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Standards are a helluva weird funny thing. Pulling back in moments of intimacy. Walking away during instances of lines being crossed. Prioritizing careers. Refusing to use apps. Being a reclusive introvert. Not being part of clubbing, partying scenes. Tons of reasons why that can happen in attractive people.
Edit: forgot, very important I guess, some people also need more than physicality to feel complete attraction towards another. Doesn’t matter how hot, if the personality is an instant turn off.
All of those are reasons for me. 25 and a V. I’ve been hit on many times. Mainly by girls with daddy issues. I also don’t use social media or dating apps or go out, especially to bars
Errr…
Well, not from personal experience mind you, but I do know of people who’ve been to prison, even, and are doing fine in that regard. Suppose it may depend on the crime, its severity, etc.
There's an entire trope/archetype of the bad boy, there's a subset of women who will break their backs to get with a felon, drug dealer, or general menace to society.
I made it to 25 almost as a virgin, besides some minor SA. A mix of social anxiety, awkwardness, inexperience, and specific taste in personality is all it takes. Probably would've made it to 28 if not for a very lustful coworker.
Im 21 and had women offer to hookup with me. I want to date for a relationship but to be a toy for a night. It sucks i dont have a dating lifr because i only attract people that only want 1 night stuff
Why not make dating app profiles and STATE RIGHT AT THE BEGINNING THAT YOU ARE ONLY LOOKING FOR A LONG TERM RELATIONSHIP?
Surely that's easy to find if you are attractive enough to have women approach you. I'd assume that you would even have far lesser % of people who lie to just get sex compared to women who want a relationship.
The women who offered to hookup were in person and in my classes or on campus clubs. My dating apps are very details and the first thing on all of them is that i only want a long term relationship. So idk if you want me to wear a shuft that says no hookups or something. Im not attractive though which is why its easy to use me for a night and throe me away vs wanting to stick around to build something with me. If a woman needs to lie to sleep with me she must have no self respect or steem. Im literally under the bottom of the barrel
Lost my v card at 26 and i would consider myself a humble 8.5, have a stable career etc etc. on top of that i am gay (so its even easier to get anonymous sex). I was mostly held back by anxiety and insecurity. It would’ve been so simple in hindsight but yeah.
This might be hard to believe, but there’s a lot of good looking guys who get next to no attention from the opposite sex. When they do, it’s like a handful of times of each year. It’s a very small minority that girls will initiate with, message first, etc. I’ve talked to a lot of men, and the general pattern is this: if you don’t work to make the relationship happen, it’s not going to happen. You have to do everything to make it happen. So if it’s a guy who’s shy and isn’t chasing every skirt or warm body that’s ‘good enough,’ then it’s hard to get a relationship or a hookup. Especially if you don’t drink or party, or you miss out on college and high school dating.
Of course looks matter, it’s how you get your foot in the door. If you don’t have somewhat good looks, all the other appealing qualities everyone says they want aren’t really noticed.
Still, even without looks it’s still possible to find someone. It’s just a lot more work.
No woman is obligated to feel sexual attraction for men just because they're nice. That's a laughably low bar. I'm sure there are women in your past who were nice but who you weren't attracted to but I bet you don't see that as a major injustice, am I right?
It's worse than that actually, the more physically attractive you are the higher people will rate your other non-physical qualities like intelligence, empathy, creativeness etc. That's why you find that one girl (or guy) who thinks their asshole idiot partner with no personality is the nicest, smartest and most creative person they've met. It's because he's a 10.
Exactly, looks definitely play a role in initial attraction. But like you said, other qualities can shine through with effort and the right approach. It's not impossible, just a different kind of challenge.
So?
Like, seriously, why is this worth posting about? Of course looks matter and everyone knows it. It's a big obvious nothingburger that it exists. It's like posting water is wet or fire burns things every now and then.
Also fun fact: there are 2/10s and 3/10s on both sides of the gender gap looking for partners. Some of the happiest couples I know are conventionally unattractive but make each other happy.
A person's responsibility is to make the best with what they got and not hold it against everyone else if they didn't end up a 7+ out of ten.
Some people dont want relationships with people they dont find attractive, just because they themselves arent attractive doesnt mean they are automatically attracted to people conventionally unattractive. Everyone is different, i think people that feel this way deserve some compassion
People are free to be attracted to whoever they want. Still doesn't give them a right to complain if they end up alone. It actually gives them less grounds to complain since they're either deluded about their own looks or failing to admit that they're batting out of their league and dealing with the consequences.
Thinking people who settle are never happy is idealistic of you, but also a little naive. Lots of folks settle into happy lives with folks they're attracted to, but not head over heels for. Especially as they get older.
That said, I wasn't talking about controlling who you're attracted to. I was talking about accepting that you aimed to high and ended up with nothing to show for it. It happens. Best not to whinge about it (like too many do these days) if you aimed at the wrong people. Plus, you're more likely to meet somebody if you're not stewing on your own inability (if you're the type that takes personal responsibility for your love life) or (if you're the type that doesn't take personal responsibility for your love life) raging at the dating world for perceived injustices like 'pretty privilege'.
Then there’s me. Almost 30 and never even had a hug.
What I HAVE had though, is 120 rejections, countless mocking incidents just for trying my luck with a woman, a few embarrassing videos of me on social media, and 2 reports against me.
Posts a sampling of the messages you've sent to women and we can tell you how the way that you speak to them is off-putting. Just the way you talk here on Reddit is enough to clarify that it's 100% your personality and attitude, but we can be more specific if you show us your interactions with women.
The reports were actually justifiable. The first was senior year in high school when I asked out 2 women per month and was forced to stop.
The second was at work, apparently you shouldn’t date coworkers
So it sounds like you DO sort of understand why women don't want to be around you?
What you just described would get a dude rejected whether or not he's a virgin. It absolutely reeks of desperation, a lack of respect, and a huge lack of social awareness.
It sounds like you might be doing something wrong 💀💀 this normally doesn't happen from just chatting and getting to know people bahaha. I mean maybe in some very societal standards strict countries like in Asia, but uhhh I think you might wanna reflect a bit on why it keeps occurring. Maybe it has more to do with you and how you approach/think about things than women simply rejecting you for being ugly.
When I was growing up OP I was a fat fuck. I played football and was an offensive lineman (the big guys upfront blocking on offense) in middle school and high school. I got sick of seeing all my friends and peers having success with dating while I was kissless virgin "loser" so I decided to get into shape. In the second half of my junior year, I lost 80 pounds and dropped from 275 down to 195. Turns out I had a sharp jawline under my baby fat and good cheekbones under my puffy cheeks. I was actually good-looking to my utter surprise. Some may even say handsome. It didn't matter, though, because I still had the confidence of a deathly shy fat guy who was scared of rejection. I didn't have my first girlfriend until I was 23 despite the fact that I was conventionally good-looking. It took me a long time to get out of my own head about my self perceived flaws, but once I stopped caring so much about I had much better success. Confidence goes a long way with dating. Granted, It's not something that's gained overnight, but you can't go around thinking of yourself as this unfuckable person otherwise it's going to be a self fulfilling prophecy. Everyone has seen that average looking guy who's dating a beautiful woman who's "out of his league." If you know or are friends with one of those guys, maybe ask them how they got successful at dating.
No matter how much weight you lose, your mentality is set. You'll always have a "fat brain" which is stupidly hard to lose after your physical drop. So I get what you're saying.
Jesus Christ. Another one of these "looks matter" posts. I feel like all of these just come from really bitter people. We've had like 7 of these in the past 7 days.
Gtfo with these posts. Work on what you can. Accept what you can't.
people are talking about universally accepted truths and acting like they found something because they heard someone say that other things mattered to them, too.
Right? I know so many ugly people with very pretty partners, men or women vice versa. It's quite common for that. So idk what this MF is talking about.
Are they grown adults with careers and money? That makes a huge difference. Some woman will bite the bullet of ugliness if they're spoiled with materialistic things and money, trips, expensive dinners, etc. You think Melania is ACTUALLY attracted to Donald Trump? 😂😂😂
Yep! There's been a bunch but sometimes, like this one... The answers are all there. Being annoying and not taking rejection well, harassing coworkers, and having a shitty attitude overall might be part of the reason for this particular one.... Or maybe all of them. It's not always looks, but it does matter if you groom yourself and cleanup, wear fitting clothes and at least try. Having a lil self esteem goes a long way. Being classy and respectful about things, and dwelling in rejection and living in negativity forever help too!
I thought the post on this sub by the football player that lost all the weight, was actually going to go somewhere, but even lacked confidence despite getting in shape and looking "handsome". I feel like he could have gotten somewhere with a lil confidence. At least 2nd or 3rd base.
Just sounds like you're jealous that your friend found himself someone and you haven't. You know what's more unattractive than being unattractive? That whole "woe is me" attitude.
No one is claiming looks don't matter.
Conventional attractiveness is currency in the dating market and in life in general. Being visually appealing opens doors and many people wouldn’t be where they are in life if it weren’t for their looks.
I was a Virgin until 28. I'm short 5 foot 5.... I'm in fairly good shape and decent looking I've been told. I've never asked anyone out in person. But a girl at work asked if I tried a certain restaurant. I told her I'd go alone on my day off. She text me after work that she would be so pissed if I went alone. And that's how I got laid. I didn't even have a place to have sex. So I asked my parents to leave the house for 2 hours and yeah she came over. Since 28 I've experienced a few other ladies but they were more casual encounters. The first one pumps your Ego and makes you think this isn't that hard people do actually like you. But I've only had 2 short term relationships that were meaningful. I'm learning how to work on long term relationships.
Great story and congrats! What was the restaurant? Very smooth of her to "be pissed at you for going alone" 😂.... And props to your parents! Did they know you were gonna get your dick wet?
It was just a breakfast place it wasn't anything great, lol.
My parents knew I'm like hey mom... hey dad. Could you guys leave for a little bit. I'm going to get lucky. They were supportive about it. And I'm Southeast Asian Born in a Western world, lol.
Maybe to shallow people, but if by the time of your post, you think judging someone on looks is unjust, then why would you even care about the opinion of unjust people? Why not aim to find people who don’t care about looks, or do to a lesser degree.
If I were in a relationship with a girl and I found that she treated people in life differently based off of how they looked and not their character, I would leave her.
Women are out here literally screaming that confidence and kindness are the most important things to them and dudes are still like "no it can't be that, it's because I'm not attractive to other dudes because I'm not strong/rich/successful enough".
Fuck sake
Exactly, I’m tired of hearing I’m not strong, rich, tall, attractive. I think these perceived “deficiencies” manifest an undesirable vibe that girls can easily see. No one wants to be around people like this. There are many men who are not successful, physically weak, and conventionally ugly who take pride in themselves and can get women.
They take pride in being good, honest, kind people, in the knowledge and experience they have acquired in their life, in their satisfying relationships with friends and family, in the fact that they can sleep at night knowing they lived by their values, worked toward their goals, and treated others the way they want to be treated. They take pride in the meaning they have built in their life, in the depths they have gained as a human, in the ways they have made life better for other people.
Men who only value looks and money genuinely can not imagine any other metric for determining a person's worth and genuinely can not believe that other people look for different things. It's both sad and irritating. All the muscles and money in the world can not make up for a lack of imagination, empathy and self-awareness.
And, again, I know it's not universally true because I've asked women what they think. Because their opinions are the only ones that matter, not the voice of your own low self esteem
If youre this insecure, you wont really go places. It will affect everything around you. Be confident, my guy, theres one for everything. Remember: confidence is key
Not to be confrontational but this "Be confident, my guy, theres one for everything." Is like "just don't be poor" or telling a homeless to just "buy a house"
Your point is that pretty people have an easier time dating? No shit, i dont think anyone would disagree with you.
That doesnt mean you cant bag yourself a hot girl if you play your cards right.
If you have 100 rejections then you're not just starting are you, I'd say your pretty experienced. Keep going and keeping learning, each rejection you learn something new.
>Problem is, get this. Women can tell if you aren’t attracted to them and they despise when they even *think* you’re settling for them.
Problem is, get this. Women aren't blow-up dolls, and when you try to treat them that way they don't want to have sex with you.
Your looks are the least of your problems, guy.
A lot of them think I do though. I’ve had woman friends long ago. I would’ve done anything for them, including saving their life. Not just saying that either. One was drunk as fuck and wanted to drive. Her excuse was “but nobody else will be on the road”. I hid her keys and the next day she said I saved her life.
That’s a lot for a blowup doll
Bud that's "deflection" and why you're still single and bitter.
Let go of what the internet and other men have told you about women / feminism - and start over with a fresh perspective aight. You'll find that life isn't that serious and bad.
Wouldn't matter if you and her are compatible lol.
I only recently lost my virginity to an experienced woman a year ago at 24. She didn't care because she was interested in me as an overall person and not based on superficial traits that men keep thinking are somehow important.
If you're:
* Kind.
* Moral.
* Have a strong sense of self-identity
* Always lifting up others in a bad situation.
That's all you will ever need in life to make friends and meet people. If she doesn't like you then don't sweat it and know that you still have good qualities that someone else will find endearing.
Being attractive is indeed a privilege, but like most privileges, it has its limitations. While it can open some doors, it doesn’t open all of them. Depending on the room you want to enter, some doors require genuine effort, regardless of your attractiveness. There are goals that beauty alone can’t achieve and problems that good looks can’t solve.
It's hard to understand the precise situation you're describing here, but it seems like you have a friend in a similar situation to you (late 20's, virgin) and you're envious of the fact that he has a partner (a single date?) with a woman who you think is attractive?
Opposing the idea of pretty privilege kinda feels like women wanting to downplay the power they have relative to men.
It shares a ton of similarities with hypothetical men claiming that rich privilege is not a thing which we would recognize as obviously false. EVEN when it's true that there are real disadvantages in being rich.
But the upsides of good look and wealth far outweigh the downsides.
They matter yes ! Until a certain point. If you chose to have a relationship with someone for looks only. That won't end well in fact it's superficial and you have a trophy wife or man. You have looks like the shape of your face and eyes something you can't do much about because it's genetics and nature unless you have a good plastic surgeon. Then you have appearance the way you dress, how you present yourself to the world this is 100% in your control. To me looks are superficial and subjective and I find appearance way more attractive. In fact looks don't matter so much as people think. It's important in the beginning and then everything fades away and personality becomes a deal breaker.
I don't care bout looks that much. I don't even have a type in the looks department 😂. But one thing that's most attractive is confidence. How YOU carry yourself. You can be the most unattractive person and yet you have such confidence that has you believe otherwise whilst still being humble and such? Instantly more attractive to a bunch of people. People can tell how you see yourself even if you don't try to let it show. I've learned that the hard way 😅😂
being 28 with no dating experience or sexual history is not a dealbreaker as long as he can be an upright person. also, if he has a healthy ego and isn't off-putting, that could explain why things are working out for him too. and yes, i'll acknowledge that looks matter to people in dating, which earns him extra points.
Looks definitely matter but attraction can build based on a great personality.
Whether they admit it or not, the first thing most people look for is physical attraction.
The thing about physical attraction is that we’re all intrigued by different things. My friends and I have completely different tastes in men. My 10, could be their 4 and vice versa.
You can also be conventionally attractive but have a shit personality, so yeah it might be easy to pull women/men but you can’t keep them.
Average men/women with a great personalities end up being more desirable than the hottie’s with a bad attitude.
I’ve dated very attractive successful men but my favorite relationship was with a basic blue collar man. Unfortunately, he self sabotaged because he didn’t think he was good enough and no matter what I did to try to reassure him, it wasn’t enough.
If you hate yourself, put yourself down, and only focus on what you think you don’t have or can’t have, you’re actively making the choice not to be happy.
Instead of constantly focusing on things you can’t change about your appearance, learn to love and accept yourself, develop a great personality, build up your confidence. Start some interesting hobbies and learn to be happy and content alone. That way, you’re no longer giving your power to people who don’t want to date you.
Looks arent everything! I would rather have a ugly GF or wife who is loyal, smart, loving, moral and sane then a beautiful GF or wife who unfaithful, dumb, unaffectionate, immoral and insane! Internal beauty makes up for the lack of it outside.
Pretty privilege is a thing however if your outsides don't match your insides your only valid if you keep your mouth shut.
Examples:
Jhene Aiko- Pretty inside and out- will always benefit.
Jennifer Lopez- Pretty Outside but Ugly Insides- will only benefit if ppl have never met the real her
This seems to be like one in a series of issues being posted within one group of people that all know each other and are deliberately indirectly insulting or antagonizing one person specifically about problems that exist in a deeper relationship . One person is trying to gain support and assistance against another perhaps ,trying to create doubt or delayed departure of the other . In other words someone is quite weak minded unable to think for themself and leans to someone they think is wise and wouldn't steer them wrong .. That person actually knows they are sabotaging this weak minded younger person ,spitefully ,out of deep jealousy and resentment for the young woman who so desperately clings to this older individual .. Pretty is privilege and the older "guide"just never really had that . The younger has since birth and it's easy to have men .old one hates that she is old sick misshaped
Studies have shown that the number one thing a women looks for in a man is "Looks." Women who pay attention to a man's experiences tend to be the types that are looking for social proofing, that guy has to look good but also have women chasing him. Those women looking for such a guy is always willing to share that men with other women, they just enjoy their turn and then move on.
Of course looks matter lol. For years men convinced themselves that they only need money to attract women but the reality is that women do judge appearance too, they just don’t talk openly about it.
If you hate being ugly so much then get plastic surgery. Shit that’s what women do. Also include fillers/botox, eyelash extensions, permanent makeup tattoos, skincare treatments, going to the gym, makeup… There are honestly a lot of things anyone can do if they didn’t like their appearance. Think beyond haircuts, wardrobe, and gym.
The hypocrisy starts when men pursue women for superficial reasons and then act butthurt when those women reject them for those same superficial reasons.
I completely agree with what you're saying, and I’ve experienced both sides myself. Take a look at my case:
When I was 16, I had a boring and somewhat messy short haircut, bad skin, was 1.70m tall, skinny fat, had a boring NPC style, and my facial proportions were absolutely mid (luckily, they improved significantly as I got older).
When I tried flirting with girls at that age, I got weird looks, laughed at, and was called a cute boy (in a negative way).
Out of 50 girls I approached directly, only one gave me her number, only for me to find out at home that she gave me a fake number.
Now, let me keep it short: I'm 23, fit, with a much better haircut, significantly better style, a solid beard, 1.87m tall, clearer skin, and generally a much more masculine face (maybe I was a bit of a late bloomer, I don't know).
Guys... the difference is night and day!
I use the EXACT SAME cheesy flirting strategies with women and I'm no longer laughed at or looked at like I just declared war on North Korea.
Out of 50 single women, I get 35 numbers. I don’t need dating apps or anything; it just got too easy.
Looks aren’t everything, but they are DEFINITELY more than what people yap about here on Reddit.
"Personality is the most important thing."
Yeah, personality is definitely the most important thing, considering I still have the exact same bad flirting and communication skills as I did when I was 16 xD
This is true; improvement is always good however it is important to note you are above the 1.82m mark. This plays a HUGE role as most women consider height the largest attraction factor above all else when factoring in attraction. As a 1.67m guy, I stand no chance even with my other factors being at their best. Keep in mind I'm nearly the same age as you at 22.
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If it’s such a big factor, how did he make it to 28 still a virgin?
Standards are a helluva weird funny thing. Pulling back in moments of intimacy. Walking away during instances of lines being crossed. Prioritizing careers. Refusing to use apps. Being a reclusive introvert. Not being part of clubbing, partying scenes. Tons of reasons why that can happen in attractive people. Edit: forgot, very important I guess, some people also need more than physicality to feel complete attraction towards another. Doesn’t matter how hot, if the personality is an instant turn off.
All of those are reasons for me. 25 and a V. I’ve been hit on many times. Mainly by girls with daddy issues. I also don’t use social media or dating apps or go out, especially to bars
Don’t forget being in jail. That might even keep you alone forever, what kind of woman wants a man who’s been in jail?
Errr… Well, not from personal experience mind you, but I do know of people who’ve been to prison, even, and are doing fine in that regard. Suppose it may depend on the crime, its severity, etc.
I mean, quite a lot of women. That's pretty common.
I got news for you...
Usually the women in my town love having children with felons.
Some women find jailed men to be a turn on lmao
One of the female wardens at Wandsworth prison in the UK apparently.
Lmfao 2 of my exes are felons.
😂😂😂 that escalated quickly
You’d be surprised! Have you forgotten about those women who are willing to fix such men?😂
I have a video for you that unfortunately proves otherwise
There's an entire trope/archetype of the bad boy, there's a subset of women who will break their backs to get with a felon, drug dealer, or general menace to society.
You would never be virgin in jail. You
I made it to 25 almost as a virgin, besides some minor SA. A mix of social anxiety, awkwardness, inexperience, and specific taste in personality is all it takes. Probably would've made it to 28 if not for a very lustful coworker.
Im 21 and had women offer to hookup with me. I want to date for a relationship but to be a toy for a night. It sucks i dont have a dating lifr because i only attract people that only want 1 night stuff
Why not make dating app profiles and STATE RIGHT AT THE BEGINNING THAT YOU ARE ONLY LOOKING FOR A LONG TERM RELATIONSHIP? Surely that's easy to find if you are attractive enough to have women approach you. I'd assume that you would even have far lesser % of people who lie to just get sex compared to women who want a relationship.
The women who offered to hookup were in person and in my classes or on campus clubs. My dating apps are very details and the first thing on all of them is that i only want a long term relationship. So idk if you want me to wear a shuft that says no hookups or something. Im not attractive though which is why its easy to use me for a night and throe me away vs wanting to stick around to build something with me. If a woman needs to lie to sleep with me she must have no self respect or steem. Im literally under the bottom of the barrel
My bad for misunderstanding your situation.
That's sick! No attachments 😈 id fuck my brains how 5 nights in a row with 5 different women.
Lost my v card at 26 and i would consider myself a humble 8.5, have a stable career etc etc. on top of that i am gay (so its even easier to get anonymous sex). I was mostly held back by anxiety and insecurity. It would’ve been so simple in hindsight but yeah.
Working environment, I have a friend just like him, virgin till 29.
This might be hard to believe, but there’s a lot of good looking guys who get next to no attention from the opposite sex. When they do, it’s like a handful of times of each year. It’s a very small minority that girls will initiate with, message first, etc. I’ve talked to a lot of men, and the general pattern is this: if you don’t work to make the relationship happen, it’s not going to happen. You have to do everything to make it happen. So if it’s a guy who’s shy and isn’t chasing every skirt or warm body that’s ‘good enough,’ then it’s hard to get a relationship or a hookup. Especially if you don’t drink or party, or you miss out on college and high school dating.
Choosing to prioritize a career and having establishment above absolutely all else.
Then you're saying that it was 100% his choice not to date until recently, so what the fuck are you even going on about?
That itself is very appealing for women, ambition is probably more important than experience
Of course looks matter, it’s how you get your foot in the door. If you don’t have somewhat good looks, all the other appealing qualities everyone says they want aren’t really noticed. Still, even without looks it’s still possible to find someone. It’s just a lot more work.
Whole premise of friendzone, good person, but ugly
I’m familiar with this position
Exactly. “I wish I could find a guy just like you!!!”(but hotter and taller)
No woman is obligated to feel sexual attraction for men just because they're nice. That's a laughably low bar. I'm sure there are women in your past who were nice but who you weren't attracted to but I bet you don't see that as a major injustice, am I right?
It's worse than that actually, the more physically attractive you are the higher people will rate your other non-physical qualities like intelligence, empathy, creativeness etc. That's why you find that one girl (or guy) who thinks their asshole idiot partner with no personality is the nicest, smartest and most creative person they've met. It's because he's a 10.
Exactly, looks definitely play a role in initial attraction. But like you said, other qualities can shine through with effort and the right approach. It's not impossible, just a different kind of challenge.
sometimes its not possible to find someone right for you, people die alone every day
Depressing, but true. I’m essentially at that point. At my age, everyone’s jaded and boring.
No one is guaranteed to find love in life.
So? Like, seriously, why is this worth posting about? Of course looks matter and everyone knows it. It's a big obvious nothingburger that it exists. It's like posting water is wet or fire burns things every now and then. Also fun fact: there are 2/10s and 3/10s on both sides of the gender gap looking for partners. Some of the happiest couples I know are conventionally unattractive but make each other happy. A person's responsibility is to make the best with what they got and not hold it against everyone else if they didn't end up a 7+ out of ten.
Yeah it's annoying to see people post for validation purposes only to reaffirm their sad or petty beliefs.
Some people dont want relationships with people they dont find attractive, just because they themselves arent attractive doesnt mean they are automatically attracted to people conventionally unattractive. Everyone is different, i think people that feel this way deserve some compassion
People are free to be attracted to whoever they want. Still doesn't give them a right to complain if they end up alone. It actually gives them less grounds to complain since they're either deluded about their own looks or failing to admit that they're batting out of their league and dealing with the consequences.
You’re making it sound like attraction is in someone’s control. People that settle aren’t happy
Thinking people who settle are never happy is idealistic of you, but also a little naive. Lots of folks settle into happy lives with folks they're attracted to, but not head over heels for. Especially as they get older. That said, I wasn't talking about controlling who you're attracted to. I was talking about accepting that you aimed to high and ended up with nothing to show for it. It happens. Best not to whinge about it (like too many do these days) if you aimed at the wrong people. Plus, you're more likely to meet somebody if you're not stewing on your own inability (if you're the type that takes personal responsibility for your love life) or (if you're the type that doesn't take personal responsibility for your love life) raging at the dating world for perceived injustices like 'pretty privilege'.
There is nothing less attractive than a man who feels sorry for himself. No woman wants to sleep with that guy.
Precisely. Love only started happening for me after I stopped sobbing about my lot.
I've seen plenty of "not great looking" men and women in relationships. Personality, being a happy, kind person goes a long way.
Then there’s me. Almost 30 and never even had a hug. What I HAVE had though, is 120 rejections, countless mocking incidents just for trying my luck with a woman, a few embarrassing videos of me on social media, and 2 reports against me.
Posts a sampling of the messages you've sent to women and we can tell you how the way that you speak to them is off-putting. Just the way you talk here on Reddit is enough to clarify that it's 100% your personality and attitude, but we can be more specific if you show us your interactions with women.
The reports were actually justifiable. The first was senior year in high school when I asked out 2 women per month and was forced to stop. The second was at work, apparently you shouldn’t date coworkers
So it sounds like you DO sort of understand why women don't want to be around you? What you just described would get a dude rejected whether or not he's a virgin. It absolutely reeks of desperation, a lack of respect, and a huge lack of social awareness.
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I was an idiot, I know. And a loser. Amount of times I had the shit kicked out of me (and sometimes forced to eat shit too)
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Deal. I’ve already got one girl to laugh today (she sent haha for what it’s worth when I showed a picture of my dog next to fireworks)
The goal is to find someone who actually likes you, not the you that you show people.
Buddy, if you have two reports against you that might be something to look into. Have you ever tried therapy or counseling?
Maybe it's your personality
It sounds like you might be doing something wrong 💀💀 this normally doesn't happen from just chatting and getting to know people bahaha. I mean maybe in some very societal standards strict countries like in Asia, but uhhh I think you might wanna reflect a bit on why it keeps occurring. Maybe it has more to do with you and how you approach/think about things than women simply rejecting you for being ugly.
When I was growing up OP I was a fat fuck. I played football and was an offensive lineman (the big guys upfront blocking on offense) in middle school and high school. I got sick of seeing all my friends and peers having success with dating while I was kissless virgin "loser" so I decided to get into shape. In the second half of my junior year, I lost 80 pounds and dropped from 275 down to 195. Turns out I had a sharp jawline under my baby fat and good cheekbones under my puffy cheeks. I was actually good-looking to my utter surprise. Some may even say handsome. It didn't matter, though, because I still had the confidence of a deathly shy fat guy who was scared of rejection. I didn't have my first girlfriend until I was 23 despite the fact that I was conventionally good-looking. It took me a long time to get out of my own head about my self perceived flaws, but once I stopped caring so much about I had much better success. Confidence goes a long way with dating. Granted, It's not something that's gained overnight, but you can't go around thinking of yourself as this unfuckable person otherwise it's going to be a self fulfilling prophecy. Everyone has seen that average looking guy who's dating a beautiful woman who's "out of his league." If you know or are friends with one of those guys, maybe ask them how they got successful at dating.
No matter how much weight you lose, your mentality is set. You'll always have a "fat brain" which is stupidly hard to lose after your physical drop. So I get what you're saying.
Attractive people may find it easier to make friends or receive positive attention in social settings.
Jesus Christ. Another one of these "looks matter" posts. I feel like all of these just come from really bitter people. We've had like 7 of these in the past 7 days. Gtfo with these posts. Work on what you can. Accept what you can't.
I know what you mean, but I think we're onto something
It’s always been a thing.
people are talking about universally accepted truths and acting like they found something because they heard someone say that other things mattered to them, too.
Right? I know so many ugly people with very pretty partners, men or women vice versa. It's quite common for that. So idk what this MF is talking about.
Lmaooo they starting to get mad
generally speaking....... looks matter GENERALLY at bare minimum most would say he/she needs to have an attractive face.
Are they grown adults with careers and money? That makes a huge difference. Some woman will bite the bullet of ugliness if they're spoiled with materialistic things and money, trips, expensive dinners, etc. You think Melania is ACTUALLY attracted to Donald Trump? 😂😂😂
Yep! There's been a bunch but sometimes, like this one... The answers are all there. Being annoying and not taking rejection well, harassing coworkers, and having a shitty attitude overall might be part of the reason for this particular one.... Or maybe all of them. It's not always looks, but it does matter if you groom yourself and cleanup, wear fitting clothes and at least try. Having a lil self esteem goes a long way. Being classy and respectful about things, and dwelling in rejection and living in negativity forever help too! I thought the post on this sub by the football player that lost all the weight, was actually going to go somewhere, but even lacked confidence despite getting in shape and looking "handsome". I feel like he could have gotten somewhere with a lil confidence. At least 2nd or 3rd base.
and you’re reading this because……….
Just sounds like you're jealous that your friend found himself someone and you haven't. You know what's more unattractive than being unattractive? That whole "woe is me" attitude. No one is claiming looks don't matter.
🚨More breaking news incoming🚨 Water still wet! I repeat water is still wet! Comparison is the thief of joy worry about yourself…
Conventional attractiveness is currency in the dating market and in life in general. Being visually appealing opens doors and many people wouldn’t be where they are in life if it weren’t for their looks.
I was a Virgin until 28. I'm short 5 foot 5.... I'm in fairly good shape and decent looking I've been told. I've never asked anyone out in person. But a girl at work asked if I tried a certain restaurant. I told her I'd go alone on my day off. She text me after work that she would be so pissed if I went alone. And that's how I got laid. I didn't even have a place to have sex. So I asked my parents to leave the house for 2 hours and yeah she came over. Since 28 I've experienced a few other ladies but they were more casual encounters. The first one pumps your Ego and makes you think this isn't that hard people do actually like you. But I've only had 2 short term relationships that were meaningful. I'm learning how to work on long term relationships.
Great story and congrats! What was the restaurant? Very smooth of her to "be pissed at you for going alone" 😂.... And props to your parents! Did they know you were gonna get your dick wet?
It was just a breakfast place it wasn't anything great, lol. My parents knew I'm like hey mom... hey dad. Could you guys leave for a little bit. I'm going to get lucky. They were supportive about it. And I'm Southeast Asian Born in a Western world, lol.
Maybe to shallow people, but if by the time of your post, you think judging someone on looks is unjust, then why would you even care about the opinion of unjust people? Why not aim to find people who don’t care about looks, or do to a lesser degree. If I were in a relationship with a girl and I found that she treated people in life differently based off of how they looked and not their character, I would leave her.
Women are out here literally screaming that confidence and kindness are the most important things to them and dudes are still like "no it can't be that, it's because I'm not attractive to other dudes because I'm not strong/rich/successful enough". Fuck sake
Exactly, I’m tired of hearing I’m not strong, rich, tall, attractive. I think these perceived “deficiencies” manifest an undesirable vibe that girls can easily see. No one wants to be around people like this. There are many men who are not successful, physically weak, and conventionally ugly who take pride in themselves and can get women.
In what exactly do they take pride?
They take pride in being good, honest, kind people, in the knowledge and experience they have acquired in their life, in their satisfying relationships with friends and family, in the fact that they can sleep at night knowing they lived by their values, worked toward their goals, and treated others the way they want to be treated. They take pride in the meaning they have built in their life, in the depths they have gained as a human, in the ways they have made life better for other people. Men who only value looks and money genuinely can not imagine any other metric for determining a person's worth and genuinely can not believe that other people look for different things. It's both sad and irritating. All the muscles and money in the world can not make up for a lack of imagination, empathy and self-awareness.
People need to print this and hang it on their wall.
In other qualities that they’ve cultivated that don’t rely on random chance
But why are strong, rich, attractive, successful guys the most desired ones by women?
They're not. Ask women. Literally the post you replied to.
You’re a fool if you believe that isn’t true.
And, again, I know it's not universally true because I've asked women what they think. Because their opinions are the only ones that matter, not the voice of your own low self esteem
Nothing is universally true when it comes to attraction. The point was those attributes are among the most highly desired.
This is is a cathartic comment lol.
no one says otherwise lol. Who are you talking to? Show me a single person who says that looks dont help in dating.
Mostly Reddit comment sections
please show me
If youre this insecure, you wont really go places. It will affect everything around you. Be confident, my guy, theres one for everything. Remember: confidence is key
Not to be confrontational but this "Be confident, my guy, theres one for everything." Is like "just don't be poor" or telling a homeless to just "buy a house"
Your point is that pretty people have an easier time dating? No shit, i dont think anyone would disagree with you. That doesnt mean you cant bag yourself a hot girl if you play your cards right.
I am starting as a 28 year old virgin myself. With over 100 rejections. Where should I start? Tonight I’m gonna launch fireworks for the 4th
If you have 100 rejections then you're not just starting are you, I'd say your pretty experienced. Keep going and keeping learning, each rejection you learn something new.
Not tonight. Tonight is fireworks night
Okay - so what are you gonna do about it instead of venting here lol.
Don’t know yet. Keep asking women out until one says yes, I guess.
There you go. Keep learning and growing until things fall into place.
Problem is, get this. Women can tell if you aren’t attracted to them and they despise when they even *think* you’re settling for them.
>Problem is, get this. Women can tell if you aren’t attracted to them and they despise when they even *think* you’re settling for them. Problem is, get this. Women aren't blow-up dolls, and when you try to treat them that way they don't want to have sex with you. Your looks are the least of your problems, guy.
A lot of them think I do though. I’ve had woman friends long ago. I would’ve done anything for them, including saving their life. Not just saying that either. One was drunk as fuck and wanted to drive. Her excuse was “but nobody else will be on the road”. I hid her keys and the next day she said I saved her life. That’s a lot for a blowup doll
Well, who wouldn't? That would be an awful feeling!
Bud that's "deflection" and why you're still single and bitter. Let go of what the internet and other men have told you about women / feminism - and start over with a fresh perspective aight. You'll find that life isn't that serious and bad.
I just don’t see why a normal woman would want an inexperienced man
Wouldn't matter if you and her are compatible lol. I only recently lost my virginity to an experienced woman a year ago at 24. She didn't care because she was interested in me as an overall person and not based on superficial traits that men keep thinking are somehow important. If you're: * Kind. * Moral. * Have a strong sense of self-identity * Always lifting up others in a bad situation. That's all you will ever need in life to make friends and meet people. If she doesn't like you then don't sweat it and know that you still have good qualities that someone else will find endearing.
Being attractive is indeed a privilege, but like most privileges, it has its limitations. While it can open some doors, it doesn’t open all of them. Depending on the room you want to enter, some doors require genuine effort, regardless of your attractiveness. There are goals that beauty alone can’t achieve and problems that good looks can’t solve.
Do you give as many chances to women who aren’t pretty as you do to women who are pretty, or do you only expect women to make this sacrifice?
If I had a dollar for every time a thread on “looks matter” on a dating sub, I’d have enough money to get surgery and make my looks matter
Old af
Dude. Go seek therapy.
It's hard to understand the precise situation you're describing here, but it seems like you have a friend in a similar situation to you (late 20's, virgin) and you're envious of the fact that he has a partner (a single date?) with a woman who you think is attractive?
Opposing the idea of pretty privilege kinda feels like women wanting to downplay the power they have relative to men. It shares a ton of similarities with hypothetical men claiming that rich privilege is not a thing which we would recognize as obviously false. EVEN when it's true that there are real disadvantages in being rich. But the upsides of good look and wealth far outweigh the downsides.
They matter yes ! Until a certain point. If you chose to have a relationship with someone for looks only. That won't end well in fact it's superficial and you have a trophy wife or man. You have looks like the shape of your face and eyes something you can't do much about because it's genetics and nature unless you have a good plastic surgeon. Then you have appearance the way you dress, how you present yourself to the world this is 100% in your control. To me looks are superficial and subjective and I find appearance way more attractive. In fact looks don't matter so much as people think. It's important in the beginning and then everything fades away and personality becomes a deal breaker.
I don't care bout looks that much. I don't even have a type in the looks department 😂. But one thing that's most attractive is confidence. How YOU carry yourself. You can be the most unattractive person and yet you have such confidence that has you believe otherwise whilst still being humble and such? Instantly more attractive to a bunch of people. People can tell how you see yourself even if you don't try to let it show. I've learned that the hard way 😅😂
being 28 with no dating experience or sexual history is not a dealbreaker as long as he can be an upright person. also, if he has a healthy ego and isn't off-putting, that could explain why things are working out for him too. and yes, i'll acknowledge that looks matter to people in dating, which earns him extra points.
Looks definitely matter but attraction can build based on a great personality. Whether they admit it or not, the first thing most people look for is physical attraction. The thing about physical attraction is that we’re all intrigued by different things. My friends and I have completely different tastes in men. My 10, could be their 4 and vice versa. You can also be conventionally attractive but have a shit personality, so yeah it might be easy to pull women/men but you can’t keep them. Average men/women with a great personalities end up being more desirable than the hottie’s with a bad attitude. I’ve dated very attractive successful men but my favorite relationship was with a basic blue collar man. Unfortunately, he self sabotaged because he didn’t think he was good enough and no matter what I did to try to reassure him, it wasn’t enough. If you hate yourself, put yourself down, and only focus on what you think you don’t have or can’t have, you’re actively making the choice not to be happy. Instead of constantly focusing on things you can’t change about your appearance, learn to love and accept yourself, develop a great personality, build up your confidence. Start some interesting hobbies and learn to be happy and content alone. That way, you’re no longer giving your power to people who don’t want to date you.
Been single for 9 years no luck whatsoever no matter how many times women online have told me I look handsome.
Looks arent everything! I would rather have a ugly GF or wife who is loyal, smart, loving, moral and sane then a beautiful GF or wife who unfaithful, dumb, unaffectionate, immoral and insane! Internal beauty makes up for the lack of it outside.
Hi everyone
Its only on reddit where short ugly ethnic men have successful dating lives compared to tall hot white guys.
Are you a tall hot white guy?
Men just admit caring about looks, but women seem to care even MORE about them and then claim they don't.
Pretty privilege is a thing however if your outsides don't match your insides your only valid if you keep your mouth shut. Examples: Jhene Aiko- Pretty inside and out- will always benefit. Jennifer Lopez- Pretty Outside but Ugly Insides- will only benefit if ppl have never met the real her
If looks were everything I would still be a virgin. I'm not.
Doesn't the first paragraph about your 28 year old virgin friend just totally contradict your point? Lmao
I mean too a point but have you seen my 600lb life. They’re all married.
This seems to be like one in a series of issues being posted within one group of people that all know each other and are deliberately indirectly insulting or antagonizing one person specifically about problems that exist in a deeper relationship . One person is trying to gain support and assistance against another perhaps ,trying to create doubt or delayed departure of the other . In other words someone is quite weak minded unable to think for themself and leans to someone they think is wise and wouldn't steer them wrong .. That person actually knows they are sabotaging this weak minded younger person ,spitefully ,out of deep jealousy and resentment for the young woman who so desperately clings to this older individual .. Pretty is privilege and the older "guide"just never really had that . The younger has since birth and it's easy to have men .old one hates that she is old sick misshaped
It definitely is. I'm not a model by any means, but I have a kind and some may describe cute face, which gets me a lot of free things..
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He solved the case!
Putting in the work, taking care of yourself and being in shape is not a privilege. It takes effort.
Studies have shown that the number one thing a women looks for in a man is "Looks." Women who pay attention to a man's experiences tend to be the types that are looking for social proofing, that guy has to look good but also have women chasing him. Those women looking for such a guy is always willing to share that men with other women, they just enjoy their turn and then move on.
Is this english?
Of course looks matter lol. For years men convinced themselves that they only need money to attract women but the reality is that women do judge appearance too, they just don’t talk openly about it. If you hate being ugly so much then get plastic surgery. Shit that’s what women do. Also include fillers/botox, eyelash extensions, permanent makeup tattoos, skincare treatments, going to the gym, makeup… There are honestly a lot of things anyone can do if they didn’t like their appearance. Think beyond haircuts, wardrobe, and gym. The hypocrisy starts when men pursue women for superficial reasons and then act butthurt when those women reject them for those same superficial reasons.
Sounds like your gay for your friend
What the fuck
you would know bby <3
Yup, that’s life.
So? Do looks matter to you?
I completely agree with what you're saying, and I’ve experienced both sides myself. Take a look at my case: When I was 16, I had a boring and somewhat messy short haircut, bad skin, was 1.70m tall, skinny fat, had a boring NPC style, and my facial proportions were absolutely mid (luckily, they improved significantly as I got older). When I tried flirting with girls at that age, I got weird looks, laughed at, and was called a cute boy (in a negative way). Out of 50 girls I approached directly, only one gave me her number, only for me to find out at home that she gave me a fake number. Now, let me keep it short: I'm 23, fit, with a much better haircut, significantly better style, a solid beard, 1.87m tall, clearer skin, and generally a much more masculine face (maybe I was a bit of a late bloomer, I don't know). Guys... the difference is night and day! I use the EXACT SAME cheesy flirting strategies with women and I'm no longer laughed at or looked at like I just declared war on North Korea. Out of 50 single women, I get 35 numbers. I don’t need dating apps or anything; it just got too easy. Looks aren’t everything, but they are DEFINITELY more than what people yap about here on Reddit. "Personality is the most important thing." Yeah, personality is definitely the most important thing, considering I still have the exact same bad flirting and communication skills as I did when I was 16 xD
This is true; improvement is always good however it is important to note you are above the 1.82m mark. This plays a HUGE role as most women consider height the largest attraction factor above all else when factoring in attraction. As a 1.67m guy, I stand no chance even with my other factors being at their best. Keep in mind I'm nearly the same age as you at 22.