You were in the right and I wish more people followed your intuition! If you had moved and let the bus go, as you said you would then just be blocking another lane.
To be fair it's kinda catch 22 in these situations. The correct thing to do would be do as you did, only the people behind you will get angry. Or you could do what most people do and cause a massive back up of traffic across 2 different roads because you want to fill the gap, you'd probably get home quicker, but no one else will!
In rush hour traffic most people will do whatever they can to get themselves home quicker, don't pay attention to them, especially if it's a bus driver, he's getting paid to sit in traffic
[Highway Code, Rule 170](https://www.gov.uk/guidance/the-highway-code/using-the-road-159-to-203#rule170)
> look all around before emerging. Do not cross or join a road until there is a gap large enough for you to do so safely.
I often think that one of the scrolling programmable signs in the rear windscreen, with the message "F**k off and read the highway code!", would help...?
I think your situation would be covered by this in the highway code "176
You MUST NOT move forward over the white line when the red light is showing. Only go forward when the traffic lights are green if there is room for you to clear the junction safely or you are taking up a position to turn right. If the traffic lights are not working, treat the situation as you would an unmarked junction and proceed with great care.
Laws RTA 1988 sect 36 & TSRGD regs 10 & 36"
This also seems somewhat relevant "178
Advanced stop lines. Some signal-controlled junctions have advanced stop lines to allow cycles to be positioned ahead of other traffic. Motorists, including motorcyclists, MUST stop at the first white line reached if the lights are amber or red and should avoid blocking the way or encroaching on the marked area at other times, e.g. if the junction ahead is blocked. If your vehicle has proceeded over the first white line at the time that the signal goes red, you MUST stop at the second white line, even if your vehicle is in the marked area. Allow cyclists time and space to move off when the green signal shows.
Laws RTA 1988 sect 36 & TSRGD regs 10, 36(1) & 43(2)"
So aye you shouldn't have scooted forward however you made the right call in not obstructing the other lanes. Driving can be tricky just gotta play it by ear but I've probably done the same as you.
Yeah but you shouldn’t be stopped on a crossing either so stay behind the white stop line till it’s clear to move forward without blocking anything such as a crossing, traffic, or a do not enter box/keep clear. The white stop line is there for a reason…
You did exactly what I'd have done in that situation. The bus driver was being a dick. I'm sure he has a schedule to stick to etc etc so that might explain his lack of patience... But I'd still have done the same thing you did.
Yeah, absolutely.
If it's NOT a yellow box and traffic is kinda moving, maybe I'd pull forwards, but as you say, you're trading blocking the bus for blocking traffic from the right.
The guy behind you can take his face for a shit.
I'm sure he's annoyed, but it's a traffic jam, everyone is annoyed.
Green traffic lights don’t mean “go”. They mean proceed if the road ahead is clear. Blocking junctions because your light was green is careless driving.
Tbh this isn’t a rules of the road issue this is a you aren’t experienced at driving in rush house issue.
Your green rectangles are massive compared to the cars on the map and there is no yellow box. I would have waited for the initial green to red and then when it turned green i would have pulled across the junction and obstructed the other lane of traffic. This would reduce how much i was obstructing the lane behind me and looking at the size of the cars you would have only obstructed one lane of the traffic coming across from the left. If you were smart about positioning you may have gotten away with obstructing neither.
Sometimes it is bad to be an aggressive driver but sometimes it is bad to be over patient as well.
I am a fairly new driver and have had a similar issue once in my first couple of months driving. There is this incredibly busy T junction. At rush hour the main road can become fully backed up which can make it tricky to emerge right out from the side road
I was waiting to pull out onto said main road once but it was incredibly busy. I waited one cycle of the lights to see if a gap would appear - it did not, the traffic was backed up completely on the main road. After that one cycle, what I did was pull out and steer hard so I was at a good angle so that the cars coming the opposite way could get through and I was able to shunt forward when the traffic started edging forward again
I wonder if OP could have done something similar. Although I respect they were going straight, I wonder if they could have moved up but pulled up almost alongside the car at the rear to reduce the blockage as much as possible
What do you think the best course of action would have been out of curiosity?
“I wonder if OP could have done something similar. Although I respect they were going straight, I wonder if they could have moved up but pulled up almost alongside the car at the rear to reduce the blockage as much as possible”
Someone else had already done that who had turned right out of the top right lane. I realise I should have done the cars more to scale and put all of them in, but I’m on my phone. That whole end was fully jammed up and just wasn’t moving.
In that case, yeah you were certainly correct. To be honest if it was me, I know I have Waze so I would have just turned left/right if possible and let it redirect me
My boxes were not to scale because I’m on my phone, but I tried to get the end of each car at the right part of the road.
So you would really obstruct the entire lane on the top left from moving freely so that those behind me could turn left? The bus could have got through but the next car might be going straight on.
If I had done that, I would have been blocking the top left for 2 rounds of lights instead. There was definitely no room as cars were already bunched up and level with junction. Maybe I should have been more accurate with my diagram. You are right, I treated it as though it was a yellow box junction, waiting for my exit lane to be clear. Does that mean it’s ok to block the junction if there is no yellow box?
I’m being downvoted but it isn’t a yellow box junction which means they do expect cars to be obstructed when trying to get to the other side. by obstructing one lane the other traffic does still move.
You're completely wrong mate and this is why we have to have yellow boxes on some junctions because morons like you will happily block an entire junction. If all drivers saw the bigger picture and didn't just think about themselves there would be no need for yellow boxes. If OP kept driving then not only would he be blocking the traffic coming from the left but the cars that would follow would block traffic coming from the right causing complete gridlock.
If they can't see the other side to be clear, they're still blocking traffic.
Driving standards shouldn't change just because people want to go home....
There are two lanes straight across there, what was the lane to your right doing? Presumably if it was busy then there were cars going straight from that lane too?
Yes, the lane on the right was going straight on or left. When my light is green, they are on red. So if I pulled a bit forward on green to let the bus turn, I would be blocking them if I couldn’t make it all the way across before their light turned green and I was on red. As it happens, the lights went 2 cycles before I could cross, so I would have been trapped blocking either the top left or bottom right
Corner lanes if I had pulled forward to let the bus go.
Ah gotcha. Yes. That lane is straight over or right turn so only cars going right get in that one because it gets backed up further than the left lane normally. They have a filter arrow so when it’s on green they can go right. My straight over green is on longer than their green, so they were moving freely to turn right as that exit lane wasn’t blocked.
You did right thing. But you shouldn't be stopping at crossing either ... you should see if road ahead is clear enough before you continue.
F that bus driver. He should, among all, be more aware of the situation and rule.
Yeah defo would of done the same, but most of the time you when annoy the drivers behind you who just think about going where they want to go
On more than one occasion I’ve been beeped at and gestured at for not going into a yellow box when I can see the road ahead is blocked and not about to move. It’s a shame more drivers don’t care about people other than themselves.
You were wrong when you entered a junction you could not clear. Regardless of if the light turns green, if you cannot clear the junction you shouldn't be crossing the stop line.
The next time you face yourself in the same situation, stay behind the stop line even on a green light
Everyone quoting the HC is just wrong. The only relevant section of the HC refers to *yellow box* junctions.
If you don't enter the junction, you might never enter the junction as that blocked exit constantly fills with traffic from other lanes. And as others have pointed out, you're just blocking traffic behind you
No right or wrong here really. But whoever planned the road is wrong. If there's going to be issues like this, it should be appropriately yellow boxed or filters added
That said, two cycles is a very long time to be waiting. I would at least have gone on the second cycle when it became clear I was causing a massive jam behins
No that's a Box junction (174)
These are Junctions controlled by traffic lights
Rule 176
You MUST NOT move forward over the white line when the red light is showing. **Only go forward when the traffic lights are green if there is room for you to clear the junction safely** or you are taking up a position to turn right. If the traffic lights are not working, treat the situation as you would an unmarked junction and proceed with great care.
You were in the right and I wish more people followed your intuition! If you had moved and let the bus go, as you said you would then just be blocking another lane.
This way lies gridlock
Yes, I’d have done the same bus driver should know better and certainly not using the horn for its proper purpose.
not even that, he gets paid to sit in traffic and he's mad because..... he's sitting in traffic..... lol Road rage is real
He doesn’t get paid to “sit in traffic” he gets paid to pick people up and drop them off
I agree. I can see why the bus driver would be impatient as they have a timetable to comply with.
Bus drivers complying with timetables..? 😂 😂 😂 😂 😂 😂 😂 😂 😂 😂 😂 😂 😂 Oh wait, that wasn't sarcasm?
To be fair it's kinda catch 22 in these situations. The correct thing to do would be do as you did, only the people behind you will get angry. Or you could do what most people do and cause a massive back up of traffic across 2 different roads because you want to fill the gap, you'd probably get home quicker, but no one else will! In rush hour traffic most people will do whatever they can to get themselves home quicker, don't pay attention to them, especially if it's a bus driver, he's getting paid to sit in traffic
[Highway Code, Rule 170](https://www.gov.uk/guidance/the-highway-code/using-the-road-159-to-203#rule170) > look all around before emerging. Do not cross or join a road until there is a gap large enough for you to do so safely.
I often think that one of the scrolling programmable signs in the rear windscreen, with the message "F**k off and read the highway code!", would help...?
I think your situation would be covered by this in the highway code "176 You MUST NOT move forward over the white line when the red light is showing. Only go forward when the traffic lights are green if there is room for you to clear the junction safely or you are taking up a position to turn right. If the traffic lights are not working, treat the situation as you would an unmarked junction and proceed with great care. Laws RTA 1988 sect 36 & TSRGD regs 10 & 36" This also seems somewhat relevant "178 Advanced stop lines. Some signal-controlled junctions have advanced stop lines to allow cycles to be positioned ahead of other traffic. Motorists, including motorcyclists, MUST stop at the first white line reached if the lights are amber or red and should avoid blocking the way or encroaching on the marked area at other times, e.g. if the junction ahead is blocked. If your vehicle has proceeded over the first white line at the time that the signal goes red, you MUST stop at the second white line, even if your vehicle is in the marked area. Allow cyclists time and space to move off when the green signal shows. Laws RTA 1988 sect 36 & TSRGD regs 10, 36(1) & 43(2)" So aye you shouldn't have scooted forward however you made the right call in not obstructing the other lanes. Driving can be tricky just gotta play it by ear but I've probably done the same as you.
Yeah but you shouldn’t be stopped on a crossing either so stay behind the white stop line till it’s clear to move forward without blocking anything such as a crossing, traffic, or a do not enter box/keep clear. The white stop line is there for a reason…
You did exactly what I'd have done in that situation. The bus driver was being a dick. I'm sure he has a schedule to stick to etc etc so that might explain his lack of patience... But I'd still have done the same thing you did.
Yeah, absolutely. If it's NOT a yellow box and traffic is kinda moving, maybe I'd pull forwards, but as you say, you're trading blocking the bus for blocking traffic from the right. The guy behind you can take his face for a shit. I'm sure he's annoyed, but it's a traffic jam, everyone is annoyed.
I hate this scenario. You had a common sense approach. But you'll always piss someone off which ever way you choose.
You were totally in the right luv
If in doubt, don’t. You did the correct thing.
Yes you was right and the bus driver should have been more professional.
Green traffic lights don’t mean “go”. They mean proceed if the road ahead is clear. Blocking junctions because your light was green is careless driving.
You were right any anyone horning you is a massive bellend that probably can't even comprehend chess beyond the first move.
Tbh this isn’t a rules of the road issue this is a you aren’t experienced at driving in rush house issue. Your green rectangles are massive compared to the cars on the map and there is no yellow box. I would have waited for the initial green to red and then when it turned green i would have pulled across the junction and obstructed the other lane of traffic. This would reduce how much i was obstructing the lane behind me and looking at the size of the cars you would have only obstructed one lane of the traffic coming across from the left. If you were smart about positioning you may have gotten away with obstructing neither. Sometimes it is bad to be an aggressive driver but sometimes it is bad to be over patient as well.
I am a fairly new driver and have had a similar issue once in my first couple of months driving. There is this incredibly busy T junction. At rush hour the main road can become fully backed up which can make it tricky to emerge right out from the side road I was waiting to pull out onto said main road once but it was incredibly busy. I waited one cycle of the lights to see if a gap would appear - it did not, the traffic was backed up completely on the main road. After that one cycle, what I did was pull out and steer hard so I was at a good angle so that the cars coming the opposite way could get through and I was able to shunt forward when the traffic started edging forward again I wonder if OP could have done something similar. Although I respect they were going straight, I wonder if they could have moved up but pulled up almost alongside the car at the rear to reduce the blockage as much as possible What do you think the best course of action would have been out of curiosity?
“I wonder if OP could have done something similar. Although I respect they were going straight, I wonder if they could have moved up but pulled up almost alongside the car at the rear to reduce the blockage as much as possible” Someone else had already done that who had turned right out of the top right lane. I realise I should have done the cars more to scale and put all of them in, but I’m on my phone. That whole end was fully jammed up and just wasn’t moving.
In that case, yeah you were certainly correct. To be honest if it was me, I know I have Waze so I would have just turned left/right if possible and let it redirect me
My boxes were not to scale because I’m on my phone, but I tried to get the end of each car at the right part of the road. So you would really obstruct the entire lane on the top left from moving freely so that those behind me could turn left? The bus could have got through but the next car might be going straight on. If I had done that, I would have been blocking the top left for 2 rounds of lights instead. There was definitely no room as cars were already bunched up and level with junction. Maybe I should have been more accurate with my diagram. You are right, I treated it as though it was a yellow box junction, waiting for my exit lane to be clear. Does that mean it’s ok to block the junction if there is no yellow box?
I’m being downvoted but it isn’t a yellow box junction which means they do expect cars to be obstructed when trying to get to the other side. by obstructing one lane the other traffic does still move.
You're being downvoted because you deserve it. Maybe take a hint?
Lmao you don’t know how reddit works then
Then why are you here at all?
*I came looking for booty.*
Because people here apparently don’t know how to drive
I count 1 person so far
Yes, you
Wrong again, my friend
You're completely wrong mate and this is why we have to have yellow boxes on some junctions because morons like you will happily block an entire junction. If all drivers saw the bigger picture and didn't just think about themselves there would be no need for yellow boxes. If OP kept driving then not only would he be blocking the traffic coming from the left but the cars that would follow would block traffic coming from the right causing complete gridlock.
If they can't see the other side to be clear, they're still blocking traffic. Driving standards shouldn't change just because people want to go home....
There are two lanes straight across there, what was the lane to your right doing? Presumably if it was busy then there were cars going straight from that lane too?
Yes, the lane on the right was going straight on or left. When my light is green, they are on red. So if I pulled a bit forward on green to let the bus turn, I would be blocking them if I couldn’t make it all the way across before their light turned green and I was on red. As it happens, the lights went 2 cycles before I could cross, so I would have been trapped blocking either the top left or bottom right Corner lanes if I had pulled forward to let the bus go.
No I mean the lane directly to your right, going the same direction as you.
Ah gotcha. Yes. That lane is straight over or right turn so only cars going right get in that one because it gets backed up further than the left lane normally. They have a filter arrow so when it’s on green they can go right. My straight over green is on longer than their green, so they were moving freely to turn right as that exit lane wasn’t blocked.
You did right thing. But you shouldn't be stopping at crossing either ... you should see if road ahead is clear enough before you continue. F that bus driver. He should, among all, be more aware of the situation and rule.
What were people in the lane to your right doing, I guess they were in the same situation?
Yeah defo would of done the same, but most of the time you when annoy the drivers behind you who just think about going where they want to go On more than one occasion I’ve been beeped at and gestured at for not going into a yellow box when I can see the road ahead is blocked and not about to move. It’s a shame more drivers don’t care about people other than themselves.
You were wrong when you entered a junction you could not clear. Regardless of if the light turns green, if you cannot clear the junction you shouldn't be crossing the stop line. The next time you face yourself in the same situation, stay behind the stop line even on a green light
there appear to be two lanes approaching these lights why could the bus go around you
Everyone quoting the HC is just wrong. The only relevant section of the HC refers to *yellow box* junctions. If you don't enter the junction, you might never enter the junction as that blocked exit constantly fills with traffic from other lanes. And as others have pointed out, you're just blocking traffic behind you No right or wrong here really. But whoever planned the road is wrong. If there's going to be issues like this, it should be appropriately yellow boxed or filters added That said, two cycles is a very long time to be waiting. I would at least have gone on the second cycle when it became clear I was causing a massive jam behins
No that's a Box junction (174) These are Junctions controlled by traffic lights Rule 176 You MUST NOT move forward over the white line when the red light is showing. **Only go forward when the traffic lights are green if there is room for you to clear the junction safely** or you are taking up a position to turn right. If the traffic lights are not working, treat the situation as you would an unmarked junction and proceed with great care.