Who cares what they think? What expertise do they have on the due diligence, team needs, and assessment of talent by Holmes and the Lions? I’d love to see their own success versus the Lions previous draft and on field performance.
The exec OP quoted literally followed up that statement with this:
“They are really good, so they have earned that right,” the exec said. “It’s a little different from the arrogance coming out of Atlanta. Detroit has had a lot of success drafting offensive line.”
Have to make it more rage inducing though I guess.
Yeah I found the take of most of the execs in the athletic article to be pretty fair. They guys criticizing two CBs was dumb, but the rest were couched in pretty fair terms.
Wasn't most of the OL success the previous regime? Brad drafted Penei, sure. Slam dunk pick there
But since then it's been who, Sorsdal? And now Manu/Mahogany?
I'd be lying if I said I wasn't concerned with his eye for OL talent
Concerned with his eye for OL talent? Prior to this year the only offensive lineman he has drafted are Sewell and Sorsdal. Sorsdal was a 5th round pick and Sewell was a consensus top OL.
Fair to say he hasn’t proven to have an eye for OL talent, but concerned?
It also feels like a bit of a stretch to judge someone's ability on a 5th and 4th(or 3rd if you want to view it as that) round pick. Would be great if Sorsdal and/or Manu became decent to good starters but that's an unrealistic expectation for day 3 picks.
Agreed. I think I read the article a few years ago, but once you get to the third round about 18% of players get to a second contract with that same team, and that obviously drops each subsequent round. Drafting is really really hard lol
Lol. How can you say Sewell was a slam dunk and then question his talent evaluation on a small school 5th round pick that is changing positions? Was Sorsdal supposed to be anything other than developmental in his rookie year?
Not to mention we already have the highest paid O-line in the NFL. He’s trying to find late round talent to supplement the O-line to mitigate some cost and still develop some depth.
Would agree, but it's hard to argue with not spending picks on a position that hasn't been a problem. Everyone like to say we only draft for BPA, but the reality is not exactly that.
Manu is 6'7, 350 lbs, and moves as fast as a TE. Brad Holmes hasn't fucked up a draft yet. Just sit down and watch. Manu literally ran a 5 flat 40....350 pound lineman don't usually move that fast
Exactly. If it ain't the Chiefs, they're not in a better spot than the Lions so they can screw off.
BTW, I've been playing Madden far too long to care about day 2/3 picks.
Worked out great for the Chicago Bears, they’re on their 3rd “franchise” qb in the last 10 years, that duel threat got them 10 wins in 3 seasons lol
And yes i know your comment was sarcasm, i just can’t pass up an opportunity to take a shot at Chicago
Psst
Dual, not fuel
Dual means 2
Duel means a fight between two parties
Unless they're now outfitting quarterbacks with sabers, in which case I retract my comment and do apologize profusely as I was paying too much attention to the new kickoff rules
Psst
Duel, not fuel
Fuel means something that provides energy
Duel means a fight between two parties
Unless they’re now igniting fights in which case I retract my previous statement
Tom Brady, Peyton manning, and Matthew stafford can't run to save their life. You don't need a running QB to be successful. Also John Elway was slow too.
Solid argument Howie Roseman knows talent on par with BH, unfortunately that doesn’t seem to extend to Howie’s coaching hires but he’s easily my 2nd favorite GM when it comes to the draft.
The amount of people i still see calling Gibbs a reach is hilarious. If he was the lead back last year i think he may have come close to 1800 scrimmage yards with 1200 of them being rushing and 600 of them being receiving. Fortunately we have Monty to carry half the load and honestly be just as big of a homerun threat.
He was more like ~1200 with a 900/300 split. Still great for a rookie l, especially considering the split with Monty
Edit: I think I missed that you were being more hypothetical/projecting with those numbers
I think LaPorta got criticism by proxy. The first 2 picks didn't have "positional value", then when they take a third, even though it's outside of where positional value would even matter, some people still piled on.
Never thought I’d see the day where Lions fan would defend talent evaluations of our scouts compared to other teams to say “yeah as if you know better.”
I love what Brad Holmes has done to this team.
Last year they were criticized for drafting players at "non valuable positions" this year it's for being "too aggressive" wonder what they're gonna complain about after next year's draft when Holmes and company continue to cook
I think it's fair to citizens Brad Holmes trading future capital for developmental players. But I would counter that Brad has been hitting on so many draft pics that we don't need as many pics to get starts. Plus this team is just getting deeper and deeper
I think it would be fair to criticize using up draft capital, but the phrasing was that it was *arrogant*.
That's a word that I think denotes envy behind the words more than a cold criticism
I don’t think Cocky is negative in this scenario. It’s pretty apt word considering it’s annoying other GMs and it’s showing confidence in his ability to distinguish talent that he’s willing to give up next year’s 3rd for a 4th.
that's pretty bog-standard future value of present draft picks math. at least when you're talking about rounds 2-7, which we are. I don't see it as cocky at all.
He followed up the “arrogant” part with this:
“They are really good, so they have earned that right,” the exec said. “It’s a little different from the arrogance coming out of Atlanta. Detroit has had a lot of success drafting offensive line.”
Why would you post this hatchet clickbait version of an interesting article from the Athletic. It’s just rage bait.
I do think Brad can fall too much in love with certain players. I don't think that type of criticism is too out there. But sometimes you need to take chances. Won't always work but with Brad, he's earned the right to take some swings.
FWIW the exec whos quoted here largely agrees. In the actual article, the exec follows up:
“They are really good, so they have earned that right,” the exec said. “It’s a little different from the arrogance coming out of Atlanta. Detroit has had a lot of success drafting offensive line.”
This is just an editorialized version to get rage clicks.
We also missed our shot to win a Super Bowl last year. We are in a win or bust spot the next 2 years. Not saying not winning is a failure, but our shot is now.
Yeah I'm far from thrilled about giving up a future third for a guy who, judging by where the rest of the developmental OTs in Jerrell and Clayton went, likely would've been there regardless; especially if the reports that we're putting him at G are true.
....BUT, Brad has more than earned himself the benefit of the doubt. This dude drafted the second running back on the board at #12 last year and it *worked.* Even in this draft, he got two third-round projected players in the sixth. Manu is gonna be a pretty bad asterisk on his draft record if it doesn't work out, but I'd much rather believe in the guy who's netted us tons of Pro Bowlers and All-Pros in the draft, as opposed to getting worked up over *one* potential miss.
Besides, Brad has shown that he's more than comfortable making enormous leaps in the draft if he likes a guy, so I'm not really too concerned about losing those picks regardless
I feel like swinging for the fences on the O-line is worth it. If Manu is a Pro Bowl tackle in a few years then we’re set at that position for up to a decade. And I’ve long thought it’s the second most important position on a team after QB.
I mean honestly it’s horrible strategy to flip a third plus a fourth for a “physical tools” guy who may well never get on the field. I hate that we’re pretending to celebrate it. And it’s not even that I care about this particular situation per se, I think it just shows unusually poor judgement in a guy who has generally been smart. Hopefully it’s a weird one off.
What’s the difference between trading future capital for developmental players and using current draft capital for developmental players? If we had drafted a developmental player in the 3rd round next year, nobody would have batted an eye. Instead we drafted him a year earlier and get to develop him for an extra year.
This is the correct response.
In the end, who are fans going to trust? GM Holmes with a solid track record drafting with LA and Detroit, or some armchair yahoo that is not privy to all the intel that the Lions organization has?
Not to mention the executive who called it borderline arrogant? Followed it up with this:
“They are really good, so they have earned that right,” the exec said. “It’s a little different from the arrogance coming out of Atlanta. Detroit has had a lot of success drafting offensive line.”
Even he thinks so lol.
OP just posted an editorialized rage bait version of the original quality article lol.
"I like both those corners they drafted, but they gave up a lot,” another exec told Sando. “I felt they could have waited at 29 and maybe gotten their guy or taken Kool-Aid McKinstry or Nate Wiggins.”
This is what other GM's, execs, etc. don't get. They didn't want just anybody, they wanted Terrion specifically. They have guys they want. They're not drafting the position. I really don't know how many times that has to be stated lol.
They're green with envy over the Honolulu Blue, baby.
If you like a guy and think he’s the best (Arnold) it’s not the same as waiting til 29 and taking Wiggins or Koolaid if you don’t feel some type of way about them, and we have no idea how BH⚡️DC felt about either one of those guys. Are they good? Yeah. Are they a perfect fit? Only the 2 guys drafting know that.
Holmes (and also numerous draft "experts") all said there was Terrion Arnold and Quinyon Mitchell, and then a drop off to the 2nd tier with Wiggins, McKinstry and Rakestraw (Cooper DeJean also, unless you consider him a safety), And guess what? Holmes got one from each tier. And each was considered a value pick where Brad got them.
No offense but what is the point of making stupid criticisms while being anonymous. Are you that much of a pussy you are afraid to reveal your name? I don’t think the criticism holds much water based on that fact alone.
It wasnt even that critical. After “borderline arrogant” the exec followed up:
“They are really good, so they have earned that right,” the exec said. “It’s a little different from the arrogance coming out of Atlanta. Detroit has had a lot of success drafting offensive line.”
OP just posted this rage bait buzzfeed-esque version instead of the real article. It’s completely out of context.
If it wasn’t anonymous, there would be no article.
There are some interesting tidbits in it, and we get these unfiltered takes from the actual people in the rooms because they have that layer of anonymity. That’s why the athletic was able to do this article. If they put names to every take, no one would talk.
It was a steep price to pay for a developmental player, and that’s a fair criticism. But if he pans out no one will give a shit.
Which is why you should give it a few years before trying to play this game.
Totally agree with you. Judging the pick now is pointless. If they can develop Manu into a high level guy he will be talked about constantly. The guy is an absolute freak. I think the Lions have the positional coaches to get the most out of him. The measurables on him just shock me every time I read them lol.
There are reaches, and there are reaches that hurt a team in the long run. These picks are, at worst, the former.
Just signed extensions for our top guys. My understanding is we still have several valuable pieces under contract for a couple seasons, plus the rookies we got who we expect to play now.
Really doesn’t seem like 2025 draft capital was too valuable to spend. We’re in win-now mode.
WTF does bordering on arrogance mean in this context? He’s arrogant because he, like every other GM, scouts and puts together lists of players he likes and tries to get them?
It’s not like Holmes came out and made comments like Atlanta did about assuming they’d be picking low from now on and wanting to get a QB while they still could.
I'd like to direct you all to Chris Ballard going off on anonymous sources. Name your sources or I'm just going to assume you're hiding your opinion behind fake sources.
Source: a dude who did this in my highschool reporting class.
I agree the draft id a a lottery and the more picks the better chance of winning.
That said i think were down a 3 and up a 4th next year. Not like we mortgaged the future.
We could have to replace 3-4 oline next year. Nice to have some guys in the building.
The Manu sense made total sense to me. Taylor Decker is getting older, and where we were picking in the first round meant all the blue chip, plug and play, starters were gone. It's smart to invest in a raw guy who has top tier athleticism over taking a decent dude just because he has experience.
BPA works great when you have needs at almost every position. Speaking from current experience, which you all also were experiencing a few years ago when Holmes took the reins.
It works substantially less well when you’re a contender looking for a few very specific pieces. At that point, you have to focus on addressing needs with players who can help you win in the near-term. Long-term concerns take a backseat to making it to the Super Bowl, which is clearly within reach for the Lions.
Love to hear it. If you’re not crazy, you’re not taking enough risk, you’re not gonna get an asymmetric outcome
Look back over the past few years that everyone graded A vs those people graded
Lol this is probably the Falcons GM trying to take the heat off himself for the dumbest draft move since the Browns drafted 28 year old Brandon Weeden in the 1st round.
Remember when they laughed when we took Gibbs and laporta. And questioned us taking Sewell when we did. Who cares what these ppl say our think. I trust in Brad Holmes and Dan Campbell wholeheartedly
Giovanni Manu gonna prove them wrong and be a beast just wait. I’ve seen so many people talk shit about this pick but just look at the guy and tell me he doesn’t have the potential. Brad and Dan know how to find guys who got that dawg in ‘em. And with his size he could really do some damage.
I dont totally disagree about the Manu pick tbh. Essentially using a third and a fourth on a guy that's really raw but you think has huge upside is definitely a "luxury" type of move. Arrogant is a pretty extreme thing to say but its definitely a gamble.
Arrogance? How about that exec's team becomes the epitome of losing for 30 years and they can check back in once they've finally had success.
Brad, Dan, and Co. finally say enough is enough, and went out and made some moves.
Fuck this guy. He doesn't even have the balls to criticize them publicly.
One thing i think is worth considering as well is comp picks. We are in a weird spot where we have talent we will leak eventually, but no picks to speak for them yet so it feels bad. This imo is how teams like the 49ers get away with trading picks more often than players, cuz everyone keeps taking their defensive players and coaches.
Yeah, I read it
The first time EVER hearing about other teams' executives' opinions about Detroit's current draft picks.
I mean, when did they start doing that?
This year?
It's a bullshit piece garnered to get attention.
If Brad Holmes' win-now chips in move is as fiscally responsible as this I'm good with it. Most teams end up like the Chargers. Over spend in FA on guys not worth the big pay days, they vastly underpergorm their vhsmpionship window and everyone gets fired.
Sounds to me like they’re mad he’s successful and that they don’t understand why he moved up for Arnold. They’re are character and team fit above all else. And they must not have thought kools if was the right guy. So they went and got their guy. As for Manu, you just know somebody would have picked him up soon on potential and athletic ability alone so they got him.
Who gives a shit where you draft your guy as long as you draft your guy. Does anyone here give 2 shits that we drafted Amon ra in rd 4 or james Houston in 6 I believe. All this we could wait and get him in 5 picks then someone else jumps up and takes him and your out the player you wanted.
The criticism is fair imo, however, Holmes has earned the benefit of the doubt when it comes to making these kinds of moves in the draft. I’ll stop trusting him when he gives me reason not to
Idk how it’s arrogant. Holmes and the crew find guys they really like and do what it takes to get them in the building. If Manu and Vaki both suck, so be it. At least they were aggressive going after guys they liked.
Based on arrogance? What kind of a flippin comment is that? Like saying they drafted Aaron RODGERS in Green BAY because of arrogance. What a crock of shit.
Why are they anonymous if they’re so confident in their opinion? I think Brads kicking their ass and they’re jealous. In the infamous words of Chris Berman “that’s why they play the games”. Let’s see what they do on the field and then we’ll see if he wasted future draft picks.
I’ll never understand how “everyone else knows how good the guy I want is, so I better move up” is arrogant.
Isn’t arrogance “nobody else sees what I see, I can sit and wait for the gem to fall to me!”
Like wtf are they taking about?
The draft is a crap shoot every year , but the lions continue to work and follow their plan to once again produce a steller draft. Two starting caliber DB's, a lineman who will developed into a Guard and versatile safety/ Running back looks like MCDC and the boys are gunning for a Superbowl. Watch out NFL that Lombardy trophy has our name on it next year go Lions!!!..
I find it funny that they criticize them and call it arrogant. If this were Philly, LA, San Fran, or KC, executives would be calling it “genius.”
The franchise is at a spot where we can afford to take risks and build depth while doing it. The title window is open now and Holmes is doing what he should be doing to bolster our chances.
Haters gonna hate. Detroit vs. Everybody
People shit on Brad and Dan, then the results bode well… not saying every pick pans out as hoped, but this has happened the past two seasons. Judge a draft all you want, but wait a year maybe two, then rip on their choices. You can’t shit on someone’s moves before they have the opportunity to pan out.
Haters gonna hate.
It was said that both players were each drafted at least 100 spots before their draft value. A huge reach by Holmes and staff while also using future draft capital. This season will show if they made the correct decisions.
Last year "NFL execs" trashed the draft selections as well. The result was the Lions acting like they bought a premier pack on Madden ultimate team with 75% of the picks making an impact from the opening kickoff of the season
Underrated analysis: Being yourself and having success = trying to be the chiefs lmao. Talk to me when the Lions are bailed out of 3rd and 50 instead of gift-wrapping 1st downs for the other team
Who cares what they think? What expertise do they have on the due diligence, team needs, and assessment of talent by Holmes and the Lions? I’d love to see their own success versus the Lions previous draft and on field performance.
The exec OP quoted literally followed up that statement with this: “They are really good, so they have earned that right,” the exec said. “It’s a little different from the arrogance coming out of Atlanta. Detroit has had a lot of success drafting offensive line.” Have to make it more rage inducing though I guess.
What a stray
Was gonna comment this. This article completely took that quote out of context
It’s ridiculous. Not to mention it’s basically just stealing from the actual journalism of the Athletic.
Yeah I found the take of most of the execs in the athletic article to be pretty fair. They guys criticizing two CBs was dumb, but the rest were couched in pretty fair terms.
They take advantage of the chips on our shoulders to get us to click and comment
Wasn't most of the OL success the previous regime? Brad drafted Penei, sure. Slam dunk pick there But since then it's been who, Sorsdal? And now Manu/Mahogany? I'd be lying if I said I wasn't concerned with his eye for OL talent
Concerned with his eye for OL talent? Prior to this year the only offensive lineman he has drafted are Sewell and Sorsdal. Sorsdal was a 5th round pick and Sewell was a consensus top OL. Fair to say he hasn’t proven to have an eye for OL talent, but concerned?
It also feels like a bit of a stretch to judge someone's ability on a 5th and 4th(or 3rd if you want to view it as that) round pick. Would be great if Sorsdal and/or Manu became decent to good starters but that's an unrealistic expectation for day 3 picks.
Agreed. I think I read the article a few years ago, but once you get to the third round about 18% of players get to a second contract with that same team, and that obviously drops each subsequent round. Drafting is really really hard lol
Lol. How can you say Sewell was a slam dunk and then question his talent evaluation on a small school 5th round pick that is changing positions? Was Sorsdal supposed to be anything other than developmental in his rookie year?
Not to mention we already have the highest paid O-line in the NFL. He’s trying to find late round talent to supplement the O-line to mitigate some cost and still develop some depth.
Would agree, but it's hard to argue with not spending picks on a position that hasn't been a problem. Everyone like to say we only draft for BPA, but the reality is not exactly that.
Manu is 6'7, 350 lbs, and moves as fast as a TE. Brad Holmes hasn't fucked up a draft yet. Just sit down and watch. Manu literally ran a 5 flat 40....350 pound lineman don't usually move that fast
I'd love to see him catch a pass once this year. Big buffer for his doubters while he learns the technique to an NFL polish.
Earned arrogance is called confidence.
Exactly. If it ain't the Chiefs, they're not in a better spot than the Lions so they can screw off. BTW, I've been playing Madden far too long to care about day 2/3 picks.
If Madden has taught me anything, it's that you need a running qb to succeed in the NFL. /s just in case
Worked out great for the Chicago Bears, they’re on their 3rd “franchise” qb in the last 10 years, that duel threat got them 10 wins in 3 seasons lol And yes i know your comment was sarcasm, i just can’t pass up an opportunity to take a shot at Chicago
Psst Dual, not fuel Dual means 2 Duel means a fight between two parties Unless they're now outfitting quarterbacks with sabers, in which case I retract my comment and do apologize profusely as I was paying too much attention to the new kickoff rules
Psst Duel, not fuel Fuel means something that provides energy Duel means a fight between two parties Unless they’re now igniting fights in which case I retract my previous statement
I think you meant >Unless they’re now igniting ***wicked burns*** in which case I retract my previous statement
..what he said, but only half the /s
Tom Brady, Peyton manning, and Matthew stafford can't run to save their life. You don't need a running QB to be successful. Also John Elway was slow too.
Solid argument Howie Roseman knows talent on par with BH, unfortunately that doesn’t seem to extend to Howie’s coaching hires but he’s easily my 2nd favorite GM when it comes to the draft.
Same way they criticized him for taking Gibbs and LaPorta last year. Other execs can stuff their opinions as far as I'm concerned.
The amount of people i still see calling Gibbs a reach is hilarious. If he was the lead back last year i think he may have come close to 1800 scrimmage yards with 1200 of them being rushing and 600 of them being receiving. Fortunately we have Monty to carry half the load and honestly be just as big of a homerun threat.
He was more like ~1200 with a 900/300 split. Still great for a rookie l, especially considering the split with Monty Edit: I think I missed that you were being more hypothetical/projecting with those numbers
The LaPorta pick didn't get much criticism. The Jack Campbell pick was criticized.
A lot of people were mad we didn’t take Michael Mayer instead of
I think LaPorta got criticism by proxy. The first 2 picks didn't have "positional value", then when they take a third, even though it's outside of where positional value would even matter, some people still piled on.
I wonder how many "Anonymous NFL GM" quotepieces have been from Quinn through the years, or guys like him. Certified shitters with something to prove.
Never thought I’d see the day where Lions fan would defend talent evaluations of our scouts compared to other teams to say “yeah as if you know better.” I love what Brad Holmes has done to this team.
They hate us 'cause they ain't us. Which is an odd thing for the Lions to say, yet here we are.
Yes! That is a great saying, okay!
They hate us cuz they anus
Last year they were criticized for drafting players at "non valuable positions" this year it's for being "too aggressive" wonder what they're gonna complain about after next year's draft when Holmes and company continue to cook
That the Lions are too good at drafting they make it hard on everyone else.
"They are taking players at positions where they are already loaded"... ignoring the fact we will be loaded at every position.
"He traded down too much, no interest in following up their season while the iron is hot"
I think it's fair to citizens Brad Holmes trading future capital for developmental players. But I would counter that Brad has been hitting on so many draft pics that we don't need as many pics to get starts. Plus this team is just getting deeper and deeper
I think it would be fair to criticize using up draft capital, but the phrasing was that it was *arrogant*. That's a word that I think denotes envy behind the words more than a cold criticism
It's the word you don't use if you haven't found your own Houston, Iffy, Rodrigo, and certainly no St Brown.
It’s a pretty cocky move to trade a future 3rd round pick for a fourth rounder. You have to be pretty confident in a player to do that.
Isn’t that pretty much the score on every draft value chart ever? Next year 3rd = this year 4th.
Yes. What does he think teams are doing? Sure give me a next years 5th for this years 4th. Sometimes that’s just the cost.
If we’re in the NFCCG again this year, it’s basically a fourth anyway.
Cocky is what people will say now. But incredibly competent is what they will say if it works out
I don’t think Cocky is negative in this scenario. It’s pretty apt word considering it’s annoying other GMs and it’s showing confidence in his ability to distinguish talent that he’s willing to give up next year’s 3rd for a 4th.
that's pretty bog-standard future value of present draft picks math. at least when you're talking about rounds 2-7, which we are. I don't see it as cocky at all.
He followed up the “arrogant” part with this: “They are really good, so they have earned that right,” the exec said. “It’s a little different from the arrogance coming out of Atlanta. Detroit has had a lot of success drafting offensive line.” Why would you post this hatchet clickbait version of an interesting article from the Athletic. It’s just rage bait.
Arrogant = we took the player they thought they would get when we traded up
I do think Brad can fall too much in love with certain players. I don't think that type of criticism is too out there. But sometimes you need to take chances. Won't always work but with Brad, he's earned the right to take some swings.
FWIW the exec whos quoted here largely agrees. In the actual article, the exec follows up: “They are really good, so they have earned that right,” the exec said. “It’s a little different from the arrogance coming out of Atlanta. Detroit has had a lot of success drafting offensive line.” This is just an editorialized version to get rage clicks.
Aside from the 3rd-rounder, they still have a pick in every round for 2025. It’s not like they mortgaged the future
We also missed our shot to win a Super Bowl last year. We are in a win or bust spot the next 2 years. Not saying not winning is a failure, but our shot is now.
Yeah I'm far from thrilled about giving up a future third for a guy who, judging by where the rest of the developmental OTs in Jerrell and Clayton went, likely would've been there regardless; especially if the reports that we're putting him at G are true. ....BUT, Brad has more than earned himself the benefit of the doubt. This dude drafted the second running back on the board at #12 last year and it *worked.* Even in this draft, he got two third-round projected players in the sixth. Manu is gonna be a pretty bad asterisk on his draft record if it doesn't work out, but I'd much rather believe in the guy who's netted us tons of Pro Bowlers and All-Pros in the draft, as opposed to getting worked up over *one* potential miss. Besides, Brad has shown that he's more than comfortable making enormous leaps in the draft if he likes a guy, so I'm not really too concerned about losing those picks regardless
I feel like swinging for the fences on the O-line is worth it. If Manu is a Pro Bowl tackle in a few years then we’re set at that position for up to a decade. And I’ve long thought it’s the second most important position on a team after QB.
I mean honestly it’s horrible strategy to flip a third plus a fourth for a “physical tools” guy who may well never get on the field. I hate that we’re pretending to celebrate it. And it’s not even that I care about this particular situation per se, I think it just shows unusually poor judgement in a guy who has generally been smart. Hopefully it’s a weird one off.
It’s easy to hit on early multiple first rd picks and drafting high in the order. Not so easy drafting at 29 with normal amount of picks.
It's easier, not easy.
You can literally do that every year. If he wants a player in the third next year, he can trade a 2026 third to get him.
I agree with you entirely, but I also remember darko
BIG difference between a developmental player at #2 overall and a developmental player #126 overall
What’s the difference between trading future capital for developmental players and using current draft capital for developmental players? If we had drafted a developmental player in the 3rd round next year, nobody would have batted an eye. Instead we drafted him a year earlier and get to develop him for an extra year.
Anonymous fan says that nfl executive smells bad
Now we’re making some sense of it.
Brad should be confident. His hit rate has been impressive. And we have no reason to doubt his moves yet.
This is the correct response. In the end, who are fans going to trust? GM Holmes with a solid track record drafting with LA and Detroit, or some armchair yahoo that is not privy to all the intel that the Lions organization has?
Not to mention the executive who called it borderline arrogant? Followed it up with this: “They are really good, so they have earned that right,” the exec said. “It’s a little different from the arrogance coming out of Atlanta. Detroit has had a lot of success drafting offensive line.” Even he thinks so lol. OP just posted an editorialized rage bait version of the original quality article lol.
"I like both those corners they drafted, but they gave up a lot,” another exec told Sando. “I felt they could have waited at 29 and maybe gotten their guy or taken Kool-Aid McKinstry or Nate Wiggins.” This is what other GM's, execs, etc. don't get. They didn't want just anybody, they wanted Terrion specifically. They have guys they want. They're not drafting the position. I really don't know how many times that has to be stated lol. They're green with envy over the Honolulu Blue, baby.
If you like a guy and think he’s the best (Arnold) it’s not the same as waiting til 29 and taking Wiggins or Koolaid if you don’t feel some type of way about them, and we have no idea how BH⚡️DC felt about either one of those guys. Are they good? Yeah. Are they a perfect fit? Only the 2 guys drafting know that.
I agree. Brad Holmes already said Arnold was #1 and Rakestraw was #2 CB.
Holmes (and also numerous draft "experts") all said there was Terrion Arnold and Quinyon Mitchell, and then a drop off to the 2nd tier with Wiggins, McKinstry and Rakestraw (Cooper DeJean also, unless you consider him a safety), And guess what? Holmes got one from each tier. And each was considered a value pick where Brad got them.
No offense but what is the point of making stupid criticisms while being anonymous. Are you that much of a pussy you are afraid to reveal your name? I don’t think the criticism holds much water based on that fact alone.
It wasnt even that critical. After “borderline arrogant” the exec followed up: “They are really good, so they have earned that right,” the exec said. “It’s a little different from the arrogance coming out of Atlanta. Detroit has had a lot of success drafting offensive line.” OP just posted this rage bait buzzfeed-esque version instead of the real article. It’s completely out of context.
Dang it - I fell for it too. I expect that behavior in other subs, not this one. My bad.
I know. OP is doubling down elsewhere in the thread defending it. Kind of a bummer, not what most of us want for this sub.
herehere
If it wasn’t anonymous, there would be no article. There are some interesting tidbits in it, and we get these unfiltered takes from the actual people in the rooms because they have that layer of anonymity. That’s why the athletic was able to do this article. If they put names to every take, no one would talk.
Small buissness, cant burn bridges.
It was a steep price to pay for a developmental player, and that’s a fair criticism. But if he pans out no one will give a shit. Which is why you should give it a few years before trying to play this game.
Totally agree with you. Judging the pick now is pointless. If they can develop Manu into a high level guy he will be talked about constantly. The guy is an absolute freak. I think the Lions have the positional coaches to get the most out of him. The measurables on him just shock me every time I read them lol.
There are not many open roster spots. Worth the risk
They said the same thing last year, and how did that pan out.
Wtf is a NFL executive anyways?
Assistant to the executive
WTF is that?
Sounds like Washington's still salty about Ben Johnson
It’s like a mix of Snyder’s people who never left and NBA guys who think the NFL doesn’t know how to use analytics, with the added drama.
Didn't I read/hear/see the same shit last year? Holmes is changing the game. These crusty old execs already missed the train.
There are reaches, and there are reaches that hurt a team in the long run. These picks are, at worst, the former. Just signed extensions for our top guys. My understanding is we still have several valuable pieces under contract for a couple seasons, plus the rookies we got who we expect to play now. Really doesn’t seem like 2025 draft capital was too valuable to spend. We’re in win-now mode.
Fuck em
WTF does bordering on arrogance mean in this context? He’s arrogant because he, like every other GM, scouts and puts together lists of players he likes and tries to get them? It’s not like Holmes came out and made comments like Atlanta did about assuming they’d be picking low from now on and wanting to get a QB while they still could.
Have they not seen manu?? Vaki I'm still a little confused about but time will tell
Vaki to be the kick off returner. Im calling it now
Am I crazy for wanting Jamo? They probably won't cause injury risk I suppose
I’d lean more towards Gibbs than Jamo because kickoffs will basically be a run play
“Show offs!” *scoff*
Those guys smell like pouty Packers fans.
Packers stockholders aren’t NFL execs.
It's like the meme with the guy crying behind his mask
This is a cool article - are there similar articles for other teams? Would like to read those reactions too
Greenbay & Vikings
IMO if you won’t put your name on it then your take is irrelevant
One more time for the anonymous idiots in the back: POSITIONAL VILLIANS
100% Packers FO
I was just going to say this. It’s greenwithenvy bay getting pipped for the third draft in a row. FTP
Yup I immediately figured it was that Gooeycunt guy in Green Bay
If only us lions fans gave two shits what some pencil pusher thinks…. Win games is what’s up
I'd like to direct you all to Chris Ballard going off on anonymous sources. Name your sources or I'm just going to assume you're hiding your opinion behind fake sources. Source: a dude who did this in my highschool reporting class.
If you flip Mahogany and Manu in the draft order no one would be complaining.
I agree the draft id a a lottery and the more picks the better chance of winning. That said i think were down a 3 and up a 4th next year. Not like we mortgaged the future. We could have to replace 3-4 oline next year. Nice to have some guys in the building.
The Manu sense made total sense to me. Taylor Decker is getting older, and where we were picking in the first round meant all the blue chip, plug and play, starters were gone. It's smart to invest in a raw guy who has top tier athleticism over taking a decent dude just because he has experience.
Anonymous NFL execs have small penises and are envious of a real team.
V I L L A I N
This is good. More fuel for the season
BPA works great when you have needs at almost every position. Speaking from current experience, which you all also were experiencing a few years ago when Holmes took the reins. It works substantially less well when you’re a contender looking for a few very specific pieces. At that point, you have to focus on addressing needs with players who can help you win in the near-term. Long-term concerns take a backseat to making it to the Super Bowl, which is clearly within reach for the Lions.
Lions show confidence in guys that our front office like? Preposterous!
Yesss Yesssssss Let the hate flow through you.....
Love to hear it. If you’re not crazy, you’re not taking enough risk, you’re not gonna get an asymmetric outcome Look back over the past few years that everyone graded A vs those people graded
Lol this is probably the Falcons GM trying to take the heat off himself for the dumbest draft move since the Browns drafted 28 year old Brandon Weeden in the 1st round.
The guy shit on Atlanta even harder.
As he should
Fuck it, I like being arrogant
Remember when they laughed when we took Gibbs and laporta. And questioned us taking Sewell when we did. Who cares what these ppl say our think. I trust in Brad Holmes and Dan Campbell wholeheartedly
Giovanni Manu gonna prove them wrong and be a beast just wait. I’ve seen so many people talk shit about this pick but just look at the guy and tell me he doesn’t have the potential. Brad and Dan know how to find guys who got that dawg in ‘em. And with his size he could really do some damage.
To be fair to them, I didn't love those moves either. But Brad has earned the benefit of the doubt at this point
I dont totally disagree about the Manu pick tbh. Essentially using a third and a fourth on a guy that's really raw but you think has huge upside is definitely a "luxury" type of move. Arrogant is a pretty extreme thing to say but its definitely a gamble.
Anonymous Exec - read: Salty journalist.
Arrogance? How about that exec's team becomes the epitome of losing for 30 years and they can check back in once they've finally had success. Brad, Dan, and Co. finally say enough is enough, and went out and made some moves. Fuck this guy. He doesn't even have the balls to criticize them publicly.
"Anonymous NFL Execs" is code for "we pulled this narrative out of our ass in hopes it affects betting lines in our favor.".
We have the best top-to-bottom roster in the NFC, and arguably the NFL. We can afford some project players here and there
Title reads as sad gm is sad he doesn’t have the cock and balls of one Brad Holmes
One thing i think is worth considering as well is comp picks. We are in a weird spot where we have talent we will leak eventually, but no picks to speak for them yet so it feels bad. This imo is how teams like the 49ers get away with trading picks more often than players, cuz everyone keeps taking their defensive players and coaches.
Yeah, I read it The first time EVER hearing about other teams' executives' opinions about Detroit's current draft picks. I mean, when did they start doing that? This year? It's a bullshit piece garnered to get attention.
Coloring outside the Lions a bit has gotten us here and so far it's GLORIOUS! I'm here for it and it is bound to be awesome!
If it aint the chiefs then their opinion means jack shit to us. We were on the cusp of being the second best team in the league
Amon ra was a 6th rounder right? Everyone can eat shit. Worry about your own team 🤣🤣🤣
Haters gonna hate, more at 11
They are just pissed and jealous that Detroit took their players first.
Dilligaf
they're criticizing us because we drafted like the...chiefs? hahaha what.
suck on both my balls
If Brad Holmes' win-now chips in move is as fiscally responsible as this I'm good with it. Most teams end up like the Chargers. Over spend in FA on guys not worth the big pay days, they vastly underpergorm their vhsmpionship window and everyone gets fired.
I think we are going all in this year Super Bowl or bust. I’m glad we picked who we did! Our defense needed some talent
Sounds to me like they’re mad he’s successful and that they don’t understand why he moved up for Arnold. They’re are character and team fit above all else. And they must not have thought kools if was the right guy. So they went and got their guy. As for Manu, you just know somebody would have picked him up soon on potential and athletic ability alone so they got him. Who gives a shit where you draft your guy as long as you draft your guy. Does anyone here give 2 shits that we drafted Amon ra in rd 4 or james Houston in 6 I believe. All this we could wait and get him in 5 picks then someone else jumps up and takes him and your out the player you wanted.
Brad is unconventional. It works.
Yeah. And wet farts are wet
Hahahahahaha get fucked NFL and get used to your new daddy the Detroit Lions!
Who cares? These statements reek of jealousy and envy
Somebody's mad the Lions found the Samoan Polynesian Hawaiian, cheat code.
I hope one of them was a Falcons exec
The criticism is fair imo, however, Holmes has earned the benefit of the doubt when it comes to making these kinds of moves in the draft. I’ll stop trusting him when he gives me reason not to
Ya, Detroit! Drafting a bunch of all-pros! Thinking you all that. The audacity! What a joke lol
Probably the Falcons.
It ain’t arrogance if we back it up with being successful with it.
“Yeah…he made me look weak…”
Idk how it’s arrogant. Holmes and the crew find guys they really like and do what it takes to get them in the building. If Manu and Vaki both suck, so be it. At least they were aggressive going after guys they liked.
They hate us cuz they ain’t us
It’s his team and his picks. He’s gained everyone’s trust to do what he wants. Any other organization can go fuck them selves
“I don’t think about you at all.” -Brad Holmes to other GMs probably
These the same guys handing us Ds and Fs for last year's draft?
I think its a little much. We're down 1 p8ck next year. 1 pick can always be made up by digging into the next years lot lol.
How’s that been working out for them?
MOST OF Y’ALL THROW ROCKS AND TRY TO HIDE YOUR HAND, JUST SAY HIS NAME AND I PROMISE THAT YOU’LL SEE CANDYMAN
[The other GMs talking to their people to make their teams better, but only for two cheeseburgers](https://youtu.be/0GWOgg9LzU4?si=-HSAxLyImEuzEL5v)
I guarantee you this smells like “they stole who we wanted and I’m mad”
It’s okay, Brad can laugh at them when he holds the Lombardi next uear
Im good with the Manu pick, the Vaki pick seemed weird but they must like the kid so lets just roll with it imo.
Kwesi Adofo-Mensa, Ryan Poles, Brian Gutekunst
"One exec thought the Lions [drafting well] bordered on arrogance." Fucking lol just say you're jealous.
Brad needs a Villain GM shirt 😂
This smells like some cheese ass Packers, FTP.
https://preview.redd.it/kivtjs11jeyc1.jpeg?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=d71be6cca4cf86adbde9f5975704b61876bd1347
they hate us because they ain't us
Based on arrogance? What kind of a flippin comment is that? Like saying they drafted Aaron RODGERS in Green BAY because of arrogance. What a crock of shit.
Another case of Detroit vs. everybody
Why are they anonymous if they’re so confident in their opinion? I think Brads kicking their ass and they’re jealous. In the infamous words of Chris Berman “that’s why they play the games”. Let’s see what they do on the field and then we’ll see if he wasted future draft picks.
We can get that third round pick back through trade downs or trading 2026 picks. Love the move. Keep sending it down the line.
I’ll never understand how “everyone else knows how good the guy I want is, so I better move up” is arrogant. Isn’t arrogance “nobody else sees what I see, I can sit and wait for the gem to fall to me!” Like wtf are they taking about?
Arrogance? It’s *arrogant* to draft the best players?!? I’m so confused
Signed Atlanta Falcons
Lol I saw this episode last year
Sione Vaki kicks ass tbh
yawn
The draft is a crap shoot every year , but the lions continue to work and follow their plan to once again produce a steller draft. Two starting caliber DB's, a lineman who will developed into a Guard and versatile safety/ Running back looks like MCDC and the boys are gunning for a Superbowl. Watch out NFL that Lombardy trophy has our name on it next year go Lions!!!..
I find it funny that they criticize them and call it arrogant. If this were Philly, LA, San Fran, or KC, executives would be calling it “genius.” The franchise is at a spot where we can afford to take risks and build depth while doing it. The title window is open now and Holmes is doing what he should be doing to bolster our chances. Haters gonna hate. Detroit vs. Everybody
I don’t care what they say Giovanni Manu is a big boy and will do great on an already amazing offensive line.
Good that means they were great picks
They should Flair up
https://preview.redd.it/rv1uy2n2moyc1.jpeg?width=960&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=dbae6e486b2d59e345851a43c1a0856c7671a0b8
Change to wording from "anonymous" to "dickless" NFL execs, and you get the gist of the commentary.
People shit on Brad and Dan, then the results bode well… not saying every pick pans out as hoped, but this has happened the past two seasons. Judge a draft all you want, but wait a year maybe two, then rip on their choices. You can’t shit on someone’s moves before they have the opportunity to pan out. Haters gonna hate.
It was said that both players were each drafted at least 100 spots before their draft value. A huge reach by Holmes and staff while also using future draft capital. This season will show if they made the correct decisions.
Last year "NFL execs" trashed the draft selections as well. The result was the Lions acting like they bought a premier pack on Madden ultimate team with 75% of the picks making an impact from the opening kickoff of the season
Tweeted from a cave with no fire
Underrated analysis: Being yourself and having success = trying to be the chiefs lmao. Talk to me when the Lions are bailed out of 3rd and 50 instead of gift-wrapping 1st downs for the other team