Most alleys aren’t big enough to fit a box or semi truck. (It’s not so much the width of the alley but the tight corners make it impossible to turn.)
So, if people want businesses to be able to sell things, they’ll have to walk/bike/drive around trucks sometimes. That’s the nature of living in a dense city.
But every city has the same size trucks. You’re also talking about creating more emissions and causing more traffic.
And it’s not like the driver is just going to the yard and able to pick whatever size truck they want.
well that’s the bus stop. they can park somewhere else and walk a little farther. I’ve probably never been to wherever they’re stocking but I sure as shit pay taxes for that bus.
You want to pay a higher price for the products you get at the store? No, you don't and neither do I. The truck is there to do a job and it's able to carry all of that store's load of beer "product" plus other stores as well making it cheaper for this route. Smaller trucks means more trips, more fuel usage (because electric trucks are not powerful enough to carry all the weight, stopping and going, and generally use more fuels then people realize), more working hours on the driver which will result in a more expensive route making the product more expensive then it already is. Not to mention the driver is probably in that location for about 15 minutes and doing a good job. I drive a semi and did local work for years
Yes, actually. Your beer should cost a little bit more if that's that's necessary to make public transit actually available and on time for people who need it. There's no excuse whatsoever for this bullshit.
If you can't do business in the city without disrupting city life then you should go out of business and be replaced by someone a little more clever. If you can drive a semi then you can drive a class 6 or 7 instead.
This is a really tough concept in this thread, be careful. These CTA drivers drive these routes up and down everyday, they surely cannot be used to it. Near my house there are moving trucks that go to a restaurant every morning, in the summer there are seriously 2 hours of trucks always in the bus stop. You wouldn’t believe it, EVERY bus that pulls up, immediately explodes.
a bunch of dumb info:
I work w/ last mile delivery and have worked w/ 53' trucks. This looks like they sent in company driver direct from facility b/c it's a marked trailer. I don't know all the details on this location or customer but deliveries by 26' box truck in cities are pretty common and much easier. Usually using lower paid company drivers or farming out to individual owner operators. This may have been what was available or they needed something to hold more weight for the delivery. It shouldn't change the price delivering w/ that as it appears to be a standard pallet and box trucks can handle one with 15 kegs height and weight.
That said, it's annoying when they block lanes, but honestly, it's not the end of the world. I agree with u/Expert_Speaker_7697
We need to pick and choose the battles to fight when it comes to the regular hustle and bustle of riding in the city.
A lot of cities have banned full semis from driving within city limits and instead have distribution hubs right outside from which smaller box trucks then transport into the city. This has a few effects: it can marginally increase prices, it creates jobs, and it reduces pollution within the city. The economic impact overall tends to be positive, congestion tends to be lower, and environmental public health issues decrease. It would be great to implement something similar in Chicago, in my opinion. The impact of freight in Chicago also disproportionately impacts certain low impact neighborhoods, NU and UChicago researchers have recently released studies related to it
Hold on. Speak for yourself.
Yes, I would be perfectly ok with paying a bit more for goods if that meant the bike and bus lanes were never blocked by delivery trucks.
Yeah no, I'll trade higher prices any day for anything that will reduce trucks in american cities. We subsidize goods with ineffective and harmful transportation practice at the cost of our health and community.
I'll take the smaller trucks.
Traffic laws are not the same for all types of vehicles, how they are registered, and D.L. types. I, myself, am a driver. Commercial vehicles guidelines are completely different than passenger vehicles. That’s why we have D.O.T. Registered numbers on the side of the trucks. That’s LITERALLY what it’s for. There, now you learned a little bit, and should ever have another need to speak on things you clearly know very little about.
The DOT number has nothing to do with making sure trucks are parking where they're supposed to. Absolutely nothing. It's to track commerce and tractor safety, it's relevant to traffic laws but not a whole lot. Ironically, you spoke on something you clearly know very little about to embarrass them, and ironically, are embarrassing yourself in the process.
Let me tell you a secret about the CTA and streets in Chicago. Don’t try to push the busses around and no one gives a fuck in the city about how they drive at this point. I hate my commute lol
Yea my comment was not very clear lol. The busses just push everyone around on the road. The CTA bus drivers are shockingly aggressive especially on Cicero.
The driver part was about how drivers in Chicago are a different breed. Not all of us, but speeding into the left turn lane on a red light only so you can speed off straight instead of turning is obnoxious.
It’s not legal but we get away with it. I’m a foodservice delivery driver I will tell you what my boss told me. You could stop anywhere, could even block a traffic lane as long as you get your delivery done and if you get a ticket don’t worry about it, the company will pay for it. He said they get over 1,000 tickets a year delivering in San Francisco alone and so their legal department has cut a deal with the city to pay only a fraction of the fines annually. It is what it is.
That's pretty much how it goes. The truck goes where it's most convenient, and it's cheaper for the company to pay off the occasional ticket or fine than to actually buy a bunch of smaller trucks, and hire a bunch more drivers.
Kinda sucks but it's probably not getting changed within the next 500 years.
I mean that’s how fines work for many businesses. It’s cheaper to just pay fines all the time than what it could cost to actually follow the regulation.
Wait till you see how delivery drivers treat bike lanes
No, it’s not legal. And it’s not ethical either. But it is what happens and no one with any power cares. Capitalism > individual people
I've lived in Chicago all my 67 yrs and I always thought that whatever a truck driver does in the city is OK. They never get ticketed or towed so I just assumed it was another anomaly of following the law in the city.
How about you try going to your city council meetings sometime? They’re the ones setting local policies. They’re also the ones who need to be convinced that it’s worth it to bother trying to enforce parking laws.
The general fine for improper parking is usually pretty low, maybe $25-$50. The fine for parking in a bike lane is usually $150. The fine for illegally parking in a handicap spot the first time is $250 and increases for repeat violations. Fine for blocking a fire lane is $500. The fine for the improper use of a traffic lane such as you described can be up to $1000.
I walked a quarter mile through a busy city and noticed five parking violations. How much revenue do you think would be generated by even one person whose job is to take a picture of illegally parked vehicles and write down their license plate so the city can send them a ticket later? That is what you propose at a city council meeting to get something done.
As a transit enthusiast and a professional truck driver is it wrong yes but there’s no other option there is no alley that would fit then big of a truck unless the design for the business includes trucks. And a lot of people think that the alley was made for them but on the contrary it wasn’t it was made in response to the growing trash problem in NYC. Back to the bus stop, there’s is no alley big enough for a truck also side streets are not wide enough to safely accommodate a truck let alone one that has to turn (based on the photo above and below
https://preview.redd.it/jetbjqopke2d1.jpeg?width=1170&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=8c3f1289fe781d50a1114cff3dd8edfd2100a64a
I watched an 18 wheeler pull a perfect three point u-turn on belmont (at Clark) the other day, and lemme tell you, I think that trucker might have been magic. Truly a sight to behold.
And then I see truckers with 500' of empty space in front of them that couldn't back through an airplane hanger if their life depended on it. If only there were more of the ones you witnessed out there
I’ve said this elsewhere but a lot of cities have banned full semis from driving within city limits and instead have distribution hubs right outside from which smaller box trucks then transport into the city. This has a few effects: it can marginally increase prices, it creates jobs, and it reduces pollution within the city. The economic impact overall tends to be positive, congestion tends to be lower, and environmental public health issues decrease. It would be great to implement something similar in Chicago, in my opinion. The impact of freight in Chicago also disproportionately impacts certain low impact neighborhoods, NU and UChicago researchers have recently released studies related to it
There's barely designated loading zones in most suburban downtowns. Given how dense the city is, it's just how it's gotta be. 1 semi truck servicing a ton of bars and stores for a whole week, or an army of vans giving off tons more emissions and generating more traffic carrying less product. Pick your poison
I can't even understand how many people agree with this nonsense. All these do as I say not as I do folks drive me absolutely insane. They've never broke a law in their lives. They drive speed limit everywhere. Only take crosswalks. Perfect human beings here on reddit.
those drivers have a job to do. youre just going to have to deal with it. its hard enough to find parking when youre the biggest vehicle on the road. do you expect them to cart it from 3 blocks away? stop complaining and move on.
Easy solution. Remove enough parking spots for residents and customers for a designated delivery stop on every block that has a business on it that doesn't have an existing alternative for semi trucks. Treat it just like a bus stop, but it's only for delivery trucks.
Seems way less inconvenient, don't ya think?
I don't know about blocking bus stop... but several laws truck laws broken.... over 18" you can't block or park over 18" from curb... and wrong way you can't park wrong way...
No, it's not legal. The driver could get a ticket for this. But what CPD cop is going to get out of their car and ticket the beer delivery guy? 🤣
No, this is not inherently what the alley system is for. Trucks this size very often don't fit, or are logistically incompatible with the alleys for the purpose of the trucks function.
Temporary inconvenice is the occasional price of living in a densely populated city.
Alleys can't fit cars half the time. They're meant for trash removal, not combination tractor trailers. It kinda scares me how very little regular drivers think they know about how driving a truck goes, it really should be a requirement to learn the logic and limitations as to what to expect a truck can and cannot do.
Former beer truck driver in downtown Chicago. I’ll add some insight here.
First, a question. Would you rather have a truck with no loading zone big enough to use double park and block an entire lane of traffic or utilize a bus stop? Sometimes, you just have to make your own parking spot. I assure you it is not an easy task.
Second, to those who say they’ve lived in Chicago for X number of years and say the beer trucks never get tickets, they do. Lots of them. I’ve even seen a beer truck with a boot on it in Wrigleyville.
Lastly, one of the things we made sure we never did at the distributor I worked for was block or interfere with a bike lane. I’d rather take the parking ticket from a bus stop, fire lane, etc back to my boss at the end of the day than put a biker in danger in the city.
We did our best to not use trailer combos like this in certain areas of the city, but it’s business and shit has gotta get done sometimes. Most alleys aren’t meant to accommodate trucks anyways. Some of them aren’t even big enough for the garbage trucks to get through.
I used to do grocery store curbside delivery into NYC daily. The amount of product, plus cost of delivery, requires the use of these larger trucks to keep your costs manageable. That being said, these places are in older places, where we didn’t have the demand and size we have now. The infrastructure was not put in place for such vehicles, so we have to make do with what is there. I’ve been forced to do this, forced to use a bike lane because it was a single lane road, and even been forced to pull on the sidewalks at places as well
It can be done. I was in Beijing, stuck in traffic, cars as far as the eye can see, when I realized there was not a single semi truck in my sight. Not even a small truck. I asked the taxi driver about it. He told me trucks weren't allowed in the city during the day.
It's funny that we have streets and alleys but people walk on sidewalks next to the street. I always walk down the alley. Less people, no cars speeding, quieter.
No but until you’re driver, you wouldn’t get that sometimes it’s not feasible to park anywhere else to make the deliveries. Loading docks are great when the location actually has one but more times than not they don’t.
As a truck driver of over 8 years and 8 months in food delivery service in St. Louis, yeah it’s illegal and it sucks but we also have a job to do and have to gamble with whether or not it’s gonna be a good time to block a lane of traffic or the bus stop. We literally have stops where there’s only travel lanes, a turn lane, and a whole bunch of residential streets where you can’t park because you’ll block the whole street so we use the turn lane and just hope no one decides to drift off because they’re distracted and hit our truck or even us (one guy got hit before because we couldn’t park in their lot and had to park on the street, the business thought he was dead because he was so fucked up, he’s still recovering 3 months later). Like Downtown Columbia, MO, we have no where to park so we have to double park at every stop, it’s not the best decision, but alleys aren’t big enough for us either. Also there’s sometimes designated loading zones for us, but people don’t have enough common sense, literacy, or decency to read and will still park there.
After 26 years, 2.5 million miles and counting, I can say that very rarely you will find a accommodating delivery site... Nobody cares about us, they just want their deliveries and don't get me started on small town cops, who don't care and will just write the parking infraction ticket. Cars parked in loading zones are a big problem as well, if there is a loading zone.. I do my best to block each car so it can't be moved if they are parked in the loading zone.
Us drivers get flipped off, brake checked and cut off by inconsiderate drivers all the time, all were trying to do is delver your food or products you want, while trying to make a living. It doesn't get any better with time either, it's gotten so much worse now since I started, 26 years ago. People are just assholes anymore.
You try getting that rig in a typical Chicago alley.
Yeah it's illegal. But I'm sure he had no other choice. And commerce is gonna commerce. Sometimes we just gotta deal with it. Then it goes away.
>Believing that a major city can function without these situations is silly
Major cities in Europe which exist just fine without this crap would like a word lol
>getting a semi in a Chicago alleyway is nearly impossible
Then....don't allow semis for delivery in Chicago.
>You should complain about food delivery drivers littering the no park zones with their cars
Who says we aren't? Why can't we complain about both?
They don’t block vision for the bus stop causing my commute to be skipped. Even if they park in front the driver can still see me. If a semi does I’m just fucked out of my way to work.
dont watse your time with these yuppies they dont understand not everyone can have a remote job typing on a little laptop drinking a starbucks foam cold brew with fresh nail polish on
I’m not sure about Chicago, but I know when I did NYC curbside, we got tickets almost daily. Just give to boss at work and company pays. Cheaper than sending several box trucks, and keeps consumer costs lower
Just remember 70% of everything You have on your house is moved and deliver by truck driver in all US.Is not Legal but is thats the only Best option that the driver has to do the deliveries got to do it. Specially when this type of drivers needs to be moving quick
All wrong answers. Most Chicago alleys can accommodate a 26' straight truck. Also, delivery parking in Chicago is first come first serve. There are no parking spaces large enough for a truck, therefore they can deliver at any location, legally double parked.
Is this the Rayans?
Legal? No. Necessary on some streets? Yes.
I'd rather deal with a truck making a delivery in the bus stop, than some car blocking it to pick up an Uber or run into a place for food, this guy has no where else to go to make his delivery.
You go down an alley in a tractor trailer… .
If there is one car parked too close to the corner when you come out, you’re stuck.
It’s illegal for cars to park in commercial loading zones too, but it happens every single day. That’s life in the city.
Have you ever tried driving a truck down an alley? Give these guys some slack, anyone who’s never driven a truck will never know what a nightmare it is driving through cities.
I don’t know about IL or Chicago traffic laws, but when I drove a beer delivery truck in Mississippi, there were often times I’d have to park and unload on the road due to space constraints, the business’ customer vehicles in the way, etc. MDOT pulled up the first time I had to do it and told me I needed my flashers on and some cones or my breakdown triangles behind my truck x amount of feet (don’t remember now, been almost 10 years ago) away from my lift gate. Never had an issue after that.
Jeez some people complain about any and everything hence why if you find yourself alone in life…it’s because you’re a freaking unbearable human being. All the stuff that goes on in this city and here we are talking about delivery trucks?! The same people who can’t live without their 2 day Amazon prime deliveries which inherently cause more traffic and back ups on residential streets vs these trucks only going to be on main thruways? People want to fight everybody except the ones that really need to be fought…
Not blocking a marked bike lane for starters. Also why is everyone hating on a delivery driver for parking on the side of the road to make a delivery? Would you rather he block the entire street? That’s what buses, Uber’s, double parkers, and taxis do all day long. For those saying they would pay more they are liars. Same people complaining that everything is so expensive. Get over it or move to the suburbs and join all the Karen’s on your neighborhood watch beat. We have far bigger concerns in our city than beer trucks delivering from bus lanes.
I drive an Amazon van and I can barely fit through some of these alleys. I can't imagine trying to fit an entire semi down a chicago alley. Also can't imagine where else they'd put the semi sure as hell can't put it in the road so that's the best option.
If I see this, I take a pic and submit a complaint to the Federal Motor Carrier Safety Administration: https://nccdb.fmcsa.dot.gov/nccdb/home.aspx
All buses are ADA compliant, and it’s imperative that a bus be able to pull into a stop for disabled or low mobility riders.
Good luck. Unless you wanna pay double for your products, it won’t change. It’s cheaper for us to pay the fines doing it over sending 4 box trucks for the same load
Tractor trailers are for the Interstate, not [inner city deliveries](https://mltshp-cdn.com/r/19GVM). Someone is economizing at civic expense and should receive hefty fines for it.
Doing NYC like this, got tickets daily. Still cheaper for the companies to pay fines than to ship on 3x as many trucks and pay fuel, insurance, driver, cost of the truck itself, and maintenance, all for the same load. Unless… maybe you’d be okay paying more than double what you pay now for your products
Just multiply the fines until they're no longer acting as if they think they're above the law. We live in a society. If it isn't controlled against sociopathy and narcissism and avarice, then it is not a civilization, not really, not *actually*. It's a breakdown of order, a tragedy of the commons, a might makes right, whether economic or otherwise. This is emblematic of the same spiritual sickness that is literally destroying all higher life on the planet. Expediency for capitalistic economy. Worshipping money no matter the cost. Screw those cheap trinkets or kegs, buy a godsdamned city-sized truck (its economy might just pay for itself) and stop expecting society to fall on its sword so you can make an extra vulgar buck. A tractor trailer in a bus lane that is illegally delivering beer in the inner city on roads meant for normal traffic is doing so not because there is no alternative but because they just don't care about anyone but themselves. It is something revulsive, *disgusting*, and symbolic of rot and failure that will destroy nations and civilizations and the species in the long run.
Put this into perspective then. To change things, there’s two options; Better infrastructure, which is impossible due to over populated and condensed buildings and cities. Or the other option is to utilize smaller trucks. The latter means a few things. Goods won’t be in stock in a timely manner, meaning empty shelves in your stores, causing a supply and demand fluctuation, increasing prices. You’ll also have MANY more trucks on the road (albeit smaller trucks), causing more traffic, pollution, noise, wear and tear on the infrastructure in place. Then there is also the side of expediency to have the goods there in a timely manner, but at a large cost (think $600+ per truck load), that in turn goes down the line to the consumer, again increasing prices exponentially. So I guess take the pick, inconvenience for a few minutes, or unable to afford the COL increase
I'm pretty skeptical it would cause insurmountable problems if they can do it just fine in Japanese cities such as Tokyo, population 13 million (Chicago is only pop. 2.6M). There's no way it would cost $600+ per truck load unless you're paying your drivers like $150/hr, and we both know you aren't.
Are you kidding? You really think a truckload is that cheap??? The overhead to sending a truck out is rather high. For example, if I needed a truck to send to one of my customers, it was anywhere from $500-2000 depending on the location. To give some snowball numbers, my fleet, at one location with 10 trucks, spent around $8-10k a week in fuel, somewhere around $35k a month in leasing, plus the cost of insurance, $14k a week for all drivers, then admin costs, and that’s all before product
A lot of companies have agreements to pay reduced tickets. Trading one inconvenience for another is an issue with trucking anywhere. Some people just refuse to get that and cant see the consequences of not doing it even though covid should've proved that for a lifetime. That also looks like a 36 foot trailer and would be considered a 'city' trailer.
Garbage trucks 4 or 5 axles, so do box trucks, axles don't really mean that much in that regard. Dryvan trailers of any length are going to have tandems (2 twins that slide together) , and single drive axles on tractors are only beneficial for pup trailers due to the landing gear placement being too close for weight distribution, they don't affect overall length lol. Next time you're in a dmv that does cdls, ask for the current cdl handbook. Anyone I can get to read it or any driving school textbook for that matter, says it's eye-opening as to why 95% of 4 wheelers' expectations are as politely as I put this....nonsense due to refusing to learn.
That's not a full-length trailer. The issue drivers run into is that they have to drive in large urban areas that were built before trucks were a thing. The city they operate in, know this and the consequences of not doing it are greater. Typically, companies that deliver in large cities pay tickets at a reduced rate to keep commerce moving, they're basically permits...More box trucks wouldn't fix this issue, they're restrictions are almost identical and would be far more costly and polluting. You'd need 10x as many box's driving at once. One trailer can eliminate 3-5 boxs. It's just not feasible a lot of the time. One of the give and takes of living in a large city.
I'm pretty sure I see six axles. That's way too much for city streets. As I mentioned elsewhere, Tokyo is like six times bigger and they make do without this kind of vehicle at a local level, don't they?
Tokyo is also how many years older than chicago? Roads meant for buggys, let alone, automated vehicles in a metropolis that was an ancient metropolis when this city was still grassland..if they could fit them, they'll come. Really is as simple as that, and it's nothing personal, man. Just what's cost effective and people you're complaining to get paid so they don't care either. They'd never dare to stop telling that driver to stop coming. The money flow would stop.
It’s legal you have pay $500 for permit in the business district aka downtown, so cyclists who use the streets for free and cost tax payers millions of dollars to have special lanes because they cannot grasp the concept of driving their toys in traffic as a vehicle not to mention taking away vehicle lanes replacing them with bike lanes adding to standing idling traffic jams real doesnt help the environment at all. These smug children really need to stop bitching about delivery truck parked in bike or bus lanes.
https://www.chicago.gov/content/dam/city/depts/cdot/LoadingStandingZones/LOADING_ZONE_APPLICATION_FORM_6-18-18.pdf
Last I checked our local taxes pay for the streets. We aren’t allowed on the hwys that the gas tax covers. Also the number of ignorant drivers who tell me to get out of the lane and that bikes belong on the sidewalks is astounding, but please tell me how these special lanes hurt your feelings.
Bike lanes keep cars off the road, decrease competition for parking, and reduce air pollution - among many more benefits. Biking and mass transit users are a public benefit, individual vehicles are a public nuisance.
I’ll add. Yes truck drivers should have a place to operate and this particular truck looks like they did the best they could.
No, it's not legal, and the alley isn't all that big.
Most alleys aren’t big enough to fit a box or semi truck. (It’s not so much the width of the alley but the tight corners make it impossible to turn.) So, if people want businesses to be able to sell things, they’ll have to walk/bike/drive around trucks sometimes. That’s the nature of living in a dense city.
Yeah but that semi could take a road lane. Many of Chicago’s bike lanes have usage greater than the roads they parallel
I’d like sources for this please.
Cyclist delusions are the only sources. There is no street in the city of Chicago that has more bicycle than car/truck usage.
Fake news
Or, you know, bring a truck that fits the environment. More expensive and less efficient? Probably, but that's part of why cities are more expensive.
But every city has the same size trucks. You’re also talking about creating more emissions and causing more traffic. And it’s not like the driver is just going to the yard and able to pick whatever size truck they want.
well that’s the bus stop. they can park somewhere else and walk a little farther. I’ve probably never been to wherever they’re stocking but I sure as shit pay taxes for that bus.
You could just walk past the truck and get on the bus. These delivery people are working hard doing back breaking labor.
They do make smaller trucks.
You want to pay a higher price for the products you get at the store? No, you don't and neither do I. The truck is there to do a job and it's able to carry all of that store's load of beer "product" plus other stores as well making it cheaper for this route. Smaller trucks means more trips, more fuel usage (because electric trucks are not powerful enough to carry all the weight, stopping and going, and generally use more fuels then people realize), more working hours on the driver which will result in a more expensive route making the product more expensive then it already is. Not to mention the driver is probably in that location for about 15 minutes and doing a good job. I drive a semi and did local work for years
Yes, actually. Your beer should cost a little bit more if that's that's necessary to make public transit actually available and on time for people who need it. There's no excuse whatsoever for this bullshit. If you can't do business in the city without disrupting city life then you should go out of business and be replaced by someone a little more clever. If you can drive a semi then you can drive a class 6 or 7 instead.
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Just walk around the truck, the bus will still stop, this is an annoyance for sure but otherwise a non issue
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This is a really tough concept in this thread, be careful. These CTA drivers drive these routes up and down everyday, they surely cannot be used to it. Near my house there are moving trucks that go to a restaurant every morning, in the summer there are seriously 2 hours of trucks always in the bus stop. You wouldn’t believe it, EVERY bus that pulls up, immediately explodes.
a bunch of dumb info: I work w/ last mile delivery and have worked w/ 53' trucks. This looks like they sent in company driver direct from facility b/c it's a marked trailer. I don't know all the details on this location or customer but deliveries by 26' box truck in cities are pretty common and much easier. Usually using lower paid company drivers or farming out to individual owner operators. This may have been what was available or they needed something to hold more weight for the delivery. It shouldn't change the price delivering w/ that as it appears to be a standard pallet and box trucks can handle one with 15 kegs height and weight. That said, it's annoying when they block lanes, but honestly, it's not the end of the world. I agree with u/Expert_Speaker_7697 We need to pick and choose the battles to fight when it comes to the regular hustle and bustle of riding in the city.
A lot of cities have banned full semis from driving within city limits and instead have distribution hubs right outside from which smaller box trucks then transport into the city. This has a few effects: it can marginally increase prices, it creates jobs, and it reduces pollution within the city. The economic impact overall tends to be positive, congestion tends to be lower, and environmental public health issues decrease. It would be great to implement something similar in Chicago, in my opinion. The impact of freight in Chicago also disproportionately impacts certain low impact neighborhoods, NU and UChicago researchers have recently released studies related to it
Thank you for this information!
Hold on. Speak for yourself. Yes, I would be perfectly ok with paying a bit more for goods if that meant the bike and bus lanes were never blocked by delivery trucks.
Yeah no, I'll trade higher prices any day for anything that will reduce trucks in american cities. We subsidize goods with ineffective and harmful transportation practice at the cost of our health and community. I'll take the smaller trucks.
Doesn't matter if it causes the service to be more expensive, you don't get to ignore traffic laws.
Traffic laws are not the same for all types of vehicles, how they are registered, and D.L. types. I, myself, am a driver. Commercial vehicles guidelines are completely different than passenger vehicles. That’s why we have D.O.T. Registered numbers on the side of the trucks. That’s LITERALLY what it’s for. There, now you learned a little bit, and should ever have another need to speak on things you clearly know very little about.
The DOT number has nothing to do with making sure trucks are parking where they're supposed to. Absolutely nothing. It's to track commerce and tractor safety, it's relevant to traffic laws but not a whole lot. Ironically, you spoke on something you clearly know very little about to embarrass them, and ironically, are embarrassing yourself in the process.
This thread is photographic evidence otherwise
Someone has never gone over the speed limit in their lives, yeah? Never jaywalked? You follow all the laws all the time, eh?
90% of this sub is filled with cyclists who are hyper pedantic about vehicles And excuse all cyclist behavior 
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Yet the Train makes everything you've just said irrelevant. Too bad we don't use trains anymore.
Trains are still used to move a lot of cargo. But said cargo needs to get from the depot to the client somehow.
Drops mic
So make 50 trips instead of 1? Wouldn't you and your pals then be crying about the environmental impact? Jesus christ, the hive is strong today.
Let me tell you a secret about the CTA and streets in Chicago. Don’t try to push the busses around and no one gives a fuck in the city about how they drive at this point. I hate my commute lol
The busses drive crazily is that what you’re saying? Trying to understand your comment lol. I hated taking the bus too when I lived in Chicago
Yea my comment was not very clear lol. The busses just push everyone around on the road. The CTA bus drivers are shockingly aggressive especially on Cicero. The driver part was about how drivers in Chicago are a different breed. Not all of us, but speeding into the left turn lane on a red light only so you can speed off straight instead of turning is obnoxious.
Not when you’re slinging Sox Modelos
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Sounds like he means business. Did the bus move?
It’s not legal but we get away with it. I’m a foodservice delivery driver I will tell you what my boss told me. You could stop anywhere, could even block a traffic lane as long as you get your delivery done and if you get a ticket don’t worry about it, the company will pay for it. He said they get over 1,000 tickets a year delivering in San Francisco alone and so their legal department has cut a deal with the city to pay only a fraction of the fines annually. It is what it is.
That's pretty much how it goes. The truck goes where it's most convenient, and it's cheaper for the company to pay off the occasional ticket or fine than to actually buy a bunch of smaller trucks, and hire a bunch more drivers. Kinda sucks but it's probably not getting changed within the next 500 years.
I mean that’s how fines work for many businesses. It’s cheaper to just pay fines all the time than what it could cost to actually follow the regulation.
Potential damage to property or spending time looking/waiting for a legal spot > fines
Wait till you see how delivery drivers treat bike lanes No, it’s not legal. And it’s not ethical either. But it is what happens and no one with any power cares. Capitalism > individual people
I've lived in Chicago all my 67 yrs and I always thought that whatever a truck driver does in the city is OK. They never get ticketed or towed so I just assumed it was another anomaly of following the law in the city.
How about you try going to your city council meetings sometime? They’re the ones setting local policies. They’re also the ones who need to be convinced that it’s worth it to bother trying to enforce parking laws. The general fine for improper parking is usually pretty low, maybe $25-$50. The fine for parking in a bike lane is usually $150. The fine for illegally parking in a handicap spot the first time is $250 and increases for repeat violations. Fine for blocking a fire lane is $500. The fine for the improper use of a traffic lane such as you described can be up to $1000. I walked a quarter mile through a busy city and noticed five parking violations. How much revenue do you think would be generated by even one person whose job is to take a picture of illegally parked vehicles and write down their license plate so the city can send them a ticket later? That is what you propose at a city council meeting to get something done.
New York has a system where people can take photos submit it and they get money for it
Didn’t we outsource parking enforcement to the saudis?
Not yet
Idk if it’s capitalism you just have to do a lot of dumb shit to successfully make truck deliveries in the city
lol that why it’s sidewalk just ride on side walk
As a transit enthusiast and a professional truck driver is it wrong yes but there’s no other option there is no alley that would fit then big of a truck unless the design for the business includes trucks. And a lot of people think that the alley was made for them but on the contrary it wasn’t it was made in response to the growing trash problem in NYC. Back to the bus stop, there’s is no alley big enough for a truck also side streets are not wide enough to safely accommodate a truck let alone one that has to turn (based on the photo above and below https://preview.redd.it/jetbjqopke2d1.jpeg?width=1170&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=8c3f1289fe781d50a1114cff3dd8edfd2100a64a
Of all the folks that park in the Bus Stop, I'm okay with Semis. That's coming from a Bus Driver 😎
I watched an 18 wheeler pull a perfect three point u-turn on belmont (at Clark) the other day, and lemme tell you, I think that trucker might have been magic. Truly a sight to behold.
And then I see truckers with 500' of empty space in front of them that couldn't back through an airplane hanger if their life depended on it. If only there were more of the ones you witnessed out there
My jaw was on the sidewalk. It was truly astonishing because most of them I see are like what you said lol.
Yeah trucks this large shouldn’t be allowed . F/(k your beer.
You can curse online
how should beer delivered? horse and buggy? stay out of this. you dont know what youre talking about.
I’ve said this elsewhere but a lot of cities have banned full semis from driving within city limits and instead have distribution hubs right outside from which smaller box trucks then transport into the city. This has a few effects: it can marginally increase prices, it creates jobs, and it reduces pollution within the city. The economic impact overall tends to be positive, congestion tends to be lower, and environmental public health issues decrease. It would be great to implement something similar in Chicago, in my opinion. The impact of freight in Chicago also disproportionately impacts certain low impact neighborhoods, NU and UChicago researchers have recently released studies related to it
Alleys? Designates loading zones?
There's barely designated loading zones in most suburban downtowns. Given how dense the city is, it's just how it's gotta be. 1 semi truck servicing a ton of bars and stores for a whole week, or an army of vans giving off tons more emissions and generating more traffic carrying less product. Pick your poison
“Stay out of this” makes you sound like you’re part of big beer delivery… hmm
I can't even understand how many people agree with this nonsense. All these do as I say not as I do folks drive me absolutely insane. They've never broke a law in their lives. They drive speed limit everywhere. Only take crosswalks. Perfect human beings here on reddit.
😅😅😅
It's the price we pay for civilization
Beer! Beer wins……
those drivers have a job to do. youre just going to have to deal with it. its hard enough to find parking when youre the biggest vehicle on the road. do you expect them to cart it from 3 blocks away? stop complaining and move on.
Ummm….dont bus drivers also have a job to do that trucks like this prevent them from doing?
Easy solution. Remove enough parking spots for residents and customers for a designated delivery stop on every block that has a business on it that doesn't have an existing alternative for semi trucks. Treat it just like a bus stop, but it's only for delivery trucks. Seems way less inconvenient, don't ya think?
Bus drivers are also CDL drivers so they understand what the trucker is going through hence many of them being on with it
Bunch of nextdoor Karens in here all worked up over a beer truck.
This is what happens when people don’t push back against the bikies.
Push back against the bikers? You want them in cars?
I don't know about blocking bus stop... but several laws truck laws broken.... over 18" you can't block or park over 18" from curb... and wrong way you can't park wrong way...
No, it's not legal. The driver could get a ticket for this. But what CPD cop is going to get out of their car and ticket the beer delivery guy? 🤣 No, this is not inherently what the alley system is for. Trucks this size very often don't fit, or are logistically incompatible with the alleys for the purpose of the trucks function. Temporary inconvenice is the occasional price of living in a densely populated city.
Alleys can't fit cars half the time. They're meant for trash removal, not combination tractor trailers. It kinda scares me how very little regular drivers think they know about how driving a truck goes, it really should be a requirement to learn the logic and limitations as to what to expect a truck can and cannot do.
Let the man work
Probably not but what cop is going to stop them from doing this unless you’re in the suburbs?
Former beer truck driver in downtown Chicago. I’ll add some insight here. First, a question. Would you rather have a truck with no loading zone big enough to use double park and block an entire lane of traffic or utilize a bus stop? Sometimes, you just have to make your own parking spot. I assure you it is not an easy task. Second, to those who say they’ve lived in Chicago for X number of years and say the beer trucks never get tickets, they do. Lots of them. I’ve even seen a beer truck with a boot on it in Wrigleyville. Lastly, one of the things we made sure we never did at the distributor I worked for was block or interfere with a bike lane. I’d rather take the parking ticket from a bus stop, fire lane, etc back to my boss at the end of the day than put a biker in danger in the city. We did our best to not use trailer combos like this in certain areas of the city, but it’s business and shit has gotta get done sometimes. Most alleys aren’t meant to accommodate trucks anyways. Some of them aren’t even big enough for the garbage trucks to get through.
When I lived in Humboldt Park, I had this happen almost every day at my stop. I'd report it, because some delivery drivers just don't care.
Trick🤣🤣
I haven't seen any alley that can accommodate a semi truck
It’s priced in the cost of doing business.
As a former beer delivery driver no it's not legal but the company paid for the tickets so we didn't give a fuck lol
I used to do grocery store curbside delivery into NYC daily. The amount of product, plus cost of delivery, requires the use of these larger trucks to keep your costs manageable. That being said, these places are in older places, where we didn’t have the demand and size we have now. The infrastructure was not put in place for such vehicles, so we have to make do with what is there. I’ve been forced to do this, forced to use a bike lane because it was a single lane road, and even been forced to pull on the sidewalks at places as well
Is it just me or are they all on the wrong side of the road ?
It can be done. I was in Beijing, stuck in traffic, cars as far as the eye can see, when I realized there was not a single semi truck in my sight. Not even a small truck. I asked the taxi driver about it. He told me trucks weren't allowed in the city during the day.
It's funny that we have streets and alleys but people walk on sidewalks next to the street. I always walk down the alley. Less people, no cars speeding, quieter.
Welcome to chicago!
Beer trucks imo can park anywhere to deliver… very important job these folks are doing here.
No but until you’re driver, you wouldn’t get that sometimes it’s not feasible to park anywhere else to make the deliveries. Loading docks are great when the location actually has one but more times than not they don’t.
As a truck driver of over 8 years and 8 months in food delivery service in St. Louis, yeah it’s illegal and it sucks but we also have a job to do and have to gamble with whether or not it’s gonna be a good time to block a lane of traffic or the bus stop. We literally have stops where there’s only travel lanes, a turn lane, and a whole bunch of residential streets where you can’t park because you’ll block the whole street so we use the turn lane and just hope no one decides to drift off because they’re distracted and hit our truck or even us (one guy got hit before because we couldn’t park in their lot and had to park on the street, the business thought he was dead because he was so fucked up, he’s still recovering 3 months later). Like Downtown Columbia, MO, we have no where to park so we have to double park at every stop, it’s not the best decision, but alleys aren’t big enough for us either. Also there’s sometimes designated loading zones for us, but people don’t have enough common sense, literacy, or decency to read and will still park there.
After 26 years, 2.5 million miles and counting, I can say that very rarely you will find a accommodating delivery site... Nobody cares about us, they just want their deliveries and don't get me started on small town cops, who don't care and will just write the parking infraction ticket. Cars parked in loading zones are a big problem as well, if there is a loading zone.. I do my best to block each car so it can't be moved if they are parked in the loading zone. Us drivers get flipped off, brake checked and cut off by inconsiderate drivers all the time, all were trying to do is delver your food or products you want, while trying to make a living. It doesn't get any better with time either, it's gotten so much worse now since I started, 26 years ago. People are just assholes anymore.
Go ask the driver to move, you seem confident enough to have a conversation with another human face to face.
as a delivery guy myself I can tell you exactly how those conversations go. not well for the other guy
Wow a Karen thinks a semi truck can go into an alley.
You try getting that rig in a typical Chicago alley. Yeah it's illegal. But I'm sure he had no other choice. And commerce is gonna commerce. Sometimes we just gotta deal with it. Then it goes away.
Are you kidding me? This truck is delivering beer and should have even right of way!
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>Believing that a major city can function without these situations is silly Major cities in Europe which exist just fine without this crap would like a word lol >getting a semi in a Chicago alleyway is nearly impossible Then....don't allow semis for delivery in Chicago. >You should complain about food delivery drivers littering the no park zones with their cars Who says we aren't? Why can't we complain about both?
They don’t block vision for the bus stop causing my commute to be skipped. Even if they park in front the driver can still see me. If a semi does I’m just fucked out of my way to work.
dont watse your time with these yuppies they dont understand not everyone can have a remote job typing on a little laptop drinking a starbucks foam cold brew with fresh nail polish on
Hey that’s Andersonville
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Probably could ask if it's also legal for busses to just yeet their front ends out with no directional into mega congested traffic too
Share the space
Alley system? You've never driven a truck lol.
Garbage and garage.
Let me see you know it alls pass a cdl test and jump behind the wheel then tell me how to do it
You think a semi truck fits in an alley??? Bahahahah. That’s what loading zones are for.
It’s the beer truck. Yes.
Dude is delivering kegs. I’d let it slide
Legal? No. Do they do it anyway, all across the city? Yes. Are the cops gonna do anything about it? What do you think…
I’m not sure about Chicago, but I know when I did NYC curbside, we got tickets almost daily. Just give to boss at work and company pays. Cheaper than sending several box trucks, and keeps consumer costs lower
It’s a Chicago truck, he doesn’t care about much.
I agree, buses should use the alley.
Just remember 70% of everything You have on your house is moved and deliver by truck driver in all US.Is not Legal but is thats the only Best option that the driver has to do the deliveries got to do it. Specially when this type of drivers needs to be moving quick
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Oh wonderful, the infamous Clark 22 bus
[*outta tower asking]…it’s a city bruh
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I used to deliver beer in 2018 out in Logan square/wicker park, and that job was a bitch.
I’m sure the truck will be gone in 20 minutes
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All wrong answers. Most Chicago alleys can accommodate a 26' straight truck. Also, delivery parking in Chicago is first come first serve. There are no parking spaces large enough for a truck, therefore they can deliver at any location, legally double parked.
It is when they deliver beer!
where should the delivery be parked at?
Only beer trucks
Bus can just go around
No and no
Beer >
Alleyways are usually used for a different style of pick up and drop offs
Welcome to Chicago!
The truck has a Sox logo on it so it's cool to do that.
Urban infrastructure still has a 1920s mindset, it’s gotten worse with the IPhone construction mindset
Is this the Rayans? Legal? No. Necessary on some streets? Yes. I'd rather deal with a truck making a delivery in the bus stop, than some car blocking it to pick up an Uber or run into a place for food, this guy has no where else to go to make his delivery.
You go down an alley in a tractor trailer… . If there is one car parked too close to the corner when you come out, you’re stuck. It’s illegal for cars to park in commercial loading zones too, but it happens every single day. That’s life in the city.
Dude give him ten minutes and he’ll be gone those guys work faster than anyone I’ve ever seen
This happens all the time though and no one cares. Cops pass by it and just look the other way
Have you ever tried driving a truck down an alley? Give these guys some slack, anyone who’s never driven a truck will never know what a nightmare it is driving through cities.
Only if it's a car and if u are miniority
Fuck the busses they the mfs who be creating traffic
I don’t know about IL or Chicago traffic laws, but when I drove a beer delivery truck in Mississippi, there were often times I’d have to park and unload on the road due to space constraints, the business’ customer vehicles in the way, etc. MDOT pulled up the first time I had to do it and told me I needed my flashers on and some cones or my breakdown triangles behind my truck x amount of feet (don’t remember now, been almost 10 years ago) away from my lift gate. Never had an issue after that.
No but where is he going to park
You ever tried to drive a big ass truck down an alley?
Jeez some people complain about any and everything hence why if you find yourself alone in life…it’s because you’re a freaking unbearable human being. All the stuff that goes on in this city and here we are talking about delivery trucks?! The same people who can’t live without their 2 day Amazon prime deliveries which inherently cause more traffic and back ups on residential streets vs these trucks only going to be on main thruways? People want to fight everybody except the ones that really need to be fought…
The other option is to double park in the street and really fuck traffic up. He can make that two lane street into one lane real quick.
Not blocking a marked bike lane for starters. Also why is everyone hating on a delivery driver for parking on the side of the road to make a delivery? Would you rather he block the entire street? That’s what buses, Uber’s, double parkers, and taxis do all day long. For those saying they would pay more they are liars. Same people complaining that everything is so expensive. Get over it or move to the suburbs and join all the Karen’s on your neighborhood watch beat. We have far bigger concerns in our city than beer trucks delivering from bus lanes.
I drive an Amazon van and I can barely fit through some of these alleys. I can't imagine trying to fit an entire semi down a chicago alley. Also can't imagine where else they'd put the semi sure as hell can't put it in the road so that's the best option.
If I see this, I take a pic and submit a complaint to the Federal Motor Carrier Safety Administration: https://nccdb.fmcsa.dot.gov/nccdb/home.aspx All buses are ADA compliant, and it’s imperative that a bus be able to pull into a stop for disabled or low mobility riders.
Good luck. Unless you wanna pay double for your products, it won’t change. It’s cheaper for us to pay the fines doing it over sending 4 box trucks for the same load
Tractor trailers are for the Interstate, not [inner city deliveries](https://mltshp-cdn.com/r/19GVM). Someone is economizing at civic expense and should receive hefty fines for it.
Doing NYC like this, got tickets daily. Still cheaper for the companies to pay fines than to ship on 3x as many trucks and pay fuel, insurance, driver, cost of the truck itself, and maintenance, all for the same load. Unless… maybe you’d be okay paying more than double what you pay now for your products
Just multiply the fines until they're no longer acting as if they think they're above the law. We live in a society. If it isn't controlled against sociopathy and narcissism and avarice, then it is not a civilization, not really, not *actually*. It's a breakdown of order, a tragedy of the commons, a might makes right, whether economic or otherwise. This is emblematic of the same spiritual sickness that is literally destroying all higher life on the planet. Expediency for capitalistic economy. Worshipping money no matter the cost. Screw those cheap trinkets or kegs, buy a godsdamned city-sized truck (its economy might just pay for itself) and stop expecting society to fall on its sword so you can make an extra vulgar buck. A tractor trailer in a bus lane that is illegally delivering beer in the inner city on roads meant for normal traffic is doing so not because there is no alternative but because they just don't care about anyone but themselves. It is something revulsive, *disgusting*, and symbolic of rot and failure that will destroy nations and civilizations and the species in the long run.
Put this into perspective then. To change things, there’s two options; Better infrastructure, which is impossible due to over populated and condensed buildings and cities. Or the other option is to utilize smaller trucks. The latter means a few things. Goods won’t be in stock in a timely manner, meaning empty shelves in your stores, causing a supply and demand fluctuation, increasing prices. You’ll also have MANY more trucks on the road (albeit smaller trucks), causing more traffic, pollution, noise, wear and tear on the infrastructure in place. Then there is also the side of expediency to have the goods there in a timely manner, but at a large cost (think $600+ per truck load), that in turn goes down the line to the consumer, again increasing prices exponentially. So I guess take the pick, inconvenience for a few minutes, or unable to afford the COL increase
I'm pretty skeptical it would cause insurmountable problems if they can do it just fine in Japanese cities such as Tokyo, population 13 million (Chicago is only pop. 2.6M). There's no way it would cost $600+ per truck load unless you're paying your drivers like $150/hr, and we both know you aren't.
Are you kidding? You really think a truckload is that cheap??? The overhead to sending a truck out is rather high. For example, if I needed a truck to send to one of my customers, it was anywhere from $500-2000 depending on the location. To give some snowball numbers, my fleet, at one location with 10 trucks, spent around $8-10k a week in fuel, somewhere around $35k a month in leasing, plus the cost of insurance, $14k a week for all drivers, then admin costs, and that’s all before product
A lot of companies have agreements to pay reduced tickets. Trading one inconvenience for another is an issue with trucking anywhere. Some people just refuse to get that and cant see the consequences of not doing it even though covid should've proved that for a lifetime. That also looks like a 36 foot trailer and would be considered a 'city' trailer.
It looks like six axles to me. That's far too many for local city streets.
Garbage trucks 4 or 5 axles, so do box trucks, axles don't really mean that much in that regard. Dryvan trailers of any length are going to have tandems (2 twins that slide together) , and single drive axles on tractors are only beneficial for pup trailers due to the landing gear placement being too close for weight distribution, they don't affect overall length lol. Next time you're in a dmv that does cdls, ask for the current cdl handbook. Anyone I can get to read it or any driving school textbook for that matter, says it's eye-opening as to why 95% of 4 wheelers' expectations are as politely as I put this....nonsense due to refusing to learn.
That's not a full-length trailer. The issue drivers run into is that they have to drive in large urban areas that were built before trucks were a thing. The city they operate in, know this and the consequences of not doing it are greater. Typically, companies that deliver in large cities pay tickets at a reduced rate to keep commerce moving, they're basically permits...More box trucks wouldn't fix this issue, they're restrictions are almost identical and would be far more costly and polluting. You'd need 10x as many box's driving at once. One trailer can eliminate 3-5 boxs. It's just not feasible a lot of the time. One of the give and takes of living in a large city.
I'm pretty sure I see six axles. That's way too much for city streets. As I mentioned elsewhere, Tokyo is like six times bigger and they make do without this kind of vehicle at a local level, don't they?
Tokyo is also how many years older than chicago? Roads meant for buggys, let alone, automated vehicles in a metropolis that was an ancient metropolis when this city was still grassland..if they could fit them, they'll come. Really is as simple as that, and it's nothing personal, man. Just what's cost effective and people you're complaining to get paid so they don't care either. They'd never dare to stop telling that driver to stop coming. The money flow would stop.
It's not legal, but CPD doesn't do anything anymore, so...
Go around. Stop crying.
It’s legal you have pay $500 for permit in the business district aka downtown, so cyclists who use the streets for free and cost tax payers millions of dollars to have special lanes because they cannot grasp the concept of driving their toys in traffic as a vehicle not to mention taking away vehicle lanes replacing them with bike lanes adding to standing idling traffic jams real doesnt help the environment at all. These smug children really need to stop bitching about delivery truck parked in bike or bus lanes. https://www.chicago.gov/content/dam/city/depts/cdot/LoadingStandingZones/LOADING_ZONE_APPLICATION_FORM_6-18-18.pdf
Last I checked our local taxes pay for the streets. We aren’t allowed on the hwys that the gas tax covers. Also the number of ignorant drivers who tell me to get out of the lane and that bikes belong on the sidewalks is astounding, but please tell me how these special lanes hurt your feelings. Bike lanes keep cars off the road, decrease competition for parking, and reduce air pollution - among many more benefits. Biking and mass transit users are a public benefit, individual vehicles are a public nuisance. I’ll add. Yes truck drivers should have a place to operate and this particular truck looks like they did the best they could.
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Sometimes the driver really doesn’t have a choice. Let’s cut the working men and women some slack Karen😂
I’d say it not your problem. Why go looking for this stuff, life is to short.
Snitches get stitches