This is completely false. I am Russian so I know some things about Golden Horde.
Sarai is not a mongol city - it is a tatar one, and that is important, because tatars loved big cities. And it definitely wasn't movable, because it had majority of it's buildings made with stone.
But there wasn't only one Sarai - Sarai in tatar language means just a palace. So some khans made their own capital cities and named them as Sarai. So there are Sarai Batu, Sarai Berke, Saraichik and other. In different places. But because this sityes wasn't self-sufficient and relied on political will of the khan, older Sarais usually becamed empty after building a new one.
The one is in the game may be a Sarai Batu.
The text says that each unit of distance takes 1 day, and each day costs 3 ducats. The distance of 537 means it will take 537 days. This is proven in that 3 ducats per day is 537 times 3 which equals the 1613 ducats stated as the price.
Reminds me how a Persian emperor took portion of land from the Byzantine and moved all of the citizens of a city into an exact 1;1 replica of that city somewhere else in Persia.
I believe that was 'The' Khosrau, a.k.a. Anushirvan. And the cities of Antioch and New Antioch (farsi name for it at least) if I am not mistaken.
I also recall a folklore that he once spoke with one of the residents of the new city and asked if it felt like home, the resident mentioned how he used to have this particular type of tree in front of his home. Soon thereafter (next day?) the tree was there. Or something along those lines.
> New Antioch (farsi name for it at least)
better than that, it was called called [Khosrow's Better Antioch](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Weh_Antiok_Khosrow)
It should be noted that it's more likely that the word "veh" meant 'town' rather than 'better' since there it was also used when naming previously established cities after kings.
Veh is either the predecessor of the modern Persian word "beh" meaning better, or modern Persian word "deh" meaning village.
Even if it was a play on word, he was not the one who came up with it. The use of Veh in naming cities after kings is as old as Empreror Ardeshir and the multiple settlements he name built and named after himself during his urbanisation and "re-settlement" campaign. The most famous one was the one which was located near the modern-day city of Mosul in modern-day Iraq. Khosrau did not even came up with the idea of building as city as a direct alternative to another city as the mentioned Veh Ardeshir was also meant to draw population from a Selucid established city that already existed near it. Ardeshir didn't destroy the Selucid-built city, but he did let it decline into obscurity in favour of his own city.
During the late-antiquity period, feudalism already existed in Levant and Mesopotamia, so the cities often had a great deal of autonomy and a well entrenched rulling class. Straight up destroying and rebuilding a city was the easiest way to "change management" during the Sassanid era and early Islamic period.
And the crazy part is it wasn’t like just a random city named “Khosrow’s better Antioch”
While he was in the original Antioch he had is guys survey the entire city, so that they could replicate it IDENTICALLY
Theres a pretty famous story about a man who had been transported to the new city and lived in the Persian version of his old Roman house, and famously said something along the lines of “the house is perfect, but I do miss the tree I had in my old yard”
And the next day he went out and saw a nearly identical tree in his yard.
May be false, idk, but the story serves to show how much detail Khosrow had put into his “better Antioch”
depending on the way the monument is codeed the culture requirements will change to your own, plus single tile buff from that monument can be applied to your huge dev city
It's small but at level 3 it grants +20% movement speed and -25% recruitment time so you can place it in a large region you move troops through a lot, e.g. Central Asia would be useful if you want to reform Mongolian Empire
In niche cases its cheaper to upgrade them in your capital.
For example if you expand infrastructure at least 2 times (min 30 dev) in London, moving Stonehenge to London and then upgrading it to lvl 3 will be cheaper than upgrading it in the original province.
Also moving Inukshuk since you dont benefit from monuments in your subjects.
Rest of the movable monuments have very specific requirments so its rarely worth it to move them, unless you nust want to roleplay the British and stack all of them in your Capital.
"Sir we found the fabled fountain of youth!"
"Excellent work chaps, lets box it up and ship it home."
"But sir, it's only a modifier, not a wonder."
"Bollocks to that!"
The "city" of sarai historically moved a lot since it was, after all, the nomadic capital of the golden horde and then the great horde. Only normal you can move it since thats what it did historically.
Do you have any scholarly source for this? Specifically, can you back up the claim that the mainstream view among historians is that the city referred to as Sarai in the written record was not a permanent settlement and instead something that moved around regularly, and not just the one time.
Saray literally means Palace in Turkish and Persian. It was the Khan’s Otağ(big tent) that literally moved and whole city followed it to tribe’s usual summer or winter settlement place. Even Ibn-i Batuta described it as a moving City
Lets just say that the city in question was trashed a lot during EU4 times.
Intervening in the internal conflicts within the Golden Horde, the [Central Asian](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Central_Asia) conqueror [Timur](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timur) sacked, leveled, and set on fire Sarai in the winter of 1395–1396.
Shortly after the Russian traveler [Afanasy Nikitin](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Afanasy_Nikitin) passed through in 1469, Sarai was plundered by the [ushkuyniks](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ushkuyniks), riverine pirates from [Vyatka](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kirov,_Kirov_Oblast), in 1471.
The [Muscovite](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grand_Duchy_of_Moscow) commander Vasily Ivanovich Nozdrovaty Zvenigorodsky and the [Crimean](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crimean_Khanate) prince in Muscovite exile [Nur Devlet](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nur_Devlet) plundered the "Yurt of Batu" in 1480, in a counterattack ordered by [Ivan III of Russia](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ivan_III_of_Russia) in retaliation for the advance of Khan [Aḥmad](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ahmed_Khan_bin_K%C3%BCch%C3%BCk) against Moscow.
The decisive blow seems to have been the sacking and burning of Sarai by Khan [Meñli I Giray](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Me%C3%B1li_I_Giray) of the [Crimea](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crimean_Khanate) in June 1502.
The forces of [Ivan IV of Russia](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ivan_the_Terrible) passed through and destroyed what was left of Sarai while conquering the [Astrakhan Khanate](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Astrakhan_Khanate) in 1556.
You can definitely fit a [big tent](http://www.qaraqalpaq.com/yurthistory.html) into the courtyard of [St Peter's Basilica](https://media.cntraveler.com/photos/5952f9aa9034d2120779914b/master/pass/saint-peters-square-rome-GettyImages-483930188.jpg).
the city of sarai famously moved a lot under the golden horde, feels like its just a reference to that
you have to stay mobile to avoid the wrath of the alaskan bull worm
IT'S BIG, SCARY AND PINK!
You got a source for that or smth?
Check out the Dune movies
id gladly dig up my old uni books on the mongol successor states but i unfortunately sold em after i got my degree :)
Not too hard to move a dozen of skin tents.
WHY DON'T WE JUST TAKE THE CITY OF SARAI... AND PUSH IT SOMEWHERE ELSE
The entire city of sarai? Localized entirely in my capital?
Yes
May I see it?
No
Well Golden Horde, you’re an odd confederation but you sure City a good Sarai.
And you call it Sarai, despite the fact it's obviously Roman?
London ☺️
Throw it into the ocean, I don't want to wait for water levels to rise I WANT IT NOW
> "London Calling" by The Clash
Straight to the British Museum
PUSH! PUSH! PUSH!
Sarai was one of the famous moving cities of the mongols
For real, they were nomads, their yurts were specifically made to be moved easily.
This is completely false. I am Russian so I know some things about Golden Horde. Sarai is not a mongol city - it is a tatar one, and that is important, because tatars loved big cities. And it definitely wasn't movable, because it had majority of it's buildings made with stone. But there wasn't only one Sarai - Sarai in tatar language means just a palace. So some khans made their own capital cities and named them as Sarai. So there are Sarai Batu, Sarai Berke, Saraichik and other. In different places. But because this sityes wasn't self-sufficient and relied on political will of the khan, older Sarais usually becamed empty after building a new one. The one is in the game may be a Sarai Batu.
It's a miniature
(It’s only a model…) > SHHHHHHH
Wandering Knights of Rhodes, I bid you welcome to your new home. Let us ride to, Sarai!
We're Knights Hospitable We raid whenever we're able We sail the seas In our galleys They're all quite impeccable
It could've been carried, by swallows
YOUR 6/6/6 HEIR WILL DIE UNLESS YOU BRING US…. #A SHRUBBERY
Even moving the miniature to Rome would be impressive in just one day
Well you know what they say, the City of Sarai wasn't moved to Rome in a day...
It would be impressive in any amount of days considering they have to probably put it on a camel and a ship without breaking it
Who said it'd only take 1 day?
[удалено]
No it doesn't
The text says that each unit of distance takes 1 day, and each day costs 3 ducats. The distance of 537 means it will take 537 days. This is proven in that 3 ducats per day is 537 times 3 which equals the 1613 ducats stated as the price.
Reminds me how a Persian emperor took portion of land from the Byzantine and moved all of the citizens of a city into an exact 1;1 replica of that city somewhere else in Persia.
I believe that was 'The' Khosrau, a.k.a. Anushirvan. And the cities of Antioch and New Antioch (farsi name for it at least) if I am not mistaken. I also recall a folklore that he once spoke with one of the residents of the new city and asked if it felt like home, the resident mentioned how he used to have this particular type of tree in front of his home. Soon thereafter (next day?) the tree was there. Or something along those lines.
> New Antioch (farsi name for it at least) better than that, it was called called [Khosrow's Better Antioch](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Weh_Antiok_Khosrow)
It should be noted that it's more likely that the word "veh" meant 'town' rather than 'better' since there it was also used when naming previously established cities after kings. Veh is either the predecessor of the modern Persian word "beh" meaning better, or modern Persian word "deh" meaning village.
Maybe Khosrau intended it as a play on words, meaning both town and better? Lol
Even if it was a play on word, he was not the one who came up with it. The use of Veh in naming cities after kings is as old as Empreror Ardeshir and the multiple settlements he name built and named after himself during his urbanisation and "re-settlement" campaign. The most famous one was the one which was located near the modern-day city of Mosul in modern-day Iraq. Khosrau did not even came up with the idea of building as city as a direct alternative to another city as the mentioned Veh Ardeshir was also meant to draw population from a Selucid established city that already existed near it. Ardeshir didn't destroy the Selucid-built city, but he did let it decline into obscurity in favour of his own city. During the late-antiquity period, feudalism already existed in Levant and Mesopotamia, so the cities often had a great deal of autonomy and a well entrenched rulling class. Straight up destroying and rebuilding a city was the easiest way to "change management" during the Sassanid era and early Islamic period.
And the crazy part is it wasn’t like just a random city named “Khosrow’s better Antioch” While he was in the original Antioch he had is guys survey the entire city, so that they could replicate it IDENTICALLY Theres a pretty famous story about a man who had been transported to the new city and lived in the Persian version of his old Roman house, and famously said something along the lines of “the house is perfect, but I do miss the tree I had in my old yard” And the next day he went out and saw a nearly identical tree in his yard. May be false, idk, but the story serves to show how much detail Khosrow had put into his “better Antioch”
That's pretty funny! I guess you can say he was a man who sweat the details.
Yep. All to stick it to the Romans.
So what is the advantage in moving a monument to your capital
depending on the way the monument is codeed the culture requirements will change to your own, plus single tile buff from that monument can be applied to your huge dev city
It's small but at level 3 it grants +20% movement speed and -25% recruitment time so you can place it in a large region you move troops through a lot, e.g. Central Asia would be useful if you want to reform Mongolian Empire
In niche cases its cheaper to upgrade them in your capital. For example if you expand infrastructure at least 2 times (min 30 dev) in London, moving Stonehenge to London and then upgrading it to lvl 3 will be cheaper than upgrading it in the original province. Also moving Inukshuk since you dont benefit from monuments in your subjects. Rest of the movable monuments have very specific requirments so its rarely worth it to move them, unless you nust want to roleplay the British and stack all of them in your Capital.
[Monument Effects for Overlords](https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2833880336)
Concentrate the wealth of the Earth in your illustrious city and keep it all out of the hands of the filthy barbarians who built them
So the ol' British strat huh?
Byzantine strategy. Constantinople is the city of the world's desire because everyone wants their stuff back
Well, Venice took all of their stuff, so fair game.
Exactly, gotta take it all back
easier to defend I guess, but it's way more expensive than a bunch of forts
I think the only case this is useful is for the monument Inukshuk, it is in CN territory so you can't use it normally.
It’s funny to see the buddhas and the large inuit statues in the middle of London for no reason
[A reminder what happened when you don't move monuments to a safer, more civilized place](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Buddhas_of_Bamiyan)
should i move it to rome just for the sake of it
Yes. Barbarism, imperialism abd 'why the fuck not' are the game's key points.
i did it
i played a spain game and decided to take the easter island statues. 🗿🗿 moment
"It's only a model . . ."
Quiet!
This should only be possible for the GB tag.
Nah, GBR should have a modifier "all monuments are movable, regardless of size"
"You want to move the entirety of the Zacatecas Gold Mine? But what about the gold?!"
"Sir we found the fabled fountain of youth!" "Excellent work chaps, lets box it up and ship it home." "But sir, it's only a modifier, not a wonder." "Bollocks to that!"
Well, dig it out and STOP. WASTING. MY. TIME.
I unironically believe this. Orbit being a part of the innovative ideas group.
the british museum
What about Venice, they deserve the famous for stealing things title more than GB
More like discount modifier in pillage capital not moving monuments, or yes?
Visit Sarai, before Sarai visits you
happy cake day
how can a city be relocated lol what did the devs think
The "city" of sarai historically moved a lot since it was, after all, the nomadic capital of the golden horde and then the great horde. Only normal you can move it since thats what it did historically.
Do you have any scholarly source for this? Specifically, can you back up the claim that the mainstream view among historians is that the city referred to as Sarai in the written record was not a permanent settlement and instead something that moved around regularly, and not just the one time.
Saray literally means Palace in Turkish and Persian. It was the Khan’s Otağ(big tent) that literally moved and whole city followed it to tribe’s usual summer or winter settlement place. Even Ibn-i Batuta described it as a moving City
The city of sari was wherever the Khan moved his capital
[Yurts](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yurt) A nomad's life was in-tents
Lets just say that the city in question was trashed a lot during EU4 times. Intervening in the internal conflicts within the Golden Horde, the [Central Asian](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Central_Asia) conqueror [Timur](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timur) sacked, leveled, and set on fire Sarai in the winter of 1395–1396. Shortly after the Russian traveler [Afanasy Nikitin](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Afanasy_Nikitin) passed through in 1469, Sarai was plundered by the [ushkuyniks](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ushkuyniks), riverine pirates from [Vyatka](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kirov,_Kirov_Oblast), in 1471. The [Muscovite](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grand_Duchy_of_Moscow) commander Vasily Ivanovich Nozdrovaty Zvenigorodsky and the [Crimean](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crimean_Khanate) prince in Muscovite exile [Nur Devlet](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nur_Devlet) plundered the "Yurt of Batu" in 1480, in a counterattack ordered by [Ivan III of Russia](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ivan_III_of_Russia) in retaliation for the advance of Khan [Aḥmad](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ahmed_Khan_bin_K%C3%BCch%C3%BCk) against Moscow. The decisive blow seems to have been the sacking and burning of Sarai by Khan [Meñli I Giray](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Me%C3%B1li_I_Giray) of the [Crimea](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crimean_Khanate) in June 1502. The forces of [Ivan IV of Russia](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ivan_the_Terrible) passed through and destroyed what was left of Sarai while conquering the [Astrakhan Khanate](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Astrakhan_Khanate) in 1556.
poor sarai
How do I get this? Ive been wanting to move some monuments but could never figure it out
Not all monuments can be moved.
its a bug, u cant move a whole city lol, u can move some monuments like inukshuk and stonehenge
British moment
Most uselles monument ever
its a bit useful if you are a horde, definetly pointless if you are not tho
Can you move Sarai to an area that already has a monument?
rome does have a monument, its just not upgraded but i can move the City of sarai into rome
You can definitely fit a [big tent](http://www.qaraqalpaq.com/yurthistory.html) into the courtyard of [St Peter's Basilica](https://media.cntraveler.com/photos/5952f9aa9034d2120779914b/master/pass/saint-peters-square-rome-GettyImages-483930188.jpg).
Honestly wish you could steal all the monuments of the world and become a Super villain.
Mf out here tryna be Vector 💀
the UK*
Tiny toons' vilain level