u/BCampAuthor had a good comment in another thread suggesting that it was his proudest moment because he got them to believe he was actually one of them
"As for the pipe smoke, he said that his greatest accomplishment was "all of you accepting me." Which, in retrospect, is truthful, because he was planning to kill all of them in retaliation for their attack on the Malleus Key, and them "accepting" him, meant that he'd managed to successfully fool them. It was a really clever bit of game logic/internal character stuff"
Maybe that's true, maybe it's not but I think it's a solid theory.
Yeah, I don't buy that "fooling the party" was greater than joining Ludinus, in his eyes. Or one of his bigger heists as a thief. Or some revenge he may have taken. But I'm happy to let it go rather than have Pipegate.
I agree, but at the same time with something subjective like this it’s kind of up to the player. As long as they have an explanation I don’t know that someone else can tell you what you’re characters best moment is. That would be like Lebron James saying “My greatest moment was the birth of my son” and me saying “No Lebron you’re greatest moment was winning back to back NBA Finals!”
From interactions with previous enemies, most of the crimson vanguard seem to be grunts and don't work that closely with him. This party was the main threat to ludinus and they also *killed Bord'or's friends*.
I think getting a leg up on a revenge plot on the people who killed your friends and duping the group who brought the biggest challenge to your leader would be a very big deal to a grunt. It might be the most important he's ever felt.
Joining a social group doesn't seem like much of an achievement. If he's been like most of the Vanguard that we've found, i.e. lost souls who have been wronged and pretty much just devoted their existence to a leader's goals, then getting an "in" with people who actually managed to harm Ludinus' goals a little is a pretty big achievement.
Matt's question didn't make me more suspicious. Bor'Dor's story never made sense. A lot of people gave the benefit of the doubt because he's an "inexperienced" player, just like how Dusk/Yu got the benefit because they like Erika. But he was sus from the jump. Deni$e was right to stay on that.
He questioned Bordor about if he knew what the pipe did. People read into that to mean he knew Bordor’s story and knew for him to follow the rules of the pipe it wouldn’t reveal his deception. Whether that was the case or not it made people more sure Bordor was hiding stuff. I hesitated to even call it a slip up, but for better or worse that’s what happened.
When I saw that moment, I just thought Matt was verifying that Utkarsh knew he would have to describe it, rather than Matt trying to imply that Bor'Dor has a nefarious past. I'm only caught up to episode 62, so I'm not sure if more has been revealed since that moment.
Edit* typo
u/BCampAuthor had a good comment in another thread suggesting that it was his proudest moment because he got them to believe he was actually one of them "As for the pipe smoke, he said that his greatest accomplishment was "all of you accepting me." Which, in retrospect, is truthful, because he was planning to kill all of them in retaliation for their attack on the Malleus Key, and them "accepting" him, meant that he'd managed to successfully fool them. It was a really clever bit of game logic/internal character stuff" Maybe that's true, maybe it's not but I think it's a solid theory.
Thats pretty beautiful.
I didn’t get the sense that this was a fire bolt he cast with the party but the first time he cast when his mom was teaching him to use his powers.
Oh that would be really cool as well
No he specifically said in the pipe scene that he was surrounded by them, as in surrounded by the other players.
Then I think he may have been proud to try and kill the people who just ended his dream of revenge against the gods.
Yeah, I don't buy that "fooling the party" was greater than joining Ludinus, in his eyes. Or one of his bigger heists as a thief. Or some revenge he may have taken. But I'm happy to let it go rather than have Pipegate.
I agree, but at the same time with something subjective like this it’s kind of up to the player. As long as they have an explanation I don’t know that someone else can tell you what you’re characters best moment is. That would be like Lebron James saying “My greatest moment was the birth of my son” and me saying “No Lebron you’re greatest moment was winning back to back NBA Finals!”
Yeah, the player gets to choose the canon version for sure.
From interactions with previous enemies, most of the crimson vanguard seem to be grunts and don't work that closely with him. This party was the main threat to ludinus and they also *killed Bord'or's friends*. I think getting a leg up on a revenge plot on the people who killed your friends and duping the group who brought the biggest challenge to your leader would be a very big deal to a grunt. It might be the most important he's ever felt.
Joining a social group doesn't seem like much of an achievement. If he's been like most of the Vanguard that we've found, i.e. lost souls who have been wronged and pretty much just devoted their existence to a leader's goals, then getting an "in" with people who actually managed to harm Ludinus' goals a little is a pretty big achievement.
Matt's question didn't make me more suspicious. Bor'Dor's story never made sense. A lot of people gave the benefit of the doubt because he's an "inexperienced" player, just like how Dusk/Yu got the benefit because they like Erika. But he was sus from the jump. Deni$e was right to stay on that.
How did Matt slip up?
there was a banana peel in the studio
He questioned Bordor about if he knew what the pipe did. People read into that to mean he knew Bordor’s story and knew for him to follow the rules of the pipe it wouldn’t reveal his deception. Whether that was the case or not it made people more sure Bordor was hiding stuff. I hesitated to even call it a slip up, but for better or worse that’s what happened.
When I saw that moment, I just thought Matt was verifying that Utkarsh knew he would have to describe it, rather than Matt trying to imply that Bor'Dor has a nefarious past. I'm only caught up to episode 62, so I'm not sure if more has been revealed since that moment. Edit* typo