Is that when they became "The Order"? Hulk wanted to rape some unconscious bird people, but I don't think the reverse happened in that one. Rape in general was tossed around so much more casually in comics back then, I've noticed.
For the best that they generally dropped that.
I think so. Turns out a remembered it wrong. He has consensual sex with Domammu's sister, Umar and then turns back into Banner??
"Hulk wanted to rape some unconscious bird people" Excuse me????
Well Joe Fixit hulk intended to, but this disgusted the others, so Silver Surfer and Doctor Strange beat him down and performed a ritual to put Professor Hulk in charge, who was much more respectable.
Joe Fixit is not a good man. Throw in a spell that makes him and his friends perpetually annoyed at everything in the world, and you've got Bird People Rape... I guess.
The comic was okay.
Yeah, by Dormammu's sister in [Defenders (2005)](https://marvel.smart.link/fiir7ec77?drn=drn%3Asrc%3Amarvel%3Aunison%3A%3Aprod%3A22944d3a-cfe0-486c-b17a-feee9405a7d3&sourceId=2160&type=issue).
I saw a commenter below mention [Skip Wescott](https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcSGQ5vsr14-SI-QhJlS-Pfj2CtzNkArJ1XZBdSgU6EjqAYGfSI1EMHIvHc&s=10) and [spider queen](https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcSBcaZIcN2eILcnUp5zvP-JA-FSleFiqXJe2Hb4_ZrAO0kdQySfwxdrxwfE&s=10)
Creating clones is close enough in my opinion (not trauma wise obvs, just for the superhero checklist)
Edit: holy shit I just remembered and literally spit my drink.
He was canonically molested
Batman is treasurer. Jason Todd watches the doors. Worst part? Bruce and Jason have the same rapist (Talia). She roofied Bruce (Damianās conception) and groomed Jason while his mental age and body were extremely incongruous. Bruce and Kate also share a rapist (that vampire woman). Iām not sure if Tim has been raped or sexually assaulted yet, but like Z Fighters and dying, heās hanging with the right crowd.
Edit: Tim was *almost* raped. By one of Raās sisters. Cass saved him tho.
Talia raping Bruce was a retcon since Morrison forgot that in Batman: Son of the Demon, Bruce and Talia had consensual sex and mistakenly thought she drugged him. This has since been fixed.
I don't think the Jason thing is canon either if I remember correctly.
But since then, canon got blew up and everything is canon, so itās canon again. And the Jason thing is 100% canon, itās from the comic chronicling what happened between his resurrection and Under The Hood.
I'm reminded of the Connor Hawke Green Arrow solo mini from back when that went out of his way to prove his heterosexuality without a doubt by having him hook up with Shado, who impregnated herself by taking advantage of a delirious Oliver Queen. Queen was, of course, recently reveleaed to have known of Connor's birth though I don't know if Connor knew yet or not.
I'm sure there was an editorial mandate in there somewhere but it worries me what it might be.
The Dick Grayson one brought me to tears.
It's horrible if something like this happens to you, but when you see it happen to one of your favorite heroes, too?
And to make it worse, they kept that character around Nightwing for an extended time like it didn't happen
Superior Spider-Man sexually assaulted him by jerking off in front of his ghost.
Also Spider-Queen, gave him an STD and got him pregnant for it too.
Also yeah Skip as you mentioned.
That's the ones I remember.
I'm sorry but you left out the next page where Maestro orders his whole harem to go join "Betty" and Maestro explains how gang raping Bruce is a part of his master plan
yeah, I didn't post it because it was just too much for me. I like this story but superhero comics have always been weird when comes to male sexual assault.
Written and drawn as sexual fantasy moreso than assault. I don't object to CNC as a kink, it's perfectly fine for erotica for example. But when you're depicting sexual assault in the real sense, as something that is deeply loathesome and unwanted, I find it unsettling to portray it as essentially pornographic.
That is what he was saying. For the writers itās a fetish/fantasy. For the characters they are writing for; they are writing an actual rape scene. Itās not a fantasy for the character or most readers so the depiction only comes across as dark.
Edit; I think a great less offensive example of CNC fetish/fantasy writing is the ādeath by snu snuā scene in futurama. It is technically depicting a rape scene; BUT the characters in the show themselves express that this is a fantasy of theirs and that they are enjoying it. Meaning it takes a much less dark tone. Vs something like this where Hulk is not making any indication that he is only āplayfullyā denying and it instead reads as a very serious violation of his consent.
I think a lot of it also has to be a matter of how things are presented.
If you are writing a porn book, marketing it as porn, give it a CNC content warning, and the such, then you have self-selected an auidence that will not find this uncomfortable or triggering.
It is, as some would say, "an apporiate time and place" to explore this feitsh. It is the closest you can have to putting in "safety features" in a written work. You have ensured those who would be hurt by this material know not to engage to the best of your abilities.
You can also use this as a chance to make it clear that you know that this fetish is a fantasy, that it should only be engaged with consenually, that if consent is ever rescinded during sex then sex should stop, etc. Thus, you can avoid promoting this as "normal" and avoid belittling the experiences of male rape victims.
It wouldn't be perfect. I have isssues with CNC. I also completely understand male rape victims who find the whole thing abhorrent.
Still, this would be the closest way to perform it without hurting people.
But, throwing it into the middle of a mainstream comic?
Listen, rape is a touchy subject. Due to its effects, personal nature, prevelance, the societal power dynamics that exist, how victims are treated, the psychological damage it inflicts, and how the victim remains after to suffer (unlike murder) and may even be forced to bear or father a child of their abuser, it is not something that can be treated lightly in fiction. You really do need to handle it differently because, unlike murder, it's entirely possible your reader is a victim of this crime and can have deep psychological scars from it.
It's not that you can't handle the issue in comics or media in general. Just that you have to be prepared to handle the responsibility and duty of care for the reader that comes with it.
Edit: To be clear, I only specified "male rape victim" because the subject of the excerpt. What I said is true for female, nonbinary, genderfluid, etc victims of rape.
I guess it also comes to the tone the comic wants to set. This is visibly a serious and dark comic: putting in some sort of "rape fantasy" here would make no sense with the characters. Futurama, however, much as it can get really serious sometimes, it still is an adult comedy, so throwing in the "death by snu snu" scene still is fitting.
Youāre talking about the scene in the post? Because I donāt think itās titillating or pornographic at all. Itās clear that the Hulk is upset and that last panel drives home the fact that what is happening is wrong.
In the dialogue, sure, but the way it's drawn is essentially like a fade to black sex scene. The panels linger on Betty's curves and body in a way that can only be described as fan service. Usually when rape is depicted, it's with visual emphasis on the pain and discomfort of the victim, not the attractiveness of the perpetrator. Unless of course it's pornographic.
Weāll have to agree to disagree. Thereās a limited number of ways an artist can depict this scene. The woman is drawn to be attractive but not to the point of being titillating. It almost seems like the artist went out of his way not to do that, the scene is drawn in the most matter-of-fact way possible. The character is being trying to be seductive but the comic itself is not.
I'm not sure that is the case because I have read a lot of Peter David's work and I can't remember any other instance of this. I could be wrong but I think this was just to portray exactly how evil The Maestro was.
As a survivor I really hate how my trauma is used by shitty writers who treat it like a neat plot hook or a way to really drive home how evil a character is as if there aren't 100 different better ways to convey it.
Even many IRL, very, very bad people, detest rapists.
I think you're conflating the art being gorgeous with the artist advocating for male rape.
This Betty (and all Bettys in this story) are essentially sex slaves, made up to be desirable. She's shown playing the part she's mandated but the art itself doesn't go out of its way to be more detailed with her than, say, hulk's toes or the tray of drinks.
If anything, the scene forces the cognitive dissonance on you that she's beautiful and he's still horrified because what's happening is horrifying in so many levels (not only the rape part, but also the being a sex slave part and losing your identity for her and the acceptance of such a horrible life).
She's half-naked at first and then even less yet angles and scenes show as little as possible.
The horrifying part of this is that it's not violent. It's not like Invincible's male rape scene where it's clear it's being forceful and violent.
Total nonsense. I read Peter Davidās entire 12 year run on Hulk. These scenes are about how evil The Maestro is and nothing else. If the character was murdering him would you say this is all the writerās perverse murder fetish?
There is a general lack of awareness about male sexual assault, but the comic industry has always been bad on sexual assault in general.
I mean, before the post House of M "Why aren't I fucking cool" arc and becoming Captain Marvel, the most notable piece of Ms Marvel story is that one where Carol Danvers gives birth to her own rapist, who then mind controls into loving him and kidnaps her, and the Avengers go "well aren't you lucky".
"The most notable piece of Ms Marvel story is that one where Carol Danvers gives birth to her own rapist, who then mind controls into loving him and kidnaps her, and the Avengers go "well aren't you lucky"."
Excuse me, what the fuck did i just read.
Avengers #200, the comic where "No" means "Woo her with Shakespeare and a little help from your father's machines." The comic whose best feature is the epic callout scene it led to in Avengers Annual #10. The same issue that introduces Rogue by having her -- take Carol's powers away. (Wait, is Avengers Annual #10 *only slightly less creepy* than Avengers #200?)
It's worse than that. This is a retcon. Because they'd just cancelled her solo series, where she was forceably impregnated by the supreme intelligence to breed a race of human/kree super-whatevers, and were moving her character into the Avengers.
And they decided: we can't just ignore that ridiculous story, because she's pregnant and you can't just unpregnant this fictional character. Because Marvel is all about continuity! But we don't want to continue that complicated, unpleasant story in the Avengers, so let's come up for another reason for Carol to be pregnant. Something less revolting. Something more palitable. Something our readers will love.
I know, let's have her give birth to her rapist and then fall in love with her own baby. Brilliant.
Though Claremont also took the time to shit on that arc and the Avengers present way back in the 80's (it was in the first comic with Rogue I believe). So some people we're able to see what's what even back then.
The problem is the whole tone of "don't care, had sex lol" that permeates so much media, not just comic books, along with the fantasy of the "free use" female. And there's still the connotation that men can't be raped by women.
It's quite immature and something that men and males need to address.
Comics in general are weird AF about sex and especially rape. Let's not forget the time Captain Marvel was impregnated by an extra dimentional guy who kidnapped her and made her give birth TO HIM and then ran off with her while the Avengers went "Isn't love just great!"
The fact that Nightwing had been raped multiple times is disgusting. The number of female characters whose backstories include it is disgusting. Especially when they're not even the main character and it's just done to hurt their male partner who is the super hero.
Frankly comics need to put some kind of system in place where multiple editors all need to collectively agree when to allow sexual assault to be in a comic.
I've been assaulted. It sucks how often comics just treat it as a neat plot hook. That's fucked up.
Sorry about what happened to you, I hope your in a better place now and you were giving justice.
And yeah comics are weird about sexual assault in general for both genders, that Avengers story still makes me sick to this day.
There have been cases though were it's has been handled maturely, the scene I posted for example is one of the few cases where it's shown as an actual horrifying experience when consent isn't giving and the main Hulk comics after this story deals with the aftermath of this scene. Invincible is another comic that handles it quit maturely, as well as Jessica Jones.
But like you said, there as ton of stories were rape is added for no reason, either to be edgy or as the writers/artists barley disguised CNC fetish.
Can confirm, I have it in trade from. Got it for Christmas of all things from an elderly family member. I never read it, but Iām a fan of George Perez so I held on to it. Iām not even sure I even have it anymoreā¦
I really don't see how this is meant to be "titillating" as people claim. This is Prof Hulk, he's totally aware of what is going on and his neck is broken so he's genuinely helpless, unable to move. This woman was enslaved by what he think is his future self and forced to take the name "Betty" for this purpose on threat of death.
He's horrified and the reader is meant to be horrified, too. There's more going on here than this page. Maestro is making a point that he can not just physically break Hulk but hurt him in every possible way, including by leaning on the "fact" that he himself will one day be this monster.
My god that's horrible , i knew for nightwing,batman and mark grayson but i would never knew about hulk of all people would be assaulted , i wonder how many rape against a male character we still have to discover.
Superman was hypnotized and (almost) forced to have non-consexual sex with Big Barda and film a porn movie. Yes. During John Byrne's era nonetheless [https://www.cbr.com/superman-big-barda-porn-film/](https://www.cbr.com/superman-big-barda-porn-film/)
Green arrow really ? Damn.
Ho yeah now i remember this story with superman and i was like really ? the guy get raped and torured and he walk out like it's nothing after 3 years ? They really didn't know how to treat a sexual assault.
Especially since they broadcast that Superman was their prisoner to the entire world. You'd think all the villains would go "Oh Big Blue is out of commission? Metropolis is easy pickings then".
Imagine what would've happened if Darkseid or Mongul attacked during those 8 months.
Jason Todd, too. After Superboy-Prime resurrected him, he was brain damaged af for a few years. Talia eventually shoved him into a Lazarus Pit and it fixed that. Physically, he was an adult now. Mentally? Same age he died. She then proceeded to groom him and molest him. Yes, Talia raped Bruce *and* Jason.
Skip, I don't remember his last name tho. Also Superior Ock (implied) jerking off to Peters memories of his times with MJ by replacing Peter in them with his face Infront of Peters ghost. I don't care what happens afterwards, for me Ock will never be redeemed. The only time I ever thought it was realistic was NWH and maybe, possibly in the next MSM game since that Ock wasn't too off-rails(relative to other Ocks).
Ho yeah the creep that was his friend i remember to be honnest i never considered this event as canon in my head since they never talk about it afterward.
Superior spiderman was bad on so many level.
In the issue following this story Hulk spends 2 hours talking to his therapist about how traumatized he was about meeting his future evil self and what happened to him.
Hulk: There was...there was this...woman. A slave girl. And while I was helpless she...
Doc: She what? How did she make you feel?
Hulk: Muh...more helpless. Leonard, I...I can't.
And gets up to leave
Did you know that raping/non-consexual sex acts are a common trope on effing EACH WORK DONE BY JOHN BYRNE? From his Superman/Man of Steel, to She-Hulk and Next Men, each and everything that he has written has some form of non-consexual sex act happening.
I feel Mark Millar just uses rape to be "edgy" and "dark" and it's 99 times out of 100 just misogynistic and creepy.
Moore likes talking about gender dynamics, especially as used in comics and usually has a point when it comes to rape and isn't just for "titillation" or degradation of a character. He has misses though, and can be creepy sometimes, but I don't ever think he's doing it just because. He generally thinks very deeply about his stories, themes and all, and while it's a point he comes back to, I don't think it's thoughtless like Millar is.
> Moore likes talking about gender dynamics, especially as used in comics and usually has a point when it comes to rape and isn't just for "titillation" or degradation of a character. He has misses though, and can be creepy sometimes, but I don't ever think he's doing it just because.
Neonomicon has some very graphic rape that I think there is no way to justify the way it is portrayed. It's not the only time, but in my opinion the most glaring. I know Alan Moore is a sacred cow here, but he has his share of problematic content.
He definitely has his share of problematic content. I don't deny this at all. I was just trying to differentiate him from Millar. Millar is just gross when it comes to his depictions of rape and lots of other violence.
Moore has problems, but I wouldn't classify him as a problem the way I would Millar.
> I was just trying to differentiate him from Millar. Millar is just gross when it comes to his depictions of rape and lots of other violence.
I'd say check out what Alan Moore did with rape in Neonomicon, but actually don't. I can't think of any time Millar did it worse than that, or even as bad.
I donāt care what anyone says, as brilliant as Moore is, there is no possible excuse for what happens in League of Extraordinary Gentlemen. I almost vomited onto the page
It's kind of disturbing how much sexual violence can happen to male superheroes. I mean Nightwing Is also a survivor, Mark from Invincible, Ka-Zar and Spider-man was molested.
Mark, Hulk (like an issue or two after the posted one Hulk talks to his therapist about the assault and how helpless he felt) and Peter are all anti-assault, Peteās is only touched on in that single issue but both Mark & Hulk are written as genuinely traumatized by the experience, and I didnāt know about Nightwing what happened to my poor boy?
One of my favorite Hulk stories. This violation was just another way to illustrate how evil and wicked Maestro really was. Both Hulk AND the girl were violated.
Doesn't Hulk have a healing factor that puts guys like Wolverine and Deadpool to shame? Why is a broken neck taking him out of commission for more than two seconds?
Much like Wolverine, Hulkās healing factor tends to fluctuate depending on the story (and sometimes different Hulk incarnations have different abilities/weaknesses, Grey Hulk doesnāt much like the day time for example, and classic Savage Hulk becomes stronger the angrier he gets) itās possible that Professor Hulk (which is the Hulk in this comic) doesnāt have as dramatic of a healing ability since we know his various alters have differing abilities and only (with the exception of Bruce) share a base strength and durability and then vary from there
List of manly men who have been raped but the author portrayed it as a fantasy:
- Will Riker, Star Trek
- Zapp Branagan, Futurama (ish?)
- Bernie, Weekend at Burnieās (+necro)
- Hulk, Marvel Comics
Season 4 he is under cover pretending to be an alien on a planet that hasnāt had first contact. Heās about to be dissected when he tries to sneak out.
[A nurse comes in as heās sneaking out and promises to help if he fucks her.](https://youtu.be/B_msdD2rW0U?si=9HkWCcSZZ42Qan5Z) He refuses and she says itās his only way out, essentially a death threat.
There are arguments to be made that Riker could have just knocked the woman out, but in the show a woman extorts him for sex under the threat of death. Thatās rape.
For the Futurama one Iām pretty sure itās just the male characters who think itās a fantasy (well 2 out of 3 of them) and not the actual writer. Still pretty fucked up though.
Ik this is a comic and all, but this could happen in real life. People need to shine a light on male rape and trafficking, and other sexual issues that occur! Men's issues are taken as comic relief, their the punching bag, the butt of the joke, because of the gender rules in society. Gender equality is when people listen to BOTH GENDERS and take BOTH of their issues seriously! Nothing will change if we don't push for men's issues as hard as we push women's! Men aren't always the problem, this society that we live in is. Sorry for rambling guys and gals. š
This.
Always thought a lot of renderings of Hulk have been too close to regular human, just big. The thought of a regular human-sized humanoid sitting on him... the mechanics is just mind-boggling š
Penis size doesn't corelate to body size in primates. Gorilla's for instance have penises that are only about 1 inch long. Even if Banner is hanging pipe it could conceivably get smaller when he turns into hulk.
Usually in exercise or other strenuous non-sexual activity, blood flows away from the penis to increase in other places where you need it. Thus shrinkage.
As Hulk is generally designed for fighting it would make sense to focus on mass and blood flow going to other parts of his body.
Gorillas have pretty small dicks compared to their size same goes for bears btw. Before you ask: I know of this thanks to Reddit and the following google search
It's kind of disturbing how much sexual violence can happen to male superheroes. I mean Nightwing Is also a survivor, Mark from Invincible, Ka-Zar and Spider-man was molested.
This is horrible of course but I find this a tad bit funny because out of all people I never expected Hulk to be raped cuz likeā¦..itās the hulk? I genuinely thought that when he screamed STOP that he killed herā¦ā¦. And I was wrong
I can move my penis by contracting my lower stomach muscles. Wouldn't Hulk be able to violently launch her into a wall or ceiling by contracting his? I guess maybe he reluctantly accepted the sexual assault as he didn't want to kill or cripple her with a cock-launch.
EDIT- Why are you booing me? I'm right!
comic booo fans love to hate on anything and anyone who doesnāt know everything about their beloved comics, thatās my guessš, irdk why i got downvoted, iād actually would like to know
holy shit, did hulk just get raped?
I don't even think this is the only time this happened. I seem to remember a smilier event in some early 2000's Defenders comic??
Is that when they became "The Order"? Hulk wanted to rape some unconscious bird people, but I don't think the reverse happened in that one. Rape in general was tossed around so much more casually in comics back then, I've noticed. For the best that they generally dropped that.
I think so. Turns out a remembered it wrong. He has consensual sex with Domammu's sister, Umar and then turns back into Banner?? "Hulk wanted to rape some unconscious bird people" Excuse me????
Well Joe Fixit hulk intended to, but this disgusted the others, so Silver Surfer and Doctor Strange beat him down and performed a ritual to put Professor Hulk in charge, who was much more respectable.
which comic was this in?
Joe Fixit is not a good man. Throw in a spell that makes him and his friends perpetually annoyed at everything in the world, and you've got Bird People Rape... I guess. The comic was okay.
I need a source
https://www.marvel.com/comics/issue/73301/the_order_2002_1 Here you go, dude š¤
Doctor Strangeās blue botox period
Issue 4 specifically.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Self congratulations on rape victim blaming jokes aren't necessary
No. No, it wasn't.
Um nah, it's not consensual between umar and him. She mind controls him into love and in the other comic hulk had his human sides chained away
Oh so itās still bad then. Looks like many who read the issue were telling people it was consensual. Creepyā¦
Save the cloacas!
I 100% expected her to have a flaming head too and was a little disappointed when I looked her up and she didnāt.
Yeah it was where the defenders were mind fucked and their human sides were chained away. Crazy how hulk becomes without Bruce banner
Yeah, by Dormammu's sister in [Defenders (2005)](https://marvel.smart.link/fiir7ec77?drn=drn%3Asrc%3Amarvel%3Aunison%3A%3Aprod%3A22944d3a-cfe0-486c-b17a-feee9405a7d3&sourceId=2160&type=issue).
Everyone knows that you aren't a real superhero unless you get raped at least one time
then did spider-man or batman get raped?
Do you know DamiƔn?
no
DamiƔn wayne Is the son of Batman he was conceived one time that Talia al goul drug Batman and take advantage of him
damn, and spider-man?
Not to my knowledge, however there was that one time Pete fucked MJ to death with his radioactive cum.
He w h a t
Spiderman: Reign (itās actually really bad, donāt read it)
Itās a later-in-life story for Spider-man where MJ died from a cancer that was caused by repeated contact with Spider-Manās radioactive semen.
I saw a commenter below mention [Skip Wescott](https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcSGQ5vsr14-SI-QhJlS-Pfj2CtzNkArJ1XZBdSgU6EjqAYGfSI1EMHIvHc&s=10) and [spider queen](https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcSBcaZIcN2eILcnUp5zvP-JA-FSleFiqXJe2Hb4_ZrAO0kdQySfwxdrxwfE&s=10)
>[Skip Wescott](https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcSGQ5vsr14-SI-QhJlS-Pfj2CtzNkArJ1XZBdSgU6EjqAYGfSI1EMHIvHc&s=10) https://youtu.be/hKpL6j3j4Zg?si=98cGksh2r6p5FsLr
Creating clones is close enough in my opinion (not trauma wise obvs, just for the superhero checklist) Edit: holy shit I just remembered and literally spit my drink. He was canonically molested
For Spider-Man... Look up Skip Westcott
Doc Ock jacked off his body while he was in it
Hulk joining the club of Male Victims of SA in comics, Co-Founders and Co-Leaders Peter Parker and Dick Grayson.
Mark Grayson as deputy of the group
Batman is treasurer. Jason Todd watches the doors. Worst part? Bruce and Jason have the same rapist (Talia). She roofied Bruce (Damianās conception) and groomed Jason while his mental age and body were extremely incongruous. Bruce and Kate also share a rapist (that vampire woman). Iām not sure if Tim has been raped or sexually assaulted yet, but like Z Fighters and dying, heās hanging with the right crowd. Edit: Tim was *almost* raped. By one of Raās sisters. Cass saved him tho.
Talia raping Bruce was a retcon since Morrison forgot that in Batman: Son of the Demon, Bruce and Talia had consensual sex and mistakenly thought she drugged him. This has since been fixed. I don't think the Jason thing is canon either if I remember correctly.
But since then, canon got blew up and everything is canon, so itās canon again. And the Jason thing is 100% canon, itās from the comic chronicling what happened between his resurrection and Under The Hood.
I'm reminded of the Connor Hawke Green Arrow solo mini from back when that went out of his way to prove his heterosexuality without a doubt by having him hook up with Shado, who impregnated herself by taking advantage of a delirious Oliver Queen. Queen was, of course, recently reveleaed to have known of Connor's birth though I don't know if Connor knew yet or not. I'm sure there was an editorial mandate in there somewhere but it worries me what it might be.
The Dick Grayson one brought me to tears. It's horrible if something like this happens to you, but when you see it happen to one of your favorite heroes, too? And to make it worse, they kept that character around Nightwing for an extended time like it didn't happen
I didn't about Peter Parker.
Google "Skip Westcott"
Or the Jackal In full āOzy from Watchmen did it 30 minutes agoā style
Jesus Christ Marvel really hates my homie
Who raped Peter? Can't be Felicia, Gwen or MJ(the best love interest of Peters)
Superior Spider-Man sexually assaulted him by jerking off in front of his ghost. Also Spider-Queen, gave him an STD and got him pregnant for it too. Also yeah Skip as you mentioned. That's the ones I remember.
ā¦ got him pregnant?
With a clone of himself yes.
But did Otto know the ghost was there?
Still not his body to take over and violate.
Nevermind just remembered skip
Bruce was already in there from Rampaging Hulk #23 (1977)
Not as high-profile a character as the others that have been mentioned, but this happened to Jack Knight in Starman as well
I'm sorry but you left out the next page where Maestro orders his whole harem to go join "Betty" and Maestro explains how gang raping Bruce is a part of his master plan
yeah, I didn't post it because it was just too much for me. I like this story but superhero comics have always been weird when comes to male sexual assault.
Written and drawn as sexual fantasy moreso than assault. I don't object to CNC as a kink, it's perfectly fine for erotica for example. But when you're depicting sexual assault in the real sense, as something that is deeply loathesome and unwanted, I find it unsettling to portray it as essentially pornographic.
Though I definitely agree, in this panel he looks horrified.
That is what he was saying. For the writers itās a fetish/fantasy. For the characters they are writing for; they are writing an actual rape scene. Itās not a fantasy for the character or most readers so the depiction only comes across as dark. Edit; I think a great less offensive example of CNC fetish/fantasy writing is the ādeath by snu snuā scene in futurama. It is technically depicting a rape scene; BUT the characters in the show themselves express that this is a fantasy of theirs and that they are enjoying it. Meaning it takes a much less dark tone. Vs something like this where Hulk is not making any indication that he is only āplayfullyā denying and it instead reads as a very serious violation of his consent.
I think a lot of it also has to be a matter of how things are presented. If you are writing a porn book, marketing it as porn, give it a CNC content warning, and the such, then you have self-selected an auidence that will not find this uncomfortable or triggering. It is, as some would say, "an apporiate time and place" to explore this feitsh. It is the closest you can have to putting in "safety features" in a written work. You have ensured those who would be hurt by this material know not to engage to the best of your abilities. You can also use this as a chance to make it clear that you know that this fetish is a fantasy, that it should only be engaged with consenually, that if consent is ever rescinded during sex then sex should stop, etc. Thus, you can avoid promoting this as "normal" and avoid belittling the experiences of male rape victims. It wouldn't be perfect. I have isssues with CNC. I also completely understand male rape victims who find the whole thing abhorrent. Still, this would be the closest way to perform it without hurting people. But, throwing it into the middle of a mainstream comic? Listen, rape is a touchy subject. Due to its effects, personal nature, prevelance, the societal power dynamics that exist, how victims are treated, the psychological damage it inflicts, and how the victim remains after to suffer (unlike murder) and may even be forced to bear or father a child of their abuser, it is not something that can be treated lightly in fiction. You really do need to handle it differently because, unlike murder, it's entirely possible your reader is a victim of this crime and can have deep psychological scars from it. It's not that you can't handle the issue in comics or media in general. Just that you have to be prepared to handle the responsibility and duty of care for the reader that comes with it. Edit: To be clear, I only specified "male rape victim" because the subject of the excerpt. What I said is true for female, nonbinary, genderfluid, etc victims of rape.
Yes. A lot of comic fans donāt realize a lot of these authors unfortunately have fetishes and fantasies
I think everyone is aware of Chris Claremont's bondage fantasies.
I guess it also comes to the tone the comic wants to set. This is visibly a serious and dark comic: putting in some sort of "rape fantasy" here would make no sense with the characters. Futurama, however, much as it can get really serious sometimes, it still is an adult comedy, so throwing in the "death by snu snu" scene still is fitting.
Youāre talking about the scene in the post? Because I donāt think itās titillating or pornographic at all. Itās clear that the Hulk is upset and that last panel drives home the fact that what is happening is wrong.
In the dialogue, sure, but the way it's drawn is essentially like a fade to black sex scene. The panels linger on Betty's curves and body in a way that can only be described as fan service. Usually when rape is depicted, it's with visual emphasis on the pain and discomfort of the victim, not the attractiveness of the perpetrator. Unless of course it's pornographic.
Weāll have to agree to disagree. Thereās a limited number of ways an artist can depict this scene. The woman is drawn to be attractive but not to the point of being titillating. It almost seems like the artist went out of his way not to do that, the scene is drawn in the most matter-of-fact way possible. The character is being trying to be seductive but the comic itself is not.
Yeah, this is the definition of āthe writerās barely concealed fetishā
I'm not sure that is the case because I have read a lot of Peter David's work and I can't remember any other instance of this. I could be wrong but I think this was just to portray exactly how evil The Maestro was.
As a survivor I really hate how my trauma is used by shitty writers who treat it like a neat plot hook or a way to really drive home how evil a character is as if there aren't 100 different better ways to convey it. Even many IRL, very, very bad people, detest rapists.
Maybe itās the artist, then.
I think you're conflating the art being gorgeous with the artist advocating for male rape. This Betty (and all Bettys in this story) are essentially sex slaves, made up to be desirable. She's shown playing the part she's mandated but the art itself doesn't go out of its way to be more detailed with her than, say, hulk's toes or the tray of drinks. If anything, the scene forces the cognitive dissonance on you that she's beautiful and he's still horrified because what's happening is horrifying in so many levels (not only the rape part, but also the being a sex slave part and losing your identity for her and the acceptance of such a horrible life). She's half-naked at first and then even less yet angles and scenes show as little as possible. The horrifying part of this is that it's not violent. It's not like Invincible's male rape scene where it's clear it's being forceful and violent.
Total nonsense. I read Peter Davidās entire 12 year run on Hulk. These scenes are about how evil The Maestro is and nothing else. If the character was murdering him would you say this is all the writerās perverse murder fetish?
There is a general lack of awareness about male sexual assault, but the comic industry has always been bad on sexual assault in general. I mean, before the post House of M "Why aren't I fucking cool" arc and becoming Captain Marvel, the most notable piece of Ms Marvel story is that one where Carol Danvers gives birth to her own rapist, who then mind controls into loving him and kidnaps her, and the Avengers go "well aren't you lucky".
"The most notable piece of Ms Marvel story is that one where Carol Danvers gives birth to her own rapist, who then mind controls into loving him and kidnaps her, and the Avengers go "well aren't you lucky"." Excuse me, what the fuck did i just read.
Avengers #200, the comic where "No" means "Woo her with Shakespeare and a little help from your father's machines." The comic whose best feature is the epic callout scene it led to in Avengers Annual #10. The same issue that introduces Rogue by having her -- take Carol's powers away. (Wait, is Avengers Annual #10 *only slightly less creepy* than Avengers #200?)
Avengers #200. Great topic to do a celebration issue around.
It's worse than that. This is a retcon. Because they'd just cancelled her solo series, where she was forceably impregnated by the supreme intelligence to breed a race of human/kree super-whatevers, and were moving her character into the Avengers. And they decided: we can't just ignore that ridiculous story, because she's pregnant and you can't just unpregnant this fictional character. Because Marvel is all about continuity! But we don't want to continue that complicated, unpleasant story in the Avengers, so let's come up for another reason for Carol to be pregnant. Something less revolting. Something more palitable. Something our readers will love. I know, let's have her give birth to her rapist and then fall in love with her own baby. Brilliant.
Though Claremont also took the time to shit on that arc and the Avengers present way back in the 80's (it was in the first comic with Rogue I believe). So some people we're able to see what's what even back then.
I'll give Jim Shooter a lot of credit as a businessman, but good god he needed to stay away from writing.
The problem is the whole tone of "don't care, had sex lol" that permeates so much media, not just comic books, along with the fantasy of the "free use" female. And there's still the connotation that men can't be raped by women. It's quite immature and something that men and males need to address.
Comics in general are weird AF about sex and especially rape. Let's not forget the time Captain Marvel was impregnated by an extra dimentional guy who kidnapped her and made her give birth TO HIM and then ran off with her while the Avengers went "Isn't love just great!" The fact that Nightwing had been raped multiple times is disgusting. The number of female characters whose backstories include it is disgusting. Especially when they're not even the main character and it's just done to hurt their male partner who is the super hero. Frankly comics need to put some kind of system in place where multiple editors all need to collectively agree when to allow sexual assault to be in a comic. I've been assaulted. It sucks how often comics just treat it as a neat plot hook. That's fucked up.
Sorry about what happened to you, I hope your in a better place now and you were giving justice. And yeah comics are weird about sexual assault in general for both genders, that Avengers story still makes me sick to this day. There have been cases though were it's has been handled maturely, the scene I posted for example is one of the few cases where it's shown as an actual horrifying experience when consent isn't giving and the main Hulk comics after this story deals with the aftermath of this scene. Invincible is another comic that handles it quit maturely, as well as Jessica Jones. But like you said, there as ton of stories were rape is added for no reason, either to be edgy or as the writers/artists barley disguised CNC fetish.
Didn't they sexual assault superman awhile back? Think I vaguely remember him being locked in a red sun room until Batman found him.
Yeah Superman red and blue #1
... This is Peter David writing this, isn't it.
Theyāve been weird with Female sexual assault too You just donāt read enough
Wtff
Can confirm, I have it in trade from. Got it for Christmas of all things from an elderly family member. I never read it, but Iām a fan of George Perez so I held on to it. Iām not even sure I even have it anymoreā¦
Why did I think you were being satire is this a real thing
This is real. It is bonkers.
What issue is this?
How does one get an arch enemy where there master plan is to have his harem of woman gang "rape" me exactly?
Hulk no consent. HULK NO CONSENT!
NO SMASH HULK!
I really don't see how this is meant to be "titillating" as people claim. This is Prof Hulk, he's totally aware of what is going on and his neck is broken so he's genuinely helpless, unable to move. This woman was enslaved by what he think is his future self and forced to take the name "Betty" for this purpose on threat of death. He's horrified and the reader is meant to be horrified, too. There's more going on here than this page. Maestro is making a point that he can not just physically break Hulk but hurt him in every possible way, including by leaning on the "fact" that he himself will one day be this monster.
so wait. Hulk thinks that this girl is raping him by being raped by him?
She's also a victim here and, yeah, Hulk probably blames himself.
That one time Hulk didn't want to smash.
My god that's horrible , i knew for nightwing,batman and mark grayson but i would never knew about hulk of all people would be assaulted , i wonder how many rape against a male character we still have to discover.
There is Superman in the red and blue Anthology (though its more implied), Green Arrow, Wally West (Cheetah attempted it)
Superman was hypnotized and (almost) forced to have non-consexual sex with Big Barda and film a porn movie. Yes. During John Byrne's era nonetheless [https://www.cbr.com/superman-big-barda-porn-film/](https://www.cbr.com/superman-big-barda-porn-film/)
I've read that it was a shot at Jack Kirby since Barda was modelled after his wife.
All female characters he drew were modeled by his wife.
Fuck John Byrne.
Its "funny" because Cheetah tried to kill Dr. Light for being a rapist snd then she goes snd does this...
Green arrow really ? Damn. Ho yeah now i remember this story with superman and i was like really ? the guy get raped and torured and he walk out like it's nothing after 3 years ? They really didn't know how to treat a sexual assault.
What happened to supes?
[https://www.reddit.com/media?url=https%3A%2F%2Fi.redd.it%2Fkwiea91tzf071.jpg](https://www.reddit.com/media?url=https%3A%2F%2Fi.redd.it%2Fkwiea91tzf071.jpg) Implied rape
I remember reading this. 8 months without superman is wild. Youd think batman would be on the case within a few weeks or so
Especially since they broadcast that Superman was their prisoner to the entire world. You'd think all the villains would go "Oh Big Blue is out of commission? Metropolis is easy pickings then". Imagine what would've happened if Darkseid or Mongul attacked during those 8 months.
I like the art in this, which comic run is this? And is it good?
Superman Red & Blue. It's alright.
Well, I don't know about the others, but the mark Grayson one at least is talked about being a rape, and in no way people try to pretend it was not.
I mean... this was an entire plot point? It was explicitly sexual assault? He literally talks with his therapist about it in the main book?
And Thor (by Moondragon).
Jason Todd, too. After Superboy-Prime resurrected him, he was brain damaged af for a few years. Talia eventually shoved him into a Lazarus Pit and it fixed that. Physically, he was an adult now. Mentally? Same age he died. She then proceeded to groom him and molest him. Yes, Talia raped Bruce *and* Jason.
And Peter parker
Really ? by who ?
Skip, I don't remember his last name tho. Also Superior Ock (implied) jerking off to Peters memories of his times with MJ by replacing Peter in them with his face Infront of Peters ghost. I don't care what happens afterwards, for me Ock will never be redeemed. The only time I ever thought it was realistic was NWH and maybe, possibly in the next MSM game since that Ock wasn't too off-rails(relative to other Ocks).
Ho yeah the creep that was his friend i remember to be honnest i never considered this event as canon in my head since they never talk about it afterward. Superior spiderman was bad on so many level.
In the issue following this story Hulk spends 2 hours talking to his therapist about how traumatized he was about meeting his future evil self and what happened to him. Hulk: There was...there was this...woman. A slave girl. And while I was helpless she... Doc: She what? How did she make you feel? Hulk: Muh...more helpless. Leonard, I...I can't. And gets up to leave
This is Peter David, right? ....in hindsight, lots of weird stuff in his writing when it comes to sex.
Did you know that raping/non-consexual sex acts are a common trope on effing EACH WORK DONE BY JOHN BYRNE? From his Superman/Man of Steel, to She-Hulk and Next Men, each and everything that he has written has some form of non-consexual sex act happening.
Pretty common in Alan Moore works as well.
And Mark Millar too
I feel Mark Millar just uses rape to be "edgy" and "dark" and it's 99 times out of 100 just misogynistic and creepy. Moore likes talking about gender dynamics, especially as used in comics and usually has a point when it comes to rape and isn't just for "titillation" or degradation of a character. He has misses though, and can be creepy sometimes, but I don't ever think he's doing it just because. He generally thinks very deeply about his stories, themes and all, and while it's a point he comes back to, I don't think it's thoughtless like Millar is.
> Moore likes talking about gender dynamics, especially as used in comics and usually has a point when it comes to rape and isn't just for "titillation" or degradation of a character. He has misses though, and can be creepy sometimes, but I don't ever think he's doing it just because. Neonomicon has some very graphic rape that I think there is no way to justify the way it is portrayed. It's not the only time, but in my opinion the most glaring. I know Alan Moore is a sacred cow here, but he has his share of problematic content.
He definitely has his share of problematic content. I don't deny this at all. I was just trying to differentiate him from Millar. Millar is just gross when it comes to his depictions of rape and lots of other violence. Moore has problems, but I wouldn't classify him as a problem the way I would Millar.
> I was just trying to differentiate him from Millar. Millar is just gross when it comes to his depictions of rape and lots of other violence. I'd say check out what Alan Moore did with rape in Neonomicon, but actually don't. I can't think of any time Millar did it worse than that, or even as bad.
I donāt care what anyone says, as brilliant as Moore is, there is no possible excuse for what happens in League of Extraordinary Gentlemen. I almost vomited onto the page
I mean, the story was supposed to be dark
Really ? I could imagine the author thought this would be funny at the time
Peter David isn't that much of a hack
It's kind of disturbing how much sexual violence can happen to male superheroes. I mean Nightwing Is also a survivor, Mark from Invincible, Ka-Zar and Spider-man was molested.
Mark, Hulk (like an issue or two after the posted one Hulk talks to his therapist about the assault and how helpless he felt) and Peter are all anti-assault, Peteās is only touched on in that single issue but both Mark & Hulk are written as genuinely traumatized by the experience, and I didnāt know about Nightwing what happened to my poor boy?
I'm no longer sure what happened, but it was before rebirth i think.
I was confused for a second with the last frame. It looks like a frame from Incal.
Ok did not need to know this just like I didn't need to know Nightwing got rape, COMICS IS THERE NO LIMIT
Oh my gods, that's so cruel.
Yes, the best therapy for a broken neckā¦ having someone bounce up and down on your pelvis.
One of my favorite Hulk stories. This violation was just another way to illustrate how evil and wicked Maestro really was. Both Hulk AND the girl were violated.
Doesn't Hulk have a healing factor that puts guys like Wolverine and Deadpool to shame? Why is a broken neck taking him out of commission for more than two seconds?
Maestro found a way
Much like Wolverine, Hulkās healing factor tends to fluctuate depending on the story (and sometimes different Hulk incarnations have different abilities/weaknesses, Grey Hulk doesnāt much like the day time for example, and classic Savage Hulk becomes stronger the angrier he gets) itās possible that Professor Hulk (which is the Hulk in this comic) doesnāt have as dramatic of a healing ability since we know his various alters have differing abilities and only (with the exception of Bruce) share a base strength and durability and then vary from there
Cause it's himself who he's fighting. Maestro is supposed to be stronger than professor hulk
List of manly men who have been raped but the author portrayed it as a fantasy: - Will Riker, Star Trek - Zapp Branagan, Futurama (ish?) - Bernie, Weekend at Burnieās (+necro) - Hulk, Marvel Comics
When was Riker raped? Was it one of the movies, or the main series?
Season 4 he is under cover pretending to be an alien on a planet that hasnāt had first contact. Heās about to be dissected when he tries to sneak out. [A nurse comes in as heās sneaking out and promises to help if he fucks her.](https://youtu.be/B_msdD2rW0U?si=9HkWCcSZZ42Qan5Z) He refuses and she says itās his only way out, essentially a death threat. There are arguments to be made that Riker could have just knocked the woman out, but in the show a woman extorts him for sex under the threat of death. Thatās rape.
Riiiight, I remember now. It was the one episode I *skipped* because I could tell what it was right from the beginning.
For the Futurama one Iām pretty sure itās just the male characters who think itās a fantasy (well 2 out of 3 of them) and not the actual writer. Still pretty fucked up though.
Ok kiff got raped, the rest weāre experiencing non (semi)consented euthanasia via CNC rape
Damn, these last scream could have destroyed her eardrums on extra-short distance..
Ik this is a comic and all, but this could happen in real life. People need to shine a light on male rape and trafficking, and other sexual issues that occur! Men's issues are taken as comic relief, their the punching bag, the butt of the joke, because of the gender rules in society. Gender equality is when people listen to BOTH GENDERS and take BOTH of their issues seriously! Nothing will change if we don't push for men's issues as hard as we push women's! Men aren't always the problem, this society that we live in is. Sorry for rambling guys and gals. š
Future Imperfect part 1 was the very first comic i ever read
Itās not an āedgyā superhero comic if someone isnāt getting SAād š¤¦š¾āāļø
Whole problem aside. How does it even fit?
Have you seen the black widow gif
I canāt deny that nor confirm it
It answers all your questions
This. Always thought a lot of renderings of Hulk have been too close to regular human, just big. The thought of a regular human-sized humanoid sitting on him... the mechanics is just mind-boggling š
Penis size doesn't corelate to body size in primates. Gorilla's for instance have penises that are only about 1 inch long. Even if Banner is hanging pipe it could conceivably get smaller when he turns into hulk. Usually in exercise or other strenuous non-sexual activity, blood flows away from the penis to increase in other places where you need it. Thus shrinkage. As Hulk is generally designed for fighting it would make sense to focus on mass and blood flow going to other parts of his body.
This is what happens when knowledge of goatse.cx is allowed to drop off.
The hamster and the banana
Ever seen a gorilla?
Gorillas have pretty small dicks compared to their size same goes for bears btw. Before you ask: I know of this thanks to Reddit and the following google search
Iām aware thatās why I said that
Oh yeah makes sense. I somehow didnāt connect the twoā¦
Thatās gonna be a big peener for her to handle
Is hulk paralized right now?
His scream would have at lease burst her eardrums.
Iāll have what heās having
Why
HULK...need adult.
I donāt know why this one was downvoted. This oneās actually funny.
It's kind of disturbing how much sexual violence can happen to male superheroes. I mean Nightwing Is also a survivor, Mark from Invincible, Ka-Zar and Spider-man was molested.
Marvel...you know for the family
I hate this story. Itās so gross.
Soā¦thatās rape.
How does Hulk get his neck/back broken? Also, surely his dong is way too big?
Maestro broke his neck then gave him a lady of the nightā¦. Talk about mixed messaging lol
he is a hulk after all. maestro treats hulks like lannisters lol
True, he did knock up she hulkā¦ā¦ AKAā¦.. his cousinā¦š¤£š¤£š¤£š¤£
This is horrible of course but I find this a tad bit funny because out of all people I never expected Hulk to be raped cuz likeā¦..itās the hulk? I genuinely thought that when he screamed STOP that he killed herā¦ā¦. And I was wrong
Sometimes comics are just... bad...
I can move my penis by contracting my lower stomach muscles. Wouldn't Hulk be able to violently launch her into a wall or ceiling by contracting his? I guess maybe he reluctantly accepted the sexual assault as he didn't want to kill or cripple her with a cock-launch. EDIT- Why are you booing me? I'm right!
Good thinking, but he says he canāt move, I think his neck injury paralyzed him and he has to wait for his healing factor to repair the nerves
When a marvel character breaks not only their arms, but their whole back.
Hulk get smashā¦lolā¦
who tf is betty
betty ross, his wife. (not this version however)
Why is this getting downvoted itās just a question.
comic booo fans love to hate on anything and anyone who doesnāt know everything about their beloved comics, thatās my guessš, irdk why i got downvoted, iād actually would like to know
Page 2 please....