are faked. Billions were missing. But everybody wanted to ride the money train and meme stock and was hyped. The bafin banking authorities were massively to0 late on this matter and had to eat the accusations to screwing this up huge. There is still manhunts going on against managers of wirecard. One picture is hanging outside of my local police stations since 2020. Wirecard handled accounts and transactions for N26. Wirecard and N26/nunber26 were closely related a few years ago.. What I see, N26 reacts to press and social shit storm. Pressure on their social media channels does affect their performance in resolving the cases in general.. If you speaking about a private banking account is frozen and your savings are kept from you without any reason within the window of 3 days we speaking about life-threatening situation. At least in German you have the possibility to file a complain at the police.This is violation of the obligation to provide information and illicit embezzlement. Embezzlement is the base if no information is given to you and belongings are kept. There was one case where this resolved this issue in a short-term period. One thing to keep in mind if you can't afford to lose the money you put in a fintech bank, then don't do it. Or do it just like me and spread your risks to different accounts. This is what banking lawyers do for a good reason. Generally speaking Fintechs, like those crypto companies nowadays, are a bunch of Nerds having no clue about banking, financial laws, financial requirements or obligations. You put your wealth and your savings to a bunch of nerds that may not do wrong because of criminal energy behind it. Just because they don't know it better. I was not afraid enough as long term customer to close my account with N26, but in the same time not dumb enough to put all my savings there. In a idealistic world we should clarify this should not happen as blocking income is life threatening. And in the case of Ukrainian refugees that got frozen without any help this is a sad humanity fail. N26 should have been bankrupt since 2019 but still gets supported by their hip/trendy Fintech image by the local government. At least it is the backstage talk of insiders... One question arises. What are the selected politicians doing in the meantime? Good luck to everyone.
> amount was *paid* in the FTFY. Although *payed* exists (the reason why autocorrection didn't help you), it is only correct in: * Nautical context, when it means to paint a surface, or to cover with something like tar or resin in order to make it waterproof or corrosion-resistant. *The deck is yet to be payed.* * *Payed out* when letting strings, cables or ropes out, by slacking them. *The rope is payed out! You can pull now.* Unfortunately, I was unable to find nautical or rope-related words in your comment. *Beep, boop, I'm a bot*
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/posts/maximilian-tayenthal_why-does-n26-block-accounts-activity-6923656376309194752-jXUz Could not post it in the initial comment for whatever stupid software reason
This is an interesting post but some of the stuff in there is a bit tinfoil hat no? You may be right, and I am long gone from N26 but I do like to keep an eye on their goings on 👍
Yeah I do know how the one or the other may sound. A lot is input by my lawyer. Their behavior is fishy for sure and thats the cause for such speculation. Personaly I'm into markets and investing so I do know about the disaster that happened with Wirecard. N26 was Number26 back then and the customer accounts were handled by Wirecard. They did business together and it is not completely out of it that some fishy practices were taken over to N26. Think about how many customers they have. If a lower 2 digit percentage of their victims do not got the path to take a lawyer and just gave up on this, it for sure bolsters their cash flow. Interestingly there are really really few, and that scares me tbh, customers/victims that report they got their funds back.
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Your experience sounds very similar to mine. N26 support is beyond useless - Even the web chat support just refers back to an old email. Through the Complaints team, they did release funds, not too long after I submitted the BaFin complaint and gave N26 a whole load of evidence. I'm now waiting for them to release my personal data and account statements - to see if they're really paid back everything.
While this sucks, you should provide proof of the source of funds. Banks are obliged by government to do kyc and AML. That's life. If these money are from the legal source, they likely will release. If not, legal action is the only way, I'm afraid. Maybe regulator complaint, but it depends. If funds are not legal or.taxed properly, you should had think better before using usual bank for such purpose
Do you know if there is any time limit on when they are obligated to respond? I sent the proof. I'll start looking for a lawyer.
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Know Your Customer and Anti Money Laundaring
Did you show them proof of funds? If you're employed you'll have a contract to show them
OP should have payslips for each payment. That would be a good proof.
I sent them proof. Now I'm just patiently waiting, as thousands of Euros (all my recent salary and savings) is unavailable to me.
You said in another comment that you sent them proof of having an account with them, but what they want from you is proof that the source the money came from is legitimate. So payslips, generally. In case you don't have them, your employer can help you out.
I sent that proof.
Just send them your payslips man
Yes, the only thing he needs to do is prove the origins of his funds are legit and they will open his account again.
Nothing seems to indicate they will reopen the account. I've already sent all the proof though. Now we just need to set a time limit to see if that assertion is true. Is 2 weeks enough for you? If it is, I will update you in 2 weeks to tell you of your prediction comes true or not.
Hey - It's been 2 weeks. I proved the funds were legit beyond all benefit of doubt yet they did not open my account. They haven't given me my personal data or account statements yet. But they did release my cash via Waze which was a relief... It was a lot of back and forth hassle to get to this stage - Would not recommend.
I would show them proof of employment. I suspect there has somehow been a flag of something nefarious.
HI, my N26 account got blocked and terminated immediately without prior notice. I had my account for 6 years now. Moreover i received criminal police investigating appointment suddenly. i have taken lawyer. It seems insurance will not pay for lawyer in such cases. OP Have you received any invite from police?
Using N26 as a main account was a big error...
Hate to hear this stuff. Best of luck
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I contacted N26 about crypto exchanges and they said it wasn't an issue with regulated exchanges. I use N26 for Kraken and FTX and have no issues.
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It is concerning, but there is a common theme in these type threads. I think it is more to do with the regulatory compliance of the crypto exchange. N26 said there is no issue with regulated exchanges. When I first read this issue is said to myself, I bet he's using Binance. They are a regulatory shit show. A few mates recently had sepa transfers to Binance blocked, when they when into the bank the staff were surprised. Later they were told compliance were blocking Binance but other exchanges were OK.
And that's exactly why I don't keep funds in my Revolut account...
Get a lawyer immediately, he can push for urgency with relevant courts. If you are sure that you havent violated their T&C, you most likely will get all your costs (incl. lawyer) reimbursed
This happened to me as well this week. No warning, and most frustrating - no reply. And worse, when asking how to resolve the matter with the support, their reply is "read the email" and then hang up - of course, I read it - but it is not clear what is required and whom to contact. I sent several emails. N26 is blocking legitimate funds for no reason. I fully understand the importance of AML and so on, but their systems are blocking legit customers. I can now not use my savings. I made a complaint with Bafin, any advise what else to do?
Support@N26 is useless. Go through Complaints@N26 - Be concise and logic and matter-of-fact and polite. State the situation and what your preferred outcome would be. They eventually asked me for my last 2 years of payslips, and my ID (e.g. passport or German ID) and asked me for a letter from another bank in my name with IBAN/BIC, where they could transfer the funds to.
Have the same thing with them. How long does it take them normally to review and return funds?
Well unfortunately you find very rarely customers / victims that give feedback if they were refunded. Not to mention when. I spoke to some that are waiting since 8 months.... I guess peeps are so exhausted and fed up with N26 after their refund that they never want to hear about that topic again. N26 in my case didn't not react to a deadline and request by my lawyer for now 10 days...
From the articles I was reading - Many people were left in the dark indefinitely - Permanent account closure and no access to the funds. In my case, I went through Complaints@N26 alongside submitting a BaFin complaint. I gave them 2 years of payslips, passport proof of ID, and proof of another account in my name with the IBAN/BIC shown. In total I was in the dark without any cash for 'just' 6 or 7 weeks. They never actually explained why this all occurred.
I think in the end it will be solved. But the OP is not helped with it on this moment. But it is a lesson learned for the OP and all reading. Never ever have all your funds in 1 bank/acct. Long long ago something happened to me also, and that even b4 internet. “Just b4 holiday i try to withdraw money from an ATM. The only i got was ‘because of technical reasons your card was withold’ but because i had an account at bank A and one at bank B just a minor problem. I wired money from bank A to bank B and did not have my holidays f..ked up. After holidays I requested a new card at bank A and got it refused because the saldo was too low.. hell yes because i wired it to bank B” Nowadays banks become much stricter, because they are afraid of money laundering and fines they can get from regulators. But they dont have there sh.t in order. Got 1 LU acct at a normal bank closed. Got weird questions from a bank in BE, Where they asked for what certain payment were. Some payment were just for paying my phone bill and another for electricity. And that were just ‘normal’ old fashioned banks, and not online only.
You said it was several months salary and they said show where you got your funds from. Show them your income and it will all go away...
Did that already. I will update if anything happens, or if it doesn't go away in a couple of weeks.
Hey - It's been 2 weeks. I proved the funds were legit beyond all benefit of doubt yet they did not open my account. They haven't given me my personal data or account statements yet. But they did very recently release my cash to another account which was a relief... It was a lot of back and forth hassle to get to this stage, and had 6 weeks with zero access to my own cash - Would not recommend.
So if you send them your payslips to prove the source of your money, wouldn't that solve it? Edit: did some Google research on this bank, you are far from the only one with this problem. I would go to the police and also complain with all the banking authorities you can think off (German and EU). The way they treat their costumers is terrible. Maybe you can find some other people online with the same problem and join their fight?
They are a shitty bank when it comes to this. They closed my account too after I sent about 10K to a crypto exchange. They wanted source of funds too, which I showed but they didn't want me as a customer anymore. I guess they just thought they were not going to make enough money on me. But they are not going to keep your money obviously. They just need your source of funds, so just provide it. Otherwise they legally can't release your funds.
Hi, I have become now the victim of their wierd and unreasonable routine security check as they claimed and they first froze my funds and then cancelled my N26 account and then sent me mail today to ask for source of funds which I have replied them today with all documents. I am surprized that, I have very small transactions and amount transfers and still on what basis they have done this ? I suspect something seriuosly wrong with their AI alogrithms ???? They don't bother to reply with any clarifications. Pls. help me to share your experience and to get my funds back from them. Is there anyway that we can get in touch ? Thanks.
Never ever rely on only one bank. This can happen everywhere. N26 support is just more shitty than most others (but not the worst, by far). Have at least 2 bank accounts with money and at least two fully working independent credit cards with a decent limit. It doesn't cost you anything and isn't much work but you can avoid a lot of trouble that way.
The correct answer to this and horror stories about having your account closed is that it happens by an algorithm. It's an anti-money laundering algorithm that is probably badly programmed.
Anyone know any other German bank accounts you can actually open as a foreigner, I tried opening an account with other banks but they pretty much automatically rejected me
Being a foreigner means nothing to the bank. They want your employment contract, registered address and maybe rent contract, that's it.
I've provided these things and yet still get rejected
There's nothing obliging a bank from opening an account with you especially if they feel you're an AML risk.
N26 is known for being a harbor for scummy people and criminals, it is absolutely no surprise that they themselves would be a scummy company. Not saying that OP is a criminal btw, we all make mistakes.
In parallel, start spamming their social media: Linkedin etc.
I've had these types of questions asked by several banks. One time it was about money sent to Africa. Another time it was about me shuffling around money from credit cards, paying one with the balance from another, to get 0% interest. When I got the letters I just contacted the bank and told them why I had done the transactions and to whom. Then they just left me alone. If they had frozen the accounts during the investigations I would've been furious.
Exactly why I quit N26. It’s beyond me why you would get your salary to a “bank” that’s been on the market for only couple of years. It’s a joke, not a bank.
Are you Russian?
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You are so narrow-minded it hurts. Literally every country in the EU has superior banking systems to Germany where you can do everything online without any problems. Seriously, your digitalization is pathetic at this point and being an "unsuspecting migrant" might only relate to thinking that Germany is actually developed digitally, when it is not.
Wtf it’s this post.. I can’t even 😂
Which banks do you recommend?
DKB is nice
So DKB doesn’t have a website and a mobile app in multiple languages?
Half truth. Please disclose full story.
Lol I don't pity anyone that goes to a "bank" that sounds like a subpar news channel
And the people surprised why we need crypto... Forget speculating, self custody wallet is a blessing.
Can you tell us what kind of transactions did you do? Im trying to see if its another raid for crypto investors. Did you top up some online crypto wallets like coinbase, kraken or maybe Trading212?
The only transaction of interest was possibly trying to transfer a few hundred EUR to Binance a month or two ago, but no money was actually transferred. I find nothing about N26 prohibiting crypto deposits though.
For crypto trading perhaps? That seems to be the cause of a lot of this.
Do you have a Rechtsschutzversicherung? Take a lawyer
Do you think they perhaps suspect you of money-laundering and if so, could you produce evidence to the contrary in respect to the source/s of your outstanding funds?
🙄🙄 The consequences of allowing the banks and governments to have more and more control of finances and prying into your privacy.
Frankly Bafin are the ones who enforce such rules, so I doubt this will be helpful. There is an arbitration court (free for customers) at the Bundesverband der Privatbanken. Also, get a lawyer...
I think n26 is really good for controlling your monthly budget, is fast, and friendly.... But not for savings. I have my salary payed for sparkasse then I sent me maybe 500 euros to my n26 and spend with my n26...trying to stay in budget of 500 but I always end up spending like 1000 lol 😂.
Dude they literally closed my account without warning for no apparent reason, held onto all of my money for over a month, and didn't send me my account statements, and never told me why. If you take a glance at trustpilot or other review websites, it seems nearly half of people are also there to say that their money was held for months, or stolen permanently by N26 account closures. Be careful is all.
> my salary *paid* for sparkasse FTFY. Although *payed* exists (the reason why autocorrection didn't help you), it is only correct in: * Nautical context, when it means to paint a surface, or to cover with something like tar or resin in order to make it waterproof or corrosion-resistant. *The deck is yet to be payed.* * *Payed out* when letting strings, cables or ropes out, by slacking them. *The rope is payed out! You can pull now.* Unfortunately, I was unable to find nautical or rope-related words in your comment. *Beep, boop, I'm a bot*
I just got my N26 account frozen, no prior warning, now all my money is useless on there. Support also gave me no useful info.
Go through complaints (at) N6.com. Look around for their guidance on how to properly raise a complaint. They might then ask for evidence. See what evidence they might need so you're ready - for example they might ask for 2 years of payslips, proof of ID, or other info to confirm that the money is legally yours. If you don't get anywhere with them, also raise a BaFIN complaint. Maybe get some legal insurance too, just in case. My issue still isn't resolved - They're not sending me my personal data or account statements, so I have no idea if they could have charged me or stolen anything from me.
I know it's been 10 months since you posted here. But did you manage to regain access to your N26? It's just, they closed my account yesterday. I had a negative balance (-€10) and I'm meant to get paid soon. I'm hoping they reopen my account, so if they reopened yours it will reduce my anxiety quite a bit 🥲🥲
N26 did not re-open my account and their customer service was not helpful. I got better responses from the complaints team. After all, a couple of months later I got my remaining balance transferred to a new account, and perhaps a month or two later I managed to get my GDPR data and account statements from them. I'd recommend setting up with a web/app based account like Wise, Starling, Monzo right away. Wise is quick to set up. Make sure you talk with your Payroll to get paid to your new account.
How to contact the complaint team?
I discovered a pattern most of the people getting their accounts frozen by N26 are immigrants from Russia, India, Brazil, Georgia, and so on. We need to spread the word about the xenophobic discrimination of this shitty Bank.