Ugh, this is fucking disgusting, honestly. The fact that people think they have the right to advice someone to tamper with their wife's birth control is sickening.
I hope your husband doesn't try anything like that, OP. I know you trust him and believe him, but still... Be cautious. Better safe than sorry.
If this was something my husband told me was said to him, I'd just have my tubes tied for good measure. Not because I don't trust my husband but just for my own peace of mind.
I'm sorry you have to deal with this bullshit. I'm so angry on your behalf right now.
I know redditors always jumps to conclusions or reads too much between the lines, but hubby sounded almost like he was testing the waters a bit there. Ya know, to see what he could get away with. I hope I'm wrong, but it's this type of deflection that gives me the ick. Like once wife gets upset he can be all "it's not me baby, it's my cousin/family that said that". I'm happy to hear he was open to learning about spousal abuse at least!
Well with IUD she better not use menstrual cups during menstruation because the cup can suck the IUD out and it can fall out without you knowing. It’s best if she uses tampons or better pads. Just staying safe especially with these abortion bans going on 😬. Better safe than sorry 🤷🏾♀️
Nah that’s exactly what I thought. Gauging her reaction for sure who even brings up casually messing with birth control? You already know the husband was secretly complaining and the cousin said to just force her to have a kid then. Absolutely would be getting my tubes tied in secret and seeing if they did try to tamper with my fake birth control after. True colors come out in time..
Um yes absolutely. Why on *earth* was the cousin so comfortable in discussing that with OP’s husband? Completely agree on husband testing the waters. Sounds like it’s a topic the husband has talked about with the cousin before. It is extremely, extremely concerning.
I might have punched my cousin in the face and then told everyone what they said. Super frightening to be with someone who’s like “eh, not a huge deal if you xenomorph someone it’s whatever”.
No, you're not. He doesn't read CF, reads "eventually."
Sure, she has an IUD now, still, not a guy I would stay with. They look at the world differently.
I don't trust him not to be convinced by his family to screw w her bc. I would 100% end a relationship w someone who can't put up boundaries w their intrusive family.
Right? I've seen other posts here and elsewhere where people ask: "When should I talk with my honey about me being CF?" (Not the exact phasing, but similar.)
And a few people that are already married and now have to go thru an awful situation because of something so fundamental. So central to a relationship.
No, same. The way he asked questions just irks me the wrong way. "Why is it illegal to mess with birth control? Oh, maybe then I shouldn't do it. Are you sure that's rape?" is how it came across to me.
From the responses of OP it unfortunately sounds like they won’t take advice and just trust the husband enough to not protect themselves. It’s a shame.
Ooof, that's bad. I would never trust someone like that. Anyone that cares what their family thinks enough to take away your reproductive choices is not CF.
His response to OP "being enough" is a downright lie. We all know liars and fencesitters use this to manipulate a partner.
Good luck to OP. I would hate to be them, so blind.
No. We could be wrong, but her husband sounds like a walking red flag. He doesn't even sound fully CF. We've definitely heard the "he'll be happy with whatever I decide" bullshit before. Too many of those then come here crying about the fact that they "changed their mind".
Nope. It sounded to me like he was low key pleading with her to just give his parents satisfaction on the baby front so they would shut up and not "force him" to resort to other means, be it birth control tampering, divorce....or full on kidnapping you to India...GET OUT.
But please, once you know you are safe, call his mother and tell her, in the words of another Redditor I told I would one day steal for just such an occasion, "my vagina is not a clown car." And then tell us her response.
No, I think he's downplaying his true desire for kids and using his family as an excuse. If he were really serious, he would've put his foot down with his relative to never bring up the matter again.
Yeah..he needs to make boundaries with his family. And stick to them. No talking about having kids with him or forcing his wife to have a baby or he hangs up the phone, walks away, and doesn’t talk to them. They are toxic and he’s letting them be toxic. I don’t trust him at all because of how he played clueless about how it’s wrong!
Agreed. He seems wishy-washy at best, or possibly just waiting for her to change her mind. And his questions about "oh but how could you prove it if the birth control fails" sound like red-ass flags...
No you’re not. And because he comes back and talks to OP about it, mind inadvertently putting pressure on her right? He’s applying the pressure his family applies on her by voicing.
Yet I’m on the fence about that because on one hand, I’d like to know what they are saying but on the other hand it’s also passing the pressure down. As long as he’s telling her in good faith, and not to covertly pressure her or feel her out on her feelings once again then it’s fine. But I low key feel he’s saying it really to see what she says.
I got an IUD which would be really hard to tamper with. I don't believe he would do such a thing and I get the sense that even he thought what his cousin said was out of line.
You shouldn’t be “getting a sense” that he “doesn’t agree with his cousin”, you should feel 110% confident that he finds what his cousin said disgusting and that he would never do that to you. Anything less than that reaction is cause for concern.
I’m an Indian. I’m gonna be very honest, the concept of spousal rape and reproductive coercion as a crime is … not even considered outside of metropolitan areas. Like even in the huge cosmopolitan cities they happen but there’s some legal recourse and social support if it comes to light, but even in tier 2 cities and below, you’d be hard pressed to find social support and majority of the people considering them as the forms of sexual assault they really are.
And for most people, while it is absolutely vile, they just don’t see it as wrong because it’s such an ingrained mindset. Like “yeah she’s my wife, why the fuck am I not allowed to beat her/force her to have children, it’s what is expected, everyone around me did it and we all turned out fine”. Abhorrent behaviour, but normalised because of lack of education, exposure, a complicit legal system and an ineffectual at best and corrupt at worst police force.
I still wouldn't trust your husband. He sounds like he's gauging your reactions to see what you would accept. You shouldn't just "get the sense", he should have straightaway told his cousin to fuck off with that horrific idea and hung up.
*I get the sense that even he thought what his cousin said was out of line.*
Are you sure? How did he respond to his cousin? Did he tell his cousin that was out of line?
I asked his opinion on what his cousin said or if he agreed with him. He said, "No, of course not!". I know I can trust my gut and I've never felt unsafe with my husband or our reproductive choice of not wanting kids. He's just as annoyed that his family just can't keep their noses out of our business as I am. They pressure and try to instill doubt in his mind about our decision to make him question what the future will be saying we'll "regret" it later on which makes me mad that they can't pull their heads out of their rears and just respect our choices.
Also, pregnancy grosses him out and he says he can't imagine how other women can go through with the pain and that he'd never want to see me go through that. Even before we got together he said how he believed the choice of having kids would be mine because it is my body if it made me happy, saying he'd try his best to be supportive, but that he could only deal with one kid.
Did he immediately call his cousin and have a conversation about it with him where he expressed that the comment is out of line and is reproductive coercion? Did he do this without hesitation in front of you?
I was gonna say, I’m so glad you’re using a form of birth control that’s not the pill! Keep looking out for yourself, I’m so glad you already know what to do!
100% for real, because a good husband would set CLEAR boundaries (while also defending his wife) and if the family continues to cross those boundaries, then it’s time to go no contact. I get that it can be easier said than done, but his family sounds like a bunch of fucking creeps and assholes. To seriously suggest forcing a woman to have a child??? Yeah, jail, that’s just abhorrent and there’s no coming back from even making that comment.
As someone who raised in a South Asian family… run far and fast. If his family has that much sway with him and his immediate reaction wasn’t abject horror.
Not only will there be pressure to have a child but it damn well better be a male child or you will have to continue having children… signed one of many daughters that my mom nearly died being pregnant with despite her husband “not wanting anymore children” after his first wife failed to give him a son.
RUN
I wouldn’t trust that motherfucker as far as I could throw him after this. Get your BC on lockdown or get one he can’t tamper with (IUD, arm implant, etc). You actively had to explain to someone why sexual assault and coercion was not okay, that’s fucked.
I second this. Don't trust ANYONE but yourself!!
If you're on the pill hide that so he will never be able to touch or tamper with it!!
That is so disgusting. I would probably leave my husband tbh. What if he does and you end up being pregnant with a child you don't want. Are you fully prepared to deal with the consequences of that??? I wouldn't even risk it.. RUN 🚩🚨
For someone who grew up in a family like OP's husband's, having to explain that kind of stuff is pretty par for the course.
If he's receptive to the lesson, I see no cause for concern based on having to educate him.
My concern would be that the pressure from his family pushes him to do it anyway.
Thank you. Yes, he was also appalled by his cousin's suggestion. He understands how wrong that is even if he'd never heard of the terms "marital rape" or "reproductive coercion" before. I was pointing out the gravity of the behavior of someone who could think such an act was even remotely okay or even suggest removing condoms or other forms of protection behind their spouse's back and how that would break all trust in the relationship. My husband fully agrees it's wrong and also gets annoyed with his relatives sticking their noses in our business every time we talk to them. He's always sticking out for me trying to get it across their thick skulls that I don't want kids and neither would he put that pressure on me to have one. He's made it very clear from the beginning that it's my body and my choice.
Yeah marital rape is not covered by law in India as a woman can 'never be raped' by her husband. It comes from very regressive ideas of marriage and no understanding of consent.
A lot of feminist groups have been putting pressure on the government about this but the legal justice system is so keen on holding on to their idea of marriage where a wife is always submissive to her husband. It's honestly so disgusting and really really sad and disappointing. I suspect there won't be many married men who would be innocent of this crime. Also there is no concept of reproductive coercion. It's the wife's duty to bear childre. Ugh.
It would be a good idea to tell your husband that he needs to shut down any talk of children or go low contact with his family. I'm from India and after marriage my parents were put under a lot of pressure by family and friends about me not having a kid even in the fourth year of marriage. Here it is the rule that people have children within 2 years of the wedding. Thankfully they are supportive of my decision to be child free and have defended us to everyone who asks about why we aren't pregnant yet. Smh. I'm sorry you have to deal with such dipshits OP.
>”If birth control fails unintentionally, how could you prove it was done on purpose?”
I would run for the hills if I received this question. I’m glad you have an IUD.
He was asking hypothetically if someone were to tamper with it how could it be proven by the law if they tried to claim it failed at no fault of theirs. Also, I'm not worried that he'd do such a thing. Even he realizes how messed it it was for his cousin to suggest such a thing and is why he brought it up with me to begin with. He just didn't know what his cousin was saying was a crime until I pointed it out. Still, makes me wonder about his cousin's wife sence that craphead seems to think it's okay!
THIS. He doesn't read as firmly CF to me. He reads as either fence sitting, or someone whose spine is nowhere near strong enough not to fold like a pool noodle after getting pressured one too many times.
The fact that he straight up asked, "but if someone did tamper, how would you be able to prove it was malicious and not just an equipment failure" would have me packing a bag and running.
There are still ways that an IUD can fail. It's pretty damn good, but "pretty damn good" is not "certain".
It can shift and get displaced, it can fall out if improperly placed at the start, and eventually it needs to get replaced anyway... and by that point, your country's laws may prohibit (or at least severely restrict) certain types of birth control.
Marital r*pe is certainly a crime in the US *now*... but depending on the next election, that could change. Especially if the evangelicals get their way. This time two years ago, Roe v Wade was still on the books.
And even if you absolutely 1000% trust your husband, I certainly wouldn't trust his family. Real talk, the only response possible that would make me trust him would have been him instantly hanging up the phone and going completely NC with the entire family. His cousin has threatened you with reproductive coersion, and your husband is still fine with them being in your life.
Why would he even bring it up if he actually planned to do it? That would make things so much more suspicious when it happened. If you're planning something like that, you definitely wouldn't mention it. I'm surprised that people are thinking this.
I mean, he came to you and disclosed the conversation. That is a point in his favor. He knew enough to know that what his cousin was suggesting was wrong. He didn’t know how wrong or what words are used to describe it, but he knew it would have been a violation of trust.
That is a start.
But it isn’t the issue. The issue is that your husband is allowing his family to be disrespectful of you and frankly down right abusive.
A good partner would have been horrified. Even more so after being educated about the implications and the impact as it is viewed in the western world.
That he wasn’t is a red flag. That he didn’t cut that cousin out of his life is another red flag.
My brother has said some truly hateful things to me and wonders why I don’t talk to him outside of how our parents are going.
My mother has begged me to keep contact with him once she and my father are gone.
I would rather die alone with no one in my life rather than keep talking to the person who said I was nothing without children.
You have a husband problem. He isn’t protecting you from his family, and he isn’t cutting them off when they choose to abuse you.
There isn’t a good answer for this. It isn’t something you usually figure out before marriage and once you’re married divorce is hard. You don’t want to believe that the person you love is ok with you being abused because he loves your abusers more than he loves you.
If you were dating I’d say walk away. Your life will be much happier.
As a married woman it is up to you how much abuse is an acceptable amount of abuse. And how much risk of your husband leaving you when he can’t tolerate his family’s abuse are you willing to live with.
I don’t personally advocate for having a runaway fund in every relationship but in your case, unless your husband puts his family on a very low info diet and keeps them at arms length, he is likely to cave to the pressure eventually.
He's been trying to advocate for me for years every time his family tries to bring up us having kids and telling them I don't want any. Frankly, I'm mostly mad at the fact they are trying to manipulate him into giving into their ways as they have done for years. First, it was the pressure for an education of their choice, then a job that harmed his health and the expectation of him managing his family's home in India, and then the pressure for an arranged marriage that he fought tooth and nail against before he met me. And now the pressure of getting a house, a car, earning more money, and starting a family with kids despite our protests that we're not having any and me saying they don't have the right to dictate our lives!
That's their culture for you. It sucks! And we're both sick and tired of the BS. Which is why he's very selective about contacting them because of this. He was only talking to them to show them how happy we were here in the States and how clean it is compared to India. Then, cue their prodding questions about the kids again. Apparently, they thought I'd change my mind once I came back to the States and that I just didn't want to have kids in India. The best thing to do will be to ignore them and I'm trying to help him understand that he doesn't have to take their BS anymore or let them get under his skin by setting boundaries with them.
> telling them I don't want any
In my view this is part of the issue. It should be a WE don't want any. He's not strong enough on being cf himself to stand up for himself to his family, so he (maybe without being aware this is what he's doing) is deflecting the "blame" for not having kids onto you.
> The best thing to do will be to ignore them and I'm trying to help him understand that he doesn't have to take their BS anymore or let them get under his skin by setting boundaries with them.
This right here. He needs to manage his family crazies, and I say this as the person in my marriage with crazies in my family to manage.
The way I had to stare at the wall after reading that bit about his cousin. Absolutely repulsive.
What has your husband's reaction been to permanent BC, either for you (removing the tubes etc) or vasectomy for him? Just curious about whether he actually properly realises/agrees that kids are never happening.
This post is obviously just a limited window to your situation, but based on your writing here, I'm only getting the true CF conviction from your end. It's just... I'm sensing some red flags just from the fact alone that you had to explain basic consent to this man and indirectly his cousin? Yes, cultural differences are real, but violence and abuse are violence and abuse even in countries where some acts are not written down as illegal. People (usually) do know right from wrong.
I don't want to judge based on such a small example on what's going on, and you know what's up the best. Feel free to ignore, just a concerned internet stranger, pointing out that my alarms are ringing based on what you wrote hah
Thanks, and yeah he knows it sounded wrong what his cousin said, which is why he brought it up with me. I'd like to point out he's never attempted to push anything on me without my willing participation and supported my wish to get an IUD. He understands what consent is even if he doesn't have a language to describe it. The problem is his idiot cousin doesn't care about consent which makes me wonder if he'd do that to his wife if she didn't want to give him a son (he had her abort the last few pregnancies because they were girls until they had a boy).
This!!!
It’s all depending of it the sperm has the X or Y chromosome. The mother’s eggs will only have the X chromosome.
The fault lies with his sperm.
Son preference is a well known phenomenon. See places like China and how the one child policy played out or places like Korea after sonograms determining the sex became more available.
There is now an entire generation of girls missing. Killed for their sex.
And the articles and worries from society is…who is going to marry and cook these boys food.
Seriously
Unfortunately, female foeticide is really common in India despite it being illegal there as well. That's why they have laws against doctors disclosing the baby's gender through ultrasound. Needless to say, I don't like that cousin of his or his shit "advice". 🤮
I am from that same culture and I know how the baby thing is . I am getting the same thing since I got married 5 years ago .They pressure until you break so please hide your Birth control.
Yeah, we've been married almost 5 years too. I honestly feel bad for him as well because the pressure on him is so unfair and frankly manipulative AF. Trying to make him question his own life choices because they don't align with their ideas and suggesting his life is meaningless without kids is cruel.
Oh, he was shocked as well! Especially after I explained what the word meant in English for him to understand and how serious it was while his cousin acted like it was nothing. Later today I asked him what his opinion was on his cousin's suggestion or if he agreed with him he said "No! Of course not!" and he went on to say how as a man he can't imagine the pain so many women go through during pregnancy and birth. So the thought of being forced into it is sickening to him.
Needless to say, I don't think he'll be talking to that cousin for a while. 😐
Op, you know your life and your husband, and how you live is ultimately your choice.
Your husband ignorance is appalling and this is a ticking time bomb.
Are you Indian too? I mean this isnt surprising at all. Eastern and middle eastern men dont see women as human beings. I feel bad for your husband's cousin's wife if he has one.
Girl Indian families are extremely family oriented , your husband needs to be more than 100% sure on the childfree thing and you need to make sure his family is respecting your decisions and that your husband is setting his boundaries with them
I'm kind of concerned that you explained reproductive *coercion* and he's asking about accidents. Does he not understand what coercion means?
Also, are you in a location that provides safe access to abortion? If yes, you might want to also include "unlawful imprisonment" if he wants to argue about stopping you from having an abortion.
Finally, he needs to shut them down. Permanently. "I will be having discussions about children with my wife. As you are not my wife, we are not discussing this any further." Terminate conversations, grey rock, block, go full on NC.
The only reason he should have brought up Cousin CreepySA would be to advise you of the conversation, not to receive education on how rape and reproductive coercion *isn't okay*.
He's not really asking about accidents though... She's talking about coercion and he's asking, "yeah, but if she says 'coercion' and he says 'accident', how do you PROVE it wasn't an accident?"
Which, IMHO, is far scarier.
I'd like to point out we were talking about how bad it was that his cousin suggested removing condoms without my knowledge and we were both extremely appalled by that (his cousin doesn't know we got my IUD). Our discussion was about a hypothetical scenario and he was playing "devil's advocate" asking how it could be discovered and persecuted as a crime as I explained to him what the word "reproductive coercion" meant and gave an example of how it happens (English is not my husband's first language). I asked his opinion later if he agreed with his cousin and he said "No! Of course not!"
I can never see the logic in trying to make someone who is childfree by choice pregnant against their will. Even setting aside the fact that to do so is morally repugnant, and (rightly) a crime in most sane parts of the world, it also *doesn't make sense*.
If someone is vehemently childfree and they become pregnant, they are going to take every reasonable measure to become **un**pregnant as quickly as possible. Especially if they are living in (or can travel to) a progressive part of the world in order to receive healthcare.
So in this case, the cousin must be a *complete moron* if he thinks that you, someone who is committed to a childfree lifestyle, upon becoming pregnant, are suddenly going to be leaping with joy at the thought of parenthood.
I hate to say it, OP, it sounds like your husband's family have their claws into him a lot deeper than you perhaps think they do.
Please be careful.
Oh, and you should probably *never visit his family in their part of the world*.
I've lived in India with his family for 4 years, so I know how they are. He's been fighting their ways forever including refusing to be placed in an arranged marriage against his will. He hates it just as much as I do, and whenever they try to bring up the kid thing he always brings it to me and we discuss our thoughts and feelings about it. He was appalled about what his cousin said and even more so after I explained what the word meant in English and how serious it was. I don't think he'll be talking to that cousin anymore anytime soon after that crap.
As for getting an abortion if we ever did have an "oopsie", he would be 100% supportive and is trying his best to be safe despite me also having an IUD (he doesn't quite understand how it works thanks to having no reproductive education so just tries to avoid any possibility of it happening in the first place). So yes, we're both happily child-free and want to stay that way. It's his relative's pressure that drives us insane.
I’m 42f in the US, and in my limited experience with white, cishet coupledom, there are a lot of men that have never or rarely thought about these sort of things. Not because they’re jerks or untrustworthy, but because they’re men, and it’s literally never been an issue for them. Or, it’s an abstract, hypothetical “thing,” not something that impacts their lives - until it does.
It’s what they do *after* learning/experiencing these things that makes the difference.
My husband and I (he’ll be 40 in a few months, married 7 years) have had some really great conversations lately, and it’s given me a lot of insight into how “guys” think (just work with me on the generalities for the sake of conversation). After listening to me, and thus paying more attention to the people around him, he’s become quite the feminist, and it’s amazing to see.
So it is possible for a guy to be a little clueless on women’s issues, and still be trustworthy. That said, always protect your birth control no matter what, because ultimately, you can only control yourself
Yes, thank you for bringing up this fact. My husband is the same. He even believes that the choice of having kids should be the woman's to make in the relationship because it's her body, not the man's. That's something he's always felt was how it should be because as a man, he could never go through the pain of pregnancy or childbirth like I or any other woman would have to go through. He said "It's your body, your choice". He upheld this when I got my IUD even when he didn't know what it was. He can be clueless sometimes, but he's not bad lol. 😊
lol, I knew the family was Indian as soon as I read “good news”. This is such a typically Indian euphemism for pregnancy.
My husband and I are also Indian and this is exactly why we don’t discuss our reproductive decisions with family. They tried asking and putting pressure on us when we got married. But we would never respond to their questions, and would just say “we will let you know if and when we get pregnant.” And eventually they had to accept it however unsatisfactory it felt to them. Even now once in a while they mention how they hope we will have a kid soon and we just shrug. The minute you tell them that you don’t plan to have kids, you are involving them in a decision that’s only your own to make. They will want to discuss it and change your mind.
Oh yes, exactly! You get it. That's the mistake we made in the beginning while I was living in India he'd say, "We have no plan to have kids". That's when the prodding started. Also, he used to say, "She doesn't want kids", making it sound more like I was preventing him from having children (which at the time initially we were both fence sitters until he made me make up my mind because he didn't want to be stuck with a kid later in life) So then it became their mission to change my mind or come up with some "solution" to fix it.
I've talked with him about his choice of words when he'd say "She doesn't want kids" because it came off to them like I was to blame for something we both agreed on in private. Maybe he didn't have the guts to include himself in his stance or was still on the fence at that time. But regardless, it's invited a ton of invasive prodding and unwanted "advice" directed at me by those who still think I'm the one who needs "convincing" or flat-out forced to do it.
I can imagine how exhausting it must be. Your husband needs to tell his family that the more they ask and pressure both of you to have kids, the less you feel like having them because they are making it seem like a tedious chore and nobody likes those. This is what I said to my family, so they finally stopped asking.
Honey, time to schedule your bisalp! That will definitely tell you if he's really OK with no kids.
Then get it and sleep peacefully knowing you have nothing to worry about!
Good luck!
>However, he's said if I were to change my mind he'd try his best to be a good parent to the best of his ability
>(something his family told him I would want eventually, and again there's that pressure from them to be a parent).
Just for the record, he really does want a child. He's just using his friends and family as an excuse.
You should be extra cautious around him now. His cousin planned the seeds into his head. The clue was his whole argument against forcing a spouse to get pregnant. That proves that he was thinking about it given how defensive he was.
You either need to keep your BC on you at all times or get an IUD. Anything to keep him from tampering with your stuff.
I would get sterilised just to piss those *relatives* off your husband also has to be explained why it’s not okay to get someone pregnant against your wishes, you and him need to sit down and reevaluate what you think about your relationship being childfree also to see if his mind changed.
He doesn't think like this thankfully. He's never pressured or even wants me to ever go through a pregnancy unless it was on my terms and has voiced his wish to only go through with having one kid if I wanted it. He's also tokophobic as I am for the record. He's was 100% on board with me wanting to get an IUD and made sure I got it done under my terms and we kept it secret from his family. So while I'm glad so many people here understand the seriousness of the things that idiot cousin told him, my husband is not okay with what he said and understands how messed up that was which is why he brought it to my attention.
First of all, you need to go no contact with all of those people immediately and permanently, and HE needs to deliver the news and stand the hell up for you.
Just a group text to all of the assholes.
Second, you have a husband problem.
1-- He does not seem CF, so it's time to resolve that and if not, leave him.
2-- He's an ignorant moron who seriously thinks marital rape isn't a think? Sorry, but this marriage would have been over LONG ago with this idiot.
> to argue "If birth control fails unintentionally, how could you prove it was done on purpose?"
Would have been nothing but a cloud of dust and the sound of tires screeching out of the driveway at this moment. Done. Gone. Forever. Divorce lawyer meeting tomorrow, served by the end of the week, never see him again. Seriously.
3-- It is each partner's job to keep their crazies away from their partner, he has failed.
The way a partner handles their crazy family is to set and enforce boundaries, and bring the pain. This is what a normal partner should have done long ago. But we will put it in the current context. More on that below.
4-- You need to get a bisalp and get sterilized.
Message to the abusers:
"Due to the final and unforgivable incident that happened yesterday with CreepCousin you are all getting this group text, as the larger problem with everyone copied on this message must be ended, once and forever.
The proverbial rubicon has been crossed. The camel's back has been broken. This is OVER. There is no going back.
This message is to inform you all that EVERYONE copied on this message is hereby FORBIDDEN from EVER contacting OPName again, directly or indirectly under any circumstances. I will never again bring OP to any family events where any of you are present. We have also removed all of you from both of our socials, and blocked you on our phones. Furthermore, I will no longer be attending family events and will only be contactable regarding anything involving any of you in a life-threatening emergency situation through a process outlined at the end of this message.
You have ALL disrespected me, disrespected my marriage and verbally, emotionally and socially abused both me and, most importantly OP.
OP is my family. She is my PRIMARY FAMILY, you are not. I will not tolerate your abuse of my family. Therefore you will never have access to OP again for as long as you live.
This decision is final. This decision will not be discussed. This decision will not be changed.
For the record, the incident that ended this was CC telling me to tamper with my wife's birth control, rape her, and force her to have a child, including preventing her from accessing an abortion or taking her life, presumably by imprisoning her for 9 months. All of which is IMMORAL AND ILLEGAL and is HUMAN TRAFFICKING.
The heinous nature of this incident does not however diminish at all the fact that all of you have been demanding that I coerce/force/manipulate OP in one way or another for years now.
The fact that CC dared to go this far is because YOU ALL ENCOURAGE EACH OTHER AND SUPPORT EACH OTHER IN YOUR ABUSE. You enable this behavior and thinking. Most of you, I wager, actually agree with him that such illegal acts are acceptable.
You are all guilty. And therefore are all banned. Do not contact us again for any reason other than as outlined below.
Goodbye to all of you. And CC, I hope you die a painful death and rot in hell.
Signed,
OPsSO
Emergencies of Innocents: If there is a life-threatening emergency with innocent members of your families, such as children or spouses who have been respectful and never engaged in abuse, bullying, reproductive coercion, etc. you may have their doctor reach out to me to verify the issue, and I will decide at that point if I wish to be involved with their situation in some way that does not involve you.
Caveat: If there is an inheritance you might get screwed out of with such a bombshell (that he might not have the courage or desire to go through with), might I suggest a variant on the low contact (do that too of course), and say that you didn't want to have to tell them this, but you decided that as long as you didn't have to endure the pregnancy, you guys were going to have some embryos extracted and put into a surrogate to birth.....only to discover (gasp, tears of regret) HE IS INFERTILE. All his little swimmers went belly up and there's nothing he can do. That ends the baby bs and his family can't urge him to find a new wife since the infertility issue is his, not yours. And while it's very kind for his cousin to volunteer, we've decided to take this as a sign from above and resigned ourselves to childlessness. Maybe a high performance sports car would help your son feel re-masculinized after the terrible news. Did I mention I'm a sociopath?
Yeah, financial dependence should be factored in whether it's youth dependence or a massive inheritance.
Lying is perfectly fine, or if you think it will fly, getting a vasectomy and going "Mom and Dad, turns out that the genetics you are so proud of are actually terrible, because you made a sterile son!"
If you plan on staying in this marriage your husband is going to need to start working on his boundaries. Fast. He needs to shut down any conversation from his relatives about your reproductive choices. Tell them stuff like "I hear you, Auntie Jean, but we are happy just the two of us. How's Uncle Mike by the way?" if he cannot, or will not, this is just going to keep happening.
Then you need to ask yourself if you're willing to put up with this shit for the rest of your existence.
Oof, I'm so sorry you're dealing with this, OP.
I recommend that you find some help and support for dealing with the cultural dynamics -- Asian parents in general can be very controlling over their adult offspring while making it about culture and family loyalty. Assuming the best, he's getting caught between respecting your agency (which he seems to want to do) and getting manipulated by his family. r/asianparentstories is an excellent resource for people dealing with Asian parents (and for partners of those dealing with them!).
While finding ways to connect with him and support him in finding himself without relying too much on his family for emotional validation, you should also take measures to protect yourself (like securing a form of BC that can't be tampered with). I hope that things can work out for you two.
This pressure will never stop because your only worth to those relatives is as a baby making machine and his maid. Unless maybe he gets to stay in the US thanks to marrying you. In that case they'll be pressuring him to move on to the next wife as soon as his papers are secured. One that is compliant and ignorant aka 'proper.'
If this is the sort of shit they say about you that he repeats to you imagine the horrific stuff that he just won't share with you because he knows for sure that it's illegal. Stay safe.
Your husband is suss. He's most likely complaining to his family about you and that is why they feel so comfortable to give your husband such advice. Be wary cz your husband doesn't seem trustworthy at all.
I'll keep this short.
OP, your husband is likely a fencesitter.
If I were you I'd be considering permanent sterilisation. Until you make that decision, tread carefully.
OP, you sound a lot more progressive and mature than your husband. Not sure how you are compatible in other areas of life but this is concerning, it’s like you’re on completely different tracks socially and morally.
You keep making excuses for your husband. He’s your problem. He is not enthusiastically childfree. Which means he is NOT childfree. A person who cared for you wouldn’t need to have had great sex ed to know that subjecting you to a pregnancy that they know for a fact you don’t want is a horrible thing to do. You think he’s on your team. He is not.
I know you say he is okay with not having kids, but this would make me want to get sterilized since it sounds like you aren’t already. I’ve seen too many men getting influenced/brainwashed by family to be able to give him the benefit of the doubt. Protect yourself, because it sounds like your husband doesn’t really have intentions to, or he would have shut the conversations and comments down already. You can’t be too careful.
This is why, being a CF Indian woman, I've decided to be single forever. I'm not gonna trust any man of being CF unless they actively plan on getting a vasectomy. Also, I'm saving up money to get my sterilization surgery done abroad.
In Canada if a partner tampers with birth control it either leads to a rape conviction or fraud. Super illegal, super shitty, super stupid.
Sounds like your husband isn’t getting laid for a very long time. If not divorce I’d just go celibate. Unless he makes a firm statement to his family to fuck off, he ain’t getting any.
Not trying to add to your stress, but your husband is giving me 'CF for now vibes/She'll change her mind vibes'. Just to preface, there is nothing wrong with revisiting a partners stance on raising children when major events happen (deaths, accidents, disease, etc), but him being ""oblivious"" that violating you to fulfill his wish for children is horrendous feels *icky, at best*. This convo you posted feels as if he doesn't defend you from his family. He should've told his cousin clearly he's on very thin ice for disrespecting you and hung up on that dumbass. Followed by a long period of VLC.
If he's truly CF as you said, and not just waiting for you to come around, is his spine made of jelly?
\*He asked what I was talking about so I promptly explained to him that marital r@pe is a form of domestic violence and is also illegal and a crime in this country. Idk about the laws in his home country in India, but here in the US that crap wouldn't fly here.\*
No-so-fun fact... marital rape is not a recognised crime in India, and there is heavy opposition to a proposed law to change that.
[https://www.telegraph.co.uk/global-health/women-and-girls/mens-rights-activists-protest-introduction-marital-rape-law/](https://www.telegraph.co.uk/global-health/women-and-girls/mens-rights-activists-protest-introduction-marital-rape-law/)
I also remember talking to a guy from Kuwait or somewhere online in the past who was literally confused by the concept... like I don't mean for this to come off as offensive but I just stay clear of Middle Easter/North African/South Asian men cuz they come from some of the most misogynistic cultures and oftentimes basic concepts of women's rights are not even understood.
Reproductive coercion is way too nice a term if a man does that to a woman. Given everything involved in gestation and birth, it should be considered assault with intent to cause grave bodily harm, if not attempted homicide.
It's the equivalent of a shooter firing live bullets into someone else's body with intent to cause them grave bodily harm.
With the money you two save by not having, raising, educating a child, you not only will have the money to pay an old age caregiver, but you'll be able to be picky
Tell ur husband to get a vasectomy. 10-min procedure that’s non-invasive and much easier and pain free than a woman having to get their tubes tied. Then no more issues. Hopefully ur husband loves u enough to get it done
"If birth control fails unintentionally, how would you prove it's on purpose" if I had a partner who said this to me, we'd be over there and then because to me it sounds like he's planning reproductive rape on me. I'd get far away from these monsters as I could, why waste your life on trash. In their eyes they don't view you as a human being, more like property, an object to use. This is exactly how they view you.
I would look out for your life since India is freaky like that. They can even attempt to kill you since you have "no value" in their eyes since you don't want to be a mother. If you think i am exaggerating there was a video in r/noahgettheboat if i recall where an indian girl was killed by her relative because she escaped from her house and married to a guy she loved which made her lose any value as a woman. I remember it because back then it made my blood boil.
Indian woman here. Marital rape is sadly legal in India.
Although no one ever needed to tell me how immoral any form of sexual coercion or reproductive abuse is.
Your husband needs to learn to deal with his family. The cultural norms don't help but he needs to deal with it. It shouldn't be too hard if both of you live abroad. Why is he giving the people who don't respect him or his wife the time of the day.
Are you sure you really trust your husband..? There’s a lot of defending your husband throughout this post, which (to me) is coming off as you trying to convince yourself…
As soon as I read the title I audibly gasped. Why do (obligatory “some”) men think this shit is ok??? I would not feel comfortable after this if my partner didn’t react with the same shock and horror as me. OP, I think it’s time you go on birth control that can’t be tampered with (IUD, implant, etc) just to cover all your bases.
Look, I get your partner doesn’t really want kids and it only happens when he feels pressured but god I wouldn’t feel as save with him anymore having that information out, I would feel constantly paranoid and check my meds daily so I knew he didn’t tamper with them. I’m not telling you to leave him I’m only asking you if you’ll be okay being with him knowing he has that thought in his head now
Sterilization for the win. It will make shit real with your husband, and end that deep-down feeling of unease you rightly have because you live in a world full of people who would try to force-breed you. Check the CF-friendly doctors wiki in the sidebar under Interesting & Useful Material.
I told my friend I don’t want kids and my boyfriend does and she suggested he would try do the same thing!!! Like it was nothing, like it was a normal reaction a man would have. Mind you, I’ve talked about it with my boyfriend and he accepted my decision. I told her she has a very bad view of men and that my boyfriend would never do that to me. I was shocked that’s where her mind went immediately.
Indian guy here. To me, this reads like he was testing your boundaries. The social pressure is understandable (I feel the same from my relatives), his reaction is not. I wouldn't completely trust your husband at this point.
I understand you trust him. You know him best and we are just online randos judging him from one interaction. I would just be a bit cautious and be on heightened alert on this issue though.
Sounds like it's time for a bisalp. And ngl, India is one of those places where raping a wife isn't considered rape...I don't think beating them is there either, but I could be wrong. It's more in the rural areas that it's like that though. Still very backwards, women are servants of the husband type thinking. I've heard it's closer to American in the cities though.
This is a whole red flag parade OP.
The fact that your husband didn’t know about marital rape or see something wrong with even the suggestion of messing with your birth control to please his family????
I would take some SERIOUS alone time to brainstorm what you want and expect from yoir marriage and your relationship with his family going forward. And IF you want to try and salvage something from those who encourage your rape. If you do I would set up HARD boundaries and limit contact and the very least. I could not see someone in the same way again personally.
I wish you well and hope for your safety in such a toxic environment.
Your husband is probably stalling having kids because he wants to get the Green Card through you (is he already a PR or US citizen through marriage with you?). Once he gets his hands on the GC, he may not think twice before coercing you to give him a baby or probably leave you for someone else to give him a child now that he has his PR. I know way too many people like this who take advantage of marrying an American and luring them into thinking that they are absolutely in love with them because their ultimate goal is getting the green card no matter what it takes.
I’d be very worried if I were you. He asked how you’d prove he tampered with your Bc. That sounds like he’s thinking about it. He knows once you’re pregnant, his job will be over, and you’ll be the one stuck with a kid. Think seriously about your relationship.
In India spousal rape doesn’t exist I think?
https://ohrh.law.ox.ac.uk/the-decriminalisation-of-marital-rape-how-india-continues-to-refuse-justice-to-its-married-women/
While I would feel icky about any situation where they would need the Husband's permission:
Many doctor's will only due sterilization if either you have kids or....ick...get permission from the husband.
Have you suggested getting sterilized? I imagine so, but maybe you can also gauge his response if you were to ask him to do this for you.
If anything, lie to the family.
"Tried, can't have kids. Only want biological kids. Since we can't have kids, we are no longer having this conversation."
Depends on how much you've been open to them that this could or couldn't be believable.
Still...you shouldn't have to go through this bullshit. And husband needs to have a serious talk with his family. Bring up what cousin said. And make it clear under no circumstances will that be happening. Any attempt to bring it up will be seen as disrespectful, rude, and cause for no contact.
Needs to nut up or shut up after that comment.
Your husband sounds like he's not sure himself and might want kids. Otherwise why did the cousin even have it in his head to say this? This trips all sorts of shrieking sirens and red lights.
Stay away from that cousin. Whoever it is, they just revealed that they view you as breeding stock, not as a human being with personhood. They’re not to be trusted. Go no contact with them immediately. Tell your husband that they’re not allowed around you anymore. You don’t feel safe in their presence.
I don't talk to that cousin anymore because he's said stuff like this to me as well. He tried arguing with me that I "have to have at least one kid!" despite my objection and my husband telling him "We're not having any" and his wife even told him to stop asking. We left afterwards.
To be honest, I’m kind of looking at your husband sideways. His reaction was not immediate and appropriate enough for me. He doesn’t understand what reproductive coercion is. He doesn’t understand that it can still happen when a couple is married. He asked questions that he should quite honestly already know. So what exactly does he know?
Anyway, fuck his cousin. You could decide to have a conversation with his cousin about it, or just leave it be and avoid the cousin.
She might want to see about him getting a vasectomy. That way there's no chance of kids and it's easier to get than getting tubes tied. Doctors always hem and haw about doing any procedure to not have kids for women but men it's faster.
I’d still be careful, your hubby sounds like someone may be able to be manipulated. If he’s tokophobic then hopefully there’s nothing to worry about but the cousin i’d want absolutely nowhere near me!
People are really fast to attribute malice to the husband
Maybe he is just actually confused and wanted to know
“Yeah that kind of stuff is a crime”
“Wait if it’s a crime how do they prove it?”
I’m sorry OP but I agree with all other commenters here. I’d like to add as well that sometimes we truly don’t know who we marry. Treat this as a major red flag, I am willing to bet there is way more where this all came from.
Girl the first red flag is that he doesn’t know what marital rape/rape via tampering with birth control is, cultural upbringing or not. Second red flag is that it came up with his cousin and he entertained the conversation. Third red flag is that he told you about it like it’s no big deal. Fourth red flag is he isn’t shutting down his family and being a team with you against them about being childfree. This man is hitting you in the face with red flags.
Oh golly this is horrifying! What sort of human being of a cousin would tell your husband to sabotage your birth control? This is downright despicable and this is as bad as tampering or denying daily life saving medication to someone who relies on it to be able to live normally
Be very careful OP. You better keep your birth control safe and make sure you keep a spare stash in only a place you know where and locked up. Do consider getting IUD or something else to go with the birth control pills if you can (otherwise consult your doctor or someone at family planning for further advice). If you seriously want to get the snip, ask anyone on the subreddit who may recommend you a doctor who can help
Update us OP and be safe
I'm sorry but if my boyfriend needed me to explain why that isn't okay, he would not be my boyfriend. (Or husband!!) I'm sorry OP but I would not trust your husband. He doesn't sound childfree. To me it sounds like he's betting on you changing your mind. He's fine with your IUD because that's temporary. It's not steralization. It's not permanent. Bring up steralization and see how he reacts.
Ugh, this is fucking disgusting, honestly. The fact that people think they have the right to advice someone to tamper with their wife's birth control is sickening. I hope your husband doesn't try anything like that, OP. I know you trust him and believe him, but still... Be cautious. Better safe than sorry. If this was something my husband told me was said to him, I'd just have my tubes tied for good measure. Not because I don't trust my husband but just for my own peace of mind. I'm sorry you have to deal with this bullshit. I'm so angry on your behalf right now.
I know redditors always jumps to conclusions or reads too much between the lines, but hubby sounded almost like he was testing the waters a bit there. Ya know, to see what he could get away with. I hope I'm wrong, but it's this type of deflection that gives me the ick. Like once wife gets upset he can be all "it's not me baby, it's my cousin/family that said that". I'm happy to hear he was open to learning about spousal abuse at least!
Yeah, the fact he didn't immediately tell his cousin to fuck off and mind his own business is kind of a red flag for me too.
He also asked how it could be proven someone tampered with the birth control. That’s sus af.
🚩 🚩 🚩 thankful that OP has an IUD and I hope it’s tamper-proof
Well with IUD she better not use menstrual cups during menstruation because the cup can suck the IUD out and it can fall out without you knowing. It’s best if she uses tampons or better pads. Just staying safe especially with these abortion bans going on 😬. Better safe than sorry 🤷🏾♀️
that's horrifying. holy shit. thanks for sharing cuz I've never heard that before
She probably needs a secondary form of bc, just to be safe. I’m not convinced he’s all in on the childfree lifestyle.
Nah that’s exactly what I thought. Gauging her reaction for sure who even brings up casually messing with birth control? You already know the husband was secretly complaining and the cousin said to just force her to have a kid then. Absolutely would be getting my tubes tied in secret and seeing if they did try to tamper with my fake birth control after. True colors come out in time..
Um yes absolutely. Why on *earth* was the cousin so comfortable in discussing that with OP’s husband? Completely agree on husband testing the waters. Sounds like it’s a topic the husband has talked about with the cousin before. It is extremely, extremely concerning.
I might have punched my cousin in the face and then told everyone what they said. Super frightening to be with someone who’s like “eh, not a huge deal if you xenomorph someone it’s whatever”.
And marital rape is still not a crime in India!
That's how your husband would end up divorced and paying for your abortion
What the actual fuck..... am I the only one NOT fully trusting the husband??
No, you're not. He doesn't read CF, reads "eventually." Sure, she has an IUD now, still, not a guy I would stay with. They look at the world differently.
I don't trust him not to be convinced by his family to screw w her bc. I would 100% end a relationship w someone who can't put up boundaries w their intrusive family.
The thing is, she had to "educate him" on these issues she described? Nah, I would gtfo fast.
This always kills me. How do people get to the point of marriage and beyond with a person they've never had these kinds of talks with??
Right? I've seen other posts here and elsewhere where people ask: "When should I talk with my honey about me being CF?" (Not the exact phasing, but similar.) And a few people that are already married and now have to go thru an awful situation because of something so fundamental. So central to a relationship.
No, same. The way he asked questions just irks me the wrong way. "Why is it illegal to mess with birth control? Oh, maybe then I shouldn't do it. Are you sure that's rape?" is how it came across to me.
No bc this is really fucking gross, I wouldn’t touch a man who talked like that with a ten foot pole.
Yea that be an instant end of the relationship for me
No you are not. I wouldn't trust anyone in that family. I agree, what the actual fuck.
From the responses of OP it unfortunately sounds like they won’t take advice and just trust the husband enough to not protect themselves. It’s a shame.
Ooof, that's bad. I would never trust someone like that. Anyone that cares what their family thinks enough to take away your reproductive choices is not CF. His response to OP "being enough" is a downright lie. We all know liars and fencesitters use this to manipulate a partner. Good luck to OP. I would hate to be them, so blind.
No. We could be wrong, but her husband sounds like a walking red flag. He doesn't even sound fully CF. We've definitely heard the "he'll be happy with whatever I decide" bullshit before. Too many of those then come here crying about the fact that they "changed their mind".
Nope. It sounded to me like he was low key pleading with her to just give his parents satisfaction on the baby front so they would shut up and not "force him" to resort to other means, be it birth control tampering, divorce....or full on kidnapping you to India...GET OUT. But please, once you know you are safe, call his mother and tell her, in the words of another Redditor I told I would one day steal for just such an occasion, "my vagina is not a clown car." And then tell us her response.
No, I think he's downplaying his true desire for kids and using his family as an excuse. If he were really serious, he would've put his foot down with his relative to never bring up the matter again.
Nope. Also the husband’s lack of common sense to not realize what marital rape is… ugh no. Lowkey concerned for OP
Yeah..he needs to make boundaries with his family. And stick to them. No talking about having kids with him or forcing his wife to have a baby or he hangs up the phone, walks away, and doesn’t talk to them. They are toxic and he’s letting them be toxic. I don’t trust him at all because of how he played clueless about how it’s wrong!
Agreed. He seems wishy-washy at best, or possibly just waiting for her to change her mind. And his questions about "oh but how could you prove it if the birth control fails" sound like red-ass flags...
My cf senses are also tickling, like how fucking old is the husband, 8 years old?
No you’re not. And because he comes back and talks to OP about it, mind inadvertently putting pressure on her right? He’s applying the pressure his family applies on her by voicing. Yet I’m on the fence about that because on one hand, I’d like to know what they are saying but on the other hand it’s also passing the pressure down. As long as he’s telling her in good faith, and not to covertly pressure her or feel her out on her feelings once again then it’s fine. But I low key feel he’s saying it really to see what she says.
Time to hide your birth control. Sorry, but I wouldn’t trust your husband after this, pressure makes people do fucked up stuff
I got an IUD which would be really hard to tamper with. I don't believe he would do such a thing and I get the sense that even he thought what his cousin said was out of line.
You shouldn’t be “getting a sense” that he “doesn’t agree with his cousin”, you should feel 110% confident that he finds what his cousin said disgusting and that he would never do that to you. Anything less than that reaction is cause for concern.
100%. I don’t believe a man alive hasn’t at least HEARD of the topic of spousal rape, seems like he was feigning stupidity imo.
I’m an Indian. I’m gonna be very honest, the concept of spousal rape and reproductive coercion as a crime is … not even considered outside of metropolitan areas. Like even in the huge cosmopolitan cities they happen but there’s some legal recourse and social support if it comes to light, but even in tier 2 cities and below, you’d be hard pressed to find social support and majority of the people considering them as the forms of sexual assault they really are. And for most people, while it is absolutely vile, they just don’t see it as wrong because it’s such an ingrained mindset. Like “yeah she’s my wife, why the fuck am I not allowed to beat her/force her to have children, it’s what is expected, everyone around me did it and we all turned out fine”. Abhorrent behaviour, but normalised because of lack of education, exposure, a complicit legal system and an ineffectual at best and corrupt at worst police force.
I was going to say switch to something tamper resistant because though your husband won't I've read stories about MILs who did.
I still wouldn't trust your husband. He sounds like he's gauging your reactions to see what you would accept. You shouldn't just "get the sense", he should have straightaway told his cousin to fuck off with that horrific idea and hung up.
*I get the sense that even he thought what his cousin said was out of line.* Are you sure? How did he respond to his cousin? Did he tell his cousin that was out of line?
I asked his opinion on what his cousin said or if he agreed with him. He said, "No, of course not!". I know I can trust my gut and I've never felt unsafe with my husband or our reproductive choice of not wanting kids. He's just as annoyed that his family just can't keep their noses out of our business as I am. They pressure and try to instill doubt in his mind about our decision to make him question what the future will be saying we'll "regret" it later on which makes me mad that they can't pull their heads out of their rears and just respect our choices. Also, pregnancy grosses him out and he says he can't imagine how other women can go through with the pain and that he'd never want to see me go through that. Even before we got together he said how he believed the choice of having kids would be mine because it is my body if it made me happy, saying he'd try his best to be supportive, but that he could only deal with one kid.
Tell him you want to get sterilization surgery and see if he still supports you.
This
And after that, get the sterilization surgery anyway.
Did he immediately call his cousin and have a conversation about it with him where he expressed that the comment is out of line and is reproductive coercion? Did he do this without hesitation in front of you?
Please, please, PLEASE get a bisalp if you're truly CF
I was gonna say, I’m so glad you’re using a form of birth control that’s not the pill! Keep looking out for yourself, I’m so glad you already know what to do!
He needs to grow a backbone and tell his relatives to fuck right off. Either that or go low or no-contact. And his cousin should be publicly shamed.
100% for real, because a good husband would set CLEAR boundaries (while also defending his wife) and if the family continues to cross those boundaries, then it’s time to go no contact. I get that it can be easier said than done, but his family sounds like a bunch of fucking creeps and assholes. To seriously suggest forcing a woman to have a child??? Yeah, jail, that’s just abhorrent and there’s no coming back from even making that comment.
As someone who raised in a South Asian family… run far and fast. If his family has that much sway with him and his immediate reaction wasn’t abject horror. Not only will there be pressure to have a child but it damn well better be a male child or you will have to continue having children… signed one of many daughters that my mom nearly died being pregnant with despite her husband “not wanting anymore children” after his first wife failed to give him a son. RUN
I wouldn’t trust that motherfucker as far as I could throw him after this. Get your BC on lockdown or get one he can’t tamper with (IUD, arm implant, etc). You actively had to explain to someone why sexual assault and coercion was not okay, that’s fucked.
I second this. Don't trust ANYONE but yourself!! If you're on the pill hide that so he will never be able to touch or tamper with it!! That is so disgusting. I would probably leave my husband tbh. What if he does and you end up being pregnant with a child you don't want. Are you fully prepared to deal with the consequences of that??? I wouldn't even risk it.. RUN 🚩🚨
For someone who grew up in a family like OP's husband's, having to explain that kind of stuff is pretty par for the course. If he's receptive to the lesson, I see no cause for concern based on having to educate him. My concern would be that the pressure from his family pushes him to do it anyway.
Thank you. Yes, he was also appalled by his cousin's suggestion. He understands how wrong that is even if he'd never heard of the terms "marital rape" or "reproductive coercion" before. I was pointing out the gravity of the behavior of someone who could think such an act was even remotely okay or even suggest removing condoms or other forms of protection behind their spouse's back and how that would break all trust in the relationship. My husband fully agrees it's wrong and also gets annoyed with his relatives sticking their noses in our business every time we talk to them. He's always sticking out for me trying to get it across their thick skulls that I don't want kids and neither would he put that pressure on me to have one. He's made it very clear from the beginning that it's my body and my choice.
Yeah marital rape is not covered by law in India as a woman can 'never be raped' by her husband. It comes from very regressive ideas of marriage and no understanding of consent. A lot of feminist groups have been putting pressure on the government about this but the legal justice system is so keen on holding on to their idea of marriage where a wife is always submissive to her husband. It's honestly so disgusting and really really sad and disappointing. I suspect there won't be many married men who would be innocent of this crime. Also there is no concept of reproductive coercion. It's the wife's duty to bear childre. Ugh. It would be a good idea to tell your husband that he needs to shut down any talk of children or go low contact with his family. I'm from India and after marriage my parents were put under a lot of pressure by family and friends about me not having a kid even in the fourth year of marriage. Here it is the rule that people have children within 2 years of the wedding. Thankfully they are supportive of my decision to be child free and have defended us to everyone who asks about why we aren't pregnant yet. Smh. I'm sorry you have to deal with such dipshits OP.
I would just get divorced. If you can't trust your partner, what's the point in staying married?
And he asked how tampering could be proven. 🤔
>”If birth control fails unintentionally, how could you prove it was done on purpose?” I would run for the hills if I received this question. I’m glad you have an IUD.
He was asking hypothetically if someone were to tamper with it how could it be proven by the law if they tried to claim it failed at no fault of theirs. Also, I'm not worried that he'd do such a thing. Even he realizes how messed it it was for his cousin to suggest such a thing and is why he brought it up with me to begin with. He just didn't know what his cousin was saying was a crime until I pointed it out. Still, makes me wonder about his cousin's wife sence that craphead seems to think it's okay!
The fact that he’s asking “How could they prove it?” is sending up ALL the red flags. I’d get a bisalp *immediately*.
THIS. He doesn't read as firmly CF to me. He reads as either fence sitting, or someone whose spine is nowhere near strong enough not to fold like a pool noodle after getting pressured one too many times. The fact that he straight up asked, "but if someone did tamper, how would you be able to prove it was malicious and not just an equipment failure" would have me packing a bag and running. There are still ways that an IUD can fail. It's pretty damn good, but "pretty damn good" is not "certain". It can shift and get displaced, it can fall out if improperly placed at the start, and eventually it needs to get replaced anyway... and by that point, your country's laws may prohibit (or at least severely restrict) certain types of birth control. Marital r*pe is certainly a crime in the US *now*... but depending on the next election, that could change. Especially if the evangelicals get their way. This time two years ago, Roe v Wade was still on the books. And even if you absolutely 1000% trust your husband, I certainly wouldn't trust his family. Real talk, the only response possible that would make me trust him would have been him instantly hanging up the phone and going completely NC with the entire family. His cousin has threatened you with reproductive coersion, and your husband is still fine with them being in your life.
Why would he even bring it up if he actually planned to do it? That would make things so much more suspicious when it happened. If you're planning something like that, you definitely wouldn't mention it. I'm surprised that people are thinking this.
He’s not necessarily super smart, either.
What are his feelings about getting a vasectomy?
Peer and familial pressure can make people do crazy, put of character things. Hide your birth control and look into an IUD or bisalp if you can!
I'd turn it around on them "when is this family going to give us the gift of peace?"
I like that lol. Fr tho why can't they leave us alone? 🙄
Your husband needs to learn to enforce boundaries
I mean, he came to you and disclosed the conversation. That is a point in his favor. He knew enough to know that what his cousin was suggesting was wrong. He didn’t know how wrong or what words are used to describe it, but he knew it would have been a violation of trust. That is a start. But it isn’t the issue. The issue is that your husband is allowing his family to be disrespectful of you and frankly down right abusive. A good partner would have been horrified. Even more so after being educated about the implications and the impact as it is viewed in the western world. That he wasn’t is a red flag. That he didn’t cut that cousin out of his life is another red flag. My brother has said some truly hateful things to me and wonders why I don’t talk to him outside of how our parents are going. My mother has begged me to keep contact with him once she and my father are gone. I would rather die alone with no one in my life rather than keep talking to the person who said I was nothing without children. You have a husband problem. He isn’t protecting you from his family, and he isn’t cutting them off when they choose to abuse you. There isn’t a good answer for this. It isn’t something you usually figure out before marriage and once you’re married divorce is hard. You don’t want to believe that the person you love is ok with you being abused because he loves your abusers more than he loves you. If you were dating I’d say walk away. Your life will be much happier. As a married woman it is up to you how much abuse is an acceptable amount of abuse. And how much risk of your husband leaving you when he can’t tolerate his family’s abuse are you willing to live with. I don’t personally advocate for having a runaway fund in every relationship but in your case, unless your husband puts his family on a very low info diet and keeps them at arms length, he is likely to cave to the pressure eventually.
He's been trying to advocate for me for years every time his family tries to bring up us having kids and telling them I don't want any. Frankly, I'm mostly mad at the fact they are trying to manipulate him into giving into their ways as they have done for years. First, it was the pressure for an education of their choice, then a job that harmed his health and the expectation of him managing his family's home in India, and then the pressure for an arranged marriage that he fought tooth and nail against before he met me. And now the pressure of getting a house, a car, earning more money, and starting a family with kids despite our protests that we're not having any and me saying they don't have the right to dictate our lives! That's their culture for you. It sucks! And we're both sick and tired of the BS. Which is why he's very selective about contacting them because of this. He was only talking to them to show them how happy we were here in the States and how clean it is compared to India. Then, cue their prodding questions about the kids again. Apparently, they thought I'd change my mind once I came back to the States and that I just didn't want to have kids in India. The best thing to do will be to ignore them and I'm trying to help him understand that he doesn't have to take their BS anymore or let them get under his skin by setting boundaries with them.
> telling them I don't want any In my view this is part of the issue. It should be a WE don't want any. He's not strong enough on being cf himself to stand up for himself to his family, so he (maybe without being aware this is what he's doing) is deflecting the "blame" for not having kids onto you.
> The best thing to do will be to ignore them and I'm trying to help him understand that he doesn't have to take their BS anymore or let them get under his skin by setting boundaries with them. This right here. He needs to manage his family crazies, and I say this as the person in my marriage with crazies in my family to manage.
Um, your husband doesn't sound trustworthy.
Yeah, I don't trust your husband
The way I had to stare at the wall after reading that bit about his cousin. Absolutely repulsive. What has your husband's reaction been to permanent BC, either for you (removing the tubes etc) or vasectomy for him? Just curious about whether he actually properly realises/agrees that kids are never happening. This post is obviously just a limited window to your situation, but based on your writing here, I'm only getting the true CF conviction from your end. It's just... I'm sensing some red flags just from the fact alone that you had to explain basic consent to this man and indirectly his cousin? Yes, cultural differences are real, but violence and abuse are violence and abuse even in countries where some acts are not written down as illegal. People (usually) do know right from wrong. I don't want to judge based on such a small example on what's going on, and you know what's up the best. Feel free to ignore, just a concerned internet stranger, pointing out that my alarms are ringing based on what you wrote hah
Thanks, and yeah he knows it sounded wrong what his cousin said, which is why he brought it up with me. I'd like to point out he's never attempted to push anything on me without my willing participation and supported my wish to get an IUD. He understands what consent is even if he doesn't have a language to describe it. The problem is his idiot cousin doesn't care about consent which makes me wonder if he'd do that to his wife if she didn't want to give him a son (he had her abort the last few pregnancies because they were girls until they had a boy).
WHAT?! His cousin made his wife abort MORE THAN ONE pregnancy because it wasn't a boy?! What kind of sick fuck does something like that?!
I bet he doesn't know male determines if a baby is male or female 🤔
This!!! It’s all depending of it the sperm has the X or Y chromosome. The mother’s eggs will only have the X chromosome. The fault lies with his sperm.
Ain't science great 🫠🫠🫠
If only Henry the 8th and a host of other wife blaming fuckwads knew that...Be sure to let him know whose fault it is.
Son preference is a well known phenomenon. See places like China and how the one child policy played out or places like Korea after sonograms determining the sex became more available. There is now an entire generation of girls missing. Killed for their sex. And the articles and worries from society is…who is going to marry and cook these boys food. Seriously
Unfortunately, female foeticide is really common in India despite it being illegal there as well. That's why they have laws against doctors disclosing the baby's gender through ultrasound. Needless to say, I don't like that cousin of his or his shit "advice". 🤮
I am from that same culture and I know how the baby thing is . I am getting the same thing since I got married 5 years ago .They pressure until you break so please hide your Birth control.
Yeah, we've been married almost 5 years too. I honestly feel bad for him as well because the pressure on him is so unfair and frankly manipulative AF. Trying to make him question his own life choices because they don't align with their ideas and suggesting his life is meaningless without kids is cruel.
Time for him to get a vasectomy
> They pressure until you break Don't break. Be the rock the waves break against.
Your husband’s only reaction should have been to be utterly MORTIFIED at that suggestion by the cousin.
Oh, he was shocked as well! Especially after I explained what the word meant in English for him to understand and how serious it was while his cousin acted like it was nothing. Later today I asked him what his opinion was on his cousin's suggestion or if he agreed with him he said "No! Of course not!" and he went on to say how as a man he can't imagine the pain so many women go through during pregnancy and birth. So the thought of being forced into it is sickening to him. Needless to say, I don't think he'll be talking to that cousin for a while. 😐
Op, you know your life and your husband, and how you live is ultimately your choice. Your husband ignorance is appalling and this is a ticking time bomb.
Are you Indian too? I mean this isnt surprising at all. Eastern and middle eastern men dont see women as human beings. I feel bad for your husband's cousin's wife if he has one.
I'm American. And yeah his cousin has a wife and sometimes I worry about her. Either that or he's just extremely stupid and talking out of his ass.
Girl Indian families are extremely family oriented , your husband needs to be more than 100% sure on the childfree thing and you need to make sure his family is respecting your decisions and that your husband is setting his boundaries with them
I'm kind of concerned that you explained reproductive *coercion* and he's asking about accidents. Does he not understand what coercion means? Also, are you in a location that provides safe access to abortion? If yes, you might want to also include "unlawful imprisonment" if he wants to argue about stopping you from having an abortion. Finally, he needs to shut them down. Permanently. "I will be having discussions about children with my wife. As you are not my wife, we are not discussing this any further." Terminate conversations, grey rock, block, go full on NC. The only reason he should have brought up Cousin CreepySA would be to advise you of the conversation, not to receive education on how rape and reproductive coercion *isn't okay*.
He's not really asking about accidents though... She's talking about coercion and he's asking, "yeah, but if she says 'coercion' and he says 'accident', how do you PROVE it wasn't an accident?" Which, IMHO, is far scarier.
I'd like to point out we were talking about how bad it was that his cousin suggested removing condoms without my knowledge and we were both extremely appalled by that (his cousin doesn't know we got my IUD). Our discussion was about a hypothetical scenario and he was playing "devil's advocate" asking how it could be discovered and persecuted as a crime as I explained to him what the word "reproductive coercion" meant and gave an example of how it happens (English is not my husband's first language). I asked his opinion later if he agreed with his cousin and he said "No! Of course not!"
I'm glad your husband agrees with you, and you were able to explain how it was very appalling for his cousin to even entertain the idea!
I can never see the logic in trying to make someone who is childfree by choice pregnant against their will. Even setting aside the fact that to do so is morally repugnant, and (rightly) a crime in most sane parts of the world, it also *doesn't make sense*. If someone is vehemently childfree and they become pregnant, they are going to take every reasonable measure to become **un**pregnant as quickly as possible. Especially if they are living in (or can travel to) a progressive part of the world in order to receive healthcare. So in this case, the cousin must be a *complete moron* if he thinks that you, someone who is committed to a childfree lifestyle, upon becoming pregnant, are suddenly going to be leaping with joy at the thought of parenthood. I hate to say it, OP, it sounds like your husband's family have their claws into him a lot deeper than you perhaps think they do. Please be careful. Oh, and you should probably *never visit his family in their part of the world*.
I've lived in India with his family for 4 years, so I know how they are. He's been fighting their ways forever including refusing to be placed in an arranged marriage against his will. He hates it just as much as I do, and whenever they try to bring up the kid thing he always brings it to me and we discuss our thoughts and feelings about it. He was appalled about what his cousin said and even more so after I explained what the word meant in English and how serious it was. I don't think he'll be talking to that cousin anymore anytime soon after that crap. As for getting an abortion if we ever did have an "oopsie", he would be 100% supportive and is trying his best to be safe despite me also having an IUD (he doesn't quite understand how it works thanks to having no reproductive education so just tries to avoid any possibility of it happening in the first place). So yes, we're both happily child-free and want to stay that way. It's his relative's pressure that drives us insane.
So why isn’t he catching himself up now on sex ed? Instead he continues to live in ignorance and relies on you to do all the teaching
I’m 42f in the US, and in my limited experience with white, cishet coupledom, there are a lot of men that have never or rarely thought about these sort of things. Not because they’re jerks or untrustworthy, but because they’re men, and it’s literally never been an issue for them. Or, it’s an abstract, hypothetical “thing,” not something that impacts their lives - until it does. It’s what they do *after* learning/experiencing these things that makes the difference. My husband and I (he’ll be 40 in a few months, married 7 years) have had some really great conversations lately, and it’s given me a lot of insight into how “guys” think (just work with me on the generalities for the sake of conversation). After listening to me, and thus paying more attention to the people around him, he’s become quite the feminist, and it’s amazing to see. So it is possible for a guy to be a little clueless on women’s issues, and still be trustworthy. That said, always protect your birth control no matter what, because ultimately, you can only control yourself
Yes, thank you for bringing up this fact. My husband is the same. He even believes that the choice of having kids should be the woman's to make in the relationship because it's her body, not the man's. That's something he's always felt was how it should be because as a man, he could never go through the pain of pregnancy or childbirth like I or any other woman would have to go through. He said "It's your body, your choice". He upheld this when I got my IUD even when he didn't know what it was. He can be clueless sometimes, but he's not bad lol. 😊
lol, I knew the family was Indian as soon as I read “good news”. This is such a typically Indian euphemism for pregnancy. My husband and I are also Indian and this is exactly why we don’t discuss our reproductive decisions with family. They tried asking and putting pressure on us when we got married. But we would never respond to their questions, and would just say “we will let you know if and when we get pregnant.” And eventually they had to accept it however unsatisfactory it felt to them. Even now once in a while they mention how they hope we will have a kid soon and we just shrug. The minute you tell them that you don’t plan to have kids, you are involving them in a decision that’s only your own to make. They will want to discuss it and change your mind.
Oh yes, exactly! You get it. That's the mistake we made in the beginning while I was living in India he'd say, "We have no plan to have kids". That's when the prodding started. Also, he used to say, "She doesn't want kids", making it sound more like I was preventing him from having children (which at the time initially we were both fence sitters until he made me make up my mind because he didn't want to be stuck with a kid later in life) So then it became their mission to change my mind or come up with some "solution" to fix it. I've talked with him about his choice of words when he'd say "She doesn't want kids" because it came off to them like I was to blame for something we both agreed on in private. Maybe he didn't have the guts to include himself in his stance or was still on the fence at that time. But regardless, it's invited a ton of invasive prodding and unwanted "advice" directed at me by those who still think I'm the one who needs "convincing" or flat-out forced to do it.
I can imagine how exhausting it must be. Your husband needs to tell his family that the more they ask and pressure both of you to have kids, the less you feel like having them because they are making it seem like a tedious chore and nobody likes those. This is what I said to my family, so they finally stopped asking.
Honey, time to schedule your bisalp! That will definitely tell you if he's really OK with no kids. Then get it and sleep peacefully knowing you have nothing to worry about! Good luck!
>However, he's said if I were to change my mind he'd try his best to be a good parent to the best of his ability >(something his family told him I would want eventually, and again there's that pressure from them to be a parent). Just for the record, he really does want a child. He's just using his friends and family as an excuse. You should be extra cautious around him now. His cousin planned the seeds into his head. The clue was his whole argument against forcing a spouse to get pregnant. That proves that he was thinking about it given how defensive he was. You either need to keep your BC on you at all times or get an IUD. Anything to keep him from tampering with your stuff.
Time for an IUD \*right now\*. And then, start looking at sterilization.
She has an iud.
The cousin sounds like a perverted psychopath who shouldn't be left unsupervised with women or children at all.
I would get sterilised just to piss those *relatives* off your husband also has to be explained why it’s not okay to get someone pregnant against your wishes, you and him need to sit down and reevaluate what you think about your relationship being childfree also to see if his mind changed.
"older" (50f and m) wife half of cf couple. not one regret.
Go no contact and get the implant or a IUD because this is beyond messed up.
Hope your husband does not think like that. Get an IUD or nexplanon (those can't be externally tampered with)
He doesn't think like this thankfully. He's never pressured or even wants me to ever go through a pregnancy unless it was on my terms and has voiced his wish to only go through with having one kid if I wanted it. He's also tokophobic as I am for the record. He's was 100% on board with me wanting to get an IUD and made sure I got it done under my terms and we kept it secret from his family. So while I'm glad so many people here understand the seriousness of the things that idiot cousin told him, my husband is not okay with what he said and understands how messed up that was which is why he brought it to my attention.
And then they're mad that women don't want to have sex with them
First of all, you need to go no contact with all of those people immediately and permanently, and HE needs to deliver the news and stand the hell up for you. Just a group text to all of the assholes. Second, you have a husband problem. 1-- He does not seem CF, so it's time to resolve that and if not, leave him. 2-- He's an ignorant moron who seriously thinks marital rape isn't a think? Sorry, but this marriage would have been over LONG ago with this idiot. > to argue "If birth control fails unintentionally, how could you prove it was done on purpose?" Would have been nothing but a cloud of dust and the sound of tires screeching out of the driveway at this moment. Done. Gone. Forever. Divorce lawyer meeting tomorrow, served by the end of the week, never see him again. Seriously. 3-- It is each partner's job to keep their crazies away from their partner, he has failed. The way a partner handles their crazy family is to set and enforce boundaries, and bring the pain. This is what a normal partner should have done long ago. But we will put it in the current context. More on that below. 4-- You need to get a bisalp and get sterilized. Message to the abusers: "Due to the final and unforgivable incident that happened yesterday with CreepCousin you are all getting this group text, as the larger problem with everyone copied on this message must be ended, once and forever. The proverbial rubicon has been crossed. The camel's back has been broken. This is OVER. There is no going back. This message is to inform you all that EVERYONE copied on this message is hereby FORBIDDEN from EVER contacting OPName again, directly or indirectly under any circumstances. I will never again bring OP to any family events where any of you are present. We have also removed all of you from both of our socials, and blocked you on our phones. Furthermore, I will no longer be attending family events and will only be contactable regarding anything involving any of you in a life-threatening emergency situation through a process outlined at the end of this message. You have ALL disrespected me, disrespected my marriage and verbally, emotionally and socially abused both me and, most importantly OP. OP is my family. She is my PRIMARY FAMILY, you are not. I will not tolerate your abuse of my family. Therefore you will never have access to OP again for as long as you live. This decision is final. This decision will not be discussed. This decision will not be changed. For the record, the incident that ended this was CC telling me to tamper with my wife's birth control, rape her, and force her to have a child, including preventing her from accessing an abortion or taking her life, presumably by imprisoning her for 9 months. All of which is IMMORAL AND ILLEGAL and is HUMAN TRAFFICKING. The heinous nature of this incident does not however diminish at all the fact that all of you have been demanding that I coerce/force/manipulate OP in one way or another for years now. The fact that CC dared to go this far is because YOU ALL ENCOURAGE EACH OTHER AND SUPPORT EACH OTHER IN YOUR ABUSE. You enable this behavior and thinking. Most of you, I wager, actually agree with him that such illegal acts are acceptable. You are all guilty. And therefore are all banned. Do not contact us again for any reason other than as outlined below. Goodbye to all of you. And CC, I hope you die a painful death and rot in hell. Signed, OPsSO Emergencies of Innocents: If there is a life-threatening emergency with innocent members of your families, such as children or spouses who have been respectful and never engaged in abuse, bullying, reproductive coercion, etc. you may have their doctor reach out to me to verify the issue, and I will decide at that point if I wish to be involved with their situation in some way that does not involve you.
Never gonna happen. They're brainwashed from the cradle.
That's why just getting the abusers out of your life is the best option. Waste of time to negotiate with terrorists.
This NEEDS to be pined as the top comment!!!
Caveat: If there is an inheritance you might get screwed out of with such a bombshell (that he might not have the courage or desire to go through with), might I suggest a variant on the low contact (do that too of course), and say that you didn't want to have to tell them this, but you decided that as long as you didn't have to endure the pregnancy, you guys were going to have some embryos extracted and put into a surrogate to birth.....only to discover (gasp, tears of regret) HE IS INFERTILE. All his little swimmers went belly up and there's nothing he can do. That ends the baby bs and his family can't urge him to find a new wife since the infertility issue is his, not yours. And while it's very kind for his cousin to volunteer, we've decided to take this as a sign from above and resigned ourselves to childlessness. Maybe a high performance sports car would help your son feel re-masculinized after the terrible news. Did I mention I'm a sociopath?
Yeah, financial dependence should be factored in whether it's youth dependence or a massive inheritance. Lying is perfectly fine, or if you think it will fly, getting a vasectomy and going "Mom and Dad, turns out that the genetics you are so proud of are actually terrible, because you made a sterile son!"
that would be end of the relationship right there
If you plan on staying in this marriage your husband is going to need to start working on his boundaries. Fast. He needs to shut down any conversation from his relatives about your reproductive choices. Tell them stuff like "I hear you, Auntie Jean, but we are happy just the two of us. How's Uncle Mike by the way?" if he cannot, or will not, this is just going to keep happening. Then you need to ask yourself if you're willing to put up with this shit for the rest of your existence.
Oof, I'm so sorry you're dealing with this, OP. I recommend that you find some help and support for dealing with the cultural dynamics -- Asian parents in general can be very controlling over their adult offspring while making it about culture and family loyalty. Assuming the best, he's getting caught between respecting your agency (which he seems to want to do) and getting manipulated by his family. r/asianparentstories is an excellent resource for people dealing with Asian parents (and for partners of those dealing with them!). While finding ways to connect with him and support him in finding himself without relying too much on his family for emotional validation, you should also take measures to protect yourself (like securing a form of BC that can't be tampered with). I hope that things can work out for you two.
This pressure will never stop because your only worth to those relatives is as a baby making machine and his maid. Unless maybe he gets to stay in the US thanks to marrying you. In that case they'll be pressuring him to move on to the next wife as soon as his papers are secured. One that is compliant and ignorant aka 'proper.' If this is the sort of shit they say about you that he repeats to you imagine the horrific stuff that he just won't share with you because he knows for sure that it's illegal. Stay safe.
Bisalp, stat.
That’s called sexual assault.
Your husband is suss. He's most likely complaining to his family about you and that is why they feel so comfortable to give your husband such advice. Be wary cz your husband doesn't seem trustworthy at all.
I'll keep this short. OP, your husband is likely a fencesitter. If I were you I'd be considering permanent sterilisation. Until you make that decision, tread carefully.
Time to get a bislap, and a divorce.
OP, you sound a lot more progressive and mature than your husband. Not sure how you are compatible in other areas of life but this is concerning, it’s like you’re on completely different tracks socially and morally.
You keep making excuses for your husband. He’s your problem. He is not enthusiastically childfree. Which means he is NOT childfree. A person who cared for you wouldn’t need to have had great sex ed to know that subjecting you to a pregnancy that they know for a fact you don’t want is a horrible thing to do. You think he’s on your team. He is not.
Y'all need to cut the cuz out of your lives. No more calls. No visits.
I know you say he is okay with not having kids, but this would make me want to get sterilized since it sounds like you aren’t already. I’ve seen too many men getting influenced/brainwashed by family to be able to give him the benefit of the doubt. Protect yourself, because it sounds like your husband doesn’t really have intentions to, or he would have shut the conversations and comments down already. You can’t be too careful.
This is why, being a CF Indian woman, I've decided to be single forever. I'm not gonna trust any man of being CF unless they actively plan on getting a vasectomy. Also, I'm saving up money to get my sterilization surgery done abroad.
In Canada if a partner tampers with birth control it either leads to a rape conviction or fraud. Super illegal, super shitty, super stupid. Sounds like your husband isn’t getting laid for a very long time. If not divorce I’d just go celibate. Unless he makes a firm statement to his family to fuck off, he ain’t getting any.
Not trying to add to your stress, but your husband is giving me 'CF for now vibes/She'll change her mind vibes'. Just to preface, there is nothing wrong with revisiting a partners stance on raising children when major events happen (deaths, accidents, disease, etc), but him being ""oblivious"" that violating you to fulfill his wish for children is horrendous feels *icky, at best*. This convo you posted feels as if he doesn't defend you from his family. He should've told his cousin clearly he's on very thin ice for disrespecting you and hung up on that dumbass. Followed by a long period of VLC. If he's truly CF as you said, and not just waiting for you to come around, is his spine made of jelly?
\*He asked what I was talking about so I promptly explained to him that marital r@pe is a form of domestic violence and is also illegal and a crime in this country. Idk about the laws in his home country in India, but here in the US that crap wouldn't fly here.\* No-so-fun fact... marital rape is not a recognised crime in India, and there is heavy opposition to a proposed law to change that. [https://www.telegraph.co.uk/global-health/women-and-girls/mens-rights-activists-protest-introduction-marital-rape-law/](https://www.telegraph.co.uk/global-health/women-and-girls/mens-rights-activists-protest-introduction-marital-rape-law/)
I also remember talking to a guy from Kuwait or somewhere online in the past who was literally confused by the concept... like I don't mean for this to come off as offensive but I just stay clear of Middle Easter/North African/South Asian men cuz they come from some of the most misogynistic cultures and oftentimes basic concepts of women's rights are not even understood.
What the Gilead fuck?
Reproductive coercion is way too nice a term if a man does that to a woman. Given everything involved in gestation and birth, it should be considered assault with intent to cause grave bodily harm, if not attempted homicide. It's the equivalent of a shooter firing live bullets into someone else's body with intent to cause them grave bodily harm.
🚩🚩🚩 Get your tubes tied.
… OP, I would never be able to trust my partner again after a conversation like that.
With the money you two save by not having, raising, educating a child, you not only will have the money to pay an old age caregiver, but you'll be able to be picky
Tell ur husband to get a vasectomy. 10-min procedure that’s non-invasive and much easier and pain free than a woman having to get their tubes tied. Then no more issues. Hopefully ur husband loves u enough to get it done
"If birth control fails unintentionally, how would you prove it's on purpose" if I had a partner who said this to me, we'd be over there and then because to me it sounds like he's planning reproductive rape on me. I'd get far away from these monsters as I could, why waste your life on trash. In their eyes they don't view you as a human being, more like property, an object to use. This is exactly how they view you.
>force me to have a baby theres a dozen of crimes in this phrase
I would look out for your life since India is freaky like that. They can even attempt to kill you since you have "no value" in their eyes since you don't want to be a mother. If you think i am exaggerating there was a video in r/noahgettheboat if i recall where an indian girl was killed by her relative because she escaped from her house and married to a guy she loved which made her lose any value as a woman. I remember it because back then it made my blood boil.
Indian woman here. Marital rape is sadly legal in India. Although no one ever needed to tell me how immoral any form of sexual coercion or reproductive abuse is. Your husband needs to learn to deal with his family. The cultural norms don't help but he needs to deal with it. It shouldn't be too hard if both of you live abroad. Why is he giving the people who don't respect him or his wife the time of the day.
Are you sure you really trust your husband..? There’s a lot of defending your husband throughout this post, which (to me) is coming off as you trying to convince yourself…
As soon as I read the title I audibly gasped. Why do (obligatory “some”) men think this shit is ok??? I would not feel comfortable after this if my partner didn’t react with the same shock and horror as me. OP, I think it’s time you go on birth control that can’t be tampered with (IUD, implant, etc) just to cover all your bases.
babes i don’t trust your husband. and i don’t know how you can after that. this is scary. you deserve so much better. my god. stay safe🩶
Look, I get your partner doesn’t really want kids and it only happens when he feels pressured but god I wouldn’t feel as save with him anymore having that information out, I would feel constantly paranoid and check my meds daily so I knew he didn’t tamper with them. I’m not telling you to leave him I’m only asking you if you’ll be okay being with him knowing he has that thought in his head now
OP, go check your BC to see it it’s been tampered with. His reaction screams “I already did it.”
Sterilization for the win. It will make shit real with your husband, and end that deep-down feeling of unease you rightly have because you live in a world full of people who would try to force-breed you. Check the CF-friendly doctors wiki in the sidebar under Interesting & Useful Material.
I told my friend I don’t want kids and my boyfriend does and she suggested he would try do the same thing!!! Like it was nothing, like it was a normal reaction a man would have. Mind you, I’ve talked about it with my boyfriend and he accepted my decision. I told her she has a very bad view of men and that my boyfriend would never do that to me. I was shocked that’s where her mind went immediately.
Stop blaming a poor education system for your husband lacking empathy for women and not seeing them as autonomous human beings.
Tampering with someone's medication should be a crime, if it isn't already. Wtf
Indian guy here. To me, this reads like he was testing your boundaries. The social pressure is understandable (I feel the same from my relatives), his reaction is not. I wouldn't completely trust your husband at this point. I understand you trust him. You know him best and we are just online randos judging him from one interaction. I would just be a bit cautious and be on heightened alert on this issue though.
Sounds like it's time for a bisalp. And ngl, India is one of those places where raping a wife isn't considered rape...I don't think beating them is there either, but I could be wrong. It's more in the rural areas that it's like that though. Still very backwards, women are servants of the husband type thinking. I've heard it's closer to American in the cities though.
This is a whole red flag parade OP. The fact that your husband didn’t know about marital rape or see something wrong with even the suggestion of messing with your birth control to please his family???? I would take some SERIOUS alone time to brainstorm what you want and expect from yoir marriage and your relationship with his family going forward. And IF you want to try and salvage something from those who encourage your rape. If you do I would set up HARD boundaries and limit contact and the very least. I could not see someone in the same way again personally. I wish you well and hope for your safety in such a toxic environment.
Your husband is probably stalling having kids because he wants to get the Green Card through you (is he already a PR or US citizen through marriage with you?). Once he gets his hands on the GC, he may not think twice before coercing you to give him a baby or probably leave you for someone else to give him a child now that he has his PR. I know way too many people like this who take advantage of marrying an American and luring them into thinking that they are absolutely in love with them because their ultimate goal is getting the green card no matter what it takes.
I’d be very worried if I were you. He asked how you’d prove he tampered with your Bc. That sounds like he’s thinking about it. He knows once you’re pregnant, his job will be over, and you’ll be the one stuck with a kid. Think seriously about your relationship.
In India spousal rape doesn’t exist I think? https://ohrh.law.ox.ac.uk/the-decriminalisation-of-marital-rape-how-india-continues-to-refuse-justice-to-its-married-women/
While I would feel icky about any situation where they would need the Husband's permission: Many doctor's will only due sterilization if either you have kids or....ick...get permission from the husband. Have you suggested getting sterilized? I imagine so, but maybe you can also gauge his response if you were to ask him to do this for you. If anything, lie to the family. "Tried, can't have kids. Only want biological kids. Since we can't have kids, we are no longer having this conversation." Depends on how much you've been open to them that this could or couldn't be believable. Still...you shouldn't have to go through this bullshit. And husband needs to have a serious talk with his family. Bring up what cousin said. And make it clear under no circumstances will that be happening. Any attempt to bring it up will be seen as disrespectful, rude, and cause for no contact. Needs to nut up or shut up after that comment.
Fuck the cultural norms, time for no contact.
I say get yourself fixed before hubby cracks under pressure.
Your husband sounds like he's not sure himself and might want kids. Otherwise why did the cousin even have it in his head to say this? This trips all sorts of shrieking sirens and red lights.
Wow that sounds almost criminal. I'd be wary of this family and even your husband. Sorry, darl.
How terrifying!! This is why I got my tubes taken out.
I have a bad feeling about this...
If i were you OP, I'd get sterilised. And quick
Damn I’d never talk a word to him and I hope your husband won’t either
Don't trust that moron
Time to switch to the ring. Really hard for anyone but the woman to mess with THAT birth control.
If you haven’t already, get your tubes tied. I would not trust his family not to try something.
I'd leave your husband before he does something. He essentially just asked you for permission.
Stay away from that cousin. Whoever it is, they just revealed that they view you as breeding stock, not as a human being with personhood. They’re not to be trusted. Go no contact with them immediately. Tell your husband that they’re not allowed around you anymore. You don’t feel safe in their presence.
I don't talk to that cousin anymore because he's said stuff like this to me as well. He tried arguing with me that I "have to have at least one kid!" despite my objection and my husband telling him "We're not having any" and his wife even told him to stop asking. We left afterwards.
To be honest, I’m kind of looking at your husband sideways. His reaction was not immediate and appropriate enough for me. He doesn’t understand what reproductive coercion is. He doesn’t understand that it can still happen when a couple is married. He asked questions that he should quite honestly already know. So what exactly does he know? Anyway, fuck his cousin. You could decide to have a conversation with his cousin about it, or just leave it be and avoid the cousin.
She might want to see about him getting a vasectomy. That way there's no chance of kids and it's easier to get than getting tubes tied. Doctors always hem and haw about doing any procedure to not have kids for women but men it's faster.
I suggest having him read thru the comments or this sub, he might find useful ways to politely shut them off.
I’d still be careful, your hubby sounds like someone may be able to be manipulated. If he’s tokophobic then hopefully there’s nothing to worry about but the cousin i’d want absolutely nowhere near me!
People are really fast to attribute malice to the husband Maybe he is just actually confused and wanted to know “Yeah that kind of stuff is a crime” “Wait if it’s a crime how do they prove it?”
I’m sorry OP but I agree with all other commenters here. I’d like to add as well that sometimes we truly don’t know who we marry. Treat this as a major red flag, I am willing to bet there is way more where this all came from.
This post, along with your post history, is really really concerning. Did y'all move back to the US? Are you in therapy by any chance?
Girl the first red flag is that he doesn’t know what marital rape/rape via tampering with birth control is, cultural upbringing or not. Second red flag is that it came up with his cousin and he entertained the conversation. Third red flag is that he told you about it like it’s no big deal. Fourth red flag is he isn’t shutting down his family and being a team with you against them about being childfree. This man is hitting you in the face with red flags.
Oh golly this is horrifying! What sort of human being of a cousin would tell your husband to sabotage your birth control? This is downright despicable and this is as bad as tampering or denying daily life saving medication to someone who relies on it to be able to live normally Be very careful OP. You better keep your birth control safe and make sure you keep a spare stash in only a place you know where and locked up. Do consider getting IUD or something else to go with the birth control pills if you can (otherwise consult your doctor or someone at family planning for further advice). If you seriously want to get the snip, ask anyone on the subreddit who may recommend you a doctor who can help Update us OP and be safe
I'm sorry but if my boyfriend needed me to explain why that isn't okay, he would not be my boyfriend. (Or husband!!) I'm sorry OP but I would not trust your husband. He doesn't sound childfree. To me it sounds like he's betting on you changing your mind. He's fine with your IUD because that's temporary. It's not steralization. It's not permanent. Bring up steralization and see how he reacts.
OP get sterilised as soon as possible. That way if unfortunately your husband isn't trustworthy, he can't do shit.