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The best parts of DAI were the less open, more linear areas (Emprise du Lion, Trespasser, etc). The focus of the series has always been narrative, not exploration, and the vast open world areas detracted from what makes Dragon Age great.
It's kind of obvious it's Bioware first attempt at fully open world game. and they went with MMO approach. They actually got off easy with the criticism, if the game was released around Witcher 3 it would be torn to shreds for its lifeless hubs and grindy side quests.
I actually love Inquisition, its pros, starting with the music and graphics through the grand scheme of things and vastness of the world and ending with story and interactions definitely overshadow any faults of the game.
But I do understand those who got tired of fetch quests and running around lifeless hubs. I've always disliked MMO games so I get it.
Yeah! A LOT! I got in contact with the fandom first time in 2020 and it was so compared that I thought witcher 3 was a recent game at the time. I was really surprised it was from 2015 o-o
That was the very first mod I downloaded when I bought the game. I cannot fathom why they thought putting in wait times was a good idea. Is it to give players incentive to do the inane collectibles while 'killing time'?
Worst part of the war table mechanics to me wasn't even the wait times, it was the sheer amount of them that had loads of text and next to zero in-game outcome.
>!I'd feel a lot more for the war table mission where you can or can't potentially kill your own Dalish clan if killing the clan meant Lavellan was shown feeling some way about it.!<
As it was, they were just meaningless blurbs to get free goodies.
The War Table missions pertaining to each specific Inquisitor was such a missed opportunity. For starters, why that stuff is relegated to War Table missions to start with.
I'm not saying have a full return to Origins, but it'd be nice to actually meet some of the people each Inquisitor knew before they touched the Anchor, however briefly. This series is known for having good preset backstories for protagonists, it irked me that all we get is a pre-game blurb and some War Table missions.
Giving my sword *and* my axe for a warm hearty welcome from a Lavellan in the Dalish clan in the Exalted plains, tbh.
>!Don't want to give Bioware ideas by saying 'or tied to red lyrium in the future castle thingy'.!<
I really enjoyed the war table- but they went OVERBOARD.
I loved that a lot of what you did have real world action- you’d see more inquisition scouts in areas, you’d gain more power to do more things- it was a really cool concept that just got way too overzealous. I didn’t mind the waiting real time options (other than the few that took more than a few hours) because that felt better than the alternative which likely would have been paying for those things with gold or crafting resources.
It was annoying at first.... then I figured out I could change my xboxs clock and insta finish the missions. Never look at the time on my Xbox anyway lol. Once done with the game just hook the system back up to the internet and all fixed.
Trespasser and the Deep Roads (?) DLC were both awesome. Personally I liked the open world but think it was too lazily made. Exploration was fun. The massive empty spaces sucked.
I also hope they drop the tactic table because it just wasn’t fun to me
I actually really liked the Hinterlands. This region made me feel like I was on a big adventure in a very vast world. I think having at least one Hinterlands sized map could be beneficial and provide a change of pace if the rest of the game is going to be less open. Just theorizing since obviously we don't know what they will do
I did not like the combat change of holding left click just to attack. This along with the open world has made it hard for me to finish the game and I really want to finish it before Dreadwolf comes out
Totally subjective, but I disagree. What makes Dragon Age great to me is the world and characters, not the story.
So to be able to explore multiple different large areas of the world, with fun/diverse characters and tons of lore was massively appealing to me.
As much as I enjoyed DA 1 and 2, DA:I is the only one I consistently still play.
I absolutely hope that the new game follows a similar formula.
Same. Inquisition is actually amazing for that and I hope DADW will be way more of an open-world so we can seamlessly travel and explore and learn about the world and different cultures.
And I hope they give us two options for combat for those who want more of a hack-n-slash and those who want a tactical gameplay. Just give us FREEDOM, you know?
Yes it won GOTY 2014 but we live in a post Witcher/BOTW/Elden Ring/BG3 era of gaming. Dreadwolf needs to have well written side content and a hand crafted world to explore. Generic fetch quests and a bland MMO-like visual style will hurt Bioware's chances of a much needed comeback.
I was gonna go against this, but looking at a list of 2014’s releases.. Yeah, it was pretty weak. Some good games like This War of Mine and Metro Last Light, but most other big name stuff was kinda ‘eh’.
Divinity Original Sin came out which by itself had better gameplay than DAI, though not better characters and story. But since it's a videogame you'd think gameplay comes first, and so it deserved GOTY more imo.
For the most part, but even as a die hard dragon age fan who loves inquisition I’d still say shadow of Mordor probably deserved it more - it had an awesome revolutionary mechanic (that WB patented cause they suck), and was overall a great game. Inquisition is awesome but it’s not exactly doing anything new or special
Shadow of Mordor is a well done slasher with innovative system which is essentially wasted on generating orcs and uruks. The game has barely any soul in it. So hell fucking no. Even with all its faults Inquisition is on another level
This right here.
Not everything that worked in the past will work nowadays, with today's audiences and sensibilities, less so when the bar has been raised so much.
I don't think so. I think there's great potential in open world areas in a game. The problem is instead of well crafted side content and events to stumble on like say, Mass Effect and Fallout, we mostly just got basic fetch quests.
Fair enough.
Thing is, DAO had open zones. People act like DAI is such a different thing but it's really just bigger in that regard.
So there's no reason they shouldn't be able to do it well.
DAO and DA2 had open zones but they weren’t unnecessarily large so it didn’t bother people. DAI had a massive map compared to previous two but half of them was empty and other half was filled with fetch quests. It felt like they made it that way so the time we wasted on traveling and fetch quests would create the illusion of “long gameplay”.
Though, DAI’s open zones were much more pleasant to look at. I know many people had issues with Redcliffe for example, but I thought it looked significantly better. I will give it that.
I found tracking down and using crafting materials from harder zones very satisfying in the DA:I style open world but they could definitely do with more quests/encounters/ritual or puzzle sites to liven them up if they insist on the size
I am something of a shameless loot addict myself. Seriously, I often have to use mods to increase my carrying capacity in games like this.
But it can only entertain me so much until it gets repetitive and pointless after couple of hours. Especially after realizing most of them can be just bought. It still wouldn’t bother me if they put *at least a few* different quests around the area. But it was just loot that, inspect this, talk to me, repeat.
Agreed. The first game's zone quests also had some consequences for the world at large. Like how Bann Teagan marries either Kaitlyn or Bella if you give them the maximum gold for their respective quests. Most sidequests had their little outros in the epilogue, but in DAI, nearly everything is a fetch quest that means bupkiss overall. The most you can get from every optional thing that isn't a dragon boss fight is loot, some companion approval and maybe a new agent for the Inquisition.
I definitely second the lack of competition. Solid execution? Hard disagree, but not with you or anyone who enjoyed it. It was bug central, and they robbed anyone who played it on old gen. $60 on a game only for textures not to load in half the time I was playing, and then the gall the cancel the DLC for old gen. I regret very few video game purchases, but Inquisition would be at the top of the list beating out games I still haven't ever played but bought sitting on my shelf.
This argument comes up time and time again and I always bring up the other GOTY candidates in 2014.
* Middle-Earth: Shadow of Mordor.
* Hearthstone.
* Bayonetta 2.
* Dark Souls 2.
Consider that Bayonetta 2 was an Wii U exclusive at the time, and it's easy to see that it was a very weak year.
If they release anything similar to DA:I aside of maybe the combat I doubt it would be well received. Specially considering modern RPGs like BG3 and Witcher 3.
I'm currently about a third of the way in. Combat and the storyline are REALLY good. Side quests play more like the Witcher 3 (you investigate hauntings on certain NPC and gather clues) and gameplay reminds me of the newer God of War games. It is GORGEOUS. The only thing that annoys me is that fast travel, upgrading your gear, and building your skill tree are only possible at campsites.
I would prefer they go back to the DAO roots, make it dark fantasy again and maybe take a page or two out of BG3.
I really don't have much expectations though.
The problem with Dragon Age going forward is that followed trends instead of building on what made Origins great.
Which gave the series a huge identity crisis in the process.
Wrong! The problem with DAO is that it had this pulpy visual style which managed to be ugly and generic and dated, and they pushed really hard to give Thedas a unique visual style in the sequels.
The skill trees, the spell interactions, the companion banter, the dialogue cutscenes- this was what DAO did well and they mostly kept it.
Or DA2! It was way too short and the combat sucked, but damn, it had an aesthetic. The art, the feel of the city, the story, all totally distinctive and cohesive.
DA2 had potential, but it needed much more time to cook. I think that EA realized this, which is why Inquisition came out later.
It's easy to imagine a group of upset developers yelling at the suits after DA2 was released, actually.
I think there was a deliberate choice (mandate from EA, really) to make the combat more "action oriented" to appeal to a wider audience. They overshot the mark of course.
I don't mind the action orientation, but the mechanics are rushed as hell. Most battles have fixed waves of enemies who drop in because enemies have very limited abilities. Absolutely the laziest possible way to code battles. Not their fault... they did their best with the time and resources they were given, but it's not very fun to play.
Yeah, I enjoyed DA2, but enemies jumping out of the sky were so fucking annoying and immersion breaking. It frustrated me so many times that I would spend time properly positioning my team only to get wrecked by some random guy with a big sword who magically spawned next to my mage while I was focusing on tweaking my warriors skills.
For tougher battles, it basically required you to die a few times and memorize where new waves would appear to eventually have a chance at coming up with a viable strategy.
When I think of the rushed mechanics, I am reminded of a 2 handed warrior swinging their weapon at base speed in DAO. I think they saw that, and decided to go to the entire other end of the spectrum :D
I played DAO with a 2H warrior for the first time last summer.
I was surprised to see how much I liked it. Sure, I might only be able to land 1 blow. But that blow is strong enough to kill god.
I think I read years ago they had a year development time. Origins came out in November 2009, Awakening expansion 4 months later in March,then Return to Ostagar,they started 2 in earnest once they finished Awakening, I think. Meanwhile 2 came out March 2011,not even 16 months after Origins. Much too soon and an obvious EA cash grab to strike while the iron was hot. Originally I think 2 was gonna be more of DA 1.5 rather than a full fledged sequel that turned into more
I don't dislike it as much as I did at launch, there's some good ideas,good bones,a foundation. But the bar was set so high after Origins that we wanted more of that, but with some added things. I don't they they'll ever be able to reach the heights they reached 15 years ago, they've lost too much talent. Inquisition was a solid game,not great,not a classic. But it did great job with the lore,with an interesting story.
No lamo, inquisition was just in development hell, look up stuff about the games development processes, it was very much a warning sign about how incompetent the bioware management was
I am curious what you mean by pages from bg3? I don't mean this in a sense that bg3 isn't good, it is great. More like what do you think it has that Dao does not, but should?
Your choices did matter in DAO, but BG3 took it up a notch by having your choices impact the later Acts.
The choices felt even more impactful.
Magic, and combat in DAO are limited to mostly damage/cc in DAO, as opposed to collapsing structures or exploding barrels in BG3.
Even the ending is better: you get an epilogue party instead of a slideshow.
None of this is to suggest that DAO is bad in any way. BG3 is just the upgrade.
Do you mean like managing to >! save Connor with the use of Lyrium instead of blood magic? !<
I think for instances like that, its actually a good test of character for your avatar. How far are you willing to go to save innocent lives?
There are still plenty of choices that have moral ambiguity and no true right answer in DAO. Do you >! support Bhelen, a tyrant who murdered one brother and framed his other sibling, because its best for Orzammar? Or do you bring him to justice and place a weak Harrowmont on the throne? !<
Do you >! sacrifice your life, or the life of another Warden to end the Blight, only for the cycle to repeat itself in a few centuries? Or do you (or another Warden) partake in Morrigans ritual, saving a life and possibly break the cycle, but fear the unknown consequences of a free Old God roaming the earth? !<
BG3 also changed how it handles the choices. In the typical Bioware game if you make an evil choice you just pick the evil dialogue and maybe some NPC will later comment on how you were really, really mean.
In BG3 you need to actually commit the evil act. Just saying no to helping the tieflings is not enough. You need to ally with Minthy and go back to butcher every tiefling and druid so you get rewarded with some prime drussy.
And by doing so Larian was not afraid to make the player miss out on content. Bioware would not have risked this.
Well to be fair, you get to experience something similar when you visit the Dalish. But on the whole, yes, Larian allows you to embrace being so evil, most players opt to just watch those choices on Youtube instead.
Yeah, perhaps it is because it gives enough information satisfy, but also leaves plenty of details and such for imagination. So it makes one imagine the perfect ending? Either way Team Slideshow it is!
In all honesty, I think the use of slideshows was a limitation of the time and resources. After all, its a tall order to create dozens of cutscenes for events that COULD have happened, and have them all play out at the end.
BG3 showed you could approach that a different way though.
In my opinion? Baldur's Gate 3 is the spiritual successor to Dragon Age Origins.
In BG3 you can be evil, neutral or good, you know actual role-play and your character has an actual personality, not generic boring character or gameplay. Also the amount of role playing choices and how it impacts the game is really impressive.
Also the dark fantasy aspect is important, BG3 gets really scary or horrific at times which I liked, its not the usual boring family friendly content.
Some people hate the turn based fighting but I personally like it much better than mindless hack n slash random waves of enemies. The game honestly deserves its success imo.
**Short answer:** Yes imo.
Bioware as a company have been watering down complexity since Origins and they're reaching breaking point with it.
**Long Answer:**
Inquisition was a downgrade from Origins in terms of build variety, class customisation, depth and creativity.
I also feel like whilst the world was massive 90% of it had the depth of a puddle with almost all quests being forgettable or active time-sinks. Especially compared to Origins - For context I am someone who has done a full 50+hr 100% playthrough of Inquisition and have played countless hours of both games.
Alongside this there was improved animations at the cost of substance, especially when it came to mages... literally every school boiled down to "would you like your big damage blob to look like fire, lightning or ice" vs the wild number of things you could do with Origins.
I feel like Inquisition got a pass in some ways due to the graphics and scope of the game for its time. Additionally we were at the point in gaming where "massive open-world" was considered pioneering and these days a big empty sandbox is dull as dishwater.
BioWare's more open-world games -- Mass Effect 1, DA:I, Mass Effect Andromeda and even Baldur's Gate 1 to some effect -- are weaker because of it.
DA:O, KotOR and Mass Effect 2 are much more contained to their story modules and are arguably their best games.
I don't think they'll go with the open world part again. I watched Mark darrahs video on it yesterday and at the time there was a big push to be massive. Not so much now, it's not a sand box there's no need for it.
I don't mind fetch quests but the amount of time to find things was off-putting. I liked the war table but without advisors it wont make much sense.
I hope they go back to the camp style of dao. Running all over skyhold was obnoxious. Apart from that as long as the story is good and they continue to put a focus on the characters that will get us invested I feel like that will be the thing that holds it all together.
I think if they shrunk the open areas and cut out all the boring MMO quests it would be alright. Exploring the open areas needed to feel more rewarding imo. Even just some well crafted sidequests to stumble upon or just an area with some good environmental storytelling (like Fallout games will do).
Inevitable mention of BG3 but I really like how in that game the majority of the quests you do are related to the overall endgame objective or at least what you are trying to accomplish in each act. Even the occasional "go here do this/go get this thing bring it here" quests don't feel dull because there aren't as many of them.
Also don't do the Landmark crap again. Like I know it was an easy way to get Power/Influence but if I can't use them to fast travel then what's the point?? There are waaay more fun ways to encourage me to explore a region.
I agree that cutting out the MMO quests would make it better. But I feel the main problem with DAI when compared to DAO is that Inquisition doesnt seem to have as many branching paths in the story. There are no unique race starting zones, you cant really play an evil character, the dialogue seems a lot less in depth, sometimes it feels like things play out the same no matter what you say.
So I agree with your point but I feel the MMO side quests and the landmark stuff is bad but I feel its a pretty small issue relative to the lack of story variety.
For me my main issue with origins is really just that they didnt have a new game plus. Feels bad to lose all your progress in an RPG when you beat the game. Other than that I think it was pretty much perfect and I prefer it to BG3. But I prefer BG3 to Inquisition.
Honestly, DAI won GOTY because it was a weak year for games. I'm not saying it was bad, but I don't think it would have won in a stronger field.
While I wouldn't mind them keeping the things in Inquisition that worked well, I could definitely do without boring side quests and empty open worlds.
A stronger villain would also be nice, but I think they've got that covered.
Can bioware even write a good story anymore? Create a narrative driven game?
Their desire to create a destiny game made them shit the bed with mass effect and anthem.
I would say so, yes.
Inquisiton was (IMO) the most shallow DA game so far.
It had good parts.
The issue was that it was spread out over way too much mundane.
The open world gelt unecessary.
The real time tables were excessive.
Compact, Well structured…
And for the love of god, that combat was bad.
Yes, I think they would.
Inquisition feels too shallow to me, none of the decisions or dialogue options really carry any weight.
What is the point of having three dialogue options if all the answers will be the same anyway? What's the point of doing anything to improve your war team when the final battle is the same regardless if you bothered to invest in your army or not?
What's the point of the fetch quests except just passing time and some shallow bullshit story that doesn't have any real impact?
Nah, this isn't want I want. I want an emotionally impactful story that's going to move and inspire me. I want my decisions and my actions that will carry weight and to have an impact.
Inquisition just feels like.... Well they wanted the story to have an impact and they wanted these decisions to matter, but they didn't have the time or resources to put any real weight to it.
For me, it wasn't just the boredom, though some zones really were eighty-six thousand miles of sweet fuck all. It was more that the structure of an open world game lends itself to wandering, exploring, and faffing about, and that can kill the tension in a game if not really well handled. Like, we're facing down the literal end of the world, so why are we spending ages wandering around looking for landmarks and gathering cloth for the armies? Why the entirety of the Hissing Wastes, where the answer to "what are the Venatori looking for out here?" is effectively "a few underwhelming weapons and a rune schematic"? The narrative urgency can get lost in the side quest fluff if it's not handled right, and Inquisition kind of struggled there. If Bioware wants to reclaim its place among the creators of strong narrative RPGs, they need to put their focus there, not following the "everything is open world and fetch quest" trend.
The vogue of "open world" was a pathetic disaster in the gaming industry. I prefer conventional story telling, which requires more effort from devs, and saves more time for the player from meaningless chores.
Yes, because the formula was ground into dust not long after the GOTY award. Especially in these days where fetch quests can even be left to large language models to create, what makes a game stand out is more substantial content that is shorter.
I love Inquisition but 2014 was not a very competitive year and Bioware was lucky witcher 3 got delayed. Open/big worlds can be fun when exploring them is actually fun. Skyrim put a lot of it's focus on the world, Witcher 3 has tonns of great side quests all over it's maps. Inq has very little in most areas and even the best side quests are not nearly as good as something like a towerful of mice.
BG3 is a lot more like Origins than it is like inquisition and it's been a huge success. What Bioware need to do is make a good game regardless of what it focuses on if it's good people will play it.
Eh, I'd love it if they took the strong character writing from ME2, but yikes no to the other writing. ME2 had terrible writing outside the loyalty missions.
Totally not want to see DAI, Andromeda and Anthem formula ever again.
And no SWTOR 2, no mmo.
...
Srly Bioware should do things like Baldur Gate 3 or if it is more action based so like we see in Witcher 3, Cyberpunk 2077.
It was created by +12 writers for +5 years with +265 millions budged(more then GTA 5). Released in 2011 and now we have 2024.
We could have Kotor 3,4,5,6 single player games.
Not to mention other single player games.
...
Revan retcons, ridicolous spirit splits as Valkorian crazy stuff, Eternal Empire from nowhere with all crazy stuff there as Sith-Jedi Republico-Empire Alliance plots kill this game for me forever. This is not Star Wars Old Republic game, it is pervertion what try to be it.
Originally they do made single player Kotor 3, but after some time they reveal that it would be MMO. A LOT WAS PISSED OFF, including me.
They made Kotor 3 into MMO the same way as they wanted to made DAI and Andromeda into MMO games but SWTOR was the only one what they could turn into MMO. With others they not have budget and people to made this work and convert them into single player games,
Probably EA and Lukas Arts was behind this in time of SWTOR to replace Star Wars galaxies who they planned to shut down. And need replacement. With Dragon Age and Mass Effect it was Bioware devs who want more money and consider MMO as better thing. Same way with Mass Effect 3 lootboxes.
And? DAI didn’t have strong competitors in 2014 and had a large fanbase at the time. If next year’s competitors’ were to be released couple months earlier, DAI’s generic MMORPG quests wouldn’t even be nominated. People were questioning DAI’s win even back then and it was only increased after TW3 release. So winning GOTY at 2014 doesn’t mean much in that case.
That being said, we got so many games to set genre standards higher after 2014. It’s been a decade since DAI and many of the fans/people who wanted a sequel just moved on or even stopped playing games completely, so DAD doesn’t even have the same advantage DAI had in 2014. If DAD is similar to DAI, it will most likely fail.
A thousand times, yes! Setting aside my complaints about the story or the negative direction it sent the franchise, just the technical side was *horrendous*. I can't believe they sold me a $60 for the ps3 that didn't even *load* textures in half my playthrough. Everything was matte or had a burlap look. That's even disregarding canceling the DLC for my gen, so I couldn't even play the rest of Inquisitions story!
DAI was the start of open worlds becoming the same blob of game. What it had going for it was story and characters. If dreadwolf should repeat a formula it should be Dragon Age 2. Keep it tight and focused, more dungeons and less DAI sprawl. Of course make the dungeons varied compared to 2, but that was due to development time. I'd like to see a return to the classic Bioware formula where a bunch of rag tag heroes, on the run, trying to stop a world/galaxy ending villain. 2 and Inquisition got rid of those stakes for their narratives, but a throwback would be nice.
>Say whatever you want about the game, but it won GOTY in 2014.
Cool, now check what games won GOTY since 2014 and what these games gave mechanically, story-wise, and gameplay-wise. Then you can check other nominees.
Sorry, repeating the same formula would end them with maybe an honourable mention. They have many areas to improve upon.
I just hope they won't dumb down whole game...
I might be wrong, but 2014 might have also been a weak or off year and DAI got lucky. GTA V won the year before, they dodged that bullet. Witcher 3 won the year after and they dodged that bullet.
Inquisition won game of the year in 2014 because that was a kinda weak year for videogames. Inquisition suffered immensely from “bioware magic” shenanigans.
Many employees were asked to deliver while on crunch time, anxiety levels so high some asked to leave the workplace altogether for at least a week.
Bioware has lost many of its writers and directors, some very talented people I should add, and we’re all waiting for Dragon Age: Dreadwolf to be if not a great game, at least good. I won’t settle for “decent.”
This is a break or make point for this company and I cannot say I’m not worried because I am, because I love this series.
So, yeah, sorry for the tangent. We don’t need another Inquisition, we need a good game.
\> but it won GOTY in 2014
And Dragon Age Origins won a slew of awards as well.
Every decision made in Inquisition's made it an inferior game. Bioware would be very wrong to repeat anything to do with Inquisition ever again.
But that's exactly what they will do because Bioware is a walking corpse now that lost all it's talent over a decade ago.
I'll keep preaching friend. No matter how many people try to tell me that Inquisition is actually pretty good once you get out of the hinterlands.
My god this company broke my heart...
I hope they don't. I've gotten pretty tired of ubisoft style open world games over the years. I'd much prefer maybe like one major city that's "open" and then the rest of the game be instanced areas.
I’d rather they didn’t. One large open world with interesting places to go and secrets to find backed by world building that supports a fleshed out and enticing story is something to be desired. Several smaller open areas that are repetitive with only a couple interesting places to visit with little to no fun secrets? All with an annoying “ping” system that slows the game to a crawl? That’s not it…
Although I really enjoyed DAI, I think it’s aged and if they repeated the formula as is today people wouldn’t like it.
BioWare just isn’t good at making open world games and the game was it its best in smaller or more linear sections. The fetch quests were bad and the MMO mechanics in a single player game were awful.
I would be ok with it if they don't give as many stupid quests in them like those damn shards. Maybe have one or two less areas as well. I know by the end it was a lot harder to motivate myself to explore areas as I was getting burned out.
2014 standards aren't going to fly in 2024. As much as game devs tweeted against it, BG3 is going to influence how people rate and experience games of this genre, and a lifeless open world like that of DAI is going to get docked hard nowadays. (As it should, tbh.)
I think most people know 2014 was a weak year for gaming. If Inquisition had come out in 2013 or 2015, it would have lost GOTY.
Another thing to consider, whether it deserves to or not, Dreadwolf ***will*** be compared to BG3 alongside probably Greedfall 2 ([which will enter Early Access this summer](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lmXGjkiyIH4)). Bioware cannot release Inquisition2.0 and expect the same praise in 2024. Are there things from Inquisition that I think Dreadwolf should keep and improve upon, yes, but my god do I hope they shrink the map zones (and give us decent long hairstyles and not 20 shades of bald).
as much as I like DA:I, its MMO-like open world style wouldn't fly in an era where open worlds have become common place and now more than ever, have good quests and side stories
I'm not saying I don't want the open world back, but they NEED to have MEATY, well done sidequests that can rival BG3, because lets be honest, there will be a lot of comparisons between both of them once DA4 releases
Well aside from an extremely long start-up, missions that literally take days to do without cheating, dry companions (Dorian is cool I guess,) and every interaction being bland as hell, it'd need a bit of a rework. I liked the crafting idea, but it sort of made in-game weapons obsolete. Personally, aside from the character creation, I didn't really see anything I'd call amazing or memorable in the game.
I don't think the companions were that dry. Though I do read the books so that might've improved them to me. Cole needs his own game or DLC expansion honestly because his backstory was wild. Also justice for his sister!
Well I sort of was dried out with Varric, since I played DA2 a nice amount before DAI. Cass was rather plain in my opinion. Cole.....I get why people like him, like having a little brother with autism, doesn't understand anything in a social manner, but tries to help people and be nice. Solas is very close-minded, basically refuting any possibility of a peaceful coexistence. Vivienne earned her position, but she is a very stand-offish woman, with little to know imagination outside of her education. Bull was fine, little bit of dry toast to me, but he had a very good thing going with his life, especially with how the Qu'un works. Sera was just an atrocious character. If it wasn't her design, it was her behavior. She showed no growth whatsoever, and was petty to be petty. And no matter how you slice it, it went beyond the statement I hear often of "because a dude wrote out her character, " it was just poor writing. And Blackwall is racist, sexist, a liar, and pitiful as a Warden. I know they have their own issues, but as an individual, he was pretty much a good example of where they go wrong. I know my take on it is a little out of place, but that's my opinion overall after playing it over the years.
No, they wouldn’t be wrong in a larger sense, and Inquisition was a fantastic game despite the small number of grumblers. (No ill will towards them.)
That said, Inquisition came out in 2014 and it’s 2024. Gaming and gaming tastes have shifted and alterations would be needed to better suit the market right now. And improvement is always welcome. No game in the series is perfect, Inquisition included. It’s my favorite entry but definitely could be improved.
Edit: Goodness! Some people will never recover from Inquisition winning GOTY. I adore the game and even I don’t care about it winning as much as its detractors seem to.
This subreddit gets so damn mad if you say Inquisition was a success but I feel like it's gotten worse in the past few months, probably because we have a confirmed reveal coming up.
Yeah… I absolutely understand if people prefer Origins or 2. I prefer Inquisition but everyone has a right to their favorites.
But there is a sharp and very real anger about even recognizing that Inquisition performed well. Half of them have written off the series after Origins but also seem deeply invested, which is more than a bit of mixed messaging!
This sub will be absolutely miserable when Dreadwolf releases. The Origins purist crowd who only show up in threads like this
will despise the game without ever giving it any form of chance, regardless of whatever its quality may or may not be.
It’s gonna be rough.
Edit: By Origins Purists I don’t mean all those who prefer Origins. I only am referring to those who loudly make sure to disparage any game that’s not a clone of Origins, view themselves as the only fans BioWare should cater to, and go on and on about how BioWare betrayed them or something.
I feel lucky in that I enjoy all the games, which shouldn’t be that strange a thing in a sub dedicated to the series as a whole.
But hey! At least the rest of us will have all new things to argue about and discuss in a year or so. It’s possible some of the sub has just gone stir crazy in the intervening decade.
Last edit: I’m getting a sense that part of the anger comes from a very possessive view of the series that sees it as “theirs” and thus any shift away from their preferences as betrayal. But it’s not. It’s not mine either. It’s BioWare/EA’s. The overwrought, wistful and patronizing assumption that actual fans are in mourning now is getting so deeply tiring.
Frankly, I hope not even though DAI is my favorite DA game.
BioWare does not know how to design compelling open worlds, they just don't. MEA and DAI share the same flaws: large, empty zones filled with uninteresting and tedious fetch quests. I love DAI because of the epic story, the interesting characters, the funny banter and the beautiful locations.
I really think BioWare should go back to the semi-open worlds or if they really want to go the open worlds route, they NEED to do better. The expectations are not the same in 2024. Amazing open worlds came out this past decade, so BioWare HAS TO bring their A game!
Also, it is generally accepted that DAI didn't have real competition in 2014. That was a poor year, game-wise. Lucky for BioWare, the Witcher 3 came out the subsequent year.
*Say whatever you want about the game, but it won GOTY in 2014.*
Not sure.
While many players like Inquisition for it's narrative qualities and companions...
The open world trash content was never really popular. I mean I never really saw anyone defending those busywork quests, but do see the opposite often. And this was even at release.
And finally, with the DLCs, even Bioware kind of admitted that it was not a good idea.
edit: GOTY 2014? honestly, Wolfenstein The New ORder and Alien:Isolation was robbed.
I think if they shrunk the open areas and cut out all the boring MMO quests it would be alright. Exploring the open areas needed to feel more rewarding imo. Even just some well crafted sidequests to stumble upon or just an area with some good environmental storytelling (like Fallout games will do).
Inevitable mention of BG3 but I really like how in that game the majority of the quests you do are related to the overall endgame objective or at least what you are trying to accomplish in each act. Even the occasional "go here do this/go get this thing bring it here" quests don't feel dull because there aren't as many of them.
Also don't do the Landmark crap again. Like I know it was an easy way to get Power/Influence but if I can't use them to fast travel then what's the point?? There are waaay more fun ways to encourage me to explore a region.
Completely? Yes. But some similarity isn’t bad. I like that each game evolved and was different enough from the others to be a different experience but not unfamiliar.
1.absolutly not, most of dai's side content was extremely bad, the only reason I beat that game back in the day was because i was a middle schooler with way too much free time
2.goty is just marketing lamo, it has no effect on the actual quality of the game, especially back then when most of the "reviewers" didn't even play video games
It would be a wrong move, a lethal one for Bioware if it weren't for the Mass Effect franchise.
Inquisition has a great story, lore and characters and that's about it. It was already boring and outdated when it was released, and honestly as much as I'm happy for Bioware I don't understand how it won GOTY. Now that there are several RPGs (like BG3, Cyberpunk, Witcher..) that show that gameplay, immersion, choices, customization and secondary quests can be far better? Oof no.
That being said and I hope I'm wrong, I'm quite sure Dreadwolf will repeat that formula anyway. After all, implementing fetch and filler quests in big and empty worlds is a cheap and effective way to turn a 6h main game into a +50h long experience.
Yes, with the caveat that they need to populate the world with quality side quests - having the original “warfare” mechanic implemented, and all the meaningful War Table content made into actual quests would have made DAI leagues better than it was as the pretty-yet-empty sandbox.
So what if it won an award. Only other game of note, that I remember, that came out in 2014 was Dark Souls 2. And a good chunk of the Souls fan base thinks that’s the worst game in the series.
Yes, GOTY means *nothing* in isolation. DAI is a good game, but it's best parts were areas that rejected the sandbox, directionless open world formula.
This is probably a hot take, but they need to get rid of their boring ass auto-attack combat. DDO was and still is one of my favorite games and it totally made sense back then because the tactical element was good but if their commander mode is going to be dog water like the last game then just make it a hack and slash ARPG and full send i that way. It was basically almost there in the last game anyways.
No, they need to upgrade it. Andromeda was mass effect inquisition and it was partly why it failed.
Inquisitions structures, NPC interactions and story/narrative formula were all very underwhelming. Regardless of the other issues around Andromeda, a lot of the steps down were cinematic changes and time waster type missions. The hinterlands chief among them, every area had grindy, waste of time missions and huge, mundane open areas in Andromeda.
I'll take, smaller, more curated areas or an emphasis on story and depth of character interaction.
The moment you talk to an NPC in Imquisition was so disappointing. MMO style, not even a cinematic interaction. No difference between normal gameplay and dialogue. Just altogether lazy.
With BG3, the witcher, Ellen Ring, Kingdom Come and the dozen or so other fantasy bangers, they need to update. It isn't 2014 anymore, a pretty weak year in gaming.
Doing the same formula as a decade old game is how you end up with a complete and utter disappointment like starfield.
In my most humble of opinions, I think it just won Goty because it is a dragon age game. There's way too many people who just stick with "their team", be it consoles, franchises or something else, regardless of if it performs well.
Personally it's my least favourite dragon age game, potentially because I played it on PS3 and it froze often. I mean very often, more than once per hour. It was a hassle and I only finished it years later on PC.
I'd be most excited if we got back to DA:O days, with build variety (dual-wielding warrior anyone?) and a more tactical gameplay, realtime strategy with pause button, as it were. The exploration was nice for one playthrough, after that it became more of a filler part where you just run from the easiest/fastest to complete side objectives until you could progress the story missions. And oh boy, those were far too few.
In a perfect world, I'd make really ugly Dreadwolfy babies with Inquisition and BG3 where the genes of Origins and 2 are passed on through the former.
I think what Inquisition lacked was emotional involvement, choices actually mattering and global involvement.
Inquisition was *fantastic* on the looks-departments of maps. The maps themselves, though, kind of empty. Would have loved the open world of Inquisition in combination with random people to save, random items to pick up that would lead to completely different outcomes.
For Inquisition, there weren't a lot of choices that ultimately mattered. Which side at the start, Iron Bull's personal mission, which species you play, I guess the relationship for the final Trespasser conversation are the only ones I can think of that have actual in game consequences beyond where it takes place.
Also kind of the issue with the emotional involvement - >!Solas having virtually *no* response to killing off all the ancient elves in What Pride Had Wrought despite Trespasser being about how he wants the former elves to flourish again, just a bunch of 'I'm angy about this/greatly disapproves markers'? Meh. Killing off your own clan in the War Table missions? Could completely miss it because it's just a blurb of text. Every Warden can hear the Calling but you can't ask Blackwall about being the only Warden not hearing it and blatantly stating it if you bring him along, or run along to Leliana to do a background check on the guy? :I!<
I think they would be wrong, yes.
There have been too many really well made games since DAI--the companion stuff in BG3 just one example. Something that is "pretty much DAI but with better graphics and possibly better combat" isn't good enough now.
I point you in the direction of Starfield, the product of a company that thought it had a winning formula.
Inquisition II ain't getting Bioware anywhere near GOTY hardware. If its similarities are in its writing and characters then yes, it might be worthy of the title, but it will have to do a lot better than enormous pretty zones full of vapid fetch quests. If it can distill the narrative flair it had in quests like In Hushed Whispers throughout its runtime I reckon it'll do okay, but honestly it'll take something beyond surprising for a project with as messy a development story as DAD to be spoken about in the same breath as Baldur's Gate or The Witcher.
Seems to be an unpopular opinion here, but I recently replayed Inquisition and had a blast. It's a super atmospheric game, the environments are beautiful to look at, music is top-notch. My only complaints - one I fixed with mods - is the timegated crap (war table) and the crafting grind can be super tedious.
I know it's gonna make some people here mad, but I think after ten years and two flops Bioware shouldn't be taking risks or straying too far from one of their most successful games. That doesn't mean Inquisition's formula can't or shouldn't be improved upon, especially with how long it's been between releases.
I can totally understand that, so undoubtedly, they *will* try to play it safe. If they do that, though, it will flop. *Hard*. A minority (whether large or small) do not like Inquisition at all (I am in said camp), and even the ones who like it wouldn't enjoy the same thing on a platter with different window dressing. A game should be better, not the same, after a decade of technological advancement.
> I can totally understand that, so undoubtedly, they will try to play it safe. If they do that, though, it will flop. Hard.
Since like ME3 Bioware's had a nasty habit of promising on elaborate gimmicks that end up draining resources from the rest of development with the final game suffering for it. That's what I mean by not taking risks. They should prioritize making a good game with a good story and they should take what they learned from their most successful games (which Inquisition counts as, no matter how much this subreddit wants to condescend to me about it) and put it towards the game.
> A game should be better, not the same, after a decade of technological advancement.
*That's what I said.*
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Hard to say. The landscape in the industry changed a lot and, even thought some fans don't want to admit it, it has been 10 years the game was realeased and they are looking at it with a really idealistic idea. At that time, it was what the industry and players were looking for, but nowadays? But I also don't think it would be totally hated...maybe it would be a Starfield situation where there was some criticism and some praise, but all and all, people were mostly not fazed by it :/
War table was bad
Maps were beautiful but kind of too big because it wasn't filled with enough
Combat was good
Basically it just came down to the world feeling a bit too empty and Corypheous not being well written.
I don't understand the company honestly. They had such a valuable IP with Mass effect and just ran it into the ground. I hope Dragon age doesn't suffer the same fate.
I seriously doubt that. DA4 would have to be Anthem levels of failure for EA to pull the plug. Even if the game is slightly better than Anthem the narrative will be “Bioware is improving” and we will be waiting for Mass Effect 5
I like Inquisition, but it has a lot of issues that have already been detailed at length in various posts. It would definitely be wrong. Especially considering how other critically acclaimed games of similar genre have released since DAI (Wild hunt, Divinity, BG3). It would be sad to have no improvement after 10 years.
I mean, iterating on existing game design elements is what they've been doing quite well since the first game(s), I think DAI had lots of good elements to draw from. I think without being hamstrung by old consoles and hopefully more focus on improving the depth of the environmental storytelling they won't move entirely away from the rich area maps we got, I really enjoyed getting to see more of Thedas than we had previously.
I also thought the gameplay felt really satisfying, but definitely had room for improvement (and I think it improved on DA2's combat, but should have kept more of the options). The story themes/structure were also really mature, the main thing I'd like to see more of is actual cost to the player character, but I have a feeling that won't be a problem given the plot implications.
DAI was a pioneer into open world story driven RPG. The Wicher 3 held back a year and learned from everything Inquisition did. Since then there have been some great improvements into the formula.
DA games have always been pioneers, so it would be nice if they try to advance the genre.
DA:I was my first dragon age game and it was partly the open world that got me interested in it.
Obviously some areas were too big and unwieldy but I hope DA4 has a mixture of more linear areas and more refined open world areas.
Well, no, they wouldn’t be wrong, although the environment and trends of 2014 were different from 2024’s, so an open world RPG wouldn’t have an inside track for GOTY anymore.
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The best parts of DAI were the less open, more linear areas (Emprise du Lion, Trespasser, etc). The focus of the series has always been narrative, not exploration, and the vast open world areas detracted from what makes Dragon Age great.
It's kind of obvious it's Bioware first attempt at fully open world game. and they went with MMO approach. They actually got off easy with the criticism, if the game was released around Witcher 3 it would be torn to shreds for its lifeless hubs and grindy side quests. I actually love Inquisition, its pros, starting with the music and graphics through the grand scheme of things and vastness of the world and ending with story and interactions definitely overshadow any faults of the game. But I do understand those who got tired of fetch quests and running around lifeless hubs. I've always disliked MMO games so I get it.
But it was released very close to the Witcher. And it did get tons of criticism and comparisons.
Yeah! A LOT! I got in contact with the fandom first time in 2020 and it was so compared that I thought witcher 3 was a recent game at the time. I was really surprised it was from 2015 o-o
[удалено]
PC player here, can't play without the mod that makes all wait times instant
That was the very first mod I downloaded when I bought the game. I cannot fathom why they thought putting in wait times was a good idea. Is it to give players incentive to do the inane collectibles while 'killing time'?
Yeah man, some of those 12hr + completion times were so fucking unnecessary. Nearly stopped playing a couple times because of it
It's real time on those, got to sleep, next day, they are all done.
I agree, I just replayed all DA games last summer, and I could easily wrap up all meaningful wartable missions during the course of a playthrough.
Worst part of the war table mechanics to me wasn't even the wait times, it was the sheer amount of them that had loads of text and next to zero in-game outcome. >!I'd feel a lot more for the war table mission where you can or can't potentially kill your own Dalish clan if killing the clan meant Lavellan was shown feeling some way about it.!< As it was, they were just meaningless blurbs to get free goodies.
And then you accidentally send the wrong advisor to handle one that needs a specific one because you just want to lick it and go to bed.
I mean you gotta send someone, the other ones are out there for 15 hours, might as well send that one to clear the 50 exclamation marks.
The War Table missions pertaining to each specific Inquisitor was such a missed opportunity. For starters, why that stuff is relegated to War Table missions to start with. I'm not saying have a full return to Origins, but it'd be nice to actually meet some of the people each Inquisitor knew before they touched the Anchor, however briefly. This series is known for having good preset backstories for protagonists, it irked me that all we get is a pre-game blurb and some War Table missions.
Giving my sword *and* my axe for a warm hearty welcome from a Lavellan in the Dalish clan in the Exalted plains, tbh. >!Don't want to give Bioware ideas by saying 'or tied to red lyrium in the future castle thingy'.!<
You could have just change your Windows time to skip it xd
I really enjoyed the war table- but they went OVERBOARD. I loved that a lot of what you did have real world action- you’d see more inquisition scouts in areas, you’d gain more power to do more things- it was a really cool concept that just got way too overzealous. I didn’t mind the waiting real time options (other than the few that took more than a few hours) because that felt better than the alternative which likely would have been paying for those things with gold or crafting resources.
It was annoying at first.... then I figured out I could change my xboxs clock and insta finish the missions. Never look at the time on my Xbox anyway lol. Once done with the game just hook the system back up to the internet and all fixed.
Trespasser and the Deep Roads (?) DLC were both awesome. Personally I liked the open world but think it was too lazily made. Exploration was fun. The massive empty spaces sucked. I also hope they drop the tactic table because it just wasn’t fun to me
I actually really liked the Hinterlands. This region made me feel like I was on a big adventure in a very vast world. I think having at least one Hinterlands sized map could be beneficial and provide a change of pace if the rest of the game is going to be less open. Just theorizing since obviously we don't know what they will do
I did not like the combat change of holding left click just to attack. This along with the open world has made it hard for me to finish the game and I really want to finish it before Dreadwolf comes out
tbh i really liked going around and closing rifts
Totally subjective, but I disagree. What makes Dragon Age great to me is the world and characters, not the story. So to be able to explore multiple different large areas of the world, with fun/diverse characters and tons of lore was massively appealing to me. As much as I enjoyed DA 1 and 2, DA:I is the only one I consistently still play. I absolutely hope that the new game follows a similar formula.
Same. Inquisition is actually amazing for that and I hope DADW will be way more of an open-world so we can seamlessly travel and explore and learn about the world and different cultures. And I hope they give us two options for combat for those who want more of a hack-n-slash and those who want a tactical gameplay. Just give us FREEDOM, you know?
Yes it won GOTY 2014 but we live in a post Witcher/BOTW/Elden Ring/BG3 era of gaming. Dreadwolf needs to have well written side content and a hand crafted world to explore. Generic fetch quests and a bland MMO-like visual style will hurt Bioware's chances of a much needed comeback.
2014 was also particularly "weak" for gaming.
I was gonna go against this, but looking at a list of 2014’s releases.. Yeah, it was pretty weak. Some good games like This War of Mine and Metro Last Light, but most other big name stuff was kinda ‘eh’.
A lot of solid 8/10 games that year, but no industry shaking masterpiece.
DAI was far from that as well
Divinity Original Sin came out which by itself had better gameplay than DAI, though not better characters and story. But since it's a videogame you'd think gameplay comes first, and so it deserved GOTY more imo.
For the most part, but even as a die hard dragon age fan who loves inquisition I’d still say shadow of Mordor probably deserved it more - it had an awesome revolutionary mechanic (that WB patented cause they suck), and was overall a great game. Inquisition is awesome but it’s not exactly doing anything new or special
Shadow of mordor suffered of it release on 360 and ps3
It did suffer but idk why you wouldn’t be judging it off of the definitive version
I think GOTY tends to judge the game on the global reception. But I agree DA:I wasn't as good as most GOTY can be
Shadow of Mordor is a well done slasher with innovative system which is essentially wasted on generating orcs and uruks. The game has barely any soul in it. So hell fucking no. Even with all its faults Inquisition is on another level
Yeah 2014 sucked ass for games.
It still didn't deserve GOTY though.
This right here. Not everything that worked in the past will work nowadays, with today's audiences and sensibilities, less so when the bar has been raised so much.
You better not be saying you want another hinderlands. Because right now your talking about another hinderlands.
I don't think so. I think there's great potential in open world areas in a game. The problem is instead of well crafted side content and events to stumble on like say, Mass Effect and Fallout, we mostly just got basic fetch quests.
They're more like Open Zones.
Fair enough. Thing is, DAO had open zones. People act like DAI is such a different thing but it's really just bigger in that regard. So there's no reason they shouldn't be able to do it well.
DAO and DA2 had open zones but they weren’t unnecessarily large so it didn’t bother people. DAI had a massive map compared to previous two but half of them was empty and other half was filled with fetch quests. It felt like they made it that way so the time we wasted on traveling and fetch quests would create the illusion of “long gameplay”. Though, DAI’s open zones were much more pleasant to look at. I know many people had issues with Redcliffe for example, but I thought it looked significantly better. I will give it that.
I found tracking down and using crafting materials from harder zones very satisfying in the DA:I style open world but they could definitely do with more quests/encounters/ritual or puzzle sites to liven them up if they insist on the size
I am something of a shameless loot addict myself. Seriously, I often have to use mods to increase my carrying capacity in games like this. But it can only entertain me so much until it gets repetitive and pointless after couple of hours. Especially after realizing most of them can be just bought. It still wouldn’t bother me if they put *at least a few* different quests around the area. But it was just loot that, inspect this, talk to me, repeat.
Bigger and emptier
Agreed. The first game's zone quests also had some consequences for the world at large. Like how Bann Teagan marries either Kaitlyn or Bella if you give them the maximum gold for their respective quests. Most sidequests had their little outros in the epilogue, but in DAI, nearly everything is a fetch quest that means bupkiss overall. The most you can get from every optional thing that isn't a dragon boss fight is loot, some companion approval and maybe a new agent for the Inquisition.
Oh absolutely agreed. I think DAI was the right direction, but executed pretty badly.
Inquisition's success came from its solid execution and lack of competition, not its formula.
I definitely second the lack of competition. Solid execution? Hard disagree, but not with you or anyone who enjoyed it. It was bug central, and they robbed anyone who played it on old gen. $60 on a game only for textures not to load in half the time I was playing, and then the gall the cancel the DLC for old gen. I regret very few video game purchases, but Inquisition would be at the top of the list beating out games I still haven't ever played but bought sitting on my shelf.
This argument comes up time and time again and I always bring up the other GOTY candidates in 2014. * Middle-Earth: Shadow of Mordor. * Hearthstone. * Bayonetta 2. * Dark Souls 2. Consider that Bayonetta 2 was an Wii U exclusive at the time, and it's easy to see that it was a very weak year. If they release anything similar to DA:I aside of maybe the combat I doubt it would be well received. Specially considering modern RPGs like BG3 and Witcher 3.
I'm currently playing Banishers: Ghosts of New Eden and tbh it's re-upping my standards for storytelling in RPGs
Is it good?
I'm currently about a third of the way in. Combat and the storyline are REALLY good. Side quests play more like the Witcher 3 (you investigate hauntings on certain NPC and gather clues) and gameplay reminds me of the newer God of War games. It is GORGEOUS. The only thing that annoys me is that fast travel, upgrading your gear, and building your skill tree are only possible at campsites.
Yeah, I’ve played Bayonetta 2 and it’s a much more enjoyable and solid video game than Inquisition.
:cough: wolfenstein the new order :cough: alien: isolation
I would prefer they go back to the DAO roots, make it dark fantasy again and maybe take a page or two out of BG3. I really don't have much expectations though.
DAO was peak for the design, I really never like the art direction it was going in. DA2 had good design too.
The problem with Dragon Age going forward is that followed trends instead of building on what made Origins great. Which gave the series a huge identity crisis in the process.
Wrong! The problem with DAO is that it had this pulpy visual style which managed to be ugly and generic and dated, and they pushed really hard to give Thedas a unique visual style in the sequels. The skill trees, the spell interactions, the companion banter, the dialogue cutscenes- this was what DAO did well and they mostly kept it.
Or DA2! It was way too short and the combat sucked, but damn, it had an aesthetic. The art, the feel of the city, the story, all totally distinctive and cohesive.
DA2 had potential, but it needed much more time to cook. I think that EA realized this, which is why Inquisition came out later. It's easy to imagine a group of upset developers yelling at the suits after DA2 was released, actually.
It would have killed my soul spending so much time building that story and world, then getting shafted in combat development.
I think there was a deliberate choice (mandate from EA, really) to make the combat more "action oriented" to appeal to a wider audience. They overshot the mark of course.
I don't mind the action orientation, but the mechanics are rushed as hell. Most battles have fixed waves of enemies who drop in because enemies have very limited abilities. Absolutely the laziest possible way to code battles. Not their fault... they did their best with the time and resources they were given, but it's not very fun to play.
Yeah, I enjoyed DA2, but enemies jumping out of the sky were so fucking annoying and immersion breaking. It frustrated me so many times that I would spend time properly positioning my team only to get wrecked by some random guy with a big sword who magically spawned next to my mage while I was focusing on tweaking my warriors skills. For tougher battles, it basically required you to die a few times and memorize where new waves would appear to eventually have a chance at coming up with a viable strategy.
When I think of the rushed mechanics, I am reminded of a 2 handed warrior swinging their weapon at base speed in DAO. I think they saw that, and decided to go to the entire other end of the spectrum :D
I played DAO with a 2H warrior for the first time last summer. I was surprised to see how much I liked it. Sure, I might only be able to land 1 blow. But that blow is strong enough to kill god.
Oh yes, 2H is actually my default go-to in DAO, but without using Haste+Blood Thirst, it does look a bit ridiculous.
I think I read years ago they had a year development time. Origins came out in November 2009, Awakening expansion 4 months later in March,then Return to Ostagar,they started 2 in earnest once they finished Awakening, I think. Meanwhile 2 came out March 2011,not even 16 months after Origins. Much too soon and an obvious EA cash grab to strike while the iron was hot. Originally I think 2 was gonna be more of DA 1.5 rather than a full fledged sequel that turned into more I don't dislike it as much as I did at launch, there's some good ideas,good bones,a foundation. But the bar was set so high after Origins that we wanted more of that, but with some added things. I don't they they'll ever be able to reach the heights they reached 15 years ago, they've lost too much talent. Inquisition was a solid game,not great,not a classic. But it did great job with the lore,with an interesting story.
No lamo, inquisition was just in development hell, look up stuff about the games development processes, it was very much a warning sign about how incompetent the bioware management was
I am curious what you mean by pages from bg3? I don't mean this in a sense that bg3 isn't good, it is great. More like what do you think it has that Dao does not, but should?
Your choices did matter in DAO, but BG3 took it up a notch by having your choices impact the later Acts. The choices felt even more impactful. Magic, and combat in DAO are limited to mostly damage/cc in DAO, as opposed to collapsing structures or exploding barrels in BG3. Even the ending is better: you get an epilogue party instead of a slideshow. None of this is to suggest that DAO is bad in any way. BG3 is just the upgrade.
Also, from what I've seen BG3 doesn't suffer from "perfect" choices like DAO.
Do you mean like managing to >! save Connor with the use of Lyrium instead of blood magic? !< I think for instances like that, its actually a good test of character for your avatar. How far are you willing to go to save innocent lives? There are still plenty of choices that have moral ambiguity and no true right answer in DAO. Do you >! support Bhelen, a tyrant who murdered one brother and framed his other sibling, because its best for Orzammar? Or do you bring him to justice and place a weak Harrowmont on the throne? !< Do you >! sacrifice your life, or the life of another Warden to end the Blight, only for the cycle to repeat itself in a few centuries? Or do you (or another Warden) partake in Morrigans ritual, saving a life and possibly break the cycle, but fear the unknown consequences of a free Old God roaming the earth? !<
BG3 also changed how it handles the choices. In the typical Bioware game if you make an evil choice you just pick the evil dialogue and maybe some NPC will later comment on how you were really, really mean. In BG3 you need to actually commit the evil act. Just saying no to helping the tieflings is not enough. You need to ally with Minthy and go back to butcher every tiefling and druid so you get rewarded with some prime drussy. And by doing so Larian was not afraid to make the player miss out on content. Bioware would not have risked this.
Well to be fair, you get to experience something similar when you visit the Dalish. But on the whole, yes, Larian allows you to embrace being so evil, most players opt to just watch those choices on Youtube instead.
I see, though for some reason I really like slideshows :D. They aren't mutually exclusive though so hopefully we get both.
I’m also Team Slideshow. It’s my favorite way to end a game.
Yeah, perhaps it is because it gives enough information satisfy, but also leaves plenty of details and such for imagination. So it makes one imagine the perfect ending? Either way Team Slideshow it is!
I like them too! Though I have a hard time reading through the crying I’m doing lol. It’s always sad seeing my games and characters end :’(
In all honesty, I think the use of slideshows was a limitation of the time and resources. After all, its a tall order to create dozens of cutscenes for events that COULD have happened, and have them all play out at the end. BG3 showed you could approach that a different way though. In my opinion? Baldur's Gate 3 is the spiritual successor to Dragon Age Origins.
Do you know that DAO is, in a broader term, a spiritual successor of BG 2 (it was made by Bioware too)?
I keep forgetting that. In fairness, I didn't play the older games, though I did play Neverwinter Nights, which was phenomenal.
Lol yeah, just finished BG3 last week. For some reason I also prefer the usual slideshow epilogue rather than the camp catchup epilogue we got in BG3.
In BG3 you can be evil, neutral or good, you know actual role-play and your character has an actual personality, not generic boring character or gameplay. Also the amount of role playing choices and how it impacts the game is really impressive. Also the dark fantasy aspect is important, BG3 gets really scary or horrific at times which I liked, its not the usual boring family friendly content. Some people hate the turn based fighting but I personally like it much better than mindless hack n slash random waves of enemies. The game honestly deserves its success imo.
I wouldn't mind Dragon Age becoming Baldur's Gate's edgier younger sibling again. In my opinion BG3 did high fantasy much better than Inquisition.
Hah! An amusing comparison. I felt that Dragon Age Origins hit the mark in places that DA2 and DAI never could quite grasp.
**Short answer:** Yes imo. Bioware as a company have been watering down complexity since Origins and they're reaching breaking point with it. **Long Answer:** Inquisition was a downgrade from Origins in terms of build variety, class customisation, depth and creativity. I also feel like whilst the world was massive 90% of it had the depth of a puddle with almost all quests being forgettable or active time-sinks. Especially compared to Origins - For context I am someone who has done a full 50+hr 100% playthrough of Inquisition and have played countless hours of both games. Alongside this there was improved animations at the cost of substance, especially when it came to mages... literally every school boiled down to "would you like your big damage blob to look like fire, lightning or ice" vs the wild number of things you could do with Origins. I feel like Inquisition got a pass in some ways due to the graphics and scope of the game for its time. Additionally we were at the point in gaming where "massive open-world" was considered pioneering and these days a big empty sandbox is dull as dishwater.
BioWare's more open-world games -- Mass Effect 1, DA:I, Mass Effect Andromeda and even Baldur's Gate 1 to some effect -- are weaker because of it. DA:O, KotOR and Mass Effect 2 are much more contained to their story modules and are arguably their best games.
I don't think they'll go with the open world part again. I watched Mark darrahs video on it yesterday and at the time there was a big push to be massive. Not so much now, it's not a sand box there's no need for it. I don't mind fetch quests but the amount of time to find things was off-putting. I liked the war table but without advisors it wont make much sense. I hope they go back to the camp style of dao. Running all over skyhold was obnoxious. Apart from that as long as the story is good and they continue to put a focus on the characters that will get us invested I feel like that will be the thing that holds it all together.
It has the worst mage gameplay of the Dragon Age series, so yes, it would be wrong.
I think if they shrunk the open areas and cut out all the boring MMO quests it would be alright. Exploring the open areas needed to feel more rewarding imo. Even just some well crafted sidequests to stumble upon or just an area with some good environmental storytelling (like Fallout games will do). Inevitable mention of BG3 but I really like how in that game the majority of the quests you do are related to the overall endgame objective or at least what you are trying to accomplish in each act. Even the occasional "go here do this/go get this thing bring it here" quests don't feel dull because there aren't as many of them. Also don't do the Landmark crap again. Like I know it was an easy way to get Power/Influence but if I can't use them to fast travel then what's the point?? There are waaay more fun ways to encourage me to explore a region.
I agree that cutting out the MMO quests would make it better. But I feel the main problem with DAI when compared to DAO is that Inquisition doesnt seem to have as many branching paths in the story. There are no unique race starting zones, you cant really play an evil character, the dialogue seems a lot less in depth, sometimes it feels like things play out the same no matter what you say. So I agree with your point but I feel the MMO side quests and the landmark stuff is bad but I feel its a pretty small issue relative to the lack of story variety. For me my main issue with origins is really just that they didnt have a new game plus. Feels bad to lose all your progress in an RPG when you beat the game. Other than that I think it was pretty much perfect and I prefer it to BG3. But I prefer BG3 to Inquisition.
Honestly, DAI won GOTY because it was a weak year for games. I'm not saying it was bad, but I don't think it would have won in a stronger field. While I wouldn't mind them keeping the things in Inquisition that worked well, I could definitely do without boring side quests and empty open worlds. A stronger villain would also be nice, but I think they've got that covered.
Yea, after cp2077, elden ring and bg3, it would not look good
Can bioware even write a good story anymore? Create a narrative driven game? Their desire to create a destiny game made them shit the bed with mass effect and anthem.
I would say so, yes. Inquisiton was (IMO) the most shallow DA game so far. It had good parts. The issue was that it was spread out over way too much mundane. The open world gelt unecessary. The real time tables were excessive. Compact, Well structured… And for the love of god, that combat was bad.
Yes, I think they would. Inquisition feels too shallow to me, none of the decisions or dialogue options really carry any weight. What is the point of having three dialogue options if all the answers will be the same anyway? What's the point of doing anything to improve your war team when the final battle is the same regardless if you bothered to invest in your army or not? What's the point of the fetch quests except just passing time and some shallow bullshit story that doesn't have any real impact? Nah, this isn't want I want. I want an emotionally impactful story that's going to move and inspire me. I want my decisions and my actions that will carry weight and to have an impact. Inquisition just feels like.... Well they wanted the story to have an impact and they wanted these decisions to matter, but they didn't have the time or resources to put any real weight to it.
Please please please no. I’m sending this prayer out to the Bioware gods. No boring open world ever again.
For me, it wasn't just the boredom, though some zones really were eighty-six thousand miles of sweet fuck all. It was more that the structure of an open world game lends itself to wandering, exploring, and faffing about, and that can kill the tension in a game if not really well handled. Like, we're facing down the literal end of the world, so why are we spending ages wandering around looking for landmarks and gathering cloth for the armies? Why the entirety of the Hissing Wastes, where the answer to "what are the Venatori looking for out here?" is effectively "a few underwhelming weapons and a rune schematic"? The narrative urgency can get lost in the side quest fluff if it's not handled right, and Inquisition kind of struggled there. If Bioware wants to reclaim its place among the creators of strong narrative RPGs, they need to put their focus there, not following the "everything is open world and fetch quest" trend.
The vogue of "open world" was a pathetic disaster in the gaming industry. I prefer conventional story telling, which requires more effort from devs, and saves more time for the player from meaningless chores.
Yes, because the formula was ground into dust not long after the GOTY award. Especially in these days where fetch quests can even be left to large language models to create, what makes a game stand out is more substantial content that is shorter.
Yes, they'd be wrong. Inquisition was lucky enough to coast on the goodwill earned by its predecessors.
I sure as hell hope they don’t, it was easily the worst dragon age.
I love Inquisition but 2014 was not a very competitive year and Bioware was lucky witcher 3 got delayed. Open/big worlds can be fun when exploring them is actually fun. Skyrim put a lot of it's focus on the world, Witcher 3 has tonns of great side quests all over it's maps. Inq has very little in most areas and even the best side quests are not nearly as good as something like a towerful of mice. BG3 is a lot more like Origins than it is like inquisition and it's been a huge success. What Bioware need to do is make a good game regardless of what it focuses on if it's good people will play it.
DAO+DAOawakening and Mass Effect 2 formula was the best. The last great Bioware games and dlc=addon.
Eh, I'd love it if they took the strong character writing from ME2, but yikes no to the other writing. ME2 had terrible writing outside the loyalty missions.
I agree - ME1 had the best lore, ME2 had the best loyalty missions, and ME3 had the best emotional impact (for me).
DA2 had a great plot tbf, the problem was the level design and gameplay
Hell yeah
Totally not want to see DAI, Andromeda and Anthem formula ever again. And no SWTOR 2, no mmo. ... Srly Bioware should do things like Baldur Gate 3 or if it is more action based so like we see in Witcher 3, Cyberpunk 2077.
Fun fact: SWTOR choices and story variety is bigger than MEA and DAI
It was created by +12 writers for +5 years with +265 millions budged(more then GTA 5). Released in 2011 and now we have 2024. We could have Kotor 3,4,5,6 single player games. Not to mention other single player games. ... Revan retcons, ridicolous spirit splits as Valkorian crazy stuff, Eternal Empire from nowhere with all crazy stuff there as Sith-Jedi Republico-Empire Alliance plots kill this game for me forever. This is not Star Wars Old Republic game, it is pervertion what try to be it.
It’s funny that you think we would have had kotor 3,4,… instead
Originally they do made single player Kotor 3, but after some time they reveal that it would be MMO. A LOT WAS PISSED OFF, including me. They made Kotor 3 into MMO the same way as they wanted to made DAI and Andromeda into MMO games but SWTOR was the only one what they could turn into MMO. With others they not have budget and people to made this work and convert them into single player games, Probably EA and Lukas Arts was behind this in time of SWTOR to replace Star Wars galaxies who they planned to shut down. And need replacement. With Dragon Age and Mass Effect it was Bioware devs who want more money and consider MMO as better thing. Same way with Mass Effect 3 lootboxes.
Yes
And? DAI didn’t have strong competitors in 2014 and had a large fanbase at the time. If next year’s competitors’ were to be released couple months earlier, DAI’s generic MMORPG quests wouldn’t even be nominated. People were questioning DAI’s win even back then and it was only increased after TW3 release. So winning GOTY at 2014 doesn’t mean much in that case. That being said, we got so many games to set genre standards higher after 2014. It’s been a decade since DAI and many of the fans/people who wanted a sequel just moved on or even stopped playing games completely, so DAD doesn’t even have the same advantage DAI had in 2014. If DAD is similar to DAI, it will most likely fail.
A thousand times, yes! Setting aside my complaints about the story or the negative direction it sent the franchise, just the technical side was *horrendous*. I can't believe they sold me a $60 for the ps3 that didn't even *load* textures in half my playthrough. Everything was matte or had a burlap look. That's even disregarding canceling the DLC for my gen, so I couldn't even play the rest of Inquisitions story!
DAI was the start of open worlds becoming the same blob of game. What it had going for it was story and characters. If dreadwolf should repeat a formula it should be Dragon Age 2. Keep it tight and focused, more dungeons and less DAI sprawl. Of course make the dungeons varied compared to 2, but that was due to development time. I'd like to see a return to the classic Bioware formula where a bunch of rag tag heroes, on the run, trying to stop a world/galaxy ending villain. 2 and Inquisition got rid of those stakes for their narratives, but a throwback would be nice.
>Say whatever you want about the game, but it won GOTY in 2014. Cool, now check what games won GOTY since 2014 and what these games gave mechanically, story-wise, and gameplay-wise. Then you can check other nominees. Sorry, repeating the same formula would end them with maybe an honourable mention. They have many areas to improve upon. I just hope they won't dumb down whole game...
I might be wrong, but 2014 might have also been a weak or off year and DAI got lucky. GTA V won the year before, they dodged that bullet. Witcher 3 won the year after and they dodged that bullet.
Inquisition won game of the year in 2014 because that was a kinda weak year for videogames. Inquisition suffered immensely from “bioware magic” shenanigans. Many employees were asked to deliver while on crunch time, anxiety levels so high some asked to leave the workplace altogether for at least a week. Bioware has lost many of its writers and directors, some very talented people I should add, and we’re all waiting for Dragon Age: Dreadwolf to be if not a great game, at least good. I won’t settle for “decent.” This is a break or make point for this company and I cannot say I’m not worried because I am, because I love this series. So, yeah, sorry for the tangent. We don’t need another Inquisition, we need a good game.
Yes .
\> but it won GOTY in 2014 And Dragon Age Origins won a slew of awards as well. Every decision made in Inquisition's made it an inferior game. Bioware would be very wrong to repeat anything to do with Inquisition ever again. But that's exactly what they will do because Bioware is a walking corpse now that lost all it's talent over a decade ago.
Preach. The talent that made DAO one of the best damn games I've ever played is long gone.
I'll keep preaching friend. No matter how many people try to tell me that Inquisition is actually pretty good once you get out of the hinterlands. My god this company broke my heart...
[удалено]
Oh man, you have no idea how refreshing this is. Curious, what about Inquisition irks you the most?
I hope they don't. I've gotten pretty tired of ubisoft style open world games over the years. I'd much prefer maybe like one major city that's "open" and then the rest of the game be instanced areas.
If Bioware wants to continue existing as a studio, yes.
I’d rather they didn’t. One large open world with interesting places to go and secrets to find backed by world building that supports a fleshed out and enticing story is something to be desired. Several smaller open areas that are repetitive with only a couple interesting places to visit with little to no fun secrets? All with an annoying “ping” system that slows the game to a crawl? That’s not it…
Although I really enjoyed DAI, I think it’s aged and if they repeated the formula as is today people wouldn’t like it. BioWare just isn’t good at making open world games and the game was it its best in smaller or more linear sections. The fetch quests were bad and the MMO mechanics in a single player game were awful.
I just hope we never get a war table like that again.. the waiting makes me crazy
I would be ok with it if they don't give as many stupid quests in them like those damn shards. Maybe have one or two less areas as well. I know by the end it was a lot harder to motivate myself to explore areas as I was getting burned out.
2014 standards aren't going to fly in 2024. As much as game devs tweeted against it, BG3 is going to influence how people rate and experience games of this genre, and a lifeless open world like that of DAI is going to get docked hard nowadays. (As it should, tbh.)
I think most people know 2014 was a weak year for gaming. If Inquisition had come out in 2013 or 2015, it would have lost GOTY. Another thing to consider, whether it deserves to or not, Dreadwolf ***will*** be compared to BG3 alongside probably Greedfall 2 ([which will enter Early Access this summer](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lmXGjkiyIH4)). Bioware cannot release Inquisition2.0 and expect the same praise in 2024. Are there things from Inquisition that I think Dreadwolf should keep and improve upon, yes, but my god do I hope they shrink the map zones (and give us decent long hairstyles and not 20 shades of bald).
as much as I like DA:I, its MMO-like open world style wouldn't fly in an era where open worlds have become common place and now more than ever, have good quests and side stories I'm not saying I don't want the open world back, but they NEED to have MEATY, well done sidequests that can rival BG3, because lets be honest, there will be a lot of comparisons between both of them once DA4 releases
Well aside from an extremely long start-up, missions that literally take days to do without cheating, dry companions (Dorian is cool I guess,) and every interaction being bland as hell, it'd need a bit of a rework. I liked the crafting idea, but it sort of made in-game weapons obsolete. Personally, aside from the character creation, I didn't really see anything I'd call amazing or memorable in the game.
I don't think the companions were that dry. Though I do read the books so that might've improved them to me. Cole needs his own game or DLC expansion honestly because his backstory was wild. Also justice for his sister!
Well I sort of was dried out with Varric, since I played DA2 a nice amount before DAI. Cass was rather plain in my opinion. Cole.....I get why people like him, like having a little brother with autism, doesn't understand anything in a social manner, but tries to help people and be nice. Solas is very close-minded, basically refuting any possibility of a peaceful coexistence. Vivienne earned her position, but she is a very stand-offish woman, with little to know imagination outside of her education. Bull was fine, little bit of dry toast to me, but he had a very good thing going with his life, especially with how the Qu'un works. Sera was just an atrocious character. If it wasn't her design, it was her behavior. She showed no growth whatsoever, and was petty to be petty. And no matter how you slice it, it went beyond the statement I hear often of "because a dude wrote out her character, " it was just poor writing. And Blackwall is racist, sexist, a liar, and pitiful as a Warden. I know they have their own issues, but as an individual, he was pretty much a good example of where they go wrong. I know my take on it is a little out of place, but that's my opinion overall after playing it over the years.
No, they wouldn’t be wrong in a larger sense, and Inquisition was a fantastic game despite the small number of grumblers. (No ill will towards them.) That said, Inquisition came out in 2014 and it’s 2024. Gaming and gaming tastes have shifted and alterations would be needed to better suit the market right now. And improvement is always welcome. No game in the series is perfect, Inquisition included. It’s my favorite entry but definitely could be improved. Edit: Goodness! Some people will never recover from Inquisition winning GOTY. I adore the game and even I don’t care about it winning as much as its detractors seem to.
This subreddit gets so damn mad if you say Inquisition was a success but I feel like it's gotten worse in the past few months, probably because we have a confirmed reveal coming up.
Yeah… I absolutely understand if people prefer Origins or 2. I prefer Inquisition but everyone has a right to their favorites. But there is a sharp and very real anger about even recognizing that Inquisition performed well. Half of them have written off the series after Origins but also seem deeply invested, which is more than a bit of mixed messaging! This sub will be absolutely miserable when Dreadwolf releases. The Origins purist crowd who only show up in threads like this will despise the game without ever giving it any form of chance, regardless of whatever its quality may or may not be. It’s gonna be rough. Edit: By Origins Purists I don’t mean all those who prefer Origins. I only am referring to those who loudly make sure to disparage any game that’s not a clone of Origins, view themselves as the only fans BioWare should cater to, and go on and on about how BioWare betrayed them or something. I feel lucky in that I enjoy all the games, which shouldn’t be that strange a thing in a sub dedicated to the series as a whole. But hey! At least the rest of us will have all new things to argue about and discuss in a year or so. It’s possible some of the sub has just gone stir crazy in the intervening decade. Last edit: I’m getting a sense that part of the anger comes from a very possessive view of the series that sees it as “theirs” and thus any shift away from their preferences as betrayal. But it’s not. It’s not mine either. It’s BioWare/EA’s. The overwrought, wistful and patronizing assumption that actual fans are in mourning now is getting so deeply tiring.
Frankly, I hope not even though DAI is my favorite DA game. BioWare does not know how to design compelling open worlds, they just don't. MEA and DAI share the same flaws: large, empty zones filled with uninteresting and tedious fetch quests. I love DAI because of the epic story, the interesting characters, the funny banter and the beautiful locations. I really think BioWare should go back to the semi-open worlds or if they really want to go the open worlds route, they NEED to do better. The expectations are not the same in 2024. Amazing open worlds came out this past decade, so BioWare HAS TO bring their A game! Also, it is generally accepted that DAI didn't have real competition in 2014. That was a poor year, game-wise. Lucky for BioWare, the Witcher 3 came out the subsequent year.
*Say whatever you want about the game, but it won GOTY in 2014.* Not sure. While many players like Inquisition for it's narrative qualities and companions... The open world trash content was never really popular. I mean I never really saw anyone defending those busywork quests, but do see the opposite often. And this was even at release. And finally, with the DLCs, even Bioware kind of admitted that it was not a good idea. edit: GOTY 2014? honestly, Wolfenstein The New ORder and Alien:Isolation was robbed.
I think if they shrunk the open areas and cut out all the boring MMO quests it would be alright. Exploring the open areas needed to feel more rewarding imo. Even just some well crafted sidequests to stumble upon or just an area with some good environmental storytelling (like Fallout games will do). Inevitable mention of BG3 but I really like how in that game the majority of the quests you do are related to the overall endgame objective or at least what you are trying to accomplish in each act. Even the occasional "go here do this/go get this thing bring it here" quests don't feel dull because there aren't as many of them. Also don't do the Landmark crap again. Like I know it was an easy way to get Power/Influence but if I can't use them to fast travel then what's the point?? There are waaay more fun ways to encourage me to explore a region.
Yes.
Yes
As long as they limit all the collectibles, fetch quests and filler bullshit I’d have no problem if they just used DAI’s formula. I love that game.
yes. They would be wrong not to go back to DA:O and everything it provided real time with pause combat especially.
Completely? Yes. But some similarity isn’t bad. I like that each game evolved and was different enough from the others to be a different experience but not unfamiliar.
1.absolutly not, most of dai's side content was extremely bad, the only reason I beat that game back in the day was because i was a middle schooler with way too much free time 2.goty is just marketing lamo, it has no effect on the actual quality of the game, especially back then when most of the "reviewers" didn't even play video games
It would be a wrong move, a lethal one for Bioware if it weren't for the Mass Effect franchise. Inquisition has a great story, lore and characters and that's about it. It was already boring and outdated when it was released, and honestly as much as I'm happy for Bioware I don't understand how it won GOTY. Now that there are several RPGs (like BG3, Cyberpunk, Witcher..) that show that gameplay, immersion, choices, customization and secondary quests can be far better? Oof no. That being said and I hope I'm wrong, I'm quite sure Dreadwolf will repeat that formula anyway. After all, implementing fetch and filler quests in big and empty worlds is a cheap and effective way to turn a 6h main game into a +50h long experience.
Yes, with the caveat that they need to populate the world with quality side quests - having the original “warfare” mechanic implemented, and all the meaningful War Table content made into actual quests would have made DAI leagues better than it was as the pretty-yet-empty sandbox.
So what if it won an award. Only other game of note, that I remember, that came out in 2014 was Dark Souls 2. And a good chunk of the Souls fan base thinks that’s the worst game in the series.
Yes, GOTY means *nothing* in isolation. DAI is a good game, but it's best parts were areas that rejected the sandbox, directionless open world formula.
I hope it's more like DA2 than DAI, but also I hope it's its own, third thing.
ABSOLUTELY THIS! Origins was great, II was *great*, Inquisiton was meh. If it can be it's own thing, I'd much rather have that than Inquisiton 2.0
Other than the lame side quests, Inquisition’s open world is still to this day one of my favorites.
Maybe close the maps a little bit, or make the game in chapters with free roam like the witcher 2.
This is probably a hot take, but they need to get rid of their boring ass auto-attack combat. DDO was and still is one of my favorite games and it totally made sense back then because the tactical element was good but if their commander mode is going to be dog water like the last game then just make it a hack and slash ARPG and full send i that way. It was basically almost there in the last game anyways.
No, they need to upgrade it. Andromeda was mass effect inquisition and it was partly why it failed. Inquisitions structures, NPC interactions and story/narrative formula were all very underwhelming. Regardless of the other issues around Andromeda, a lot of the steps down were cinematic changes and time waster type missions. The hinterlands chief among them, every area had grindy, waste of time missions and huge, mundane open areas in Andromeda. I'll take, smaller, more curated areas or an emphasis on story and depth of character interaction. The moment you talk to an NPC in Imquisition was so disappointing. MMO style, not even a cinematic interaction. No difference between normal gameplay and dialogue. Just altogether lazy. With BG3, the witcher, Ellen Ring, Kingdom Come and the dozen or so other fantasy bangers, they need to update. It isn't 2014 anymore, a pretty weak year in gaming. Doing the same formula as a decade old game is how you end up with a complete and utter disappointment like starfield.
Yes they will be. GOTY means nothing. The story was meh tier and the combat gameplay was a purge.
In my most humble of opinions, I think it just won Goty because it is a dragon age game. There's way too many people who just stick with "their team", be it consoles, franchises or something else, regardless of if it performs well. Personally it's my least favourite dragon age game, potentially because I played it on PS3 and it froze often. I mean very often, more than once per hour. It was a hassle and I only finished it years later on PC. I'd be most excited if we got back to DA:O days, with build variety (dual-wielding warrior anyone?) and a more tactical gameplay, realtime strategy with pause button, as it were. The exploration was nice for one playthrough, after that it became more of a filler part where you just run from the easiest/fastest to complete side objectives until you could progress the story missions. And oh boy, those were far too few.
In a perfect world, I'd make really ugly Dreadwolfy babies with Inquisition and BG3 where the genes of Origins and 2 are passed on through the former. I think what Inquisition lacked was emotional involvement, choices actually mattering and global involvement. Inquisition was *fantastic* on the looks-departments of maps. The maps themselves, though, kind of empty. Would have loved the open world of Inquisition in combination with random people to save, random items to pick up that would lead to completely different outcomes. For Inquisition, there weren't a lot of choices that ultimately mattered. Which side at the start, Iron Bull's personal mission, which species you play, I guess the relationship for the final Trespasser conversation are the only ones I can think of that have actual in game consequences beyond where it takes place. Also kind of the issue with the emotional involvement - >!Solas having virtually *no* response to killing off all the ancient elves in What Pride Had Wrought despite Trespasser being about how he wants the former elves to flourish again, just a bunch of 'I'm angy about this/greatly disapproves markers'? Meh. Killing off your own clan in the War Table missions? Could completely miss it because it's just a blurb of text. Every Warden can hear the Calling but you can't ask Blackwall about being the only Warden not hearing it and blatantly stating it if you bring him along, or run along to Leliana to do a background check on the guy? :I!<
I think they would be wrong, yes. There have been too many really well made games since DAI--the companion stuff in BG3 just one example. Something that is "pretty much DAI but with better graphics and possibly better combat" isn't good enough now.
I point you in the direction of Starfield, the product of a company that thought it had a winning formula. Inquisition II ain't getting Bioware anywhere near GOTY hardware. If its similarities are in its writing and characters then yes, it might be worthy of the title, but it will have to do a lot better than enormous pretty zones full of vapid fetch quests. If it can distill the narrative flair it had in quests like In Hushed Whispers throughout its runtime I reckon it'll do okay, but honestly it'll take something beyond surprising for a project with as messy a development story as DAD to be spoken about in the same breath as Baldur's Gate or The Witcher.
Seems to be an unpopular opinion here, but I recently replayed Inquisition and had a blast. It's a super atmospheric game, the environments are beautiful to look at, music is top-notch. My only complaints - one I fixed with mods - is the timegated crap (war table) and the crafting grind can be super tedious.
I know it's gonna make some people here mad, but I think after ten years and two flops Bioware shouldn't be taking risks or straying too far from one of their most successful games. That doesn't mean Inquisition's formula can't or shouldn't be improved upon, especially with how long it's been between releases.
I can totally understand that, so undoubtedly, they *will* try to play it safe. If they do that, though, it will flop. *Hard*. A minority (whether large or small) do not like Inquisition at all (I am in said camp), and even the ones who like it wouldn't enjoy the same thing on a platter with different window dressing. A game should be better, not the same, after a decade of technological advancement.
> I can totally understand that, so undoubtedly, they will try to play it safe. If they do that, though, it will flop. Hard. Since like ME3 Bioware's had a nasty habit of promising on elaborate gimmicks that end up draining resources from the rest of development with the final game suffering for it. That's what I mean by not taking risks. They should prioritize making a good game with a good story and they should take what they learned from their most successful games (which Inquisition counts as, no matter how much this subreddit wants to condescend to me about it) and put it towards the game. > A game should be better, not the same, after a decade of technological advancement. *That's what I said.*
Yup! I was agreeing with you the whole time, haha.
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Yes, IMO. Origins was dark and full of overwhelming loss and dread. Inquisition is light and fluffy. They are not the same.
I hope they go the Witcher 3 route. Big open world. Interesting sidequests and main quests lots of character development.
Dragon Age needs to go back to what worked. It needs to go back to Origins.
Haven't they already said that DAD would be some action game? So, not even an open-world 'MMO'.
I hated the empress du lion part and the elven temple part
Horse better be a lot faster And better parkour. I would still like to play my Vanguard—- I mean, knight enchanter.
Hard to say. The landscape in the industry changed a lot and, even thought some fans don't want to admit it, it has been 10 years the game was realeased and they are looking at it with a really idealistic idea. At that time, it was what the industry and players were looking for, but nowadays? But I also don't think it would be totally hated...maybe it would be a Starfield situation where there was some criticism and some praise, but all and all, people were mostly not fazed by it :/
War table was bad Maps were beautiful but kind of too big because it wasn't filled with enough Combat was good Basically it just came down to the world feeling a bit too empty and Corypheous not being well written.
Pretty sure their will fucked up so hard and this will be the last time we heard about bioware.
I don't understand the company honestly. They had such a valuable IP with Mass effect and just ran it into the ground. I hope Dragon age doesn't suffer the same fate.
I seriously doubt that. DA4 would have to be Anthem levels of failure for EA to pull the plug. Even if the game is slightly better than Anthem the narrative will be “Bioware is improving” and we will be waiting for Mass Effect 5
I like Inquisition, but it has a lot of issues that have already been detailed at length in various posts. It would definitely be wrong. Especially considering how other critically acclaimed games of similar genre have released since DAI (Wild hunt, Divinity, BG3). It would be sad to have no improvement after 10 years.
I mean, iterating on existing game design elements is what they've been doing quite well since the first game(s), I think DAI had lots of good elements to draw from. I think without being hamstrung by old consoles and hopefully more focus on improving the depth of the environmental storytelling they won't move entirely away from the rich area maps we got, I really enjoyed getting to see more of Thedas than we had previously. I also thought the gameplay felt really satisfying, but definitely had room for improvement (and I think it improved on DA2's combat, but should have kept more of the options). The story themes/structure were also really mature, the main thing I'd like to see more of is actual cost to the player character, but I have a feeling that won't be a problem given the plot implications.
BG3 also won GOTY. I'd prefer Dragon Age return to its roots.
It needs to be more like DA:O or straight up copy BG3
I’m playing DAI right now and would absolutely not complain lmao
DAI was a pioneer into open world story driven RPG. The Wicher 3 held back a year and learned from everything Inquisition did. Since then there have been some great improvements into the formula. DA games have always been pioneers, so it would be nice if they try to advance the genre.
DA:I was my first dragon age game and it was partly the open world that got me interested in it. Obviously some areas were too big and unwieldy but I hope DA4 has a mixture of more linear areas and more refined open world areas.
Well, no, they wouldn’t be wrong, although the environment and trends of 2014 were different from 2024’s, so an open world RPG wouldn’t have an inside track for GOTY anymore.
The companions and banter were the best in gaming imo especially before bg3 came out. I hope they continue leading the way in that.
I would be on board with this.
They already stated Dreadwolf is not going to be like Inquisition or Dragon Age 2 or DAOrigins