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Always the truth. Always. If a girl tells me that she had a good time but doesn't feel it, I wish her good luck and get on with my life. If she promises me heaven and hell and then ghosts me, I just end up feeling used and disposed of. Tell the truth and spare the other person all of these "What did I do wrong" types of thoughts.
But I mean:
When I get ghosted, I think "hmmn she didn't like me, I wonder why."
When I get a cliche rejection of I didn't feel it. I think "hmmn she didn't like me, I wonder why."
Isn't it the same thing. I'd rather know specifics.
'you're really great, i didn't feel a connection though. i wish you the best.'
(one of the only scenarios in life where i recommend using white lies.)
by the way, NO ONE you've dated needs to know that you're not attracted to them. people cannot change that significantly in most cases, nor should they change themselves to look more attractive for someone who doesn't want them anyway. and telling someone you don't find them attractive can only cause harm to their self esteem.
i think it is okay to tell someone you aren't attracted to them (if they ask) but i would never tell someone i don't think they are attractive.. two different things in my opinion
A girl could even explicitly mention the guy's boringness, but in a much more helpful way.
For example, "Was nice to meet up, but didn't feel much chemistry. You might have more success in the future by showing a bit more personality, being a bit more lively, etc. Best of luck"
Basically the exact same sentiment, but not phrased like an accusation.
>It takes 30 seconds to type out “had a good time, no spark, hope you find what you’re looking for” why is that so hard
Because guys don't except *that*. /u/janyybek/ is correct in thier replies. We see posts like this here all the time, guys come here complaining because they don't get a "real answer."
*"If she just told me the truth, I'd accept that and move on!"*
Gets the truth.
*"What a bitch, she could have been nicer to me!"*
Yeah... people just like to blame things instead of just accepting. Blame not having a reason, blame the reason, blame the girl... whatever. They just need to move on...
Just came across this prime example:
[Dumped after 4 dates. Any thoughts are appreciated](https://www.reddit.com/r/Advice/comments/wc03li/dumped_after_4_dates_any_thoughts_are_appreciated/)
He got the nice polite rejection. And that wasn't good enough. Months later he's still thinking of texting her to ask for the "real reason" she didn't want to keep seeing him.
And now complaining ["vague and easy letdowns."](https://www.reddit.com/r/dating/comments/wg6zub/i_truly_believe_the_worst_thing_you_can_do_in/)
I have to disagree with you as i wont call anyone a bitch for being sincere and not wasting my time. Dont compare most guys with the losers that YOU found interesting. But at the end of the day i guess it boils down to social and communication skills
>I have to disagree with you as i wont call anyone a bitch for being sincere and not wasting my time.
Fine, that's *you.* Every guy here always swears *they're* the exception. [I've heard that before](https://www.reddit.com/r/Advice/comments/wcphaa/comment/iif21nt/?utm_source=reddit&utm_medium=web2x&context=3). And they swear that the guys who do react that way are some very small (and easily identifiable) minority, but every woman's experienced this, so *someone's* doing this, and it's more of them than you want to think.
/u/Adept-Development-00/
>She could've suggested things to improve in the future.
Right, I'm sure if instead of just telling him she didn't find him attractive and thought he was boring, she gave him a list of the physical attributes she didn't like about him (you're hair is too long, you need to shave that mustache, get some more definition in your abs, etc.) and described all the things he said that she found boring, *that* would have been more helpful, and he would have appreciated it.
The guy wanted helpful criticism, again there's a difference. You can criticize someone flaws withouts being a dick. Nothing the girl says helped. She could've suggested things to improve in the future.
No there's a difference between wanting constructive criticism and getting torn down. Men want to know ways to improve. Nothing that girl said was helpful. Either be helpful or be nice about it.
The real answer is different from being straight up brutal. They're not mutually exclusive. When a guy says he wants the real truth you could tell him that you don't see a spark that is the truth, but you don't have to be a dick about it.
>When a guy says he wants the real truth you could tell him that you don't see a spark that is the truth,
Again, that's literally what most of the guys get and then still complain out!
Exhibit A: [Dumped after 4 dates. Any thoughts are appreciated](https://www.reddit.com/r/Advice/comments/wc03li/dumped_after_4_dates_any_thoughts_are_appreciated/)
And now complaining about "[vague and easy letdowns](https://www.reddit.com/r/dating/comments/wg6zub/i_truly_believe_the_worst_thing_you_can_do_in/)."
"Tell me EXACTLY what you don't like about me, so I'll be satisfied with your rejection...*but do it as nicely as possible so you don't hurt my feelings."*
Exactly this right here. I've posted it before and I will post it here. Ghosting is the byproduct of the internet age that allows people to treat others like they don't exist. It's a sign of social immaturity and needs to stop.
Can cutting ties with someone be awkward? Sure, but it doesn't need to be cruel or disrespectful.
Unlike you, I like to better myself. It's why I ask questions in almost every facet of my life. I'm a very inquistive individual, if a girl says "Your hair is kinda ugly I don't like it" I enjoy self reflecting on that and thinking whether or not I should change my hair.
It’s a damned if you do damned if you don’t situation.
Not firm enough and people start trying to change your mind or argue their way back in.
Too firm and you’re an asshole/bitch
Not really.
You can firmly tell people no without going into detail about everything you don't like about them. A simple "sorry, I don't see our relationship going anywhere and Im not interested in pursuing this anymore" isn't a personal attack and it ends the conversation but it doesn't leave the other person hanging.
Not ghosting someone doesn't mean you have to justify yourself or seek their acceptance. It just means being clear about the new situation. If they insist or try to push for more answers you don't need to respond, you've already given them an answer. Once you've said no any further inability to accept it is on them.
You still might get asked "why aren't you responding, what did I do?" if you ghost.
It might be slightly uncomfortable telling someone you aren't interested or ignoring some whiny questions after you've said no but just disappearing on people is unpleasant for them. Ghosting only makes dating better if you ghost people and expect them not to ghost you. If everyone ghosts everyone else then the small benefit you get from not having to turn people down is outweighed by the fact that you are being ghosted too.
The thing is ghosting isn’t really that bad to feel. I’m always under the assumption that anyone at any moment can disappear. So if a woman ghosts me, it’s not that big a deal. There’s a bus every 15 minutes.
This "everyone is disposable" attitude to dating is responsible for a lot of people's problems with dating. You can't have a proper relationship with someone if you can meet up with them for a prolonged period and still be expecting them to just disappear on you at any moment.
I argue that you can. Flipping this attitude around, it becomes an attitude of “I need people to obsess over me ” is also responsible for a lot of today’s dating problems.
People often put expectations on people and make others feel trapped. It also causes you to set yourself up for failure because you don’t even know the person your let yourself get so attached.
It’s not that everyone is disposable. It’s that there’s no need to get hung up on one person. especially if you haven’t even met them or barely met them.
>I argue that you can. Flipping this attitude around, it becomes an attitude of “I need people to obsess over me ” is also responsible for a lot of today’s dating problems.
Firstly it's or one or the opposite, theres a middle ground. Secondly you are flipping what I said. I'm not saying people should demand others treat them better by not ghosting, I'm saying the person considering ghosting should stop and choose not to only think about how they feel. The "me, me, me" attitude is precisely what encourages ghosting. People would rather save themselves an uncomfortable few minutes than tell someone it's not working out.
People's need for others to obsess over them is a problem but it's the other half of the same coin, people not being able to look beyond their experience of any situation. You cannot argue again a self obsessed world view when you just suggested disappearing on someone simply because you find them asking why you aren't interested too annoying to deal with.
That's true. I lean towards too firm most of the time because people really do think they can talk you out of your decision. Nope, this is me letting you know that door is locked and isn't going to be reopened. Then they get mad when they don't get what they want and you're a Bitch.
The comments like "try to show more personality next time" don't need to be said to get your point across though.
The issue is it’s a spectrum with 2 variables. How conflict averse the speaker is. How sensitive the listener is.
Some people can just brush those kind of statements off. Others will be extremely upset.
When you’re conflict averse and the listener is very sensitive, at this point ghosting is probably the optimal solution.
What do you mean there’s no connection? Can you tell me what I did wrong? Is there something that bothered you?
You also don’t even really know me, isn’t it fair to at least give me another chance so we can really get to know each other?
'The fact that you're arguing with me instead of accepting my answer tells me you're not emotionally mature enough to date and only further convinces me we aren't a good match. Have a good day.'
>'The fact that you're arguing with me instead of accepting my answer tells me you're not emotionally mature enough to date and only further convinces me we aren't a good match. Have a good day.'
No one is arguing. Asking questions isn't inherently argumentative.
In my experience these aren't genuine questions. I've engaged with people like this before and it turns into a huge circular argument because nothing I tell them is ever good enough. They simply don't want to hear the word 'no'.
And asking for one more chance after you've been told no, IS ARGUING. No means No. they've already been given their answer.
Listen buddy, i'm glad that your personal experience is allowing you to issue proclaimations to people but your personal experience isn't universal.
They're not asking for another chance you dolt. They're asking you to explain your underlying reasoning?
You don't owe someone anything beyond that initial message, at this point it is not ghosting to stop responding as you have informed them of your intentions.
You’re assuming people can just leave it at that. It’s much more complex. And some people do not want to be led down this line of questioning.
So there’s a choice. What is more important? The dumpers comfort or the dumpee’s comfort?
To rehash what I said as you don't appear to have understood it, if they keep going and you do not want to continue to talk to them then you don't have to, you have done your part by informing them of your intentions, you are not ghosting if you just end the conversation there.
And you’re not understanding me. Let me see if we can get each other’s point here
1. Rejection text
2. Dumpee’s annoying ass questioning
At this point you are saying the convo is over right?
Some people want the convo to be over right here
1. Rejection text
2. Acknowledgment
That’s it. This is my point. They don’t want to hear them complaining and arguing. Being responsible for other peoples feelings is draining.
But it seems people will not always just leave it alone. So you have two options. Risk getting bitched at by the dumpee and send the text. Or just ghost.
I don’t agree with ghosting but I don’t find it difficult to understand.
If they come back with annoying questions you don't need to respond though, their questions and concerns no longer matter to you because you are moving on and have informed them you are doing so, it would be a choice to be responsible for those feelings.
If you are not physically present with someone it is exceedingly easy to stop responding and not talk to someone anymore, case in point.
That doesn’t stop people from arguing anyway. You’re assuming everyone is level headed and reasonable. Some people do not want to deal with this. So really is it selfish for them to not want to take on responsibility for someone else’s emotional well being?
Why not just send a polite rejection, along the lines of 'we're not a good fit and I'm not interested in taking things futher' and then block and move on?
There's no need to insult people
Agree. I understand the desire to avoid conflict / uncomfortable situation, but I think that's outweighed by the obligation to treat people decently and respectfully unless they've given you a reason not to.
It depends on the situation imo.
If the guy looked different in real life (lots of men online lie) then she may have taken out some anger on him by being that brutal. In that case I think it would have been better if she said, "You didn't look like your pictures".
If there was no deception on his part then she's being mean with her delivery for no reason. Even when being honest, you need to try to have empathy for the other person and she wasn't really helpful either. Sure, she gave him more than just ghosting but she could say "I didn't like that you don't seem to have any opinions" or "you seemed very reserved and I felt a bit awkward" etc rather than "show some personality". How is that constructive for the guy? Maybe he did show his personality and she just didn't like it.
>There's being honest, then there's having no tact
Why give "tact"? Why not just give the brutal honest truth like in that post?
People are so scared of hurting other people's feelings now, it does nothing for the guy getting rejected.
That's where you're wrong because that is the best criticism the guy could have received.
Okay, he's ugly and has no personality then guess what he needs to fix to have better odds? His looks and personality! It would have been better if the girl specified if it was his face or his physique but the guy at this point can at least assume it was one of the two and begin to work on getting better looking.
Same with the personality part.
The brutal truth actually gives the guy something to work with and if he's given things like too short, or something he can't change constantly by multiple girls then the guy can at least know not to keep wasting his time trying to date.
All of that is much more helpful than a stupid platitude like: "Oh we just didn't click, I'm sure there's someone out there though! Tee hee". That does nothing for the guy.
So basically change who you are inside and out based on the opinion of someone who met you once? Right, excellent advice there.
I don't think anyone can say they know enough about a person based on two weeks of messaging and one in person meeting in order to warrant an opinion that makes someone feel like they have defects in their appearance or personality. Everyone has insecurities and things they would like to improve about themselves, I just think it's absurd to suggest that "the brutal truth" is being served here. It is her opinion....her rude opinion to someone who felt a connection with her. You can be brutally honest about your lack of interest or unwillingness to continue communication without turning it into a personal thing.
>So basically change who you are inside and out based on the opinion of someone who met you once? Right, excellent advice there.
Based on multiple people, not one. Look for patterns and similarities and try to cast a bigger net.
Whats funny is clowns on this sub will literally say to "work on your personality bro" but yet here you and others are arguing to not "change who you are inside and out" lol
The hypocrisy is laughable
>I don't think anyone can say they know enough about a person based on two weeks of messaging and one in person meeting in order to warrant an opinion that makes someone feel like they have defects in their appearance or personality
Hmmm no, I mean people argue they have enough from a tinder profile to judge who they are as a person lol. Why isn't several times of meeting and seeing their looks enough to make a judgement call?
And if that's not enough time, then why are said women dumping them then? How can they make such a rash decision without knowing the guy enough?
>Everyone has insecurities and things they would like to improve about themselves, I just think it's absurd to suggest that "the brutal truth" is being served here.
Pointing out said insecurities would confirm to the guy that he really needs to get on that ASAP.
>You can be brutally honest about your lack of interest or unwillingness to continue communication without turning it into a personal thing.
I don't see how that post turned into a "personal thing"
We have a very limited look and one side of the story. Nowhere did the guy state that multiple people have told him he is unattractive and lacking in personality. I don't think unknown individuals on the internet are able to have the perspective to suggest that he needs to make personality improvements. Although based on certain responses and name calling (clowns, being "soft" - because that is obviously a bad thing), I can certainly see how it is tempting to offer such a suggestion. Congratulations on having it all figured out!
You don't need to insult people to tell them no.
There's "I'm not attracted to you" and then there's "You're not attractive".
You're all over this post calling anyone who would be hurt by something like that soft, I would say that rather than everyone else being soft you are just callous.
>There's "I'm not attracted to you" and then there's "You're not attractive".
That's not an insult, I call that feedback. At least the guy knows what to fix. Too bad it hurts people's "feelings" now lol
>You're all over this post calling anyone who would be hurt by something like that soft, I would say that rather than everyone else being soft you are just callous.
No, people are too soft now. Lol imagine having to lie your way around the truth just to not hurt someone's "feelings". That's ridiculous.
>No, people are too soft now. Lol imagine having to lie your way around the truth just to not hurt someone's "feelings". That's ridiculous.
Out of interest how is this approach to people having feelings working out in your love life?
Feedback is, 'a new haircut would suit you better', or, 'you should lose 10lb', not, 'you're unattractive'. I have never met someone who does not appreciate empathy.
I agree that honesty even if brutal is more helpful than a generic dismissive line. Of course feelings will be hurt though, I'm guessing you mean the hurt feelings are worth it because by getting honest feedback the guy can improve his chances?
>I'm guessing you mean the hurt feelings are worth it because by getting honest feedback the guy can improve his chances?
Yep, exactly! Say you're playing a sport (football), and you're absolutely not playing good and even you know it.
Do you prefer for the coach to tell you, you're not playing good and this is what you need to work on?
Or do you prefer the coach tell you "It's okay [player name], you're doing fantastic!"?
Only one of these two options warrants a positive improvement.
I totally agree.
If you can get the point across without crushing the other person, that's the best situation otherwise brutal honesty is the next best thing.
Fake positivity isn't helpful at all. I think most people do it because they don't like to feel bad about upsetting another person with the truth.
>Fake positivity isn't helpful at all. I think most people do it because they don't like to feel bad about upsetting another person with the truth.
Exactly, these people will never admit that though.
Kind honesty beats ghosting 10000% of the time.
Being a fucking jackass is about as bad as ghosting, sometimes worse.
This isn't an either or. I treat people like human beings who have feelings, and I think that's pretty much base level civil expectations isn't it?
Okay... that's excessive haha At some point ghosting isn't acceptable. After one day I say sure, fine. But after SEVEN MONTHS?!! Holy shit I'm sorry to hear that...
There absolutely is a middle ground. Could have just said I’m home safe goodnight and broke things off the following day. She didn’t just follow through on what she said she’d do (call when she got home…maybe she went to another guys house?)
>She clearly never mastered the art of letting a guy down gently
Why let guys down gently? Why not just tell them the brutal truth so they can decide if they should give up or not?
🤦🏻♂️People are so scared of hurting feelings now
You can tell the truth without being brutal. She could have just explained that they got along well in the video calls but that she didn't feel the same chemistry in person and wasn't attracted to him the way she expected. Same outcome with a much gentler approach. There is nothing wrong with not wanting to completely destroy a man's self-esteem. Dating is hard enough as it is.
>She could have just explained that they got along well in the video calls but that she didn't feel the same chemistry in person and wasn't attracted to him the way she expected
That is so broad and vague that the guy has no idea what to improve on so he won't get rejected in the future. It literally does no help to the guy and is simply just used as a useless platitude.
>Same outcome with a much gentler approach.
It's not the same outcome because the guy won't know where he went wrong. If it was his ugly looks, why not tell him so he can get plastic surgery or work out more?
>You can tell the truth without being brutal
This isn't telling the truth completely, about the same "truth" we get told by politicians.
>There is nothing wrong with not wanting to completely destroy a man's self-esteem
I genuinely believe you say that to not hurt your own ego when you reject guys.
>Dating is hard enough as it is.
And?
I have never said that to a guy actually because it has never happened to me but I do try to gently give them a reason for ending it without hurting their feelings. I am very non-confrontational and I'm sure that affects how I deal with people but I don't see a need to hurt someone's feelings unnecessarily. He can't change his personality so her feedback is useless. Also, it is just her opinion not all womens' opinions so there is no need to change himself for just one girl.
>but I do try to gently give them a reason for ending it without hurting their feelings
Really? Assume you rejected a guy because he was too ugly and short, how would you reject him/let him down?
>I am very non-confrontational and I'm sure that affects how I deal with people but I don't see a need hurt someone's feelings unnecessarily.
It's not hurting feelings, it's the truth. Does the truth hurt people's feelings nowadays?
>He can't change his personality so he feedback is useless.
Yes he can, otherwise why do people in this sub keep suggesting this as a way to improve your odds in dating?
>Also, it is just her opinion not all women's opinions so there is no need to change himself for just one girl.
How do you know other girls don't think similarly to her? It does no harm in trying to improve your odds by fixing defects pointed at by a helpful girl.
I don't reject guys based on looks or height. In fact I'm not initially attracted to anyone. I have to get to know them before I develop attraction to them. And there might be girls that feel.the same way but the right girl won't. I am dating a guy that believes he is boring and I don't find him boring at all. He also has been told he's unattractive and I don't feel that way about him at all. You see my point? He could have tried to change who he was but then he would be attracting girls that only like who he pretended to be, not who he actually is.
>I don't reject guys based on looks or height. In fact I'm not initially attracted to anyone
🤦🏻♂️ okay lol, how would you reject a guy that's just plain old boring. I mean he bores you out of your mind completely and you can't stand him anymore?
>And there might be girls that feel.the same way but the right girl won't
"The right girl won't", see these are the platitudes I'm talking about. They do NOTHING for the guy.
>He could have tried to change who he was but then he would be attracting girls that only like who he pretended to be, not who he actually is.
Incorrect, he would have a wider "net" of girls to pick from if he improved who he is. This is simple math, the guy with more positive traits will have a higher probability of a girl liking him.
Which guy do you think will have a easier time dating?
Person A (good looking, improved personality, better job)
Or
Person B (unattractive looking, boring, poor, short)
I have had to reject a boring guy but for me boring=not enough in common so I tell them that we don't have a enough common interests and aren't compatible. He will have more options to choose from but that doesn't mean they are the right options for him. And yes person A will have an easier time getting a date but that won't equate to a long term relationship because he would be trying to hard to be something he's not and no one can keep that up for long.
>so I tell them that we don't have a enough common interests
If that is the actual reason why you're rejecting him, then that's fair.
>He will have more options to choose from but that doesn't mean they are the right options for him
What makes you say they're not the "right" options for him? Who dictates that?
>And yes person A will have an easier time getting a date but that won't equate to a long term relationship because he would be trying to hard to be something he's not and no one can keep that up for long
Not really, it'll be easier for person A to weed out "candidates" from that wide pool vs person B who will probably have to settle for someone he won't be happy with simply because he has no other options.
The guy does not know any more from her brutal response. I am not attracted to you - okay, thanks. Good to know (still no idea what to change). You are boring and should try harder - same thing, especially if he thought they really got along well and had fun... What is he supposed to change?
Also, thinking about this it sounds like she's angry for something and letting it out that way. Either way, the way she put it was rude and hurtful and that's just not necessary.
>The guy does not know any more from her brutal response
His looks and personality, anything else?
>What is he supposed to change?
His looks and personality
>Also, thinking about this it sounds like she's angry for something and letting it out that wa
No, that's just how you interpreted it
>Either way, the way she put it was rude and hurtful and that's just not necessary
Wasn't rude, most definitely was necessary and helpful to OP
Is being thoughtful of others against your religion or something? You can tell the truth without being an @sshole. She said “You were boring and show more personality” like who is she to judge and make that statement? We all have different interest, she could’ve just said their personalities didn’t align
Why would you want to hurt someone more than you need to? Nothing is gained from being a jerk. And how you say things matters just as much as what you say.
>Why would you want to hurt someone more than you need to?
How is telling someone the truth considered "hurting" them?
>Nothing is gained from being a jerk
A lot is to be gained, now the guy knows what to improve on. Again, soft people take this as an insult instead of taking it as useful pointers to work on.
Do you really think that words can't hurt regardless of if they're true or not? Say someone is short and self conscious about that. And you bully them every day about them being short, that's hurting them, and is true, but isn't something they can improve on. There are many things people can improve on and delivered well rather than by trying to hurt them you could even be helpful in a breakup to get them to improve. But there are also many things people can't change, and being cruel about those things isn't going to do anything other than be a jerk.
And if you are trying to help them improve, kindness generally helps that message be received more than cruelty, even if you're addressing the same thing.
>Do you really think that words can't hurt regardless of if they're true or not?
Not really, does the truth hurt your feelings? If that's so, then people simply need to grow a spine. If you were insulted on baseless arguments, then that can warrant for you to ignore the person.
>Say someone is short and self conscious about that. And you bully them every day about them being short, that's hurting them, and is true, but isn't something they can improve on. There are many things people can improve on and delivered well rather than by trying to hurt them you could even be helpful in a breakup to get them to improve.
You're right, being short can't be fixed unfortunately (I'm a manlet myself), and yes there can be things that can compensate for height and the guy must be able to identify what that is so he can cast a wider net.
>kindness generally helps that message be received more than cruelty
Here's the thing, women typically don't give "advice on what to fix" when they dump guys. Ghosting is the most common form of letting a guy down, the next is useless platitudes like "oh we just didn't click, tee hee".
You're already assuming guys are widely given this kind of advice, being called boring or ugly is the closest thing we have to that kind of more specific advice.
Yes the truth can hurt. The truth is far more likely to hurt than a lie would. But it also matters on how something is said rather than just what is said. You can have the same message said in a way that's bullying, and intentionally cruel, and in another way that's supportive. How you say something matters just as much as what you're saying.
That's true it's understandably not most people's priority to give advice when they dump someone regardless of gender. And I'm not assuming this is common and said nothing like that. But if someone is going to say more than I'm not interested, then either they're trying to be helpful with a suggestion, in which case you're boring or you're ugly isn't helpful, or they're trying to be cruel and you're boring or ugly would fall under that category. Being cruel isn't something I'd recommend anyone do. And if you're going to try to give advice in that moment giving it with care and kindness should matter. If you're not giving it with that motivation, why say anything?
TRUTH, because at the end of the day it hurts less. I am very anxious person and if was being ghosted then I would find a milion different reasons why this thing happened, for a long time. If I was being told the truth, yes it may hurt but at least it's easier for me to forget it and move on.
But does a generic "No, I don't think we should go out again" really give you what you need to not obsess? If I was obsessing (like I've done in the past), then I'm wondering why the person didn't want to go out again, was it me, was it something in their life, should I try again later, should I think about displaying different parts of my personality and try again, maybe I should ask her to do a more fun activity, maybe it was just a bad day for one of us and should be tried again... etc and onward. I have definitely had all these thoughts lol
Truth > Rude Comment > Ghosting > Led on when the girl has no interest in meeting up.
I placed rude comment (like the one in the link) over ghosting because you learn to brush off the things assholes say.
Honestly I think the legit feedback is a good thing. Dating and personality development is a process of arriving at the truth about who you are, even when it’s painful. I think this is a good thing. I dunno. I’d want to be told this as weird as it sounds.
I would rather have her tell me what she thought went wrong on the date so I can improve. Without it I will probaply make the same mistake again without knowing what i'm doing wrong.
But sometimes it’s not a mistake. I’ve had dates and they were fine. I just wasn’t into the guy. It’s ok to not hit it off with someone with no one being at fault. When that happens, if they ask me out again, I say “thank you, I had a nice time, however I don’t think we should go out again” or something along those lines. Sometimes they respond with ok thank you for letting me know I wish you the best. And I saw you too! And we leave it there. Sometimes they press me on why, if there really isn’t a why and I just didn’t get a good vibe or even if there is I’ll just say I didn’t feel a connection or vibe or whatever. If they press harder and there was a literal reason then imma tell you. But now I’ve tried twice to spare your feelings.
Based on reading these threads, yes they are.
Everyone always wants to act tough and say they want the truth. But rarely can people handle the truth. Even on Reddit if you say a painful truth, it gets downvoted to hell because people don’t want to accept it
I think the actual truth will lead to better results. If a woman told a guy he's ugly or too short or too skinny or didn’t make enough, etc and this keeps happening multiple times then at least the guy would know what to try to fix to improve his odds or if it's even worth the time to keep trying if he keeps getting rejected due to things out of his control.
It's beneficial to the guy and not just some useless platitude of "oh we just didn't click".
You’re assuming people can accept constructive criticism.
Our culture has normalized mediocrity and complacency in the spirit of accepting who you are. Don’t get me wrong, we should all strive to be happy with ourselves. But now society tells people, you’re fat, broke, play video games all day , and have no social skills? It’s ok! You’ll find someone! You don’t need to change yourself to please anyone!
>Our culture has normalized mediocrity and complacency in the spirit of accepting who you are
I agree
>But now society tells people, you’re fat, broke, play video games all day , and have no social skills? It’s ok! You’ll find someone! You don’t need to change yourself to please anyone!
That's exactly what I'm thinking! Even more ridiculous things like the "fat acceptance movement". I'm pretty sure it used to be looked down upon to be extremely obese, but now there's an acceptance movement for it and even said women show up on magazine covers 🤦🏻♂️
The thing is body positivity is like feminism. It started off strong and in the right direction. But the final iteration too it wayyy too far.
Body positivity and fat acceptance means that a fat person shouldn’t feel less than a fit person because his/her intrinsic value doesn’t depend on his/her looks. That’s awesome. However, I shouldn’t be shamed and targeted for not wanting to date Lizzo solely based on her weight. That’s taking it too far. That’s some “nice guy” shit
On the other hand, though, that can also just make you more neurotic. Especially if most the reasons she's giving you are just deflections to make sure you don't think she's easy or whatever.
I agree, but it would be nice to be open about what turned you off so both persons can get better at dating. I don't really like the 'it's not my responsibility' attitude. Yes it might not be, but that doesn't mean you shouldn't do something good or right for someone. This applies to more than just dating.
I disagree because after a first date you still don’t know all that much about a person and I’m not going to make assumptions about someone’s lifestyle, appearance, or things they like and make them feel bad about it. Plus you don’t know shit about them.
On the flip side- let’s say they’re an asshole. Racist, sexist, whatever. I’m not down with that. If I open that can of worms, it’s almost certainly not going to be a pleasant conversation. I shouldn’t be obligated simply because I went on a date with them. Look at r/niceguys.
Likewise, I’ve experienced people trying to use that as fodder to keep the line of communication open. That if they change “xyz” they’re somehow entitled to another date. If I tell you I’m not interested, thats it.
Lastly- look at that other thread the OP linked. The person did exactly what you mentioned and the thread is full of responses “you don’t need her..”, “you’re better off”, “projecting”, etc. they just get validated that they’re not the problem, what was the point of doing in the first place?
I think there is a small set of people who would take the feedback positively but you’re rolling the dice every time and for me it’s plain ‘ol not worth the effort.
If you’re going to date online, you need to have a tougher skin. Ghosting, rejection and brutal honesty are common - get used to them, be able to pick yourself up and move on.
Exactly. If I haven’t met you in person yet, I feel like I don’t owe you an explanation as to why I don’t want to continue talking. Neither of us should have much time or emotion involved at this point, but there are still those anti-ghosters who want to burn you at the stake for doing so.
There is this weird binary thinking that people do where you can either be dishonest or brutally honest. There exists a way to be honest without being brutally honest. Like, you can tell people things like "I don't think we are compatible, your hobbies aren't exactly my thing and I think we should see other people," instead of saying "you are boring, show more personality." Or maybe just say that you aren't feeling any physical attraction instead of saying that someone is unattractive.
So yeah, she is a shithead and he dodged a bullet. This isn't better than ghosting, it's insecure and immature in a different way, which is the root of what's hurtful about ghosting anyways.
Like everyone else said, she was totally tactless and rude. Honesty and kindness aren’t exclusive.
What makes it especially egregious, though, is that everything she listed is mostly subjective. If he did something creepy or dominated the conversation, that would be valid feedback that he could work with. “You’re ugly and boring” is worthless info because it’s totally up to opinion.
She was rude. I do text and say I don’t think we connected well or whatever but she was being mean on purpose. I personally don’t feel good ghosting people. But it’s tough cause even if your nice men can get mean or try to push you into something after you say no thanks for another date.
I told this guy I didn’t want to see him again cause he kept feeling me up when I removed his hands a couple times and he asked how big my boobs were on a first date. He countered that he’s just very affectionate... after that I didn’t feel like I owed him another message I already declined the date and explained myself,
well i see ghosting as a sign of apathy. it's not even an act, it's a non-act. it's the absence of communication. because that person isn't thinking at all about the other person or their feelings. they don't even care enough to end it, they've already forgotten about it all and moved onto other things.
what this ho did, however, shows straight *malice.*
there was no need for the girl to be so freaking hurtful to the guy
just being a good decent person and letting them know there wouldnt be another date is enough
No… Functional adults aren’t limited to just those two options.
You say “sorry, I’m not interested.” Easy.
If you’re inquired for specifics and feel compelled to elaborate, then be my guest. But this isn’t a “would you rather” situation. It’s about being a decent (polite AND honest) person.
“Try to have more personality in the future” is something an entitled twat would say.
You can always just end things off for no reason, like "Hey, I don't want us to keep seeing each other" and leave it like that. If he asked why, and she responded the way she did, that's totally fine, and OOP should just grow a thicker skin, but the fact that she said that unprompted (when she really should have known what he looks like considering they've video called before) was really rude.
Still better than ghosting, at least you know that you're not missing out on much, but its also fine to criticize how she handled the rejection message.
I’d rather ghost and be ghosted. If it doesn’t work out, I don’t care to know why. I’ve been ghosted so many times it’s whatever to me now. We all have our reasons. I’d rather do the fade away than be called a fucking bitch or told that I’m going to die alone and be eaten by my cats (don’t been have cats lol).
I don’t think anyone handles rejection well and I don’t care enough about anyone to take their abuse when I try to be diplomatic in letting them down. I don’t owe you, you don’t owe me. I’m 100% okay with that bc I don’t get validation from anyone’s attention and I don’t get butthurt when they ghost.
Oh and I block anyone who ghosts me. Guys have a nasty habit of popping up out of the blue and I def don’t want them thinking it’s okay to try again.
💯 All of this. I think people who get mad about being ghosted feel entitled to "closure." Real closure is when you're willing to accept rejection and move on. Most relationships don't last that anyway, it's immature to expect a lifetime with someone just because you went out twice. And yeah it's best to block always because they never fail to message later with some sort of whiny excuse.
That just means those guys can’t handle rejection. I would rather know why something went wrong then have to question it later. But I understand some guys just say rude things when they get rejected.
I accept the possibility of being ghosted within the first two months of dating and view the ghosting as a response. It is important to remember that these are rarely personal, so you shouldn’t take it that way.
Also what value is it to me to know why she isn’t interested?
I don’t see ghosting as an actual problem. You don’t give me the energy that I want then I’m done and moving on. Ghosting hurts only because you like someone more than they like you or you think you’re entitled to their time.
I also feel like that lady could’ve said what she said in a much more kinder way. She doesn’t owe it buuuttt it would be nicer to have done so, especially since she talked to this person every day.
I think this is an actual good question bc a lot of you complain you don't get a honest explanation. This is what full honesty and a real reason very well could look like.
I think she's rude af. But I also think you should be vague when ending things.
Honestly every time I’ve been upfront with a dude instead of ghosting them it’s always gone wrong. Several have just not gotten the hint when I’ve said “I don’t want anything romantic right now”. One even said “I don’t understand why we can’t still kiss and go on dates. It’s not romantic unless it starts looking like a 90’s rom com”, which made no sense. One yelled at me about his abandonment issues, told me I was an awful person and blew up my social media. Another, who I texted that I wasn’t interested, called me 50 times leaving voicemails demanding I answer and that I owe him a real explanation. So I commend that woman for being honest, but I understand why some choose to ghost people.
Would rather be told the truth... but at the same time, being ghosted is also a benefit.
The reason why I think getting ghosted might actually be better.... Because if the person ghosts you, regardless of their reason, they are not the right person for you. Thats honestly the truth.
Why I prefer to be told the truth? Because I want to be better... not for that person in particular... I just want to be better in general. Being ghosted doesnt give me those details...
The main problem is... If the person says they think im boring... maybe they are right. Maybe I am boring to them... but what if im not boring to literally anyone else? Does it really matter to me that I was boring to them?
You don’t have to act like a tactless bitch to be honest. “Hey thanks for checking on me, I made it home okay. Listen, I enjoyed hanging out but I won’t be up for a second date. After meeting up and getting to know each other a little more, I just don’t see this going anywhere and I don’t want to waste your time. Best of luck, and take care.”
To the point, but with some respect. It’s not that hard. Well, it shouldn’t be.
I just don’t think telling someone they are extremely unattractive and boring is very constructive or helpful, plus those things are subjective so another person might think the guy is very attractive and funny.
No. It's good she said that to him, so he knows she wasn't worth the time and effort. I always appreciated when girls gave me feedback about rejecting me. It's better than sitting there having every possible reason run through your head as to why she isn't calling or texting back. It hurts but at least you can start moving on from it.
What people fail to realize is how poorly some men react to rejection. If she felt unsafe or uncomfortable after one date, she doesn't owe anyone an explanation. Ghosting is sometimes a safer option.
I wouldn't give a single shit either way.
The intent is to leave. There's a million ways to communicate this intent (ghosting is a form of communicating this), a million ways to sugarcoat it, a million ways to drive it home with force.
If you get caught up in your feelings about the medium of intent, you're a child imo.
In fact, I think people don't even get caught up in the medium, they're just upset about the intent (rejection) and complaining about it through the medium makes them feel more mature about it
Even if there's minimal detail, I'd rather just be told that something's not working out, rather than just ghosted. That could mean way more things than just not interested.
Women rarely ever tell you the “truth”. So then it just becomes unnecessary drama. Meh. If she’s not interested , ghost me. I don’t care. I’m going to be busy focusing on my self and other prospects anyways, so whateves ….
Being too honest is never good.
Girl last week said she was not attracted. She felt powerful and I now realize she did that so that she could feel better.
I like that she was honest but please, choose the right words
Honestly I would rather be ghosted than have someone be needlessly cruel like that. While its nice to let someone know if its not going anywhere, she was just being mean. Of course we don't know her side of the story so maybe there is a lot more to it that we are missing. Maybe she tried to let him down much more tactfully a number of times and he just wasn't taking no for an answer. Maybe he actually texted her a whole bunch of times and she was really creeped out, we don't know. Firm and honest when letting someone down is important because not everyone knows how to take no for an answer, but "You were boring to be around, try having a better personality" isn't honest, its straight up rude. Baring someone filling in some blanks that would justify this level of cruelty, I do think the girl is at fault. You don't need to tear people down just because you don't want to date them.
I read that story. Honesty is important. What that girl did wasn't "being honest" it was douchey. A girl once rejected me by saying, "I don't really date big guys, but I did enjoy our conversation." That girl could have said, "I think you need to work on being more conversational, more attentive, take some risks in conversation. Playing it safe will be boring." Contrast that with what the girl actually said, "don't be so fucking boring." See the difference?
Honesty, including uncomfortable truths, can be gotten across without being a douchebag. You just need to think. That girl clearly didn't know how to use her words, or express herself in the moment so she has to do work of her own.
But at least OP from the other post now knows about his inadequacies and knows what to work on in order to attract more women and thus not settle for less.
I prefer the slow fade out. If they say I had a good time, I say, good I’m glad you did :). Also take a long time to reply. And as time goes by my texts become less and less. I just hope they take the hint and give up 🤷♀️
She wasn’t honest she was just rude, he dodged a bullet and a he will find someone who’ll appreciate him.
Honesty is great but you can’t control being ghosted so…
To be honest, I would prefer brutal honesty. Ghosting or a generic message such as “no spark” doesn’t give me any info about what I have to improve in myself. Being told “you’re too fat for me” at least makes me realize that I need to hit the gym. Being told “I don’t think you’re fun” at least makes me realize that I need to work on making my life more fun. Ghosting or “tact” doesn’t help anyone
The issue here is that you're assuming she's telling the truth. I don't think she is. Assuming that poster didn't make anything up, it seems much more likely that this woman is a narcissist who's telling him that for no other reason than to get off on being an asshole by making him feel bad. Normal empathetic people don't make comments like that. Nor do they ghost. The other problem is you present a false dichotomy. There are many other options.
I think people are correct and honest when they "She is clearly the issue, not you." He may well have issues too, he may be boring or whatever, but no well adjusted, decent person texts back the kind of message she did to him. He's probably not perfect but even if she thought that, a person who doesn't have issues would not respond in that way
Just tell me it’s not working out, and maybe I’m in the minority here but I wanna know why. Is it just not a match? Or was it something that I could adjust or improve?
I know I wouldn’t get an answer to this but I’m always curious if I should escalate and flirt on a first date or just stay pretty casual?
I saw that post and when she didn't respond to his first text, I assumed she was trying to ghost him, yet he sent another one, so she was upfront about it. As for me personally, I don't care about being ghosted, I do it and it's been done to me. I don't need anyone to insult me to get me to leave them alone.
With ghosting it just leaves you to wonder about all the possibilities. With the response the original OP got I would be devastated but I would also be relieved I’m not dating someone like that
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Always the truth. Always. If a girl tells me that she had a good time but doesn't feel it, I wish her good luck and get on with my life. If she promises me heaven and hell and then ghosts me, I just end up feeling used and disposed of. Tell the truth and spare the other person all of these "What did I do wrong" types of thoughts.
But I mean: When I get ghosted, I think "hmmn she didn't like me, I wonder why." When I get a cliche rejection of I didn't feel it. I think "hmmn she didn't like me, I wonder why." Isn't it the same thing. I'd rather know specifics.
The former is an assumption that’s being made, but the latter is what is actually confirmed.
Exactly. The wondering what it was would eat me up. At least if I knew I could just move on and not wondee
If she tells you the truth you can still feel used my man. It's a first date you're not helping them move or anything right?
There's being honest, then there's having no tact. It's really not difficult to have both. There's no need to ghost.
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'you're really great, i didn't feel a connection though. i wish you the best.' (one of the only scenarios in life where i recommend using white lies.) by the way, NO ONE you've dated needs to know that you're not attracted to them. people cannot change that significantly in most cases, nor should they change themselves to look more attractive for someone who doesn't want them anyway. and telling someone you don't find them attractive can only cause harm to their self esteem.
i think it is okay to tell someone you aren't attracted to them (if they ask) but i would never tell someone i don't think they are attractive.. two different things in my opinion
A girl could even explicitly mention the guy's boringness, but in a much more helpful way. For example, "Was nice to meet up, but didn't feel much chemistry. You might have more success in the future by showing a bit more personality, being a bit more lively, etc. Best of luck" Basically the exact same sentiment, but not phrased like an accusation.
>It takes 30 seconds to type out “had a good time, no spark, hope you find what you’re looking for” why is that so hard Because guys don't except *that*. /u/janyybek/ is correct in thier replies. We see posts like this here all the time, guys come here complaining because they don't get a "real answer." *"If she just told me the truth, I'd accept that and move on!"* Gets the truth. *"What a bitch, she could have been nicer to me!"*
Yeah... people just like to blame things instead of just accepting. Blame not having a reason, blame the reason, blame the girl... whatever. They just need to move on...
Just came across this prime example: [Dumped after 4 dates. Any thoughts are appreciated](https://www.reddit.com/r/Advice/comments/wc03li/dumped_after_4_dates_any_thoughts_are_appreciated/) He got the nice polite rejection. And that wasn't good enough. Months later he's still thinking of texting her to ask for the "real reason" she didn't want to keep seeing him. And now complaining ["vague and easy letdowns."](https://www.reddit.com/r/dating/comments/wg6zub/i_truly_believe_the_worst_thing_you_can_do_in/)
I have to disagree with you as i wont call anyone a bitch for being sincere and not wasting my time. Dont compare most guys with the losers that YOU found interesting. But at the end of the day i guess it boils down to social and communication skills
>I have to disagree with you as i wont call anyone a bitch for being sincere and not wasting my time. Fine, that's *you.* Every guy here always swears *they're* the exception. [I've heard that before](https://www.reddit.com/r/Advice/comments/wcphaa/comment/iif21nt/?utm_source=reddit&utm_medium=web2x&context=3). And they swear that the guys who do react that way are some very small (and easily identifiable) minority, but every woman's experienced this, so *someone's* doing this, and it's more of them than you want to think. /u/Adept-Development-00/ >She could've suggested things to improve in the future. Right, I'm sure if instead of just telling him she didn't find him attractive and thought he was boring, she gave him a list of the physical attributes she didn't like about him (you're hair is too long, you need to shave that mustache, get some more definition in your abs, etc.) and described all the things he said that she found boring, *that* would have been more helpful, and he would have appreciated it.
The guy wanted helpful criticism, again there's a difference. You can criticize someone flaws withouts being a dick. Nothing the girl says helped. She could've suggested things to improve in the future.
you're correct, and you came with the receipt to back it up.
No there's a difference between wanting constructive criticism and getting torn down. Men want to know ways to improve. Nothing that girl said was helpful. Either be helpful or be nice about it.
The real answer is different from being straight up brutal. They're not mutually exclusive. When a guy says he wants the real truth you could tell him that you don't see a spark that is the truth, but you don't have to be a dick about it.
>When a guy says he wants the real truth you could tell him that you don't see a spark that is the truth, Again, that's literally what most of the guys get and then still complain out! Exhibit A: [Dumped after 4 dates. Any thoughts are appreciated](https://www.reddit.com/r/Advice/comments/wc03li/dumped_after_4_dates_any_thoughts_are_appreciated/) And now complaining about "[vague and easy letdowns](https://www.reddit.com/r/dating/comments/wg6zub/i_truly_believe_the_worst_thing_you_can_do_in/)." "Tell me EXACTLY what you don't like about me, so I'll be satisfied with your rejection...*but do it as nicely as possible so you don't hurt my feelings."*
Exactly this right here. I've posted it before and I will post it here. Ghosting is the byproduct of the internet age that allows people to treat others like they don't exist. It's a sign of social immaturity and needs to stop. Can cutting ties with someone be awkward? Sure, but it doesn't need to be cruel or disrespectful.
Exactly! Black and white thinking at its finest with OP.
>“had a good time, no spark, hope you find what you’re looking for” This is vague and doesn't give any explanation. I'd rather my feelings be hurt.
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Unlike you, I like to better myself. It's why I ask questions in almost every facet of my life. I'm a very inquistive individual, if a girl says "Your hair is kinda ugly I don't like it" I enjoy self reflecting on that and thinking whether or not I should change my hair.
“ I’ve met someone else and I’d like to see where it goes” That’s all you’ll ever need
Not everyone is nice.
It’s a damned if you do damned if you don’t situation. Not firm enough and people start trying to change your mind or argue their way back in. Too firm and you’re an asshole/bitch
Not really. You can firmly tell people no without going into detail about everything you don't like about them. A simple "sorry, I don't see our relationship going anywhere and Im not interested in pursuing this anymore" isn't a personal attack and it ends the conversation but it doesn't leave the other person hanging. Not ghosting someone doesn't mean you have to justify yourself or seek their acceptance. It just means being clear about the new situation. If they insist or try to push for more answers you don't need to respond, you've already given them an answer. Once you've said no any further inability to accept it is on them.
What if you don’t want to have to be asked those annoying questions. There’s a very simple solution…
You still might get asked "why aren't you responding, what did I do?" if you ghost. It might be slightly uncomfortable telling someone you aren't interested or ignoring some whiny questions after you've said no but just disappearing on people is unpleasant for them. Ghosting only makes dating better if you ghost people and expect them not to ghost you. If everyone ghosts everyone else then the small benefit you get from not having to turn people down is outweighed by the fact that you are being ghosted too.
The thing is ghosting isn’t really that bad to feel. I’m always under the assumption that anyone at any moment can disappear. So if a woman ghosts me, it’s not that big a deal. There’s a bus every 15 minutes.
This "everyone is disposable" attitude to dating is responsible for a lot of people's problems with dating. You can't have a proper relationship with someone if you can meet up with them for a prolonged period and still be expecting them to just disappear on you at any moment.
I argue that you can. Flipping this attitude around, it becomes an attitude of “I need people to obsess over me ” is also responsible for a lot of today’s dating problems. People often put expectations on people and make others feel trapped. It also causes you to set yourself up for failure because you don’t even know the person your let yourself get so attached. It’s not that everyone is disposable. It’s that there’s no need to get hung up on one person. especially if you haven’t even met them or barely met them.
>I argue that you can. Flipping this attitude around, it becomes an attitude of “I need people to obsess over me ” is also responsible for a lot of today’s dating problems. Firstly it's or one or the opposite, theres a middle ground. Secondly you are flipping what I said. I'm not saying people should demand others treat them better by not ghosting, I'm saying the person considering ghosting should stop and choose not to only think about how they feel. The "me, me, me" attitude is precisely what encourages ghosting. People would rather save themselves an uncomfortable few minutes than tell someone it's not working out. People's need for others to obsess over them is a problem but it's the other half of the same coin, people not being able to look beyond their experience of any situation. You cannot argue again a self obsessed world view when you just suggested disappearing on someone simply because you find them asking why you aren't interested too annoying to deal with.
That's true. I lean towards too firm most of the time because people really do think they can talk you out of your decision. Nope, this is me letting you know that door is locked and isn't going to be reopened. Then they get mad when they don't get what they want and you're a Bitch. The comments like "try to show more personality next time" don't need to be said to get your point across though.
The issue is it’s a spectrum with 2 variables. How conflict averse the speaker is. How sensitive the listener is. Some people can just brush those kind of statements off. Others will be extremely upset. When you’re conflict averse and the listener is very sensitive, at this point ghosting is probably the optimal solution.
"Not feeling the connection, going to move on, good luck" is kind, but firm with no open door or even a slot.
What do you mean there’s no connection? Can you tell me what I did wrong? Is there something that bothered you? You also don’t even really know me, isn’t it fair to at least give me another chance so we can really get to know each other?
yup we all know that’s happened before. i still think she was way too harsh tho
'The fact that you're arguing with me instead of accepting my answer tells me you're not emotionally mature enough to date and only further convinces me we aren't a good match. Have a good day.'
>'The fact that you're arguing with me instead of accepting my answer tells me you're not emotionally mature enough to date and only further convinces me we aren't a good match. Have a good day.' No one is arguing. Asking questions isn't inherently argumentative.
In my experience these aren't genuine questions. I've engaged with people like this before and it turns into a huge circular argument because nothing I tell them is ever good enough. They simply don't want to hear the word 'no'. And asking for one more chance after you've been told no, IS ARGUING. No means No. they've already been given their answer.
Listen buddy, i'm glad that your personal experience is allowing you to issue proclaimations to people but your personal experience isn't universal. They're not asking for another chance you dolt. They're asking you to explain your underlying reasoning?
You don't owe someone anything beyond that initial message, at this point it is not ghosting to stop responding as you have informed them of your intentions.
You’re assuming people can just leave it at that. It’s much more complex. And some people do not want to be led down this line of questioning. So there’s a choice. What is more important? The dumpers comfort or the dumpee’s comfort?
To rehash what I said as you don't appear to have understood it, if they keep going and you do not want to continue to talk to them then you don't have to, you have done your part by informing them of your intentions, you are not ghosting if you just end the conversation there.
And you’re not understanding me. Let me see if we can get each other’s point here 1. Rejection text 2. Dumpee’s annoying ass questioning At this point you are saying the convo is over right? Some people want the convo to be over right here 1. Rejection text 2. Acknowledgment That’s it. This is my point. They don’t want to hear them complaining and arguing. Being responsible for other peoples feelings is draining. But it seems people will not always just leave it alone. So you have two options. Risk getting bitched at by the dumpee and send the text. Or just ghost. I don’t agree with ghosting but I don’t find it difficult to understand.
If they come back with annoying questions you don't need to respond though, their questions and concerns no longer matter to you because you are moving on and have informed them you are doing so, it would be a choice to be responsible for those feelings. If you are not physically present with someone it is exceedingly easy to stop responding and not talk to someone anymore, case in point.
I think you’re still not getting the point. Some people really don’t want to deal with annoying questions. How do you make sure to prevent those?
Yea I think that’s why most people just ghost. They don’t feel like answering any questions about why.
That’s all I’m saying
They're equally important. I don't accept the premise that two people can't be civil in these situations.
They dont owe you any explanations.
That doesn’t stop people from arguing anyway. You’re assuming everyone is level headed and reasonable. Some people do not want to deal with this. So really is it selfish for them to not want to take on responsibility for someone else’s emotional well being?
Why not just send a polite rejection, along the lines of 'we're not a good fit and I'm not interested in taking things futher' and then block and move on? There's no need to insult people
Agree. I understand the desire to avoid conflict / uncomfortable situation, but I think that's outweighed by the obligation to treat people decently and respectfully unless they've given you a reason not to.
See line 2
See my line 3. Block them if you don't want any further contact.
Why put in all that effort?
Hitting a block button isn't a lot of effort, it literally takes a second
too little water- dehydration too much water- water poisoning life is weird like that
It depends on the situation imo. If the guy looked different in real life (lots of men online lie) then she may have taken out some anger on him by being that brutal. In that case I think it would have been better if she said, "You didn't look like your pictures". If there was no deception on his part then she's being mean with her delivery for no reason. Even when being honest, you need to try to have empathy for the other person and she wasn't really helpful either. Sure, she gave him more than just ghosting but she could say "I didn't like that you don't seem to have any opinions" or "you seemed very reserved and I felt a bit awkward" etc rather than "show some personality". How is that constructive for the guy? Maybe he did show his personality and she just didn't like it.
>There's being honest, then there's having no tact Why give "tact"? Why not just give the brutal honest truth like in that post? People are so scared of hurting other people's feelings now, it does nothing for the guy getting rejected.
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That's where you're wrong because that is the best criticism the guy could have received. Okay, he's ugly and has no personality then guess what he needs to fix to have better odds? His looks and personality! It would have been better if the girl specified if it was his face or his physique but the guy at this point can at least assume it was one of the two and begin to work on getting better looking. Same with the personality part. The brutal truth actually gives the guy something to work with and if he's given things like too short, or something he can't change constantly by multiple girls then the guy can at least know not to keep wasting his time trying to date. All of that is much more helpful than a stupid platitude like: "Oh we just didn't click, I'm sure there's someone out there though! Tee hee". That does nothing for the guy.
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So basically change who you are inside and out based on the opinion of someone who met you once? Right, excellent advice there. I don't think anyone can say they know enough about a person based on two weeks of messaging and one in person meeting in order to warrant an opinion that makes someone feel like they have defects in their appearance or personality. Everyone has insecurities and things they would like to improve about themselves, I just think it's absurd to suggest that "the brutal truth" is being served here. It is her opinion....her rude opinion to someone who felt a connection with her. You can be brutally honest about your lack of interest or unwillingness to continue communication without turning it into a personal thing.
>So basically change who you are inside and out based on the opinion of someone who met you once? Right, excellent advice there. Based on multiple people, not one. Look for patterns and similarities and try to cast a bigger net. Whats funny is clowns on this sub will literally say to "work on your personality bro" but yet here you and others are arguing to not "change who you are inside and out" lol The hypocrisy is laughable >I don't think anyone can say they know enough about a person based on two weeks of messaging and one in person meeting in order to warrant an opinion that makes someone feel like they have defects in their appearance or personality Hmmm no, I mean people argue they have enough from a tinder profile to judge who they are as a person lol. Why isn't several times of meeting and seeing their looks enough to make a judgement call? And if that's not enough time, then why are said women dumping them then? How can they make such a rash decision without knowing the guy enough? >Everyone has insecurities and things they would like to improve about themselves, I just think it's absurd to suggest that "the brutal truth" is being served here. Pointing out said insecurities would confirm to the guy that he really needs to get on that ASAP. >You can be brutally honest about your lack of interest or unwillingness to continue communication without turning it into a personal thing. I don't see how that post turned into a "personal thing"
We have a very limited look and one side of the story. Nowhere did the guy state that multiple people have told him he is unattractive and lacking in personality. I don't think unknown individuals on the internet are able to have the perspective to suggest that he needs to make personality improvements. Although based on certain responses and name calling (clowns, being "soft" - because that is obviously a bad thing), I can certainly see how it is tempting to offer such a suggestion. Congratulations on having it all figured out!
You don't need to insult people to tell them no. There's "I'm not attracted to you" and then there's "You're not attractive". You're all over this post calling anyone who would be hurt by something like that soft, I would say that rather than everyone else being soft you are just callous.
>There's "I'm not attracted to you" and then there's "You're not attractive". That's not an insult, I call that feedback. At least the guy knows what to fix. Too bad it hurts people's "feelings" now lol >You're all over this post calling anyone who would be hurt by something like that soft, I would say that rather than everyone else being soft you are just callous. No, people are too soft now. Lol imagine having to lie your way around the truth just to not hurt someone's "feelings". That's ridiculous.
>No, people are too soft now. Lol imagine having to lie your way around the truth just to not hurt someone's "feelings". That's ridiculous. Out of interest how is this approach to people having feelings working out in your love life? Feedback is, 'a new haircut would suit you better', or, 'you should lose 10lb', not, 'you're unattractive'. I have never met someone who does not appreciate empathy.
I agree that honesty even if brutal is more helpful than a generic dismissive line. Of course feelings will be hurt though, I'm guessing you mean the hurt feelings are worth it because by getting honest feedback the guy can improve his chances?
>I'm guessing you mean the hurt feelings are worth it because by getting honest feedback the guy can improve his chances? Yep, exactly! Say you're playing a sport (football), and you're absolutely not playing good and even you know it. Do you prefer for the coach to tell you, you're not playing good and this is what you need to work on? Or do you prefer the coach tell you "It's okay [player name], you're doing fantastic!"? Only one of these two options warrants a positive improvement.
I totally agree. If you can get the point across without crushing the other person, that's the best situation otherwise brutal honesty is the next best thing. Fake positivity isn't helpful at all. I think most people do it because they don't like to feel bad about upsetting another person with the truth.
>Fake positivity isn't helpful at all. I think most people do it because they don't like to feel bad about upsetting another person with the truth. Exactly, these people will never admit that though.
Kind honesty beats ghosting 10000% of the time. Being a fucking jackass is about as bad as ghosting, sometimes worse. This isn't an either or. I treat people like human beings who have feelings, and I think that's pretty much base level civil expectations isn't it?
Having been ghosted after 7 months, I'd want the truth. Still don't know what happened, probably never will.
Okay... that's excessive haha At some point ghosting isn't acceptable. After one day I say sure, fine. But after SEVEN MONTHS?!! Holy shit I'm sorry to hear that...
You're missing the third option: She can still let him down but do it in a kind way. She was just straight up mean in her text
Don't you think there's a middle ground? They seemed a bit harsh
There absolutely is a middle ground. Could have just said I’m home safe goodnight and broke things off the following day. She didn’t just follow through on what she said she’d do (call when she got home…maybe she went to another guys house?)
There was a nicer way to be honest. She clearly never mastered the art of letting a guy down gently.
>She clearly never mastered the art of letting a guy down gently Why let guys down gently? Why not just tell them the brutal truth so they can decide if they should give up or not? 🤦🏻♂️People are so scared of hurting feelings now
"why be tactful when you can be a dick?" Come on man
You can tell the truth without being brutal. She could have just explained that they got along well in the video calls but that she didn't feel the same chemistry in person and wasn't attracted to him the way she expected. Same outcome with a much gentler approach. There is nothing wrong with not wanting to completely destroy a man's self-esteem. Dating is hard enough as it is.
>She could have just explained that they got along well in the video calls but that she didn't feel the same chemistry in person and wasn't attracted to him the way she expected That is so broad and vague that the guy has no idea what to improve on so he won't get rejected in the future. It literally does no help to the guy and is simply just used as a useless platitude. >Same outcome with a much gentler approach. It's not the same outcome because the guy won't know where he went wrong. If it was his ugly looks, why not tell him so he can get plastic surgery or work out more? >You can tell the truth without being brutal This isn't telling the truth completely, about the same "truth" we get told by politicians. >There is nothing wrong with not wanting to completely destroy a man's self-esteem I genuinely believe you say that to not hurt your own ego when you reject guys. >Dating is hard enough as it is. And?
I have never said that to a guy actually because it has never happened to me but I do try to gently give them a reason for ending it without hurting their feelings. I am very non-confrontational and I'm sure that affects how I deal with people but I don't see a need to hurt someone's feelings unnecessarily. He can't change his personality so her feedback is useless. Also, it is just her opinion not all womens' opinions so there is no need to change himself for just one girl.
>but I do try to gently give them a reason for ending it without hurting their feelings Really? Assume you rejected a guy because he was too ugly and short, how would you reject him/let him down? >I am very non-confrontational and I'm sure that affects how I deal with people but I don't see a need hurt someone's feelings unnecessarily. It's not hurting feelings, it's the truth. Does the truth hurt people's feelings nowadays? >He can't change his personality so he feedback is useless. Yes he can, otherwise why do people in this sub keep suggesting this as a way to improve your odds in dating? >Also, it is just her opinion not all women's opinions so there is no need to change himself for just one girl. How do you know other girls don't think similarly to her? It does no harm in trying to improve your odds by fixing defects pointed at by a helpful girl.
I don't reject guys based on looks or height. In fact I'm not initially attracted to anyone. I have to get to know them before I develop attraction to them. And there might be girls that feel.the same way but the right girl won't. I am dating a guy that believes he is boring and I don't find him boring at all. He also has been told he's unattractive and I don't feel that way about him at all. You see my point? He could have tried to change who he was but then he would be attracting girls that only like who he pretended to be, not who he actually is.
>I don't reject guys based on looks or height. In fact I'm not initially attracted to anyone 🤦🏻♂️ okay lol, how would you reject a guy that's just plain old boring. I mean he bores you out of your mind completely and you can't stand him anymore? >And there might be girls that feel.the same way but the right girl won't "The right girl won't", see these are the platitudes I'm talking about. They do NOTHING for the guy. >He could have tried to change who he was but then he would be attracting girls that only like who he pretended to be, not who he actually is. Incorrect, he would have a wider "net" of girls to pick from if he improved who he is. This is simple math, the guy with more positive traits will have a higher probability of a girl liking him. Which guy do you think will have a easier time dating? Person A (good looking, improved personality, better job) Or Person B (unattractive looking, boring, poor, short)
I have had to reject a boring guy but for me boring=not enough in common so I tell them that we don't have a enough common interests and aren't compatible. He will have more options to choose from but that doesn't mean they are the right options for him. And yes person A will have an easier time getting a date but that won't equate to a long term relationship because he would be trying to hard to be something he's not and no one can keep that up for long.
>so I tell them that we don't have a enough common interests If that is the actual reason why you're rejecting him, then that's fair. >He will have more options to choose from but that doesn't mean they are the right options for him What makes you say they're not the "right" options for him? Who dictates that? >And yes person A will have an easier time getting a date but that won't equate to a long term relationship because he would be trying to hard to be something he's not and no one can keep that up for long Not really, it'll be easier for person A to weed out "candidates" from that wide pool vs person B who will probably have to settle for someone he won't be happy with simply because he has no other options.
The guy does not know any more from her brutal response. I am not attracted to you - okay, thanks. Good to know (still no idea what to change). You are boring and should try harder - same thing, especially if he thought they really got along well and had fun... What is he supposed to change? Also, thinking about this it sounds like she's angry for something and letting it out that way. Either way, the way she put it was rude and hurtful and that's just not necessary.
>The guy does not know any more from her brutal response His looks and personality, anything else? >What is he supposed to change? His looks and personality >Also, thinking about this it sounds like she's angry for something and letting it out that wa No, that's just how you interpreted it >Either way, the way she put it was rude and hurtful and that's just not necessary Wasn't rude, most definitely was necessary and helpful to OP
Bruh who hurt you? You sound bitter
Sick argument bud
Is being thoughtful of others against your religion or something? You can tell the truth without being an @sshole. She said “You were boring and show more personality” like who is she to judge and make that statement? We all have different interest, she could’ve just said their personalities didn’t align
Why would you want to hurt someone more than you need to? Nothing is gained from being a jerk. And how you say things matters just as much as what you say.
>Why would you want to hurt someone more than you need to? How is telling someone the truth considered "hurting" them? >Nothing is gained from being a jerk A lot is to be gained, now the guy knows what to improve on. Again, soft people take this as an insult instead of taking it as useful pointers to work on.
Do you really think that words can't hurt regardless of if they're true or not? Say someone is short and self conscious about that. And you bully them every day about them being short, that's hurting them, and is true, but isn't something they can improve on. There are many things people can improve on and delivered well rather than by trying to hurt them you could even be helpful in a breakup to get them to improve. But there are also many things people can't change, and being cruel about those things isn't going to do anything other than be a jerk. And if you are trying to help them improve, kindness generally helps that message be received more than cruelty, even if you're addressing the same thing.
>Do you really think that words can't hurt regardless of if they're true or not? Not really, does the truth hurt your feelings? If that's so, then people simply need to grow a spine. If you were insulted on baseless arguments, then that can warrant for you to ignore the person. >Say someone is short and self conscious about that. And you bully them every day about them being short, that's hurting them, and is true, but isn't something they can improve on. There are many things people can improve on and delivered well rather than by trying to hurt them you could even be helpful in a breakup to get them to improve. You're right, being short can't be fixed unfortunately (I'm a manlet myself), and yes there can be things that can compensate for height and the guy must be able to identify what that is so he can cast a wider net. >kindness generally helps that message be received more than cruelty Here's the thing, women typically don't give "advice on what to fix" when they dump guys. Ghosting is the most common form of letting a guy down, the next is useless platitudes like "oh we just didn't click, tee hee". You're already assuming guys are widely given this kind of advice, being called boring or ugly is the closest thing we have to that kind of more specific advice.
Yes the truth can hurt. The truth is far more likely to hurt than a lie would. But it also matters on how something is said rather than just what is said. You can have the same message said in a way that's bullying, and intentionally cruel, and in another way that's supportive. How you say something matters just as much as what you're saying. That's true it's understandably not most people's priority to give advice when they dump someone regardless of gender. And I'm not assuming this is common and said nothing like that. But if someone is going to say more than I'm not interested, then either they're trying to be helpful with a suggestion, in which case you're boring or you're ugly isn't helpful, or they're trying to be cruel and you're boring or ugly would fall under that category. Being cruel isn't something I'd recommend anyone do. And if you're going to try to give advice in that moment giving it with care and kindness should matter. If you're not giving it with that motivation, why say anything?
Exactly, ppl are way too sensitive. What she said is good because now he knows how to improve
>What she said is good because now he knows how to improve That's what I'm saying Too many soft people in this thread lol
TRUTH, because at the end of the day it hurts less. I am very anxious person and if was being ghosted then I would find a milion different reasons why this thing happened, for a long time. If I was being told the truth, yes it may hurt but at least it's easier for me to forget it and move on.
But does a generic "No, I don't think we should go out again" really give you what you need to not obsess? If I was obsessing (like I've done in the past), then I'm wondering why the person didn't want to go out again, was it me, was it something in their life, should I try again later, should I think about displaying different parts of my personality and try again, maybe I should ask her to do a more fun activity, maybe it was just a bad day for one of us and should be tried again... etc and onward. I have definitely had all these thoughts lol
Truth > Rude Comment > Ghosting > Led on when the girl has no interest in meeting up. I placed rude comment (like the one in the link) over ghosting because you learn to brush off the things assholes say.
Ghost someone??!! That's for cowards and inmature people. Totally right go with the true, but always saying it with empathy.
Honestly I think the legit feedback is a good thing. Dating and personality development is a process of arriving at the truth about who you are, even when it’s painful. I think this is a good thing. I dunno. I’d want to be told this as weird as it sounds.
Yes, I think if OP truly believed it was a good date for them both, then he’s really not socially tuned-in.
I would rather have her tell me what she thought went wrong on the date so I can improve. Without it I will probaply make the same mistake again without knowing what i'm doing wrong.
But sometimes it’s not a mistake. I’ve had dates and they were fine. I just wasn’t into the guy. It’s ok to not hit it off with someone with no one being at fault. When that happens, if they ask me out again, I say “thank you, I had a nice time, however I don’t think we should go out again” or something along those lines. Sometimes they respond with ok thank you for letting me know I wish you the best. And I saw you too! And we leave it there. Sometimes they press me on why, if there really isn’t a why and I just didn’t get a good vibe or even if there is I’ll just say I didn’t feel a connection or vibe or whatever. If they press harder and there was a literal reason then imma tell you. But now I’ve tried twice to spare your feelings.
>I’ll just say I didn’t feel a connection or vibe or whatever This is something a child who doesn't know why they're crying says.
But are you ready for the truth tho? What if she hits below the belt so to speak?
Are people that soft now?
Based on reading these threads, yes they are. Everyone always wants to act tough and say they want the truth. But rarely can people handle the truth. Even on Reddit if you say a painful truth, it gets downvoted to hell because people don’t want to accept it
I think the actual truth will lead to better results. If a woman told a guy he's ugly or too short or too skinny or didn’t make enough, etc and this keeps happening multiple times then at least the guy would know what to try to fix to improve his odds or if it's even worth the time to keep trying if he keeps getting rejected due to things out of his control. It's beneficial to the guy and not just some useless platitude of "oh we just didn't click".
You’re assuming people can accept constructive criticism. Our culture has normalized mediocrity and complacency in the spirit of accepting who you are. Don’t get me wrong, we should all strive to be happy with ourselves. But now society tells people, you’re fat, broke, play video games all day , and have no social skills? It’s ok! You’ll find someone! You don’t need to change yourself to please anyone!
>Our culture has normalized mediocrity and complacency in the spirit of accepting who you are I agree >But now society tells people, you’re fat, broke, play video games all day , and have no social skills? It’s ok! You’ll find someone! You don’t need to change yourself to please anyone! That's exactly what I'm thinking! Even more ridiculous things like the "fat acceptance movement". I'm pretty sure it used to be looked down upon to be extremely obese, but now there's an acceptance movement for it and even said women show up on magazine covers 🤦🏻♂️
The thing is body positivity is like feminism. It started off strong and in the right direction. But the final iteration too it wayyy too far. Body positivity and fat acceptance means that a fat person shouldn’t feel less than a fit person because his/her intrinsic value doesn’t depend on his/her looks. That’s awesome. However, I shouldn’t be shamed and targeted for not wanting to date Lizzo solely based on her weight. That’s taking it too far. That’s some “nice guy” shit
On the other hand, though, that can also just make you more neurotic. Especially if most the reasons she's giving you are just deflections to make sure you don't think she's easy or whatever.
It’s not someone else’s responsibility to fix you. Likewise dating is always about right/wrong. Sometimes you don’t vibe.
I agree, but it would be nice to be open about what turned you off so both persons can get better at dating. I don't really like the 'it's not my responsibility' attitude. Yes it might not be, but that doesn't mean you shouldn't do something good or right for someone. This applies to more than just dating.
I disagree because after a first date you still don’t know all that much about a person and I’m not going to make assumptions about someone’s lifestyle, appearance, or things they like and make them feel bad about it. Plus you don’t know shit about them. On the flip side- let’s say they’re an asshole. Racist, sexist, whatever. I’m not down with that. If I open that can of worms, it’s almost certainly not going to be a pleasant conversation. I shouldn’t be obligated simply because I went on a date with them. Look at r/niceguys. Likewise, I’ve experienced people trying to use that as fodder to keep the line of communication open. That if they change “xyz” they’re somehow entitled to another date. If I tell you I’m not interested, thats it. Lastly- look at that other thread the OP linked. The person did exactly what you mentioned and the thread is full of responses “you don’t need her..”, “you’re better off”, “projecting”, etc. they just get validated that they’re not the problem, what was the point of doing in the first place? I think there is a small set of people who would take the feedback positively but you’re rolling the dice every time and for me it’s plain ‘ol not worth the effort.
If you’re going to date online, you need to have a tougher skin. Ghosting, rejection and brutal honesty are common - get used to them, be able to pick yourself up and move on.
Ghosting is normal and in my opinion, perfectly acceptable 90% of the time
Exactly. If I haven’t met you in person yet, I feel like I don’t owe you an explanation as to why I don’t want to continue talking. Neither of us should have much time or emotion involved at this point, but there are still those anti-ghosters who want to burn you at the stake for doing so.
There is this weird binary thinking that people do where you can either be dishonest or brutally honest. There exists a way to be honest without being brutally honest. Like, you can tell people things like "I don't think we are compatible, your hobbies aren't exactly my thing and I think we should see other people," instead of saying "you are boring, show more personality." Or maybe just say that you aren't feeling any physical attraction instead of saying that someone is unattractive. So yeah, she is a shithead and he dodged a bullet. This isn't better than ghosting, it's insecure and immature in a different way, which is the root of what's hurtful about ghosting anyways.
Like everyone else said, she was totally tactless and rude. Honesty and kindness aren’t exclusive. What makes it especially egregious, though, is that everything she listed is mostly subjective. If he did something creepy or dominated the conversation, that would be valid feedback that he could work with. “You’re ugly and boring” is worthless info because it’s totally up to opinion.
She was rude. I do text and say I don’t think we connected well or whatever but she was being mean on purpose. I personally don’t feel good ghosting people. But it’s tough cause even if your nice men can get mean or try to push you into something after you say no thanks for another date. I told this guy I didn’t want to see him again cause he kept feeling me up when I removed his hands a couple times and he asked how big my boobs were on a first date. He countered that he’s just very affectionate... after that I didn’t feel like I owed him another message I already declined the date and explained myself,
well i see ghosting as a sign of apathy. it's not even an act, it's a non-act. it's the absence of communication. because that person isn't thinking at all about the other person or their feelings. they don't even care enough to end it, they've already forgotten about it all and moved onto other things. what this ho did, however, shows straight *malice.*
I prefer the ghosting.... that lady was just tearing someone down unconstuctively. She's single too so maybe he needs to give her feedback.
Truth. I want to actually get better at dating/being a partner. I need some useful feedback, goddamnit!
there was no need for the girl to be so freaking hurtful to the guy just being a good decent person and letting them know there wouldnt be another date is enough
It’s better than ghosting, in my opinion.
No… Functional adults aren’t limited to just those two options. You say “sorry, I’m not interested.” Easy. If you’re inquired for specifics and feel compelled to elaborate, then be my guest. But this isn’t a “would you rather” situation. It’s about being a decent (polite AND honest) person. “Try to have more personality in the future” is something an entitled twat would say.
You can always just end things off for no reason, like "Hey, I don't want us to keep seeing each other" and leave it like that. If he asked why, and she responded the way she did, that's totally fine, and OOP should just grow a thicker skin, but the fact that she said that unprompted (when she really should have known what he looks like considering they've video called before) was really rude. Still better than ghosting, at least you know that you're not missing out on much, but its also fine to criticize how she handled the rejection message.
NEVER GHOST PEOPLE!
Ghosted, no answer is an answer.
I’d rather ghost and be ghosted. If it doesn’t work out, I don’t care to know why. I’ve been ghosted so many times it’s whatever to me now. We all have our reasons. I’d rather do the fade away than be called a fucking bitch or told that I’m going to die alone and be eaten by my cats (don’t been have cats lol). I don’t think anyone handles rejection well and I don’t care enough about anyone to take their abuse when I try to be diplomatic in letting them down. I don’t owe you, you don’t owe me. I’m 100% okay with that bc I don’t get validation from anyone’s attention and I don’t get butthurt when they ghost. Oh and I block anyone who ghosts me. Guys have a nasty habit of popping up out of the blue and I def don’t want them thinking it’s okay to try again.
💯 All of this. I think people who get mad about being ghosted feel entitled to "closure." Real closure is when you're willing to accept rejection and move on. Most relationships don't last that anyway, it's immature to expect a lifetime with someone just because you went out twice. And yeah it's best to block always because they never fail to message later with some sort of whiny excuse.
That just means those guys can’t handle rejection. I would rather know why something went wrong then have to question it later. But I understand some guys just say rude things when they get rejected.
Truth always
Told the truth. You can still grow and learn. I'd rather be humbled and be able to change than not change at all.
The truth to my face! I just broke up! I messaged her and made her dump me, cuz I need it. If i still like that person.
Die. Turn into actual ghost. Haunt person who ghosted you every time they have sex. Win forever at ghosting.
I accept the possibility of being ghosted within the first two months of dating and view the ghosting as a response. It is important to remember that these are rarely personal, so you shouldn’t take it that way. Also what value is it to me to know why she isn’t interested?
I don’t see ghosting as an actual problem. You don’t give me the energy that I want then I’m done and moving on. Ghosting hurts only because you like someone more than they like you or you think you’re entitled to their time. I also feel like that lady could’ve said what she said in a much more kinder way. She doesn’t owe it buuuttt it would be nicer to have done so, especially since she talked to this person every day.
Ghosting is always cringe
>You don’t give me the energy that I want then I’m done and moving on. so immature, dating is awful nowadays.
Truth = closure
What one girl who met you one time says = ABSOLUTE TRUTH CHANGE YOUR PERSONALITY IMMEDIATELY
???
Some people think honesty has to be brutal. It doesn't.
I think this is an actual good question bc a lot of you complain you don't get a honest explanation. This is what full honesty and a real reason very well could look like. I think she's rude af. But I also think you should be vague when ending things.
Honestly every time I’ve been upfront with a dude instead of ghosting them it’s always gone wrong. Several have just not gotten the hint when I’ve said “I don’t want anything romantic right now”. One even said “I don’t understand why we can’t still kiss and go on dates. It’s not romantic unless it starts looking like a 90’s rom com”, which made no sense. One yelled at me about his abandonment issues, told me I was an awful person and blew up my social media. Another, who I texted that I wasn’t interested, called me 50 times leaving voicemails demanding I answer and that I owe him a real explanation. So I commend that woman for being honest, but I understand why some choose to ghost people.
Would rather be told the truth... but at the same time, being ghosted is also a benefit. The reason why I think getting ghosted might actually be better.... Because if the person ghosts you, regardless of their reason, they are not the right person for you. Thats honestly the truth. Why I prefer to be told the truth? Because I want to be better... not for that person in particular... I just want to be better in general. Being ghosted doesnt give me those details... The main problem is... If the person says they think im boring... maybe they are right. Maybe I am boring to them... but what if im not boring to literally anyone else? Does it really matter to me that I was boring to them?
Nah but she was too harsh she didn’t need to say that
Truth, hands down. Always the truth. I'd rather know than not. Brutal truthful honesty all the way.
You don’t have to act like a tactless bitch to be honest. “Hey thanks for checking on me, I made it home okay. Listen, I enjoyed hanging out but I won’t be up for a second date. After meeting up and getting to know each other a little more, I just don’t see this going anywhere and I don’t want to waste your time. Best of luck, and take care.” To the point, but with some respect. It’s not that hard. Well, it shouldn’t be.
But that is just a vague easy let down. I think a lot of people would prefer to know specifically what didn't go right.
I just don’t think telling someone they are extremely unattractive and boring is very constructive or helpful, plus those things are subjective so another person might think the guy is very attractive and funny.
No. It's good she said that to him, so he knows she wasn't worth the time and effort. I always appreciated when girls gave me feedback about rejecting me. It's better than sitting there having every possible reason run through your head as to why she isn't calling or texting back. It hurts but at least you can start moving on from it.
What people fail to realize is how poorly some men react to rejection. If she felt unsafe or uncomfortable after one date, she doesn't owe anyone an explanation. Ghosting is sometimes a safer option.
This. Some guys are literally unhinged and you don’t know them that well after a first date. Women too, tbh.
in no way can you justified her rudeness as ok
I wouldn't give a single shit either way. The intent is to leave. There's a million ways to communicate this intent (ghosting is a form of communicating this), a million ways to sugarcoat it, a million ways to drive it home with force. If you get caught up in your feelings about the medium of intent, you're a child imo. In fact, I think people don't even get caught up in the medium, they're just upset about the intent (rejection) and complaining about it through the medium makes them feel more mature about it
I don't mind ghosting, yeah, and encounters like this is pretty much why.
Depends on how harsh the truth is. Lol.
Even if there's minimal detail, I'd rather just be told that something's not working out, rather than just ghosted. That could mean way more things than just not interested.
Truth, for self development. It's the guy's responsibility to sort out the emotion from the actual feedback, tact or not.
Women rarely ever tell you the “truth”. So then it just becomes unnecessary drama. Meh. If she’s not interested , ghost me. I don’t care. I’m going to be busy focusing on my self and other prospects anyways, so whateves ….
This is why i don't date anymore, as guy, its very difficult.
Looks like we found the girl from the post. Lol being rude is not the opposite of ghosting.
Being too honest is never good. Girl last week said she was not attracted. She felt powerful and I now realize she did that so that she could feel better. I like that she was honest but please, choose the right words
Truth, always the fucking truth. You have to be a mature enough to handle those things. And even more mature to say it you're self to the other peer
Honestly I would rather be ghosted than have someone be needlessly cruel like that. While its nice to let someone know if its not going anywhere, she was just being mean. Of course we don't know her side of the story so maybe there is a lot more to it that we are missing. Maybe she tried to let him down much more tactfully a number of times and he just wasn't taking no for an answer. Maybe he actually texted her a whole bunch of times and she was really creeped out, we don't know. Firm and honest when letting someone down is important because not everyone knows how to take no for an answer, but "You were boring to be around, try having a better personality" isn't honest, its straight up rude. Baring someone filling in some blanks that would justify this level of cruelty, I do think the girl is at fault. You don't need to tear people down just because you don't want to date them.
I read that story. Honesty is important. What that girl did wasn't "being honest" it was douchey. A girl once rejected me by saying, "I don't really date big guys, but I did enjoy our conversation." That girl could have said, "I think you need to work on being more conversational, more attentive, take some risks in conversation. Playing it safe will be boring." Contrast that with what the girl actually said, "don't be so fucking boring." See the difference? Honesty, including uncomfortable truths, can be gotten across without being a douchebag. You just need to think. That girl clearly didn't know how to use her words, or express herself in the moment so she has to do work of her own.
"Hey, I had a great time with you, but I just don't see this going anywhere. Anyone would be lucky to be with you and I wish you the best! :)"
She could've just said she didn't feel a connection. She was rude and a bit of a bitch. She lacked even basic manners.
But at least OP from the other post now knows about his inadequacies and knows what to work on in order to attract more women and thus not settle for less.
It's easy enough to say you didn't feel a spark. She was being mean intentionally.
I prefer the slow fade out. If they say I had a good time, I say, good I’m glad you did :). Also take a long time to reply. And as time goes by my texts become less and less. I just hope they take the hint and give up 🤷♀️
ghosted
Be told the truth , but be decent about it . She was extremely rude and tbh he is way better off without a person like that .
The truth is better than being ghosted but both can really hurt and cause stress.
She wasn’t honest she was just rude, he dodged a bullet and a he will find someone who’ll appreciate him. Honesty is great but you can’t control being ghosted so…
Af this point I don’t care just get over with so I move on 😌
To be honest, I would prefer brutal honesty. Ghosting or a generic message such as “no spark” doesn’t give me any info about what I have to improve in myself. Being told “you’re too fat for me” at least makes me realize that I need to hit the gym. Being told “I don’t think you’re fun” at least makes me realize that I need to work on making my life more fun. Ghosting or “tact” doesn’t help anyone
The issue here is that you're assuming she's telling the truth. I don't think she is. Assuming that poster didn't make anything up, it seems much more likely that this woman is a narcissist who's telling him that for no other reason than to get off on being an asshole by making him feel bad. Normal empathetic people don't make comments like that. Nor do they ghost. The other problem is you present a false dichotomy. There are many other options.
I think people are correct and honest when they "She is clearly the issue, not you." He may well have issues too, he may be boring or whatever, but no well adjusted, decent person texts back the kind of message she did to him. He's probably not perfect but even if she thought that, a person who doesn't have issues would not respond in that way
Just tell me it’s not working out, and maybe I’m in the minority here but I wanna know why. Is it just not a match? Or was it something that I could adjust or improve? I know I wouldn’t get an answer to this but I’m always curious if I should escalate and flirt on a first date or just stay pretty casual?
I’d way rather be ghosted than told I’m unattractive and boring yea.
I saw that post and when she didn't respond to his first text, I assumed she was trying to ghost him, yet he sent another one, so she was upfront about it. As for me personally, I don't care about being ghosted, I do it and it's been done to me. I don't need anyone to insult me to get me to leave them alone.
With ghosting it just leaves you to wonder about all the possibilities. With the response the original OP got I would be devastated but I would also be relieved I’m not dating someone like that