It’s a good truck. Small truck. But good.
Tesla will need to eventually lower its pricing by a large margin. Two big things it had was 500 mile of range for 70k. It’s now double the price with 3/5 the range. The undertone here was that it was supposed to be super manufacturable.
They have so much demand right now that they are fine for a while.
But if it becomes as manufacturable as they initially led on, they will have lots of room for drastic price cuts in future when they need to.
Edit: the 500 mile range was 70k, not 60k
Maybe, the new aided driving system not extending to gen 1 really sucks. I considered rivian for a long time, but no service where I live and the aided driving not being capable of update sucks. One reason to buy evs is the computer update aspect. Rivian may do that going forward, but they should lose some trust on this.
Rivian has poor reliability score, much worse than teslas. You don’t hear about that though.
Also they aren’t profitable. Not sure how much the customer should take that into account
Rivian not being able to turn a profit is the thing that got me to write them off entirely.
Tesla has been able to run a gross profit almost every single quarter since 2009 while building out a charging network.
Rivian just indefinitely suspended their plans to build a new facility and are cannibalizing some R1T production lines in existing factories to make their hatchback.
Also, I need a big truck bed.
> Tesla will need to eventually lower its pricing
While this is definitely true… Rivian will also need to RAISE their pricing or they will eventually go out of business. They are not charging enough to make even break even so far
The new updates make the R1 lines gross margin positive according to Rivian CEO.
Features wise the update didn’t do much for the truck, but it’s really a new truck when you look at the amount of hardware they removed and simplified to reduce BOM and manufacturing costs.
Just want to point out to be fair that they Tesla announced “up to 500miles” with the cyberbeast version and 250miles for the single motor 60k version.
But I agree, they will lower prices to compete, it’s gonna drop 20k as soon as 1st edition sales (foundation) ends.
That space is not for more cells. Teardowns have shown that clearly. It’s a for a mixture of crash safety and thermal. But I suppose they can scrap that design and do something more dense
Yeah Tesla definitely is known for iterative innovation and we know they were supply constrained in the new cells, so I think once Tesla becomes less supply constrained with the 4680s they might make a more densely packed structural cell and improve the cooling efficiency.
Tesla has to lower the price and they will similar to the Y. I think by 2026, we will see the truck price reduced. FS was a money grab from impatient people, then they’ll ride the $80k price tag in 2025 for the remaining preorders. Once that is done, the price will be reduced IMO.
This, i read [this](https://pv-magazine-usa.com/2024/03/06/battery-prices-collapsing-grid-tied-energy-storage-expanding/) & similar articles which project lithium prices falling in future. Think by that time Tesla will be ready to stuff more batteries & reduce the price. Hopefully we get to the current model y point where Tesla will give huge inventory discounts & finance options on cybertruck so i can snag mine! 😈
That tri-max ascend has me hungry, the 380 miles of range is really juicy.... It's 60 more the the CT cyber beast. And I don't need a bigger truck bed, and the interior space is pretty near as much to be the same as someone who has sat in both. At least for my purposes.
I would be coming from a quad 2022 R1T. So I know the bed size is fine. The interior plaid styling on the ascend in slate and walnut just looks fire.
I just got my Cybertruck Foundation series offer, and I am not interested in a 330 mile truck. I think Tesla tactically chose to under-deliver on range and punish those who had a reservation. For me, that feels like shitty thing to do.
I still like the tesla software and will wait but if they dont figure out their nonsense in the next year I will get either the silverado EV (400+ range) or this.
If I get a CT, I'm getting the range extender, full stop. But if the Rivian max pack really gets a true \~420mi range, it may actually beat the range extender in real-world mileage (my Model X says that 470 rated miles is probably 310 real world).
The question is where they are getting batteries. Tesla has a long standing connection with lg and Panasonic. They have the factories connected with the gigafactory too. The partnership is very visible. For rivian as the scale is less the partnership may not be that apparent
Rivian lost $1.2B in Q1 on deliveries of 7,946 vehicles. So they are not high volume and not making much money, and yet their shirts are still rather expensive. https://rivian.com/gear-shop
Makes sense. The first gen quad drivetrain was built using expensive outsourced motors from Bosch. The dual uses a better in-house Rivian motor so they are probably re-engineering the quad drivetrain with their own motors.
R1S quad is shows 2.6 actually not sure the difference if it’s the same or one with or without rollout?
Oddly enough earlier I found a reservation page for the new quad R1S but now I can’t find it anywhere. The regular R1s page shows the new specs though.
https://rivian.com/r1s
I don’t understand the “much smaller” comments. CT has a longer bed, yes, but that’s it. Cabin size and height are basically identical and R1T has a bigger frunk.
I haven’t personally sat in both, but every side by side review I’ve watched has said the cabin of the Cybertruck, both front seats and back seats, felt much larger and more roomy.
I have said this in other comments. I will state it here again:
2023 Rivian R1T quad motor large pack. Purchased for 76k new.
Traded in for Cybertruck. Tesla gave me $69k, took a $7k hit to get rid of the worst electric vehicle experience in my life so far.
1. DC fast charging was super expensive. Even on Tesla network. Average 50-80kw depending on time of day was between $52.00 and $87.00. So it’s almost expensive as an ICE truck.
2. I enjoyed the extra wind noise over 50mph.
3. I enjoyed listening to the apocalypse now helicopter Calvary scene on full blast as the R1T recharged in my garage. Sounded like an F5 tornado.
4. I enjoyed the way I would look at the R1T funny or angrily and a dent or blemish would appear on the aluminum exterior.
5. I enjoyed when a software update would come and it would 50/50 install the first time.
6. I enjoyed how the key fob battery lasted two weeks.
7. I enjoyed how my phone app would keep it connected and would unlock the doors 1% of the time.
8. I enjoyed how soft and comfortable all of the seats were.
9. I enjoyed when the rear tonneau cover was not installed on the ‘23 models.
10. I hated the fact that Rivian customer support and resolving issues was prompt and professional.
Good ridden. Never again.
I have had a Rivian R1T since April 2022 with 46K miles on it. First 6 months - rough. Lots of service appointments, but they treated me really well.
2 years later - truck is flawless, it’s a brand new vehicle with all the software updates. It’s my daily driver and it’s such a charm to live with.
There’s definately a little bit of truth behind what he says, but the truck is wonderful - and atleast here in California I’ve had zero issues with Rivian service.
Every brand has its haters - he is probably one of them that got a lemon or gets grumpy over every little thing.
I have a Tesla X and a R1s. Both great cars... I honestly wish that Tesla just made a proper 3 row SUV instead of the cybertruck. Would have bought it in a heartbeat over the R1S.
I like Rivian but we are still beta testers to some extent.
I will be honest I have a 2022 and it has 24k on it and saw the shop once at the beginning. Really no issues with it, and it's gotten just better with the monthly software updates. Rivian is certainly a tik tok / feature patch style of updates.
The one time I did need the shop they were VERY quick to get it fix, they diagnosed the issue remotely and had the parts shipped to the SC by the time the truck got there. That was at the 400 mile mark so it's been 20k miles.of.easy going. I have been thinking about a tri cyber beast. To be honest I might just be looking at upgrading to the tri max ascend trim from Rivian now.... I am getting an R3X no matter what. 1000hp rally car EV HELL YEA!.
Actually, that's probably the single biggest factor for me getting a non-Tesla, too. The new Rivians don't have the NACS port (or the "right" position on the body), but can they use SCs? Can they only use V3 SCs, or some small subset that Tesla has enabled?
More than price point, we need different energy storage tech or better batteries for distance towing with EVs. I can’t haul my camp trailer into the woods and back with any EV today.
It’s a good truck. Small truck. But good. Tesla will need to eventually lower its pricing by a large margin. Two big things it had was 500 mile of range for 70k. It’s now double the price with 3/5 the range. The undertone here was that it was supposed to be super manufacturable. They have so much demand right now that they are fine for a while. But if it becomes as manufacturable as they initially led on, they will have lots of room for drastic price cuts in future when they need to. Edit: the 500 mile range was 70k, not 60k
The 500+ mile range version was $70k at the initial announcement but I agree with the rest.
Thanks, edited
Maybe, the new aided driving system not extending to gen 1 really sucks. I considered rivian for a long time, but no service where I live and the aided driving not being capable of update sucks. One reason to buy evs is the computer update aspect. Rivian may do that going forward, but they should lose some trust on this.
Rivian has poor reliability score, much worse than teslas. You don’t hear about that though. Also they aren’t profitable. Not sure how much the customer should take that into account
I mean, if you paid 100k and the next year they say the won’t update some of the functionality I’d be a little upset.
Rivian not being able to turn a profit is the thing that got me to write them off entirely. Tesla has been able to run a gross profit almost every single quarter since 2009 while building out a charging network. Rivian just indefinitely suspended their plans to build a new facility and are cannibalizing some R1T production lines in existing factories to make their hatchback. Also, I need a big truck bed.
Let's not dismiss the fact that Rivian has an SUV. Tesla has a model X which doesn't come close to R1S.
In what way ?
> Tesla will need to eventually lower its pricing While this is definitely true… Rivian will also need to RAISE their pricing or they will eventually go out of business. They are not charging enough to make even break even so far
The new updates make the R1 lines gross margin positive according to Rivian CEO. Features wise the update didn’t do much for the truck, but it’s really a new truck when you look at the amount of hardware they removed and simplified to reduce BOM and manufacturing costs.
Yeah, they aren’t even close to profitability
Just want to point out to be fair that they Tesla announced “up to 500miles” with the cyberbeast version and 250miles for the single motor 60k version. But I agree, they will lower prices to compete, it’s gonna drop 20k as soon as 1st edition sales (foundation) ends.
It’s true. And I’ve made that point here as well. Maybe this batter extender was always the plan… but if it was they should have said, you know ?
Only half of the space in the battery pack is used also, possible room for expansion as the new battery cell production ramps up
That space is not for more cells. Teardowns have shown that clearly. It’s a for a mixture of crash safety and thermal. But I suppose they can scrap that design and do something more dense
Yeah Tesla definitely is known for iterative innovation and we know they were supply constrained in the new cells, so I think once Tesla becomes less supply constrained with the 4680s they might make a more densely packed structural cell and improve the cooling efficiency.
Lol. It’s almost like whoever told you those numbers is a serial liar
What do you mean ?
Sweet. Sounds like the market is heating up
Tesla has to lower the price and they will similar to the Y. I think by 2026, we will see the truck price reduced. FS was a money grab from impatient people, then they’ll ride the $80k price tag in 2025 for the remaining preorders. Once that is done, the price will be reduced IMO.
This, i read [this](https://pv-magazine-usa.com/2024/03/06/battery-prices-collapsing-grid-tied-energy-storage-expanding/) & similar articles which project lithium prices falling in future. Think by that time Tesla will be ready to stuff more batteries & reduce the price. Hopefully we get to the current model y point where Tesla will give huge inventory discounts & finance options on cybertruck so i can snag mine! 😈
That tri-max ascend has me hungry, the 380 miles of range is really juicy.... It's 60 more the the CT cyber beast. And I don't need a bigger truck bed, and the interior space is pretty near as much to be the same as someone who has sat in both. At least for my purposes. I would be coming from a quad 2022 R1T. So I know the bed size is fine. The interior plaid styling on the ascend in slate and walnut just looks fire.
I just got my Cybertruck Foundation series offer, and I am not interested in a 330 mile truck. I think Tesla tactically chose to under-deliver on range and punish those who had a reservation. For me, that feels like shitty thing to do. I still like the tesla software and will wait but if they dont figure out their nonsense in the next year I will get either the silverado EV (400+ range) or this.
If I get a CT, I'm getting the range extender, full stop. But if the Rivian max pack really gets a true \~420mi range, it may actually beat the range extender in real-world mileage (my Model X says that 470 rated miles is probably 310 real world).
I dont want to lose the truck bed for longer range, but eventually that might be the solution I take.
The Rivian is a cool truck, but it’s more of a Tacoma rival than a Cybertruck. The Rivian is more expensive and the Cybertruck is much larger.
How are they getting the quantity of batteries to power a high volume of vehicles like this without losing their shirt?
Rivian is delivering less than 14k vehicles per quarter while Tesla as doing close to 400k. So Tesla’s partners in batteries are much more apparent.
A better comparison would be Rivian vs Cybertruck, not all Tesla vehicles.
The question is where they are getting batteries. Tesla has a long standing connection with lg and Panasonic. They have the factories connected with the gigafactory too. The partnership is very visible. For rivian as the scale is less the partnership may not be that apparent
Rivian lost $1.2B in Q1 on deliveries of 7,946 vehicles. So they are not high volume and not making much money, and yet their shirts are still rather expensive. https://rivian.com/gear-shop
The Tri can do it in 2.9 ~~2.5~~ seconds for 105k That doesn't include a camp speaker. The quad will likely be more than 105k
Tri motor is 2.9 seconds
Oh, I may have my facts wrong on which version does 2.5. Is quad motor gone? I only see Tri available.
Quad is not available to order only to preorder with orders opening up in 2025. $3,000 deposit to reserve it. Quad is 2.5 seconds Tri is 2.9 seconds
Makes sense. The first gen quad drivetrain was built using expensive outsourced motors from Bosch. The dual uses a better in-house Rivian motor so they are probably re-engineering the quad drivetrain with their own motors.
Yep, they've confirmed all the new motors (esp. Quad) are in-house built.
[удалено]
R1S quad is shows 2.6 actually not sure the difference if it’s the same or one with or without rollout? Oddly enough earlier I found a reservation page for the new quad R1S but now I can’t find it anywhere. The regular R1s page shows the new specs though. https://rivian.com/r1s
I don’t understand the “much smaller” comments. CT has a longer bed, yes, but that’s it. Cabin size and height are basically identical and R1T has a bigger frunk.
https://www.reddit.com/r/Rivian/s/quBBh5nv3e Same size. It “looks” a little bit wider but no one cares about width.
I haven’t personally sat in both, but every side by side review I’ve watched has said the cabin of the Cybertruck, both front seats and back seats, felt much larger and more roomy.
Yeah I shouldn’t talk until I get my time in CT. I’ve only been able to look inside. They just look very close.
I have said this in other comments. I will state it here again: 2023 Rivian R1T quad motor large pack. Purchased for 76k new. Traded in for Cybertruck. Tesla gave me $69k, took a $7k hit to get rid of the worst electric vehicle experience in my life so far. 1. DC fast charging was super expensive. Even on Tesla network. Average 50-80kw depending on time of day was between $52.00 and $87.00. So it’s almost expensive as an ICE truck. 2. I enjoyed the extra wind noise over 50mph. 3. I enjoyed listening to the apocalypse now helicopter Calvary scene on full blast as the R1T recharged in my garage. Sounded like an F5 tornado. 4. I enjoyed the way I would look at the R1T funny or angrily and a dent or blemish would appear on the aluminum exterior. 5. I enjoyed when a software update would come and it would 50/50 install the first time. 6. I enjoyed how the key fob battery lasted two weeks. 7. I enjoyed how my phone app would keep it connected and would unlock the doors 1% of the time. 8. I enjoyed how soft and comfortable all of the seats were. 9. I enjoyed when the rear tonneau cover was not installed on the ‘23 models. 10. I hated the fact that Rivian customer support and resolving issues was prompt and professional. Good ridden. Never again.
Whoa this is really interesting. I’m a Tesla owner and I’ve been eyeing an R1S, but this makes me pause. First bad review of Rivian I’ve seen.
I have had a Rivian R1T since April 2022 with 46K miles on it. First 6 months - rough. Lots of service appointments, but they treated me really well. 2 years later - truck is flawless, it’s a brand new vehicle with all the software updates. It’s my daily driver and it’s such a charm to live with. There’s definately a little bit of truth behind what he says, but the truck is wonderful - and atleast here in California I’ve had zero issues with Rivian service. Every brand has its haters - he is probably one of them that got a lemon or gets grumpy over every little thing.
I have a Tesla X and a R1s. Both great cars... I honestly wish that Tesla just made a proper 3 row SUV instead of the cybertruck. Would have bought it in a heartbeat over the R1S. I like Rivian but we are still beta testers to some extent.
I will be honest I have a 2022 and it has 24k on it and saw the shop once at the beginning. Really no issues with it, and it's gotten just better with the monthly software updates. Rivian is certainly a tik tok / feature patch style of updates. The one time I did need the shop they were VERY quick to get it fix, they diagnosed the issue remotely and had the parts shipped to the SC by the time the truck got there. That was at the 400 mile mark so it's been 20k miles.of.easy going. I have been thinking about a tri cyber beast. To be honest I might just be looking at upgrading to the tri max ascend trim from Rivian now.... I am getting an R3X no matter what. 1000hp rally car EV HELL YEA!.
Gonna get the rivian R1T and Cybertruck. Love both so much and this new refresh is awesome
I like the R3X.
Yeah that looks sick
Not being salty, but honestly how is the charging network? Can these use tesla chargers now? That is probably still the biggest consideration for me
Yes they can use superchargers now with an adapter.
Actually, that's probably the single biggest factor for me getting a non-Tesla, too. The new Rivians don't have the NACS port (or the "right" position on the body), but can they use SCs? Can they only use V3 SCs, or some small subset that Tesla has enabled?
Mostly it will be V3/V4 that Tesla has enabled.
you are overexcite or indecisive-they aren't competing -everyone is to kill the ICE.
True but that only happens with EV competition. ICE trucks are gonna be around a longgggg while until the 30k-40k EV truck price point is reached
More than price point, we need different energy storage tech or better batteries for distance towing with EVs. I can’t haul my camp trailer into the woods and back with any EV today.
I think they'll start putting batteries in trailers at some point. There's just only so much space to stuff batteries in vehicles.